DFO hate for divers?

[Amphibious]

Area 13


These waters are closed to the harvest of all marine life by divers for the preservation of unique underwater habitat: Discovery Passage, in the Campbell River area, bounded by a straight line from North Bluff on Quadra Island, across Seymour Narrows to a fishing boundary sign on Vancouver Island, and south by a line from the light on the end of the south Government Dock breakwater at Campbell River to Cape Mudge lighthouse.


Area 24


Pacific Rim National Park Reserve
Portions of Areas 20-24, 121, 123 and 124: All tidal waters within the park are closed to scuba and skin diving for all species, all year.



so it's legal for the rod and reel guys, but not divers... WTF?

time for some grumpy phone calls.....

[pnbrock]

if these are rockfish conservation ares they are off limits to all fishing.

[Amphibious]

if these are rockfish conservation ares they are off limits to all fishing.


read the quotes. they are diver specific.


so what are they really protecting? rod and reel guys catch and release how many rockfish for every ling/halibut they catch? a dozen? more?

from the DFO website:


Note:
Most rockfish will not survive catch and release. The pressure difference between the surface and depths they inhabit will inflate the swim bladder to the point where it will push the fish’s stomach out its mouth, thereby killing the fish.

[The Watcher]

What is the purpose of the regulation?
To protect finfish, or is it more likely in place to protect mollusks, urchins, etc?
Also, is it legal to harvest finfish with a spear gun, and, if so, what species and when?
What you've presented is a glimpse of a bigger picture.
I'd like to see the whole thing.

[Gateholio]

Spearfishing should be banned, anyway.

[Hilgy]

Spearfishing should be banned, anyway.

Why????

Just wondering what your reasoning behind a ban would be. I ve done it a few times in the Bahamas and it was quite fun.



Hilgy

[Amphibious]

Spearfishing should be banned, anyway.

yes, because it's a purely selective, by-catch free form of harvest?

or because joe fat-ass boat fisherman doesn't have the physical ability or can't be bothered to put the effort in to do it?

get off the sauce.



as for what spearfishermen can take, look at your regs. we can;'t touch salmon or trout. only Cod, Lingcod, Greenling, Halibut and other flatfish. we can take some crabs and shellfish, but not all.

these closures in the original post make absolutely no sense, and further restrict the spearfishermen with out a boat, we have very little access now to any legal place to practice our sport. especially with Reg 12 being closed to all groundfish...

[SHACK]

for the preservation of unique underwater habitat

Your question is answered in the regulation, I dont get it, whats so hard to understand? Its not worded "for the protection of unique underwater species", that would be a bit more specific and probably be a good reason to keep anglers out, maybe they actually are worried about the habitat that may be disrupted by divers harvesting marine life from the sea floor and such, not from a hook and line?

[The Watcher]

http://www.pac.dfo-mpo.gc.ca/fm-gp/maps-cartes/rca-acs/permitted-permis-eng.htm

Looks like all rockfish are off limits to all fishermen for conservation reasons.
I don't have a problem with that and yes, I'm a diver as well.
Funny that trawlers for scallops are allowed. That don't seem right.

[Amphibious]

for the preservation of unique underwater habitat

Your question is answered in the regulation, I dont get it, whats so hard to understand? Its not worded "for the protection of unique underwater species", that would be a bit more specific and probably be a good reason to keep anglers out, maybe they actually are worried about the habitat that may be disrupted by divers harvesting marine life from the sea floor and such, not from a hook and line?


Diving activities are still legal in these areas. Spearfishing causes no more "harm" to the environment then normal diving activities, or standard line fishing.

[Amphibious]

http://www.pac.dfo-mpo.gc.ca/fm-gp/maps-cartes/rca-acs/permitted-permis-eng.htm

Looks like all rockfish are off limits to all fishermen for conservation reasons.
I don't have a problem with that and yes, I'm a diver as well.
Funny that trawlers for scallops are allowed. That don't seem right.


the two closures mentioned are diving specific, they are not rockfish closures.

