stone rams x2

[Tlineman]

Sharing a success story. "Blueboy", my dad and myself had the hunt of a lifetime. Scored on two 8 year old rams and a goat. Rams were shot less than 24hrs apart and a little over a mile from each other. Don't bother asking where as we're tight lipped on the topic as per most sheep hunters. My 6th sheep hunt and first ram. Hard work and dedication pays off in the end. :-D



http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/showphoto.php?photo=20428&limit=recent

[Steeleco]

Great looking animals, Congrats.
http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/data/500/medium/rams.jpg

[d6dan]

Beauty Rams guys, thanks for the peek..Is there a goat pic?.

[Tlineman]

Here's a pic of the goat. A Billy, but I underestimated his age. Only 4. Still a trophy to me and cared for as such. They sure are hard to judge when they're by themselves.

http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/showphoto.php?photo=20429&cat=500&ppuser=18703

[ramron]

Nice rams, almost look like twins.

[Wild Images]

http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/data/500/medium/goatpic.JPG (http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/showphoto.php?photo=20429&size=big&cat=500&ppuser=18703)

[6 K]

Good grief man, you cut off your heads.
Got any decient pitures? You know ones that might show your smiling faces?
How about some better ones of your rams, profile shots, face on or just one that you can see both horns in.
By the way it took me six years to get my first ram too, I know you had a smiling face.
How far of a shot? what cal.?
ya goats can be deceiving.
I took one years ago I thought to be better than average, cause his horn length was longer than his face. You guessed it, short face. Real short face.
Congrats on your firsts,

[guest]

Congrats on your success.
That said, read your opening post, sounds like your as beauty ....... why bother being such a %$%%$*&&* , and not post proper pics.
In other words, with posts like this .........who cares?

There are some great people on this site, I see with 7 posts your off to a well received start.

Just my opinion.

CT

[Mik]

Great lookin rams, Nice Mt. Goat! Congratulations.
Do you have any other pics? as these seem to be "grainy". What camera did you use?

[Jelvis]

Unfreakinreal hunters wow not one but two, fantastic hunting and shooting a real success story. Stones and goats! Beauty sheep and goat. Unreal.
Jel .. Thanks for the looky. You hunters got in good physical condition to do that .. it paid off.

[Tlineman]

Good grief man, you cut off your heads.
Got any decient pitures? You know ones that might show your smiling faces?
How about some better ones of your rams, profile shots, face on or just one that you can see both horns in.
By the way it took me six years to get my first ram too, I know you had a smiling face.
How far of a shot? what cal.?
ya goats can be deceiving.
I took one years ago I thought to be better than average, cause his horn length was longer than his face. You guessed it, short face. Real short face.
Congrats on your firsts,

My Ram (the whiter face) was from 160yds, downhill, 7mm Rem mag. Nice shot with a clean kill. After spotting him from across the valley (he was alone) we watched him bed out of site in the willows and then raced across to try a stalk. The ram was feeding down low in the willows and we were fortunate to see him before he saw us. We watched him through a Swaravski 65X Scope for over 45 minutes before determining that he's legal. He's about a half inch short of full curl, but eight years old. All three of us looked through the scope and counted the rings before squeezing the trigger. Didn't want to make a mistake with such a beautiful animal. I shot from the seated position and hit him in the spine, a little higher than I was aiming, and he dropped in his tracks. Smiles bigger than you've ever seen in your life.

"Blueboys" ram was also from roughly 150 yds with a 280, downhill again. We were spotted by his ram in the am and just waited him out. He was accompanied by a 3/4 curl. The 3/4 curl didn't like us, (we were roughly 800yds away), but the big boy was content to just get up and feed away from us. Just as they were skylining and about to go out of site, 6 suckle heads came into the picture to complicate things. We had to wait for the two groups to part, then made our stalk with the full curl and the 3/4 out of site over the ridge. Being careful of which way the suckle heads would spook, we jumped them with hopes that they wouldn't run back towards the full curl. It worked. We worked our way up to the ridge only to find two 3/4 curls bedded down a senants, not letting anything approach. Damn it all, we didn't have a play. While contemplating our move, (we hadn't been spotted by the 3/4 curls), two ewes came up over the ridge with our rams nose up their arse. Accompanied by two other rams, they made their way towards us but we lost site of them while trying to stay out of site. All of a sudden we saw them bust out across a drainage below us, in pursuit of the ewes. Having still not been seen, we waited till they crossed the ridge on the other side then made our move. Running across the drainage we got to the top and found them on the other side and were able to make the kill. Yahoo!

