Poll: Would you support NR "Accompany To Hunt" permits for BC Sheep, Grizzly Bear?

[Walking Buffalo]

What are your thoughts on allowing Non Residents to obtain "Accompany to Hunt" permits for BC Sheep and Grizzly Bear? The Poll is multiple choice.

I understand the additional restrictions regarding Grizzly Bears and the LEH system. One step at a time. :)

Please post up your thoughts where more detail is required, such as Stones only, or Bighorns only....Create a NR draw sytem for these animals....NR Canadians only.... NR Canadians and Aliens....

[Mr. Dean]

Canadians, perhaps, maybe, I dunno.
Out of Country, no way in hell.

The only reservation I'd have is that my chances of winning a lottery tag of my own would shrink.

[elkdom]

invite the whole world ? I don't think so,
for non-residents/aliens ,other than migratory and small game, it should be residents only BC Big Game,

Province by Province, big game management is big money and takes many years to be effective, supplying big game hunts for all that can find a friend or a shirt tail relative in BC? is ridiculous,

for non residents to hunt big game in BC ?, hire a licensed GO, and have at it !

[bighornbob]

I dont really have a problem for it being for sheep only as most are under GOS. There would always be those that abuse the system and take money under the table etc. But you could set up some strict rules like:
1 permit to accompany every 5 years or maybe one a lifetime.
The BC resident would use his tag (like a junior license). That way only one sheep is killed.
You could even make it that the BC resident loses his rights to a sheep tag for the next 3 years if he uses the permit to accompany.

Like I said there would be people abusing the system and the G/O would be screaming bloody murder but wouldn't it be great if you could take your father or brother on a once in a lifetime sheep hunt. I would easily give up my right to hunt sheep for a few years if I could take someone like a son, father, brother best friend hunting sheep. Would I do it for someone I met on the internet, not bloody likely.

BHB

[Deaddog]

no problem on my part if we were to give out say a couple of sheep or grizz on an leh...for a permit to accompany

[wicket]

invite the whole world ? I don't think so,
for non-residents/aliens ,other than migratory and small game, it should be residents only BC Big Game,

Province by Province, big game management is big money and takes many years to be effective, supplying big game hunts for all that can find a friend or a shirt tail relative in BC? is ridiculous,



for non residents to hunt big game in BC ?, hire a licensed GO, and have at it !
Are you talking about the sheep griz only or all big game ....cause this Canadian with a shirt tail relative ie BROTHER would take exception to your train of thought. Im pretty sure that the local economy in the shuswap appreciates the 1000 to 1500 dollars I spend to enjoy 2 weeks chasing mule deer and the ever elusive 2pt moose. On a side note Im astounded that there are gos on sheep. I do agree with bighornbob in his idea for an accompany permit every 5 yrs for BCs glory species if it was ever opened. sorry just re read your post all big game should be for bc residents only .... sorry dont agree. There should be more opportunity for residents than non resident Canadians for sure and the permit to accompany accomplishes that. Plus on the sheep on grizzly tags non res Canadians should have to apply with the appropriate app fees and earn enough preference points before being able to buy a tag regardless if there is a GOS or not.... again giving pref to BC residents but not eliminating all Canadians the right to hunt Canadian animals. my 2 cents anyways

[BCHunterFSJ]

I dont really have a problem for it being for sheep only as most are under GOS. There would always be those that abuse the system and take money under the table etc. But you could set up some strict rules like:
1 permit to accompany every 5 years or maybe one a lifetime.
The BC resident would use his tag (like a junior license). That way only one sheep is killed.
You could even make it that the BC resident loses his rights to a sheep tag for the next 3 years if he uses the permit to accompany.

Like I said there would be people abusing the system and the G/O would be screaming bloody murder but wouldn't it be great if you could take your father or brother on a once in a lifetime sheep hunt. I would easily give up my right to hunt sheep for a few years if I could take someone like a son, father, brother best friend hunting sheep. Would I do it for someone I met on the internet, not bloody likely.

BHB

I agree 100% with bighornbob! I have always dreamed of taking my brother on such a hunt (there is no way he could ever afford to do it otherwise) in the mountains.