[The Watcher]

Spearfishing should be banned, anyway.


Read point 8 on this list:

http://www.pac.dfo-mpo.gc.ca/fm-gp/rec/law-loi/restrictions-eng.htm


Now read point 6 on this list:

http://www.huntingbc.ca/forum/announcement.php?f=31


Things that make ya go "Hmmmmmm" ;-)

[The Watcher]

the two closures mentioned are diving specific, they are not rockfish closures.


Where's the link?

[Amphibious]

http://www.pac.dfo-mpo.gc.ca/fm-gp/rec/tidal-maree/a-s13-eng.htm

http://www.pac.dfo-mpo.gc.ca/fm-gp/rec/tidal-maree/a-s24-eng.htm

they are clearly targeting divers.

[The Watcher]

Look at this while I look at those.
http://www.pac.dfo-mpo.gc.ca/fm-gp/maps-cartes/rca-acs/areas-secteurs/13-eng.htm
I don't know the area that well, so i'm trying to see if anything lines up. I agree it's BS if angling is OK and diving isn't but I'd like to have all the facts first, ya know?

[PGK]

I believe it's over concerns around bull kelp. Stop complaining and go kill mo capr!

[Amphibious]

I believe it's over concerns around bull kelp. Stop complaining and go kill mo capr!


Carp will be destroyed in record numbers come summer, you can count on that. care to expand on the bull kelp issue? we don't hurt a strand of it while spearfishing, hell, I use it to anchor my kayak.

and while your at it, bitchslap the folks that put Bass, Pike, and Perch on the gamefish list in southern BC. sellouts...

right now, If I want to go spearfishing next week, I can go to the Queen Charlotte's, in and around tofino harbor or Winter Harbor. not much left for the shore diver...

[Sitkaspruce]

I am trying to remember tha last time I caught an urchin, box crab, abalone, scallop, or other form of bivalve while trolling or jigging for fish.:mrgreen:

Maybe the closure is to protect the sea bed from the rape and pillage of the old. I know the CR used to be hammered by divers, just the same as the bottom of Denman and Hornby. I used to check a lot of divers who were coming in with over limits of scallops and such. Maybe just like the RCA, these are areas to be protected from divers.

Give the local office a call and ask the reason for the closure. And ask for someone who has been there for a while and might actually know.

Cheers

SS

[Gateholio]

Why????

y

Mostly because Amphibious enjoys it.

[Amphibious]

I am trying to remember tha last time I caught an urchin, box crab, abalone, scallop, or other form of bivalve while trolling or jigging for fish.:mrgreen:

Maybe the closure is to protect the sea bed from the rape and pillage of the old. I know the CR used to be hammered by divers, just the same as the bottom of Denman and Hornby. I used to check a lot of divers who were coming in with over limits of scallops and such. Maybe just like the RCA, these are areas to be protected from divers.

Give the local office a call and ask the reason for the closure. And ask for someone who has been there for a while and might actually know.

Cheers

SS

yup, with that line of thinking better close everything to fishing completely, or are other forms of fishing free from those that take over their limits....

[Sitkaspruce]

yup, with that line of thinking better close everything to fishing completely, or are other forms of fishing free from those that take over their limits....

Not sure where that comment is coming from.......:confused:

I am not pointing fingers, just looking at it from a different point of view.

Divers are a lot harder to check that fishers, and they were no different that any other fisher, a few broke the law, but most didn't. But since most speicies they target are NOT migratory, they can be subject to over harvest. Same as RCA's. And that is, IMO, the reasons they are closed.

Phone and maybe you will be satisfied with the answer. DFO will be the only ones who can answer your question.

Cheers

SS

[303Brit]

It's closed there becuase thats where the biggest box crab in the planet are. along with rockbay marine reserve.

