Pistol Hunting

[Dan Webster]

What is the state of play with pistol hunting on your side of the pond?, over here in the UK it's pretty frowned upon, I don't know if this has been covered in a previous post, just looking for some pointers as I have every intention of leaving this country for newer pastures that do actually allow me to shoot the guns I want, at the things I want to eat!!!

I may sound extreme to move countries just to shoot real pistols but if you could see the way this contry is spiralling out of control, it brings up the whole 'Quality of Life' issue as well.:cry:

Dan

[Brambles]

Handguns are kept on a short leash in Canada. NO hunting with handguns and you even need special permits to own them and take them to the gun range. You basically arn't allowed to carry them other than to and from the gunrange.

The laws in the USA are different. there you can carry a concealed handgun (states differ on there rules about this so look into it on a state by state basis) and you can hunt with handguns.

Sorry

Brambles

[Dan Webster]

Thanks for the info, at least you get to have them, even if it is with a permit. Even with a permit over here everything has to be over 24" in length with at least 12" of barrell or it has to be a muzzle-loader:cry:

[ratherbefishin]

I just can't see the legal reasoning behind including single shot handguns like the TC in with semi-automatic pistols.

[Fred]

Actually if you jump through the right hoops and just the right way it is possible to legally carry a hand gun in thee bush. This has been discussed here before. You need to be a Trapper, Timber Cruiser, a Geologist or a Prospector. However, there are police departments or detachments that actively discourage this in spite of it being legal. Just try to get a "Remote Carry" permit from the clowns at Langley Detachment!
Welcome to the house that Marc built Mr. Webster. You will find enough hunting info here to get your heart to racing!! :biggrin: Fred

[416]

Did you forget "redneck" in your list Fred?? LOL:biggrin: :biggrin:

[Gateholio]

I just can't see the legal reasoning behind including single shot handguns like the TC in with semi-automatic pistols.

I can't see the legal reaosning behind treating handguns differently than a bolt aciton rifle, fo rthat matter.

[kishman]

Actually if you jump through the right hoops and just the right way it is possible to legally carry a hand gun in thee bush. This has been discussed here before. You need to be a Trapper, Timber Cruiser, a Geologist or a Prospector. However, there are police departments or detachments that actively discourage this in spite of it being legal. Just try to get a "Remote Carry" permit from the clowns at Langley Detachment!
Welcome to the house that Marc built Mr. Webster. You will find enough hunting info here to get your heart to racing!! :biggrin: Fred

It's funny to see this come up, I was fishing near bella-coola this last summer, tons of bears/sign, and I ran into 3 different parties of hikers who where carrying handguns. With that many bears around it seemed to make sence:idea: , I think the new ruger silverhawk "alaskan" in .480 ruger would suit this porpose perfectly....thoughts?

[olek_Z_bc]

I can't see the legal reaosning behind treating handguns differently than a bolt aciton rifle, fo rthat matter.

+1

A Gun is a gun is a gun.

I would love to be able to carry a .44 magnum or what have you for self denefence against animals (4 and 2 legged) in the woods, not just a "wilderness carry" permit. I think (and this is just a youngsters inexperienced opinion) that it is much faster to draw a pistol from the hip vs a rifle on your shoulder in case of a charge by a wild animal. Also (and again this is only my opinion), when tracking say a wounded bear or other big animal in dense brush it would be a lot more convinient (if not safer) to be able to track with a good caliber handgun in hand.

I believe that enough appeals to the federal & provincial govs, the w.l.a.p. and some backing of MP's and this could be pushed thru. If anyone has an argument about how handguns are ment for only one thing (and you know who I am quoting here) then go give your head a shake because you are not helping out the firearms community.

Cheers,

Alex

[Kirby]

Also (and again this is only my opinion), when tracking say a wounded bear or other big animal in dense brush it would be a lot more convinient (if not safer) to be able to track with a good caliber handgun in hand.


I agree with the statement made by Gatehouse, no reason to treat them differently. However, if I was going in after a wounded bear, you can be assured My pistol(if carrying) would be in a holster, and my Shot-gun, lever gun, or my bolt gun would be in my hands. I'd rather hit it once with a 30-06, .338, 45-70 or 12 gauge slug than twice or three times with any pistol I could fire accuratly that fast8-) . JMO

Kirby

[olek_Z_bc]

Kirby, good point.

What I meant is dense brush that could contaminate your barrel with debries, get tree sap on your scope lens, etc. etc. I guess a shotty would be a good alternative but I just sold mine (lol) so I would have a funny predicament ;)

[brotherjack]

The only handgun(s) I would ever bother to own would be better classed as 'hand cannons'. .454 Cassul, .50 S&W, .50A&E, or the like. Only use I would have for one would be a last ditch effort to stop a bear that was already within hand-to-hand combat range.

Having grown up in the U.S. and spending many years shooting handguns of all kinds (from .22lr to .50 A&E), I find the Canadian paranoia about how dangerous such weapons are kind of laughable. You ever tried to plant a 3 inch group at 100 yards with a handgun? Good luck! Not saying it couldn't be done by an expert marksman, but still, good luck! However, any cheap rifle with a $50 scope can hit that 3 inch group with relative ease (my .303 does it just fine), even in the hands of a fairly inexperienced shooter. Thus, I conclude, that I would much rather face a criminal armed with say, a .25 calibre handgun (a prohibited weapon in Canada), than I would one with a .338 with a 3-12 scope, any day of the week!

Anyway... $0.02 won't even buy you a coffie, so...

[Gateholio]

Having grown up in the U.S. and spending many years shooting handguns of all kinds (from .22lr to .50 A&E), I find the Canadian paranoia about how dangerous such weapons are kind of laughable. You ever tried to plant a 3 inch group at 100 yards with a handgun? Good luck! Not saying it couldn't be done by an expert marksman, but still, good luck! However, any cheap rifle with a $50 scope can hit that 3 inch group with relative ease (my .303 does it just fine), even in the hands of a fairly inexperienced shooter. Thus, I conclude, that I would much rather face a criminal armed with say, a .25 calibre handgun (a prohibited weapon in Canada), than I would one with a .338 with a 3-12 scope, any day of the week!

Anyway... $0.02 won't even buy you a coffie, so...

