Unused traplines, there for the taking???

[chilcotin hillbilly]

I had this discussion with a biologist at the MOE office a week or two ago. In my area there is not one trapper using there trapline. I have Lived here for 7 seasons now and not a trap has been set on these traplines. I suggested taking over on of these lines as I thought after a couple years of non use the crown was to take it back and give it to someone else.
I was told I would be better to ask permission and use the there trapline so I wouldn't piss anyone off??
Does the MOE really have no balls??? I am sure this is the same all over the province, and now with the CO's respnsible for the wolf problems you would think the would want active trappers that actually get things done.

Whats the real deal behind the trapline use regulations?

Does this happen in your area?

What can we do about it?

[proguide66]

If I recall correctly , if a trap line shows no activity for 2 years it " may" be up for auction.
While looking into some areas here ( reg 2) I came across a monster line wich hadnt showed activity since late 70's.The " office" said that the majority of lines are owned by firstnations here and auctioning them off would most likely cause" major headache for all" so...they instead ussued me a permit to trap for $55.00....easy,smooth...and I was killing wolves....

Sometimes puffing your chest up and getting ready to fight for an activity may be more a pain in the ass than 'silently slipping into the questioned activity' and carrying on........:neutral:

[Trapper D]

i have found , that personality tends to involve itself , in discussions about, said traplines. depending on who you talk to. from region to region, there are different ideals. some of the guys ive had communication with are great guys as you know. some are standoffish. maybe like you say its better not to stick your chest out and just pursue a permit. but apparently some regions will not even do that. the permit and authorization bureau ,will still goe through the process, only to get shut down further down the line. its been said that there possibly going to start looking into these DORMANT traplines, to resell them. but its also been said that there are hurdles to overcome, before this can be done. the treaties are said to be one of the roadblocks. but at the same time i know of guide outfitter certificates have been issued in some of these areas of contention. which to me seems contradictery , to the reasons trapline transferring have been stalled. im in the process of trying to aquire a trapline. Im sure M.O.E. are having difficulties regarding, information on or about traplines, for a number of reasons. ie records havent been kept up to date regarding usage, and who, what and where.

[BCrams]

Seems pretty clear cut to me. FN holders may be a different story however as PGuide said.


4

No person shall continue to hold a

registered trapline unless he or she:
●


carries on active trapping on his or her

registered trapline to the satisfaction of
the Regional Manager, or
●


obtains permission from the Regional

Manager to temporarily discontinue the
use of his or her registered trapline for
a period not exceeding two years, or
●


uses or causes the use of his or her

trapline by a licensed trapper or a
person exempted from holding a
licence.
4


A person fails to use a trapline where,

within a year, that person fails to take from
the trapline furbearing animals of a value of
$200, or 50 pelts, except where it is unreasonable
for that value of animals or number
of pelts to be taken from the trapline.

Additional information as required.

http://www.env.gov.bc.ca/pasb/applications/process/trapper.html#a4

[CanuckShooter]

person fails to use a trapline where,


within a year, that person fails to take from
the trapline furbearing animals of a value of
$200, or 50 pelts, except where it is unreasonable
for that value of animals or number
of pelts to be taken from the trapline.

Is there a way to determine if anyone is taking pelts 'of a value of $200' or not?? I know of trappers that trap for short periods of time and do not sell the pelts due to low prices...it would appear they are not active when in fact they are.???????

[Trapper D]

person fails to use a trapline where,


within a year, that person fails to take from
the trapline furbearing animals of a value of
$200, or 50 pelts, except where it is unreasonable
for that value of animals or number
of pelts to be taken from the trapline.

Is there a way to determine if anyone is taking pelts 'of a value of $200' or not?? I know of trappers that trap for short periods of time and do not sell the pelts due to low prices...it would appear they are not active when in fact they are.???????
they can also apply to the regional manager to temporarily suspend trapping for a certain amount of time.

[Trapper D]

its not exactly easy to aquire information , from the outside looking in. im in the early stages of my pursuit, so im sure ,patience is probably an asset. frustrating though

[CanuckShooter]

There is an option of trapping on private land also is there not???:-D

[proguide66]

person fails to use a trapline where,


within a year, that person fails to take from
the trapline furbearing animals of a value of
$200, or 50 pelts, except where it is unreasonable
for that value of animals or number
of pelts to be taken from the trapline.

