Fraud thread

[frenchbar]

in light of the fraud thread ...just a question will these people that cheat at getting into record books to basically fuel their egos ..be the same people that are out their breaking are hunting laws cheating at taking the animals in the first place ...the whole thing stinks to high heaven:twisted:
your thoughts...

[BiG Boar]

Would people that cheat on their wives also be poachers? What about a guy that looks at the cards of the guy at the table sitting next to him? What about the guy who has a beer at lunch while pulled over doing some glassing?

'Whose house is of glass, must not throw stones at another.'

[frenchbar]

maybe its time just to get rid of the trophy records .....Do we REALY need it ? if it fuels cheating ...

[pnbrock]

i dont get it ,is there more to this?

[frenchbar]

http://www.huntingbc.ca/forum/showthread.php?80006-Fraud

[GoatGuy]

Record books are fine. B&C was set up to measure the success of the conservation movement. The problem is people have moved away from record books and turned them into trophy books.

I have buddies that have a pile of 'book' critters, some of them would go top 5 or top 10 but they refuse to have anything to do with the trophies or more importantly the people.

Too many people that think hunting is about shooting something bigger than the next guy, often that has to do with having deeper pockets, not challenging themselves physically and mentally. IMO they just don't get hunting.

Throw a fence around it!

[kgriz]

Wow, lots of concern about illegal shown here....if you want to investigate the verbatim legality of something on a grander scale....go through the legislation on shooting from a powerboat and try and find where it is OK for big game. Not, migratory game birds....big game. HMMM Now don't say that its OK because the CO's say so...read the legislation. This is not the only example like this is upon close inspection of legislation.
Make your own choices, try to be a good person etc....period. Lots of lawbreaking and morality breaking done by all...not right perhaps but not quite as dramatic as this all is either.

[BiG Boar]

maybe its time just to get rid of the trophy records .....Do we REALY need it ? if it fuels cheating ...

I believe it was created to try to encourage people to take male species, and keep the populations producing. If it helps with that still, I'm all for it.

Would I ever enter an animal, probably not, I see it more as a money grab. But I would measure an animal, just to see how it measures up compared to others.

I think there are many parts of B&C that are stupid, for example, when measuring a moose, a moose with 10 inch points up top, get a score of 1 inch, per point. Where as if it had 3 inch points up there, it would still score the same.

The fact that symmetry is taken into account for mule deer, however if they have the same sticker on each side, they count as deductions, makes no real sense.

I'm sure there are many other points as to why they system itself sucks.

How many bull elk get moved around the country to be shot as free range animals? I don't really know.

Why is a guy allowed to use a team of 10 spotters and guides, and planes and helicopters in certain areas to "help find" the animals.

Where ever you have competition, you will have someone willing to bend the rules to win. Look at the olympics.

[kgriz]

Oh and as for the "do it for the sport and not the book types who don't enter stuff on some moral ground"...like to see them shoot new number one and then not enter it....knowing the money that it would bring them through possible endorsements, touring the animal etc.

[kgriz]

big boar, i could not agree with you more

[GoatGuy]

Oh and as for the "do it for the sport and not the book types who don't enter stuff on some moral ground"...like to see them shoot new number one and then not enter it....knowing the money that it would bring them through possible endorsements, touring the animal etc.

Some people just aren't into hunting for those reasons.

[frenchbar]

your last sentence pretty much says it all bb .i guess i realy have a hard time with the whole thing of cheating to get into a book ...pretty low if you ask me .

[sammy-j-peppers]

I think there are many parts of B&C that are stupid, for example, when measuring a moose, a moose with 10 inch points up top, get a score of 1 inch, per point. Where as if it had 3 inch points up there, it would still score the same.

The fact that symmetry is taken into account for mule deer, however if they have the same sticker on each side, they count as deductions, makes no real sense.

I'm sure there are many other points as to why they system itself sucks.

.

Spoken like a true SCI fan...... Now there's a group of guys with ego problems. Just because their animals don't score well in the B&C they make up their own rules and count everything. Weak. Next were going to hear how great the GOABC new book is. Everything makes the book! Now there is no need to cheat or lie. Were all wieners!

[wsm]

maybe this is why my dad refused to enter any animal into record books. he used to say too much politics. as when i was young my coat rack was a 23" wide south pemberton blacktail . dont know if it would make book or not but though it might be close. he refused to enter it

[kgriz]

"Some people just aren't into hunting for those reasons. "...Oh I get it...each to his own, but not entering something into the top 10 or even 5 by choice is a world apart from not putting a number 1 in on some moral stance...I talked with the people about 15 years ago that carted the "Duke of Arrowhead" elk around to shows etc. and I think they said it generated about 40K+ per year going to shows etc...to the government I might add as it was confiscated. Like to see someone not want that money on a morale stance who isn't loaded already.