100% agreed

Handguns make people nervous because they can be concealed, and because "they are only made to kill people"

I won't even bother adressing the latter comment, becuase it is just soccer mommy rhetoric.

Concealable? Who cares? The law abiding gun owner isn't going to harm anyone with his firearms, and the criminals will misuse tham anyway!!:wink:

As for trackign a wounded animal, I'll take my rifle, thanks...:D

the purpose of a defensive handgun is to fight your way to the rifle you shoudl have never laid down in the first place!:cool:

[tangozulu]

the fantastic canadian hunting makes up for the inability to use a hand gun believe me. besides............... You can still shoot targets all day long at the range with your hand guns.

[olek_Z_bc]

the fantastic canadian hunting makes up for the inability to use a hand gun believe me. besides............... You can still shoot targets all day long at the range with your hand guns.

That's pretty ignorant man. Why would you say that? :confused::confused:

I still shoot targets with my 300 & 338 and yeah I used to shoot skeet too when I had a shotty, what's your point? Do you just agree with all the liberal government thought was good for you or ???

Please explain your post a little, seems kinda one sided with no alternative.

Cheers,

Alex

[ratherbefishin]

I'd love to be able to carry even a 22 handgun for potting grouse when deer hunting

[abbyfireguy]

I have been an active handgun shooter in the past ,but , with all the closures and restrictions on active gun/rifle ranges I sold my King Cobra 357 a few years ago......
As for hunting or defending one's self in the bush against animals.....Good luck if it is any bigger than a gopher.....
I don't believe for one second that you would come out on the winning end with a pistol against a grizzlie or big black bear...
Think I'll stick with my 300 wby or 338 win mag.......
That's all I would need was a pissed off bear crashing around in the bush.........With my luck that's what would happen, even being a good off hand shooter..
After patching up and/or bagging up far too many young people on the streets of Vancouver from handgun(concealed) wounds(the joys of being a firefighter), I'm not loosing too much sleep over the handgun thing..Esspecially after the liberals got the boot..I think their stupid bill will die a natural death anyways...
I would however , rather see the illegal handguns targeted, not the legal permitted ones...
After all we have one of the tightest handgun laws in the world already...

[moose hunter]

i see 2 many grouse out deer and moose hunting and can only carry 1 rifle i think handgun hunting should be legal like said before a gun is a gun, it would be awesome to have a 22 on hand but trying to hunt a buck wiht a 44 magnum would be the best just my thoughts. moosie

[huntwriter]

A handgun is great for peace of mind in bush where bears are in the neighbourhood. They are also fun and highly accurate as a hunting weapon. Shame we can't use them here too.

[hutch]

I just got my freeminers licence and am going to be looking into a carry permit, but all rights I should be able to carry anywhere in B.C. whilst looking for a claim

[abbyfireguy]

Have at it guys..Me,,,I have absolutely no desire to be looking through the sights of a 44 mag pop gun at a hairy brown beast with really big teeth...
Guess some people just have bigger gonads than others...I just prefer not to feed mine to Yogi Bear willingly..:wink:

[greybark]

:D As an officer in the CAF I was issued a Browning 9mm Pistol , and for a year I was attached to the Princes Patricia` rifle team . During this time I had ample time to practice with the pistol under the Unit`s pistol team commander.
To be a top pistol shooter they spent hours each day isolating and exersizing their trigger finger by grabbing their left wrist (right handed shooter) with the right hand . AS in firing the pistol they would draw in the trigger finger with no other hand muscles reacting.
:-( Imagin a Grizz charging at you and if you had time to draw your mag pistol trying to hit it . The closer he gets the more frantic the muscles in your pistol hand react and 99% of us (including me )would be far better off with a adequate rifle .
The short barreled weapon is so easily affected with very little force and results some pretty wild shooting . The tighter you grip the weapon the worse it gets .
:D I use a 12g Win Defender when on meat runs .

REMEMBER -- Keep Your Fingertab On --

[Fred]

I used to carry a RugerSBH( and a S&W29-3 and a DE) in 44RM while prospecting. I have also taken a gunsmithing course and was doing my own reloading. I became quite proficient at shooting my handguns. Whenever I was able to though I carried a 12 ga because the 44 has roughly the same muzzle energy at the tip of it's barrel as a 30/30 does at 100 yards. The 44 is fine as a last dich defence weapon against bears and cats but it is and snould NOT be a primery defence weapon.

GrayBark, check your PM's please! Fred

[Gateholio]

[quote=abbyfireguy]

I have been an active handgun shooter in the past ,but , with all the closures and restrictions on active gun/rifle ranges I sold my King Cobra 357 a few years ago......

Well, if you want to try it out again, Abbotsford has a great handgun program at Abbotford Fish & Game. Lot of fun, good indoor range etc.

As for hunting or defending one's self in the bush against animals.....Good luck if it is any bigger than a gopher.....
I don't believe for one second that you would come out on the winning end with a pistol against a grizzlie or big black bear...

A bit of a deafeatist attitude you have.:cool: The point is not that a rifle or shotgun is better than a pistol; of course it is. The point is that you can have a pistol by your side 24/7, whetehr you are hunting or not. People have sucessfully defended themselves form predators with handguns, and it sure beats chucking rocks!!

And hunting? Well, virtually every representative species, including Cape Buffalo, Hippo, moose etc have been taken cleanly with a handgun. It relaly comes down to the skill of the hunter.

After patching up and/or bagging up far too many young people on the streets of Vancouver from handgun(concealed) wounds(the joys of being a firefighter), I'm not loosing too much sleep over the handgun thing

What's your point? That people misuse firearms? Of course they do. Those people are called criminals. They don't follow our laws, they ignore them.

The laws only affect the law abidign, who were not going to commit crimes with thier handguns in the first place. I could put a loaded handgun in my pocket tomorrow (concealed) and walk around with it until this time next year, and guess what? It would never be misused. It would just sit there, (concealed) and do nothing.

Since you have patched up or bagged lots of people with handgun wounds, you must see the equal amount of knife and bunt instrument injuroes? Since knives and blunt instruments are much more common murder weapons than guns, but noone seems to be calling for thier banning!!:wink:

After all we have one of the tightest handgun laws in the world already

Yup, and it's a shame, because all the laws do nothing to keep criminals form acessing handguns, the laws only make it a hassle for the law abiding gun owner. The handgun laws disarm the law abiding, and help the criminals, since it is a good bet that the criminal will not encounter armed resistence form thier victims.

