Rodgers Fishing lodge Publicily Announcues they will by Halibut Quota

[lorneparker1]

http://rodgersfishinglodge.com/pdf/Rodgers%20Fishing%20Newsletter%2003_2013.pdf


HERE WE GO!

Lorne


CELEBRATING THE RODGERS FAMILY'S101ST YEAR SPORTFISHING LEGACY
Pan Fried Halibut
Many of you have been asking about the new halibut regulations that wererecently announced by the DFO. The 2013 regulations allow for the retention of1 Halibut a day and 2 in possession which is the same as in 2012. The bigchange for 2013 is that they have now imposed a slot limit on the size of thehalibut that you are allowed to retain. One halibut has to be under 83cm whichis about a 15 pound fish and the other halibut has to be under 126 cm which isabout a 60 pound fish. We feel that these new regulations will not only beconfusing to our guests, but, will also be difficult for us to administer. As you canwell imagine, this is a very controversial and unpopular decision on the part ofthe DFO.On a more positive note, DFO has also established a new program, which isnow available to the Sports Fishing Industry whereby Sports Fishing Lodgeslike ourselves, can purchase extra commercial halibut quota for this comingseason. We have decided that it is in our best interest and the best interest ofour many customers to take advantage of this opportunity. By buying commercialquota, we feel that this decision will greatly simplify this component of ourfishery. For this reason, we have decided to purchase enough commercialhalibut quota to satisfy our needs for this coming season. In short, what this willmean to our customers is that, although the possession limit will still be 2halibut per angler, our customers will now have the option of either retaining orreleasing any oversized halibut that they catch when fishing at Rodgers.We have been looking at several different ways of trying to make thisprogram work. After giving this issue a great deal of thought, we have decidedthat the best and fairest approach is to give our customers the option of keepingor releasing an oversized halibut on a pay as you go basis. In other words, if acustomer chooses to retain any halibut over the legal allowable size, than theon the spot cost of the halibut will be based on the rate of $5.00 a pound. Thisis the price that we are going to be paying per pound to the commercial sectorin order to purchase this extra quota. This extra cost of $5.00 a pound for anoversized halibut can be shared by one or more members of the party. The rateof $5.00 per pound will be based on the dressed weight, cleaned and head offof the halibut and not the round weight. The formula the DFO uses is that thedressed weight is 75% of the round weight. For example, an 80 pound halibutbecomes a 60 pound halibut when cleaned and dressed. The cost of this halibutwould be $5.00 X 60 pounds = $300.00I doubt if many other fishing lodges in B.C. will be offering this program andI feel fortunate that we have been given this opportunity. Our 2013 season isscheduled to open May 1st and according to the DFO forecasts, we areanticipating having another excellent year. The DFO forecasts are calling for anabundance of Coho/Silvers and a high return of 4 and 5 year oldChinooks/Kings. If you would like more information or if you would like to makereservations…
Give us a call at 1-800-429-5288 or email us atrodgersfishinglodge@yahoo.comand check out our new home page at

[IronNoggin]

Shameful! Yet another win for the perpetually dysfunctional DFO and the Fish Brokers (which some term "Slipper Skippers") who obviously have the former Very Much where they want them - in their back pockets that is.

The vast majority of those who guide have publicly noted solidarity to boycott this foolhardy game and are sticking to that. It is downright depressing to see any break those ranks! :confused:

DFO, in it's frenzy to desperately hang onto an allocation program that has proven a dismal failure, is driving the problem into even deeper depths at each and every turn. Buying in to their bullshit at this point simply validates their twisted Agenda (in their minds) and should be avoided at all costs!

I hope the clients of this facility wake up and smell the coffee! While I normally wish most out there Good Luck for the impending season, in this particular case (and any that follow suit) I simply can, nor will NOT! In fact I actually hope they soon realize just what a mistake they are making, and reverse their decision to support DFO & their Fish Broker Masters before they go Belly-Up! And if they don't, that they realize the Full Consequences of their actions! :evil:

Pissed! :evil: :evil: :evil:
Nog

[lorneparker1]

Matt i here yah, but we both know how this is going to play out. Sure some are saying they will boycott the program, but now with this new regulation that the DFO and SFAB have come up with, we are doomed. This REG was also lobbied HARD by The WEST COAST GUIDES ASSOC. which i think you are a member of? I hate to be the i told you so guy that i have been for the last few years( and have been hated on other forums by a "select "group of people for my out spokeness), but in the end im right and have been right. I can tell you there are guides out there as you know that are 1 or 2 trips away from the unemployment line and kraft dinner for the next year for dinner. They surely are not going to deny $1500 because a guy wants to buy quota to have the chance at a trophy hali.