303

[Amphibious]

Sorry Sitka, thought your post meant something else. pretty grumpy at the moment.

there is a group of us that plan our entire year around spearfishing trips to the island. we're all freedivers (no tanks) and spend a week at a time camping out and cooking our catch. every time we go there are more closures, less fish, and more and more hate from the line-fishing guys on the dock. a few of us even bought sit-on-top kayaks so we could explore a little further out, but now even that's bunk with the campbell river and reg 12 closures. shore access is at a premium on the island as you know. if these closures are to protect bivalve numbers, why aren't they closing it to groudfish as well? and then why only to diver harvest? I'd image harvest by divers is a drop in the bucket to the ling/rockfish harvest by traditional fishing methods. doesn't make a lot of sense to me. some phone calls next week for sure.

it's getting just about impossible to be a spearfishermen in canada. for someone like me that has been doing it as his prime pastime for almost 20yrs, it's extremely disappointing.

[The Watcher]

Maybe the closure is to protect the sea bed from the rape and pillage of the old.


http://www.pac.dfo-mpo.gc.ca/fm-gp/maps-cartes/rca-acs/permitted-permis-eng.htm



The phrase "scallops by trawl" really caught my attention. After reading a bunch of this site (above link) I don't think you have a valid point, sorry.

[luckynuts]

Getting right off Topic here........ Was down on the island just after Christmas and had read in the times that a diver was pulled down to his death from a humbolt squid off of Nanimo :eek:. This thread just made me remember so my question to you divers are you seeing any Did you read the article???? Supposedly they are really increasing in numbers and are very aggressive. No I ain't smoking anything I really did read it in the Times.:mrgreen:

W.

[Sitkaspruce]

http://www.pac.dfo-mpo.gc.ca/fm-gp/maps-cartes/rca-acs/permitted-permis-eng.htm



The phrase "scallops by trawl" really caught my attention. After reading a bunch of this site (above link) I don't think you have a valid point, sorry.

Was not trying to point out one from the other. I was simple stating what I used to see when there was a lot of divers in CR, Comox valley, Powell River and Nanaimo. For the small areas that diver can access for bivalves, I have seen the "Rape and Pilage". Divers with 30-40 lbs of scallops for each diver and three divers in one boat. Divers with $10000 worth of Abalone in one night dive. Lots of other things as well.

Yes divers, at a whole, do not damage the seabottom as much as trawlers do, but when you concentrate divers in a small area, the damage to certain species can be bad.

As for the difference between hook and line a spear fishers. The one advantage to spearfishers is that they can (and have seen in many times) go out and target the large ones. Yes it is a selective fishery if you are a conservative person, but most guys I know target the big female lings because of the bragging rights and better bang for their buck. Not all, but I would say the majority do. Same as Box crabs and Wolf Eel. Catching a big female ling is a lot harder with hook and line than with a spear, if you are in the same place.

Cheers

SS

[Amphibious]

Getting right off Topic here........ Was down on the island just after Christmas and had read in the times that a diver was pulled down to his death from a humbolt squid off of Nanimo :eek:. This thread just made me remember so my question to you divers are you seeing any Did you read the article???? Supposedly they are really increasing in numbers and are very aggressive. No I ain't smoking anything I really did read it in the Times.:mrgreen:

W.


the humbolts are pushing farther north, and have killed a few fishermen in socal/mx. from what I understand this story about the nanaimo diver is false.

[GoatGuy]

or because joe fat-ass boat fisherman doesn't have the physical ability or can't be bothered to put the effort in to do it?

get off the sauce.

I think you should mail this to DFO.

[GoatGuy]

Getting right off Topic here........ Was down on the island just after Christmas and had read in the times that a diver was pulled down to his death from a humbolt squid off of Nanimo :eek:. This thread just made me remember so my question to you divers are you seeing any Did you read the article???? Supposedly they are really increasing in numbers and are very aggressive. No I ain't smoking anything I really did read it in the Times.:mrgreen:

W.