[youngfellla]

I for one would love to be able to carry my 454 Casull or my 480 Ruger for backup when bear hunting, or when fishing a river with lots of grizz activity. I don't think many bears would argue with a 300 grain XTP at 1700 fps from a 454.:mrgreen:

As for permits, you can now get a permit that not only is good for the Gun Club you are a member of, but is good for every gun range West of Manitoba. I've got one for my 454. Seems the handgun laws have relaxed a little bit. Used to be when you bought the gun you had a Permit to Transport it that was valid for only a few hours, but now permits are good for 30 days. My 2 bits.

[hoochie]

As for permits, you can now get a permit that not only is good for the Gun Club you are a member of, but is good for every gun range West of Manitoba. I've got one for my 454. Seems the handgun laws have relaxed a little bit. Used to be when you bought the gun you had a Permit to Transport it that was valid for only a few hours, but now permits are good for 30 days. My 2 bits.

30 days?!!
mine is good for 5 years... thought everyone else's were too.

[huntwriter]

[quote=abbyfireguy]

I have been an active handgun shooter in the past ,but , with all the closures and restrictions on active gun/rifle ranges I sold my King Cobra 357 a few years ago......

Well, if you want to try it out again, Abbotsford has a great handgun program at Abbotford Fish & Game. Lot of fun, good indoor range etc.

As for hunting or defending one's self in the bush against animals.....Good luck if it is any bigger than a gopher.....
I don't believe for one second that you would come out on the winning end with a pistol against a grizzlie or big black bear...

A bit of a deafeatist attitude you have.:cool: The point is not that a rifle or shotgun is better than a pistol; of course it is. The point is that you can have a pistol by your side 24/7, whetehr you are hunting or not. People have sucessfully defended themselves form predators with handguns, and it sure beats chucking rocks!!

And hunting? Well, virtually every representative species, including Cape Buffalo, Hippo, moose etc have been taken cleanly with a handgun. It relaly comes down to the skill of the hunter.

After patching up and/or bagging up far too many young people on the streets of Vancouver from handgun(concealed) wounds(the joys of being a firefighter), I'm not loosing too much sleep over the handgun thing

What's your point? That people misuse firearms? Of course they do. Those people are called criminals. They don't follow our laws, they ignore them.

The laws only affect the law abidign, who were not going to commit crimes with thier handguns in the first place. I could put a loaded handgun in my pocket tomorrow (concealed) and walk around with it until this time next year, and guess what? It would never be misused. It would just sit there, (concealed) and do nothing.

Since you have patched up or bagged lots of people with handgun wounds, you must see the equal amount of knife and bunt instrument injuroes? Since knives and blunt instruments are much more common murder weapons than guns, but noone seems to be calling for thier banning!!:wink:

After all we have one of the tightest handgun laws in the world already

Yup, and it's a shame, because all the laws do nothing to keep criminals form acessing handguns, the laws only make it a hassle for the law abiding gun owner. The handgun laws disarm the law abiding, and help the criminals, since it is a good bet that the criminal will not encounter armed resistence form thier victims.

Have to agree with Gatehouse on this one 100%. My sentiment exactly.

[Walksalot]

My buddy has a trapline and owns but seldom carries a handgun. His go to weapon for the trapline is a Ruger .223 semi auto.
As far as carrying a handgun or rifle, I will bet I can shoulder my rifle as quick as one can pull a handgun out of a holster.
I have shot a handgun enough to know I am a piss poor shot with one and one has to practice alot to become proficient with one. I am sure it would be a novelty for a while but at the end of the day the handguns will be left in safe storage.

P.S.
Note To Government...ARM OUR BORDER GUARDS WITH HANDGUNS.

[abbyfireguy]

Well,I figured I'd get yelled at for my opinion...Don't mind too much..
I am all for the tight pistol regs as they are with maybe a few things lightened up...
Do I want to have wide open pistol ownership like the USA where everyone and his dog has a 44 Mag under his pillow at night???,,NO OF COURSE NOT.....
I am an avid hunter and own a Ruger 10-22, Wincester 30-30, Stevens 410, Remington 600 308, Weatherby 300 Mag and Win 338 Mag..These are all locked up in the gun safe as I have curious children around..
I am not naive or prude about what is going on in the streets of Canada with the dramatically escalating crimes with handguns as I've spent 27 years working the streets of Vancouver. But,I am having a hard time getting to the point where I would renew my restricted weapons permit and buy another handgun..For me I just don't see the rationale for having one yet(who knows,it may come to that).....
Just to clear one thing up, I am pissed with the Liberals for their gun registry(which I have fought actively) and this rediculous handgun ban attempt of recent weeks..As with most Liberal policies these both stink to high heaven....
I am for handgun ownership by permitted individuals for legitimate uses,not just simply to pack around ...
I also believe the criminals should be hit way harder when a gun is used in the commission of a crime..Not slapped on the wrist by our neutered judges...
Maybe if some of these crooks got caught and chewed on for a while by underfed police dogs with sharp teeth and body armor they would think twice..I know they wouldn't, but short of summorary execution ,what do you do with these gun toting knobs...
As you can tell,I'm very frustrated by this whole gun ownership thing . It is going to be decided by the politicians which really scares me , as they have not a shred of common sense amongst them all, and they don't listen to us ,the little people.
Whew, end of rant,sorry guys..
Time for another espresso and a prozac..:wink:

[Gateholio]

[quote=abbyfireguy]Well,I figured I'd get yelled at for my opinion...Don't mind too much..

This forum isn't about yelling, it's about exchanging information. In this case it's a discussion, not a YELLING MATCH.:wink:

I am all for the tight pistol regs as they are with maybe a few things lightened up...
Do I want to have wide open pistol ownership like the USA where everyone and his dog has a 44 Mag under his pillow at night???,,NO OF COURSE NOT.....

Despite evidence that our tigth handgun laws do not prevent criminals from misusing guns, you still support the laws? Maybe you could explain how a PAL, a reg certificate and an ATT would somehow magically prevent a crime? It's the person, not the paperwork, that prevents crime.