[Jim 1367]

This should get interesting really fast( Not really ) Actually I am suprised it is not a 100 % absolutely not. I could see a leh for some tags. Can an alien hunt on a hunter host now? I'll give an example as to why it might not be a bad idea if done correctly and of course very limited. Suppose a resident of Bc and an non resident alien where good friends, lets say best friends or Two brothers live in two differnt countries. The only circumstance where they could EVER hunt together is if one booked a hunt with an outfitter and the resident booked the same hunt( which he should not have to). I have hunted BC plenty, paid the price and been happy to have experianced what I have. I am just saying that in some limited fashion there could be a case made for some restrictive allowances.

[Gunner]

For Canadian Residents from a Province that has a reciprical ageement in place so we can hunt their big game.....OK. For Non Resident Aliens no way....think of all the G/Os that would be unemployed! Gunner

[elkdom]

there are hunts all over the planet, most of them you have to pay dearly for the chance,

many BC residents have been waiting for an LEH tag for CITIES designated big game, for their entire life !,may never get one!, many more,just for a swamp-donkey of a doe tag,

the public of BC pays to have BC wildlife managed every day of the year, no choice about it, resident hunters contribute even more by way of habitat surcharges,and volunteering, donating

NO, I am Not in favor of more leniency for NR accompanied big game hunts in BC,

[Ambush]

Any province or state that lets me hunt their game, should be allowed to hunt ours under the same conditions/restrictions.
The only added restriction I would apply would be that the non-resident would have to be hosted by a resident in good standing.

[primitive]

They allow bringing NR and NRA up on a Hunter Host in Alberta...and being an Outfitter from that province and now in this province it would be a disaster. The system is severely abused in Alberta by Outfitters and residents alike, and the exchange of monies between parties is rampant there (and that is for whitetails/mulies/elk, etc.). If they opened up a similiar program in BC, and included sheep, grizz, and the other highly sought after game animals in our province it would (in my opinion) be a disaster. Those who would do it right and by the book would be outnumbered by those who could make a quick 20k on a Stone or 10k on a Grizz, etc. The temptation would be too much for some. IMHO.

[wicket]

there are hunts all over the planet, most of them you have to pay dearly for the chance,

many BC residents have been waiting for an LEH tag for CITIES designated big game, for their entire life !,may never get one!, many more,just for a swamp-donkey of a doe tag,

the public of BC pays to have BC wildlife managed every day of the year, no choice about it, resident hunters contribute even more by way of habitat surcharges,and volunteering, donating

NO, I am Not in favor of more leniency for NR accompanied big game hunts in BC,
So im getting mixed msgs from you ....are you against permits to accompany for all bc big game like in your first post or just for leh hunts like in your second post? If its for all big game i do not agree. I pay habitat surcharges ...INCREASED lic fees ect . I have hunted in YOUR province 8 times and fished on the WVI once. Conservatively estimate 1500 per hunt after landing in Kamloops, thats a lot of cabbage. I honestly dont see how the 2 bootjack mulies and 2 blackbears Ive killed has impacted resident hunter opportunity. Sure Ill give you that some of the leh hunts should have res priority however Here in ont you can draw a bull or cow moose tag just like me under a permit to accompany.In BC hmmm not so much. IMO I cant see turning away any Canadian that meets the criteria for the permit to accompany. Their hard earned dollars if allocated correctly just might but more ministry boot leather on the ground. The entire countries Fish and Wildlife Divisions are tragically underfunded and understaffed regardless of how many volunteer hours are donated, so an influx of dollars should be welcomed not discouraged. Not a pissing match with you sir, just a difference in opinion.

Non-residents may hunt with an immediate relative who is an Ontario resident licensed to hunt moose in a WMU that has an open season for non-residents. An immediate relative is a person’s grandparent, parent, spouse, child, sibling or grandchild. If you qualify under this exception, you may apply in the resident moose draw for an adult validation tag. You must purchase a non-resident moose licence and submit your application, along with your affidavit verifying your relationship to your immediate relative, to a ServiceOntario Centre in the area in which you wish to hunt (see offices and WMU listings, page 8. Please note that the moose draw deadline is
May 31, 2011.

