motor mooching?

[Jager]

Anybody still do this? Tips, tricks?

I was thinking of trying for winter springs in the Nanaimo area. A past co-worker once told me how they'd rake or jig some herring, rig them up, and send them down (back in the 70-80's). Long leaders and banana weights I think. Then you start trolling and poping the motor in-and-out of gear.

Am I missing anything else?

[coach]

There's really two different techniques. One is to cut the herring at a double angle right behind the head and run two single hooks through it. Depending on the angle, you can change the roll of the herring in the water. This method is known as cut-plugging and is the most common method of fishing at fishing lodges along our coast.

The other method uses live herring rigged with two small treble hooks - one through the top of the herring's nose and one in the top of the back. For this technique, you can anchor or slowly kick the motor in and out of gear. When the Pender Harbor area had decent fishing, this was the preferred method of most anglers. Most boats had live wells in them to keep the bait fresh and most marinas sold live herring. I'm not sure why this method hasn't been used in more locations along the coast as it should be productive anywhere the fish are feeding on herring.

[BiG Boar]

I did a lot of cut plug fishing last year and it still works.

[coach]

Both methods definitely work. The only issue I can see with using live herring to mooch for winter springs would be the fact that the fish are often caught at depths of 200 or more feet. I'm not sure how much confidence I'd have in a single herring swimming around at that depth. Whenever I've fished with live herring, it has been at 60 feet or less. Cut plugging can definitely work for winter springs by trolling off a downrigger. Depending on water clarity, a flasher attached to the canon ball with a cut herring 10-15 feet above can be very effective.

[Brew]

Thats how we fish in rivers inlet. A great way to fish. Look for small taps on your rod and feed some line as your taking the rod out of the rod holder. If you continue to get small taps feed another pull of line until the fish really starts to pull. Then set the hook. The big chinook like to just mouth or slap the bait before actually trying to eat it.
We use cut plug herring cut at a 45 angle and the knife bevelled at a 45 as while you make that cut. I prefer a tight drillbit type roll.
While moving never let your line enter the water at more than a 45 degree angle and constantly go in and out of gear. Sometimes when your line is straight up and down throttling up quick can produce a strike but most strikes come when taking the boat out of gear and the herring sinks like a wounded fish. Good luck

[pescado]

Fish'in with live herring was very cool indeed. It does'nt happen often anymore because live herring is'nt available at any marinas or fuel docks. Ya you can jig for your bait with a herring jig but most people use anchovies, spoons or hootchies now behind a flasher. There are fewer fish around now and the later method lets you cover more ground. Live herring fishing got difficult when we went barbless; the herring would no longer stay on those little trebles without the barb and you needed small trebles and lite leader lines to get the proper action from your bait. There is no reason you still can't catch fish power-mooching and your method of slowing down, than speeding up will work. Just have lots of leaders tied as your going to catch alot of dogfish on the inside down deep in the winter where the fish are. Good fishing and use a herring jig instead of rake if you can find the bait.

[gorillaboy]

the key to any type of bait fishing is finding some bait. this time of year if you know of people catching springs in any numbers then they are feeding!!! now if that area has some tidal action or current to it then mooching will work. now depending on how deep your fishing and how strong the current is in your spot will dictate the size of weight you will need. up to (12 oz) dont use banana weights, use some round ball type weights and a piece of rubber tubing with a crib peg in it, with this set up you can set the length of your leader just by sliding your weight up the main line.
if you want to pm me i can give you more detailed info about exactly where on the tide line to work your bait.

[pnbrock]

good bait is either shit or to expensive,that was the old way unless you fishing queen charletts where the fish numbers are insane.local fishing is mostly needlefish ,west coast is needlefish for most of time then piltchers.so spoons are a more cost effective tool.

[stinger]

We used to motor mooch at Sansum Narrows with brined herring. It was a nice change of pace from stinging and worked just as well but its a little more fussy to get everything right especially the tide which can really fly through there.