Is there a way to determine if anyone is taking pelts 'of a value of $200' or not?? I know of trappers that trap for short periods of time and do not sell the pelts due to low prices...it would appear they are not active when in fact they are.???????


You stil have to pay a fee$ to the govt each season for each pelt taken wich also shows its active as well.

[Trapper D]

i as well am , interested in wolf management , as im an active hunter, and believe, its necessary to control there populations ,not anhilate them. there reproductive cycles does justify management. especially where ungulates have been transplanted to, and where they are in decline. wolves on the west coast of the island are eating bears now, that cant be good. im sure if these unused traplines were put up for auction, so that , a new generation of trapper can continue the management of wildlife , accountabiltiy of wildlife , which benefits M.O.E., in regards to whats in the said area. also if there s an overpopulation of a species, or underpopulation, it will be noticed earlier, with active trappers in there. trappers are natural conservationalists , they have to be, and thats what there taught. because they only have 1 area to trap , and if they over trap , there out of business. the guy who taught me , told us, of the many things hes done , to preserve , and maintain , roads, acess, other destructions from wildlife , humans, etc. for all to benefit.

[Trapper D]

There is an option of trapping on private land also is there not???:-Dya you can do that, some are pricy though. some forestry companies do that for an annual fee.

[Alone in the wildernes]

I know of a trap line thats for sale up north if anyone is interested ?

[snareman1234]

Not sure whether it is just "there for the taking"

But I got permission to trap on an unused trap line for two great years while I lived in Chilliwack.

The trapline owner was not running it, I approached him, and offered him a nice cooler of hali and salmon and got to run the line, it was awesome.

Might try this avenue as opposed to trying to take it away from the owner, even though I totally understand he should be using it or else someone else should.
Could also approach the owner with intent to buy, instead of going through the MOE to get it taken away,

[Trapper D]

i would prefer cutting a deal with an existing trapline owner ,rather than dealing with bidding process via M.O.E., since the existing holders of unused traplines wont get a red cent from resale through the gov, because from what ive been told , they are reliquished first then the gov. resells , which has nothing to do with a trapper that doenst have a trapline, requesting the gov to reclaim an unused trapline

[chilcotin hillbilly]

The traplines I am thinking about you would never get to use. To these people that I am thinking about it seems like the trap line is a status symbol, and their ownership is mentioned at every land use meeting, as if it is their only source of income.

The MOE should be responsible for policing their own policies, that goes for Guide outfitters land use as well.

In a time where money is scarce they should want to collect royalties.

[Trapper D]

The traplines I am thinking about you would never get to use. To these people that I am thinking about it seems like the trap line is a status symbol, and their ownership is mentioned at every land use meeting, as if it is their only source of income.

The MOE should be responsible for policing their own policies, that goes for Guide outfitters land use as well.

In a time where money is scarce they should want to collect royalties.
i totally agree with what your saying. usem or loozem

[ROEBUCK]

The traplines I am thinking about you would never get to use. To these people that I am thinking about it seems like the trap line is a status symbol, and their ownership is mentioned at every land use meeting, as if it is their only source of income.

The MOE should be responsible for policing their own policies, that goes for Guide outfitters land use as well.

In a time where money is scarce they should want to collect royalties.

x2
most trapline owners are nearing or long past retirement age and probably not fit enough to manage there lines anymore

[luckynuts]

Man would I have a bunch of trap lines up for the taking.

I work in an area that has a couple of trap lines through them. Unfortunately they rarely get worked and only when the price is way up on fur. However if an oil company or logging out fit comes around, Wow you would think their lives depended on the trap line. I like the term "trapping oil companies" because that is what they usually do. I haven't seen a trap in the last 2 winters which is a shame wolves are thick right now and they are getting $100-$300 a skull but still isn't enough incentive.

W.

[BlacktailStalker]

Yeah that whole trap line thing is a crock of shit.
It frustrates me as well, there are minimal active trappers around here and LOTS of land that can be trapped yet I have NO clue who owns what or where to start to acquire one... the system needs to be revised.
I know they with hold info for reasons to do with privacy and prevent issues with anti's etc but its piss poorly managed IMO and there are lots of guys missing out on what they want to do.

[Trapper D]

ya no kidding , honestly i get more info from you guys then anywhere else and im a member etc.

