What breed hunting dog?

[CanadanHirvi]

I've been thinking about getting a hunting dog. I'm quite interested in Viszlas, but I wonder if these dogs can handle cold winters? Also, do people use them in big game hunting?
I think in Ontario you are allowed to hunt deer/moose with dogs. What breed do people use for hunting big game?

[dutchie]

Hungarian Vizslas are really cool dogs, and are great pointers. But big game hunting and duck hunting is not their forte.

Check out the Deustch Kurzhaar and the Deustch Drahthaar. Zacomb and Buck both have Drahthaars and I have a Kurzhaar and Angel will soon be the pround owner of a Kurzhaar.

My pup tracked a deer for me this year at 8months old, was pointing and retrieving grouse at 6-7 months old (not perfect but he was learning) and has been retriving ducks for me all waterfowling season for us.

I also had my dog on a few big hikes this year in the snow and it was about -13 and he was fine without a aditional coat. I did have to put bees wax on his feet tho, because he does not have the extra hair inbetween his paws.

Here is the Kurzhaar site in North America
http://nadkc.org/

Here is the Canada site to the Drahthaar
http://www.vdd-canada.ca

If you are thinking about getting a dog for all around hunting, these, in my opinion are your ONLY 2 options... But I am biased because I know they can do over every other breed.

If you are big game hunting with a dog, then you have to have the dog on a leash at all times, even while blood tracking. (other then bear and cougar)

Hope this helps.

Dutchie

[digger dogger]

if you're gonna hunt big game with dogs, they have to be leashed. i've also heard if you have complete control of your dog they won't bother you about not being leashed ( depends on the c.o's mood that day probably).. there is a little info on dogs on pg 17 of the regs.. i've met a guy that hunts sheep with his lab x sheperd, super smart and loyal dog.

[LOC]

I'd second Dutchie's picks for breeds. I don't have a DK, but the north american version - GSP.

They're great dogs! Mine isn't that fond of the cold though, get below -5ish and while he doesn't slow down he does start to shake. If he's not moving around much I do put a jacket on him (yes I know, I know...).

G'luck!

[BearStump]

there's some cool vid's on youtube of the norwiegan elkhounds chasing game. Those dogs are absolutely fearless, my old man used to have a couple.

[CanadanHirvi]

Thanks Dutchie and others. Checked out those links. These dogs look very similar to German pointers, short and wire haired.
Yeah, I was thinking if there were elk hound type dogs here. I know in Finland they also hunt moose with them, (there are a couple of different breeds, but have never seen similar here) but they are not leashed. I gotta check Ontario regs if they have to be leashed there too, in case I end up moving there.
But yea, I would like a dog to point and also find big game, so I'll look more into those breeds you guys brought up.

[dutchie]

Thanks Dutchie and others. Checked out those links. These dogs look very similar to German pointers, short and wire haired.
Yeah, I was thinking if there were elk hound type dogs here. I know in Finland they also hunt moose with them, (there are a couple of different breeds, but have never seen similar here) but they are not leashed. I gotta check Ontario regs if they have to be leashed there too, in case I end up moving there.
But yea, I would like a dog to point and also find big game, so I'll look more into those breeds you guys brought up.

The DK and The DD are the root dogs that come from Germany but they are very different from the GSP and the GWP.

A major difference is the majority of GSP's/GWP's do not like the water... DD's and DK can't get enough of the water.

The energy levels are much lower with DD and DK, and the abilities of the DD and DK are bred into and tested to ensure breed standards are met.

There is also very strict breeding regulations so you will not find any HD, eye problems, elbow problems etc...

But I regress.. If you want any more info then fire me a PM.

Dutchie

[LOC]

The DK and The DD are the root dogs that come from Germany but they are very different from the GSP and the GWP.

A major difference is the majority of GSP's/GWP's do not like the water... DD's and DK can't get enough of the water.



True, my guy (a GSP) wouldn't go past his 'knees' in the water till after 2y, and even now still doesn't really like to swim.

If you are going for a GS/WP look for a breeder that deals with NAVHDA standards and not CKC 'Field testing'

Do your research and find a breed/breeder that has what your looking for in a dog. Talk to people that own the breed, and get out to see the parents if you can.

G'luck!

[Angel]

DK all the way mine is coming in April:mrgreen:.......

[CanadanHirvi]

Thanks again for the clarification. How much do these dogs usually sell for?

[dutchie]

Thanks again for the clarification. How much do these dogs usually sell for?

For a papered dog in the DKV you will be looking in the ball park of $800-$1000 for a DK.

If you are interested let me know, The breeder that I got my dog from will talk to you and assess the needs of you and your hunting endevours and if his dogs will not work for you (and he is honost) he will put you in touch with other breeders. (in the NADKC they work together to get the best dog in you hands and it is not there dogs 40% of the time)

Dutchie

[CanadanHirvi]

For a papered dog in the DKV you will be looking in the ball park of $800-$1000 for a DK.

