Alex Mota (sp?)---Kluchesi---

[MountainHigh]

Anybody heard of this guy? :confused: Just wondering what the big deal is about this guy.

[slyfox]

He now,s his stuff that,s all i,ll say.

[BiG Boar]

He now,s his stuff that,s all i,ll say.

Wow, that took a while to figure out. :wink:

[rocksteady]

Can you provide more details as far as where etc..I think I know what you are eluding to but do not want to go down that road, without knowing what you are getting at....

PM me if you wish to remain confidential...

[Devilbear]

Is this person a relation of the notorious Idalicio Mota, the immigrant "packer" who was convicted of many wildlife offences here in BC and in Alberta, during the '80s and '90s? I had discussions with some BC COs and some Alberta COs about this guy when I was working for Alberta Environment at that time, he killed a whack of game illegally and somehow avoided gaol time and/or deportation....which, is what SHOULD have happened.

At one point, Idalicio's child was taken very ill and Barry Thompkins flew the child out to medical help, although Mota was "packing" in Thompkin's GO area and his guides were NOT friends with Mota. I thought that this was a pretty decent thing to do given the circumstances.......

I have wondered what happened to Mota and if this IS a relative, well, I would be dammed cautious in any dealing with him.

[MountainHigh]

This is infact the same guy. I heard he is illegally packing too.

[snowhunter]

Alex is also a war veteran from the Portuguese Angola war with a reputation both in Angola and Canada.

He could make millions is he wrote a book about is exploits in both countries.

[7mmWSM]

When we flew in with Barry Thompkins last fall year the CO's made a stop at our camp with the chopper. They were on their way to Mota's camp to see if they could catch him red-handed. They stopped by on their way back, and asked several guides to confirm age on the sheep they confiscated, 3 of which were under-age. Mota dissapeared before the chopper landed, leaving his "clients" high and dry. Clients were evicted from the park and charged with appropriate hunting infractions.

Other CO's in Ft, Nelson we have talked to have confirmed his illegal activities have been going on for years. They can't catch him in the act though, because he'll just take off into the bush. Clients that go with him pay cash up front, and are lucky if he even stays in camp with them. He isn't licensed in any way whatsoever.

Unsubstantiated rumors (heard from multiple sources) also have it that a certain sporting goods shop in the Lower Mainland books his clients. Needless to say they won't be getting my business. This guys shoots the crap out of the country up there and does it off of the backs of the guys trying to do it the honest way.

[bruin]

I used to work in one of Tompkins camps. There were lots of bad things said about Moda.

[hellojello74]

I used to work in one of Tompkins camps. There were lots of bad things said about Moda.


I can second that!!!

Heard of him getting pissed at CO's and shooting at choppers, and killing shooting a bunch of sheep.... either way bad news

[dutchie]

From what I have heard he has a Lifetime hunting Ban. I have also heard that he has been labeled as one of the worst poachers in Canadian History.

I talked to a few people last year that said he was running the Muskwa drainage's.

Moda is a guy that should have his a$$ in a jail cell with a cell mate named Big Bubba.

Dutchie

[hellojello74]

The question is, is it really that hard to catch the guy?

And who would hire him.....?:roll:

Would make for an interesting book is the sad part IMO

[Kody94]

From what I have heard he has a Lifetime hunting Ban.

Interesting read... 30 year hunting ban, effective 1992 or so...
http://www.eab.gov.bc.ca/wildlife/91-24.HTM
http://www.eab.gov.bc.ca/wildlife/91_24.pdf

Interesting reading here too....Mr Loring took a run at Mr Mota's title.
http://www.eab.gov.bc.ca/wildlife/2005wil008a.pdf

Apparently Mr Mota is quite well known in the Yukon, and was known to "indiscriminately gun down eagles, sheep and goats within the course of a few hours".
http://www.yukon-news.com/news/12181

I can't find the actual case from Alberta yet, but he was convicted there too...
"In R. v. Mota (1991), 117 A.R. 42, 2 W.A.C. 42 (concerning a repeat
market and trophy poacher fined $10,000 or six months imprisonment), the Alberta
Court of Appeal commented that the Act's new penalties are "moderate", Mr.
Mota's sentence was "fit and appropriate" (and suggested civil actions to enjoin
him from future use or possession of firearms), and "wildlife must be accorded the
priority of a treasured national heritage - which it is". The Court at page 44 also
urged Parliament to consider "increasing the penalties, both maximum and
minimum, for repeat offences of this kind that occur in our National Parks"."

[shallowH2O]

wondering if it was the grizzled older gentlemen I ran into on the upper muskwa this year. spoke with a very heavy accent to the point you could barely understand him. he was leading a string of 6-7 horses out of kulchesi lake he said heading down the muskwa and out to prophit river. definetly wasnt overly friendly

[Buck]

Any pictures of this guy?

[snowhunter]

What training does a CO have against a higly trained, former soldier with years of combat experiences, using his skills for poaching in Western Canada ?

[Old Crow]

Alex is a gem..A different breed for sure.But one hell of a interesting character..He may have poor human skills but he knows the bush,horses and game.They will write stories about this guy when he's gone.Good or bad he is a peice of the norths fabric

[Devilbear]

I was told that Mota was a veteran of the Vietnam War, which would make him about my age and, frankly, I seriously doubt that his "bush skills" are anything special. While he may be some hot shit as far as shooting unarmed denizens of a "Third World" nation is concerned, I doubt that he will WANT to tangle with a group of trained BC COs.

Dale Copeland, a former outfitter and one of Thompkin's "head guides" had a confrontation with Mota on a packtrail some years ago and Mota backed down from Copeland. Dale is not a large man and he is, without question, among the best bushmen I have seen in almost sixty years of activities in the BC bush, I doubt that Mota could carry Copeland's jock strap as a real mountain man or best many guys I know in "guerrila" combat.

I supervised several Vietnam combat vets, including a couple of "Green Beanies" in wildfire suppression and I was not overly impressed by their bush abilities; I was VERY impressed by Dale Copeland's skills and I am not exactly a novice. Dale's wife told me of this encounter and of Thompkin's flying Mota's kid out....says a lot for Barry, IMHO.

I rather doubt the comment about the gun store booking for Mota; one of the owners is a friend of his and they have defended him in conversation with me back in the '90s; however, I do not think that they would risk their business by such behaviour and I have known them and dealt with them for almost 30 years.

I might be wrong, but, I suspect that Mota's clientele comes by "word of mouth" just like that other immigrant poacher from the '80s, "Martin" who operated in the same region. He WAS finally forced out of "business", however, I encountered him while in the camp of another packer in that area in 1991; none of these guys impress me very much and the situation needed and still needs regulation.

Mota, seems to be able to "skate" on various charges and decent hunters should pressure Victoria to get this guy deported as immigrants like him do not belong in Canada.

[northernhunter]

My dad and i flew into the kluachesi strip three years ago with villers air out of fort nelson, the second day we were there Mota came in to meet a float plane on kluachesi lake with hunters on it. I talked to one of the guys that got off the plane and he said they got ahold of him through a sporting goods store in the lower mainland also. They loaded there gear on his horses and headed toward the gathto, we could see his camp just down river a couple miles from barry's main camp when we were up high.

[Devilbear]

Very interesting, I shall have to look into this as I would not knowingly deal with anyone who would support Mota.

Were you client's of Barry's as I understood that he has an exclusive charter arrangement with Villers?

[Walking Buffalo]

Interesting read... 30 year hunting ban, effective 1992 or so...
http://www.eab.gov.bc.ca/wildlife/91-24.HTM
http://www.eab.gov.bc.ca/wildlife/91_24.pdf

Interesting reading here too....Mr Loring took a run at Mr Mota's title.
http://www.eab.gov.bc.ca/wildlife/2005wil008a.pdf

Apparently Mr Mota is quite well known in the Yukon, and was known to "indiscriminately gun down eagles, sheep and goats within the course of a few hours".
http://www.yukon-news.com/news/12181

I can't find the actual case from Alberta yet, but he was convicted there too...
"In R. v. Mota (1991), 117 A.R. 42, 2 W.A.C. 42 (concerning a repeat
market and trophy poacher fined $10,000 or six months imprisonment), the Alberta
Court of Appeal commented that the Act's new penalties are "moderate", Mr.
Mota's sentence was "fit and appropriate" (and suggested civil actions to enjoin
him from future use or possession of firearms), and "wildlife must be accorded the
priority of a treasured national heritage - which it is". The Court at page 44 also
urged Parliament to consider "increasing the penalties, both maximum and
minimum, for repeat offences of this kind that occur in our National Parks"."


I'll look for the Alberta case. Here is the Appeal, which was dismissed.

R. V Mota

http://www.canlii.org/en/ab/abca/doc/1991/1991abca188/1991abca188.html

[snowhunter]

My understanding is that Alex, being a Portuguese, fought in Portugal's colonial war in Angola, southern Africa for several years, and not i Vietnam.

The kind of money that can be made by legal and illegal means are high for anyone willing to cater to hunters in an area like Kluachesi and the surrounding ares of Gatho, and lots of politics from legal guide,outfitters and law enforcements goes into it as well, including undercover "hunters", who are very easy to spot, because they smell of coffee and doughnuts.

Martin, after everybody paid for the hunt, went bankrupt, has disappeared, but Alex has a strong following of B.C. hunters who use his and his horses services for bringing downed game, back to the camp.

[behemoth]

Very interesting, I shall have to look into this as I would not knowingly deal with anyone who would support Mota.

Were you client's of Barry's as I understood that he has an exclusive charter arrangement with Villers?

Please, if you find anything out, share it with the group. If you are satisfied that the "lower mainland store" is booking with/for this guy I would really like to know who.

A PM would be appreciated if you are not comfortable with sharing this information publicly (althought that doesn't sound like your style:wink:

[deer nut]

lots of politics from legal guide,outfitters and law enforcements goes into it as well, including undercover "hunters", who are very easy to spot, because they smell of coffee and doughnuts.

That's uncalled for. Most COs are very dedicated and hard working. IMO, they are way underpaid for what they do and the risks they take in the line of duty.

[snowhunter]

My friend, I have very hi regards for our law enforcement officers. I hope you understand that this was a joke, "that you can smell law enforcement officer, because they smell of coffee and doughtnut" :)

However, you do not have any problems with some of the xenophobic comments of deporting this individual who might have lived longer in Canada than you have lived ?

If I need to, I will sent my comments to you first next time, for some censoring :)

[Devilbear]

I made the comments about deporting Mota and am in favour of such action for any criminal not born here in Canada. This is NOT ...xenophobic...and such a comment simply indicates a lack of understanding as to what xenophobia actually is and is not.

Your comment to "deer nut", however, is hardly an example of a lack of concern for the origins of other posters here and this seems a bit hypocritical to me. I get the impression that you are in favour of Mota and others like him, which I also find a bit odd in a law-abiding resident hunter.

As to ...coffee and doughnuts... where COs and other resource management agency employees are concerned, that is simply an ignorant remark and what one usually hears from those who thought they wanted such employment, but, could not meet the requirements to be hired.

Where living in BC is concerned, perhaps "deer nut" is a newcomer and perhaps not, however, he may well have lived here longer than you have, if you wish to take that approach to the credibility of other posters. Frankly, you do not seem very concerned about the many serious convictions for wildlife offences that Mota has and maybe this is because you find such actions acceptable, or, are a friend of his?

[Devilbear]

Please, if you find anything out, share it with the group. If you are satisfied that the "lower mainland store" is booking with/for this guy I would really like to know who.

A PM would be appreciated if you are not comfortable with sharing this information publicly (althought that doesn't sound like your style:wink:

If and I stress if, I can find definite evidence that the store in question is assisting Mota in any respect, I will certainly post that here and I will never deal with them, again. That said, there are those "hunters" in BC, who legally qualify as "residents" who would gladly use the services of Mota and others like him without a qualm and many of these are from certain groups.

Unfortunately, the use of hearsay cannot bring about charges in these instances and the CO service is so understaffed and underfunded, that the scumbags get away with all kinds of dirty deals in hunting and fishing here in BC. This is not a "new" problem and will not change in the forseeable future.

[snowhunter]

It is interesting that Alex Mota's name comes up in these fine pages, and about the crimes he had committed and prosecuted for in Canada.

However, those crimes he committed in Canada, might be peanuts compared to what he was directly involved in, against the impoverish people of Angola, who was fighting for their freedom from Portuguese, colonial rule ?

After learning about Alex Mota's serious human rights violations and exploits as a portuguese "specialist" soldier in Angola, I cannot be in the same room as him, or ever to speak to him again.

Alex Mota's involvment and exploits as a soldier in Angola has for years been well known to various Canadian Law Enforcement Agencies, who, in a response to a request, among others, got this infomation from Portuguese Police files, many, many years ago.

[budismyhorse]

this guy sounds like a real treat.

[urbanhermit]

What training does a CO have against a higly trained, former soldier with years of combat experiences, using his skills for poaching in Western Canada ?
every one loves a good Rambo movie, but they are just movies.

[rocksteady]

After he was convicted in the late 80's/early 90's there was an article in BC Outdoors (IIRC) where it gave details of his expoits, as well as interview with the investigating CO....Not sure if I still have the article or not...Doubt it...

In the article he was tagged as "The Butcher of The North".....

He had bald eagles in his possession that he had shot and mounted, as well as many other protected species....

[.270]

Amazing how much damage one person or company can do to our environment if they want. The depressing thing is that the courts don't take these offences seriously enough and in many cases the penalties are a joke.

[wildcatter]

I met him a couple years ago at the sporting goods store, he gave me his phone number and said if I want to go hunting give him a call.
I knew a little bit about him because Joe told me some stories.
However I don't think the store support him in any way, he's been friends with them and a customer for some time.