There are lodges that charge $5000 for 3 days, they are surely not going to turn that down because i guy wants a trophy.


Actions speak lowder then words as we all know. And at the end of the year we will see how much quota was actually sold, and it will be depressin and be the end of us ever getting more then 15%. Because ALOT is going to be bought. Wait till next year when our TAC goes down substainally. THAT WILL BE THE END.


I have a real life scenario for you. A VERY good friend of mine has a group of doctors( 8 of them) that has fished with his outfit for 13 years. They fish for 3-5 days and spend 40k ( loging, charter, tips). yes $40,000. They also have a biggest hali derby every year. They sent him an email, that they wish continue this and are all buying quota. OF course he does not support the quota system and it makes him sick that these guys are buying it. But is he supposed to walk away from 40k?

[lorneparker1]

BTW matt, im not blaming you, i cant edit my post. lol

But the lack of forsight that group who would lobbied the SFAB for this regulation should be pointed out. OF course for members of the WCGA a 60lb big fish limit makes sense, as there are not many that big caught over there. 6 a day is perfect because guided anglers will never need 6 fish. They also lobbied for an april 1 start date, which would have put the screws to the Vic guys. This is very much becoming a cut throat industry. The industry loves to say " united we stand, devided we fall" While i agree, desicisions like these do the complete opposite.

This year will be known as the turning point of why my daughter will either have to pay to fish halibut when shes old enough, or why as a recreactional fisherman she doesnt even have access to it.

[lorneparker1]

I should also note that this is not a shot at the volunteers at the SFAB, they were lobbied, they listened, they were put in a corner by the DFO, and well now they are being left out to dry.

Lorne

[blindguy]

Unfreakin real!!! Did you put this up on sfbc?

[lorneparker1]

I would if i wasnt banned! LOL

These clowns as well as any other lodge buying qouta should be treated as COMMERICIAL and none of thier take should be deducted fom the Rec TAC! thats it thats all.

So let me get this right, you will mooch off the rec quota for free, and when you used that all up, you will lease some from the Commericial sector and pass it on to your customer.

TIME TO WAKE UP BOYS!

[Piperdown]

A little early to be in the sauce already isn't it Lorne! This is going to be a long night here :)

[Ozone]

Maybe we should start a halibut farm to take the pressure off the wild halibut like we do with salmon :-D Anyone got a supplier for atlantic halibut eggs :twisted:

[lorneparker1]

A little early to be in the sauce already isn't it Lorne! This is going to be a long night here :)


I dont drink and post.

Actually i barely drink at all :)

Lorne

[Johnnybear]

Shameful! Yet another win for the perpetually dysfunctional DFO and the Fish Brokers (which some term "Slipper Skippers") who obviously have the former Very Much where they want them - in their back pockets that is.

The vast majority of those who guide have publicly noted solidarity to boycott this foolhardy game and are sticking to that. It is downright depressing to see any break those ranks! :confused:

DFO, in it's frenzy to desperately hang onto an allocation program that has proven a dismal failure, is driving the problem into even deeper depths at each and every turn. Buying in to their bullshit at this point simply validates their twisted Agenda (in their minds) and should be avoided at all costs!

I hope the clients of this facility wake up and smell the coffee! While I normally wish most out there Good Luck for the impending season, in this particular case (and any that follow suit) I simply can, nor will NOT! In fact I actually hope they soon realize just what a mistake they are making, and reverse their decision to support DFO & their Fish Broker Masters before they go Belly-Up! And if they don't, that they realize the Full Consequences of their actions! :evil:

Pissed! :evil: :evil: :evil:
Nog

Thank you for this post Nog. Please read the above folks.

