Barbed Hooks

[Caribou_lou]

I took a short look for old threads on this issue and didn't find anything.

Just wanted to know who supports the Barbless hook regulation and why?

[bcbrez]

The least amount of damage you do to any fish your going to release the better, and I don't mind having to fight a bit harder for the ones I keep.

[crazybushcreature]

most of the fish i catch i release. so the less harm done to them the better.

[Blair]

I am all in favour of it. I don't seem to lose many of the fish I hook, and the ones I do lose are a small price to pay for the many fish I can release with relatively little harm.

[Sasquatch]

I think it should have been done a long time ago. Can't think of any reason why there should be barbs on hooks. I don't even think it makes much of a difference in the amount of fish the average angler will land.

[Dannybuoy]

I am ok with barbless but the single barbless rule is a crock as far as the big lakes are concerned . I was glad to see they changed OK lake back to allow treble hooks , those big single hooks are killers . Also i would point out that substantial % of "catch and release" fish die later as a result of poor release practice , I recall a study by Charlie White in aprox 30% of fish released didnt recover

[luckofthedraw]

I like barbless. Caught a bunch of small "non-keepers" on barbs a few years ago........just couldnt throw em back. Had to eat for a shore snack and haven't used barb since.

[835]

I am a catch kill sometimes and catch and release sometimes kind of fisherman.
I fully support single barbless fishing. I troll the ocean and flyfish the rivers and am barbless 100%

The only time i think barbed trebles should be used is with kids starting fishing. And only in lakes. When i fish with kids i use the most productive legal method of bringing in fish, because kids need to catch fish. We can teach them better ways after they are hooked.
Why lakes? Because you are only managing one specific location and you can dump a bunch more fish into it. If you want a specific lake to remain wild, put a barbless regulation on it.

Keep your line tight and you dont need a barb. And so what if you loose it, Keep fishin you'll get another.

[Caribou_lou]

This is very interesting... I am amazed at how many people support it! I for one would use a barb if I was allowed and feel it should be optional.

[RJ]

Im fine with barbless, the barbs just do too much damage if you are going to release the fish.
Back when you could fish salmon with barbs, we released some undersize that were definitely pooched.
Have had lots of heartbreakers since where the fish twists and spits the hook at the last second, but whatchagunnado...

[elkdom]

I am ok with barbless but the single barbless rule is a crock as far as the big lakes are concerned . I was glad to see they changed OK lake back to allow treble hooks , those big single hooks are killers . Also i would point out that substantial % of "catch and release" fish die later as a result of poor release practice , I recall a study by Charlie White in aprox 30% of fish released didnt recover

of coarse everyone that spends a day hooking 30 or 40 fish and releasing them are certain that they are exercising the utmost in fish conservation ??

some Countries and States have eliminated "catch and release fishing policies",because of mortality rates of catch and released fish, in those jurisdictions, the season and limit is set at catch and keep/sustainable numbers"

or there simply is no fishing season at all !

[835]

Caribou lou, How many fish do you release?
The face gets ripped off the fish when you pull out a barbed hook. Bigger fish are more able to handel it but if you are trout fishing barbs kill fish.

I primairly trout fish, its really what gets me. I fish with a 4 weigh fly rod and 3lb tippet. I can say about 90% of the fish that i hook up i land.
When i salmon fish My batting average goes down to more 70%. Now i obviously am just guessing at this but im sure it is close.
for me, Barbs do not help me land a fish. I have killed to many fish by accident with them to ever use them unless i am wih my Neice and Nephew.

[No Tag Soup Please]

I used to always fish with barbed hooks. Now that I'm tying my own flies and I use a lot of beads I seem to have mainly barbless hooks from squishing them down to put the bead onto the hook.

[835]

of coarse everyone that spends a day hooking 30 or 40 fish and releasing them are certain that they are exercising the utmost in fish conservation ??

some Countries and States have eliminated "catch and release fishing policies",because of mortality rates of catch and released fish, in those jurisdictions, the season and limit is set at catch and keep/sustainable numbers"

or there simply is no fishing season at all !


Well you are sort of right and sort of wrong.
In order to do this you would have to open regulations right up. Catch kill doesnt work with Species restrictions length restrictions and all the sort. Most systems out there you catch 10 fish before you get to one you could kill.