[BuckEye]

The fish have gone back to school, but I don't think they have gotten a great deal smarter since the 80's :mrgreen: Banana weights and cut plugs worked fantastic in those times and will in these if you can get good fresh herring.
Jig your own or second, buy some nice looking frozen ones. Pick your location and things will happen if the fish are there. A long handle net helps.
A tight spin for Coho, and a slower wider roll for springs was the general method on the north east coast of the island in days gone by.

Damn, I miss those girls from the live bait docks. All tanned from summers spend in the dock lawn chairs tanning oooooweeee:twisted: If you got 18 herring for a dozen ordered, you knew she liked ya.

[Frango]

I would suggest that you wait until summer to try mooching. The fish are very deep in winter.Fishing off Nanaimo is tough fishing in winter.In the spring with fraser fish running thru they are still out in the 800 foot depths at around 100 to 220 level.Cut plugging or mooching is better done close to shore or structure in the warmer months.It's a great way to fish but one must realize that its a shallow way to fish..Fishing kelp beds or shore lines around Barclay ,nootka ,nitinat or even around the east coast of the island it can be a great way to catch a nice sping..

[BlacktailStalker]

Go talk to the herring fisherman, buy a bunch and vac seal/styro several hundred and they'll be 5x better than what you can buy commercially.

[pnbrock]

you know any andy?

[islander338]

unfortunately freezing fresh herring does not make good bait. once thawed the scales will have slipped and the flesh will be mush. Even if thawed in the apropriate brine solution. commercial packed herring are first held in nets and starved before getting a chem bath right before packaging.

[Gunner]

We used to run over to Active and Porlier passes in the summer to motor mooch the back eddies.We always jigged our own herring over there it was never a problem getting bait.Doubt you can still find the herring.I still cutplug the rockpiles on the West Coast....when they are open.I grew up fishing live herring at Pender Harbour and cutplugging Stuart Island and Seymour Narrows when I guided up there,not many guys doing it anymore,everybody uses downriggers.

[wolverine]

I used to do both motor mooching and bucktailing for winter springs. By far the bucktailing was the most productive and the most exciting way to fish for them. Zig zagging in around the kelp beds with the bucktail either just below the surface or skimming the top worked best. You could see the springs come up and chase the bucktail and when you switched direction on the zig zag it would trigger a strike because the spring would think he had been made and the bucktail was trying to escape. Unless you know what you are doing or have someone to teach you how to mooch properly and what to look for you are going to miss more fish than you catch, especially for springs. They don't hit the bait like coho do. Rather, they like to mouth the bait a bit and will sometimes take it in their mouth and swim up a little causing the rod tip (on a 10' mooching rod the tip is slender and very sensitive) to "pop up". If you don't hit it then, you'll miss the fish. Conversly, if they hold the bait before taking it the rod tip tends to dip. These are not exagerated movements so you have to watch carefully and know what you are seeing. Lucky Louie used to make wooden plugs and if you were flea market shopping and found one that had little pin holes all over it they were the ones that you would buy because those pin holes were teeth marks from springs and you knew that that plug would work well on springs. So, in my opinion, bucktailing is easier for a beginner to get success with plus it's a blast to watch the springs chase the bait. Good luck and stay safe out there. :-D

[coach]

I used to do both motor mooching and bucktailing for winter springs. By far the bucktailing was the most productive and the most exciting way to fish for them. Zig zagging in around the kelp beds with the bucktail either just below the surface or skimming the top worked best. You could see the springs come up and chase the bucktail and when you switched direction on the zig zag it would trigger a strike because the spring would think he had been made and the bucktail was trying to escape. Unless you know what you are doing or have someone to teach you how to mooch properly and what to look for you are going to miss more fish than you catch, especially for springs. They don't hit the bait like coho do. Rather, they like to mouth the bait a bit and will sometimes take it in their mouth and swim up a little causing the rod tip (on a 10' mooching rod the tip is slender and very sensitive) to "pop up". If you don't hit it then, you'll miss the fish. Conversly, if they hold the bait before taking it the rod tip tends to dip. These are not exagerated movements so you have to watch carefully and know what you are seeing. Lucky Louie used to make wooden plugs and if you were flea market shopping and found one that had little pin holes all over it they were the ones that you would buy because those pin holes were teeth marks from springs and you knew that that plug would work well on springs. So, in my opinion, bucktailing is easier for a beginner to get success with plus it's a blast to watch the springs chase the bait. Good luck and stay safe out there. :-D


