Best for Grizzly Defence

[adrianvip]

So this year my body can't come to our yearly hunting trip near Fort St John so I decide to go alone. Usually even when I go with him we usually hunt alone. We both go on one direction and when the first one get something it let the other one know by radio then the fun begin. He has a shotgun that he keep at the camp at night or when we clean the game but this year since his not coming I will be just with my 300 winmag and my 22. I hunt for over 6 years and I never encounter a Grisly or even a Black Bear. Most of the guys I talk with they at less see one from distance. Do you guys usually take a shotgun for defense or your think the rifle will do the job just in case? I was looking at the Mossberg 500 that comes with the two barrels since the price is under $400. I never hunt with a shotgun and I don't know if I ever will so for defense I just want to make sure it does the job without breaking the budget.

[Fella]

Why not borrow your friends shotty?

[adriaticum]

Get packalarm and a shotgun

[BernDawg]

The shotgun is worth the piece of mind it brings. You're probably on the right track with the 500 as you want something with a shorter barrel that you can point instinctively cause if you ever really need it there won't be very much time to use the sights ;-)

[adrianvip]

Oh Well, I just don't want to be responsible in case something happen. Last time my 22 fall of my ATV and I was luck that I realized just a few yards from were it felt. If is mine is bad but not as bad as if you lose somebody else gun. I'm more interested to know if you guys always have a shotgun with you when your on ATV or walking or the 300 will do the job at short distance. Having the shotgun will just add one more gun on my back and I'm not crazy about but if that's what it takes to save you for a Grisly lunch then I'm ok

[BCBRAD]

I use a Dominion BackPacker ( single shot 12ga ) good for grouse and varmints of any size at spitting distance.

[adriaticum]

I use a Dominion BackPacker ( single shot 12ga ) good for grouse and varmints of any size at spitting distance.

You have to have nuts of steel and eyes of a hawk to feel safe with a single shot gun in grizzly country. ;)

[Singleshotneeded]

If you'll be carrying your .300 WM all the time it's fine, especially with bonded or solid copper bullets(TTSX). If you want something to carry when you're fishing or walking around I'd go with a 12 gauge pump, 00 buck in the tube followed by slugs...shoot it in the face first and hopefully the buckshot will damage it's sight and smelling ability, then fire slugs into the vitals. That will take care of the GRIZZLY BEAR and make sure you don't wind up a GRISLY, bloody mess.

[srupp]

remove the plug as you arnt bird hunting, remove the strap as it wont do much good on your back..get a pump action, fibreoptic front sight, and stick with quality slugs and fill er up.......da da done..

[pete_k]

A slow(er) partner

[adrianvip]

One more reason not to sell my big generator. It makes so much noise on the camp that no bear will come a mile away. At less I don't have to worry at night.

[BCBRAD]

You have to have nuts of steel and eyes of a hawk to feel safe with a single shot gun in grizzly country. ;)
medicine helps :)

[jonz]

I use a Winchester Defender for defense at the camp. But I wouldn't bother bringing it as well as a rifle on a quad or on foot.

[srupp]

I also use the Winchester defender..model 1300??

[Mishka]

When I lived up that way, I purchased a Norinco 14" barrel shotgun. It's easy to carry when I'm hiking, etc and I'm not worried about dropping it or anything like that. It does the trick for peace-of-mind.

[Gun Dog]

Bear spray and your 300 win mag. The advantage of bear spray as a first defence is it's light, easy to use and will either stop the attack or stall it until you can bring out the big iron.