If and I stress if, I can find definite evidence that the store in question is assisting Mota in any respect, I will certainly post that here and I will never deal with them, again. That said, there are those "hunters" in BC, who legally qualify as "residents" who would gladly use the services of Mota and others like him without a qualm and many of these are from certain groups.

Unfortunately, the use of hearsay cannot bring about charges in these instances and the CO service is so understaffed and underfunded, that the scumbags get away with all kinds of dirty deals in hunting and fishing here in BC. This is not a "new" problem and will not change in the forseeable future.

[BlacktailStalker]

Its important this thread stays open so everybody needs to keep it 'cool' !
Its well known many wealthy people land in Kluachesi and hire this guy.
The more that know the better !

It'd be nice to know for sure who the sporting goods store is who refers to this guy !

[Kody94]

In the article he was tagged as "The Butcher of The North".....


Good memory Rock. I found this title, but not the article itself, from "International Wildlife"...

DOLPHIN, Ric. "Stalking 'The Butcher of the North'." International Wildlife 23:1 (1993): 12-19. (Alex Mota, wildlife poacher)

[CanuckShooter]

If he is so bad you have to wonder why no one has shot the sob???

[hellojello74]

Good memory Rock. I found this title, but not the article itself, from "International Wildlife"...

DOLPHIN, Ric. "Stalking 'The Butcher of the North'." International Wildlife 23:1 (1993): 12-19. (Alex Mota, wildlife poacher)



Would love to read it if anyone can drum up a copy...

[Kody94]

Would love to read it if anyone can drum up a copy...

I can only find Int'l Wildlife articles back to '94. Hopefully someone can dig it up!

[slyfox]

He as lost his privileges to hunt in bc and alberta and did time in jail and payed big fines.As a person alex is a good friend people make mistakes and he is paying for them.I grow up in the portuguese community as a kid and alex was all way,s around he is a nice guy and one hell of a mountain man as why no one has shot this guy take it easy with comment,s like that,can get you in trouble canuckshooter.

[MountainHigh]

Its well known many wealthy people land in Kluachesi and hire this guy.
The more that know the better !


Blacktail....you're 100% correct.

that is...many wealthy (and not so wealthy) guys are breaking the law when they hire this guy.

Sounds like his kid may be taking over the illegal operation.:-?

[KB90]

alex is a good friend....a nice guy....and one hell of a mountain man.
He could be the nicest guy and best mountain hunter in the world but he is still a loser.

[MooseWhacker]

He as lost his privileges to hunt in bc and alberta and did time in jail and payed big fines.As a person alex is a good friend people make mistakes and he is paying for them.I grow up in the portuguese community as a kid and alex was all way,s around he is a nice guy and one hell of a mountain man as why no one has shot this guy take it easy with comment,s like that,can get you in trouble canuckshooter.
Purposely poaching aminals for monentary gain is not a mistake.It is a deliberate act.Shooting him may be going to far but to hell with jail send him to the pen with Bubba.

[One Shot]

including undercover "hunters", who are very easy to spot, because they smell of coffee and doughnuts.

When you are full of it, it must be possible to smell you in the next MU....:mrgreen:

[snowhunter]

Only when I have, while hunting, been wearing Gore-tex pant all day :)

[Kody94]

He as lost his privileges to hunt in bc and alberta and did time in jail and payed big fines.As a person alex is a good friend people make mistakes and he is paying for them.I grow up in the portuguese community as a kid and alex was all way,s around he is a nice guy and one hell of a mountain man as why no one has shot this guy take it easy with comment,s like that,can get you in trouble canuckshooter.

I'm not the type to convict on hearsay, but where there smoke there's usually fire....it sounds like he is still illegally packing/guiding. He has made his mistakes and paid for them, but did he learn from them or is he still making them?

[MountainHigh]

Still making them...methinks

[One Shot]

Can convictions under the provincial or Federal Wildlife Acts be enough to prohibit one to own or posses firearms or revoke a PAL?

Can the CFO do anything?

Has this ever been done before in Canada?

It would sure put further pressure on him and hinder his ability to have/obtain firearms and ammunition.

[deer nut]

My friend, I have very hi regards for our law enforcement officers. I hope you understand that this was a joke, "that you can smell law enforcement officer, because they smell of coffee and doughtnut" :)

However, you do not have any problems with some of the xenophobic comments of deporting this individual who might have lived longer in Canada than you have lived ?

If I need to, I will sent my comments to you first next time, for some censoring :)

Sorry I offended you. My bad. I feel strongly that legal action should be taken against anyone that abuses the privilidge of hunting and fishing to ensure opportunities are sustained for sportsmen (and women) of the future. Innocent until proven guilty still applies, as does the Charter of Rights & freedoms. But if he's guilty - throw the full wieght of the law at him.

....it's surprising how stealthy those COs can be, donuts or no!

[snowhunter]

I believe that Alex is consideret to be the # 1 poacher in Canada ?

[Devilbear]

I do not give a small damm as to whether Mota is a ...nice guy... or not; he is a foreigner in the country that my family helped found, fought, died and bled for and he has, according to former colleagues of mine in resource management agencies, done a LOT more than he was convicted of.

Consequently, I want to see him deported and never allowed to return to Canada, as we have allowed far too many such scumbags into this country since WWII....Michael Siefert, a former neighbour of mine in East Van. is another example, a Ukrainian war criminal, who lied to get in here and then lied about his proven atrocities at Bolzano Concentration Camp during WWII.

If, somebody has a problem with this, I am more than willing to discuss it "vis-a-vis" and am not about to accept Mota or any other foreigner like him as a Canadian, no matter what. As to his bush expertise, well, I will try him on, any day and I might have a little experience, as well.

I HATE poachers and immigrants who take advantage of how accepting we Canucks have been to foreigners in our land and will do whatever I can to keep such scum from staying in Canada.

[Devilbear]

If he is so bad you have to wonder why no one has shot the sob???


Too many "bleeding heart" liberals and socialists in Canada, now and the constant whinging about "rights" for foreigners as with the recent Tamil invaders might have something to do with it!

[Gateholio]

Do not under an circumstances name a store or any business on here. Do not imply or reference any store

[Jagermeister]

Too many "bleeding heart" liberals and socialists in Canada, now and the constant whinging about "rights" for foreigners as with the recent Tamil invaders might have something to do with it!
Talk about surrendering our rights to grant foreigners their rights. Watch this to see how our rights will be extinguished if we allow this to happen. Although it is in the US, I think that sharia law will make greater and faster inroads in Canada than the US.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W0vItJqpQ8U

Now, on the topic.
What gets me is how the "birds of a feather" flock together. Both Loring and Mota are blatant violaters and both appealed the Director's decision to suspend their hunting privileges. It really doesn't matter though, a licence is a mere formality which can be circumvented with little regard until apprehended in the future.

[budismyhorse]

thanks Gatehouse, I thought that post was waaaay offside.

[slyfox]

The last time i looked this counrty was made up of foreigners.

[CanuckShooter]

The last time i looked this counrty was made up of foreigners.

Maybe so, but the majority of them are not poachers with no regard for anything we hold dear...........

[Devilbear]

Really, well, you need to learn a little bit about Canadian history as I am NOT a foreigner and my family came to Canada long, long ago. To call a Canadian like me a foreigner is an insult of a kind that often results in a very forceful reaction as I am proud of my Canadian birth and heritage. Get it?

[goatdancer]

Whether the man is an "immigrant" or a "native son" is totally irrelevant. A poacher is a poacher and should be dealt with.

[rocksteady]

Good memory Rock. I found this title, but not the article itself, from "International Wildlife"...

DOLPHIN, Ric. "Stalking 'The Butcher of the North'." International Wildlife 23:1 (1993): 12-19. (Alex Mota, wildlife poacher)


Mind is sharp, just the body is going in the toilet:-D Too many years of hard living/playing finally catching up with me:-?

I know I have a photocopy of the article around here somewhere, in my reloading room, but its a disaster right now......Being that its supposed to be -20 or colder all weekend I will attempt to find it...Hopefully I can post it by Monday...

[Devilbear]

Whether the man is an "immigrant" or a "native son" is totally irrelevant. A poacher is a poacher and should be dealt with.

I take your point, however, the point I am trying to make is that immigrants CAN be deported for serious crimes and I think Mota and Bryan Martin, among others, SHOULD BE. This would do a lot to convince others, such as the large number of Orientals convicted of poaching fish in the Fraser and undersized crabs at sea, that we mean to have Canadian laws obeyed and if not, by by, home you shall go.

I would deport an English, Scots, Norwegian, German, French or ANY other immigrant, regardless of what else he may have done in Canada, for crimes of this nature. This is NOT about ethnicity, it is about Canadian's right to have our laws and resources respected.

...Native sons...of ALL extractions, I would like to see a minimum 10 years in gaol at hard labour for such crimes and I do not give a sh*t, WHO they are or what social position they have.

[slyfox]

Well i was born in canada 2 and am very proud of my canadain heritage and my family has been her for a long time 2.But as i see you family came her a long long long time ago so that makes you more canadain then the rest of use right.As for my Canadian history goes i think this counrty belonged to the native indain,s at first.I get it your a tuff guy.

[MountainHigh]

I'll rephrase:

First...I think that if any sporting goods business assisted or referred (including forwarding his contact info) clients to this guy they should be investigated/punished. After all, they are indirectly supporting the alleged illegal activity…
I would boycott any sporting goods store if it were the case.

Second…the C.O’s resources are stretched so thin that they could use any assistance to hold this Alex guy accountable. I would think any HBC’er that knows anyone that has supported Mr. Moda or knowledge of his activities should alert the C.O service. At the very least you would be doing the wildlife resource good favor.

[Devilbear]

No, I am a man who has very little patience for bullshit and that is what, in your illiterate fashion, you have been posting here. I very probably am a far more Canadian person than you appear to be and am also almost twice your age; I have met and dealt with all kinds of Euro-immigrants in the years when hordes of "DPs" came here after WWII. to the dismay of the Canadian veterans who had seen about all of Euros. that they really wanted to.

So, may I suggest some remedial reading and writing courses and then some serious study of Canadian history, this country was NOT a nation in aboriginal times, it WAS founded and largely built by Nordic peoples, from AD 985 onward until the post-WWII era and, you demean your own birth by calling others born here ...foreigners..., something that should be obvious to even you.

Your friend, Mota, IS a foreigner and what you might consider acceptable about him is NOT acceptable to me and to many if not most other Canucks. So, maybe you need to learn a lesson about Canada, our traditions and conservation, or, do you approve of poaching by Portuguese immigrants because you ...grew up... among them? That is what I get from your posts and I am disgusted that any young person would defend a creature like Mota.

[1/2 slam]

He as lost his privileges to hunt in bc and alberta and did time in jail and payed big fines.As a person alex is a good friend people make mistakes and he is paying for them.I grow up in the portuguese community as a kid and alex was all way,s around he is a nice guy and one hell of a mountain man as why no one has shot this guy take it easy with comment,s like that,can get you in trouble canuckshooter.

No he's not. He's a POS poacher that looks like he's still at it. Your defense of him tells me all I need to know about you. Shake your head.

[Devilbear]

I'll rephrase:

First...I think that if any sporting goods business assisted or referred (including forwarding his contact info) clients to this guy they should be investigated/punished. After all, they are indirectly supporting the alleged illegal activity…
I would boycott any sporting goods store if it were the case.

Second…the C.O’s resources are stretched so thin that they could use any assistance to hold this Alex guy accountable. I would think any HBC’er that knows anyone that has supported Mr. Moda or knowledge of his activities should alert the C.O service. At the very least you would be doing the wildlife resource good favor.

Very well said and I totally concur. However, I called them today on another issue and will go there and see what they say as I do not believe in condemning anyone until I have the facts.

There have certainly been a LOT of immigrants from non-traditional sources who have been convicted of major wildlife-fisheries offences; however, I suspect that the "powers that be" tend to ignore this as a crackdown might alienate a "vote bloc"...ain't multculti wunnerful, eh!

[CanuckShooter]

He as lost his privileges to hunt in bc and alberta and did time in jail and payed big fines.As a person alex is a good friend people make mistakes and he is paying for them.I grow up in the portuguese community as a kid and alex was all way,s around he is a nice guy and one hell of a mountain man as why no one has shot this guy take it easy with comment,s like that,can get you in trouble canuckshooter.


It is the way things are done sometimes when the authorities cannot stop horrific crimes from happening. He is in the bush and mountains, if he is poaching all the time, it's just a matter of time till someone takes things into their own hands.....:cry:

[CanuckShooter]

No, I am a man who has very little patience for bullshit and that is what, in your illiterate fashion, you have been posting here. I very probably am a far more Canadian person than you appear to be and am also almost twice your age; I have met and dealt with all kinds of Euro-immigrants in the years when hordes of "DPs" came here after WWII. to the dismay of the Canadian veterans who had seen about all of Euros. that they really wanted to.

So, may I suggest some remedial reading and writing courses and then some serious study of Canadian history, this country was NOT a nation in aboriginal times, it WAS founded and largely built by Nordic peoples, from AD 985 onward until the post-WWII era and, you demean your own birth by calling others born here ...foreigners..., something that should be obvious to even you.

Your friend, Mota, IS a foreigner and what you might consider acceptable about him is NOT acceptable to me and to many if not most other Canucks. So, maybe you need to learn a lesson about Canada, our traditions and conservation, or, do you approve of poaching by Portuguese immigrants because you ...grew up... among them? That is what I get from your posts and I am disgusted that any young person would defend a creature like Mota.

In Aboriginal times this country was inhabited by various Indian Nations...among them the Cree, the Ojibway, the Mohawk, the Coast Salish, the Dene etc etc etc....lets keep our history lessons on track shall we?