What you are suggesting doesnt work.
And i am one of the guys that will catch 30 fish in a day and i am here to tell you that with my #8 muddler almost all of the fish i catch are fine. If your hook is too big you will brain them or eyeball them. I bet you out of 30 fish i catch on the above gear maybe 1 wont make it.

[sledforever]

Where I fish there are steelhead in the river which you have to release no matter what and personally I'm ok with losing the odd fish here and there because I as the fisherman messed up and got bested by the fish. If in return this means that I can fish for springs, coho, and steelhead until I am an old man, so be it. I figure its a small price to pay for something I love to do.

[Caribou_lou]

Caribou lou, How many fish do you release?
The face gets ripped off the fish when you pull out a barbed hook. Bigger fish are more able to handel it but if you are trout fishing barbs kill fish.

I primairly trout fish, its really what gets me. I fish with a 4 weigh fly rod and 3lb tippet. I can say about 90% of the fish that i hook up i land.
When i salmon fish My batting average goes down to more 70%. Now i obviously am just guessing at this but im sure it is close.
for me, Barbs do not help me land a fish. I have killed to many fish by accident with them to ever use them unless i am wih my Neice and Nephew.

Glad you asked 835! I don't release many fish at all. When I go out I'm looking to put food on the table. I catch my fish and usually go home after I have my limit.

I'm not against catch and release... But when I hear of people catching fish that are hooked bad (in the gills) and are released, even if you are using a barbless hook. You just let go a dead fish. And I don't agree with that.

[Caribou_lou]

of coarse everyone that spends a day hooking 30 or 40 fish and releasing them are certain that they are exercising the utmost in fish conservation ??

some Countries and States have eliminated "catch and release fishing policies",because of mortality rates of catch and released fish, in those jurisdictions, the season and limit is set at catch and keep/sustainable numbers"

or there simply is no fishing season at all !

I agree with you elkdom. If there is not enough fish in the system to be able to kill one to take home, I don't think they should be fished at all. There is a mortality rate so there are still fish being killed.

[happyhunter]

I am a catch kill sometimes and catch and release sometimes kind of fisherman.
I fully support single barbless fishing. I troll the ocean and flyfish the rivers and am barbless 100%

The only time i think barbed trebles should be used is with kids starting fishing. And only in lakes. When i fish with kids i use the most productive legal method of bringing in fish, because kids need to catch fish. We can teach them better ways after they are hooked.
Why lakes? Because you are only managing one specific location and you can dump a bunch more fish into it. If you want a specific lake to remain wild, put a barbless regulation on it.

Keep your line tight and you dont need a barb. And so what if you loose it, Keep fishin you'll get another.

Well said. Personally I dont have any complaints with the regs we have right now. Lots of opportunitys out there.

[knockturnal]

i worked at a lodge that kept stats throughout the season of fish caught. When the single barbless hook rule was implimented, their numbers were the same as when they used barbs. Nothing wrong with barbless hooks. Ive been using them for the past 15 years.

[Caribou_lou]

I fish large Chinook on the Skeena river. We bar fish primarily, I find it's the most effective way. We lose many more fish since we have been using barbless hooks. Lots of the Chinook we do catch, you can see where the hook has moved around in the mount. Going from one side to the other. We never noticed this when our hooks were barbed. So in this case the barbless hook is doing more damage to the fish.

[blacklab]

I'm all for barbless hooks, but I think they could let kids hang onto a few more fish.

[bopper]

I fish barbless exclusively, and haven't noticed losing any more fish than with barbed hooks.
My fishing partner accidently hooked me in the face with a #8 wooly bugger; that's when you REALLY appreciate barbless hooks.
And for those who complain about the mortality of released fish, current studies show that 97% of fish that are properly released survive.

[ElectricDyck]

I fish small lakes/streams for trout and don't mind fishing barbless hooks, it makes it more of a challenge, especially if the alternative to catch and release is closure. Way easier to get a hook out without the barb. When fishing with my kids and the regs allow we keep the barbs on and usually end up keeping a smaller fish or two where the barbed hook was troublesome and release wasn't an option.

[Caribou_lou]

current studies show that 97% of fish that are properly released survive.

Noticed how you say "properly released". Now that you pointed that out, what is the mortality rate of fish that are caught and released?.