There's two recent studies about bear defence/deterrence:
Efficancy of Firearm For Bear Deterrence in Alaska (2012) (http://http%3A%2F%2Fwww.arcticwild.com%2Fblog%2Fefficacy-of-firearms-for-bear-deterrence-in-Alaska.pdf)
Efficacy of Bear Deterrent Spray in Alaska ( 2008 ) (http://http%3A%2F%2Fwdfw.wa.gov%2Fhunting%2Fbear_cougar%2 Fbear%2Ffiles%2FJWM_BearSprayAlaska.pdf)

A couple of quotes:
Herrero and Higgins ( 1998 ) analyzed 66 nonexperimental
incidents in which bear spray was used on both wild brown
and black bears and found that in aggressive encounters with
brown bears bear spray ended the bears’ unwanted behavior
in 94% (15 of 16) of incidents. However, in 6 cases the bear
continued to act aggressively; in 3 of these cases the bear
attacked the person spraying. In 88% (14 of 16) of the cases
the bear(s) eventually left the area after being sprayed.

Success rates by firearm type were similar with 84% of
handgun users (31 of 37) and 76% of long gun users (134
of 176) successfully defending themselves from aggressive
bears (...). When we compared out-
comes for people who used their firearm in an aggressive bear
encounter (...) to those who had firearms but did not
use them (...), we found no difference in the outcome
(...), whether the outcome was no
injury, injury, or fatality.

[Gateholio]

No way I would buy or carry a shotgun for bears if I already had a 300.

[lucky_magic_stick]

Look at a mare's leg, uncle got on is a 45colt. They are awesome guns and you can get numerous different holsters for it as well. Did i mention they come in .44mag if you really want some "stopping" power. Wicked cool guns, considered a handgun in the states but here they are non-restricted.

I have a weatherby Threat response short shotgun. Light and shoots well, also fun for skeet!

[brian]

GunDog your links are hooped, they should send you to these articles.

http://www.arcticwild.com/blog/efficacy-of-firearms-for-bear-deterrence-in-Alaska.pdf
http://wdfw.wa.gov/hunting/bear_cougar/bear/files/JWM_BearSprayAlaska.pdf

I do remember that the authors of one of the original articles comparing bear spray to firearms acknowledged that no weight was given to the firearm users level of training or competence. In some cases completely untrained people were being given/taking guns for defense and having negative outcomes. This factor does skew the stats in favor of bear spray, which takes very little training to use properly.

[bcsteve]

No way I would buy or carry a shotgun for bears if I already had a 300.

You beat me to it. Your .300 Win Mag is way more powerful and will outpenetrate any slug from a 12g.

[tuffteddyb]

Re: Best for Grisly Defence

http://www.huntingbc.ca/forum/images/shades_of_green/misc/quote_icon.png Originally Posted by Gatehousehttp://huntingbc.ca/forum/images/shades_of_green/buttons/viewpost-right.png (http://www.huntingbc.ca/forum/showthread.php?p=1384589#post1384589)
No way I would buy or carry a shotgun for bears if I already had a 300.




You beat me to it. Your .300 Win Mag is way more powerful and will outpenetrate any slug from a 12g.

totally agree

[squamishhunter]

Pistol grip Moss. 500

[FatBuck]

I haven't used it in self defence, but that is the reason I have it. I like my Henry .30/30 lever action rifle. It has an interesting safety transfer bar mechanism that I feel comfortable with. My favorite feature is the XS Ghost Rings sights. The sights are iron, and designed for quick acquisition of the target.

Rifle
http://henryrepeating.com/rifle-3030.cfm

Sight
http://www.xssights.com/index.php?nID=sights&cID=Sights&pID=sights&sID=rifle

Sight picture & explanation
http://www.xssights.com/index.php?nID=help&cID=Help%2fVideos&pID=help&sID=images

Hopefully I'll never need to use it in defence, but I know after a little practice it became easy to draw quickly.

only downside is the tube magazine.