[TheProvider]

G/O need to make a living. If it were to happen think how many pm's each one of us on this site would get from non residents. Everyone would wanna be our friends. Sure it'd be nice to take a close friend or relative but no matter what people will find a way to take advantage of it. If you wanna share a hunt with a close friend or relative have them accompany you as an oberserver. Nothing illegal about that is there? You'd still be able to share memories.

[forest walker]

I am from Alberta and would love a system where I could trade any of my tags for something in another province. I think that is a fair thing. I'm thinking Sheep right now as I type. Not sure how the details would work but why not. I get a bighorn tag every year and if I so chose why not trade it for a Stone sheep through another hunter in B.C? The number of hunters would stay the same. I could guide the B.C guy to a sheep and in turn he takes me on a stone hunt. I would gladly give up my bighorn tag to do a hunt like that

[ROEBUCK]

I do support it as long as its regulated.I had a great hunt last year with my non res father.
and a good friend would love the opertunity to hunt but can only join me here without a gun.

[bayou]

The B.C. accompanied hunt system is allready abused by many, dont need to add sheep/grizzly into the mix. It needs to be revamped to something similar to what bighornbob suggests.

[Jelvis]

Most people can't get their butt out of the truck never mind walking back in the bush.
Redundant because of that alone.
Jel .. No

[Krico]

I have no doubt in my mind the current system is being abused by the odd resident- get a "permit to accompany" for brother/dad/cousin from province x for goat/caribou/moose or whatever species, resident buys sheep tag and they head in there. Relative shoots sheep, resident cuts tag, gets it inspected and pinned, gets it mounted. Mount hangs in relative's entrance way. Whether money trades hands or not, I am sure this happens.

Making "hosting" of these species legal would only increase the temptation with the $$$ that would tossed around. Now the only thing to hide is the money, no worries on if anyone saw the non resident shooting. Honestly who wouldn't love $20,000 to go sheep hunting for a week or two with a good friend/relative. I'd be tempted. So would most other guys out there, whether they admit it or not.

[chilcotin hillbilly]

They allow bringing NR and NRA up on a Hunter Host in Alberta...and being an Outfitter from that province and now in this province it would be a disaster. The system is severely abused in Alberta by Outfitters and residents alike, and the exchange of monies between parties is rampant there (and that is for whitetails/mulies/elk, etc.). If they opened up a similiar program in BC, and included sheep, grizz, and the other highly sought after game animals in our province it would (in my opinion) be a disaster. Those who would do it right and by the book would be outnumbered by those who could make a quick 20k on a Stone or 10k on a Grizz, etc. The temptation would be too much for some. IMHO.

what he said x's 2

[pro 111]

there are hunts all over the planet, most of them you have to pay dearly for the chance,

many BC residents have been waiting for an LEH tag for CITIES designated big game, for their entire life !,may never get one!, many more,just for a swamp-donkey of a doe tag,

the public of BC pays to have BC wildlife managed every day of the year, no choice about it, resident hunters contribute even more by way of habitat surcharges,and volunteering, donating

NO, I am Not in favor of more leniency for NR accompanied big game hunts in BC,

Well said Elkdom, if you want to hunt sheep in BC , move to BC.

[dutchie]

I would be ok with Canadian Residents being allowed to harest a sheep in a GOS area but not a Grizz because they are on LEH.

My feelings are if it is on LEH in that area there should be no allocation on it other then the LEH allocation. These should be left for a resident hunter.

BUT, like Grizz and stones alike... if there are areas that the allocation is not being met, the next step would be to give it to the G/O's to offer it for lots of money.

It is our province, our tax dollars, we should be able to have a say.

Dutchie

With that being said

[hunter1947]

Keep the hunts for BC residence only we should be the first in line not aliens we are the tax payers not them we pay to have the management look after our wildlife sources not aliens..