[hazardiz]

So no trapline is there 'just for the taking'. Each trapline has one or multiple registered owners. Unless there is written consent from the registered owner of the trapline you may not trap that line. I agree that the demographic of the current owners of many of the traplines is quite old and many are not being used actively or being managed properly. The MOE is currently working on a form of enforcement/accountability to ensure that traplines are being used/managed to a certain level or they will be returned to the crown for resale. So a deficiency has been realized and work has started to make the system more accessible.

I do agree that it is not a user friendly system and access to unused traplines is nearly impossible unless there is a personal relationship with the owner or by word of mouth.

Trapping on private land is allowed so long as written permission is given by the land owner. New permission must be given each year if the original permission is not for an extended period of time.

If anyone is looking to have their trapline managed or to sell their trapline they can contact me at albertkoehler@gmail.com and I can put them in contact with trappers in the area.

Hope this answers some of your questions and concerns. If you have any more questions I will do my best to answer them or find the answer.

[tbocking]

For someone looking to get into trapping is there a course that one could take to learn how to trap and how to aquire a trapline?

[boxhitch]

Check teh BCTA website for best info

[cloverphil]

BC Trappers meeting was last wednesday at Ganders Tax. in Surrey

to do trapping you need to be a licenced trapper and in season, regs are in the Hunting and Trapping regs on the last few pages

[hunter1947]

This kind of shit happens everywhere and its about time management puts there foot down says enough is enough if you can't prove you sold furs in the last calender year you loose your trap line it is as simple as that it will be auction off to others that have a trapping licence and want to trap on this registered trap line.

One more thing that management needs to do is if there are wolves on a persons trap line and the trapper of this line don't do any trapping for the wolves in that calender year.

Management should enforce a law that will give the rights to another trapper that will trap for wolves on this trap line ,,,the CO can do spot checks on trap lines to see if the trapper has leg hold traps out or snares set up ,,,, but then again the management don't have the revenue or staff to do this like always..

[Hunt-4-Life]

As I understand it, trappers need to offer their line to FN before they can sell it. And ChilkoHB said already, it becomes something of a status symbol and a bargaining chip when dealing with land claim issues. "you can't build a mine there, I'm a' trapper' and you're infringing on my rights as a FN person by building a mine/road/cut block on my trapline (which us never actually used)". I know, sweeping generalization but true at least some of the time. And chilcoHB I'm sure taseko has heard that argument too.

I don't think it's a bad thing to be angry about thd two-tiered discriminatory system the government has set up. Why should one ethic group have any rights at all over any other ethic group? Like automatic first dibs on a trapline?

[Wild one]

The biggest issue with trapline is not FN because if it was every time a trapline transfers ownership they are consulted and given the opportunity to try to claim rights. Traplines transfer hands every year and few are lost because of FN. The only real issue here is it slows down the process to what extent varies from band to band.

The real issue has been the MOE just not starting the process in most regions. There is steps the MOE needs to do to deem them inactive/vacant which include FN consultations, giving trapline owners that are not meeting standards to keep there line the opportunity to plead there case, If owner cannot be contacted there is a time frame and number of times they must attempt of contact and other BS involved. If the line is already declared vacant FN consultations is the only real issue.

MOE likes to use FN as the excuse but if you push hard enough you will find it is lack of priority in most regions and trapping is more of a corner of the desk project. Do to the lack of man power and funding most regional mangers use there man power and funding for other issues.

Do to the real push over the last few years and show of numbers interested this issue is becoming harder for the MOE to ignore. Right now the biggest thing holding up progress is elections as the MOE will not move forward with anything till they are complete. I know in some regions things are looking up but results of elections may change things.

[Schmaus]

This thread is stupid. If you want a trapline, buy one. Don't go stepping on someone else's toes. Just because nobody lived in a house for awhile doesn't mean you can take it over.

[hunter1947]

I don't think this thread is stupid the law in the trapping regs you have to trap a number of animals during a trapping season..

[chilcotin hillbilly]

This thread is stupid. If you want a trapline, buy one. Don't go stepping on someone else's toes. Just because nobody lived in a house for awhile doesn't mean you can take it over.

Really!!! If you don't trap your line it is supposed to be returned to the crown and auctioned off. We have one active line nearby the other 7 have been untouched in 9 winters. Go figure?