The Individual Transferable Quota (ITQ) system has to be dismantled period.

This is what we are going to be faced with in regards to all species like prawns, crab, and others if we don't stick together as recreational anglers and say NO to the "experimental" quota buy in program. Step back and look at the big picture. The only ones that benefit from this are the quota holders of any given species (money) and the DFO (lazy and money).

The DFO is in bed with the commercial fisherman and fish farms. This has to change big time. They are SUPPOSED to be looking out for the welfare of all the wild fish in this great Country of ours and the best interest of ALL Canadians. They are not paid for by us to be otherwise. This is something that should be taken up with your local MLA with emails or phone calls.

I am not a guide and have no desire to be a guide. The vast majority of Canadian recreational anglers that buy licenses (just like me) do hire guides to take them out fishing for halibut. They are no different then myself. They are recreational anglers period. The guides provide the service period. It is the smart way to go IMOE. I have even thought about selling my boat because of the money pit it is. I would then be left to go on a few charters a year just like the majority of recreational anglers do.

The fight is with the Department of Fisheries and Oceans. They are the ones that need the focus of disapproval. They are the ones that need to change. The only way to do that is for us to stick together and make those changes. The guides and lodges have the lobbying power. We have the volunteers and passion. Combined we have a force to be reckoned with.

The organizations are already in place we just need new blood and fire. We can't afford to split the sector. We have to be one united.

Just my thoughts.

Cheers,
John

[40incher]

Time for the apologists to buck up with their best try. Or, possibly, apologize!

Buy your quota boys, and leave the real Canadian UA`s alone.

[lorneparker1]

While we re on the same page in some areas we are polar opposites on others.


The Individual Transferable Quota (ITQ) system has to be dismantled period.

This is what we are going to be faced with in regards to all species like prawns, crab, and others if we don't stick together as recreational anglers and say NO to the "experimental" quota buy in program. Step back and look at the big picture. The only ones that benefit from this are the quota holders of any given species (money) and the DFO (lazy and money).


Agreed, partially. The guides and lodges that are supporting this are and will benefit from this. And more and more will start to follow suit. Its really to bad they are so short sighted that this very decision to buy quota will ultimately be the end of any small charter operation for 2 reasons. 1. They usually dont attract the clientelle that can afford the per pound price on top of the charter price, and 2. they arent in a position to obsorb the cost them selves. So for the next few years places like rogers and many others will do whatever they can to make as much as they can.


The DFO is in bed with the commercial fisherman and fish farms. This has to change big time. They are SUPPOSED to be looking out for the welfare of all the wild fish in this great Country of ours and the best interest of ALL Canadians. They are not paid for by us to be otherwise. This is something that should be taken up with your local MLA with emails or phone calls.


NO argument there.


am not a guide and have no desire to be a guide. The vast majority of Canadian recreational anglers that buy licenses (just like me) do hire guides to take them out fishing for halibut. They are no different then myself. They are recreational anglers period. The guides provide the service period. It is the smart way to go IMOE. I have even thought about selling my boat because of the money pit it is. I would then be left to go on a few charters a year just like the majority of recreational anglers do.

First, do you have any data to prove your statement that the vast majority of anglers hire guides to halbut fish? I heard that the DFO thinks that roughly 100k(1/3) people that bought salt licenses would attempt halibut in any given year. I can assue you that the out of those 100k the vast majority werent guided. I would say the vast majority of Non residents hire guides, but i would defintely say the vast majority of residents do not. I dont have any data to prove that, so its just a hunch. However i will agree that the vast majority of halibut are killed by guided anglers. Why? because that is what they do, each and every day, fill the boat with halibut. Where the jow blow angler who doesnt live on hali grounds ( me and you) go out a few times a year, and may be catch a couple. We are defeintly not putting 4 in the boat every trip every day of the season. Again show me the data that proves that the majority of rec anglers use guides for hali's.
My hunch is that a small percentage hire guides but because thier success rate is so high they kill the majority of the halis. Again just a hun, i will wait for data to prove me wrong.



The fight is with the Department of Fisheries and Oceans. They are the ones that need the focus of disapproval. They are the ones that need to change. The only way to do that is for us to stick together and make those changes. The guides and lodges have the lobbying power. We have the volunteers and passion. Combined we have a force to be reckoned with.