[stoneguide]

I for sure can see why residents feel the way they do about there game no matter what province we live in.
But I know many residents that dream of hunting in other provinces and in other countrys. Many of these guys cant afford high G/O prices for hunts to be able to travel and hunt with family and friends. The permit to accompany and hunter host programs allow friends and family to be able to hunt together without high dollars.
And yes the program will have the odd guy abuse it, but we dont close the whole hunting proccess down due to a couple bad apples so why look at the hunter host deal this way.
Like was stated with proper regulations and stipulations it can be controled pretty well.

Personaly I feel friends and family should be able to hunt together before NR can just buy in and hunt where they wish.

Like Forestwalker stated id glady bring my friends that im going hunting with this year over for a bighorn if we could get the rules changed here. For now they will just come over and hunt deer. And down the road others if they are successfull in the drawings.

Im for the permit to accompany type tags. I said yes for the poll but not just for BC but for all Prov. and Territories. But for species with LEH or low numbers it should be controled or not available to keep resident oppertunity up. And if you reside in a Prov. that doesnt have this type of program you should be unable to participate.
Just my thoughts.
SG

[Camp Cook]

Help me understand this if I am out hunting sheep/goat/grizzly etc I can't have a NR buddy along to enjoy/film the trip without some special permit or are you guys wanting this?

[eastkoot]

I think there is alot of residents that can't get authorizations, so no for Non-res..

[wicket]

Re: Poll: Would you support NR "Accompany To Hunt" permits for BC Sheep, Grizzly Bear


http://www.huntingbc.ca/forum/images/shades_of_green/misc/quote_icon.png Originally Posted by elkdomhttp://www.huntingbc.ca/forum/images/shades_of_green/buttons/viewpost-right.png (http://www.huntingbc.ca/forum/showthread.php?p=959516#post959516)
there are hunts all over the planet, most of them you have to pay dearly for the chance,

many BC residents have been waiting for an LEH tag for CITIES designated big game, for their entire life !,may never get one!, many more,just for a swamp-donkey of a doe tag,

the public of BC pays to have BC wildlife managed every day of the year, no choice about it, resident hunters contribute even more by way of habitat surcharges,and volunteering, donating

NO, I am Not in favor of more leniency for NR accompanied big game hunts in BC,



So im getting mixed msgs from you ....are you against permits to accompany for all bc big game like in your first post or just for leh hunts like in your second post? If its for all big game i do not agree. I pay habitat surcharges ...INCREASED lic fees ect . I have hunted in YOUR province 8 times and fished on the WVI once. Conservatively estimate 1500 per hunt after landing in Kamloops, thats a lot of cabbage. I honestly dont see how the 2 bootjack mulies and 2 blackbears Ive killed has impacted resident hunter opportunity. Sure Ill give you that some of the leh hunts should have res priority however Here in ont you can draw a bull or cow moose tag just like me under a permit to accompany.In BC hmmm not so much. IMO I cant see turning away any Canadian that meets the criteria for the permit to accompany. Their hard earned dollars if allocated correctly just might but more ministry boot leather on the ground. The entire countries Fish and Wildlife Divisions are tragically underfunded and understaffed regardless of how many volunteer hours are donated, so an influx of dollars should be welcomed not discouraged. Not a pissing match with you sir, just a difference in opinion.

Non-residents may hunt with an immediate relative who is an Ontario resident licensed to hunt moose in a WMU that has an open season for non-residents. An immediate relative is a person’s grandparent, parent, spouse, child, sibling or grandchild. If you qualify under this exception, you may apply in the resident moose draw for an adult validation tag. You must purchase a non-resident moose licence and submit your application, along with your affidavit verifying your relationship to your immediate relative, to a ServiceOntario Centre in the area in which you wish to hunt (see offices and WMU listings, page 8. Please note that the moose draw deadline is
May 31, 2011.

maybe its time to scrap provincial transfer payments as long as we are dealing with a this is mine mantality. looks like i had better get my brother and take the month of Novemeber since im off anyways and shoot as much or YOUR shit as legally possible before a petition shows up calling for scrapping the permit to accompany. Ill do the same here with the moose draw for non residents who have a permit to accompany so residents of ontario have sooooo many more tags available. Sarcasm sure but it seems like a lot of BC res have a red ass about your leh draw system and are transfering said red ass to the Canadian permit holders. correct me if im wrong in this assumption. I still stand my my suggestions in my post above.
If the accompany system ever does get tossed, looks like Ill be heading to the states where they welcome and understand as well as go out of their ways to get non residents in to hunt big game...many without a guide depending on species. That is definately one thing about the Americans ....they understand the importance of non residence hunters and the increased funds we bring in.