If you are interested let me know, The breeder that I got my dog from will talk to you and assess the needs of you and your hunting endevours and if his dogs will not work for you (and he is honost) he will put you in touch with other breeders. (in the NADKC they work together to get the best dog in you hands and it is not there dogs 40% of the time)

Dutchie

Thanks dutchie. I might just take you up on that in the summer. Gotta figure out few things by then. Basically I haven't got a dog yet because haven't felt good about getting one and not having enough time to spend with it because of work etc.

[levind]

i'm looking to get the pudelpointer hopefully this year seams like a great all around hunting dog also.

[Angel]

Well I have to say that over the last year we ha r done a ton of research into the right dog for us, as a pup and a adult dog. The DK's natural ability and what they are bred to do is exactly the kind of all purpose dog. Everyone has there own opinions but it's hard to compete with the German testing system. As well a dog that will blood track, retrieve and point is pretty solid. The key for me with these dogs was actually seeing them first had as a pup and as a young adult and watching them work. The natural ability that they show at 8-15weeks is pretty awsome. Plus the low shedding is a huge bonus!

I think it's well worth the read to look through NADKC and German System. Again eveyone has there personal opinions on dogs and what suits there needs.

[Kasomor]

Everyone has there own opinions but it's hard to compete with the German testing system. As well a dog that will blood track, retrieve and point is pretty solid. The key for me with these dogs was actually seeing them first had as a pup and as a young adult and watching them work. The natural ability that they show at 8-15weeks is pretty awsome. Plus the low shedding is a huge bonus!

I think it's well worth the read to look through NADKC and German System. Again eveyone has there personal opinions on dogs and what suits there needs.

Is there tests held in B.C. that use the German testing system?
I want to go watch sporting dog events, besides what the retrievers do. There will be a CKC pointing/ setter test in the Lower Mainland in July. I have seen folks riding to hounds out in Agassiz and it was really cool!

Any info on places and dates would be appreciated.

Kasomor

[Buck]

There may be a German test in Alberta (VJP) this spring if not they will be in Washington or Idaho.I will get the dates .If you are considering a versatile dog this are great events to attend .

[riflebuilder]

my GWP is nuts about water I can't keep her out of it.

[birddogs]

there is also the wirehair visla,,very good dogs.

[mijinkal]

I'm on the fence between a DK, GSP and a Weimaraner. I like both breeds but my wife is a fan of the Weim's.
I've found a breeder in BC that breeds Weimaraners for hunting. They seem to be fairly similar to the GSP, DK, but haven't been bred as strictly as the DK's or for as long.
I'm not looking for just a hunting dog, but a great family companion as well. Both breeds will do the job just fine and it all depends on how much time and effort you want to put into training.

[Angel]

I'm on the fence between a DK, GSP and a Weimaraner. I like both breeds but my wife is a fan of the Weim's.
I've found a breeder in BC that breeds Weimaraners for hunting. They seem to be fairly similar to the GSP, DK, but haven't been bred as strictly as the DK's or for as long.
I'm not looking for just a hunting dog, but a great family companion as well. Both breeds will do the job just fine and it all depends on how much time and effort you want to put into training.

Again I would highly recommend the DK. I have done alot of research into the breed as well as the GSP's and I wouldnt think twice about getting a DK. I can recommend good breeders if you are more interested in a family pet. The versatility with the DK is much more desirable then the Weims IMO. You will get a great hunting partner that can retrieve, point and blood track, as well they are breed to be hot in the field and calm at home. The toughest part is that there aren t local breeders and you will most likely be ordering your dog from the US. All dogs are great tho and good luck with your choice my DK is coming in April so im super pumped!

[LOC]

When we were looking at breeds we also looked closely at the Weimaraner. The biggest issue we found is that they tend to be very 'needy' and can suffer from seperation issues if left alone alot.

One of the breeders we spoke with wouldn't sell their dog's to a house that would leave the dog alone for more than 4 hours a day...

Maybe it's not all of them, but all the owners and breeders I spoke with seemed to make it out that way...

Our guy (gsp) is home alone 6-8 hours during the work week, and while he's always happy to see us when we get back home, we've never had a complaint from the other units about him.
Also has no problem being left in the truck for long periods as long as the weather is not too hot.

[mijinkal]

Thanks LOC, I have read a lot about Weimaraners suffering from separation anxiety and it is a factor that I will definitely be looking into further.
We have busy lives and the dog will be at home alone for 6-8 hours a day. Although it will have 10 acres to play on and a few other dogs on the property to play with.
I'd also like to look into the possibility of getting some avalanche recovery training for the dog as I am frequently in the backcountry snowboarding. Just a thought right now though.

[Elkhound]

there's some cool vid's on youtube of the norwiegan elkhounds chasing game. Those dogs are absolutely fearless, my old man used to have a couple.


Only used mine for bears but he was awesome.

[Elkhound]

i'm looking to get the pudelpointer hopefully this year seams like a great all around hunting dog also.

One of my best hunting buds has one of these....he loves him. Great bird dog.

[levind]

hey elkhound do you know which breeder he got the pudelpointer from?

