Newbie with a few questions

[SummitX]

Hi guys and girls, been browsing around here the last couple weeks, looks like a great informative site so I thought I had better join!

Little about me, my wife and I just got our PAL and CORE courses done, so we're first time hunters from the Maple Ridge area, figure to start off small with some grouse and such, I see them all over on the way to the cabin so its time to start putting dinner on the table.

Anyways as its customary to introduce with a joke. A hunter is lost in the woods, remembering the universal sign of distress he fires 3 shots into the air and waits... nothing. He fires 3 more shots into the air and waits.... nothing, finally after some thought he tells himself "I hope someone finds me soon, these are my last 3 arrows"

Anways as for a couple questions that I had pop up

-the first one is regarding safes, I did a search on here and found the sentry safes from costco seem to be a popular choice, I want to spend between $200-400 dollars, and my main purpose is to keep my 4 year old boy out. Currently my options seems to be the Sentry 5 gun safe for $269.00 which is key lock, or an 8 gun safe from Canadian tire with a dial lock on sale for $239.00 regularly $399 http://www.canadiantire.ca/AST/browse/5/SportsRec/1/Hunting/FirearmSecurityProtection/PRDOVR~0750046P/Safe+with+Combo+Lock%2C+8-Gun.jsp?locale=en. I was thinking the dial lock from Canadian tire, bigger safe and the dial lock over a key lock seems to be a plus, but I worry about quality. Do the safes at costco usually come on sale around or after hunting season to wait and see if one of their nicer Sentry safes come on sale? Any thoughts on this or recomendations would be appreciated.

-second question is regarding the remington 870 magnum marine shotgun, will the wood kits for the 870 work on the 870 marine magnum? I really like the gun, but want to swap out the black synthetic with the nice walnut, should make for a nice gun at the range, or to take with me while hiking/camping in heavy bear territory.

[SummitX]

well in case anyone else was interested, I picked up the combo safe from Canadian Tire, its actually much better quality than I expected, a step above the key lock stack on safes. I don't expect it to keep a thief out, but it will definetly slow him down and create a problem, and will be more than enough for my original needs.

[Mr. Dean]

I live on the premise that if a thief wants in, the POS will get in.
4 year olds, different story.

Can't help ya about the stock Q. IMO the swap *should* work.


I welcome the pair of you here to HBC - Good luck this season and straight shootin'.

[Steeleco]

Welcome to the fray. The best thing to do with the little one is include him in the things you do with the gun, like cleaning and adjust the scope and such. If you make it fun, it will also be educational not to mention that bonding stuff!!! If you don't make it taboo he'll not have the need to be doing anything with out your permission. It's worked well for me, twice!!

[SummitX]

thanks for the tips, I think its a great idea since hes always so interested in anything I am doing, trying to sheild him from it would be harder than teaching.

[madrona sh]

I have a 5 year old boy and a 2 year old girl. I bought the key entry safe and now wish I bought one with the combination as I am paranoid that somehow sometime the kids will find the keys. Because you can't underestimate kids they can and will get into anything.

[SummitX]

thanks for the replies everyone. I thought I would ask other questions here that will inevitably show up rather than making new threads, so I guess my next question is about the firearms themselves

H&R pardner 4.10 single shot break action $150 new - Whats this gun like? Its going to be a grouse gun so I dont need any fancy stuff, but I do want something that is going to be safe to use, how is the quality on such a cheap shotgun?

CZ 455 lux .22 Again what are thoughts on this rifle? The wife and I plan on shooting this gun alot as a beginner for target practice and another good gun for small game which is all I am going after to start. I dont mind spending a bit more on this rifle as I see a good plinker as a sort of staple for starting out, and plan on having it forever. I want a quality wood stock and bolt action and dependability/reliability/safety are highest on my list.

