" dink ram " poll

[moose2]

Do you think they should go back to a one year penalty for shooting rams under the age of 8 . I think this may help the sheep population and it would ensure that annual sheep hunters would select bigger rams. The guys looking for one sheep in there life that would be happy with any full curl would not be affected by this either.
MIKE

[stoneslinger]

Naw. The greedy guys that feel the need to shoot half a dozen rams or more should just quit. Both resident and non-resident.

[Rodd]

Sheep are the best eating critters out there!! And not all hunters are "Trophy Hunters". If you want to shoot 50 have at'er, as long as they are legal! Nothing to do with Greed for most! So if you've killed half a dozen deer you should quit hunting them? Or your Greedy? Wake up!

[stoneslinger]

Lots of indians shoot bighorn ewes, lambs, and 1/2 curls down by Waterton Park for meat. Kinda hard to stomach when you've seen it happen enough times. Especially when the elk and deer are standing along the very same roads.

[Rodd]

Kinda hard to stomach that they don't have any quota's to follow for sure.... But it proves they know what is the best eating...

[mxracer328]

Kinda hard to stomach that they don't have any quota's to follow for sure.... But it proves they know what is the best eating...

or like most indians they shoot what they see

[ufishifish2]

or like most indians they shoot what they see

I don't know that "most" indians is overly accurate. Maybe the odd one, just like the Fraser river and sockeye sa................Aw, who am I kidding!!:mrgreen:

[Krico]

Why the h3ll should there be a penalty for shooting a legal ram?

[Ozone]

Kinda sounds like GOABC BS.

[Mik]

If it's legal, your way up there and made the effort, then fire away!

[Fisher-Dude]

Is there a conservation concern? If there were, there would be a restriction. Why discourage the very hunters who don't even shoot enough rams now to reach AAH?

BC's game management is not to be designed to grow trophy animals for GOABC to sell to rich foreigners.

[dutchie]

Should there be a one year penelty for shooting a spike Buck??

Or what about shooting a smaller bear? what about shooting a nanny?

If it is legal it is legal... if it is not it is not...

Dutchie

[Hunt'n Guide]

Despite what I've posted in the "dink rams" thread. I agreed with the old system where you sat out if you shot a legal ram less than 8 yrs old. It encouraged selectivity and thinned the crowds.

[Jelvis]

It's a lot more challenging hunting skill wise to get a record mule deer buck in the bush then a sheep in Kamloops ..

[Fisher-Dude]

Despite what I've posted in the "dink rams" thread. I agreed with the old system where you sat out if you shot a legal ram less than 8 yrs old. It encouraged selectivity and thinned the crowds.

Thinned the crowds? Why? There are a million square miles to hunt. We have low hunter numbers as it is.

In the huge area of 7B, we have an average 500 resident sheep hunters spread over 2 1/2 months of sheep season. In region 6, we have 210 resident sheep hunters spread over 2 1/2 months. You think it's crowded??? You want to further reduce hunter numbers from these few residents that go? WTF!

Selectivity? Why? So rich Yankees have more big easy rams, that they can BUY EVERY year if they want? You want residents to stay at home for 2 years while Bubba gets to hunt every year???

[Jelvis]

Only so many people can climb up there and take all the time off work and afford to out fit themselves, it's a rich man's Sport hunt ..
Jel .. Not many can do it ..

[MuleyMadness]

It's a lot more challenging hunting skill wise to get a record mule deer buck in the bush then a sheep in Kamloops ..

Well Jelvis, first off...the Sheep hunt in Kamloops isn't exactly GOS now is it.

Second I would argue with you about book bucks being harder to bag than a high quality ram. Different of course, but not easier, saying that is a slap in the face to those guys that spend 2 weeks under a tarp for a shot at these animals.

[Jelvis]

If your in good physical condition to climb up and way back you have a chance to see a nice sheep, otherwise no, or have a outfitter take you up into his spot. A person who can't hike good is out except in Kamloops along the roads on Red Plateau Dewdrop ..
Jel .. Is that correct or you got a better take on it mulemad lettuce hear it.

[325]

There is no conservation concern for sheep when they must already be full-curl or 8 years old. Those are very restrictive criteria, and in themselves ensure that hunters will not negatively impact over-all sheep populations.