[Elkhound]

If I recall correctly he went to the states to pick him up....I can get the info if you like. Just send me a pm.

[garyp]

I have owned and operated 5 German Short Hair Pointers over the past 20 years. I have never had one that didn't love the water. Most GSP's actually have webbed feet which helps in the water.

The Kurzhaar is simply a GSP, it is not a separate breed. Kurzhaar translates literally into "short hair."

Unfortunately a lot of the North American Breeders have lost the German imperative of "form and function" It appears what is being descibed in the quote as a Kurzhaar is simply a well bred and tested GSP following German tradition.

My best hunter was actually a "show dog" who displayed very little ability until she saw her first pheasant.


The DK and The DD are the root dogs that come from Germany but they are very different from the GSP and the GWP.

A major difference is the majority of GSP's/GWP's do not like the water... DD's and DK can't get enough of the water.

The energy levels are much lower with DD and DK, and the abilities of the DD and DK are bred into and tested to ensure breed standards are met.

There is also very strict breeding regulations so you will not find any HD, eye problems, elbow problems etc...

But I regress.. If you want any more info then fire me a PM.

Dutchie

[Buck]

[QUOTE][/
The Breed Tests (VJP and HZP) that occur a year after the puppy is born evaluate the natural abilities of the young puppy with regard to hunting and breeding potential. This provides feedback to the breeder on the success of his breeding. It is also one of the measures used by the Breed Warden to decide whether this dog can ultimately be certified for breeding. From the handler's point of view the test provides a structure and a goal to work toward for training the puppy for its responsibilities as a hunting companion.
QUOTE]

There will be a VJP in Alberta May 29 and 30.Location to be announced.

This is a good oppurtunity to see the DD pups.

In the fall the HZP and VGP are held with the latter being a finished gundog.Also a great opportunity to see what these dogs are capable of.

[QUOTE][/
The Utility Test (VGP) is a two-day test that evaluates the ability of the fully trained dog in the field, water and forest. It can only be held in the fall of the year. The VGP can occur at any time in the dog's life after the year it was whelped. Most handlers enter their dog in the VGP within two or three years of completing the HZP. A dog that has been trained for the VGP is a joy to hunt with. It is thorough in its search, staunch in pointing, and reliable as a retriever. It is fully obedient and can be trusted to work in the presence of other hunters and dogs. The handler can be confident of how this dog will behave in all hunting situations. The Blood Tracking Test (VSwP) further refines the ability of the mature dog to track wounded game.
QUOTE]

Currently there is no set date for the HZP and VGP in Alberta.There are tests in Idaho and Washington and i will post as i get the info.

[dutchie]

The Kurzhaar is simply a GSP, it is not a separate breed. Kurzhaar translates literally into "short hair."



You are correct on the translation...

But a Kurzhaar is not simply a GSP... Nor the other way around. DK's have different personalities, abilities, conformation, energy levels etc... and ALL DK's have webbed feet.

Alot of people that own GSP's say they are DK's but they are not. There is a person that has GWP's on the for hunting dog sale forum, stating they are DD's and they are not.

I am not slagging GSP's, but GSP's and DK ARE infact different dogs. I own a DK and have many friends that own GSP's and also own DK's. They notice VAST differences even as puppies. When I am training with the 2 different breeds, there are different tolerance levels between the GSP and the DK. Not good or bad just different.

I favor the DK because of the types of hunting I do, and the energy level is alot easier to handle for me, and the breeding is guaranteed because of standards.

The DK was first brought to the USA around 1910 and the American hunters wanted a dog that would run more and have more stamina... ALOT more. So they bred more english pointer into them... Adding on the "Pointer" on the end of the German Shorthair. This is the beginning of the the American GSP we know today.

The DK I have, is to the same standards the Germans bred thier dogs to 100 years ago.

If you live in the LML and you want to meet up to see what I mean send me a PM and we can meet up.

Dutchie

[Angel]

You are correct on the translation...

But a Kurzhaar is not simply a GSP... Nor the other way around. DK's have different personalities, abilities, conformation, energy levels etc... and ALL DK's have webbed feet.

Alot of people that own GSP's say they are DK's but they are not. There is a person that has GWP's on the for hunting dog sale forum, stating they are DD's and they are not.

I am not slagging GSP's, but GSP's and DK ARE infact different dogs. I own a DK and have many friends that own GSP's and also own DK's. They notice VAST differences even as puppies. When I am training with the 2 different breeds, there are different tolerance levels between the GSP and the DK. Not good or bad just different.

I favor the DK because of the types of hunting I do, and the energy level is alot easier to handle for me, and the breeding is guaranteed because of standards.

The DK was first brought to the USA around 1910 and the American hunters wanted a dog that would run more and have more stamina... ALOT more. So they bred more english pointer into them... Adding on the "Pointer" on the end of the German Shorthair. This is the beginning of the the American GSP we know today.

The DK I have, is to the same standards the Germans bred thier dogs to 100 years ago.

If you live in the LML and you want to meet up to see what I mean send me a PM and we can meet up.

Dutchie


Well put!.......