[Barracuda]

everything and everyone competes in one form or another trophy books are just another form . I dont have a problem with trophy books and if someone wants to enter in them then know the rules before hand and then take on the challange and function within the fair chase rules of that particular club you wish to enter it in.

Dont use range finder scopes or lighted nocks if your a bow hunter or tracking equipment for the hunt if you are on a hound hunt etc.



Im sure some folks only find out they are ineligible when they read the rules after they have taken the animal and then they are left with the choice of right and wrong and the the end justifies the means so they omit or make a little white lie cause no one will ever know.

Then there are the ones that simply dont care and will try to get an animal in the book by hook or by crook

Once you make that entry you are a public figure and have opened the door for all sorts of scruitiny .

just some idle thoughts

[kgriz]

People hunt for thier own reasons....you can go through the whole rhetoric of feeding your family, traditional right etc., but in the end you are killing something that a lot of the time had no clue it was coming. Make peace with that with however you have to. I have pondered the whole morality of the sport and truly you can "paint yourself into a corner" pretty fast. That is the problem with the whole morality question when it is applied....then you add in the legality deal, which is not necessarily the same thing and it all gets very confusing.
In the end, I make my choices, help who asks...I tell them where to find the rules and that's it...no preaching, make up your own mind how to apply them.

[Barracuda]

"Some people just aren't into hunting for those reasons. "...Oh I get it...each to his own, but not entering something into the top 10 or even 5 by choice is a world apart from not putting a number 1 in on some moral stance...I talked with the people about 15 years ago that carted the "Duke of Arrowhead" elk around to shows etc. and I think they said it generated about 40K+ per year going to shows etc...to the government I might add as it was confiscated. Like to see someone not want that money on a morale stance who isn't loaded already.


i think you should meet more people of a better quality as there are alot of folks that refuse to partake in all sorts of endeavours on principle and morale grounds regardless of monies involved and they are far from rich.

[GoatGuy]

"Some people just aren't into hunting for those reasons. "...Oh I get it...each to his own, but not entering something into the top 10 or even 5 by choice is a world apart from not putting a number 1 in on some moral stance...I talked with the people about 15 years ago that carted the "Duke of Arrowhead" elk around to shows etc. and I think they said it generated about 40K+ per year going to shows etc...to the government I might add as it was confiscated. Like to see someone not want that money on a morale stance who isn't loaded already.

How about number 2?

I don't think something needs to be entered in B&C to be carted around either.

In any case, if you "got it", we wouldn't be having this discussion.

[Barracuda]

Wow, lots of concern about illegal shown here....if you want to investigate the verbatim legality of something on a grander scale....go through the legislation on shooting from a powerboat and try and find where it is OK for big game. Not, migratory game birds....big game. HMMM Now don't say that its OK because the CO's say so...read the legislation. This is not the only example like this is upon close inspection of legislation.
Make your own choices, try to be a good person etc....period. Lots of lawbreaking and morality breaking done by all...not right perhaps but not quite as dramatic as this all is either.


what are you getting at ? sect 27 is pretty clear in that if it is not propelled there are no limiting factors.

[bassplayer]

For those of us that have watched WildTv, i see they advertise food supplement to enhance antler growth on deer in the states. I wonder if any of the B+C or P+Y deer taken down there have been grown racks or natural racks? Me personally, i don't care about records books. Any animal i take is a trophy to me. The more work i put into the hunt to outsmart the animal, the bigger the trophy it becomes to me.

[421fighter]

On a fishing trip,a cougar crossed the road in front of us. At that time no tag was needed. It didn't take much effort to track it, but getting out of the coulie it died in was something else. It made B and C, after it was entered. Even in the days of snail mail, I was inundated with correspondece. I cannot emagine what it would be like now, with email, etc. I would not ever again enter anything, no matter how grand. (On top of which, the cat I took to the taxidermest was not the cat I got back.And, yes, I am certain). Dave

[Mr. Dean]

in light of the fraud thread ...just a question will these people that cheat at getting into record books to basically fuel their egos ..be the same people that are out their breaking are hunting laws cheating at taking the animals in the first place ...the whole thing stinks to high heaven:twisted:
your thoughts...



It's just a book - Big Whoop.
If you wanna question ethics and/or morality, I think you need to raise your bar a lot higher.

