clearcut at my honey hole

[Fixit]

3-12, a place ive been to many times in past years.

always seen many deer, and the odd moose there.
yesterday was the first time ive been there this season, only to find burning slash piles dotting the hillsides, clearcuts galore...

figured it would be easy to nail a mule doe up there,
came home with two grouse instead.

im guessing that all the logging has scared them off, how long does it take for an area like that to recover back to what it once was?

[coach]

3-12 is a big area. Lots of deer there. Shouldn't have any trouble filling a mule doe LEH.

That said, although I've seen deer in new cuts next to burning slash many times, those new cuts seem to be better when they are two years or older.

[Marlin375]

how long does it take for an area like that to recover back to what it once was?

Maybe never. Or at least not in your life time.

Takes about 80-100 years to grow a nice mature stand of fir, throw in a mix of open patches of grass, aspen, poplar, red willow and a few junipers with a good smatering of buck brush.

Our modern replacement is pine trees as far as the eye can see.......until the beetles get them......then we have to start again.

[Westslope]

Rarely will you find large cut blocks in the stand you have just described Marlin375. If it was cut heavily it was probably a pine area that had the odd fir clump, very little of all the other stuff you described. I do agree that we should be mixing more species into the reforestation phase if the site will support them.

[coach]

It's a bit of a mess out there - but there's still some stands of old growth left. Most of what has been clearcut was beetle killed pine. I'm fairly certain, Fixit was asking how long it will be until the deer return. The answer is, it'll be good habitat within two years and continue to get better every year after that. You guys can debate clearcutting all you like - I'll help fixit get his deer via PM.

[Big Lew]

Unless it was on private property, there's been a moratorium on logging healthy non-pine timber while beetle kill is being addressed throughout most of the Province. As "coach" said, your area was most likely cut because of beetle kill. One of my Brothers is a contractor logging such areas in region 3, and I drop by to visit periodically where ever he's working. Often there are deer, including big bucks, poking about while they're working. I have done well hunting these cut blocks from the first cutting right through to when the forest is too thick and high, at which time I move back to another fresh cut block. (Mind you, I hunt only early in the season)

[moosinaround]

Maybe never. Or at least not in your life time.

Takes about 80-100 years to grow a nice mature stand of fir, throw in a mix of open patches of grass, aspen, poplar, red willow and a few junipers with a good smatering of buck brush.

Our modern replacement is pine trees as far as the eye can see.......until the beetles get them......then we have to start again.

A nice, glass half empty, chicken little the sky is falling reply!!

2 years will see some of the new underbrush come up, and the deer and moose will be in there chowing down big time!! They will use the habitat differently though, so just keep your eyes on their usage, and hunt it accordingly!

A positive glass half full reply;)!! Moosin

[finngun]

deer like moss..and logging areas has lots of it down in the easy reach....

[.300wsm]

new cuts are awsome but when there huge it's a little harder to spot so much more area to cover. decent optics and patience = success. 3-12 is pretty butchered

[Marlin375]

So would it be fair to say that we are clear-cutting areas that we planted originally. Are they second growth pine areas? and always have been pine. I am asking about 3-12. I know there are still mature mixed timber ridges that are being left intact, presumably, primarily for Mule deer.

I think about when I was in grade school in Victoria and taking a tour to the Forestry museum in Port Alberni. I was impressed that the "forestry companies" would have to wait for three generations of lifelong employees (80 years) to cut the tree I just planted....it was a fir tree. Of course this is not Vancouver Island and never will be but I know that fir trees will grow here, it just takes a while.

[Moosehunter64]

When was the last time you were in Port Alberni? It would break your heart to see the 40 year old forests they are cutting down right now.All that stuff they told you in school back then was a bunch of BS I was taught the same thing.They just cut down anything now that they can export,doesn`t matter how big it is.

[dana]

I find that deer love new clearcuts from the first year on till about year 5 or 6, depending on elevation and the species planted. Most large clearcuts are indeed lodgepole pine salvage and now we are seeing heavy spruce beetle attack in much of the Kamloops TSA. And no, the lodgepole is not second growth. The vast majority of the Pl is 80-120 years old. And it is all dead. Much of what we are logging has been dead for several years now. So, if your 'honey hole' wasn't harvested, you would be finding it a jungle of blowdown within a few years and probably wouldn't hunt it ever again anyways.