The times communist?

[luckynuts]

The times communist?

Yep you are right.. glad I left the shit hole though really miss the fishing:twisted:

[Amphibious]

As for the difference between hook and line a spear fishers. The one advantage to spearfishers is that they can (and have seen in many times) go out and target the large ones. Yes it is a selective fishery if you are a conservative person, but most guys I know target the big female lings because of the bragging rights and better bang for their buck. Not all, but I would say the majority do. Same as Box crabs and Wolf Eel. Catching a big female ling is a lot harder with hook and line than with a spear, if you are in the same place.

Cheers

SS

as far as I know wolf eels are off the list everywhere in BC. lets not bring poaching into this, as every group poaches. or is the DFO using these blanket anti-diving closures to cover their inadequate enforcement?

can be selective, yes. but they also are very limited in depth & time compared to their rod and reel counterparts. especially those that choose to spearfish on a breath hold. I didn't even find one legal ling in over 30 days of freedive-spearfishing last year. yes it was a slow year. if they're worried about bi-valves, close bivalves, lings, close lings. these blanket closures just punish the majority of honest divers.

[wolverine]

Well, speaking as a diver I can see the reasoning behind the closure. It looks to me like they are trying to restore and preserve the area so there is some sea life left to look at when you do go diving. I have seen the coastal waters of B.C. go from what could only be described as a diver's paradise to something that resembles an underwater desert. While I understand that spear fishing is very selective it is also invasive. I can take a ling with a spear even when it won't bite on a jig. That said, I think it should also be shut off to regular fishing though too as I have seen people kill more fish dragging them up and trying to chuck them back in than a law bidding diver. Diving never used to be as popular as it is now and there are now so many divers that it has taken it's toll because it's not really like any other kind of fishing. Rarely did we ever get skunked. I am now to the point where I'd rather just look at them than spear them anyway.

[Amphibious]

get rid of the tanks, you won't find it boring anymore ;)

[Ozone]

Area 13

The law was brought forward by the local dive club many years ago and has been in place ever since. The reason is that we saw what we can do to a concentrated area and would rather have a area preserved, kinda like a park. There is lots and lots of diving to be had in spots other than these ones.

As for the not enough access, I recomend a backroad mapbook.

[Amphibious]

. There is lots and lots of diving to be had in spots other than these ones.

find me some. with shore access. I'm waiting eagerly.

[stitch]

Spearfishing should be banned, anyway.

Why banned? Its like hunting with a string attached to the bullet:mrgreen:

[Ozone]

Once I get it for you, should I cook it and cut it into bight size pieces also. Its kinda like road hunters saying there is no deer becouse they cant see any, sometimes you gotta put in a bit of work. You can also do alot of exploreing with a canoe also, since you have no gear.

[Sitkaspruce]

as far as I know wolf eels are off the list everywhere in BC. lets not bring poaching into this, as every group poaches. or is the DFO using these blanket anti-diving closures to cover their inadequate enforcement?

can be selective, yes. but they also are very limited in depth & time compared to their rod and reel counterparts. especially those that choose to spearfish on a breath hold. I didn't even find one legal ling in over 30 days of freedive-spearfishing last year. yes it was a slow year. if they're worried about bi-valves, close bivalves, lings, close lings. these blanket closures just punish the majority of honest divers.

I some ways yes, it might be easier because of enforcement. Remember, most diving occurs in the winter months, for reason you already know. To get the most bang for their buck so to speak, water patrols are not that good in the winter. And if you say most are honest, then it can be a waste of the district offices limited resourses to go out and look for divers. Been there, done that.:cry: Easier to close it down like what is explained below. Blanket closures for either divers or hook and line hurt all except the fish.(and poachers!!!)