People here are inferring illegalities yet no laws have been broken.
Frankly, I question those views with suspicion and underlying motives.


Really, it's a lot of drama over something that amounts to nothing at the end of the day - There's more important things on my list.
Perhaps spend this commitment of time on Allocation issues and TRY to MAKE a difference instead of a shitstorm over this one.

My thought for the day. :smile:

[Barracuda]

well the way i see it is the laws as defined by acts and regulations are pretty well outlined and everyone plays by those rules , they are not guidlines nor are they a rough guide they are simply a standard across the board that everyone takes care to follow .

The moral code of an individual is a personal set of limitations or guidlines that first satisfy the regulations and secondly satisfy your self imposed ideals.

hunting for a trophy book animal follows the hunting regulations , your personal guidlines and the Rules for entry of the club or sanctioning body you wish to compete in. I dont really see it any different then any other sport of group be it hockey football etc.

its r

[The Dude]

Hey, if you don't like it, you can just go to SA and text the farmer what his price is for the animal. Then talk about colour combinations for the threesome mount.
Just sayin'
To each his own.

[Singleshotneeded]

I'll stick to shooting young tender 4 pt deer and 4 yr old small basket moose, the Yanks and Yank wanna-be's
can play their little games with antlers, I couldn't be bothered. Give me a decent sized critter and a couple of
beers to drink while I'm dressing it, that's Canadian! :-)

[TexasWalker]

I dug around and found this on huntshoot

http://www.huntshoot.com/forums/f5/jackpot-inherited-some-great-reading-material-10426/

Looks like the #2 is(was) held by a Steven Rupp maybe someone knows him and can ask him the story??

[BCHunterTV]

The only crime here is the persons ego got in control and wanted to appear to the man

[kgriz]

My bad on getting off-track..
I guess the strangest part about this thread is the general thought that people enter the books for self-serving purposes like recognition, bragging etc. and are being sniped at by people ON A PUBLIC FORUM....really, what's the purpose putting an opinion ,or a picture especially on here, if its not to put ones' opinion out there or be proud of your kid, friend or yourself and brag about it a bit? Kind of the same recognition as putting your name in a record book, entering the hockey hall of fame, winning a medal etc.
I'm sure that if you knew every detail about every story and pic, there would be some laws broken in many, even if its that they exceeded the speed limit on getting there, lied on their taxes by writing off the gas, cheated on their partner one night at the bar etc....Who cares...Its like there are many just waiting to be a whistle-blower as soon as they can...WOW, not really the point of being part of an activity is it?

[ThinAir]

My bad on getting off-track..
I guess the strangest part about this thread is the general thought that people enter the books for self-serving purposes like recognition, bragging etc. and are being sniped at by people ON A PUBLIC FORUM....really, what's the purpose putting an opinion ,or a picture especially on here, if its not to put ones' opinion out there or be proud of your kid, friend or yourself and brag about it a bit? Kind of the same recognition as putting your name in a record book, entering the hockey hall of fame, winning a medal etc.
I'm sure that if you knew every detail about every story and pic, there would be some laws broken in many, even if its that they exceeded the speed limit on getting there, lied on their taxes by writing off the gas, cheated on their partner one night at the bar etc....Who cares...Its like there are many just waiting to be a whistle-blower as soon as they can...WOW, not really the point of being part of an activity is it?


Exactly...

[Barracuda]

My bad on getting off-track..
I guess the strangest part about this thread is the general thought that people enter the books for self-serving purposes like recognition, bragging etc. and are being sniped at by people ON A PUBLIC FORUM....really, what's the purpose putting an opinion ,or a picture especially on here, if its not to put ones' opinion out there or be proud of your kid, friend or yourself and brag about it a bit? Kind of the same recognition as putting your name in a record book, entering the hockey hall of fame, winning a medal etc.
I'm sure that if you knew every detail about every story and pic, there would be some laws broken in many, even if its that they exceeded the speed limit on getting there, lied on their taxes by writing off the gas, cheated on their partner one night at the bar etc....Who cares...Its like there are many just waiting to be a whistle-blower as soon as they can...WOW, not really the point of being part of an activity is it?



Actually if that was part of the rules for entering the animal then it would matter . If they are unrelated to the activity or have no bearing on eligibility then they are a non issue .

If your sport say no drugs then it means you cant use drugs. period!! it does not mean you can use them as long as you are not caught.

if speeding to your track meet or or wearing white after labour day is not against the rules of your sanctioning body in your choosen activity then you are not penalized for those actions by your organization.

if the rules that you must adhere to are the game regulations in the fish and wildlife act and the rules in your club then those are what you have to follow.