IN the USA, states that have issued CCW (concealed carry permits to private citizens) have seen a DECREASE in violent crime. More guns in the hands of law abiding citizens deters criminals.

I am an avid hunter and own a Ruger 10-22, Wincester 30-30, Stevens 410, Remington 600 308, Weatherby 300 Mag and Win 338 Mag..These are all locked up in the gun safe as I have curious children around..

Keeping your firearms from unauthorized acess is a good thing, however your situation does not apply to others with no children.

I am not naive or prude about what is going on in the streets of Canada with the dramatically escalating crimes with handguns as I've spent 27 years working the streets of Vancouver

On those 27 years, the firearms restrictions have grown tighter and tighter, yet there is escalating firearm violence. Further proof that the laws are not working to prevent crime, since the criminals ignore the laws.

. But,I am having a hard time getting to the point where I would renew my restricted weapons permit and buy another handgun..For me I just don't see the rationale for having one yet(who knows,it may come to that).....

If you personally don't want a handgun, that is your choice, but your choice shoudl not impact other law abiding citizens that wish to own and use handguns in a responsible manner.

Just to clear one thing up, I am pissed with the Liberals for their gun registry(which I have fought actively) and this rediculous handgun ban attempt of recent weeks..As with most Liberal policies these both stink to high heaven....

Good. keep up the good work!:D

I am for handgun ownership by permitted individuals for legitimate uses,not just simply to pack around ...

Defending yourself from harm is a legitimate use of a firearm, so is hunting. Its perfectly legal to pack around a rifle or shotgun, why shoudl a handgun be any different? A shotgun or rifle is far more deadly than a handgun.

I also believe the criminals should be hit way harder when a gun is used in the commission of a crime..Not slapped on the wrist by our neutered judges...

Unfortunatley, most "gun" laws (such as 'safe' storage laws and paperwork offenses) get used against normal citizens, while the criminals shooting people ignore the laws. We have laws against MURDER, as well, and they ignore those ones...

I'll say it again: Gun laws only affect the law abidig, since the criminals will break the laws, anyway.

As you can tell,I'm very frustrated by this whole gun ownership thing . It is going to be decided by the politicians which really scares me , as they have not a shred of common sense amongst them all, and they don't listen to us ,the little people.

You best defense is to join an organization, and write letters to your MP. Your local gun club and the RFOBC are a good start. CSSA is also a good organization.

[huntwriter]

"I am all for the tight pistol regs as they are with maybe a few things lightened up...
Do I want to have wide open pistol ownership like the USA where everyone and his dog has a 44 Mag under his pillow at night???,,NO OF COURSE NOT....."

Err, excuse me. America has less violent crime per citizen than Canada. And in states where they have a law which expressly permits people to use a firearm for self defence the violent crime rate has gone down even more than the average.

Speaking for myself. I was born and raised in Switzerland, a country obsessed with firearm ownership and no gun control whatsoever. People there store assault rifles from the army in their houses, they carry weapons openly on the streets to the shooting range, restaurants have still gun racks. And yes you are not only permitted by law to use a firearm or any other means to harm or kill an intruder or assailant but encouraged by law, - the police does not like to chase criminals but they don't mind to carry them away in body bags, it's much less work and cheaper.

Guess what, violent crime in that country still makes headlines for weeks on end because it is so rare. It's like my dad said at one time to a German (another disarmed people). "The difference of a German criminal and a Swiss criminal is this. The Swiss criminal has to ask himself one important question, Will I survive alive? The likely answer to that is NO. Criminals might not value your or my life but they sure value their live."

It is a proven fact, not fiction, that countries where people are permitted to carry and use firearms have a much lower crime rate than those that are restricted. Or as a UN researcher put it. "A armed society is a safe and polite society."

[tangozulu]

That's pretty ignorant man. Why would you say that? :confused::confused:

I still shoot targets with my 300 & 338 and yeah I used to shoot skeet too when I had a shotty, what's your point? Do you just agree with all the liberal government thought was good for you or ???

Please explain your post a little, seems kinda one sided with no alternative.

Cheers,

Alex

The bush is full of lost game animals already, shot with real cartridges.
Why bother loosing more to pathetic hand gun ballistics.
By the way I own and shoot hand guns.

[Gateholio]

The bush is full of lost game animals already, shot with real cartridges.
Why bother loosing more to pathetic hand gun ballistics.
By the way I own and shoot hand guns.

Well, I suppose the same could be said of bow hunting, then???

Bow hutners and handgun hunters simply need to operate within thier limitations.

Both can be used sucessfully and ethically..

[timber]

I just got my freeminers licence and am going to be looking into a carry permit, but all rights I should be able to carry anywhere in B.C. whilst looking for a claim hutch.keep us posted on how you make out. all the hoops ex that you have to jump.

[abbyfireguy]

I won't bother putting up quotes,but, if you really think a proliferation of handguns is the magic cure for protecting you and your family, that is a pretty darn sad commentary on how far our Canadian society has fallen..
I am hard pressed to remember a time when accidental deaths from pistol discharges by kids finding dad's gun in a bedside nighttable were a frequent happening in Canada...
Seems to be a regular thing in the wonderful USA..That's one of the many reasons I would never consider moving to the States....
Oh well, guess I am in the minority here, so , rather than continue with the line by line critique of everything I say, its time to do something else with my time...
Thought I had fairly mainstream views but obviously not....Guess I'll keep my concerns to myself,,later guys..Won't be back here I guess,I get enough crap and abuse at work......

[ryanb]

abbyfireguy, seems to me like your missing gatehouse's point.

[Gateholio]

[quote=abbyfireguy]..

I won't bother putting up quotes,but, if you really think a proliferation of handguns is the magic cure for protecting you and your family, that is a pretty darn sad commentary on how far our Canadian society has fallen

Let s take a look at that statement:

"Proliferation of handguns" That is rhetoric used by anti gun advocats world over, to frightent he masses into thinking that if we don't make a LAW, there will be handguns spilling out into the streets, causing havoc and destrution every 5 minutes that the LAW is not passed...

How about "magic cure?" Noone suggested that handguns were the "magic cure" for protecting you and your family. It is simply one part of it. If CCW was legal in Canada, I suspect that most of us wouldn't carry a gun. I know I wouldn't , except maybe in the bush.