[slyfox]

How do you now that he still poaches so any one that talks to him is a poacher ok 1/2 SLAM. That,s real smart.

[Devilbear]

In Aboriginal times this country was inhabited by various Indian Nations...among them the Cree, the Ojibway, the Mohawk, the Coast Salish, the Dene etc etc etc....lets keep our history lessons on track shall we?

Not AGAIN, old boy, how many times do I have to explain the correct terminology and actual facts of Canadian development to you.....geezuz murphee, I have explained this to you several times.

Now, listen up, and learn as I am tired of your specious comments which are not worthy of a man of your intelligence. There WAS NO "Canada" "Ad Mare Usque Ad Mare" UNTIL Nordic peoples built this nation and THAT is a FACT.

The Neolithic primitives you refer to were NOT "nations" as we employ that term today and they NEVER built a unified nation in North America...sorry, but, you are, as so often, simply wrong.

[rocksteady]

It is the way things are done sometimes when the authorities cannot stop horrific crimes from happening. He is in the bush and mountains, if he is poaching all the time, it's just a matter of time till someone takes things into their own hands.....:cry:[/quote]

Or into their own crosshairs in their scope...

Not that I would support that as any wasy to prevent further poching but some may..:confused:

[1/2 slam]

How do you now that he still poaches so any one that talks to him is a poacher ok 1/2 SLAM. That,s real smart.

Maybe you should re read my post. I said it appears he is still at it. The second part was a comment about you defending him. And that's what you did. Where did I call you a poacher? Maybe you should do a some research on your friend. He's one of the worst poachers in Canadian history.

Have you ever heard the expression that a leopard can't change his spots?

I agree with Devilbear. His ass should be tossed out of this country.

Once again I say to you SHAKE YOUR HEAD

[slyfox]

DevilBear I never said I was defending him or agreeing with what he does. As a child I grew up around him in the Portugeuse community as he was always at club functions and I don't discriminate.

[1/2 slam]

DevilBear I never said I was defending him or agreeing with what he does. As a child I grew up around him in the Portugeuse community as he was always at club functions and I don't discriminate.

In this case you should.

[KB90]

I don't discriminate.

haha wow.

Please explain why?

[Devilbear]

In this case you should.


Most definitely and, I DO discriminate where scumbags from foreign nations are concerned as Canada is not a "dump" for the riff-raff of the world, although in recent times, one wonders.........

[BromBones]

Some interesting reading here. Had never heard of the guy until today.

Sounds like a real winner...

[mark]

Some interesting reading here. Had never heard of the guy until today.

Sounds like a real winner...

X2..... never heard of him before ever???? Hope a G-bear kills the looser!

[One Shot]

last time I checked if you aint a native indian then yous got immigrant Canadian blood.

The last time I checked, the indigneous peoples that we refer to First Nations or Native Americans are indeed imigrants themselves originating from one of two regions migrating overland from the north or via island hopping to the south only a short time (in the scheme of things) before our fore fathers.

[BromBones]

Hope a G-bear kills the looser!

Would certainly be a fitting end to have some big old grizzly shit him out into the buckbrush.:)

Not that I wish that on anyone... just sayin.

[Jagermeister]

No, I am a man who has very little patience for bullshit and that is what, in your illiterate fashion, you have been posting here. I very probably am a far more Canadian person than you appear to be and am also almost twice your age; I have met and dealt with all kinds of Euro-immigrants in the years when hordes of "DPs" came here after WWII. to the dismay of the Canadian veterans who had seen about all of Euros. that they really wanted to.

So, may I suggest some remedial reading and writing courses and then some serious study of Canadian history, this country was NOT a nation in aboriginal times, it WAS founded and largely built by Nordic peoples, from AD 985 onward until the post-WWII era and, you demean your own birth by calling others born here ...foreigners..., something that should be obvious to even you.

Your friend, Mota, IS a foreigner and what you might consider acceptable about him is NOT acceptable to me and to many if not most other Canucks. So, maybe you need to learn a lesson about Canada, our traditions and conservation, or, do you approve of poaching by Portuguese immigrants because you ...grew up... among them? That is what I get from your posts and I am disgusted that any young person would defend a creature like Mota.
Usually I agree with you, but I think your opening paragraph shows a high level of bigotry toward others that aren't of Norse ancestry.

Even the Nordics were DPs in one way or another. Otherwise they would've stayed in northern Europe ekeing out an existance as a tenent farmer, toiling for some land baron.

And another thing, what history book did you pull this out of, "So, may I suggest some remedial reading and writing courses and then some serious study of Canadian history, this country was NOT a nation in aboriginal times, it WAS founded and largely built by Nordic peoples, from AD 985 onward until the post-WWII era and, you demean your own birth by calling others born here ...foreigners..., something that should be obvious to even you."? "...it WAS founded and largely built by Nordic peoples,.....", wow!

[Gateholio]

If we see another indian/native/first nations comment on this thread, it's getting shut down........

[6616]

Mind is sharp, just the body is going in the toilet:-D Too many years of hard living/playing finally catching up with me:-?

I know I have a photocopy of the article around here somewhere, in my reloading room, but its a disaster right now......Being that its supposed to be -20 or colder all weekend I will attempt to find it...Hopefully I can post it by Monday...

Hey Mike, ask Paul Visentin about Mota someday, he should have a few tales to tell, he worked on that file for several years.

[wildcatter]

I agree, that's going too far DP is a derogatory term.
Just tell me Devilbear what would have you done without the DPs?
The US space program was built and designed by DPs, the UBC forestry faculty
was started by DPs, the basic computer language was written by a Hungarian, ball point pen,
soft contact lense, matches and I could go on, guess what non of the inventors were a Norse.


Usually I agree with you, but I think your opening paragraph shows a high level of bigotry toward others that aren't of Norse ancestry.

Even the Nordics were DPs in one way or another. Otherwise they would've stayed in northern Europe ekeing out an existance as a tenent farmer, toiling for some land baron.

And another thing, what history book did you pull this out of, "So, may I suggest some remedial reading and writing courses and then some serious study of Canadian history, this country was NOT a nation in aboriginal times, it WAS founded and largely built by Nordic peoples, from AD 985 onward until the post-WWII era and, you demean your own birth by calling others born here ...foreigners..., something that should be obvious to even you."? "...it WAS founded and largely built by Nordic peoples,.....", wow!

[Old Crow]

And once again a thread about a blatant poacher turns into a mud-slinging, member-insulting, immigrant bashing thread.
Go shoot some Ýotes, folks.
You need to get out more, or at least get back on topic.... :-)

[MountainHigh]

What I don't understand is why people still want to support this guy and pay him to take them into the bush. It must say a lot about the clientele he has taken.

Maybe its up to us as responsible outdoorsmen/women to put an end to the alleged illegal operation he's may or may not be involved with. It sounds like only through the flow of information can we weed the bad apples out of the bunch. Anonymous emails to the C.O's or peer pressure from fellow sportsmen to clients and/or any business assisting this guy...lets get the ball rollin'. Reading some of the info on here makes me real pissed off that nothing has been done.

[slyfox]

Have you not notice the price of a guide hunt in the north not every one has lot,s of money.Money talk,s it,s sad but true.

[6616]

Have you not notice the price of a guide hunt in the north not every one has lot,s of money.Money talk,s it,s sad but true.

If what I've read about Mota over the years (shooting multiple sheep and goats out of bands, shooting eagles and other protected species, etc), even if only 1/4 of it's true, certainly does not make the price of a guided hunt any or even the remotest excuse or justification for his antics. Give your head a shake man...!

http://www.yukon-news.com/news/12181

[slyfox]

I,m not saying what he does is right just that people will go with him.So why would i give my head a shake.

[6616]

I,m not saying what he does is right just that people will go with him.So why would i give my head a shake.

You were telling us what a great guy he is......?????

[slyfox]

Let,s get this out of the way i do not agree with what he did in the past.

But i will not stop talking to the man becuase his past mistakes if you guy,s think it,s right or wrong i don,t care.

If he takes people up to an area to hunt and stay,s at camp what law,s is he breaking. If he was doing something illegal would not the co,s be all over him.

[slyfox]

He is a good guy.

[Old Crow]

If what I've read about Mota over the years (shooting multiple sheep and goats out of bands, shooting eagles and other protected species, etc), even if only 1/4 of it's true, certainly does not make the price of a guided hunt any or even the remotest excuse or justification for his antics.
http://www.yukon-news.com/news/12181

In 2002, a man was arrested at Los Angeles’ LAX airport after two large birds of paradise came flying out of his luggage at security. Two pygmy monkeys were found stuffed in his pants.


Probably looked suspicious because he had a huge grin on his face! :D

[Old Crow]

He is a good guy.

OK, so if someone wanted to contact him to go for beers, how would one do that?

[slyfox]

He did some bad stuff in his past and payed for it with fines and jail time.

When this stuff happened i was a young kid and only found out later in my 20th,s what happened and that he had done his time for it.

Like i side before why would i stop talking to the man for his past mistakes the guy i now is a nice guy.

[slyfox]

That,s funny old crow.

[Old Crow]

That,s funny old crow.


No, I'm serious! If he's such a great guy I wanna buy him some beers and book a hunt! I'm sure he has some great stories about Angola too!
Você fala o Português?

[bridger]

He did some bad stuff in his past and payed for it with fines and jail time.

When this stuff happened i was a young kid and only found out later in my 20th,s what happened and that he had done his time for it.

Like i side before why would i stop talking to the man for his past mistakes the guy i now is a nice guy.

past mistakes are one thing continuing to make the same ones is a different story

[mcrae]

If he takes people up to an area to hunt and stay,s at camp what law,s is he breaking. If he was doing something illegal would not the co,s be all over him.

If he is doing it for free then it wouldn't be an issue. But since he is accepting money for it its illegal.

You are on a hunting forum trying to stick up for a guy that takes away from all of us with his antics. Normally I stay out of these types of threads but really you should do yourself a favour and walk away from this one. Nobody on this forum cares if he is a nice guy he is a poacher and has shown a blatant disregard for the rules, regulations, and laws that govern us.

[Devilbear]

Usually I agree with you, but I think your opening paragraph shows a high level of bigotry toward others that aren't of Norse ancestry.

Even the Nordics were DPs in one way or another. Otherwise they would've stayed in northern Europe ekeing out an existance as a tenent farmer, toiling for some land baron.

And another thing, what history book did you pull this out of, "So, may I suggest some remedial reading and writing courses and then some serious study of Canadian history, this country was NOT a nation in aboriginal times, it WAS founded and largely built by Nordic peoples, from AD 985 onward until the post-WWII era and, you demean your own birth by calling others born here ...foreigners..., something that should be obvious to even you."? "...it WAS founded and largely built by Nordic peoples,.....", wow!


My use of the term to which you object was, as the quotation marks indicate, a reference to the commonplace abbreviation for the "Displaced Peoples" used at the time. It is not and was not intended as anything other than a precise, historical reference. Also, the terms "Norse" and "Nordic" are NOT interchangeable, the "Norse" are ONE sub-group of the "Nordic" peoples who founded and largely built Canada.

The comments concerning the founding period of Canada, from AD 985 to circa 1635, at the death of Champlain, are derived from study of Canadian history. The Vikings first settled, some remained and interbred with aboriginals, the Nordic peoples of "The Hanseatic League" based in Norway, Britain, France and northern Germany evolved out of this and then the British and French colonies were established, with the oldest remaining settlements, but NOT the FIRST Nordic settlement in Canada, that are still in Quebec and Newfoundland from circa 1608-1610.

The "French" who explored and settled in Canada were NORMANS (Norsemen) and BRETONS, who were actually Celtic people FROM Britain, who had re-settled in France around Dieppe, at the time of the Nordic Saxon invasion as the Roman Era ended. This is a continuous process and the Nordic peoples were the founders of Canada, as the Hispanics were of much of the USA.

There are many sources for this, I suggest "Colony to Nation" by the legendary Canadian WWI veteran and historian, the late Arthur Marsden Lower, "The Kingdom of Canada" by Dr. W.L. Morton, with it's outstanding commentary on this topic and perhaps "The Vikings" by Gwynn Jones, as texts to begin to study factual and credible Canadian history. You will find that I am correct, my usage and historical or biological references are always very precise and I can only comment upon what actually happened.

The Nordic peoples were NOT "DP"s, but, I am not going to post paragraphs on Nordic explorations, economics and the post-WWII era in Canada as it is beyond the scope of this thread. I trust that this will calm your apparently disturbed equanmity and restore your agreement with me.

As to UBC, etc., that is totally irrelevant to this issue and I have spent enough time on this as it is. The arrival of Vladmir Krajina, etc. was a beneficial event for BOTH the university and his group; they did not and do not fit into the hordes of "DPs" that I mentioned and, let us not forget, they would not have been able to come here, had it not been for the Canadian veterans I mentioned. Krajina, is one of my heros, I have spoken with him to our mutual enjoyment and have and read his books.

My comments here are NOT "anti-immigrant" and certainly NOT bigoted, they simply reflect what I and others experienced at the time and are how most Canadians I know feel about foreigners like Mota, who take advantage of our acceptance into our country. Simple, really, Mota is scum and should be kicked out of Canada.

[Deaddog]

He did some bad stuff in his past and payed for it with fines and jail time.


Like i side before why would i stop talking to the man for his past mistakes the guy i now is a nice guy.

slyfox, if indeed this individual has only made past mistakes then can you do us a favour, call him offer him three grand to take you sheep hunting at the top of the gatho....then post his response to the forum.. that should clear things up... DD

[.330 Dakota]

Can convictions under the provincial or Federal Wildlife Acts be enough to prohibit one to own or posses firearms or revoke a PAL?