Either a ram is legal or it isn't....nothing else needs to be added to the equation.

[Jelvis]

Couple sheep were brought into Kamloops a few decades ago and now there everywhere eating all the deer food .. they breed like rabbits

[pappy]

I'm native so I must shoot everything I see according to some of the people on here who are proof that cousin's make love. Isn't that what Rednecks do? If a couple of them do it then thay all do it. Another post with the same sh*t showing up. We don't need to change sheep hunting rules as not many fellas even come out with sheep, compaired to how many guys try.

[Hunt'n Guide]

Thinned the crowds? Why? There are a million square miles to hunt. We have low hunter numbers as it is.

In the huge area of 7B, we have an average 500 resident sheep hunters spread over 2 1/2 months of sheep season. In region 6, we have 210 resident sheep hunters spread over 2 1/2 months. You think it's crowded??? You want to further reduce hunter numbers from these few residents that go? WTF!

Selectivity? Why? So rich Yankees have more big easy rams, that they can BUY EVERY year if they want? You want residents to stay at home for 2 years while Bubba gets to hunt every year???


Just to clarify things. I guide sheep in the Yukon. I hunt as a resident in BC. So I have no vested interest in making it easier to guide in BC.

In general "bubbas" do not hunt sheep every year. Most clients are on the hunt of a lifetime. Those that do have both the cash to hunt every year and the passion to do so are uncommon. They are usually very selective in the type of animals they harvest. In my experience this type of client is happy to be in the mountains chasing rams. If they are lucky enough to find a ram that fits their idea of a shooter they consider it a bonus.

In my own hunts for stones there has never been a lack of other resident hunters in the area. Perhaps you might want to check out the thread on the opener in the Tat and the various threads on people's hunts for stones this year. I've gotten the impression that there is a fair bit of resident pressure, in fact it sounds like lots of folks are having bad experiences because of crowds.

[stoneslinger]

That is the BC story. Crowds. Just the way it is.
You haven't lived until you have been in the company of 20 other guys all looking up at the same few sheep. Makes for a good party when the rum starts flowing!

[frenchbar]

That is the BC story. Crowds. Just the way it is.
You haven't lived until you have been in the company of 20 other guys all looking up at the same few sheep. Makes for a good party when the rum starts flowing!
:lol: and the fists start flyin:-D

[luckynuts]

Though Unfortunately many many sheep are confiscated year after year due to bad judgment. It seems one age class is hit really hard in the population. Trust me don't really want to see anything change as still trying to get my first ram but it will come to a head especially in the accessible areas like off the hiway. I would like to see a harsher penalty for shooting any illegal animal. a $350 fine is a drop in the hat for most hard core hunters.

W.


There is no conservation concern for sheep when they must already be full-curl or 8 years old. Those are very restrictive criteria, and in themselves ensure that hunters will not negatively impact over-all sheep populations.

Either a ram is legal or it isn't....nothing else needs to be added to the equation.

[Jelvis]

And the music starts playin, good old tunes

[Hunt'n Guide]

Fisher-dude seems to feel otherwise. :-? sounds like he thinks there is lots of room out there.

[Jelvis]

fd is a road hunter lol he ain't bin back there haha you got em on that one Hunt Guide lol ..

[MuleyMadness]

If your in good physical condition to climb up and way back you have a chance to see a nice sheep, otherwise no, or have a outfitter take you up into his spot. A person who can't hike good is out except in Kamloops along the roads on Red Plateau Dewdrop ..
Jel .. Is that correct or you got a better take on it mulemad lettuce hear it.

What I said Jelvis, is that it's still a very challenging hunt. It's not all about being able to climb way into the back country, it involves a lot of skills and hunting ability too...different abilities, but I wouldn't say it's easier than big Muley bucks.

[Fisher-Dude]

Fisher-dude seems to feel otherwise. :-? sounds like he thinks there is lots of room out there.

Is 710 hunters over a 2 1/2 month period on ~ 25% of the land mass of British Columbia crowded?

[stoneslinger]

Not at all. Most just happen to be fond of Drinkall's territory and tend to get warm and cozy.