[kgriz]

I agree, cheats are cheats, no question. It's the idea that because they cheated that they should be open to all forms of inquisition and possible ridicule by all that I have some reservations on based on the detail that they have their name entered in a book. Don't belong in the book, take them out...the exact details of why certainly is not the business of everybody, especially when these "details" are often missing key points of context etc. Not to mention the idea of keeping things in proportion.....someone poaching a moose is not equal to selling drugs to kids, but that point is often missed on here.....reminds me of several times when I've heard people state in interviews etc. that they would save their beloved pet before a stranger in certain instances...the world really seems to be losing perspective these days.

[Gateholio]

I dug around and found this on huntshoot

http://www.huntshoot.com/forums/f5/jackpot-inherited-some-great-reading-material-10426/

Looks like the #2 is(was) held by a Steven Rupp maybe someone knows him and can ask him the story??


Interesting first post.

[Philcott]

Interesting first post.

I must agree with you, Clarke. Nothing like heckling from a darkened room.

[Gateholio]

I often wonder what the hunting world would be like if nobody ever started a record book, or even better- no hunter names were printed in them. I wonder if we would be better off, have more fun, be less jealous and have a completely different value system on a dead animals worth. Maybe pounds of meat recovered would have been the system to score the accomplishment?

[Gateholio]

I must agree with you, Clarke. Nothing like heckling from a darkened room.


I assume it's a banned member or someone using 2 accounts that is also posting in this thread under their regular name. Internet hijinks, you know....Ill get to it later. :)

[Barracuda]

I agree, cheats are cheats, no question. It's the idea that because they cheated that they should be open to all forms of inquisition and possible ridicule by all that I have some reservations on based on the detail that they have their name entered in a book. Don't belong in the book, take them out...the exact details of why certainly is not the business of everybody, especially when these "details" are often missing key points of context etc. Not to mention the idea of keeping things in proportion.....someone poaching a moose is not equal to selling drugs to kids, but that point is often missed on here.....reminds me of several times when I've heard people state in interviews etc. that they would save their beloved pet before a stranger in certain instances...the world really seems to be losing perspective these days.


Im sure the PotHead portion of hbc will say that selling a kid dope is harmless but poaching a is a crime and Mr (or Mrs) illegal moose shooter will say that the pot pushers are the real criminals and shooting a moose illegally is a victimless act .

The other 75% of the hunters condemn both :lol:

[kgriz]

"I often wonder what the hunting world would be like if nobody ever started a record book, or even better- no hunter names were printed in them. I wonder if we would be better off, have more fun, be less jealous and have a completely different value system on a dead animals worth. Maybe pounds of meat recovered would have been the system to score the accomplishment?"
Same could be said about this site in the context of posting photos...no photos of animal allowed...only pictures of the scenery, worn-out boot leather etc allowed. The meat thing is obviously a personal preferrence inplying that its better than trophy hunting. Your opinion. It could certainly lead to statements like:
"Its not the size of the pile of meat that counts...its how it tastes" ...hilarious

[kgriz]

as far as the pot-smoking reference...wasn't really the point...pick something really nasty then that nobody thinks is OK...I'm simply poking fun the drama involved.

[Gateholio]

We don't have a ranking system for dead animals on HBC. Sure, everyone gets excited about a big animal but we get excited over tasty meat, too. Even our big game contest stresses participation rather than antler size.

There is no implication against trophy hunting. Simply hypothetical speculation on how we would "rank" a hunters accomplishment if traditional scoring systems were not developed.


"I often wonder what the hunting world would be like if nobody ever started a record book, or even better- no hunter names were printed in them. I wonder if we would be better off, have more fun, be less jealous and have a completely different value system on a dead animals worth. Maybe pounds of meat recovered would have been the system to score the accomplishment?"
Same could be said about this site in the context of posting photos...no photos of animal allowed...only pictures of the scenery, worn-out boot leather etc allowed. The meat thing is obviously a personal preferrence inplying that its better than trophy hunting. Your opinion. It could certainly lead to statements like:
"Its not the size of the pile of meat that counts...its how it tastes" ...hilarious

[Philcott]

. Simply hypothetical speculation on how we would "rank" a hunters accomplishment if traditional scoring systems were not developed.

My ranking system:

1 Home safely 10 points
2 Good time with family and/or friends 10 points
3 Sought after game shot and retrieved 10 points
4 Name in record book 10 points

Maximum score attained in 30 years of hunting so far 30 points

I'd say I'm happy with that.