Can the CFO do anything?

Has this ever been done before in Canada?

It would sure put further pressure on him and hinder his ability to have/obtain firearms and ammunition.

Unless he commits a firearms offence there is nothing the CO"s can do. I will not defend this poacher , but I must say that we as law abiding hunters dont want to give the GUN GRABBERS any more power than they already have, do we?

[rocksteady]

[quote=slyfox;864743]
But i will not stop talking to the man becuase his past mistakes if you guy,s think it,s right or wrong i don,t care.
quote]

We are not saying thatt you should not talk to him, that is your perogative, however, you must be aware of his past activities and it sounds like he may be doing it again (from some other posts on this thread)...

Be cautious, as you know the old term"guilty by association" may come up.......

I, personally, would not associate with a convicted poacher, especially in a hunting situation...Sure, maybe have a drink and a BS session at a social gathering, as you say you frequent the same community events as he (Portugese community)....but.....Be very careful...Don't want to be seen as "too close"....That could suddenly bring unwanted/unneccessary attention to you/yourself....

[bighornbob]

What I don't understand is why people still want to support this guy and pay him to take them into the bush. It must say a lot about the clientele he has taken.

Because most people have no clue. There are a few posts every year where someone posts what they did and then find out later it was against the law. They did not know the regs changed 5 years earlier or something.

How many people here actually know that packers have to be licensed, or who the guide outfitter is in an area and what are those boundaries.

I think it would be quite easy to get over 50% of the hunters out there to believe you that you were the lisenced guide of the area or he has given you permission to take residents into his area and he can take you up for $2000.

I would also bet that half of those hunters probably realize that something is up half way through their trip (i.e see the guy do something blantantly illegal) and just choose to keep their mouths shut to avoid being brought into the mess.

One thing I dont really get is if this guy is still doing it and its so obvious to everyone, why aren't the CO's all over him. Christ they have busted legal guide outfitters for breaking the law when a US clinet rats them out. I remember there was a case a few years ago where a US client complained about something and the CO service got an undercover in there working as a guide and he documented everything he saw and numerous guides got charged with the outfitter for things like not reporting a problem grizz that was shot, guides not bringing out all the meat etc etc.

If this guys is taking guys in there by getting clients that frequent a store, how tough would it really be to get this guy to take out some hunters??? There has to be more to it, or there would be a few undercover CO's going up each year.

BHB

[MountainHigh]

Unless he commits a firearms offence there is nothing the CO"s can do.

That is not correct....you'd be surprised how ingenious the C.O's can be with little information....but every bit helps.

I have spoken with someone in Law Enforcement very recently about this. This is infact still going on. He is still breaking the law and running his illegal packing operation. They told me the C.O's flew in last year and confiscated sheep/guns etc.

Apparently they are watching him and his clients may now be under scrutiny by the C.O service.

Slyfox: I know lots of nice guys with colorful pasts too...but thats no reason to be able to rape our wildlife resource and break the law and get away with it...not now or ever.

Lets help the boys in blue out....provide them any information about this guy. We owe it to ourselves, others and the wildlife! :-|

[killer]

Send this loser out of our country sounds like the best route.From what i read it sounds like he is not slowing down on doing whatever he wants.

[Kody94]

Have you not notice the price of a guide hunt in the north not every one has lot,s of money.Money talk,s it,s sad but true.

That does not excuse his actions. Even if he has reformed his 'wanton and indescriminate destruction of wildlife' ways....it seems pretty obvious that he is still "packing" at the very minimum. Since he is not licenced to do so, that means he's still (allegedly) breaking the law. He might be a great guy at community functions, but this kind of behaviour can't be excused because someone will pay him to do it.

[CanuckShooter]

[quote=slyfox;864743]
But i will not stop talking to the man becuase his past mistakes if you guy,s think it,s right or wrong i don,t care.
quote]

We are not saying thatt you should not talk to him, that is your perogative, however, you must be aware of his past activities and it sounds like he may be doing it again (from some other posts on this thread)...

Be cautious, as you know the old term"guilty by association" may come up.......

I, personally, would not associate with a convicted poacher, especially in a hunting situation...Sure, maybe have a drink and a BS session at a social gathering, as you say you frequent the same community events as he (Portugese community)....but.....Be very careful...Don't want to be seen as "too close"....That could suddenly bring unwanted/unneccessary attention to you/yourself....


You are offering sound advice....personally I wouldn't be seen within 100 feet of a POS like is being described.:evil:

[snowhunter]

Everybody who goes goes into the Kluachesi and used Alex services knows his story and status, and love him for it.

[Gunner]

Everybody who goes goes into the Kluachesi and used Alex services knows his story and status, and love him for it.If they are knowingly using the services of an unlicenced outfitter(especially one with a criminal history),then in my opinion they are just as guilty and should be prosecuted as well.Hunters that would support this individual are beyond contempt. Gunner

[snowhunter]

Because of Alex, undercover and regular CO's, RCMP Turbo-Beavers, as well as helicopter visits the Kluachesi often, with little or no results.

It's a big country up there, and if Alex could survive AK-47 armed adversaries in Angola, he should have no problems surviving in the bush around Kluachesi ?

I think he enjoys or even plays around with the undercover CO's sent to Kluachesi to keep an eye with him ?

[Gateholio]

Because of Alex, undercover and regular CO's, RCMP Turbo-Beavers, as well as helicopter visits the Kluachesi often, with little or no results.

It's a big country up there, and if Alex could survive AK-47 armed adversaries in Angola, he should have no problems surviving in the bush around Kluachesi ?

I think he enjoys or even plays around with the undercover CO's sent to Kluachesi to keep an eye with him ?

He's obviously recieved many convictions and fines, so there certainly have been results.

I hope that this thread spurs on a new interest with the CO's.

[hntcrazy]

It was probably started by a CO???????

[urbanhermit]

Because of Alex, undercover and regular CO's, RCMP Turbo-Beavers, as well as helicopter visits the Kluachesi often, with little or no results.

It's a big country up there, and if Alex could survive AK-47 armed adversaries in Angola, he should have no problems surviving in the bush around Kluachesi ?

I think he enjoys or even plays around with the undercover CO's sent to Kluachesi to keep an eye with him ?
yeah, went to school and hung around the portuguese community for 40 years and would pretty much be certain that even if he was in Angola he was probably a cab driver or a piano tuner. the BS boasting of these guys is their way to pass time.. utter crap most likely.

[slyfox]

Urbanhermit what so potruguese are all cab driver,s or piano tuner,s.

[snowhunter]

Alex must be getting "up there" as well. Could he be around 65-70 years old by now ?

I have, by several individual been told that Alex served in Angola, and most often by the ones who actually went through this kind of nasty warfare, they chose never to talk about it.

For some of these veteran, the war never ended....

[urbanhermit]

Urbanhermit what so potruguese are all cab driver,s or piano tuner,s.
no, not at all, but with all the bs flying around with "rambo of the north" you can kinda bet that he was just the opposite of what he claims. truth be told he may have been there, or had an uncle there, or bought a hat made there, but more likely it makes for good story telling. total crap most likely..

[urbanhermit]

another observation that wise people make as they get older, is that a good BS artist with always surrounds himself, to " hold court" as it were, over weak minded simpletons, that way when the simpletons are wooed by the fantastic stories they can go forth and perpetuate the, "said BS" to the masses, it helps give credibility to the BS Artist... just an observation and i am never wrong about this..

[The Hermit]

I was talking to a bunch of guys that have known urbanhermit for decades and by all accounts his ability to use his bs sensor is the stuff of legends! I've heard that he can tell a bs story from across the bar especially when watching guys trying to hit on cougars! He is amazing!!!




;--)

[luckofthedraw]

Some interesting reading here. Had never heard of the guy until today.

Sounds like a real winner...


x3. Glad this thread made me aware.

[slyfox]

I,m done with this got better thing,s to talk about you guy,s knock your self,s out.

[One Shot]

Let,s get this out of the way i do not agree with what he did in the past.

But i will not stop talking to the man becuase his past mistakes if you guy,s think it,s right or wrong i don,t care.

If he takes people up to an area to hunt and stay,s at camp what law,s is he breaking. If he was doing something illegal would not the co,s be all over him.

Given the evidence and ongoing investigations into Alex and your continued defense of him makes me believe that you support his continued activities.

Being a hunter yourself have you personnaly taken the opportunity to tell Alex that you do not support his illicit guiding/poaching activities past and present and that it is contrary to hunter ethics/moral and the law.

If you have not done so then you support his illicit activities through your silence and you are guilty as well by association.

I have to ask you, as a hunter and a friend of Alex's how may hunts have you been on with him???????

[slyfox]

O hunt,s with alex becuase i talk to the man im guilty let,s see what law that brakes i side i,m done!

[Kody94]

O hunt,s with alex becuase i talk to the man im guilty let,s see what law that brakes i side i,m done!

I'm not sure what that means exactly.


If he takes people up to an area to hunt and stay,s at camp what law,s is he breaking. If he was doing something illegal would not the co,s be all over him.

If he is getting paid to take people up to an area to hunt, whether he stays or not, it is illegal unless he's a licenced packer. We all know that he isn't.

[luckofthedraw]

[quote=Kody94;865200]I'm not sure what that means exactly.


I'll translate.

He said, " Zero hunts with Alex...just because I talk to the man means I'm guilty? What law am I breaking?

I SAID I'M DONE!
Originally Posted by slyfox http://www.huntingbc.ca/forum/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.huntingbc.ca/forum/showthread.php?p=865146#post865146)
O hunt,s with alex becuase i talk to the man im guilty let,s see what law that brakes i side i,m done!

[Kody94]

I'll translate.

He said, " Zero hunts with Alex...just because I talk to the man means I'm guilty? What law am I breaking?

I SAID I'M DONE!


Makes sense now. Thanks. :)

[slyfox]

Thanks for making it clear.

[urbanhermit]

Thanks for making it clear.
someone had to

[badlandshunter]

I heard he has a soft serve ice cream machine at Kluachesi Lake.:biggrin:

[TherealSLYFOX]

I'll post some pic in aug. Let you know if it's worth 3000
:wink:

[Jagermeister]

What really suprises me about this thread is the lack of response from willy442, Whisky Creek and snowpatrol. One would think that this thread would be near and dear to their hearts and their pocketbooks and they would be more than happy to shed some light on the thread subject.:confused:

[The Dude]

I'll post some pic in aug. Let you know if it's worth 3000
:wink:

Curiouser and curiouser......

[The Dude]

I heard he has a soft serve ice cream machine at Kluachesi Lake.:biggrin:

Actually, it's a breakfast-only restaurant. Serves any kind of wild game, plus great bacon and eggs.
Just don't ask for scrambled or over-easy, cuz the only things he serves are ''poached'' :D

[bigwhiteys]

What really suprises me about this thread is the lack of response from willy442, Whisky Creek and snowpatrol.
I can't speak for the others but I know Willy is out in camp working right now. It wasn't until this thread popped up that I heard about Alex Mota.

Carl

[urbanhermit]

Actually, it's a breakfast-only restaurant. Serves any kind of wild game, plus great bacon and eggs.
Just don't ask for scrambled or over-easy, cuz the only things he serves are ''poached'' :D
bwahahahahahhahahahahahahahahaha

[willy442]

What really suprises me about this thread is the lack of response from willy442, Whisky Creek and snowpatrol. One would think that this thread would be near and dear to their hearts and their pocketbooks and they would be more than happy to shed some light on the thread subject.:confused:

Don't worry Willie is watching. I only have one thing to say. If all resident hunters stopped using this guy. He wouldn't have any reason to be in the bush. You get what you support.

[Squamch]

Great thead, hope he ends up as grizz shit.

[Devilbear]

Well said, Willy, that IS and always HAS BEEN the basis of the problems with the former packer "Martin" and with Mota. Too many so-called "hunters" from The Lower Mainland, especially, are eager to hunt in the legendary gamefields of NEBC and will support a creep like Mota, by doing business with him.

[The Dude]

We should deport everyone from the Lower Mainland too!
Light the torches! There's gonna be a lynchin'!

[MountainHigh]

I'll post some pic in aug. Let you know if it's worth 3000
:wink:

Are you serious:confused: You are just telling us you will be breaking the law. WTF?

Forget about the past history of this guy. He's running an illegal packing operation and you, sir, are right in the middle of the mix. $3000 dollars paid to an illegal packer...wow.

How would this go over: Hey guys I'm going cougar hunting...I just paid this guy 3K and he's going to get me a nice Tom...wahoo! I'm guessing the HBC community and the Law would not too impressed with that!

Its a real shame :evil:.

[bighornbob]

Are you serious:confused: You are just telling us you will be breaking the law. WTF?

Forget about the past history of this guy. He's running an illegal packing operation and you, sir, are right in the middle of the mix. $3000 dollars paid to an illegal packer...wow.

How would this go over: Hey guys I'm going cougar hunting...I just paid this guy 3K and he's going to get me a nice Tom...wahoo! I'm guessing the HBC community and the Law would not too impressed with that!

Its a real shame :evil:.

I think he was kidding.

[urbanhermit]

frankly this story has slowed to a bore, can we please go back to sitting around the fire and hearing stories how Alex captured 648 enemy soldiers using nothing but a new toothbrush and his wilderness skills?

[CanuckShooter]

frankly this story has slowed to a bore, can we please go back to sitting around the fire and hearing stories how Alex captured 648 enemy soldiers using nothing but a new toothbrush and his wilderness skills?


I missed that story...can you repost it??? It sounds like BS to me.:confused:

[buckwild76]

you know i USED to enjoy this forum because people would share hunting stories and pictures and the odd bits of advice when asked to do so. After reading this bunch of rambling garbage i have no use for it. to those who have helped me through this forum with advice (you know who you are) thank you but i certainly will not be entering the pages of hbc again.