However, I woudl like the government to acknowledge that I, and many others are responsible citizens, and if we had that option, that blood would not flow on the streets in torrents.

While I personally have no need to carry a handgun, there are quite a few people that do. For example, some battered women, and senior citizens that could have benifited form this option. Unfortunately, many of them are now dead.

I am hard pressed to remember a time when accidental deaths from pistol discharges by kids finding dad's gun in a bedside nighttable were a frequent happening in Canada...Seems to be a regular thing in the wonderful USA..That's one of the many reasons I would never consider moving to the States....

This is completely irrelevent. If you are a responsible person, you would not leave a loaded firearm where your children can have unsupervised acess to them. The actions of a few idiots should not be the basis for restricting others.

Oh well, guess I am in the minority here, so , rather than continue with the line by line critique of everything I say, its time to do something else with my time...

You are in the minority because many of us have chosen to accept responsability for our own actions. You clearly woudl prefer to have government dictate to you what your actions should be.

You are in the minority because you fail to understand the fundamental truth that a handgun is an OBJECT, just like a rifle, just like a shotgun, just like a knife, just like a baseball bat. And just like any OBJECT, they can be used for good or evil.

You are in the minority because you fail to grasp the concept that gun aws such as the ones that pertian to handguns in Canada, are laws of paperwork and do nothing to prevent the misuse of handguns.

You say that you were against the Liberal election idea to ban handguns...."BAN HANDGUNS" Think about that for a minute..would ANY of the carnage you see on the streets be prevented form banning handguns?

Of course not! The criminals would STILL get handguns, and they woudl STILL misuse them.

And guess what? With our laws of today, they still misuse handguns, and the only ones affected by the laws are the NON CRIMINALS!!!


Thought I had fairly mainstream views but obviously not....

Unfortunately, you *do* have fairly mainstream views that are shared by many hunters, trap shooters, etc. Many of them don't use handguns (or black guns) and therefore think it is "unimportant" how they are regulated (or even banned.)

Frankly, if all the hunters and shotgunners had stood shoulder to shoulder with thier brothers that use different, less politically correct, firearms, we may not have seen such an escalation of pointless firearms laws int he last few years.

Many of these hunters and shotgunners have woken up and realized that ALL of us are in the fight to preserve private gun ownership and use in Canada, and have come to the table with thier support. Unfortunately, many still think that it's *okay* to severly regulate handguns and black guns becasue they are *scary* and "criminals may use them!":confused:

Guess I'll keep my concerns to myself,,later guys..Won't be back here I guess,I get enough crap and abuse at work......[/

It looks like you got your feelings hurt, despite the fact that I pointed out that this is a DISCUSSION, and not a personal attack on you. I would have thought that a hunter/fireman was made of tougher stuff, but of course, it's relaly up to the individual to decide if they want to participate or not.

Like I said before, forums are abotu DISCUSSION. Some guys agree to disagree. Some guys open thier mind and think aboitu things a bit, and realize that maybe they werent'100% correct, and let new ideas into thier head. They may realize that *thier* particular situation is not *everyone elses* situation..And then others just get thier feelings hurt and run away.

All of us have been civil to you, we just disagree with you. It's up to you how you want ot play it.:wink:

[Gateholio]

abbyfireguy, seems to me like your missing gatehouse's point.

No kidding!!:D

[Gateholio]

I suppose that I should mention here..

I like handguns,and I own one or 2, but primarily I am a HUNTER.

My safe is full of bolt action rifles and O/U shotguns....Bolt acitons are my primary interst.

I dont' own any black rifles, I'm not an avid handgunner either.

The closest thing I have to an assualt rife is a WWII era M1 Garand...

But I believe in sticking up for my brethren, which is why I support the black gun/handgun guys, because after they ban those guns, it's not afar leap tp the semi shotguns, and after that you can get tot he bolt rilfes...etc

Just look at Australia and England, if you want to see one future. If we keep the pressure up, we will never see that future..

[huntwriter]

Again my vote goes to Gatehouse it's pure common sense not guided by hype and political agendas.

I have stated this in this boards many times, first and foremost I am HUNTER and as such any weapon will do which gives me an opportunity to go hunting.
As for the statement by some one that hand guns are not accurate hunting weapons. Go ask the 1.5 million hand gun hunters in America or hand guns are not accurate.

It's like Gatehouse said, we should stick together, we certainly can argee or disagree on somethings but I think when it comes to weapons we should stick up for each other and respect the other hunters rights too.

There are hunting weapons which I do not like - No. I am not saying nutin about what weapon - but I stand uo and fight for every man to prodect his rights to hunt with these weapons. Prodecting others rights is equal to protecting my right.

[CanuckShooter]

Again my vote goes to Gatehouse it's pure common sense not guided by hype and political agendas.

I have stated this in this boards many times, first and foremost I am HUNTER and as such any weapon will do which gives me an opportunity to go hunting.
As for the statement by some one that hand guns are not accurate hunting weapons. Go ask the 1.5 million hand gun hunters in America or hand guns are not accurate.

It's like Gatehouse said, we should stick together, we certainly can argee or disagree on somethings but I think when it comes to weapons we should stick up for each other and respect the other hunters rights too.

There are hunting weapons which I do not like - No. I am not saying nutin about what weapon - but I stand uo and fight for every man to prodect his rights to hunt with these weapons. Prodecting others rights is equal to protecting my right.

Not meaning to point fingers...but you know what really irks me??? Terminology.....ie "there are hunting weapons"....I was taught, and I taught my kids that a firearm is a tool..not a toy. I always considered a weapon to be something that was primarily designed to be used against other humans...like a bomb...or a missile....or a fighter jet. So I would like to politely suggest that in the future we refrain from describing our hunting implements as 'weapons'.

I know this sounds like nit-picking, but my life experiece has shown me that your choice of words can sometimes have a huge impact upon another persons interpretation of your meaning. I own firearms that are a tool of my chosen sport....not weapons.