[Gateholio]

Grizzly are on LEH, so not every BC residents grizzly needs are being fulfilled, so forget anything on LEH. We already have permits to accompany for deer, moose, elk, goats, black bear....But not sheep.

Sheep is in fairly high demand by residents, so I don't see why we should be adding sheep PTA to the list. If someone wants to hunt sheep bad enough, they will move to BC to meet residency requirements.

However other states/provinces decide on dealing with this issue should have absolutely zero influence on how BC deals with it. Let them decide what is best for them and BC can decide what is best for us.

[wicket]

agreed gatehouse....maybe its me but Im picking up a no permit to accompany vibe on all big game from some posters on this thread... if this isnt the case im definately sorry....however if there is an anti P.T.A sediment, Im sorry but to put a twist on one of my favourite fictional heros dude lebowski......``The dude doesn`t abide``

[HD95]

My thoughts exactly
Grizzly are on LEH, so not every BC residents grizzly needs are being fulfilled, so forget anything on LEH. We already have permits to accompany for deer, moose, elk, goats, black bear....But not sheep.

Sheep is in fairly high demand by residents, so I don't see why we should be adding sheep PTA to the list. If someone wants to hunt sheep bad enough, they will move to BC to meet residency requirements.

However other states/provinces decide on dealing with this issue should have absolutely zero influence on how BC deals with it. Let them decide what is best for them and BC can decide what is best for us.

[gunpower]

5 years ago a friend of mine got a job and moved to the elk valley from lethbridge, he applied and got approved to hunt elk here with his father-in-law. He also applied for the sheep permit and didnt get it, he was later told that he could have had a hunter hosted sheep tag for a different Mu in reg 4. That same year another guy I know had his brother here looking for sheep, he told me they applied for the hunter host permitt and were given the go ahead to hunt sheep. The guys brother was from Manitoba. Keep in mind both of these guys are by the book hunters, This is what they told me, I have never looked into the hunter-host permits and what you are allowed to hunt.

[Krico]

Every person from Albera east to Newfoundland who wants to hunt sheep would be headed here. There's no hunter host program for sheep anywhere else, so everyone would be headed here. In the territories don't you have to be a resident for 3 full years before you can hunt sheep???

We need to start protecting our fish too, but that's another thread!

[Rackmastr]

Every person from Albera east to Newfoundland who wants to hunt sheep would be headed here. There's no hunter host program for sheep anywhere else, so everyone would be headed here. In the territories don't you have to be a resident for 3 full years before you can hunt sheep???



Alberta actually has 2 non-resident (Canadian) sheep tags that a person can be hosted for. However, with the current priority situation, you would be waiting until you were 150 years old if you started applying now. Its pretty minimal and pretty much near impossible unless you're in the top couple priorities...

[hawken]

5 years ago a friend of mine got a job and moved to the elk valley from lethbridge, he applied and got approved to hunt elk here with his father-in-law. He also applied for the sheep permit and didnt get it, he was later told that he could have had a hunter hosted sheep tag for a different Mu in reg 4. That same year another guy I know had his brother here looking for sheep, he told me they applied for the hunter host permitt and were given the go ahead to hunt sheep. The guys brother was from Manitoba. Keep in mind both of these guys are by the book hunters, This is what they told me, I have never looked into the hunter-host permits and what you are allowed to hunt.
There are some Big horn tags available for NR, but no Stones.

I'm all for allowing NR to hunt Stones, however if I lived there, I'm sure I would feel different.

[Nathaniel Poe]

Being an Albertan, I'd sure like to hunt stone sheep in BC. I've guided lots of yanks to nice stones over the years, but never pulled the trigger on one myself. Course iffin I was from BC, I'd be akeeping all them sheep for myself! LOL!