[kgriz]

that ranking pretty much sums it up for me too. The meathunter vs trophy looked like a shot but wasn't intended...I do both myself.

[Brett]

I often wonder what the hunting world would be like if nobody ever started a record book, or even better- no hunter names were printed in them. I wonder if we would be better off, have more fun, be less jealous and have a completely different value system on a dead animals worth. Maybe pounds of meat recovered would have been the system to score the accomplishment?

his sounds like it would have been a great idea!

[The Dawg]

his sounds like it would have been a great idea!

Wouldnt make a difference. I had doubters that my mulie buck from a couple years ago that it didnt weigh 110lbs deboned.

[sawmill]

My ranking system:

1 Home safely 10 points
2 Good time with family and/or friends 10 points
3 Sought after game shot and retrieved 10 points
4 Meat in the freezer and a great dinner for the kids and grandkids everytime they come over


Maximum score attained in 30 years of hunting so far 30 points

I'd say I'm happy with that.

There,fixed it for you.
Screw the book,it`s nice to have impressive racks on the wall,friends and grandkids think I`m a good hunter,but as far as "The Book",I could not give a shit.
I like to sit by my woodstove downstairs and B.S. hunting with friends while they see what I have taken over the years but it ain`t a pissin` match.
It`s all about the big roast,mashed spuds,gravy and Yorkie puddings and everyone loving the bounty.That right there is my record,just ask my kids and grandkids.

[835]

There,fixed it for you.
Screw the book,it`s nice to have impressive racks on the wall,friends and grandkids think I`m a good hunter,but as far as "The Book",I could not give a shit.
I like to sit by my woodstove downstairs and B.S. hunting with friends while they see what I have taken over the years but it ain`t a pissin` match.
It`s all about the big roast,mashed spuds,gravy and Yorkie puddings and everyone loving the bounty.That right there is my record,just ask my kids and grandkids.


Yep, I aggree.
My "Bench mark" to some what the book might be, Are bucks shot by my friends and family. That is my "Book". When i shoot one bigger then my buddy, my animal gets talked about around the fire. When my buddy shoots one bigger then mine it gets talked about around the fire. Yep, Every year i try to best my friends, and they do me. But thats my competition, and its a friendly one.

[Barracuda]

Yep, I aggree.
My "Bench mark" to some what the book might be, Are bucks shot by my friends and family. That is my "Book". When i shoot one bigger then my buddy, my animal gets talked about around the fire. When my buddy shoots one bigger then mine it gets talked about around the fire. Yep, Every year i try to best my friends, and they do me. But thats my competition, and its a friendly one.

if you think about it that really is no different then haveing a record book just on a smaller less formal scale .

Big bear,fish ,antler, pelt contest held every year with many clubs are the same thing.

[Buckzilla]

Interesting first post.
Exactly what I was thinking!

[dragonslayer]

There,fixed it for you.
Screw the book,it`s nice to have impressive racks on the wall,friends and grandkids think I`m a good hunter,but as far as "The Book",I could not give a shit.
I like to sit by my woodstove downstairs and B.S. hunting with friends while they see what I have taken over the years but it ain`t a pissin` match.
It`s all about the big roast,mashed spuds,gravy and Yorkie puddings and everyone loving the bounty.That right there is my record,just ask my kids and grandkids.

I most certainly agree with you on this, it is not about records Its a passion, and the love of the sport.

[Maxx]

It's just a book - Big Whoop.
If you wanna question ethics and/or morality, I think you need to raise your bar a lot higher.

People here are inferring illegalities yet no laws have been broken.
Frankly, I question those views with suspicion and underlying motives.


Really, it's a lot of drama over something that amounts to nothing at the end of the day - There's more important things on my list.
Perhaps spend this commitment of time on Allocation issues and TRY to MAKE a difference instead of a shitstorm over this one.

My thought for the day. :smile:

Interesting how you and gatehouse seem to be trying to deflect the fact that a very well know member on this board may have tried to de-fraud the record book. Protecting your own?

[Gateholio]

Interesting how you and gatehouse seem to be trying to deflect the fact that a very well know member on this board may have tried to de-fraud the record book. Protecting your own?


What does this even mean? If I wanted to "deflect" something I'd just delete the thread. This thread was started as a discussion about the record book and if it encourages poaching, not srupp. If you want to discuss srupp, he has a thread he started himself on the topic.

Although to be clear, I think it's bullshit that someone will post allegations about someone without any actual evidence. Especially as the topic is as lame record book "integrity" when the books are full of people that actually poached animals.