I also use it with one of these:

http://www.eberlestock.com/G2%20Gunslinger%20II.htm

[Gun Dog]

GunDog your links are hooped, they should send you to these articles.

http://www.arcticwild.com/blog/efficacy-of-firearms-for-bear-deterrence-in-Alaska.pdf
http://wdfw.wa.gov/hunting/bear_cougar/bear/files/JWM_BearSprayAlaska.pdf

I do remember that the authors of one of the original articles comparing bear spray to firearms acknowledged that no weight was given to the firearm users level of training or competence. In some cases completely untrained people were being given/taking guns for defense and having negative outcomes. This factor does skew the stats in favor of bear spray, which takes very little training to use properly.Thanks. Google is adding tracking information to links and I didn't extract the "real" links properly. I'll have to play around with it some more.

A different study of bullets at close range (another Alaska study) showed that high powered rounds -- like a 300 win mag -- fragged at close range. At high velocity some bullets will disintegrate instead of mushrooming. So they're not really a good choice for up close and personal with a bear.

[Gateholio]

A TSX bullet from a 300 will probably go end to end on most bears unless it hits the spine. Don't use blow up bullets in magnums and you will be fine.

[LYKTOHUNT]

I just purchased a grizzly 12 g pump to have around when I don't have my rifle with me, it has 12 inch barrel and ghost ring sights, it is so heavy that when I am out of ammo if I am still alive it will make a great club or maybe something to pound tent pegs in frozen ground. Like others have said your rifle works just fine

[brutus]

Not to many grizz arround fsj,if I were you I would be more scared of the crazy land owners then the grizz.most grizz are in foothills and mountains of the Rockies ,I only ever seen one grizz wich was 100km north west of fsj.chetwind,tumbler,pink mountain,fort Nelson,tuchodi is another story

[Darksith]

Get packalarm and a shotgun

yup, right there. You only need to be worried about it when you sleeping IMO. When you got your rifle over your shoulder, no need to pack a shotgun. Pack alarm would probably scare the bear off initially and wake you up at the very least.

[Ron.C]

yup, right there. You only need to be worried about it when you sleeping IMO. When you got your rifle over your shoulder, no need to pack a shotgun. Pack alarm would probably scare the bear off initially and wake you up at the very least.

Their are lots of different opinions on what gun is best from the perspective of penetration, stopping power, ammunition capacity.........I'm no expert and can't comment on that. I've only had close encounters with a couple griz and luckily none required me to do more then stand my ground and get really vocal. But have backpacked into and hunted in G bear country quite a bit. So my response is from a backcountry hunters perspective. And I either hunt with a bow or Muzzlelaoder.

There's no way to prepare for every situation. Best defence IMO is doing your best to be aware of your surroundings. Problem is, as hunters we often break allot of basic bear saftey rules. So I can understand the thought process of why some chose to carry big caliber guns or mutliple firearms. Myself, I don't let the threat of bears deteremin the type/caliber of gun I carry when hunting. I say if you want to use a 243 for because its the gun you like and shoot and shoot best for the specific game you are after, no need to carry something bigger just because you are in Griz country, or a second gun on your back just in case. Having said that, I ALWAYS have my bear spray on my pack hipbelt regardless of what/where I am hunting. It is in a position where I can discharge it without removing it from my belt or if I do end up with Mr. Griz on top on me, I can grab it from any position. Yes I know. Not ideal and if my gun is in my hands and I think an attack is imminent, I'm shooting. Point is, even if you have the biggest cannon in the woods in your hands, a situation may arise where you can't use it. And bear spray/backup guns can be pretty much useless if carried anywhere they can't be used at a moments notice. But that is just my opinion.

As for pack alarms, they do work. Last year we had a spike camp set up for an evening in an area we wanted to Mule Deer hunt the following day. At about 1am, the pack alarm went off. I'm sure our tent exit didn't look pretty and lacked military precision but needless to say, my partner and I were up and out of the tent pretty F'n fast. The ground was frozen that night and it was tough to see any good sign, but the alarm cord was noticably loose. Something definitely walking into it. Could have been a Griz, could have been a deer. Who knows? But it got us up and scared whatever tripped it away.