Remington 870 Shotgun, this is the one I want, tried and true, a good history on it for reliability, now I just need to choose which model, I plan on using this gun at the range, as well as for defensive purposes when I am hiking in the high country with lots of grizz around. Would I be better served with the 870 marine magnum with 18" barrel, or the wingmaster with the longer barrel but less weight? The wingmaster also has the different choke tubes which would make it a bit more universal, but its a much longer shotgun, any thoughts?

[Foxton Gundogs]

Remington 870 Shotgun, this is the one I want, tried and true, a good history on it for reliability, now I just need to choose which model, I plan on using this gun at the range, as well as for defensive purposes when I am hiking in the high country with lots of grizz around. Would I be better served with the 870 marine magnum with 18" barrel, or the wingmaster with the longer barrel but less weight? The wingmaster also has the different choke tubes which would make it a bit more universal, but its a much longer shotgun, any thoughts?

Just remember all 870s are NOT created equal, they are not all up to the standard of the wingmaster. If you can get a wingmaster in your budget do so the good thing about the 870 is the range of interchangeable barrels available. so you will have a gun for all seasons and I can bet if you make it thru this year without wanting to go after waterfowl or deer in the Polder, you wont next year. The wingmaster and a xtra barrel 18.5 or 20" will be all youll eber need and it will last you for ever
OH YAH weilcome.

[SummitX]

thanks for the advice and welcome, I didnt realize you could change out the barrels on the wingmaster, definetly good to know. I have thought about perhaps getting into waterfowl, as well as turkey so I guess a 12 gauge wingmaster would be good for that as well, the thought of skinning, gutting and cooling the meat on a deer just seems a bit too much for me right now, I am one of those people that worry too much about screwing it up and ruining the meat so I am trying to take it a step at a time getting comfortable first.

[Foxton Gundogs]

thanks for the advice and welcome, I didnt realize you could change out the barrels on the wingmaster, definetly good to know. I have thought about perhaps getting into waterfowl, as well as turkey so I guess a 12 gauge wingmaster would be good for that as well, the thought of skinning, gutting and cooling the meat on a deer just seems a bit too much for me right now, I am one of those people that worry too much about screwing it up and ruining the meat so I am trying to take it a step at a time getting comfortable first.

yep but with the Wingmaster(and be sure it is a Wingmaster not one of the cheaper 870s) option, the short barrel , even if you never do get into deer, will work great for turkey and as a bear protection gun go back to the 28" for waterfowl and you could even get 24" for upland and trap the posabilities are endless.
But wht ever you choose good luck and have fun.

[Singleshotneeded]

SummitX, I'd go with a Wingmaster with the longer barrel for hunting, and a company called Dlask Arms on Annacis Island, B.C., make a short
defence barrel for the 870 in either 12.5" or 14", which is cylinder bore(no choke). If the 14" barrel is short enough to work for you, it's
easier to aim accurately than the 12.5", and the slugs for bear defence will develop almost their top power from the 14" barrel. If you go
there and order one for your 870, make sure you specify a brass bead front sight and not the thick blade sight. The brass bead won't snag
on things and will let you shoot a grouse, for instance, whereas the blade sight would completely obscure the bird. Remember with an open
cylinder bore you're limited to not much more than 20 yard shots on grouse, but it's generally the best bore for slugs.

[SummitX]

thanks guys, much appreciate the information!

[new hunter]

If you look at generic replacement stocks like the tactical ones by ATI you'll see that when stocks are listed to fit an 870 , they don't list the different models , only 870 . With that in mind I would say that its safe to assume that a stock from an 870 express would fit a 870 marine , a 870 wing master or a 870 tactical. I believe that all the 870s are built off the same reciever and that the difference in models are simply barrel length , magazine capacity and trigger group componontes (wingmaster , if it really is machined }.
It wouldn't really make sense to have different recievers for each model as that would require different factories.
As for the wingmaster being made of machined parts over stamped , I have never seen that listed in catalogues as a feature . What is mentioned is the difference in stock and finish . I have never had the oppurtunity to strip down a wingmaster , but my express mag is mostly machined parts were they make sense . My action bars are stamped , and I think there might be a couple parts in the trigger , but for the most part its all investment cast and machined . Its not like an 870 is a very accurate weapon so I don't see a big advantage to machining everything , especially since the parts would make the gun heavier .
The biggest difference I could see would be asthetic .