[Ambush]

I like record books. I like looking at the awesome animals in record books. I like seeing where they came from. I especialy like the old, still standing records, shot by just regular guys out hunting. I like looking up the stories that go with these animals and men.

The record books are just like any other endeaver. People will cheat in sports, card games, car races and betting.
That doesn't make playing cards bad, or sports or racing.

People will cheat in the record books. That doesn't make record keeping bad or the honest hunters that enter them.

Don't like'm, don't enter' m. But you don't have to put those down that do.

[.330 Dakota]

What does this even mean? If I wanted to "deflect" something I'd just delete the thread. This thread was started as a discussion about the record book and if it encourages poaching, not srupp. If you want to discuss srupp, he has a thread he started himself on the topic.

Although to be clear, I think it's bullshit that someone will post allegations about someone without any actual evidence. Especially as the topic is as lame record book "integrity" when the books are full of people that actually poached animals.

Even if it were true,,and I see NO evidence of it, it still is very LOW class to make it public. If this clown has actual evidence it should be presented to the record book people, and thats the end of it. This is just petty bullshit mudslinging and everyone hear knows it...Gatehouse is absolutely correct here and should shut this guy down

[Gilmore]

Interesting how you and gatehouse seem to be trying to deflect the fact that a very well know member on this board may have tried to de-fraud the record book. Protecting your own?

I don't think the original poster was trying to slam anyone as you are. I think he was posing a question that record books in spite of what they rally stand for, which to me is to honor the best of each species, yet they may and could encourage cheating, simple as tha,t and he may have a point.

Your words-"a very well know member on this board may have tried to de-fraud the record book" I think your key word is may, you have no proof yet you have no problem slandering away. As Gatehouse said the member your slandering has started his own thread...why don't you go over there and shoot your mouth off??

[frenchbar]

Thats all it was chad ..just the question does record books encourage cheats ,,that is all .and i will say it again ..anyone that cheats to get into a record book is a snake !

[Buck]

Record books are fine. B&C was set up to measure the success of the conservation movement. The problem is people have moved away from record books and turned them into trophy books.

I have buddies that have a pile of 'book' critters, some of them would go top 5 or top 10 but they refuse to have anything to do with the trophies or more importantly the people.

Too many people that think hunting is about shooting something bigger than the next guy, often that has to do with having deeper pockets, not challenging themselves physically and mentally. IMO they just don't get hunting.

Throw a fence around it!

Yep on the one hand we are competitive creatures and on the other we are much more than that

[BiG Boar]

does record books encourage cheats?....anyone that cheats to get into a record book is a snake !

Obviously there would be no cheats if there were no recording of what they were cheating.

Secondly, why do you base so much of your opinion on how many records one has in the book? Why is your record in the book so important? Why do you care so much about the score of horns? Weather made up or not?

I actually used to have a very high opinion of you frenchbar! You were a good guy who would go out and get meat for your family and friends. Now it seems all you care about is weather or not you can smear someones name in the mud. A guy who has helped out, and offered to help out many more people than I recall you doing on this forum. I think if we were to take an HBC poll as to who has encouraged and helped out more people and furthered the sport, you may not fair as well as you think.

Time you squash this beef and ask yourself why scores are so important to you. At the end of the day your wife and kids aren't going to want your mounts when you die, but they'll remember the meals you had together and the time you spent with them.

Even if srupp did swap a grizz for a black bear, you're destroying your own reputation on here.

[frenchbar]

[QUOTE=BiG Boar;1116441]Obviously there would be no cheats if there were no recording of what they were cheating.

Secondly, why do you base so much of your opinion on how many records one has in the book? Why is your record in the book so important? Why do you care so much about the score of horns? Weather made up or not?

I actually used to have a very high opinion of you frenchbar! You were a good guy who would go out and get meat for your family and friends. Now it seems all you care about is weather or not you can smear someones name in the mud. A guy who has helped out, and offered to help out many more people than I recall you doing on this forum. I think if we were to take an HBC poll as to who has encouraged and helped out more people and furthered the sport, you may not fair as well as you think.

Time you squash this beef and ask yourself why scores are so important to you. At the end of the day your wife and kids aren't going to want your mounts when you die, but they'll remember the meals you had together and the time you spent with them.

Even if srupp did swap a grizz for a black bear, you're destroying your own reputation on here.[/QUOTE i could give a shit what you or anyone else think of me ..i dont have records in any book and could realy give a shit about scores ..i'll leave that to the likes of you...ive got 1 deer in the last 4 yrs and could care less if i kill another animal in my life ..have a nice day ...and by the way where did i smear someones name in the mud...?