[adrianvip]

Ya I know, I never see any Grisly in that area. But I take in consideration that personally I never see in the last 6 years any bear period or any Conservation Officers on any area I hunt. Maybe is just luck considering that all my body has seen at less one bear and one CO since they start hunting. I sleep in a trailer and the rifle sleep with me so the chance that a big papa or mama bear rip the trailer door and jump on me in less than 5 seconds is pretty slim. I'm not a heavy sleeper eider. The only time I will be really scare is when I have to clean the game due to the blood and odors around me that could attract them. I believe that's the most dangerous time since you don't have a gun on your hands and you are just asking for trouble.

[hare_assassin]

If you are going to stick with the 300, as per some advice here, I would suggest getting some see through rings.

A scope, even at 3x, is going to be nearly useless on a close-range, charging grizz.

[Darksith]

forget adding see through rings...come on people. If bears were really a big problem, it would be all over the news every fall. Can you bump into a bear? Of course, does the bear generally regard you as a food source, definitely not. Pack alarm is a great tool, and you are hunting FSJ, not the mountains to the north or west it sounds like. So really, your not in bear country. I wouldn't sweat it. Another scenario for someone though in regards to the pack alarm. You down an animal in bear country, and you gotta go for a return trip. An idea might be to take a few minutes to wrap the pack alarm around the area of the animal. This would at the very least alert you that a bear is on the kill. Now that is a bit of a stretch, but there are lots of ways you can stay safe when alone in the woods by yourself. One doesn't need to overarm themselves unnecessarily.

[Cami]

i think there was some body selling one for 50$ on here.

[Abashai]

Ya I know, I never see any Grisly in that area. But I take in consideration that personally I never see in the last 6 years any bear period or any Conservation Officers on any area I hunt. Maybe is just luck considering that all my body has seen at less one bear and one CO since they start hunting. I sleep in a trailer and the rifle sleep with me so the chance that a big papa or mama bear rip the trailer door and jump on me in less than 5 seconds is pretty slim. I'm not a heavy sleeper eider. The only time I will be really scare is when I have to clean the game due to the blood and odors around me that could attract them. I believe that's the most dangerous time since you don't have a gun on your hands and you are just asking for trouble.

Well ya know what they say... Bears are like Cops... Never around when you want one and always seem to show up when you don't.

If you're in a trailer sleeping I'd be far less concerned about bears than I would about the two legged varmints...

Also if you are already carrying a 300 for hunting it is pointless to carry a second, probably less accessible gun, for defense. Definitely be very wary when preparing an animal and its a good idea to have a loaded gun within immediate hands reach.
Would also be a good idea to practice close/fast target acquisition from sling carry position with your rifle. Comes in handy for those quick hunting situations and just might save your life.

[358jess]

I'd like to hear from someone that has actually seen a grizzly shot with with a 12g slug. I know 300wm's drop grizzlies every year, not so sure about a scatter gun lobbing ash trays.

[sailpunk]

If you are out hunting with a .22 & WM300 you probably aren't going to want to carry a thrid weapon. In camp and generally stomping around the Dominion Grizzly looks like a good last line of defense; short barrel, 3 rounds and light.

For me I do not have a shotgun, yet, and when I am hiking and around camp etc. I keep a CZ-858 with a folding stock (please don't judge). As I said I don't have a shotgun yet and it is fairly compact and can put 5 rounds of 7.62x39 (30-30) down range in short order. Having been an infantryman I am comfortable firing rifles like it quickly. Here is the main drawy back. You look like a douche-bag. When other people are around I shamefully put it in a bag. Again I will be moving to a shotgun when I can; probably a 870 combo with security and field barrels.

[curt]

best bear gun ever I love mine 1895 m marlin 450!!! :)

[Darksith]

I'd like to hear from someone that has actually seen a grizzly shot with with a 12g slug. I know 300wm's drop grizzlies every year, not so sure about a scatter gun lobbing ash trays.

Im pretty sure the CO's use a 12g fairly often