[Krico]

Less fish are lost using barbed hooks, and to suggest otherwise is ridiculous. I use barbs when allowed, and I'm proud of it! I even (gasp) bonk fish. Then I eat them! I have no interest in driving 8 hours to the coast with thousands of dollars invested in gear so I can catch fish for "fun" and "glory pics". Don't get me wrong, I love the fun aspect of it, but I have mouths to feed and will bring home whatever I can.

[mudNblood]

"The only time i think barbed trebles should be used is with kids starting fishing. And only in lakes. When i fish with kids i use the most productive legal method of bringing in fish, because kids need to catch fish. We can teach them better ways after they are hooked"




X2. well put.

[Ddog]

[QUOTE=Krico;896879]Less fish are lost using barbed hooks, and to suggest otherwise is ridiculous.

actually when we were allowed to use barbs on the skeena, kitimat rivers it made no difference at all when it went to barbless, we landed just as many fish and lost just as many fish. Barb or barbless.
i am barbless.

[Caribou_lou]

[QUOTE=Krico;896879]Less fish are lost using barbed hooks, and to suggest otherwise is ridiculous.

actually when we were allowed to use barbs on the skeena, kitimat rivers it made no difference at all when it went to barbless, we landed just as many fish and lost just as many fish. Barb or barbless.
i am barbless.

When we used barbs on the skeena we landed many more fish. I am with Krico on this one. It keeps the hook in there... Kinda its purpose!

[835]

Lets simplify this a bit :)

There is absolutly nothing wrong with Barbs where legal. There is absolutly nothing wrong with bonking fish, I do all the time.
Barbed damage fish more, which only matters if they are to be released. Fishing with barbed hooks (IMO) is just fine if you are a catch kill guy. But not fine if you are to release them. The idea of improper release is hard, because it is really hard to improperly release a fish if you pay a bit of attention.

So Kill guys go out and let'er rip!
release guys use barbless hooks, (me for the most part) and pay attention to the fish.


Caribou lou,
That is exactly why i asked. My uncle is very catch kill. He fishes by any legal means nessary to catch fish. Uses gang trolls etc.
If i lived and fished the Skeena I would probably use a barb if legal because i do kill some salmon. as well as bigger fish can handle a barb.

And (dont take this wrong) to me loosing way more fish with barbless only happens if you are playing the fish wrong.
gonna get burned for that, by this i mean if you constantly loose fish Barbless take a look at how you fish.

[Caribou_lou]

Lets simplify this a bit :)

There is absolutly nothing wrong with Barbs where legal. There is absolutly nothing wrong with bonking fish, I do all the time.
Barbed damage fish more, which only matters if they are to be released. Fishing with barbed hooks (IMO) is just fine if you are a catch kill guy. But not fine if you are to release them. The idea of improper release is hard, because it is really hard to improperly release a fish if you pay a bit of attention.

So Kill guys go out and let'er rip!
release guys use barbless hooks, (me for the most part) and pay attention to the fish.


Caribou lou,
That is exactly why i asked. My uncle is very catch kill. He fishes by any legal means nessary to catch fish. Uses gang trolls etc.
If i lived and fished the Skeena I would probably use a barb if legal because i do kill some salmon. as well as bigger fish can handle a barb.

And (dont take this wrong) to me loosing way more fish with barbless only happens if you are playing the fish wrong.
gonna get burned for that, by this i mean if you constantly loose fish Barbless take a look at how you fish.

Not gonna get burned too bad! I have nieces and a nephew and they are all under the age of 10. They lose a lot of fish and mainly because they are poorly fought. I also take out friends that have never been before. In these cases the barb would help alot!! And if I were allowed to use one I would. Because I'm a catch and kill guy. Nothing wrong with that. I never take more that the legal limit.

Now what I do want to exaggerate on is that if we were allowed to use barbs most guys wouldn't because all they do is practice catch and release. I would encourage it if you aren't going to keep a fish. But why do (Most) of the people who like the barbless hook regulation feel everyone should be enforced with it?

[steel_ram]

Barbless is certainly better for the fish if it's going to be released. I doubt I've ever lost a fish due to a lack of barb, in fact the bulge where the barb has been pinched still has plenty of hold.

As for kids, again I think it makes little difference. Depending on your philosophy, why not getting them started right from the get go?