I got the drop on the goat from about 100 yards. Watched him feed for about 20 min and then he bedded down under a rock right in front of me, but out of site. I could just see the white fur of the top of his back. I was able to sneek in to about 30 yards and try to get a better look at him. (I reallllllly didn't want to shoot a nanny!) After playing peekaboo with him for 10 min or so, (He'd figured out something was there) I saw a pair hanging. I'd had a good look at his horns head-on, and seen that they were close together, but had lots of time and wanted to be absolutely sure.

Man they are F#$%@#G tough animals, drilled him once, lung shot, then again with a shoulder shot yet he still started to take off downhill. Two more rounds again to finally stop him from falling into eternity. I was by myself for the goat, took pics at about 6pm, caped him out and de-boned all salvagable meat and booked her back to the tent. Hiking the last 20 min in the dark. Goats are one underrated trophy.

I'm fairly computer illiterate and struggling with the pics, give me time and I'll try to get you more. Going to remain anonymous though, sorry, no face pics.

[Jelvis]

Don't put your face on unless you want all of the hunters in Kamloops following you to your spot lol ..
Jel .. lol

[Tlineman]

Those of you who've spent countless hours, dollars, holiday's, and sweat in pursuit of such game should understand. There's nothing wrong with it taking 6 trips to get such an animal. IF it didn't, there wouldn't be too many left on the mountains and it wouldn't be such a highly regarded trophy. Hope you all understand.

[BlacktailStalker]

Congrats on your success.
That said, read your opening post, sounds like your as beauty ....... why bother being such a %$%%$*&&* , and not post proper pics.
In other words, with posts like this .........who cares?

There are some great people on this site, I see with 7 posts your off to a well received start.

Just my opinion.

CT


Proper pics? Does he have to meet your standards or something ? Wtf.

[goatdancer]

Congratulations. Nice looking rams and the goat is no slouch either. Hunting goats is a whole lot different than any other kind of hunting.

[Tlineman]

Blueboy's ram, nice dark cape

http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/showphoto.php?photo=20432&cat=500

[Tlineman]

My ram, beautiful whiter muzzle

http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/showphoto.php?photo=20431&limit=recent

[Tlineman]

We were lucky enough that we hadn't caped my ram yet before getting blueboys. So were able to get pics of the two heads together.

http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/showphoto.php?photo=20433&limit=recent

[Tlineman]

And the goat. This is him feeding at roughly 75 yards, pic is zoomed in. He moved up and bedded down under the rock in between us there. Allowing for a perfect stalk situation to 30yards.

http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/showphoto.php?photo=20434&limit=recent

[d6dan]

here you go..bigger is better.

http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/data/500/medium/ram31.jpg (http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/showphoto.php?photo=20432&size=big&cat=500)

http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/data/500/medium/Rams3.jpg (http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/showphoto.php?photo=20431&size=big&cat=recent&limit=recent)

http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/data/500/medium/ram4.jpg (http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/showphoto.php?photo=20433&size=big&cat=recent&limit=recent)

http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/data/500/medium/goat11.jpg (http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/showphoto.php?photo=20434&size=big&cat=recent&limit=recent)

[Tlineman]

thanks, I'm a moron when it comes to computers

[David Heitsman]

A brace! Well done gentlemen.

[ufishifish2]

A much better story now that you added to it. Thanks very much. Excellent aminals. Much congratulations to the both of you!!

[guest]

Nice Rams guys, cool having pic's of the billy too prior to it's demise.
Must have been a great hunt, cool story now too.

CT

[bigwhiteys]

http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/data/500/medium/ram4.jpg (http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/showphoto.php?photo=20433&size=big&cat=recent&limit=recent)

So that ram on the left was compulsory inspected as a legal 8 year old ram? Doesn't surprise me given the current track record of our CI's. He's not full curl, He's not even broomed...

He very well could be 8 but that's a ram that should have been left on the mountain. (not full curl, lamb tipped = walk away)

Carl

[Stone Sheep Steve]

http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/data/500/medium/ram4.jpg (http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/showphoto.php?photo=20433&size=big&cat=recent&limit=recent)

So that ram on the left was compulsory inspected as a legal 8 year old ram? Doesn't surprise me given the current track record of our CI's. He's not full curl, He's not even broomed...

He very well could be 8 but that's a ram that should have been left on the mountain. (not full curl, lamb tipped = walk away)

Carl

Carl- I usually have great respect for your posts but this one surprizes me. :?