The organizations are already in place we just need new blood and fire. We can't afford to split the sector. We have to be one united.

While i agree, I am sick and tired of being united when ever its convienent for the industry. Do you think the president of the WCGA gave to shit about unity when they lobbied at the last second last year for the slot. OR this year for that matter?Both stating they didnt have time to consult? Do you think these lodges that are buying quota care? Its a dog eat dog world out there right now. and THEY are drawing the line in the sand. Do you think they cared when they tried to push for an april 1 opening which would have completely facked the vic guys? The whole " we are doing whats best for ALL canadians, is such a crock of shit, and is so tiresome, that anyone with a grade 5 education can see through that cloud of bs'. All that is is a smoke screen.

Ive said it many times and ill say it again.

No guide or lodge ever got into the business because they had a calling from God, to make sure every canadian had access to halibut. NONE. THe few that build a business plan never have a line in thier excel spreadsheet for feelings. They also dont have a part in thier plan that when the going gets tough, they will do whats right instead of whats right for them. When they are asked for thier opinion if what is best for all canadians and residents of BC is contridicary to what is good for thier business, business comes first. I dont blame them one bit. But if anyone believes that the descisions being made are in the best interests of all canadians above and beyond thier own interests. I have a bridge for sale.

[IronNoggin]

HiYa Lorne :wink:


This REG was also lobbied HARD by The WEST COAST GUIDES ASSOC. which i think you are a member of?

Yup, I am a Member of the Guide's Association. Only makes sense, for even though I am rather small potatoes, it is what I do after all.

And while I obviously do not speak for that Association, I can offer you a little insight on some of the processes involved:

Your statement "Lobbied HARD" is more than a little of a misnomer.
We were presented with a series of rather sickening options courtesy of DFO. I guess we could have said NO to all of them, and left DFO to do what it pleases, but methinks we all understand just how that would work out...

So, we established a series of priorities: length of season, keeping opportunities for all as reasonable as possible under excruciatingly painful conditions, attempting to keep the possession limits at two, etc etc. And we considered each of the various Evils carefully to try and find a "Best Fit". These discussions were painful for all. And in the end, we "settled" for what we perceived as the Lesser Evil of the Nasty Stuff we'd been presented with.
And although not unanimous, eventually a form of majority was struck.
So, a letter to that effect (which you appear to now tout as "lobbying HARD") was forwarded to the SFAB in that regard.

The SFAB was faced with the exact same set of Ugly Options as we were. And they painfully came to the same set of conclusions as we did. Not overly surprising.

NO-ONE was pleased with the results. NO-ONE was at all comfortable being placed in the position to try and determine which was the least of the Evils presented by DFO. But given the worst of circumstances, they ponied up and based their decisions on what they honestly perceived as to be the least stomach-churning for ALL involved.

And while some negative feedback was expected, the Tar & Feather Crowd immediately lost all focus and reason, and began to Witch Hunt any and all involved. That while Forgetting or simply Dismissing just WHO it was that put us all in this most miserable position.

NO Option existed that would satisfy everyone. NO Option for increased allocation to the Recreational Sector was on the table. Most options would have seen the season abruptly cut short once again for all. So while painful, the option that was selected (and you must know I ain't happy with it myself) will most likely see this year's season run a near full course.

I understand you don't like it. I understand there are many more who feel the same. I am one of them.

For you (amongst others) to suggest the selection was based upon what was (is) best for the guides is Absolutely LUDICROUS!
We are all witnessing booking reductions and cancellations as a consequence. And I expect that trend to continue.
We ALL suffer under the current "regime".

I understand that the vast majority of the guides have told DFO and the PHMA to stuff their "experimental quota transfer program".
While unfortunate one or two have broken ranks with that, I suspect the balance will stick to their principles over the enticement of buying into an extremely corrupt (and likely illegal) government supported Ponzi Scheme. Time will indeed tell, but were I a betting man, I'd lay odds on the assessment I just presented.