[BCHunterFSJ]

there are hunts all over the planet, most of them you have to pay dearly for the chance,

many BC residents have been waiting for an LEH tag for CITIES designated big game, for their entire life !,may never get one!, many more,just for a swamp-donkey of a doe tag,

the public of BC pays to have BC wildlife managed every day of the year, no choice about it, resident hunters contribute even more by way of habitat surcharges,and volunteering, donating

NO, I am Not in favor of more leniency for NR accompanied big game hunts in BC,

Sounds pretty selfish to me... Don't you have any non-resident relatives that you are dying to hunt with? A dad or a brother or a son/daughter, maybe in P.E.I., maybe even in far away New Zealand? I think it would be awesome...
Hope one day it happens!

[Krico]

I'd love to hunt Dall's in NWT too, but that ain't happenin' either! If I REALLY wanted to I'd move there. Same for guys who want to hunt Stone's - move here!

[Gateholio]

Help me understand this if I am out hunting sheep/goat/grizzly etc I can't have a NR buddy along to enjoy/film the trip without some special permit or are you guys wanting this?

If you want a Canadian non BCer to come with you to hunt, he can apply for a permit to accompany you, and you go shoot a deer or bear or maybe moose, goat, elk. Not grizz or sheep.

If you just want a cameraman that isn't packing a gun and isnt' doing any shooting, then no permit required.

[budismyhorse]

I met a group of hunters once with a goat ..... The guy from BC looked pretty sheepish and the dude from Alberta who apparently was the cameraman packed the goat off the hill and was kind enough to clean up the meat and cape out the face....... He must have been really greatfull to be allowed to come along and be the cameraman.... He worked at it into the night even! Great guy, mother Teresa quality.

[Flingin' Sticks]

Agree with Gatse...Grizz on LEH=No Go for NR Hunters. As far as NR for stone sheep...I would be in favor of combining the PTA idea with a VERY limited LEH for NR Canadians. What I'm thinking of is an application you must make with a resident who is willing to accompany you on your hunt, and submit to a special draw for NR Sheep. You get drawn, you and your resident buddy get to go sheep hunting. If not, well better luck next year. If it were up to me, I'd only have this available to non-BC residents living in Canada...I think if it were open to all non-resident Aliens, it would turn into a gong show.

If one were concerned about astronomical odds for getting drawn for one of only a handful of NR permits, turn this into a once-in-a-lifetime draw. If you can't make it, sorry...book a guide next time. same if you can't tag a sheep.

[GreatWhitePopogeebo]

No thank you..

[bigwhiteys]

There are many benefits to living in this province, hunting is one of them. If other provinces/states want to make their tags available to others via draws that's fine, none of my business. BC, though has enough tourism income already. The hunting with family etc... I can understand the sentimentality of it, but seriously... People make a "choice" on where they live and work. If that choice wasn't BC then that's too bad.

If I really wanted to hunt somewhere foreign, I'd be hiring a local G/O.

Carl

[wicket]

I get the not wanting the sheep and griz on PTA. I dont get why the folks at Daniels floating store in Seymore Arm took my money for gas and beer last time I was in province hunting even though they knew I was from Ontario and hunting :) guess they didnt have enough money from tourism eh bigwhitey. The reason I posted the blurb from our hunting regs about non ont res on PTA being able to apply for adult moose tags just like Ont residents( all adult moose are on application) is to demonstrate that it could be done and regulated. Hey I respect everyones opinion on this matter. Likewise I understand why some of you say WHO CARES WHAT OTHER PLACES DO.

Thanks for any replies
Wicket

[Gateholio]

Stone sheep aren't' on LEH because they have sex restrictions and minimum horn size restrictions that limit the amount of them that can be killed, which makes them not a risk for conservation. Not so with grizzlies which allow either sex and if it's not in a family unit it is legal.

[wicket]

makes sence thanks....ps I know you know a lot about rifles and i see you around the gunnutz site so u might know offhand ....do you know when the new weatherby vangaurd will arrive in Canada. The "experts" at the local gunstores havent even heard of the Series 2 vangaurd....... just wondering....
wicket

[Ozone]

I am curious to know how many people on this site dont support the permit to accompany system regardless of species and why.