[digger dogger]

This thread is stupid. If you want a trapline, buy one. Don't go stepping on someone else's toes. Just because nobody lived in a house for awhile doesn't mean you can take it over.

Sounds like an uniformed, stupid comment. I'd drive over a few toes to get a trapline near my residents..

[boxhitch]

We have one active line nearby the other 7 have been untouched in 9 winters. Go figure? Untouched doesn't mean inactive.
Its easy to show the necessary activity on the books to keep things current , and in compliance with the rules.

[Wild one]

Untouched doesn't mean inactive.
Its easy to show the necessary activity on the books to keep things current , and in compliance with the rules.

Very true and this is one of the issues it is too easy at this time to abuse the trapline system with the lack of data being collected. The lack of data is not just an issue when it comes to trapline abuse but also comes into play that they don't even know if the lease holder is still alive in some cases. The way traplines are managed by the MOE is a real mess at this time

There is a lot of traplines deemed vacant with no lease holder in BC at this time as well. This is where the lack of work by the MOE really comes in as all that is need for these lines to go up for auction is FN consultation. Very few regions have taken the effort to start consultation and because of this these vacant lines sit in limbo with no lease holder to trap them. There is close to 50 vacant traplines in region 2 alone that just need FN consultation to be put up for auction.

Trapline abuse is a big part of the problem in some areas but the lack of trapline management by the MOE in some regions is a lot bigger problem.

[TommyGuitar]

I have it on good authority that they're working on it, guys. Believe me, everybody wants to see the traplines being used effectively. Fur is a beautiful natural resource of ours and it is a shame to let it go to waste. Keeping traplines active benefits outdoorsmen of all kinds; having funds go into conservation, general public awareness, and a stronger fur market are just some examples. Canadian fur is a fine product, some of the world's finest, and I encourage you all to keep asking about the traplines. It can only help us all.

[boxhitch]

The way traplines are managed by the MOE is a real mess at this timeThanks to Gov't downsizing , a few departments are over whelmed
Smaller Gov't and less spending has a dark side to.

[KB90]

How about the $200 dollars in fur that is needed to keep a trapline. Should that be revisited?

$200 is ridiculously low. I know prices have come up recently, but if you are only taking 200 in fur a year, you are obviously not utilizing your line, and it should be given to someone who will.

[Doublelung]

I love how people assume a trap line is not being used. Before you consider a line in active mb you should put 24 hour 365 day monitoring into it. I trap right under people noses. One of the tricks of the trade is trapping around people and not having them figure out what your up too. Yes there is a few lines that aren't in use. I believe there's five on the island that have been identified.

[Wild one]

I love how people assume a trap line is not being used. Before you consider a line in active mb you should put 24 hour 365 day monitoring into it. I trap right under people noses. One of the tricks of the trade is trapping around people and not having them figure out what your up too. Yes there is a few lines that aren't in use. I believe there's five on the island that have been identified.

When I am saying inactive/vacant these are lines that there is no lease holder for the trapline and there is a good number out there in this catigorey. I have info regarding this from the MOE and these lines mostly consist of trappers that turned there lines over to the MOE or have passed on. This does not included trappers that do not meet there min or lines where the MOE have not up dated the data.

As boxhitch mention the lack of funding has most departments over welmed. Trapping has been neglected badly because of this and with the low fur $ in the past the MOE was not pushed to fix it. With trapping being pushed a side for so long it has created a big mess with poor records. Now the people in charge of trapping are having to try and clean up the mess created by those who neglected there job in the past. This is where the poor guy who just took over the job in the last few years gets kind of screwed

I agree just because a trapper is not seen does not mean the line is inactive it is not hard to go un noticed. That being said the issue is not the guys who are not seen out trapping but the guys who are not trapping at all. The lack of data collected by the MOE makes it hard for them to tell who is even trapping. I know some lines are still declared active even though the lease holder has not had a trappers license in over 10 years.

I have dug into this issue a lot over the last 4 going on 5 years lots of phone calls ,read lots of paper work from the MOE, and a few meetings. Yes it varies from region to region on how messed up the trapline system is but the problem is a lot more than people assuming guys are not trapping.

[BCHunterTV]

http://www.mccowans.com/content/trapline-located-west-whistler

[BCHunterTV]

http://www.mccowans.com/content/trapline-north-kamloops

[wideopenthrottle]

like a mining claim i guess...use it or lose it?