[Jelvis]

A lot of that land mass is no good for hunting sheep or hunters can't get into it, so hunters tend to go where the sheep are and where they can get to.
This brings the sheep hunting areas into focus and that is where most would go.

[2SHALLOW]

Naw. The greedy guys that feel the need to shoot half a dozen rams or more should just quit. Both resident and non-resident.
I agree with you 100% how many do you need on the wall?

[Fisher-Dude]

There are 760 - 945 mule deer hunters in MU 3-28 over the whole season. Is it too crowded to hunt deer?

Comparatively, there are 710 sheep hunters in two large REGIONS. Is it too crowded to hunt sheep?

I hunted elk solo for 5 days last year, didn't see another elk hunter in the "crowded" East Kootenays until my brother came by to see how I was doing.

Maybe those like Mr Guide who think sheep hunting is too crowded should walk more or look for less popular spots.

[Deaddog]

I guess if you want to hunt opening day in the areas that are well known you will see other hunters...much like any other species... that said, I prefer to hunt sheep in early to mid sept and only once in the past ten years have we seen another hunting party, the locations we hunt include spots off the highway..., to say that there is no room out there or that spots are "hammered" is misinformed... there are only so many legal rams that are in the "highway" areas, usually after the opening they move back a range or two and are left pretty much unbothered the rest of the season except for those who are really willing to do the work... if you don't want to see the crowds , hunt later... sheep are still around and capes are much better.. DD

[willy442]

Is 710 hunters over a 2 1/2 month period on ~ 25% of the land mass of British Columbia crowded?

Very much so if they are all in10 spots. Stay on your quad on the logging roads and post about things you have some knowledge about.

[stoneslinger]

September is nice. Cool weather, no bugs, GO's usually all done except for maybe a few unfilled tags, meat keeps better, cape stays better. Did I say no bugs, opportunity for all other species on the way down the mountain. Days are shorter so you have to move faster. October can be very good but it can also be real cold, lots of snow, and frozen everything. Tracks to be seen. Days even shorter. Grizzly tend to be real hungry in October! Yup August is very crowded for Stone's. October hotspots can be busy like a small city for bighorn.

[6616]

Do you think they should go back to a one year penalty for shooting rams under the age of 8 . I think this may help the sheep population and it would ensure that annual sheep hunters would select bigger rams. The guys looking for one sheep in there life that would be happy with any full curl would not be affected by this either.
MIKE

Not if they're legal rams.

Re: crowding in sheep areas, you guys ain't seen nuttin' yet, try 4-22 or 4-23 in Sept.

[TyTy]

From my research;

Most resident hunters who hunt sheep, are/can/will over time, to be successful if put to it. and almost all guided hunts are successful seasonally.

Obviously, anyone who goes on a sheep hunt wants a trophy!!!!!!!! There are few who can acutally justify spending that amount on gas; time planning and effort spent, to call it anything other than a specialty (trophy) hunt.

My opinion: The sheep, resident to BC, are for any resident hunter who would make the effort to hunt them; for meat or trophy. Aside, the ministry may allotte the G/O tags to who live off the lands (either for meat of the supplementry $ ) to provide hunts to non-residents/ non-citzens to hunt such a sought after animal; but not to interfere with any tax-payer/hunter interests. This is the ministry's obligation to balance these interests, with the ultimate goal of having robust, heathly populations.

I do not believe sheep hunting should be a sustainunse (spelling*) hunt for F/N with the senstivitey of populations. F/N have other species to hunt for food; if they care about about the populations, they should chose to apply for certain for-set quotas, and then hunt for other animals that are available.

There are more than enough deer/ungulates in the province to provide for all that choose to hunt them.

[GoatGuy]

Seen road hunters on horses and a couple Boneheads running the skyline once in the ek other than that no resident sheep hunters in 4, 6 or 7b.

Seen plenty of guides and clients. Guess it depends on where you hunt.

Will do my best to see a resident sheep hunter this fall. To date they've been far more scarce than rams.


Just to clarify things. I guide sheep in the Yukon. I hunt as a resident in BC. So I have no vested interest in making it easier to guide in BC.