[Iron Glove]

Welcome to the world of hunting. :)
Re your choices of guns, the H&R's are very simple, safe and sturdy shotguns. I have a 410, son has a 20 and I have 4 of their single shot rifles. Never a problem other than the odd stuck case as they have extractors, not ejectors. Carry a small brass cleaning rod just in case.
CZ 22's are excellent - smooth and accurate. I use mine only for target shooting at the range 'cause it's so darn nice I don't want to scratch it up hunting. Savage rim fires are a really great rifle for the money. Get one with a synthetic stock and you don't have to worry about damaging it.
We have a Remington 20 guage in "youth" size so that it's compact and the wife can shoot it too. Nice gun.

[scallywag]

Get the cz

[Iron Sighted]

Yes, the CZ .22's are very nice and great quality for the money. I have a 452 American with a 16" barrel, I think my next .22 will be a Lux. I plan on using mine this fall for grouse. Also as mentioned the Savages are very accurate for the money but fit and finish is not as nice so they would be ideal to pack in the bush and not worry if they dinged up a bit.

[SummitX]

Great info, thank you I really do appreciate it, its an overwhelming world for a first year hunter/firearm owner I tell you!

I figure these 3 firearms will give me a great start and should last me a lifetime. We also have a rifle thats being passed down to us from my wifes Grandpa that unforunately passed, I am looking forward to seeing what it is, aparently its quite old.

[SummitX]

Whats your opinions on scoping the CZ lux? Worth while to get the good head shots? Reason I ask is I am doing an order out of the US, and they have alot of scopes at 40% off right now and thought I might pick one up for the .22. What should I look at when getting a scope for a .22? I imagine you would get a closer range one, so is it all about the optics?

[Singleshotneeded]

The most common power is probably the 3-9, and that's plenty for a .22. Get a decent 3-9X32 or 3-9X40, whichever
you can get for a good price, and you're set! I picked up a 3-9X40 Bushnell Elite 4200 for $220 from Webyshops.com
awhile back, and I think the same scope was priced at $380 at Wholesale Sports. The Cdn. Import Permit was free and
took two days, and the free US export permit they get took two weeks, so I had my scope in three weeks, and for a lot
less money than if I'd bought it here! I can understand paying a bit more here with our tax situation, but almost double?
No thanks, I'll buy online...

[Alec]

Re the gun safe from Canadian Tire. keep a bit of the advertising that referres to it as a SAFE, and glue it onto the wall. This is a CYA move should someone from officialdom question your storage methods. This shows you have done 'due diligence' by getting a 'safe' like it suggests in the PAL text.

[JHunt]

Welcome to the fray. The best thing to do with the little one is include him in the things you do with the gun, like cleaning and adjust the scope and such. If you make it fun, it will also be educational not to mention that bonding stuff!!! If you don't make it taboo he'll not have the need to be doing anything with out your permission. It's worked well for me, twice!!
Absolutely, I was about 4 when I first went to the range. Teach him gun safety and keep them out of the "Taboo" zone. by all means keep them locked up and be duely diligent but teach him to not be afraid of them. I suggest the anschutz junior .22 LR for the little one, my father went out and bought it for me the day of the ultrasound and we still have it to this day (21 years later) and it is a great little grouse/rabbit gun.

[Black Bird]

I will just pipe in about the .22. I have an ol' Mossberg 151K (1951 .22) with iron sights and I am accurate with that out to about 100m. This is not bragging - it is just stating that the gun is good. Old steel, well made, and tried and tested. Oh, and I spent all of $115 dollars on it. I would suggest that before you shell out big bucks for a .22 buy something that is old and you are not too worried about. Find out what you like or dislike about it and then adjust from there.

Just my two bits,

BB