[Dan Webster]

Well, I seem to have opened up a big can of worms with my original post. My quiery stemed from the fact that,(Life Story Time) I used to be a pretty good shot with a rifle and even worked at a US summer camp as a shooting coach/instructor, back in '97 but two weeks after I got back to the UK POW!! T-boned on a highway whilst riding my motorcycle, pretty messed up took a while to walk again but I hit my head sooooo hard that it damaged the optic nerve in my right eye and I'm right handed so shooting rifles became very fustrating. I tried teaching myself to shoot left handed but it wasn't enjoyable, that's when pistols came into play, thats why I wanted to know if I can Hunt with hand guns as they won't let me with mine over here, just wondered if you guys had it any better, with me it's a physical need rather than a wanton desire. As I said, my .44 mag handcannon with a 23" barrel develops inexcess of the required lbft of energy required to cleanly take game, but the powers that be still say NO, I even asked again yesterday and was flatly told that if I ask again they will come round and revoke my license!!

[tangozulu]

Well, I seem to have opened up a big can of worms with my original post. My quiery stemed from the fact that,(Life Story Time) I used to be a pretty good shot with a rifle and even worked at a US summer camp as a shooting coach/instructor, back in '97 but two weeks after I got back to the UK POW!! T-boned on a highway whilst riding my motorcycle, pretty messed up took a while to walk again but I hit my head sooooo hard that it damaged the optic nerve in my right eye and I'm right handed so shooting rifles became very fustrating. I tried teaching myself to shoot left handed but it wasn't enjoyable, that's when pistols came into play, thats why I wanted to know if I can Hunt with hand guns as they won't let with mine over here, just wondered if you guys had it any better, with me it's a physical need rather than a wanton desire. As I said, my .44 mag handcannon with a 23" barrel develops inexcess of the required lbft of energy required to cleaned take game, but the powers that be still say NO, I even asked again yesterday and was flatly told that if I ask again they will come round and revoke my license!!


Ohh everything is a can of worms in here, its just the way we like it.
By the way, what is there to hunt over there, these days?. Guess fox huntin is out. Red deer I guess but do you have to pay for access or what?

[Dan Webster]

Over here, game isn't to bad, muntjac, fallow, Red if you can afford it ( I can't!!), and a few other alien sub species of deer, along with rabbit & squirrels:wink: . Foxes are ok with a rifle just not with hounds anymore and boar seem to be back on the menu. There are numerous wild boar populations springing up all over the place, mainly escapee's from local farms but they all seem to have ever growing populations. Only one outfitter is offering formal hunts on them so far, but that will soon change.:biggrin:

[abbyfireguy]

[quote=abbyfireguy]..





It looks like you got your feelings hurt, despite the fact that I pointed out that this is a DISCUSSION, and not a personal attack on you. I would have thought that a hunter/fireman was made of tougher stuff, but of course, it's relaly up to the individual to decide if they want to participate or not.

Like I said before, forums are abotu DISCUSSION. Some guys agree to disagree. Some guys open thier mind and think aboitu things a bit, and realize that maybe they werent'100% correct, and let new ideas into thier head. They may realize that *thier* particular situation is not *everyone elses* situation..And then others just get thier feelings hurt and run away.

All of us have been civil to you, we just disagree with you. It's up to you how you want ot play it.:wink:

I hadn't planned on coming back on here for some time,but, I hat eto go away mad....
Gateway , you need to read your own replies before posting them..Not a personel attack on me.I guess calling the stuff I'm made of not tough enough and assuming I have run away with my feelings hurt seems pretty insensitive to a "Discussion"....
Why you think it necessary to guote line by line and pick apart sentences on their own as a method of rebutal eludes me,but guess we all have our own style of debate....I just don't like being percieved as being on the "enemy's" side...I hope I can simply lay out my standing with reguard to the handgun and firearm debate that won't leave anyone misinterpreting exactly where I stand.

- I have owned and used handguns a lot in the past(don't have time now,so I don't own any right now)
- I have actively fought for firearm ownership rights since the gun registry got shoved down our throats(yes,time and money have both left my pocket in this fight)
- Handguns should be available to anyone who passes security screening and demonstrates safe gun handling abilities.
- I am against open , lax handgun sales as many US States have currently,basically they run their handgun sales like shopping at 7-11(hard to believe but its true in some places)...

The only point that has got me very concerned listening to the DISCUSSION here is,it is sounding like a lot of you folks want unfetered and almost unregulated handgun access to anyone. I know I'm probably not correct there and I will be pointed straight shortly....
I wouldn't mind if everyone in my community owned a handgun,really, as long as they had all the security screenings and passed the appropriate gun handling courses including some actual range time...
Unfortunately not everyone would pass the police screening because of the criminal record,but, we all have our own skeletons in our past,some just have bigger ones ......

Look what this thread has got to,,I thought it was about handgun hunting???
Guess I should have kept my trap shut.....
Hope no-one goes away ticked,,,I have thought better sleeping on it and felt I should explain myself more thoroughly so you all don't get the wrong impression of my thoughts.....
Sorry if I have offended anyone on this great site..:wink:

[Steeleco]

Well with respect to hunting with handguns, I even checked into hunting with my Webley Hurricane air pistol, which at one time I almost had to register. Well I can't. It's 30 fps below the legal Handbun requirement but it's still not allowed. STUPID!!! I thought it would be the cat'ass on Grouse :sad::sad:

[Gateholio]

I hadn't planned on coming back on here for some time,but, I hat eto go away mad....
Gateway , you need to read your own replies before posting them..Not a personel attack on me.I guess calling the stuff I'm made of not tough enough and assuming I have run away with my feelings hurt seems pretty insensitive to a "Discussion"....

Abbey, I made that comment AFTER you had declared that you were doing just that!

Here is your comment:Guess I'll keep my concerns to myself,,later guys..Won't be back here I guess,I get enough crap and abuse at work

Perhaps my comment was too harsh, although it seemed an appropriate response at the time. Sorry if I offended you.8-)

Why you think it necessary to guote line by line and pick apart sentences on their own as a method of rebutal eludes me,but guess we all have our own style of debate....

Quoting line byline is an efficeint method of discussion on internet forums. It makes it so that readers don't have to go back and forth on thier screen to see what is being replied to. It's not personal.

- Handguns should be available to anyone who passes security screening and demonstrates safe gun handling abilities.