Again not against divers, but your question could be easily answered with a phone call instead of getting speculative answers on here.:wink:


Area 13

The law was brought forward by the local dive club many years ago and has been in place ever since. The reason is that we saw what we can do to a concentrated area and would rather have a area preserved, kinda like a park. There is lots and lots of diving to be had in spots other than these ones.

As for the not enough access, I recomend a backroad mapbook.

There you go, your area 12 is answered.

As for areas on the the Island. Do you have a boat?? If so there is lots of great diving here on the North island. Gods Pocket is but one of a lot of areas to dive up here.

I can ask the local dive shop about areas if you want.

Cheers

SS

[The Watcher]

Again not against divers, but your question could be easily answered with a phone call instead of getting speculative answers on here.:wink:
SS

Amen to that, Brother.

[Amphibious]

There you go, your area 12 is answered.

As for areas on the the Island. Do you have a boat?? If so there is lots of great diving here on the North island. Gods Pocket is but one of a lot of areas to dive up here.

I can ask the local dive shop about areas if you want.

Cheers

SS

I've been diving all over the Georgia and Queen Charlotte straits. gods pocket is nice, so is the browning wall, but again, this thread is about spearfishing. both of those areas are closed, as should be, they are parks. no i don't have a boat, yet. local dive shops are almost entirely anti spearfishing. many don't like freedivers much either (they don't make any money off them). priobably have 200ish days diving on the north island, great area, my preferred hunting grounds. called today and got a hand off to a voice mail box, left a polite message.


Its kinda like road hunters saying there is no deer becouse they cant see any, sometimes you gotta put in a bit of work. You can also do alot of exploreing with a canoe also, since you have no gear.

as for exploring in a canoe. ever tried to fight a tide in a canoe? I don't want to see japan that bad. freediving is not like scuba, we can't use drysuits. so after about an hour to hour in a half we need to get out and reheat, as we're usually chilled to the point neurological symptoms are starting to show. this means a protected shoreline or a warm boat.

it's nothing like road hunting. it's like me telling you you have to use a floatplane to go hunting, that you can't use road access anymore.

[Fisher-Dude]

find me some. with shore access. I'm waiting eagerly.

All this coming from the same guy who was throwing a hissy-fit when we suggested opening certain roads so that hunters could access some areas. Yeah, only when it's good for you...

[Ozone]

as for exploring in a canoe.

Yes, it quite easy,you go to the shallows and paddle. Oh and its current you are thinking about not tide.You also can do the same with a rowboat and I am guessing you wouldnt be diving with a large current anyways.

[GoatGuy]

find me some. with shore access. I'm waiting eagerly.

If you're free diving just flipper your ass further out into the ocean.


Couldn't resist.......

[Amphibious]

All this coming from the same guy who was throwing a hissy-fit when we suggested opening certain roads so that hunters could access some areas. Yeah, only when it's good for you...

honestly, did I **** your wife? what is your problem? it's not about opening new areas, it's about closing old ones. and the first time I get to use my ignore list. hurrah!


Yes, it quite easy,you go to the shallows and paddle. Oh and its current you are thinking about not tide.You also can do the same with a rowboat and I am guessing you wouldnt be diving with a large current anyways.


Current is where the fish are, the current is caused by tides.


If you're free diving just flipper your ass further out into the ocean.

Couldn't resist.......

we do long surface swims. but when you 40mins of your 80min dive is spent swimming on the surface, it's not much fun now is it! kayak helps with that, but sit on tops are pretty slow and not designed for much current.

[GoatGuy]

we do long surface swims. but when you 40mins of your 80min dive is spent swimming on the surface, it's not much fun now is it! kayak helps with that, but sit on tops are pretty slow and not designed for much current.

Go for 160 minute dives, then you'll get two hours of diving in! :wink:

[ElkMasterC]

honestly, did I **** your wife? what is your problem? it's not about opening new areas, it's about closing old ones. and the first time I get to use my ignore list. hurrah!