One other thought: ever had the unpleasant experience of having a poorly casted barbed hook removed from one's flesh? Sure to deter a kid from going fishing again.

[Tenacious Billy]

Agreed, barbed hooks are harder to pull out of one's own body than are barbless.......that fact, however, makes it pretty tough to argue that barbless hooks are just as effective at keeping fish on than are barbed ones. If I'm fishing somewhere that doesn't restrict the use of barbed hooks and I'm planning on bonking whatever I catch anyways - barbs away!!

[steel_ram]

Fine if your planning on killing everything, but what about incidentals? There's alway that overly aggressive little salmon grilse, or steelhead smolt that manages to impale themselves on some oversized whirling barbs of death.

[nano]

I think it has more to do with size of hook and how sharp it is then the barbs. I started to fish barbless hooks last year and find that they still produce the same as barbed hooks as long as they are keep ed sharp. That being said I have also seen people who are fishing barbless yet using a hook that is way to small and gut hooking fish. So what I'm trying to say is that we need to find a balance between both stiles.

[Tenacious Billy]

Fine if your planning on killing everything, but what about incidentals? There's alway that overly aggressive little salmon grilse, or steelhead smolt that manages to impale themselves on some oversized whirling barbs of death.

What about them? My point was that about the effectiveness of barbed vs barbless hooks.......I agree with Caribou Lou that on big waters when fishing for salmon, when the intention is to retain what you catch, barbed hooks are advantageous to the angler.

[happyhunter]

I think it has more to do with size of hook and how sharp it is then the barbs. I started to fish barbless hooks last year and find that they still produce the same as barbed hooks as long as they are keep ed sharp. That being said I have also seen people who are fishing barbless yet using a hook that is way to small and gut hooking fish. So what I'm trying to say is that we need to find a balance between both stiles.

If a fish is hooked bad but you would like to return it to the water you can always cut the line. Apparently (or so Ive heard) the hook will dissolve after awhile and the wound will heal.

[835]

If a fish is hooked bad but you would like to return it to the water you can always cut the line. Apparently (or so Ive heard) the hook will dissolve after awhile and the wound will heal.


Depends on too many factors. The material the hook is made of. Bronze will rot. The size of the hook and type. A treble stuck in the yap sewn the throught shut will kill the fish But a single bronze may rot out.

Fish can be tough some times, i have seen a fish with a splitshot on the line hanging from its butt. This is not the norm. But you are fore sure correct in one respect, sometimes it is way better to cut the line rather then try to get the hook out. This is why when you fish with worm the proper size hook is critical and it is best if it is bronze.

To be safe to release fish there are three parts to it. First is hook size, second is barb and third is how long you play the fish. There is more to it but these are the easiest to manage as a fisherman.


But as long as we all play by the rules and fish ethically who cares!
Ethics I feel plays a great part in fishing. But lets pretend i didnt say the "E" word

[Caribou_lou]

If a fish is hooked bad but you would like to return it to the water you can always cut the line. Apparently (or so Ive heard) the hook will dissolve after awhile and the wound will heal.

Not true!! I have found dead steelhead with flies deep in the throat with the line cut. This is more a feel good thing for the fisherman. But when it is 100% catch and release, what else does a guy do? The point I have been trying to make is that if you hook a fish deep in the gills, barbless or not, that fish is as good as dead!

Now I'm not trying to start a fight between tackle and fly fisherman here. Just the few steelhead I have found happen to have flies.

[Caribou_lou]

But as long as we all play by the rules and fish ethically who cares!
Ethics I feel plays a great part in fishing. But lets pretend i didnt say the "E" word

I strongly agree. Not afraid to say Ethics myself. But what does a fisherman do when he is practicing catch and release and hooks a fish bad beyond reviving? In a water system that is 100% catch and release?

I know what I would do. But can't say that!

[One Shot]

I am for it as it increases the survivability of released fish. The more fish that survive the release process the better for fishermen because it will mean more to recatch later....

[steel_ram]

Not true!! I have found dead steelhead with flies deep in the throat with the line cut. This is more a feel good thing for the fisherman. But when it is 100% catch and release, what else does a guy do? The point I have been trying to make is that if you hook a fish deep in the gills, barbless or not, that fish is as good as dead!

Now I'm not trying to start a fight between tackle and fly fisherman here. Just the few steelhead I have found happen to have flies.