So build a simple yes or no poll

[nap]

Excellent topic, First week in Sept, Myself and 3 brothers are going on a elk hunt up the tuchodi, 2 of us are residents of b.c. 1 from manitoba and 1 from nunivit. We have all hunted with each other at 1 time but never all of us at the same time. This is a legal hunt and all will have their own tags. I am the youngest at 48, this may never happen again, Thankfull for the "Accompany To Hunt".

[mountainman]

I probably don't count :-D being from Alberta and all but I say yes but thats cause I can't afford to hire a GOS for sheep or grizz either.

I do understand the sentiment against it as things get abused here in Alberta but I would like to think that most of the rules are followed by most people but it would get abused some.

I think if you were born in BC you should have hunting and fishing rights there as a resident!! :mrgreen: :twisted: (Born in Duncan myself live in Alberta :mrgreen:) DUCKS and RUNS for cover!!!!!

[moose2]

I feel that there's enough species to hunt already under the "Accompany to hunt permits" to allow BC residents to hunt with their out of province family now. IMO because of these species demand I think opening it for sheep and grizzly would create many more illegal guideing situations within the province. As far as the arguement of " they could never afford a stone hunt " I am sure almost everyone on here have dream hunts that are out of our price range. We either save for ever or enjoy hunting the species we can afford with the dream hunt on the back burner ( thats life ).
Mike

[Gateholio]

I feel that there's enough species to hunt already under the "Accompany to hunt permits" to allow BC residents to hunt with there out of province family now. I

That's a very good point. There are more than enough species available for friends and family to enjoy hunting together and a wilderness experience etc.

[Walking Buffalo]

Bump.... :)

Anyone change their minds?

In light of the allocation issues, perhaps resident hunters will have a new perspective on the importance of maintaining non-outfitter non resident hunting.

Voting on this poll is basically useless now, please post your vote and thoughts.

[bridger]

Years ago at an allocation committee meeting we were discussing the option of opening up sheep hunts for non resident Canadians under the permit to accompany system with the proviso that the bc resident had to use his tag as well. Two tags for one sheep! The reply from the other side of the table. Was "if that comes up again there won't be a man left standing." wasn't received well.

[itsy bitsy xj]

You wanna hunt here you gotta live here!
BUT WE'RE FULL SO STAY OUT!!

[Brez]

Interesting thread and poll. Absolutely, I will support an LEH system for out-of province hunters. It may end up being a really long shot at a tag - like getting a bighorn permit in Alberta, but what the heck, if it can get inter-provincial hunters working together and sharing their experiences.

[riflebuilder]

I would support a limited number of LEH permits foe sheep and grizzly. I have taken my cousin a few times for Goat and Caribou, they were great hunts. I have been hosted on a Caribou/Moose combo in the Yukon a great hunt with a friend and our two daughters, on of the best hunting trips I have ever had. My Daughter shot a B&C caribou her first time hunting. So if the chance was there to take my son who lives in Montreal for a shneep hunt along with my two son in-laws from the US it would be great. Currently you can take NR Aliens if they are immediate family and Canadian residents friends and family. Yes some abuse the system and that is not right. But over all there is great opportunity already, sheep and grizzly would be great but they would need to be limited and an LEH even if it is a long shot would be fun. I am grateful to live here and be able to hunt fish and enjoy the wilderness available to all BC residents and love it when I get to share with family and friends.

[.300WSMImpact!]

I have changed my mind can I revote

[Wentrot]

I would support an LEH system

[Caveman]

No different that the Yukon, Wyoming, Alberta, I would support taking out a Non-resident who had to apply for licenses or be guided, by a resident/sponsor, as in these places. Giving the rights to the tags and proceeds to the Guide/Outfitters over the Residents, No. There has to be a system out there that makes it way more palatable for all parties than to just listen to one self-servicing interest group.

[bckoothunter]

I would support a well managed NR Canadian permit to hunt system for the big ticket big game species. I think the once in a lifetime tag idea would work well. Allows NR Canadians to come and hunt potentially multiple times, however only harvest 1 animal. 1 in every 5 years would also be ok.