[ryanb]

I think fremchbar's question is a good one. Yes I'm almost certain anyone trying to defraud the record books is also out there poaching and/or violating other measures of the wildlife regulations.

[The Dude]

Alllllllll kinds of Coyotes and wolves running around out there. Cougars too.
Thousands of them.
Just sayin' Ya'll.

[Gilmore]

Obviously there would be no cheats if there were no recording of what they were cheating.

Secondly, why do you base so much of your opinion on how many records one has in the book? Why is your record in the book so important? Why do you care so much about the score of horns? Weather made up or not?

I actually used to have a very high opinion of you frenchbar! You were a good guy who would go out and get meat for your family and friends. Now it seems all you care about is weather or not you can smear someones name in the mud. A guy who has helped out, and offered to help out many more people than I recall you doing on this forum. I think if we were to take an HBC poll as to who has encouraged and helped out more people and furthered the sport, you may not fair as well as you think.

Time you squash this beef and ask yourself why scores are so important to you. At the end of the day your wife and kids aren't going to want your mounts when you die, but they'll remember the meals you had together and the time you spent with them.

Even if srupp did swap a grizz for a black bear, you're destroying your own reputation on here.


Who exactly did Frenchie smear BigBoar?? He asked a legitimate question that has some merit on a hunting website that alot of people agree with. I think that now it is you who is reading to much into something and is starting to sling mud. I think most people on this site agree with your assessment of Srupp, I know I do, but be careful not to step in your own shit here. I think everyone needs to just step away form the keyboard and calm down.

[bigwhiteys]

I think everyone needs to just step away form the keyboard and calm down.
Human behavior... and the Intraweb lol....

[kgriz]

If I rememeber correctly...its a looong time ago, wasn't the difference between black and griz skulls as simple as one will stand on end on a flat surface and one will not? Something to do with the bone structure on the back of the skull...I've tried it on several I have and it works. This was from a grade 8 CORE course on skull ID...IF it is that simple how could anybody have been fooled or expected to be in the first place?

[chilcotin hillbilly]

1/2slam should know the difference between hard evidence and hear say as he is an RCMP and should know better. Shame on you 1/2 slam you have done yourself a real disservice.

[huntcoop]

1/2slam should know the difference between hard evidence and hear say as he is an RCMP and should know better. Shame on you 1/2 slam you have done yourself a real disservice.

Perhaps he knows more than he is willing to share......? Cops never lie.... :mrgreen: do they....

[Rodd]

1/2slam should know the difference between hard evidence and hear say as he is an RCMP and should know better. Shame on you 1/2 slam you have done yourself a real disservice.

Agreed! Well that explains alot to me. Thanks CH for the update!

[sled92]

Looks like Srupp's "Allegations" thread got pulled. 1/2slam is listed as banned now as well.

[REMINGTON JIM]

Looks like Srupp's "Allegations" thread got pulled. 1/2slam is listed as banned now as well.

Anyone know why ? or care to speculate as to why ? RJ

[rocksteady]

Anyone know why ? or care to speculate as to why ? RJ

Cause the thread was going sideways and degarding into a name calling spat of allegations/rebuttals that was in no way going to help the hunting community of HBC...

[REMINGTON JIM]

Cause the thread was going sideways and degarding into a name calling spat of allegations/rebuttals that was in no way going to help the hunting community of HBC...

I can agree with that ! - but why not just lock it ! and leave up what info was already there ?

[wsm]

because the info was nothing but slander, .. no proof . ty mods for deleting that thread , now hopefully this one can stay on the straight and narrow

[835]

10 more nights and it will all be ok.........

[MB_Boy]

10 more nights and it will all be ok.........

Those 10 nights can't pass soon enough......we're inevitably heading towards;

http://themace.ca/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/thunderdome.jpg



........before those 10 nights are up; "two men enter, one man leaves". :wink: :mrgreen:

[338 winmag]

I can agree with that ! - but why not just lock it ! and leave up what info was already there ?

Well Jim it's like this, the James Younger gang was preparing a lynching until the Srupp posse rode into town to save his a$$ and now the Pinkertons are here to cover up the evidence :-D

[wsm]

Well Jim it's like this, the James Younger gang was preparing a lynching until the Srupp posse rode into town to save his a$$ and now the Pinkertons are here to cover up the evidence :-Dwhat evidence? the bs slander your speak of? . 2-3rd hand info . a court would kick this out . unless there is concrete evidence , documents ,pictures ,etc let it drop.. IMO 1/2 slam is a girl , but just because i said it doesn't make it true. my .02 cents

[huntcoop]

Did the "accused" actually state that what was claimed against him was indeed false?