True. If you puncture any of the major blood vessels leading to the gills, yank it around a bit the fish is dead, regardless. Elsewhere the hook left in might be a better option rather than turning the fish insideout trying to remove it.

[Caribou_lou]

True. If you puncture any of the major blood vessels leading to the gills, yank it around a bit the fish is dead, regardless. Elsewhere the hook left in might be a better option rather than turning the fish insideout trying to remove it.

Did you happen to miss the part where I said I have found fish that have hooks left in the throat and the line has been cut? So your saying the fish won't bleed out as fast but will eventually? I don't advise any fisherman to practice this technique!

[lorneparker1]

I fished barbs my whole life till i came to bc a few years ago. Id never go back. I dont think the barb it self does the damage, more trying to get the barb out or the time it takes to get it out.

Never once have i blamed not having a barb on losing a fish.

Lorne

[835]

Gotta admit though,,,, A barb on Coyote spoon would be nice!!!
but if you have this trouble try,,,, Spoon to split ring to swivell to hook.

[hunterlaura]

kind of makes the fight more fun when salmon fishing. But, if it's catch and release only, it makes sense to only have barbless for that.

[Caribou_lou]

kind of makes the fight more fun when salmon fishing. But, if it's catch and release only, it makes sense to only have barbless for that.

It's just that simple.... Why limit a guy like me who wants to take a fish home? Those who want to catch fish and plan on releasing them, shouldn't be using babrbs.

[meesemoot]

I don't think barbless does any favours to the fish where springs are being targeted for catch and keep. So many manage to shake off after a long battle where the fisherman would have been going home with his catch in the old days, but now has to tire out another three or four before going home empty handed because they all shook off. And I don't agree with catch and release for springs; they have lower survival rates than steelhead, so use barbed hooks, git 'er done, and leave the rest alone to spawn.

[steel_ram]

Maybe the meat fishers usung barbed should have to keep every fish they land up to the limit regardless if it's a big spring or a grilse. There is always going to be some fish that needs to be released and the least amount of trauma to the fish the better.

[Caribou_lou]

Maybe the meat fishers usung barbed should have to keep every fish they land up to the limit regardless if it's a big spring or a grilse. There is always going to be some fish that needs to be released and the least amount of trauma to the fish the better.

I have mentioned this in a post earlier in the thread. We have caught and kept fish where the barbless hook has done more damage than a barbed hook may have done! Barbless hook comes out during the fight and goes into the other side of the mouth. We never notice this when we use to use barbs. If your looking to do the least amount of trauma maybe you should just stay home!!

And for the record... I would never let a fish go that wasn't going to survive. Even if it's a small one. I'll be done for that day.

[meesemoot]

Maybe the meat fishers usung barbed should have to keep every fish they land up to the limit regardless if it's a big spring or a grilse. There is always going to be some fish that needs to be released and the least amount of trauma to the fish the better.

Barbed hooks are illegal on all rivers, streams, creeks, and sloughs in BC, in case you haven't checked the regs lately.

[steel_ram]

I'm not looking for an argument C_L, but I find your opinion of a barbless being more harmful contrary to mine, or any fisher I know. Weird stuff does happens but backing a barb out of a hole is way worse than barbless. Barbless hooks will not pop out if there's tension on them, granted a lot of people gay hand the rod thinking being gentle is going to prevent the fish from getting off.
There is an expected amount of mortality expected in catch and release, and that is worked into the management formula. So playing and releasing too many fish could be worse than bonking a few and going home, if that's what we do. So short of staying home, isn't it best to minimize trauma to the fish. Steelhead regulations actually state that your done fishing the river for the day if you kill your limit.

[CanuckShooter]

Management formula?? For catch and release?? Do you actually think they put that much effort into fishing when they don't even have the ability to predict run sizes???

[steelheadSABO]

I also agree with barbless but some trout really like to gulp it down and it doesn't matter if it's barbless or not your going to damage the gills or whatever.

Also a big problem is people picking up fish with their dry hands and wiping alot of the slime off

[steel_ram]

Management formula?? For catch and release?? Do you actually think they put that much effort into fishing when they don't even have the ability to predict run sizes???

Yes. Predicting run sizes for ocean going species is a huge, speculative, political and hopefully scientific can of worms. Apples and oranges . . .