Feels gooood doesn't it?
Enjoy the smoooth ignoring pleasure.

[Amphibious]

Go for 160 minute dives, then you'll get two hours of diving in! :wink:


after 90mins in 46F water I can barely form sentences :)

[GoatGuy]

after 90mins in 46F water I can barely form sentences :)

Do you call the fish in? Are you the fish whisperer?

[The Hermit]

One of the most fun and terrifying two minutes of my life... speared a too big Halli that dragged me all over the bottom of the ocean really fast!!! I just wasn't about to let go of my expensive spear gun! LOL

Another time a pod of transient orcas came to visit while my buddy and I had full goodie bags! I doubt my eyes have ever been bigger!!!

Spear fishing is awesome! Just got to regulate the annual catch and seasons! Although, I must admit spear fishing while scuba diving is very easy and the ling cod population did suffer for it. That being said I don't agree with the idea that divers prefer the big females for bragging rights... they taste like slimy smelly bleck... the nice five pound young ones are WAY better!

[Ozone]

Maybe you could get your mom to give you a ride. Along the way maybe she could explain how tides and currents work.

Does she also give you a ride to go bow hunting, after which you cry in her lap becouse a kid shot a deer with a rifle 5 miles away?

Like I said earlier, get a backroads mapbook, do some research and quit your bitching. Its not like they are new rules.

[Sitkaspruce]

That being said I don't agree with the idea that divers prefer the big females for bragging rights... they taste like slimy smelly bleck... the nice five pound young ones are WAY better!

I agree, but just like big hali's, springs or deer, big lings are not being shot for the food. And as you say, spearfishing for lings is pretty easy.

Seen lots of huge 40+lbs lings come up from divers. And even a few won lots of beer that night.:-D:wink:

FD, I enjoy most of your posts and even laugh at a lot of them, but what was posted here was just wrong. It was a discussion that was not going sideways and did not need BS posts about the past to make it a friggin gong show. Sometimes it is better not be heard and just watch.......

Cheers

SS

[Amphibious]

Along the way maybe she could explain how tides and currents work.


explain to me how these magic "currents" work without tidal variances? educate me please, I yearn to learn ;)

or are all the currents in BC Tidal waters based on coriolis effect or seiches? ;)


Do you call the fish in? Are you the fish whisperer?

why yes... I am. I also dress up like a giant spider and fight crime after dark...

[Ozone]

[quote=Amphibious;617827]explain to me how these magic "currents" work without tidal variances? educate me please, I yearn to learn ;)

or are all the currents in BC Tidal waters based on coriolis effect or seiches? ;)
quote]

Please dont try to impress the crowds with you magic words, it make you look like a ass.

I was hoping your mom could explian the fact that there is a thing called slack water.

[ElkMasterC]

Spearfishing should be banned, anyway.


Read point 8 on this list:

http://www.pac.dfo-mpo.gc.ca/fm-gp/rec/law-loi/restrictions-eng.htm


Now read point 6 on this list:

http://www.huntingbc.ca/forum/announcement.php?f=31


Things that make ya go "Hmmmmmm" ;-)


***** Owned again.

http://www.forumammo.com/cpg/albums/userpics/10062/BigLabowski.gif (http://www.forumammo.com/cpg/albums/userpics/10062/BigLabowski.gif)

[slayer B]

Spearfishing should be banned, anyway.
OUCH why would you want to ban spearfishing.To selectively harvest your target without driving a hook through its face and dragging it all over hells half acre before getting it to the surface just to say "Nah too small or we can get a better one" and throwing it back, isn't such a bad thing. What is next bow hunting? I would love to know the reasoning behind this opinion of yours and why you would suggest the banning of a responsible method of fishing (or hunting depending on how you look at it) that has a lower environmental impact than the usual varieties of harvest. (PS just for the record I am an avid fisherman and have nothing against anyone driving a hook through Mr. Fishface as long as its done responsibly.)