[luckofthedraw]

you know i USED to enjoy this forum because people would share hunting stories and pictures and the odd bits of advice when asked to do so. After reading this bunch of rambling garbage i have no use for it. to those who have helped me through this forum with advice (you know who you are) thank you but i certainly will not be entering the pages of hbc again.

Sorry to hear that. If you didn't like what your reading....why read it?

This site has helped me a ton in the short time I've been here. If it's an offensive thread for you.....stop reading it! Wait for something that is more "your cup of tea" to read, I wouldn't state I will never return. :-?

Best of luck out there.

[KB90]

you know i USED to enjoy this forum because people would share hunting stories and pictures and the odd bits of advice when asked to do so. After reading this bunch of rambling garbage i have no use for it. to those who have helped me through this forum with advice (you know who you are) thank you but i certainly will not be entering the pages of hbc again.

Without trying to be rude or a dick, but you say this like people care. You are one person. Hunting BC will move on without you, as a matter of fact a new member probably just signed up now.

It's a free online forum, with hundreds if not thousands of people. You can choose what you want to read/see/say. If this one thread has "ruined" HBC for you, well that's your problem.

Nobody is forcing you to read these threads, just like you don't have to respond to this response.

This is a great place, and this is an interesting thread (minus the racist crap)

[willy442]

Without trying to be rude or a dick, but you say this like people care. You are one person.

It's a free online forum, with hundred if not thousands of people. You can choose what you want to read/see/say. If this one thread has "ruined" HBC for you, well that's your problem.

Nobody is forcing you to read these threads, just like you don't have to respond to this response.

This is a great place, and this is an interesting thread (minus the racist crap)

He is most likely a repeat client!

[Devilbear]

The Port-u-guess community sticks together like glue eh :roll:

Hey bud, this is totally uncalled for; 99% of the Portguese people I have met in Vancouver over the past 30 years are no different than anyone else and are often very friendly and nice people. As I posted before, I favour deporting ANY immigrant who commits a crime in BC/Canada, but, I see no correlation between the Portoguese and poachers in general.

I know you are sort of kidding, but, this is what always results in locked threads here and this seems a bit beyond what is fair, to me. I have known poachers from many ethnic backgrounds, Canadian-born, naturalized and landed immigrants; some of the worst were well educated, well off, American draftdodgers of "WASP" ancestry back in the Kootenays. Just my opinion, no offence intended.

[huntcoop]

Hey bud, this is totally uncalled for; 99% of the Portguese people I have met in Vancouver over the past 30 years are no different than anyone else and are often very friendly and nice people. As I posted before, I favour deporting ANY immigrant who commits a crime in BC/Canada, but, I see no correlation between the Portoguese and poachers in general.

I know you are sort of kidding, but, this is what always results in locked threads here and this seems a bit beyond what is fair, to me. I have known poachers from many ethnic backgrounds, Canadian-born, naturalized and landed immigrants; some of the worst were well educated, well off, American draftdodgers of "WASP" ancestry back in the Kootenays. Just my opinion, no offence intended.

I have deleted the post. One would think that alot of his clientele would be coming from within the community. I have known and seen some of "that" community poaching before so I am not surprised in his comment.

[Devilbear]

I completely understand and would just say that I am not of Portoguese ancestry and you, sir, are a real gentleman.

[urbanhermit]

you have not eaten until you have attended a Portogeese wedding, you will come out of there 2 belt sizes larger!! amazing!

[slyfox]

Hi guys,

I thought I would post again to get you guys all riled up like teenage girls.

HE'S STILL A NICE GUY :)!

[luckofthedraw]

LOL...here we go again!

[LYKTOHUNT]

you have not eaten until you have attended a Portogeese wedding, you will come out of there 2 belt sizes larger!! amazing!Once I chose to go hunting by myself and happened to make camp by some Portoguese hunters and I must say they quickly adopted me whether I wanted it or not ,they took me in fed me weird but wonderful stuff ( cod potatoes onions and lots of olive oil, good shit,moose cheeks and undetermined stuff) made sure I had plenty of homemade beverages and treated me like a king. The funny thing is they could not imagine I would go hunting by myself and made sure I felt like part of the family and not a lonely old bum.It was a great trip.

[urbanhermit]

Hi guys,

I thought I would post again to get you guys all riled up like teenage girls.

HE'S STILL A NICE GUY :)!
why would you want to be like a teenage girl?

[troutseeker]

you know i USED to enjoy this forum because people would share hunting stories and pictures and the odd bits of advice when asked to do so. After reading this bunch of rambling garbage i have no use for it. to those who have helped me through this forum with advice (you know who you are) thank you but i certainly will not be entering the pages of hbc again.

you're welcome, goodbye. Try CGN and see if you like it better there...:-D

[troutseeker]

I take your point, however, the point I am trying to make is that immigrants CAN be deported for serious crimes and I think Mota and Bryan Martin, among others, SHOULD BE. This would do a lot to convince others, such as the large number of Orientals convicted of poaching fish in the Fraser and undersized crabs at sea, that we mean to have Canadian laws obeyed and if not, by by, home you shall go.

I would deport an English, Scots, Norwegian, German, French or ANY other immigrant, regardless of what else he may have done in Canada, for crimes of this nature. This is NOT about ethnicity, it is about Canadian's right to have our laws and resources respected.

...Native sons...of ALL extractions, I would like to see a minimum 10 years in gaol at hard labour for such crimes and I do not give a sh*t, WHO they are or what social position they have.

Unfortunately, once someone is "landed" and effectively gains citizenship, there will be no deportation. You see, they become Canadians with just as many (or more) rights and benefits as the ones born on this soil.

And as such they can be scumbags just like so many good old "born" Canadian's are and be treated in a respectful and innefective manner by our legal system. You'll notice my use of the word Legal system, as opposed to Justice system, which we lost a long time ago...

Now do like I do and take a deep breath and go listen to the sounds of waterfalls and little birdies. Do this now before your blood pressure max's out and your neck get's any more red!:-D

If you trulky want to reform this country (and it seems you do), Maybe we should talk about another special interest group that can do whatever they want in the bush and not be subject to any penalties.

This great country of ours is ripe with inequalities. I feel cheated of my rights by a government that cowtows to any and all "different groups" but lays the lumber on the likes of me. Pity that is...:(

[troutseeker]

Hi guys,

I thought I would post again to get you guys all riled up like teenage girls.

HE'S STILL A NICE GUY :)!


Maybe, I guess it just sounds like he's an asshole....

[The Silent Stalker]

Sounds like like a real ass. Hope one day they stiffen up on poachers and violators and do what's rite! Shoot em!

[deer nut]

Poachers suck, whatever their colour or creed! Race is irrelevant - ethics should be the focus of this discussion.

[.270]

Here is a picture of his truck, keep a lookout for him!

http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/data/500/medium/truck12.jpg

[The Dude]

Got a letter from the CO's this AM, and like others have said, he is under a THIRTY YEAR hunting Ban, and has never been a licensed Guide Outfitter in the province of BC.
Straight from the horses mouth, so to speak. :D

[1899]

.... he said they got ahold of him through a sporting goods store in the lower mainland also...

Will someone please pm me so I can also avoid this store.

Thanks.

[urbanhermit]

Canadian Tire :)

[The Dude]

Canadian Tire :)
http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e367/gatsby6306/111smileychubbyhilarious.gif ....
Most excellent post.
(I wanna know what store too, privately)

[6616]

It appears this guy may have broken nearly every wildlife regulation in the book and has been doing so for decades, so it's highly unlikely that a ban on hunting will stop him from carrying on with his activities.

[The Dude]

It appears this guy may have broken nearly every wildlife regulation in the book and has been doing so for decades, so it's highly unlikely that a ban on hunting will stop him from carrying on with his activities.


Hmmmmm....kinda like our gun laws.......:icon_frow

[gibblewabble]

The last time i looked this counrty was made up of foreigners.
Yes it is but the foreigners actually contributed to the country not detracted from it, I don't believe you will find much compassion for a poacher on this site good guy or no (NO). I don't have to know him to know I don't like him, poacher=scum.

EDIT: and if he has perpetrated atrocities in another part of the world he should be deported from the country preferably where he would be prosecuted.

[snowhunter]

The Colonial Portuguese Forces in Angola had "Dead Squad's" that often went out and did political/ethnic killing of innocent people in that African country.

[urbanhermit]

"Dead Squad"? they have a squad of dead soldiers that go out and kill? Must get a little ripe at high noon in their troop carrier..

[Squamch]

"Dead Squad"? they have a squad of dead soldiers that go out and kill? Must get a little ripe at high noon in their troop carrier..

Zombies are all the rage these days, you must not be on cgn.

[snowhunter]

Many Portuguese criminals avoided criminal charges at home, if they instead "volunteered" for special military services out in the colonies, and thus redeem themself by serving the Portuguese State, sometimes in the worst possible manner.

Portugal lost all it's colonial wars.

I also like to add, that most war veterans, after returning home from the war, live productive lives, respecting the laws of the land.

[crazy ducker]

can someone post me with the store to so I don't buy my new gun there

[One Shot]

can someone post me with the store to so I don't buy my new gun there

Ditto...............

[Alpine Addict]

Im sure everyone has seen "best of the west" Get yourself a huskama scope and you could solve the problem from 1500 yards away. Less likely to get caught.

[One Shot]

The Colonial Portuguese Forces in Angola had "Dead Squad's" that often went out and did political/ethnic killing of innocent people in that African country.

Should this not be "Death Squads".....:???:

[snowhunter]

It does not sounds as bad as it is, the way I spell it :)

[hellojello74]

Mind is sharp, just the body is going in the toilet:-D Too many years of hard living/playing finally catching up with me:-?

I know I have a photocopy of the article around here somewhere, in my reloading room, but its a disaster right now......Being that its supposed to be -20 or colder all weekend I will attempt to find it...Hopefully I can post it by Monday...


TTT

Have you been able to find a copy of it yet?

[just hunt]

does anyone know if there still is someone packn outa kluchise.

[Weatherby Fan]

Interesting read, anyone know what this guy's been up to lately? Is he still packing in Kluachesi?

Yeh I'm kind of curious if he's still carrying on with his illegal nonsense ?

[RiverOtter]

Can't speak to currently, but fall of 2012 the CO's were hot and heavy on Urs' dock grilling Kluachesi bound hunters........

There was a group of Italian hunters ahead of us that were of "particular" interest. The interesting part for me was the cases of whiskey stacked for a 14 day hunt....yes CASES.....

[Weatherby Fan]

Cases of Whiskey........sounds like a fun hunt.....anybody have his number ;-)

[Dirty]

Cases of Whiskey........sounds like a fun hunt.....anybody have his number ;-)
Why? You want to fly to Kluachesi and Mota' boat him?

[Weatherby Fan]

Why? You want to fly to Kluachesi and Mota' boat him?

maybe give him a cpl 40 pounders up side the head !!!!

[dracb]

Interesting and sad the vitriol thrown in this thread. The man made a mistake or bunch of mistakes for which he paid fines and spent time in jail as a consequence. Now 20 plus years after, the mere mention of his name starts people frothing at the mouth accusing him of war crimes and numerous crimes under the wildlife act. Strange indeed no one seems to report having heard him brag about the time he served his country in war merely that other people who also served mentioned in their community that he had also served. Next thing you know innuendo suggesting he committed war crimes and is a braggart about same.

Lots of comments earlier in the thread about how he constantly breaks the law, but not one instance specifically described after his conviction(s) more than 20 years ago. So where is the proof and where are the witnesses of current infractions. Oh yes someone reports they have a letter from a CO stating he has a 30 year hunting ban and has never been a guide-outfitter in BC. By golly he must be guilty of something since he transports hunters. We all know (so some of the posts state) he is guilty or why else would the CO's be at the fixed base interviewing hunters coming and going from the back country.You might even think that is what theCO's get paid for. It is sort of like the guy who used to rob banks "because that is where the money is". The fixed base is where the hunters from all operations can be most easily checked for infractions and questioned for intelligence about possible infractions. Blame the CO's, blame the government, blame someone he has to be guilty!!!!! Or he just may be a licensed transporter with every right to earn his living moving people in and out of the back country.

[RiverOtter]

Interesting and sad the vitriol thrown in this thread. The man made a mistake or bunch of mistakes for which he paid fines and spent time in jail as a consequence. Now 20 plus years after, the mere mention of his name starts people frothing at the mouth accusing him of war crimes and numerous crimes under the wildlife act. Strange indeed no one seems to report having heard him brag about the time he served his country in war merely that other people who also served mentioned in their community that he had also served. Next thing you know innuendo suggesting he committed war crimes and is a braggart about same.

Lots of comments earlier in the thread about how he constantly breaks the law, but not one instance specifically described after his conviction(s) more than 20 years ago. So where is the proof and where are the witnesses of current infractions. Oh yes someone reports they have a letter from a CO stating he has a 30 year hunting ban and has never been a guide-outfitter in BC. By golly he must be guilty of something since he transports hunters. We all know (so some of the posts state) he is guilty or why else would the CO's be at the fixed base interviewing hunters coming and going from the back country.You might even think that is what theCO's get paid for. It is sort of like the guy who used to rob banks "because that is where the money is". The fixed base is where the hunters from all operations can be most easily checked for infractions and questioned for intelligence about possible infractions. Blame the CO's, blame the government, blame someone he has to be guilty!!!!! Or he just may be a licensed transporter with every right to earn his living moving people in and out of the back country.
Won't speak to the war stuff, as I really don't know and don't care to guess.