In general "bubbas" do not hunt sheep every year. Most clients are on the hunt of a lifetime. Those that do have both the cash to hunt every year and the passion to do so are uncommon. They are usually very selective in the type of animals they harvest. In my experience this type of client is happy to be in the mountains chasing rams. If they are lucky enough to find a ram that fits their idea of a shooter they consider it a bonus.

In my own hunts for stones there has never been a lack of other resident hunters in the area. Perhaps you might want to check out the thread on the opener in the Tat and the various threads on people's hunts for stones this year. I've gotten the impression that there is a fair bit of resident pressure, in fact it sounds like lots of folks are having bad experiences because of crowds.

[stoneslinger]

Region 4 can be funny. If a couple book rams get shot early lots of locals come out of the woodwork and go to the same spot. Other years there is no one around. Best to just go fishing from a tin boat and keep looking up. Guarantee you wont see any hunters. You just may see a ram that nobody has seen all season.

[6616]

Region 4 can be funny. If a couple book rams get shot early lots of locals come out of the woodwork and go to the same spot. Other years there is no one around. Best to just go fishing from a tin boat and keep looking up. Guarantee you wont see any hunters. You just may see a ram that nobody has seen all season.

Yup, there are places in 4-35, part of 4-25, and 4-01 where you can hunt sheep all season long and see no resident sheep hunters at all if you're lucky. In 4-22, 4-23, 4-02, and another part of 4-25 it's not so easy but a significant expenditure of boot leather can usually help seperate you from the crowds.. trouble is,,, it can sometimes seperate you from the sheep as well.!

[6616]

Region 4 can be funny. If a couple book rams get shot early lots of locals come out of the woodwork and go to the same spot. Other years there is no one around. Best to just go fishing from a tin boat and keep looking up. Guarantee you wont see any hunters. You just may see a ram that nobody has seen all season.

On the other hand, often the location of a book ram in Region 4 is well known before seasons even open and than these areas get pounded hard until said ram is finally shot.

[pro 111]

Despite what I've posted in the "dink rams" thread. I agreed with the old system where you sat out if you shot a legal ram less than 8 yrs old. It encouraged selectivity and thinned the crowds.
I believe that it created more pressure on the sheep. As the guys who would go every year would pick up anyone with a tag willing to come along while they were in the penalty box. This introduced more people into the mountains to hunt sheep. Now that rule has been removed and a lot of the people who went because they had a tag are now sheep hunters.
I believe in selecting an older ram , but when I first started any legal ram was good.

[325]

It seems to me that the only people that are really concerned about younger, legal rams being shot are those who already have a number of rams on their wall.

Maybe there should be a 2 Stones sheep ram lifetime limit?? That would help thin the crowds and increase the chance that a new sheep hunter encounters a legal ram??

[stoneslinger]

Some of those same people that have a number of rams on the wall don't want anyone hunting thier rams or going to thier spots ever.

[Seeadler]

It's either legal or it's not.

[bridger]

the one in three rule if you shot a young ram did not put much extra pressure on the resource as the resident harvest was reduced not increased. as for putting a limit on the number of stone sheep you can harvest in my opinion that would not help much. there are not lots of people in the province that are sucessful on a long term basis and if they are what harm do they do? the thing to keep in mind is that the Ministry of Environment sets an allowable harvest figure for stone sheep in 7b. While it is not a figure written in stone they do use it as a guideline and only when harvest levels are exceeded (rarely) by a trend do they start putting the brakes on. When this happens the brakes are applied (hopefully) to the non resident side first. Everything else is pretty much only a topic for discussion. there are not many ways that are workable to reduce resident harvest so that is why the one in three rule works well. If you shoot an old ram you are rewarded if not you sit on the sidelines. that rule and quota's are merely a harvest controls and have very little biological signifigance. As far as shooting dink rams as compared to booner's that is a personal choice and should remain so. If the moe is satisfied with the harvest levels so be it.

[lightmag]

I hope to hunt sheep in the next year or so, when i go it will be my 1st sheep hunt, and if i'm lucky enough to have an opportunity on a "legal" ram, i'm taking it!! regardless of age and it will be one of my most prized "trophy's" even if it's barley legal and a "dink" ram, to me it will be a trophy of a lifetime.