No real disagreement there. A person with no criminal past, no history of mental illness or substance abuse shoudl be able to posess whatever type of firearm they choose.

- I am against open , lax handgun sales as many US States have currently,basically they run their handgun sales like shopping at 7-11(hard to believe but its true in some places)...

This is an exxageration (7-11). You also need to get a background check done in the USA prior to purchasing firearms. I could find out the exact procedure, but it's not as easy as some peopel claim.

In any case, why single out handguns? A gun is a gun.

The only point that has got me very concerned listening to the DISCUSSION here is,it is sounding like a lot of you folks want unfetered and almost unregulated handgun access to anyone. I know I'm probably not correct there and I will be pointed straight shortly

Handguns should just be treated like long guns. As I pointed out, the paperwork laws of registration, safe storage, only shoot at range, no hunting etc will do nothing to deter criminals from misusing them.

I wouldn't mind if everyone in my community owned a handgun,really, as long as they had all the security screenings and passed the appropriate gun handling courses including some actual range time...

A security 'screening' for a handgun shouldn't be any more stringent that that of a long gun.

Look what this thread has got to,,I thought it was about handgun hunting???
Guess I should have kept my trap shut.....
Hope no-one goes away ticked,,,I have thought better sleeping on it and felt I should explain myself more thoroughly so you all don't get the wrong impression of my thoughts.....

If everyone kept thier trap shut, we won't be able to have fun debates, and we would probably never learn anything.8-)

Sorry if I have offended anyone on this great site

I doubt anyone is offended. I know I am not...:wink:

[The 'Hummer']

I agree with the statement made by Gatehouse, no reason to treat them differently. However, if I was going in after a wounded bear, you can be assured My pistol(if carrying) would be in a holster, and my Shot-gun, lever gun, or my bolt gun would be in my hands. I'd rather hit it once with a 30-06, .338, 45-70 or 12 gauge slug than twice or three times with any pistol I could fire accuratly that fast8-) . JMO

Kirby
The choice of firearm is exactly that, a matter of choice. The important considerations are, shot placement, practice & skill, as well as (to quote a noteable individual) "a man has to know his limitations".:idea: 8-)

[craigchaplin]

I am not really interested myself in hunting with a handgun. But i can see it being challenging almost like bowhunting. (being that i would imagine you would have to be a hell of a lot closer). I also think that there should be no difference in the licenses. I think its true a gun is a gun. Although i do agree that handguns are easy to conceal i dont think anybody who has a license is gonna conceal them for a no good purpose. As long as you take a proper safety course or training in some way i dont see why they should be treated any different than a rifle or shot gun. However, im not sure who mentioned it, but i believe all Guns should be stored properly whether there are kids in the house er not. They are not somethin that should be left out or unlocked.

[Dan Webster]

Just for the record I was generally refering to pistols/handguns in rifle type calibres, .223, 45/70, .308 etc..... not the .38's and 9mm that people normally relate to when someone says 'Handgun':lol:

Regards,

Dan

[Fred]

Well, was I wrong about this place Mr. Webster? :biggrin: Fred

[The 'Hummer']

I am not really interested myself in hunting with a handgun. But i can see it being challenging almost like bowhunting. (being that i would imagine you would have to be a hell of a lot closer). I also think that there should be no difference in the licenses. I think its true a gun is a gun. Although i do agree that handguns are easy to conceal i dont think anybody who has a license is gonna conceal them for a no good purpose. As long as you take a proper safety course or training in some way i dont see why they should be treated any different than a rifle or shot gun. However, im not sure who mentioned it, but i believe all Guns should be stored properly whether there are kids in the house er not. They are not somethin that should be left out or unlocked.

:smile: If , by virtue of a PAL, we are deemed responsible enough to purchase any firearm, we should be allowed to hunt with it. Going a step further, if allowed to hunt with a handgun, and to eliminate and address the 'concealment fears', something along that line could be stated. "Carried openly - not concealed". There must be some stipulation to that end where, in the states, you are allowed to hunt with a handgun.:?:I agree. Again, for ANY firearm, only two basic rules SHOULD apply; To be used responsibly and Stored safely.

[Mr. Dean]

Hey, just a thought.

Would this guy qualify for some kind of 'special purpose permit' for being handicapped?

I've heard of people being allowed to hunt from wheelchairs on the hyway........

[huntwriter]

Not meaning to point fingers...but you know what really irks me??? Terminology.....ie "there are hunting weapons"....I was taught, and I taught my kids that a firearm is a tool..not a toy. I always considered a weapon to be something that was primarily designed to be used against other humans...like a bomb...or a missile....or a fighter jet. So I would like to politely suggest that in the future we refrain from describing our hunting implements as 'weapons'.

I know this sounds like nit-picking, but my life experiece has shown me that your choice of words can sometimes have a huge impact upon another persons interpretation of your meaning. I own firearms that are a tool of my chosen sport....not weapons.
It is rather nit-picking but if you prefer I will say "hunting tools". Or the "multiple hunting tools". Nothing like political correctness, eh. War is a bad word so it's called Liberation, and black is coloured.:wink:

So what you're saying is, if I undestand it right, a weapon is a toy and a firearm is a tool *shakes head very confused*. I was taught by my father how to respectfully handle a "hunting tool" when I was a little kid and long before we used political correctness and word twisitngs and I always - like millions of other people - understood very clearly that a weapon is not a toy and we didn't need any "hunter education couses" and "experts" to understand that. Back then it was called common sense. It's still around today but it is slowly being strangled to death by the politically correct watch dogs and those that fall for it.

But it's okay you have your opinion I have mien. I can live with that I hope you too.

[The 'Hummer']

It is rather nit-picking but if you prefer I will say "hunting tools". Or the "multiple hunting tools". Nothing like political correctness, eh. War is a bad word so it's called Liberation, and black is coloured.:wink:

So what you're saying is, if I undestand it right, a weapon is a toy and a firearm is a tool *shakes head very confused*. I was taught by my father how to respectfully handle a "hunting tool" when I was a little kid and long before we used political correctness and word twisitngs and I always - like millions of other people - understood very clearly that a weapon is not a toy and we didn't need any "hunter education couses" and "experts" to understand that. Back then it was called common sense. It's still around today but it is slowly being strangled to death by the politically correct watch dogs and those that fall for it.

