Buffalo Arrows?

[BiG Boar]

I am hoping to take a water buffalo in Argentina with my bow in a few months. I currently shoot Montec CS heads with a total weight of 395 grains. This is being pushed currently at 310 fps. Should I up my weight to 70lbs? Will this arrow work effectivley? Or would you switch it up for something eles? Think of these buffalo as big bison (size and structure wise) that get really upset when poked.

I also plan on trying for my mountain grizz with my bow when I am back. Please discuss.

[seanfalloy]

Wow that sounds like a good hunt man. Im not familiar with how hard those animals need to be hit but this might help you decide if you dont already know about it.

http://backcountrybowhunting.com/articles/calc/

You can calculate the energy that your arrow has upon launch

[Ambush]

If you can shot #70, then put it up for sure. Get your arrows up around 500 grn +.
Everybody will be able to tell you what the very best broadhead is and what NOT to use based on shooting a few deer or hearing stories around the campfire.

Did your outfitter give you a maximum recommended shot distance? That will have a bearing on what head may work best for you.

Sounds like a blast!!

[BiG Boar]

Hmm. I know so little about this. Do I keep the same spine? These arrows I use now fly really good.

How does one learn all this crap. Guns seem so much easier!

I will try to find out the max distance. The most I would be comfortable shooting would be 40 yards.

[Slugman]

Aside from uping the weight of your arrow to at least the 450grn range the single most important thing you muct factor in is your FOC (Front of Center) as this will have a dramatic effect on the penetration you will experiance on such a animal. Some serious real world research conducted by a guy by the name of Ed Ashby has produced some rock solid evidence to back this up! Do yourself a favor and read up on his studies or if you find that too dry a read make sure you have a FOC of at least 20 - 25% to make it count on this hunt!
Cheers! Have a great hunt!

[evhunter]

Hmm. I know so little about this. Do I keep the same spine? These arrows I use now fly really good.

How does one learn all this crap. Guns seem so much easier!

I will try to find out the max distance. The most I would be comfortable shooting would be 40 yards.

What spine arrow are you shooting now? And specifically what arrow shaft (brand & model), length and broad head weight? What's your draw length and peak draw weight?

[Monashee]

Every article I've read about guys who have experience with big heavy boned animals is to use a heavy arrow , at least 10 grains per pound of draw weight , so a 70# bow would use a 700 grain arrow . Two blade broadheads give the best penetration. The results are so conclusive there is no room for argument .

http://www.broadheadtalk.com/general-broadhead-discussion/476-dr-ashby-report-heavy-bone-threshold.html

[evhunter]

Aside from uping the weight of your arrow to at least the 450grn range the single most important thing you muct factor in is your FOC (Front of Center) as this will have a dramatic effect on the penetration you will experiance on such a animal. Some serious real world research conducted by a guy by the name of Ed Ashby has produced some rock solid evidence to back this up! Do yourself a favor and read up on his studies or if you find that too dry a read make sure you have a FOC of at least 20 - 25% to make it count on this hunt!
Cheers! Have a great hunt!

Great advice. Dr. Ed Ashby is THE authority on arrow penetration on very large game.

An Easton FMJ 340 spine with brass insert and 125 grain broad head from your 70# set up is a good place to start. Heavy shaft, high FOC, and a single bevel, 2 blade broad head just might be the ticket.

[Ambush]

Aside from uping the weight of your arrow to at least the 450grn range the single most important thing you muct factor in is your FOC (Front of Center) as this will have a dramatic effect on the penetration you will experiance on such a animal. Some serious real world research conducted by a guy by the name of Ed Ashby has produced some rock solid evidence to back this up! Do yourself a favor and read up on his studies or if you find that too dry a read make sure you have a FOC of at least 20 - 25% to make it count on this hunt!
Cheers! Have a great hunt!

I've read his reports and they are exhaustive and thorough, but he is also shooting TRADITIONAL gear. The difference in dynamics between trad and BB's rig are substantial.
But like I said in my first post, everyone will have a definitive answer.

BB, if you would like my personal opinion, shoot me a pm. No sense getting folks on here wound up for no reason.

[Slugman]

I've read his reports and they are exhaustive and thorough, but he is also shooting TRADITIONAL gear. The difference in dynamics between trad and BB's rig are substantial.
But like I said in my first post, everyone will have a definitive answer.

BB, if you would like my personal opinion, shoot me a pm. No sense getting folks on here wound up for no reason.

Traditional gear yes but the simple princials of building an efficient arrow still apply. Thats what Ed Ashby is all about - building an arrow that utilizes as many advantages as possiable to ensure the best outcome. The most effiecient bows in the world still benefit from an arrow that can take advantage of modern compounds. There is no need for BB to go as heavy as a 700grn arrow for sure!
One of his studies in paticular he demonstrated an equal amount of penetration from a 40lb trad bow compared to an 80lb trad bow. This was accomplished with a lighter arrow but higher FOC.
In my humble opinion this guyis the absolute authority on hunting arrow dynamics!