[Marlin375]

A nice, glass half empty, chicken little the sky is falling reply!!



True enough....I was not trying to be Mr. doom and gloom. I lost a "honey hole" a few years ago myself...a 20yr favorite, lost to a fire, so not quite the same.
But I do know it won't be the same while I am still breathing. Like loosing a friend. If it sounds abit quirky getting attached to a spot in the woods then I guess that makes me quirky :)

[Fisher-Dude]

I find that deer love new clearcuts from the first year on till about year 5 or 6, depending on elevation and the species planted. Most large clearcuts are indeed lodgepole pine salvage and now we are seeing heavy spruce beetle attack in much of the Kamloops TSA. And no, the lodgepole is not second growth. The vast majority of the Pl is 80-120 years old. And it is all dead. Much of what we are logging has been dead for several years now. So, if your 'honey hole' wasn't harvested, you would be finding it a jungle of blowdown within a few years and probably wouldn't hunt it ever again anyways.


Yep, and ungulates don't like blowdown much. It's far to easy for kitties to ambush them from above in that crap, and escape is difficult.

3-12 and 8-11 really got hammered by the beetle. Some drainages that were we leaving intact in the 90s in exchange for a few blocks > 60 ha (thanks NDP and the Forest Practices Code :( ) are now being cleaned out because they are over 95% dead. Wish we could do some broadcast burns in there again and get some better habitat, faster.

[moosinaround]

True enough....I was not trying to be Mr. doom and gloom. I lost a "honey hole" a few years ago myself...a 20yr favorite, lost to a fire, so not quite the same.
But I do know it won't be the same while I am still breathing. Like loosing a friend. If it sounds abit quirky getting attached to a spot in the woods then I guess that makes me quirky :)
The animals still use the area! They use it differently! I hunt an area that was IU logged in the 60's and 70's! It still produces lots of animals, not every year for me, but there are quite a few taken from this area. It is still a honey hole, just rearranged a bit. I know what you are saying, I was just foolin around a bit! I had a spot down the Blackwater south of PG which I loved to hunt, till the dam salvage logging! What can you do but change your tactics and strategies a bit!! Moosin

[Big Lew]

As I mentioned, I've seen deer in fresh logging, and every year there after until it became too thick and high to easily hunt, although there are still deer using them. The exceptions would be if the clear cut was in flat country away from any high ridges or mountainsides, and again, after the big tilling machines have ripped up the slash if they leave deep indiscriminate furrows and holes. We have a difficult and ankle-twisting time walking through this mess, and deer seem to avoid it as well, probably for the same reason. Cattle and moose don't seem to be bothered though.

[Looking_4_Jerky]

I have seen big bucks and piles of deer co-mingling with heavy forest equipment at work. Afterwards, I have seen both mule deer and whities munching on fresh doug-fir shoots off scrap limbs. They also really like the right kinds of lichens, so depending on the age and ecological community that was logged, the deer can be in there as they log it and immediately thereafter. I do find though, that in areas of pine-slash, especially blocks left with loads of coarse woody debris, the deer tend not to use them as much until some decent browse shows up, usually a couple of seasons after. You can get the odd animal at any time, but a block with ample early seral browse (Currants, willows, fireweed, rose, huckleberries, douglas maple, red-osier dogwood, valerian, etc) and 4-5' regen is deer and moose heaven (especially if they have decent topography). That usually takes 3-6 years after planting, and usually they're planted a inside of a couple of years after harvest.

As others have said, the deer are likely still nearby, just go and re-learn your new honey hole.

[doubled]

Not sure where in 3-12 you were but the muleys have headed out of the plateau area for a few weeks now.

[Ltbullken]

When you see good browse in the cut close to good cover, you'll find deer and moose.

[CanuckShooter]

One of my best deer spots was right in the middle of a huge freshly cut block [1/4x1/4 mile]...every time I would walk through there it seemed like I would see does..so I built a ground blind and shot nice bucks there every season until it grew up and visibility was lost. Personally I would rather see all the beetle killed pine logged off than be left to fall into a pile of 'pick up sticks' as can been seen in some areas around here now.