That being said, I would like to see at a minimum the Western Provinces/Territories, BC, AB, SASK, NWT, YUKON, make similar agreements. I think as Canadians we all deserve to hunt the different species and experience what our entire country has to offer, while at the same time protecting the rights of the local resident hunters.

I would much rather see my fellow countrymen come and explore my home hunting grounds and have the opportunity to harvest an animal they may never get the chance at without having to pay a GO. Let's face it, most Canadian hunters are either unable or unwilling (due to financial responsibilities) to pay for a guided hunt.

Also, as long as you needed a resident hunter to accompany the NR, there really would not be that many more hunters per season.

[lange1212]

I very much feel this conversation was started as a trap by the commercial hunting and trapping sector. I include trapping sector because many of the BCTA board are guides and members of the GOABC, who now are also pushing the permits to accompany issue (remove/restrict). A huge conflict of interest here as far as I'm concerned and failure to properly represent BCTA members like myself.

A permit to accompany is not "guiding" as no monetary gain can be awarded, with the GOABC for many years trying to remove this important opportunity to residents hunters of BC. It also needs to be clearly understood that PTA are never applied in areas where residents are on LEH so our LEH opportunities and odds are not impacted by a PTA.

The importance of PTA and the focal point is to maintain, entrench, provide for family and friendship values that revolve around our hunting opportunities. For all the multi generational resident hunters out there imagine your child, grandchild, brother, sister, or closest friend and hunting partner having to leave the province, often not by choice to attend school or work. The PTA allows residents of BC to provide a sustainable opportunity to sponsor a family member or peer. Like many of you I have been brought up as a hunter, and my children as hunters in BC, and is the foundation of positive family and friendship bonds that are fostered and nurtured through our hunting opportunities. This is what resident hunter PTA are supposed to represent and worth fighting to maintain, and yes the GOABC has and continues to lobby government to remove this opportunity. The greed and exclusivity factor at the expense of resident hunters rearing its ugly head once again!

What I'm concerned with like many is abuse of this system such as a "hunting show" hunting in BC under a PTA, then broadcasting that show generating revenue from it. I view this as monetary gain and a loop hole that should be closed.

PTA's are important and must remain in place for all species, and I say this as a person who's never applied for one. However that said my children are a couple of years from college/university or starting careers that may take them out of BC. If that happens I want to continue to hunt with them and have them hunt with me as generations of my family have done in BC and that today can be achieved through a PTA.

[Walking Buffalo]

Thanks for the new replies.

When I started this thread several years ago the purpose was the same as it is today.

Many jurisdictions in Canada have submitted complete control for segments of NR hunting to the commercial sector. Not allowing NR to hunt any particular species without an outfitter is purely a based on financial gain.
I have always believed that this is in contradiction to the North American model of wildlife management, the "guiding" philosophy that has for the most part maintained wildlife as a public resource.

One of the important facets of the North American model is that wildlife is held in trust by the government or ALL people. Fees associated with accessing this wildlife should be limited to management costs, not profit.
Allowing commercial for profit operations to be the only way a NR hunter can access a species is against the ideology of wildlife as a public resource. Funny enough, but not surprisingly, GOABC purports to be a champion of the North American model, when it suits their bank accounts.

I hope that a couple of points brought up here are taken seriously when the BCWF has the opportunity to re-state their position.

-All huntable species should be available to NR on a PTA, with a set maximum allocation distributed through applicable means (leh). In no circumstance will Outfitters be allowed an allocation without the existence of a proportional (% to be degermined) PTA for said species in the same area.

-NR PTA allowable harvest is calculated from a pool of all sources of NR harvest ( outfitters and PTA combined).

-NR applicants must be from a jurisdiction that offers a reciprocal agreement.


Such a position and hopeful agreement will help maintain the North American model to keep wildlife as a public resource while eliminating the for profit monopoly of NR hunting of some species.

[lange1212]

In all honesty how many who voted on the PTA poll truly know and understand this process, what's involved, and the many restrictions in place that govern its application?