Check out Gundahoos website and see how many lambtipped 8 yr olds are shot only on age.

SSS

[bigwhiteys]

Carl- I usually have great respect for your posts but this one surprizes me. :???:

Just as surprised as I was to see someone would take a chance popping a not full curl, lamb tipped ram they aged in the field to be exactly 8 years old...

And just as surprised to see none of the other sheep hunters mention it (as many of you are adamant about full curl being the guide for legality!)

We went through this not even a month ago on a 9.5 year old broomed ram, that the posters "thought" was 9.5 (so did the inspector) but the ram was really only 8.

Carl

[Stone Sheep Steve]

Just as surprised as I was to see someone would take a chance popping a not full curl, lamb tipped ram they aged in the field to be exactly 8 years old...

And just as surprised to see none of the other sheep hunters mention it (as many of you are adamant about full curl being the guide for legality!)

We went through this not even a month ago on a 9.5 year old broomed ram, that the posters "thought" was 9.5 (so did the inspector) but the ram was really only 8.

Carl

I wouldn't want to age that ram from that pic alone.

I, personally, would also want to age a ram at least @9 before deciding to shoot...but that's me. I see plenty of guides feeling confident enough to make that call on an 8 yr old ram.

SSS

[mod7rem]

Carl, I am just wandering if your reason is because of the possibilty for error, or is it the size of the ram? If it was a bigger ram with lamb tips and not fullcurl would you feel the same. My brothers ram last year was not fullcurl, had lamb tips, was 8 yrs old and scored over 174. With your statement that ram should have stayed as well. We were confident on age so we took him.

[mod7rem]

If I email it to you can you post it? I cant figure it out. I have to block his face or he'll be pissed.

[Tlineman]

Carl, your comment on lamb tips and full curl don't surprise me. I figured someone would have something to say. To me a ram that gets left on the mountain is a ram that is 7 or less, and is full curl, therefore legal. In my opinion a 8 year old ram or older is a trophy animal, and if its what your looking for, worth taking. The full curl rule has gotten alot of 6 and 7 year old rams shot.

Like I said in a earlier post as well, we watched this ram undetected for 45min through a 65x Swarovski scope at 160yards. All three members of the hunting party had a look, and all three of us agreed that this was a 8 year old ram. I have no regrets and would take the shot again in a heart beat.

Everyones entitled to an opinion, just remember that yours is worth the same and no more than the next guy.

[guest]

Tlineman,
your study of the ram paid off, he's been aged at 8 and not full curl. So good on you for taking your time and making sure. Congrats.


That said I was a chick ^%$^%^^! and for years would not shoot because of being afraid of being made a example of and loosing a trophy, so I waited for the obvious above the nose that also was over 8 yrs. I just felt better and safer in my Judgement.

Carl, the bottom line is it is 8, it makes the grade, so what's the big deal, in your opinion, he should have been left on the mountain. This guy made sure he followed the rules and succeeded, bagged a legal 8 yr. Ram. Nothing wrong with that !

Good on him.

Now for those that count false annuli on a not full curl, hurry a shot, and kill illegal Rams, chastise them, fine them, this guy did it right, he is legal .......
Bang! sheep ribs over the fire !

CT

[Tlineman]

Hope this is what your looking for. That is another annuli at the base, close to the skull. Ram had absessed teeth, all missing on one side of the upper jaw so this year was shaping up to be a poor year.
http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/data/500/medium/ramside.jpg (http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/showphoto.php?photo=20470&size=big&cat=500)
http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/data/500/medium/ramheadon.jpg (http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/showphoto.php?photo=20469&size=big&cat=500)

[guest]

Maybe there is some thing I am not seeing but that looks 8 to me ...
that said I am no expert.

CT

[bearheart]

Here's a pic of the goat. A Billy, but I underestimated his age. Only 4. Still a trophy to me and cared for as such. They sure are hard to judge when they're by themselves.

http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/showphoto.php?photo=20429&cat=500&ppuser=18703

A trick i was told by a guide was to look at base of horns for a large grey/black gland, larger the gland, older the billy. The glands are readily visible on mature billys, check out pics and mounts.:wink:

[moose2]

Great job on a very successful mountain trip. I do agree with your thoughts on the goats being a underated trophy. I think any legal animal harvested in the mountains on a backpack trip is a trophy. None of them are easy. Nice rams and nice goat
MIKE

[Stone Sheep Steve]

Okay, now that's a "slightly" better view:neutral:.