As to the "PACKING", he is NOT licenced and therefore is not allowed to charge for his services. So every hunter that uses his services is by default, a poacher. And NO, he does NOT pack for free.......

[BgBlkDg]

Interesting and sad the vitriol thrown in this thread. The man made a mistake or bunch of mistakes for which he paid fines and spent time in jail as a consequence. Now 20 plus years after, the mere mention of his name starts people frothing at the mouth accusing him of war crimes and numerous crimes under the wildlife act. Strange indeed no one seems to report having heard him brag about the time he served his country in war merely that other people who also served mentioned in their community that he had also served. Next thing you know innuendo suggesting he committed war crimes and is a braggart about same.

Lots of comments earlier in the thread about how he constantly breaks the law, but not one instance specifically described after his conviction(s) more than 20 years ago. So where is the proof and where are the witnesses of current infractions. Oh yes someone reports they have a letter from a CO stating he has a 30 year hunting ban and has never been a guide-outfitter in BC. By golly he must be guilty of something since he transports hunters. We all know (so some of the posts state) he is guilty or why else would the CO's be at the fixed base interviewing hunters coming and going from the back country.You might even think that is what theCO's get paid for. It is sort of like the guy who used to rob banks "because that is where the money is". The fixed base is where the hunters from all operations can be most easily checked for infractions and questioned for intelligence about possible infractions. Blame the CO's, blame the government, blame someone he has to be guilty!!!!! Or he just may be a licensed transporter with every right to earn his living moving people in and out of the back country.

Hmmm, very "interesting".......

[digger dogger]

Keep flapping people, not one of the people hiding behind they're keyboard could stand up to the portugues beating he'd lay on. ya for yapping to him, in person.
I've never met mota, but heard enough to keep my opinion to myself.
CO's were scared of him, and the packers licence was put into place because of Alex. (I believe)

[bridger]

Keep flapping people, not one of the people hiding behind they're could stand up to the portugues beating he'd lay on. ya for yapping to him, in person.
I've never met mota, but heard enough to keep my opinion to myself.
CO's were scared of him, and the packers licence was put into place because of Alex. (I believe)

licensing transporters had nothing to do with Mota. It was all about bringing some stability to an industry to provide back country access to resident hunters.

[Weatherby Fan]

Keep flapping people, not one of the people hiding behind they're could stand up to the portugues beating he'd lay on. ya for yapping to him, in person.
I've never met mota, but heard enough to keep my opinion to myself.
CO's were scared of him, and the packers licence was put into place because of Alex. (I believe)

Don't worry DD he's never met the Chubby Norwegian God of Thunder........Ill protect you if he tries anything ;-):mrgreen:
He does sound scary though :shock:

[dracb]

So Mr.Otter where can I find a list of licensed transporters?

[BgBlkDg]

I rather doubt that this foreigner-poacher would/could "lay a beating" on most here or a BC CO. He must be my age and at almost 70, his abilities in that respect may not be quite what they supposedly once were.

However, if he were to attack a CO, well, they carry sidearms and that might solve the problem.

[1/2 slam]

Interesting and sad the vitriol thrown in this thread. The man made a mistake or bunch of mistakes for which he paid fines and spent time in jail as a consequence. Now 20 plus years after, the mere mention of his name starts people frothing at the mouth accusing him of war crimes and numerous crimes under the wildlife act. Strange indeed no one seems to report having heard him brag about the time he served his country in war merely that other people who also served mentioned in their community that he had also served. Next thing you know innuendo suggesting he committed war crimes and is a braggart about same.

Lots of comments earlier in the thread about how he constantly breaks the law, but not one instance specifically described after his conviction(s) more than 20 years ago. So where is the proof and where are the witnesses of current infractions. Oh yes someone reports they have a letter from a CO stating he has a 30 year hunting ban and has never been a guide-outfitter in BC. By golly he must be guilty of something since he transports hunters. We all know (so some of the posts state) he is guilty or why else would the CO's be at the fixed base interviewing hunters coming and going from the back country.You might even think that is what theCO's get paid for. It is sort of like the guy who used to rob banks "because that is where the money is". The fixed base is where the hunters from all operations can be most easily checked for infractions and questioned for intelligence about possible infractions. Blame the CO's, blame the government, blame someone he has to be guilty!!!!! Or he just may be a licensed transporter with every right to earn his living moving people in and out of the back country.

He did not make a mistake. What he did was as a result of many deliberate actions. He's a POACHER and a leopard can't change it's spots. As for his current situation the CO's are apparently looking into his activities again. He's not a licensed transporter and never has been so anyone hiring him is committing an offence. You need to shake your head. He is a piece of garbage.

[Stew]

I rather doubt that this foreigner-poacher would/could "lay a beating" on most here or a BC CO. He must be my age and at almost 70, his abilities in that respect may not be quite what they supposedly once were.

However, if he were to attack a CO, well, they carry sidearms and that might solve the problem.

The Portuguese are sneaky Dewey, I doubt anyone would even know they were done, until it's too late��
You think he plays by the rules. Lol

[dracb]

Yes he made decisions that led to him breaking the law and becoming a criminal. Assuming that he like most people do not enjoy paying large or even small fines or spending long periods sharing a room in the iron bar hotel with Bubba, it is fair to call those decisions mistakes. Some leopards do change their spots. At the risk of raising the ire of the non-Christians on HBC every Christian convert is a leopard to some degree changing their spots. Even without the Grace of God most leopards spots diminish as age and life experience bring one or another type of wisdom.

I do not know the man, but after reading the entire thread there is no one who has said I saw him doing this or that infraction. There is a lot of innuendo, but not one witness willing to provide a first hand account. I would be willing to rethink a bit or as you say shake my head if I could check a government published list of licensed transporters that does not include his name. Even then someone else may hold the actual license for the business. About the only requirements to be a licensed transporter are to have $2 million insurance, a knowledge of the game regulations, the ability to write a plan of operations and enough capital to supply the animals and equipment. I have a very hard time believing the CO's are so sure he is crooked that they stand guard at the fixed base operators docks to interview Mota's clients as they come and go and can not find a reason to charge him if the operation is entirely unlicensed. Since he is a transporter and not a guide the fact that some people he transported were inspected by the CO's and found to be non-compliant does not necessarily rub off on Mota. Assuming the CO's wanted him convicted they would have offered the non-compliant hunters a pass if they implicated Mota in their infraction and testified for the Crown.

Friends and I used to fly in and set up rather elaborate base camps with several wall tents, stoves and other equipment for a couple of weeks at a time. Given the number of guides that have over the years come visiting our camps it is my experience that guides are careful to identify who is hunting in their area and not shy about keeping track of their activity. It is entirely unlikely his operations can be blatantly illegal with out it being reported to the competent authority especially if Mota's camp is only a short distance from the guide's camp in that region.

So guys if you are going to make comments about stealing someones life or wishing someone dead come forward with the real first hand proof of his violations that warrant such comments.

[BgBlkDg]

I worked for the BCFS, briefly for the BCF&W and Alberta Environment, where I was told by colleagues and then BC COs, about Mota's behaviour. I was told by Dale Copeland, about his encounters with this guy and also by Barry Thomkins, in whose concession he camped.

The Vancouver newspapers published several accounts of his convictions for divers infractions of environmental laws and this is NOT "hearsay". Mota, is NOT a Canadian, IS a total POS and should be deported, end of fu*king story!!!

[Weatherby Fan]

I've just been reading up on him and yikes he certainly was a bandit, quoted as being "the worst poacher in Canadian History" by the COs that were hunting him.

[ACE]

I've just been reading up on him and yikes he certainly was a bandit, quoted as being "the worst poacher in Canadian History" by the COs that were hunting him.

Where were you finding the info WF ...... ?
Would like to find out more about this fellow also.

[Weatherby Fan]

Where were you finding the info WF ...... ?
Would like to find out more about this fellow also.

I just Googled him

[1/2 slam]

Yes he made decisions that led to him breaking the law and becoming a criminal. Assuming that he like most people do not enjoy paying large or even small fines or spending long periods sharing a room in the iron bar hotel with Bubba, it is fair to call those decisions mistakes. Some leopards do change their spots. At the risk of raising the ire of the non-Christians on HBC every Christian convert is a leopard to some degree changing their spots. Even without the Grace of God most leopards spots diminish as age and life experience bring one or another type of wisdom.

I do not know the man, but after reading the entire thread there is no one who has said I saw him doing this or that infraction. There is a lot of innuendo, but not one witness willing to provide a first hand account. I would be willing to rethink a bit or as you say shake my head if I could check a government published list of licensed transporters that does not include his name. Even then someone else may hold the actual license for the business. About the only requirements to be a licensed transporter are to have $2 million insurance, a knowledge of the game regulations, the ability to write a plan of operations and enough capital to supply the animals and equipment. I have a very hard time believing the CO's are so sure he is crooked that they stand guard at the fixed base operators docks to interview Mota's clients as they come and go and can not find a reason to charge him if the operation is entirely unlicensed. Since he is a transporter and not a guide the fact that some people he transported were inspected by the CO's and found to be non-compliant does not necessarily rub off on Mota. Assuming the CO's wanted him convicted they would have offered the non-compliant hunters a pass if they implicated Mota in their infraction and testified for the Crown.

Friends and I used to fly in and set up rather elaborate base camps with several wall tents, stoves and other equipment for a couple of weeks at a time. Given the number of guides that have over the years come visiting our camps it is my experience that guides are careful to identify who is hunting in their area and not shy about keeping track of their activity. It is entirely unlikely his operations can be blatantly illegal with out it being reported to the competent authority especially if Mota's camp is only a short distance from the guide's camp in that region.

So guys if you are going to make comments about stealing someones life or wishing someone dead come forward with the real first hand proof of his violations that warrant such comments.

Holly F^&k. You just don't get it. Bang your head ,as hard as you can, against a concrete wall. Alex Mota was called the Butcher of the North. He was the worst poacher in the country. He killed for fun. He is not and never was a licensed transported in this province.

[metalface]

https://www.publicsafety.gc.ca/lbrr/archives/dossiers%203-2-1991-eng.pdf

[walks with deer]

The guy should be hung.....

[Gateholio]

Interesting and sad the vitriol thrown in this thread. The man made a mistake or bunch of mistakes for which he paid fines and spent time in jail as a consequence. Now 20 plus years after, the mere mention of his name starts people frothing at the mouth accusing him of war crimes and numerous crimes under the wildlife act. Strange indeed no one seems to report having heard him brag about the time he served his country in war merely that other people who also served mentioned in their community that he had also served. Next thing you know innuendo suggesting he committed war crimes and is a braggart about same.

Lots of comments earlier in the thread about how he constantly breaks the law, but not one instance specifically described after his conviction(s) more than 20 years ago. So where is the proof and where are the witnesses of current infractions. Oh yes someone reports they have a letter from a CO stating he has a 30 year hunting ban and has never been a guide-outfitter in BC. By golly he must be guilty of something since he transports hunters. We all know (so some of the posts state) he is guilty or why else would the CO's be at the fixed base interviewing hunters coming and going from the back country.You might even think that is what theCO's get paid for. It is sort of like the guy who used to rob banks "because that is where the money is". The fixed base is where the hunters from all operations can be most easily checked for infractions and questioned for intelligence about possible infractions. Blame the CO's, blame the government, blame someone he has to be guilty!!!!! Or he just may be a licensed transporter with every right to earn his living moving people in and out of the back country.

Dave, what's your connection to him?

[Steve W]

Mota is certainly the stuff that wildness lore and possibly legends are based on. I was one of the investigating officers for his BC violations, which took many months, and reading through this thread has brought back some memories of the work we did. Like all really skilled poachers he had a network of people who covered for him and held him in awe or fear. At the time he was a man of incredible physical strength and stamina and had the ability to survive days in the bush with almost no gear and what he could carry in what would amount to a small day pack. He didn't have a great ability to communicate verbally and many though him slow or dumb. However, after spending time with him and interviewing him we learned he was anything but. We never would have caught him at the time, but he made a couple of decisions that opened the door a crack and allowed us to start an in depth and focused investigation and lead to the violations in other provinces and Parks. There was so much that we had trouble convincing people that one guy could be responsible.

We were lucky at the time to be assigned a Crown Counsel who was a hunter and would meet with us regularly and go over what the investigation needed to do and how. That was a key piece in getting the convictions we did. Mota could never be deported because all the charges were summary convictions. We tired for higher level criminal charges but could not build a case for them.

If there ever is a book written about this guy. I'll want to read it.

[Weatherby Fan]

Mota is certainly the stuff that wildness lore and possibly legends are based on. I was one of the investigating officers for his BC violations, which took many months, and reading through this thread has brought back some memories of the work we did. Like all really skilled poachers he had a network of people who covered for him and held him in awe or fear. At the time he was a man of incredible physical strength and stamina and had the ability to survive days in the bush with almost no gear and what he could carry in what would amount to a small day pack. He didn't have a great ability to communicate verbally and many though him slow or dumb. However, after spending time with him and interviewing him we learned he was anything but. We never would have caught him at the time, but he made a couple of decisions that opened the door a crack and allowed us to start an in depth and focused investigation and lead to the violations in other provinces and Parks. There was so much that we had trouble convincing people that one guy could be responsible.

We were lucky at the time to be assigned a Crown Counsel who was a hunter and would meet with us regularly and go over what the investigation needed to do and how. That was a key piece in getting the convictions we did. Mota could never be deported because all the charges were summary convictions. We tired for higher level criminal charges but could not build a case for them.

If there ever is a book written about this guy. I'll want to read it.

Thanks for your service and input Steve,

just curious how old would he be and is he still around ?

[BgBlkDg]

In the case of summary convictions for serious crimes, I consider poaching to be as vile as child molesting, the laws should be changed to enable mandatory deportation on conviction.