[.330 Dakota]

1/2slam should know the difference between hard evidence and hear say as he is an RCMP and should know better. Shame on you 1/2 slam you have done yourself a real disservice.

And theres the problem..H/A wasnt hiring that day...lol

[BCHunterTV]

What I think myself and others really have a hard time believing its that a boasted experienced grizzly bear hunter by mistake mis-id's a skull he has in a box and enters it for a the BC Record Book for the number 2 spot!! And when he's asked to provide the skull he decides to pull his name...?

Okay getting into the book might not be everyone's cut of tea, but it's matters to some ad certainly did when he entered

[olharley guy]

And theres the problem..H/A wasnt hiring that day...lol

Howdy, now that is mean! LOL Maybe it's time for everyone to get on a new topic, like giving the cordinates of where the wife and I can get a couple nice deer this spring-I mean next fall. Later

[Gateholio]

I can agree with that ! - but why not just lock it ! and leave up what info was already there ?

What purpose would that serve?

[wsm]

What I think myself and others really have a hard time believing its that a boasted experienced grizzly bear hunter by mistake mis-id's a skull he has in a box and enters it for a the BC Record Book for the number 2 spot!! And when he's asked to provide the skull he decides to pull his name...?

Okay getting into the book might not be everyone's cut of tea, but it's matters to some ad certainly did when he enteredah there it is. hard to believe . but not impossible. peoples opinions dont make them true. i have seen a sheep horn get passed round to co's and biologists, hunters, etc. people u would think can age this animal . u get a 50/50 split on the POTENTIAL age of the animal . u wouldn't believe this could happen

[IPA]

I have to agree with Bc hunter on this one. I was told of this story years ago and had a hard time believing it to be true. Steve has shown himself to be good guy by helping a lot of people with hunting and other things. When he says he could not id the proper skull, and he has shown that he is experienced by his own actions on here that sealed it for me. Sometimes good people do dumb things and I believe this to be the case. Also I was standing beside 1/2 slam when he was asking questions and know who and what was said. Sad to say but good people can do dumb things just like the rest of us, heck just ask Pete Rose.

[Gateholio]

What is really astonishing is that anyone would go to the trouble to investigate something that may or may not have happened many years ago, then go on to pass public judgement on a website with no supporting documentation, for something as insignificant as this.

Even if the accusation was accurate, does it really matter? Do we really care that someone may have made a minor mistake (not even worthy of a CO investigation or file #) at some point in their life?

What does 1/2 slam have to gain by sticking his nose into something that does not concern him? This isn't a case of reporting a poacher and bringing him to justice, it's just trying to malign someone with no gain to the public or hunting community.

What is more beneficial to the hunting community?

Is it 1/2 slam finger pointing at someone over an alleged misdeed years ago?

Or is it Steve Rupp helping dozens and dozens of people over the course of years and years?

[wsm]

I have to agree with Bc hunter on this one. I was told of this story years ago and had a hard time believing it to be true. Steve has shown himself to be good guy by helping a lot of people with hunting and other things. When he says he could not id the proper skull, and he has shown that he is experienced by his own actions on here that sealed it for me. Sometimes good people do dumb things and I believe this to be the case. Also I was standing beside 1/2 slam when he was asking questions and know who and what was said. Sad to say but good people can do dumb things just like the rest of us, heck just ask Pete Rose.how do u know the guy you spoke to gave you the whole truth no details missed . and ill bet the guy u spoke to got his info second hand, which makes the info slam is spouting is 3rd hand info . totally unreliable

[rocksteady]

Stolen from Gates post, but amended a bit...


"What is really astonishing is that anyone would go to the trouble" to start a thread, which they know will get shut down, and once it does, for someone else to start a similar thread that is the same poop, different day, regarding the same incident/person and not expect it to get shut down.... And then when that gets shut down, a third, by a bit different title, someone tries to sneak it in back door on the mods so that they (the initiator of the 3rd thread) can type his 2 bits of blab, before it gets shut down...

Oh, and let's not forget that after that someone will make a really stupid, biased, one sided "poll" to try to belabour said points of the first 3 threads

Gotta love HBC :)

[wsm]

lock it up:-? shouldn't have gone on this long

[rocksteady]

Oh and one more thing......










IBTL :)

[Jagermeister]

I see that 1/2 slam got the Lui Passaglia. Nice punt!