If you want a second inspection you should bring it down to Summerland. I'm sure he'll get at least 9 out of that ram:roll:.

SSS

[trigger]

right on "tightlip" uhhh i mean tineman. lol

[kootenayelkslayer]

I am thinking Bighorn, sounds impropable for a thinhorn...


Carl

Ahh yes, that must be it.

[guest]

Again, I profess to be no expert BUT,
Carl, if you look on the outer horn about an inch toward the skull there is a dominant annuli that would make even your scoring at 8, you have not included that one.
Just my opinion.

All this said, I look for them over full curl, or real heavy through out the horn, dropped down lower jaw area, and not on the cusp of being legal or not. If I was to shoot a ram under full, it would need to be broomed heavy, easy to count at least 8 easy. Where as this Ram has lamb tips, and the annuli if I counted totalled 9, 10 Pow.

Tough one on this one but I think I see one you are not counting Carl and Willy.

CT

[Gateholio]

The frontal pic makes it more confusing for me, as the lines at the bases seem to have similar characteristics of the annuli that Carl identified.

[mod7rem]

Im afraid I cant show pics of my brothers ram but it measured just over 39" on each horn, and both bases were 15.75". There was only 1/8 difference between the two horns. Yes a stone.

[Kody94]

Im afraid I cant show pics of my brothers ram but it measured just over 39" on each horn, and both bases were 15.75". There was only 1/8 difference between the two horns. Yes a stone.


15 6/8 bases! :eek: :cool: Holy jeebus!! That is a brute! I hope he managed to sow a lot of seed out there. Hopefully your bro' changes his mind and lets you tantalize us with a pic or two!

[Gateholio]

Let's try to be civil and polite, even in disagreement. Please and thank you.

[srupp]

I hope also this can stay civil..as these are EXACTLY the posts I come to see...and for me to continue to learn from those with far more experience than me..what I think on age matters nothing..I am here to listen look and learn..keep it going....really is fascinating...

thanks

Steven

[Elkhound]

I hope also this can stay civil..as these are EXACTLY the posts I come to see...and for me to continue to learn from those with far more experience than me..what I think on age matters nothing..I am here to listen look and learn..keep it going....really is fascinating...

thanks

Steven

Me too Steven. I have never hunted sheep but they facinate me

[Big Dog]

This is positive proof that if you keep at something you can get results. Good for U guys.:-D

[Tlineman]

Hope this helps clear up any confusion. As I said before, this ram had absessed teeth and was missing several on one side of its upper jaw, (should've taken pictures before discarding). To everyone who's congratulated me on a great hunt, my most sincere thanks. I do agree that this could be confusing, but this is definitley an annuli. If you want some pics from a diff angle say so.
http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/data/500/medium/DSCF0175.JPG (http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/showphoto.php?photo=20493&size=big&cat=500)
http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/data/500/medium/DSCF0178.JPG (http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/showphoto.php?photo=20492&size=big&cat=500)

[Matty_ola]

Cool stuff:) 6Th hunt and finally you harvest your Ram. Good for you guys, finally your patience has paid off:) Enjoy a cold one for all your hard work.

[spear]

If I ever get one, even if it passes i'll be pretty shy about posting pics! This has been great for a learning experience either way, thanks for posting.

[Bluedsteel]

Hope this helps clear up any confusion. As I said before, this ram had absessed teeth and was missing several on one side of its upper jaw, (should've taken pictures before discarding). To everyone who's congratulated me on a great hunt, my most sincere thanks. I do agree that this could be confusing, but this is definitley an annuli. If you want some pics from a diff angle say so.
http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/data/500/medium/DSCF0175.JPG (http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/showphoto.php?photo=20493&size=big&cat=500)
http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/data/500/medium/DSCF0178.JPG (http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/showphoto.php?photo=20492&size=big&cat=500)

Hmmm yep that sure looks like an annuli and a legal ram. Awesome pics thanks for sharing. I think some apologies should be rolling in, would be the right thing to do!

[r106]

Good job I hope you have a good spot picked out for your trophy
________
OG KUSH (http://trichomes.org/marijuana-strains/og-kush)

[Tlineman]

Iron head has explained the false annuli. That ring does not go all the way around the horn. This is the difference between a false ring and an actual age ring.

I'll get you a pick of the backside then

[kyleklassen]

I'll get you a pick of the backside then
don't bother just tell them to f@#k off and enjoy your sheep.