Wolverine - where did you bucktail for winter springs? Anywhere I've fished for them, they've been pretty deep. My experience bucktailing has always been in shallower water in late summer or early fall, when the fish are chasing bait. I'm not doubting you - just curious as to where you found feeder springs that would come up for a bucktail.

I used to subscribe to the theory of reeling down quickly and setting the hook when the rod pops up while mooching or cut plugging. I fished River's Inlet a few years back with Ivan Berry at a spot along the inlet named after him and this exact scenario played out. Ivan was running the boat and my line went slack. As I dove for the rod, Ivan grabbed me by the shirt and held me back. After what seemed like an eternity (probably two seconds) the rod tip buried, then he let me take the rod out of the holder and set the hook. A short time later, a nice 35 pounder was in the net. Ivan knew River's Inlet and cut plugging as well as anybody and he was never a fan of setting the hook at the first sign of a fish touching the bait. He preferred to give the fish a chance to eat it.

[wolverine]

I used to bucktail them in late January early February Campbell River when I lived there. I also guided there. It's why they were called "winter springs" To bucktail springs we would rig a fly rod with a single action reel (fly reel wont hold enough line) with backing and fill it up with 15lb test. Run a long leader around 10' in length, a 5/8 oz. bead chain keel weight, a cowachin spinner just ahead of the bucktail and we were golden. Weight was about 3-4' ahead of the bucktail set up. Then head for the kelp beds. Stay just on the outside of them and set up a fast troll with a zig zag pattern. The bucktail should be just under the surface and sometimes breaking it. If you think you are going too fast you likely are not. The strike comes when you change the zig zag motion. Then hang on! There is nothing that compares to a 20lb spring on a 7weight fly rod with super light terminal tackle! Usually wind up chasing them a bit and it's a long play in but it's worth it.

As far as mooching techniques go probably every guide has there own way of setting hooks. True enough that if you set too soon you just pull the bait out of their mouths but if they get a feel for that trailing hook or the line they'll spit it out real fast so timing is everything. If I had greenies in the boat that were more interested in watching sea gulls than their rod tips I'd set the hook for them by gunning the motor. No shit. Most of the time if we didn't get fish it wasn't because they weren't there it was because the client didn't see the take and missed hitting the fish. Motor strikes and hooks that are sticky sharpe would put fish in the boat and keep the client from complaining about paying for no fish.

[Gunner]

I've seen some pretty interesting motor strikes at Row & be Damned and in the Narrows,couple of pretty good collisions when the guide was watching the rod tips and not ahead of him!It used to get pretty crowded in those back eddies! Gunner

[Phreddy]

I used to bucktail them in late January early February Campbell River when I lived there. I also guided there. It's why they were called "winter springs" To bucktail springs we would rig a fly rod with a single action reel (fly reel wont hold enough line) with backing and fill it up with 15lb test. Run a long leader around 10' in length, a 5/8 oz. bead chain keel weight, a cowachin spinner just ahead of the bucktail and we were golden. Weight was about 3-4' ahead of the bucktail set up. Then head for the kelp beds. Stay just on the outside of them and set up a fast troll with a zig zag pattern. The bucktail should be just under the surface and sometimes breaking it. If you think you are going too fast you likely are not. The strike comes when you change the zig zag motion. Then hang on! There is nothing that compares to a 20lb spring on a 7weight fly rod with super light terminal tackle! Usually wind up chasing them a bit and it's a long play in but it's worth it.

