Mulw deer population????

[GoatGuy]

I guess your missinformed two of those bucks where inthe 160 class and other two was by there choice not mine so I guess I have to lose three hunting partners because I have an opinion that I don t want to shoot immature muleys give your head a shake ................... , and again I am telling you that I am not for this season I would of kept it to a four point restriction ,,,,,,,,,,,,and again I did my part in letting you and your buddies shot the immature muleys that I suspect would grow into mature bucks that some people here in the kootenays would like to continue to hunt ........nobody else in the bush lots of elk and whitetaill for your hunting opputunities leave the mules alone for awhile until the species comes back at a repectable level Have a nice day Goatguy and feel free to come for coffee so my fingers will not get numb from dicussing this topic with you

4 pt restriction will result in fewer big bucks, anybody that has their nose in mule deer management knows that, so do the guys who consistently shoot big bucks. Seems your take is more about killing a big buck than it is about mule deer - that is unfortunate.

[bigben]

They are down, it isn't a crisis, and in the long run mule deer will continue to decline. In the long-term you'll find the same thing with most ungulates in the EK. Ingrowth, increased development on winter range, fenced tracts of property which fragment critical habitat and highway traffic will all contribute to this.

Changing hunting seasons won't help that, neither will an occasional dose of predator control, but that's what all the locals will complain about like they do now.

Why worry about the big picture when we call all point fingers at each other and worry about the things that won't make a difference? Plenty of that around.

Point well taken and lets see where our future goes from here on the wildlife of B C ,,,,,,, if you get a chance put up some of your pictures of a decent 150 buck that you have harvested every in here in the kootenays ..........Happy hunting

[happyhunter]

What we have are hunters shooting 4 pts, hunters shooting any buck, and predators killing anything. The buck:doe ratio might be good enough to get all the does pregnant but predators are going to take some of those does, take some of those bucks, and a shitload of the fawns... then the population as a whole drops off. We shoot small bucks, then we don't see them as larger bucks the following year, and were seeing fewer small bucks as well as the fawns are getting picked off. Were loosing our breeding population of MD across all ages and there aren't enough fawns to replace them at a sustainable rate. IMO predators are a much bigger factor then habitat loss. There is a lot of country out here to support a higher mule deer population then what we have.

[6616]

There is a lot of country out here to support a higher mule deer population then what we have.

That's what it seems like in the summer and fall, but what about winter? Winter range areas are only a very small portion of the overall habitat and all that habitat ones sees in the summer and fall is completely useless to deer in mid-winter. Ungulate winter range is at a premium in the East Kootenay. It's being pounded by cows, homesteader elk and white tailed deer all summer, and is losing suitability due to over-grazing and the spread of invasive and noxious weeds. Ungulate winter range is also shrinking at an incredible rate due to forest ingrowth. Currently more than 10% of ungulate winter range in the EK is behind exclusion fences. Neary 45% of ungulate winter range in the EK is private land. Nearly half the ungulate winter range on Crown Land has been impacted by forest ingrowth and encroachment. If we spent as much energy and time bitching and writing letters to government officials about habitat maintenance as we do bitching and argueing with each other about regulations maybe something might get done.

[Everett]

Well that is your experience and that was just that day. Everywhere I hunt I saw 5X the amount for people. The further I went the more hunters I saw and less game to boot.
Anyways I dont think any amount of liberal hunting will wipe mulies out. I see little buck way up with sheep and goats. You know not many people will pack out a little buck from so far. People who want to shoot little bucks want it easy they shoot them by the road. Hunter recreation demand is very high in this area. More hunters than mule deer buck by far. 3 mth long season over lapping all the other seasons. Between all factors the mule deer are going no where. This topic will continue until the world end if something doesnt change. Let hunter opportunity fall on the the game that can support the demand. WT and ELK.

Hey Everett
Whats the point of a road block up the swan when only WT is open and most folks are gone home. What a waste. Where were the CO's when the trigger happy SOB's where shooting Cows during the spike season and spikes during the Cow season? (Looser gound checkers) What a waste of money! They just wanted to see what folks were shooting.

Two CO's to boot not sure what they were looking for I assumed something specific had a young dog with them as well. I to would have liked a bigger presence join the cow season especialy the senior/junior season.
Saw 5 hunters today busiest day I have had this month but was huntin Caven area so I exspected busy.

[Fisher-Dude]

I guess your missinformed two of those bucks where inthe 160 class and other two was by there choice not mine so I guess I have to lose three hunting partners because I have an opinion that I don t want to shoot immature muleys give your head a shake ................... , and again I am telling you that I am not for this season I would of kept it to a four point restriction ,,,,,,,,,,,,and again I did my part in letting you and your buddies shot the immature muleys that I suspect would grow into mature bucks that some people here in the kootenays would like to continue to hunt ........nobody else in the bush lots of elk and whitetaill for your hunting opputunities leave the mules alone for awhile until the species comes back at a repectable level Have a nice day Goatguy and feel free to come for coffee so my fingers will not get numb from dicussing this topic with you

What would shooting off all the 3 year old four points do to help you get a big buck?

My out-of-town buddies come over for a week and shoot a 160 class buck every year - what's your excuse as a local for not getting one? They probably would have smacked a couple more this year but they dumped two 6 point elk and went home because it was too hot.

Maybe some guys can't get it done so they blame the deer season for killing off all "their" bucks?

[358mag]

We go out there every year surrounding Nov long weekend exclusively for MD. We harvest 3-4+ year old bucks and there have been plenty in the 160-180 range + a few bigger.

They are out there!!! And I can tell you there are spots that are seeing mule deer at their highest since the die-offs in the 90s.

Overall, it's no surprise mule deer are down. It's no surprise most hunters don't see big bucks. If the objective is to increase the number of mule deer and the number of class IVs you better start looking at the habitat. I can promise you that is the only way you'll see long-term change in the EK. Predator control and changing hunting seasons won't solve the problem of forest ingrowth for a species that evolved in open habitat. Just like in regions 3, 5 and 8, when you have fire suppression in a fire maintained ecosystem the native species will dwindle over time.

Without 'pictures" this thread is useless

[BCrams]

He isn't kidding. I've seen one of the bucks taken in the not too distant past and its a near 200" non-typical ... great buck.

[hunter1947]

My thoughts if you shot a big percentage of your army off that you have then whats left to fight ,regarding the EK same goes for MD I saw a hand full of small MD bucks shot this year in my area I hunted as far as I am concerned these are the up coming new recruitment to our MD stocks right now with the predator problem targeting any mule deer as for most hunters taking any buck for 31 days this has really cut into the numbers of bucks that are out there ,my vote is to go back to 4 point season for 2012 ????

[Fisher-Dude]

My thoughts if you shot a big percentage of your army off that you have then whats left to fight ,regarding the EK same goes for MD I saw a hand full of small MD bucks shot this year in my area I hunted as far as I am concerned these are the up coming new recruitment to our MD stocks right now with the predator problem targeting any mule deer as for most hunters taking any buck for 31 days this has really cut into the numbers of bucks that are out there ,my vote is to go back to 4 point season for 2012 ????

Why would you shoot all the generals off?

And how much fight would your army have if you didn't have any food for them?

The any buck season has NOT affected the deer numbers. You must understand that, and look at the real solutions, which are habitat, competition from elk and WT, and predators, and decide which of those 3 things we have the resources to deal with.