[Tlineman]

don't bother just tell them to f@#k off and enjoy your sheep.

Thinking about this regularily:twisted:

These will be my final pics on this website. From this angle you can see that there is an annuli at the base, as well as a false annuli between each real annuli, as with every year of this animals life. The real annuli including the one at the base do carry all the way around the horn as a real annuli is suppost to. Apology expected.
http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/data/500/medium/DSCF0179.JPG (http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/showphoto.php?photo=20495&size=big&cat=500)

Here you can see the annuli carrying around the horn, all the way around.

http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/data/500/medium/DSCF0181.JPG (http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/showphoto.php?photo=20494&size=big&cat=500)

Again thanks to everyone who congratulated me on my successful hunt and my 8 year old stone ram. Too bad a select few here are discouraging others from sharing their experiences with us by trying to intimidate with a "Holier than Thou" attitude.

[trapntrav]

woops! and there is the pic from the back side! This is a tough one to me, i wouldnt bet my life on it being 7 OR 8 without holding it in my hands. Either way its poor genetics (not begrudging you as i believe any legal FIRST ram is a trophy) and i guess at the end of the day you have to trust those who have had the ram in there hands.

I feel bad for all the hassle you have had on the site but it is good education for all, thanks for posting

[ufishifish2]

Much thanks to Willy, Carl, and TLineman for this debate. Thanks for all the effort in putting up all the pics Tlineman, as well as the diagrams Carl. This has been the most confusing, but also informative thread regarding aging sheep that I have ever read. I will probably be more likely to let an 8 yr old non-full curl ram "walk" in the future, for better or for worse.

[betteroffishing]

not a pro , nor an experienced sheep hunter but my eyes are seeing a lot in common between the two photos directly above this post , except where you have drawn a line with the number 8 on the pic to my right , you have chosen to leave that same line that I see on the one to the left??? i even see the false ring in front of the eighth , just like on the pick to the right. in my humble opinion congrats to you on your harvest of an inspected , and deemed to be by people who are paid to do so , legal animal. to continue the mudslinging in light of your own photo evidence being used to discredit your arguement is just poor form and sour grapes , now man up and go cry to your mommy , maybe shell listen{ i have the feeling someone was picked up too often as a young child.WOW

[r106]

not a pro , nor an experienced sheep hunter but my eyes are seeing a lot in common between the two photos directly above this post , except where you have drawn a line with the number 8 on the pic to my right , you have chosen to leave that same line that I see on the one to the left??? i even see the false ring in front of the eighth , just like on the pick to the right. in my humble opinion congrats to you on your harvest of an inspected , and deemed to be by people who are paid to do so , legal animal. to continue the mudslinging in light of your own photo evidence being used to discredit your arguement is just poor form and sour grapes , now man up and go cry to your mommy , maybe shell listen{ i have the feeling someone was picked up too often as a young child.WOW

I see it too. looks legal to me
________
MEDICAL MARIJUANA CARD (http://medicalmarijuanacard.info)

[Gateholio]

I tend to agree with this, although I will state up front that I'm not a expert on this either!:-D

The 2 rams in the pics above look identical in regards to annuli/false ring placement. Even the darker colouring of the horns is similar. Just that Tinemans ram doesn't have as deep, pronounced annuli, compared to the other ram, but that is consistent throughout the entire horn, not just the disputed area.

Add to that that Tineman mentioned the poor condition the ram was in, and it would seem to make sense that last years growth wasn't as pronounced as the rest of the horn.

[325]

Firstly, congratulations on your rams. I agree, the ram appears to be 8. However, I think shooting rams based on age that are just 8 is risky business. I hunted Stones for the first time this August. I probably saw 10 rams that may have been 8, but just shy of full-curl. I'll save my trigger-pulling until I find a full-curl or can count at least 9 annuli.

[kennyj]

Congratulations on your fine 8 year old rams.
kenny

[Gateholio]

At the end of the day, as of now, the authority to pass a ram as legal is in the hands of the CI. Is there holes in this system, yes, should all rams shot solely on age & not length be inspected by more certified inspectors and possibly have a tooth sent away, maybe.....should this hunter be belittled because of a grey area in a system.......not a chance. Go after the system that is in place to certify sheep if you don't agree not the hunter who has worked his ass off to shoot a ram that has passed an inspection that is the approved and legal inspection process.

Look for a new HBC policy regarding this coming soon....

[NaStY]

Re opened this thread. Please keep it on track. Every hunter deserves that much respect.......