This is an overt attempt by DFO to get the Recreational Sector to buy in to their twisted version of harvest allocation. "Purchasing" Access Rights to what already belongs to you is in a word - INSANE! And the Supreme Court of Canada has more than alluded to the fact that the current system is likely outside of the confines of Canadian Law.

In the legal regard, there is currently a case pending decision before the Court right now. One of the commercial fishermen has taken DFO to court over the re-assignment of 3% of the quota from the Commercial to the Recreational Sector last year. The initial findings will carry wide-sweeping consequences for all involved. Let's Hope the Judge gets it Right!
And even if he does, you can fully expect the matter to escalate through the various layers of Courts until it finally settles into the hands of the one labelled "Supreme". We already have a little knowledge of just where their stance lies, so in the end, this may actually work to the Recreational Sector's benefit.

One can Hope. And one can hope at the same time that some of the misplaced Anger out there gets re-directed towards where it rightfully belongs - squarely at the feet of the continuously dysfunctional Department of Fisheries and Oceans :evil:


I should also note that this is not a shot at the volunteers at the SFAB, they were lobbied, they listened, they were put in a corner by the DFO, and well now they are being left out to dry.

While I strongly CONCUR, you are very much sending out mixed messages in this regard by your very own words.

Nog

[lorneparker1]

Thanks for the well thought out reply Matt. I have a ton of respect for you, and always will because of the way you deal with things. Much better then i am used to getting from your aquaintences LOL. Im usually told just to shut up, be quiet, sent nasty emails, and private messages. Or my personal favourite, labelled as a commie, or even better someone with some special AGENDA!. lol Well anyone that knows me, knows the only agenda i have is equality. As you know im rather well educated, extremely passionate, STUBBORN and no non-sense type guy. We will however probably have to agree to disagree on most points as i can sense a rather circular conversation ensuing.


Ill try to keep it to one thread. I just noticed you replied to me in the other thread but i havent read that yet as your reply is quite lengthy, but i will hear tonight when i read through it.

As far as the lobbying. 2 years in row the WCGA and that sfac's recommendations were made into the regualation. No other SFAC that i know of supported that type of restrction in its exact form. Just seems that what they say goes...thats all. ANd i always here "get involved" I have been to every meetin the last 2 years. last nights was the first one i missed. Why? because its obvious that most local SFAC are a feel good process and really other then a bunch of lip service IMO have no impact on the final result. This can be proven in the regulations set forth the last 2 years for halibut. The group with the most $$$ and the most pull gets thier way. BY beef isnt with guides, i am not anti guide. I use them every year, some of my best friends are guides. And ican tell you that most of them are down right ANGRY not only at this regualtion but the folks with the most influence. My issue is us locals should not have to take it in the bum so they can line thier pockets.

No where else in our country is it ok for someone to make money on a common property resource without paying.

You want to log an area? you pay

You want to mine an area? you pay

You want to drill for oil? you pay.

You want to charge money to take people hunting? you pay.


Because of this ALOT of people are left hung from the cross so to speak. Local sfac representives(my personal friends) getting yelled at, threatening emails, north lodges fighting with south and west lodges (which i have personal friends in all those areas guiding). And thats not ok. Although NO ONE as you say was happy with the current option, and i agree with that, they are sure alot more "workable" for some and thier current businesses.

I have lots more to say, but its dinner, movie, ufc, tonight so itll be more then likely tomorrow before i get around to it.

Cheers sir!

[40incher]

Ironnoggin (read steelhead) is true to his name. Thick.

Let's all go kick some butt.

It's all out there now. Let the killing begin, and if it's over 60 no worries. We'll just call in our rich buds.

[lorneparker1]

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Rodgers-Fishing-Lodge/306651109461980?fref=ts

Let them know how you feel

[goatdancer]

Ironnoggin (read steelhead) is true to his name. Thick.

Let's all go kick some butt.

It's all out there now. Let the killing begin, and if it's over 60 no worries. We'll just call in our rich buds.

You really should read his posts a little more carefully.

[Wood butcher]

I learned years ago that DFO's mandate is not to look after the publicly owned resource so that it is there for everyone. Their mandate is to provide jobs and make $$$$.

[40incher]

You really should read his posts a little more carefully.

I think I read it just fine. It's time to kill, that's what the lodges have known for a while.