As far as mooching techniques go probably every guide has there own way of setting hooks. True enough that if you set too soon you just pull the bait out of their mouths but if they get a feel for that trailing hook or the line they'll spit it out real fast so timing is everything. If I had greenies in the boat that were more interested in watching sea gulls than their rod tips I'd set the hook for them by gunning the motor. No shit. Most of the time if we didn't get fish it wasn't because they weren't there it was because the client didn't see the take and missed hitting the fish. Motor strikes and hooks that are sticky sharpe would put fish in the boat and keep the client from complaining about paying for no fish.

Ah, memories.
I found fishing the edge around the Cape Mudge villiage or down along the kelp between Race Point and the pulp mill with a grey ghost or Coronation bucktail exceptionally good. Kinda miss those days. But I'm not moving back to the coast again. 56 years in the rain developing webbed feet was enough for me.:wink:

[wolverine]

I was just back on the island last week and I didn't realize how much I missed it until then. I don't miss those damn ferries @$70 bones a trip and I don't miss the wind and rain but ohhh.... the smell of that ocean. That's a little slice of heaven.

Yeah it used to get a little thick out there at Row or Be Damned and Copper Bluffs. You had to keep your head on a swivel or you were in for a bang up. Nice to see some of you guys remember the good old days out there when there used to be fish all over the place. Yessir... the Grey Ghost was a great bucktail. I still have a load of them in my salt water tackle box. To this day if I find myself at a flea market I find that I can't help but look for Lucky Louie plugs or spoons. I have quite a few now and I understand they are worth a mint.

Yeah.... the good ol' days. If only one could go back in time....

[muledeercrazy]

I used to bucktail them in late January early February Campbell River when I lived there. I also guided there. It's why they were called "winter springs" To bucktail springs we would rig a fly rod with a single action reel (fly reel wont hold enough line) with backing and fill it up with 15lb test. Run a long leader around 10' in length, a 5/8 oz. bead chain keel weight, a cowachin spinner just ahead of the bucktail and we were golden. Weight was about 3-4' ahead of the bucktail set up. Then head for the kelp beds. Stay just on the outside of them and set up a fast troll with a zig zag pattern. The bucktail should be just under the surface and sometimes breaking it. If you think you are going too fast you likely are not. The strike comes when you change the zig zag motion. Then hang on! There is nothing that compares to a 20lb spring on a 7weight fly rod with super light terminal tackle! Usually wind up chasing them a bit and it's a long play in but it's worth it.

As far as mooching techniques go probably every guide has there own way of setting hooks. True enough that if you set too soon you just pull the bait out of their mouths but if they get a feel for that trailing hook or the line they'll spit it out real fast so timing is everything. If I had greenies in the boat that were more interested in watching sea gulls than their rod tips I'd set the hook for them by gunning the motor. No shit. Most of the time if we didn't get fish it wasn't because they weren't there it was because the client didn't see the take and missed hitting the fish. Motor strikes and hooks that are sticky sharpe would put fish in the boat and keep the client from complaining about paying for no fish.

It makes it alot easier for a novice to pop the clip on a rigger and set the hook if the throttle is aplied at the right time!

[wolverine]

It makes it alot easier for a novice to pop the clip on a rigger and set the hook if the throttle is aplied at the right time!


So true...:-D

[Phreddy]

I was just back on the island last week and I didn't realize how much I missed it until then. I don't miss those damn ferries @$70 bones a trip and I don't miss the wind and rain but ohhh.... the smell of that ocean. That's a little slice of heaven.

Yeah it used to get a little thick out there at Row or Be Damned and Copper Bluffs. You had to keep your head on a swivel or you were in for a bang up. Nice to see some of you guys remember the good old days out there when there used to be fish all over the place. Yessir... the Grey Ghost was a great bucktail. I still have a load of them in my salt water tackle box. To this day if I find myself at a flea market I find that I can't help but look for Lucky Louie plugs or spoons. I have quite a few now and I understand they are worth a mint.

Yeah.... the good ol' days. If only one could go back in time....

And here I thought I was the only one who still hangs on to my old wooden Louies and spoons. What years were you living there. I was there from '70-'83.