[The Dude]

Are they gonna take the rope out of it's nose, or leave it tied to the tree? :???::???:
If I was gonna go that far to hunt an introduced species, I'd pay the little extra and take a Red Stag and a wild boar. Next time I'm in Asia, I've been invited to hunt wild boar with spears near the rice terraces. THAT would be a rush!
Just sayin' :rolleyes:
Have a great hunt , whatever you choose.

[bugler]

Try this BB, or google arrow spine charts.

http://www.eastonarchery.com/products/selection

Get your draw weight up as high as you can while still drawing smoothly, then select the heaviest arrow that spines properly with the head you want to use. The tip cutting montec should be a good choice, but a two blade style will penetrate even more.

[E.B.]

A few years back i guided a guy using a 400 gr arrow montec broadhead at under 300 fps, shot a large bull moose at 50 yrds broke a rib going in and it was so deep into the opposite shoulder that both of us had a hard time pulling it out. What more can you really ask for ?

[Bow Walker]

Dr. Ed Ashby - http://www.tradgang.com/ashby/

Dr. Ed Ashby's Alakan Bowhunter site - http://www.alaskabowhunting.com/default.aspx

A bit of reading, but it'll make you much more intelligent about hunting big game.

[evhunter]

Your current set up is fine. If you shoot it accuratly I'd do it with that. You have lots of energy, put the arrow in the right place and its gonna die.

Kirby

Let's go,... I have my .458 Win ready for when that arrow hits a rib going in!

[evhunter]

No, your arrow and my .458! I'm up for that challenge, you pay the way. First shot, I want a full frontal, coming at me at 10 yards.

[Ambush]

This could be you!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rK74jZDTDAM

[BiG Boar]

I emailed montec to see if it is used on moose and buffalo.

[Bchunter3006]

There is no way that arrow is out-penetrating a .458 Win. Especially when both are at bow range, sorry, but it won't happen. I agree with most of you. Arrow weight should come up to at least 450-500 grains. FOC should be high and have a good cut on contact fixed blade broadhead, 125 grain or heavier perferably. I've read about guys killing water buffalo with trad equipment so you should easily be able to get within 30 yards if they can. Good luck and have fun.

[bugler]

KE is greatly reduced upon impact as the arrow slows down. You want momentum to keep it driving through muscle and bone. For that, more weight is important. Read Ashby, undisputable junior high physics at work.

Not saying that the lighter arrow won't pass through, just that the heavier arrow has a much better chance if it runs into some heavy going. The speed you lose (2 to 3 fps per 10 gr of arrow) is negligible, might spread your pins a hair.

[greybark]

:-D Hey Dave , several Buffalo bowhunters recommened 70 lb and 8/9oo gr arrows .
Cheers

[pickaspot]

I don't think anyone has mentioned the German Kinetics broadheads. These things are made with bad intentions! Seemed to do the trick..
http://http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=4999176523&set=a.4998241523.6002.505931523&theater

[BiG Boar]

500 gr carbons with montec 125gr heads did the trick for a 1600 lbs beast just fine.

[Coyote]

Your current set up may work. It also may not. You would be wise to select equipment that gives you the best chance of achieving the desired penetration. There is a lot that can go wrong with big boned animals. The advice to increase the weight of your arrows is sound.

You asked how does one learn all this crap. Start by reading Ashby. I can't recommend him enough. It is a lot of reading but very much worth the effort. And remember he is studying what makes an effective arrow, not telling you what to shoot. What you shoot will be your decision using the knowledge you gain from reading his work.

You have a GREAT opportunity coming up. Make sure your set up doesn't leave you disappointed.

'yote

[Coyote]

PS make sure your set up is well tuned.

'yote

[Ambush]

500 gr carbons with montec 125gr heads did the trick for a 1600 lbs beast just fine.

Did I miss the pics of this marvelous monster??

[Bow Walker]

I am hoping to take a water buffalo in Argentina with my bow in a few months. I currently shoot Montec CS heads with a total weight of 395 grains. This is being pushed currently at 310 fps. Should I up my weight to 70lbs? Will this arrow work effectivley? Or would you switch it up for something eles? Think of these buffalo as big bison (size and structure wise) that get really upset when poked.

I also plan on trying for my mountain grizz with my bow when I am back. Please discuss.

Can't see where anyone has mentioned this yet, so here goes.

Are there not minimums for hunting what is considered 'dangerous game animals'? Like minimum bow poundage and arrow weights? IIRC there are restrictions like that for Bison, I bet there are for Water Buffalo as well.

[Tuffcity]

Bear in mind that this is what you will have to punch an arrow through.

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a20/Tuffcity/3cb60f87.jpg

Slightly different bone structure than North American animals.

RC