Actually, I would prefer summary execution by hanging for this atrocity and then deport his ashes!!!

Good work by you guys, SteveW.

[dracb]

Absolutely none what so ever. Since you know my name you should know enough about me to be aware that much of my life is spent protecting wildlife and the environment and mentoring new hunters and trappers. I have no patience whatsoever with blatant violators of game laws, but once the violator has paid for the crime what is the benefit to him or society of ongoing wanton persecution. My arguments are not so much in support of him as to try to make people think a bit about what they are saying. He is being persecuted here by people citing his transgressions from more or less 25 years ago. Not only do a number on here state they want him killed or wish him a painful death but they are willing to spread their dislike for him to anyone that knows him or allows him in their store.

I took the time to read all 20 previous pages of this thread to see where there was evidence he is continuing his anti social transgressions. Bugger all proof only innuendo. Numerous comments implying he is must be guilty just because the CO's check out hunters coming and going from an operation he may or may not own. But then that is their job with regards to any transporter or guide so it is not proof of any wrong doing.

Sure the CO's will watch someone with his record more than the average Joe but it is insulting to them to imply that after 25 years of search they have not found something to charge him with IF HE IS GUILTY.

During his first trials he claimed not to speak or read much English and had not read or been read to the hunting regulations. He also claimed that he had purchased some of the trophies that he was charged with. Granted if he was found guilty in error of hunting them their possession without the enabling permits constituted another charge. He was then a man from a different time and different place who brought with him an ethos from then and there that obviously was not a good fit with that of his new home. Poaching in parts of Europe was not readily available available to people without money unless they poached. I suspect the game laws of the Portuguese colonies were applied largely to trophy hunters from abroad during the years when he fought there for Portugal. He stated he learned from the various Canadian prosecutions. Unfortunately the prosecutions all took place in a short period of time following a number of years of what we call poaching and what he probably called hunting.

Given the reasonable expectation that LEO's have reportedly tried their damnedest (without success) to catch him in violation for 25 years perhaps just perhaps he is a man that is driven by a desire to hunt that is the equivalent of the most driven hunters on this site. Perhaps he started here without any knowledge of of the North American hunting ethos and got in trouble applying the standards from where he came. Maybe he did learn from each prosecution as he stated at trial and just maybe he has been clean for 25 years. I do not know but then neither does anyone else on here. He did not get a lifetime hunting ban as has been stated here. He got a 25 year ban that expires in 2019. He did state in his appeal that he had paid large fines and spent time in jail and thought a 25 year ban was not fair as it amounted to a lifetime ban.

[bridger]

Mota is certainly the stuff that wildness lore and possibly legends are based on. I was one of the investigating officers for his BC violations, which took many months, and reading through this thread has brought back some memories of the work we did. Like all really skilled poachers he had a network of people who covered for him and held him in awe or fear. At the time he was a man of incredible physical strength and stamina and had the ability to survive days in the bush with almost no gear and what he could carry in what would amount to a small day pack. He didn't have a great ability to communicate verbally and many though him slow or dumb. However, after spending time with him and interviewing him we learned he was anything but. We never would have caught him at the time, but he made a couple of decisions that opened the door a crack and allowed us to start an in depth and focused investigation and lead to the violations in other provinces and Parks. There was so much that we had trouble convincing people that one guy could be responsible.

We were lucky at the time to be assigned a Crown Counsel who was a hunter and would meet with us regularly and go over what the investigation needed to do and how. That was a key piece in getting the convictions we did. Mota could never be deported because all the charges were summary convictions. We tired for higher level criminal charges but could not build a case for them.

If there ever is a book written about this guy. I'll want to read it.

Kudo's to the great work the CO'S did on this case. Mota's poaching escapades were well known to the guys who spent much time in 7b.

[Weatherby Fan]

Absolutely none what so ever. Since you know my name you should know enough about me to be aware that much of my life is spent protecting wildlife and the environment and mentoring new hunters and trappers. I have no patience whatsoever with blatant violators of game laws, but once the violator has paid for the crime what is the benefit to him or society of ongoing wanton persecution. My arguments are not so much in support of him as to try to make people think a bit about what they are saying. He is being persecuted here by people citing his transgressions from more or less 25 years ago. Not only do a number on here state they want him killed or wish him a painful death but they are willing to spread their dislike for him to anyone that knows him or allows him in their store.

I took the time to read all 20 previous pages of this thread to see where there was evidence he is continuing his anti social transgressions. Bugger all proof only innuendo. Numerous comments implying he is must be guilty just because the CO's check out hunters coming and going from an operation he may or may not own. But then that is their job with regards to any transporter or guide so it is not proof of any wrong doing.

Sure the CO's will watch someone with his record more than the average Joe but it is insulting to them to imply that after 25 years of search they have not found something to charge him with IF HE IS GUILTY.

During his first trials he claimed not to speak or read much English and had not read or been read to the hunting regulations. He also claimed that he had purchased some of the trophies that he was charged with. Granted if he was found guilty in error of hunting them their possession without the enabling permits constituted another charge. He was then a man from a different time and different place who brought with him an ethos from then and there that obviously was not a good fit with that of his new home. Poaching in parts of Europe was not readily available available to people without money unless they poached. I suspect the game laws of the Portuguese colonies were applied largely to trophy hunters from abroad during the years when he fought there for Portugal. He stated he learned from the various Canadian prosecutions. Unfortunately the prosecutions all took place in a short period of time following a number of years of what we call poaching and what he probably called hunting.

Given the reasonable expectation that LEO's have reportedly tried their damnedest (without success) to catch him in violation for 25 years perhaps just perhaps he is a man that is driven by a desire to hunt that is the equivalent of the most driven hunters on this site. Perhaps he started here without any knowledge of of the North American hunting ethos and got in trouble applying the standards from where he came. Maybe he did learn from each prosecution as he stated at trial and just maybe he has been clean for 25 years. I do not know but then neither does anyone else on here. He did not get a lifetime hunting ban as has been stated here. He got a 25 year ban that expires in 2019. He did state in his appeal that he had paid large fines and spent time in jail and thought a 25 year ban was not fair as it amounted to a lifetime ban.

drabc...........I hear where your coming from and yes if he has served his penalties/punishment and moved on good for him,

but to say just because he was raised in a different country,era and culture excuses him from not playing by the rules........not a F-ing chance in hell, my Dad came from Norway in 1927 and with a grade 4 education and had a hell of an upbringing but when he arrived here he couldn't write or speak any English, but he hunted and fished by the rules and laws in BC for his whole life..........imagine that !

[BgBlkDg]

"he thought a lifetime ban was UNFAIR"!!!????

He did not then and does not now belong here and your on-going defence of him, call it what you will, causes me to wonder about all of the "protecting wildlife and the environment" that you claim to have done.

As others have said, Mota, is garbage and you need to pull your cranium out of your rectum and see reality.

No offence, but, he SHOULD have been sent back to Portugal.

[dracb]

I think what I said was he brought a different set of values that did not fit well here. I am not excusing him. I am sure at some point he realized that they were not acceptable. Had they caught him and prosecuted him earlier its possible that he may not have committed the litany of crimes he did. I doubt it but it is possible.

I just fail to believe that with the scrutiny he has had over the last 25 years he could have escaped additional prosecutions if he was continuing the lawless path he started on.

When he is again charged and found guilty I will admit I am wrong until then I will not beat up on him in absentia just because of what he did a long time ago and paid a price for. I would argue he didn't pay enough but then wildlife law violators seldom do. Thankfully the courts are beginning to get it right. In the meantime the courts say he has paid the price they extracted. Where is the value in wasting time hating someone with the lynch mob/witch hunt mentality that I saw on here earlier in this thread. Had I noted the dates on the first posts on this thread I would not have commented at all.

Enough time wasted on this.

[digger dogger]

"he thought a lifetime ban was UNFAIR"!!!????

He did not then and does not now belong here and your on-going defence of him, call it what you will, causes me to wonder about all of the "protecting wildlife and the environment" that you claim to have done.

As others have said, Mota, is garbage and you need to pull your cranium out of your rectum and see reality.

No offence, but, he SHOULD have been sent back to Portugal.

In other news, man is accused of fisting Grizzly bears!!!

[ACE]

Idalecio Mota would be 75 (+-) years old now ..... according to court documents.
Found with 'Google' ....

[Steve W]

I don't think it's much of a time waster to revisit topics like this. Mota was exceptional in his abilities and appetite for killing animals. People need to know that there are people out there like him to this day. Successful poachers are hard to catch mainly because they keep a low profile and any associates are like minded or have a lot to lose if they are found out. Mota was caught in an era where the fax machine was just coming into common use. No computerization of any kind and all comunications were by land line or snail mail. Jurisdictions were not as coordinated as they are now. It took months just to come up with the needed information to get a search warrant to look at his residence. With computerization, almost instant reliable communication and coordinated inter-agency intelligence gathering/sharing guys like Mota have a tougher time of it.

For the day his sentence in BC was as good as could be had and his jail time was reflective of his activties and all the people involved in the investigation were pretty happy with it. At the time there were no provisions for a lifetime hunting ban so three 10 year suspensions were handed down. He plead guilty so not all the details came out. The COs involved were better investigators after dealing with Mota and the investigation and the Crown Counsel system developed a prosecutors who specialized in environmental cases in large part because of this investigation. Mota's abilities, techniques and successes were an eye opener for all involved.

[Philcott]

Steve, maybe your the one to write the book.

[Ferenc]

It's no time waster reading this .. It's one of the biggest money makers after drugs.. Take in the international market for smuggled animals/parts .. It's bad enough to see a resource dwindle.. And yet hear and see what limitations are put on our conservation officers in order to uphold the law

[wideopenthrottle]

sounds like he had a me first entitlement attitude...he looked at the resource as limitless...he prolly rationalized it cuz it wasn't hurting anybody (in his mind)...he is what irks me about this world...but he does not deserve to be killed or beaten ...... that kinda talk is what anti hunters say about hunters and it is nonsense when they say it so........... scum..yes....environmental abuser ..yes.... deserved jail..yes ......deserves death..not so much no

[Steve W]

Steve, maybe your the one to write the book.

There was a lot of missing pieces that without his co-operation will never be known completely.

[Stormy]

sounds like he had a me first entitlement attitude...he looked at the resource as limitless...he prolly rationalized it cuz it wasn't hurting anybody (in his mind)...he is what irks me about this world...but he does not deserve to be killed or beaten ...... that kinda talk is what anti hunters say about hunters and it is nonsense when they say it so........... scum..yes....environmental abuser ..yes.... deserved jail..yes ......deserves death..not so much no

exactly - some of the shit written on this thread reads like the vile vomit, puked up on face book - by the anti gang...

some of the people calling for the mans death (and other horific punishment) on here is really disturbing - it makes one wonder how many of the face book zealots are hiding out on here - in plain sight....?

thank you Steve W - thank you for brining facts about the guy, and opening up my eyes to what really happened - I too would buy the book if it was ever written

[walks with deer]

I no where near agree with the man's actions...

That said what year did hunting regs even start?
In addition if you grew up in the 30s a 22 was used for moose or deer onsite not season for poor family's.

A couple funny books detailing crazy s&£# like elmer Keith or a poachers digest can bring you to speed on these guys thought process.they didn't have the science or the population base as we have today.

Didn't Daniel Boone mobe into a area harvest all the bears he could then move on once he couldn't find a bear.

The mine of those pre 1975 even is a lot different than other generations who actively hunted.
for example my grandpa shot every predator on site. Skinned and sold.
my dad never shot them so I was raised the same mentality.
now seeing in my lifetime great areas fall do to battle salvage and wolves together attitude has changed.

That said areas my grandpa hunted were deemed shto out... today have come back strong or stronger eg Exeter in 100 mile house.
I see whipsaw doing the same.

The guy doesn't realize he is a ass. And yes he should go to prison.

However alot a guys would take a cheap horse pack if opurtunity knocked.

That said sounds like sly fox has done it multiple times...lol (just kidding kinda.)

[Apolonius]

Mota was able to do what he did,thanks to others too.There were people that were "guided" by him.It wasn't just him that committed crimes against wildlife.There were people that have trophies ...thanks to Mota.In some circles was/is well liked.Did he serve his sentence and payed for his crimes?Well yes,if he actually learned from his mistakes and did not commit more "infractions".But i think he still did more,a life style you don't just walk away from.There were/are more customers and are willing to pay good cold cash.Here in BC and even..... Quebec is not far away.He serves a market that is made out of some specific "types" of people.Specific "nationalities".But like Steve W said ,,he is just one of many.In my opinion the Cos did the biggest "mistake"....playing by the rules....He wasn't.They did not focus on the clients,the matchmakers....Is he still active????Old dogs don't die easy.....just getting smarter.My 9 1/2 cents.

[Steve W]

In my opinion the Cos did the biggest "mistake"....playing by the rules....He wasn't.They did not focus on the clients,the matchmakers....Is he still active????Old dogs don't die easy.....just getting smarter.My 9 1/2 cents.

Some of the "matchmakers" were also investigated and charged both in BC and the Yukon. It just never made the headlines that AM did. In those days we weren't allowed to release names to the press like now. The COS didn't get them all, but there was a lot of nervous people around and some circling of the wagons for sure.

As for playing the rules - it's not an option not to if you want to be successful and not crucified in legal court or the court of public opinion. Does it mean some bad guys get away - yes it does. Bad guys will likely always be bad guys and if you can't catch them one way then give what you have to another agency to look at. CRA loves to hear about new clients and one of the rules is that if you know something bad about someone you pass it along.