I'm not a "trophy" hunter but i do like the trophy. To me, to be in the bush and enjoying the outdoors and then to be able to harvest an animal legally is a "trophy". I don't care if i ever shoot a 300+ elk, 50 " + moose or a 170+ mulie. Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't turn them down and i would be extremely grateful, but to me any cancelled tag is a "trophy".

[bridger]

good attitude:-D

[Fisher-Dude]

Some of those same people that have a number of rams on the wall don't want anyone hunting thier rams or going to thier spots ever.

Willy442 is that person. He has bragged it up on here of shooting "many" rams, and now that he can't hike the mountains anymore, he'd like to glass rams from the highway. If he can't shoot them (or doesn't want to), there's no way in hell you should be.


I have taken my fair share of quality animals in the past (both horn and tender meat) and have no need or desire to kill anything anymore.

[stoneslinger]

Lots of those types out there. Everything is top secret. I hope that there is a high success rate for residents this season whether it be Stone's rams or huge Arrow Lakes elk.

[Jelvis]

I'm with yah on that, All hbc'er's the best in 2010 .. Tight Lines n Straight Shooting
Jelness

[willy442]

Willy442 is that person. He has bragged it up on here of shooting "many" rams, and now that he can't hike the mountains anymore, he'd like to glass rams from the highway. If he can't shoot them (or doesn't want to), there's no way in hell you should be.

FD For your information: I guided for Stone Sheep for many years, during that time I assisted both residents and non in harvesting well over 100 Rams. The year after I quit guiding it was my turn to shoot a ram. I went with 5 other resident friends on a two week hunt via horse back. During that trip I took a 43 inch book Stone Ram and assisted 3 of my friends in taking Rams over 40 inches. One of which was shot along with my Ram. That year we also took the Gold and Silver medals at FNAWS for my and my partners Ram. Beating out all guides hunting Stone Sheep. The other 2 fellows along on the trip also had a chance at Rams over 40, one of which was about 44 inches and missed.

So for your infrmation if you are going to post my name or about me please be aware of the facts or keep your mouth shut. I personnally have harvested 1 Stone Sheep and 1 Dall Ram in my life.

[Fisher-Dude]

Do I have to search up your post on here that brags it up otherwise?

[killman]

Hey guys who's "dink" is that on the new Mug?:mrgreen:

[willy442]

Do I have to search up your post on here that brags it up otherwise?

Yes please show me where I've stated that I have personnally ever shot more than one Stone Sheep :-D

[Fisher-Dude]

Interesting quote from srupp's sheep thread in August 2009:

08-14-2009, 02:33 PM
willy442 (http://www.huntingbc.ca/forum/member.php?u=1262) http://www.huntingbc.ca/forum/images/statusicon/user_offline.gif
Sheep Sheriff
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Fort St John (when not working)
Posts: 822


Re: Srupp Gets His Stone Sheep !!!!!!!
Srupp; Don't get me wrong, I congradulate you on finally taking a Ram. However I for one have taken many and have first hand knowledge of the hardships it requires to be successful many times over. I have travelled the Muskawa, Kechieka and Gattho many times and have survived. The story was great and the fact your captain was able to run the river without incident is also, but its nothing special. What is special to a sheep hunter is the actual set of horns that you took. If you are unable to post them fine, I do remember though that some else in the early stages of this thread volunteered to help and you declined it. Hence the reason for my comment on being deprived as a child. Do I need to see your photo? (no) I have many of my own and never have I complained or called out my hunting partners as you did last year, that many seem to have forgot. Have a nice day. I'll look at your ram one day when you post it maybe, but I won't buy into the Srupp BS.:razz:

ETA: link http://www.huntingbc.ca/forum/showthread.php?p=496008&highlight=congradulate#post496008

[Rubicon500]

Willy442 is that person. He has bragged it up on here of shooting "many" rams, and now that he can't hike the mountains anymore, he'd like to glass rams from the highway. If he can't shoot them (or doesn't want to), there's no way in hell you should be.

Not true there FD, Ive PM'D numerous questions to Willy and hes been more than willing to help a guy out. You argue with him all the time, it doesnt mean hes a selfish dink.

[700bdl]

BC's game management is not to be designed to grow trophy animals for GOABC to sell to rich foreigners.