[BeastX]

Yes, he has made mistakes, hunted more than he should and paid his dues. Yet his name continues to be showcased as if catching him was the greatest accomplishment. Despite some of the truth, it is lamenting how many comments, false rumors and stories conjure such a negative perception of the man. But it demonstrates just how many persons have nothing better to do, how much they envy/are jealous of what he is capable of in the bush, or how desperate some are to catch him in an act, so much that their powers cross the line.

[Weatherby Fan]

Some people get famous for being a great athlete , actor, maybe a few from hunting, and some get famous for being a poaching criminal, we didn't make his choices in life for how he's remembered, HE DID !

[BeastX]

People only talk badly about a man merely because of what they hear from others and the things they see online...How many people have actually seen Alex shooting an animal? a chopper? a bald eagle? a bison? How do they know some of the people interviewed during investigation weren't actually jealous, and really looking to put Alex down? How are the game wardens so sure the bison came from a specific national park (Can the COs prove where the bison really came from)? How do the COs know that ALL the animals they seized belonged to him at that reasonable time? What about his loss of life and liberty when the COs detained him upon discovering a rifle that was never his? Or the time he was illegally detained when suspected of hunting but wasn't? Its easy for one side of a story to make fame, but the other side most of the time is rarely seen or heard of.

Bottom line is, most of the hiding rectums reading and commenting this thread do not know him in person and repeat after the other sheep. Some officers thrive on catching their guy while fueled by a corrupt lust to prove a point "Look at the son of a bitch we caught today!" Would not be the least bit surprised if some of the rifles/animals/trophies which were seized are probably claimed and kept in the conservation officers' own homes, and if that were the case, who would be made out as the real poacher(s)? They would be no better, but worse than Alex - Whether Alex Mota, Prime Minister, Chef, Hunter, Musician, or illegal police coercion used by an officer to compel a suspect to talk, everyone makes mistakes. Who doesn't?

At the end of the day, Idalecio Mota, dubbed "Butcher of the North," is your classic example made to be negatively scrutinized when people don't know the full story.

[ACE]

People only talk badly about a man merely because of what they hear from others and things they see online ...

At the end of the day, Idalecio Mota, dubbed 'Butcher of the North', is your classic example made to be negatively scrutinized when people don't know the full story.

Can you relate the true story here ...... it would put an end to the speculation about this man ?

[Gateholio]

Yeah, lets hear the full story. :)

[Whonnock Boy]

If it looks like $hit, smells like $hit, and tastes like $hit, it's probably..... I highly doubt the conservation service would spend untold amounts of money and resources on a person with little or no evidence of illegal activity. People with few morals will do and say anything to cast doubt on their accusers. Are the stories/claims true? I would put my money on yes.

[Weatherby Fan]

Yeh I can't believe those nitwit Gamewordens actually charged poor Alex, especially when he was completely innocent, I guess they have nothing better to do than run around charging innocent people.........unbelievable............

[1/2 slam]

People only talk badly about a man merely because of what they hear from others and the things they see online...How many people have actually seen Alex shooting an animal? a chopper? a bald eagle? a bison? How do they know some of the people interviewed during investigation weren't actually jealous, and really looking to put Alex down? How are the game wardens so sure the bison came from a specific national park (Can the COs prove where the bison really came from)? How do the COs know that ALL the animals they seized belonged to him at that reasonable time? What about his loss of life and liberty when the COs detained him upon discovering a rifle that was never his? Or the time he was illegally detained when suspected of hunting but wasn't? Its easy for one side of a story to make fame, but the other side most of the time is rarely seen or heard of.

Bottom line is, most of the hiding rectums reading and commenting this thread do not know him in person and repeat after the other sheep. Some officers thrive on catching their guy while fueled by a corrupt lust to prove a point "Look at the son of a bitch we caught today!" Would not be the least bit surprised if some of the rifles/animals/trophies which were seized are probably claimed and kept in the conservation officers' own homes, and if that were the case, who would be made out as the real poacher(s)? They would be no better, but worse than Alex - Whether Alex Mota, Prime Minister, Chef, Hunter, Musician, or illegal police coercion used by an officer to compel a suspect to talk, everyone makes mistakes. Who doesn't?

At the end of the day, Idalecio Mota, dubbed "Butcher of the North," is your classic example made to be negatively scrutinized when people don't know the full story.

What a complete load of horse shit. He made the choice to poach.

[RiverOtter]

Ya, but a few of the 100'ish mounts were harvested legally, so he's not a true poacher.....:roll:

[1899]

Yeah, lets hear the full story. :)

Here is part of the story, but I am sure buddy can fill us in on the rest of the details about the poor, wrongly persecuted guy:

http://canlii.ca/t/2ds4f


In view of the appellant's failure to respond to the fines, probationary orders and minimal custodial terms that have followed his 160 earlier convictions for hunting-related offences since 1980, the trial sentence was as realistic as the statute permitted.


For myself, I would add that the Attorneys General of Canada and Alberta should urgently consider the bringing of civil injunction proceedings against Mota to enjoin his future use, or even possession, of all firearms as a supplementary sanction against his unremittent taking of wildlife


From the facts of this case and from Mota's record (which I attach to these reasons) it may safely be concluded that Mota does little but kill wildlife in order to sell the animal's parts and trophies either for profit or to derive some Stone-age gratification from what he is doing. Apart from profit considerations he shows little discrimination in what he hunts, when he hunts and where he hunts. In mitigation Mr. Rice tells us that he doubts Mota's acceptance or even understanding of any restraints on the taking of wildlife. Hence wild animals found in Canada's national parks, those out of season or located in prohibited or protected areas give him no pause. Nor does sex, specie or rarity. In this case he shot a herd bull American Bison (described by locals as "the big one" from a herd of 300) within the boundaries of Wood Buffalo National Park. Its mounted head was found in Mota's van alongside 21 other wildlife heads.

[longwalk]

Here is part of the story, but I am sure buddy can fill us in on the rest of the details about the poor, wrongly persecuted guy:

http://canlii.ca/t/2ds4f

Wow! that was enlightening.

[REMINGTON JIM]

People only talk badly about a man merely because of what they hear from others and the things they see online...How many people have actually seen Alex shooting an animal? a chopper? a bald eagle? a bison? How do they know some of the people interviewed during investigation weren't actually jealous, and really looking to put Alex down? How are the game wardens so sure the bison came from a specific national park (Can the COs prove where the bison really came from)? How do the COs know that ALL the animals they seized belonged to him at that reasonable time? What about his loss of life and liberty when the COs detained him upon discovering a rifle that was never his? Or the time he was illegally detained when suspected of hunting but wasn't? Its easy for one side of a story to make fame, but the other side most of the time is rarely seen or heard of.

Bottom line is, most of the hiding rectums reading and commenting this thread do not know him in person and repeat after the other sheep. Some officers thrive on catching their guy while fueled by a corrupt lust to prove a point "Look at the son of a bitch we caught today!" Would not be the least bit surprised if some of the rifles/animals/trophies which were seized are probably claimed and kept in the conservation officers' own homes, and if that were the case, who would be made out as the real poacher(s)? They would be no better, but worse than Alex - Whether Alex Mota, Prime Minister, Chef, Hunter, Musician, or illegal police coercion used by an officer to compel a suspect to talk, everyone makes mistakes. Who doesn't?

At the end of the day, Idalecio Mota, dubbed "Butcher of the North," is your classic example made to be negatively scrutinized when people don't know the full story.

Really ? Hmm ! What relation ship do you have with him ? :biggrin: RJ

[ACE]

BeastX ...... are you Idalecio Mota ?

If so, tell your story.
Clear up any misconceptions ...

[Whonnock Boy]

It was a "witch hunt"......


Here is part of the story, but I am sure buddy can fill us in on the rest of the details about the poor, wrongly persecuted guy:

http://canlii.ca/t/2ds4f

[SPEYMAN]

The charges that were laid are just those that could be proved, how many others are there?

[1899]

The charges that were laid are just those that could be proved, how many others are there?

I was thinking the same thing- 160 convictions in roughly 10years...

[358mag]

I was thinking the same thing- 160 convictions in roughly 10years...

Huummm ... sound like a great candidate for Justin to appoint to the Senate

[Whonnock Boy]

Obviously Mr. BeastX does not know the searching capabilities of the computer age. It must be a conspiracy.....

[REMINGTON JIM]

BeastX ...... are you Idalecio Mota ?

If so, tell your story.
Clear up any misconceptions ...

Greg your reading my MINE again ! :wink: lol RJ

[RiverOtter]

Greg your reading my MINE again ! :wink: lol RJ

Jim, are you losing your MINE...?....... :mrgreen:

[1899]

Absolutely none what so ever. Since you know my name you should know enough about me to be aware that much of my life is spent protecting wildlife and the environment and mentoring new hunters and trappers. I have no patience whatsoever with blatant violators of game laws, but once the violator has paid for the crime what is the benefit to him or society of ongoing wanton persecution. My arguments are not so much in support of him as to try to make people think a bit about what they are saying. He is being persecuted here by people citing his transgressions from more or less 25 years ago. Not only do a number on here state they want him killed or wish him a painful death but they are willing to spread their dislike for him to anyone that knows him or allows him in their store.

I took the time to read all 20 previous pages of this thread to see where there was evidence he is continuing his anti social transgressions. Bugger all proof only innuendo. Numerous comments implying he is must be guilty just because the CO's check out hunters coming and going from an operation he may or may not own. But then that is their job with regards to any transporter or guide so it is not proof of any wrong doing.

Sure the CO's will watch someone with his record more than the average Joe but it is insulting to them to imply that after 25 years of search they have not found something to charge him with IF HE IS GUILTY.

During his first trials he claimed not to speak or read much English and had not read or been read to the hunting regulations. He also claimed that he had purchased some of the trophies that he was charged with. Granted if he was found guilty in error of hunting them their possession without the enabling permits constituted another charge. He was then a man from a different time and different place who brought with him an ethos from then and there that obviously was not a good fit with that of his new home. Poaching in parts of Europe was not readily available available to people without money unless they poached. I suspect the game laws of the Portuguese colonies were applied largely to trophy hunters from abroad during the years when he fought there for Portugal. He stated he learned from the various Canadian prosecutions. Unfortunately the prosecutions all took place in a short period of time following a number of years of what we call poaching and what he probably called hunting.

Given the reasonable expectation that LEO's have reportedly tried their damnedest (without success) to catch him in violation for 25 years perhaps just perhaps he is a man that is driven by a desire to hunt that is the equivalent of the most driven hunters on this site. Perhaps he started here without any knowledge of of the North American hunting ethos and got in trouble applying the standards from where he came. Maybe he did learn from each prosecution as he stated at trial and just maybe he has been clean for 25 years. I do not know but then neither does anyone else on here. He did not get a lifetime hunting ban as has been stated here. He got a 25 year ban that expires in 2019. He did state in his appeal that he had paid large fines and spent time in jail and thought a 25 year ban was not fair as it amounted to a lifetime ban.

The consequences were far too lenient, and you make too many explanations/excuses. Many, many people are guilty of crimes and are never charged. I once took an interesting psychology course taught by a psychologist who also happened to do parole eligibility/fitness for release. He said that virtually none of the serious, serial offenders will change - "the best predictors of future behavior is past behavior".

I don't believe in the magical turnaround.

Plus, from what I have read, he had a 30 year ban and that would run out in 2019.

http://www.eab.gov.bc.ca/wildlife/91_24.pdf

[ACE]

Greg your reading my MINE again ! :wink: lol RJ

:mrgreen::mrgreen: Hi Jim !

[stoneramhunter]

Just started reading this thread have met Alex, last time i had run into moda was 3 yrs ago when he was heading into his sheep area. He went in with horses solo and after 5 days turned around and came back out never made it to his sheep camp the terrain and horse trail was in bad shape the guy is in his 80s. I wont comment on his illegal activity but what i can say he was one of the toughest bush guys ive run across in the mountains. First ran into him maybe 30 something years ago when he was working with Walter kaiser. i met him when I was on my way out of the mountains with my horses and ran into a guy sleeping under a plastic tarp no sleeping bag he was leading a pack of 6 horses. i had been in for 18 days on a solo sheep hunt so was nice to see someone else. we chatted for a few minutes i asked him how long he had been in... this was the second week in October shit load of snow and a lot of wind blowdown to go across to get out with 2 more days till the highway, he said June. The guy had been in the mountains from June to October with basically nothing but minimal supplies. he had an old coffee can with a wire handle that he cooked his meat in and hard tack for food lol dressed in wool pants and mackinaw. never used a tent. To be clear im not a fan of Alex whatsoever and never agreed with what he did but i can say not to many guys would of been able to keep up with him.
we chatted for several minutes then parted ways. Over the years ive seen him several times in the mountains and occasionally at Italian sporting goods. regardless of his transgressions the guy was a skillful hardcore bushman who very few could match.

[IronNoggin]

regardless of his transgressions the guy was a skillful hardcore bushman who very few could match.

Given what I have seen you post here, I am not at all surprised to find you supporting a well known POACHER!

Carry on TROLL...

[stoneramhunter]

Given what I have seen you post here, I am not at all surprised to find you supporting a well known POACHER!

Carry on TROLL...

you know what go phuck yourself i never said i supported him read the post again. now your just being an asshole and ignorant

[IronNoggin]

you know what go phuck yourself i never said i supported him read the post again. now your just being an asshole and ignorant

Have a good long look in the mirror Idjut.

[stoneramhunter]

Have a good long look in the mirror Idjut.

yeah figured as much. obviously ya never read it. Youre dismissed

[ACE]

I never said I supported him, read the post again. Now you're just being an asshole and ignorant.

​Was/is Mota an athiest?

[stoneramhunter]

​Was/is Mota an athiest?

Wouldn't know. have no idea