No but it should be.

[Fisher-Dude]

No but it should be.

Huh? Care to explain, using science and the North American Conservation Model?

[BCRiverBoater]

I personally do not recall Willy ever claiming to shoot a lot of rams. He has shot one heck of a ram and guided many others. I know he makes mention to taking rams but he never said he pulled the trigger. Guiding hunters to rams is often mentioned by many guides as taking rams or getting rams.

Willy is very opinionated when it comes to sheep hunting but I would have to say I agree with him all the way on this one.

[willy442]

I'm waiting!!!!!!!!!!

[willy442]

Interesting quote from srupp's sheep thread in August 2009:

08-14-2009, 02:33 PM
willy442 (http://www.huntingbc.ca/forum/member.php?u=1262) http://www.huntingbc.ca/forum/images/statusicon/user_offline.gif
Sheep Sheriff
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Fort St John (when not working)
Posts: 822


Re: Srupp Gets His Stone Sheep !!!!!!!
Srupp; Don't get me wrong, I congradulate you on finally taking a Ram. However I for one have taken many and have first hand knowledge of the hardships it requires to be successful many times over. I have travelled the Muskawa, Kechieka and Gattho many times and have survived. The story was great and the fact your captain was able to run the river without incident is also, but its nothing special. What is special to a sheep hunter is the actual set of horns that you took. If you are unable to post them fine, I do remember though that some else in the early stages of this thread volunteered to help and you declined it. Hence the reason for my comment on being deprived as a child. Do I need to see your photo? (no) I have many of my own and never have I complained or called out my hunting partners as you did last year, that many seem to have forgot. Have a nice day. I'll look at your ram one day when you post it maybe, but I won't buy into the Srupp BS.:razz:

ETA: link http://www.huntingbc.ca/forum/showthread.php?p=496008&highlight=congradulate#post496008

Yes that is correct I have taken many. All for clients of which I could have shot everyone of them. However I see no need why after all the game I harvested through my guiding career that I need more than 1 of any species, except for moose,deer and elk. (table fare) Also the last shot fired through my rifle at an animal was my 200+ point white tail harvested in 2001. So for your info again I have shot 1 Stone Sheep and will never shoot another.

[Jelvis]

I believe willy also he said he seen hundreds and I believe it .. he guided so he seen em get taken etc. Lot of sheep experience there. Said he got two.
Jel .. it's in the posts ..

[Fisher-Dude]

Willy is very opinionated when it comes to sheep hunting but I would have to say I agree with him all the way on this one.

Because, simply, you have your own rams on the wall. 'nuff said.

[willy442]

Because, simply, you have your own rams on the wall. 'nuff said.

As a matter of fact you are wrong again. Both of my sheep are in Greg Rhyasons climate controlled trophy room, where they are kept under absolutely perfect humidity and temperature. My Stone is a life size mount and stands on the floor, my dall is on the wall. My mule deer which is Dana class for your info and my white tail are at my sons.

[Fisher-Dude]

As a matter of fact you are wrong again. Both of my sheep are in Greg Rhyasons climate controlled trophy room, where they are kept under absolutely perfect humidity and temperature. My Stone is a life size mount and stands on the floor, my dall is on the wall. My mule deer which is Dana class for your info and my white tail are at my sons.

What made you think I was talking to you when I quoted BCRiverBoater? Vanity overtaking your eyes again?

[willy442]

What made you think I was talking to you when I quoted BCRiverBoater? Vanity overtaking your eyes again?

You have a habit of flapping your gums in relation to me so I guess I jumped the gun. Have a nice evening.

[stoneslinger]

Well I can tell you that my Stone's ram is dinkish. One day I may get a big, old one that is standing on the doorsteps of heaven.

[sawmill]

Sheep hunters:roll:

[bridger]

Sheep hunters:roll:


are great guys!!

[dana]

I love threads where Willy chimes in. Makes for some great readin'. Those who get their panties all bunched up in knots don't even have a clue that they are being played big time. Willy must just kick back laughin his ass off to see the fools that jump in to call him out. Willy is my vote for HBC hall of fame.

[luckynuts]

I love these threads!!!:-D

if you wade through all the bullsh!t there is some good reading:-D

W.