But it's okay you have your opinion I have mien. I can live with that I hope you too.

:!: When we start 'defining' & playing with 'terminology' we start sounding like lawyers perpetuating our livelihood:twisted: . I hate to risk sounding like one, but to my way of thinking, if you use anything offensively against an individual, or any sector of society, it is a weapon. That could be anything including a rock, stick, firearm or even your hands & feet, especially if you're into Martial Arts. It is the intent of what the item is used for that makes it a weapon or the tool of a sport.:idea:

[huntwriter]

The 'Hummer' - Well said.:wink:

[Dan Webster]

Ok then......what about knife hunting;-)

[CanuckShooter]

It is rather nit-picking but if you prefer I will say "hunting tools". Or the "multiple hunting tools". Nothing like political correctness, eh. War is a bad word so it's called Liberation, and black is coloured.:wink:

So what you're saying is, if I undestand it right, a weapon is a toy and a firearm is a tool *shakes head very confused*. I was taught by my father how to respectfully handle a "hunting tool" when I was a little kid and long before we used political correctness and word twisitngs and I always - like millions of other people - understood very clearly that a weapon is not a toy and we didn't need any "hunter education couses" and "experts" to understand that. Back then it was called common sense. It's still around today but it is slowly being strangled to death by the politically correct watch dogs and those that fall for it.

But it's okay you have your opinion I have mien. I can live with that I hope you too.

What I was trying to say is that a weapon is a weapon, a firearm is a tool..it can be used as a weapon, like a rock or knife...but there is a very significant difference between the words weapon and firearm.

You may consider it simple political correctness, but you can bet your last wooden nickel that when most people hear the word 'weapon' that some little switch deep in the recesses of thier craniums...screams "used for killing people..ban it". That isn't the message I would like to get across to people when I talk about the firearms registry [for example]. I am talking about definitions, and how people process our statements, I don't have a dictionary handy but what are the differences between the definitions of the words weapon and firearm??

So at the risk of being accused of being a political correctness watchdog [woof] when someone asks me what sort of weapon I hunt with...I will always answer 'I don't hunt with a weapon...I hunt with a firearm' Think about it.....that's all I'm saying. Have a happy day....

[Fred]

Ok then......what about knife hunting;-)

I think that is mostly relegated to the southern US, Mr Webster! :mrgreen: Fred

[huntwriter]

Merriam - Webster Dictionary


Weapon

An instrument of attack or defense in combat, as a gun, missile, or sword.
Zoology. A part or organ, such as a claw or stinger, used by an animal in attack or defense.
A means used to defend against or defeat another: Logic was her weapon.
Firearms
A weapon, especially a pistol or rifle, capable of firing a projectile and using an explosive charge as a propellant.

If you speak of a collection of weapons i.e Firearms, Bows then the definition is weapons i.e "I hunt with different weapons." Or as in a collection of different arms such as firearms, bows, daggers and swords, i.e. Weapon Collector.

Arms
A weapon, especially a firearm: troops bearing arms; ICBMs, bombs, and other nuclear arms.
A branch of a military force: infantry, armor, and other combat arms.
arms
Warfare: a call to arms against the invaders.
Military service: several million volunteers under arms; the profession of arms.
As I said before I respect your opinion but you know, the fact is that we always can find something not quite right or even offensieve in many expressions. The political correct dictionary is full with such words and expressions, amongst them such mundane words as "Gay", and "Woman", unlike Webster, that dictonary lists "Firearms" and "Weapon" as means of destruction and objects to kill someone.Not a word, unlike Webster, of defense.

As to your opinion that if you say weapon people think of weapons as in killing someone I have to say the people think the same if you say firearm. That's why the anti-gun-lobby calls it a Firearm ban not a Weapon ban.

But don't take my word for it, it's just my humble opinion not the gospel.

[PGKris]

Ok then......what about knife hunting;-)

My favourite way to hunt.....A knife and quiet shoes :lol:

[huntwriter]

My favourite way to hunt.....A knife and quiet shoes :lol:
Then you should go to Tennessee, there is a wild hog hunting outfitter who offers hog hunting with a knife. Never been there but I am told that it quickly weeds out the the boys from the man.:lol:

[craigchaplin]

Then you should go to Tennessee, there is a wild hog hunting outfitter who offers hog hunting with a knife. Never been there but I am told that it quickly weeds out the the boys from the man.:lol:

Wow! I imagine it would weed out the boys from men. although kinda barbaric dont ya think? thats just my opinion but you would think it would lead to a little more suffering than normal. And ive always thought hunting is a hell of a lot less barbaric than the way they do it at a slaughter house. Shoot......kill USUALLY clean and quik.......I guess if you were especially good with a knife would be ok. Dont know that i would take part in that type of hunting.....but to each his own

[huntwriter]

Wow! I imagine it would weed out the boys from men. although kinda barbaric dont ya think? thats just my opinion but you would think it would lead to a little more suffering than normal. And ive always thought hunting is a hell of a lot less barbaric than the way they do it at a slaughter house. Shoot......kill USUALLY clean and quik.......I guess if you were especially good with a knife would be ok. Dont know that i would take part in that type of hunting.....but to each his own

What's barbaric about a slaughterhouse? I grew up in a slaughterhouse and all I ever saw was that it went "peng" and the steer troppend. By the pigs it made a little hiss from the electric and they tropped too. In India where I studied tigers we would observe that it can take most of the time up to 20 minutes for an animal to die when a tiger pulls it down and I wont write here what goes on when young tigers learn to kill. A knife in the heart is as quick a death as a well placed arrow.

Having said all that it wouldn't be for me either. I guess most of us have softend a bit as we bcame more domesticated.;)

But like you said to each his own. That has always been my philosophy.

[Dan Webster]

I was only trying to see if I get you guys away from the politics and back to the hunting, I would like knife hunt but I have no doubt that it is frowned upon up there, where you guys are.;)

Still, it will be done one day, even if it's just to say that I done it.

Dan:cool:

[kutenay]

I firmly believe that the use and ownership of ALL firearms or ANY other type of weapon is my fundamental BIRTHRIGHT and that of all other Canadians, without exception. I own pistols, have for nearly 40 years and have carried while working and recreating in the bush as did many of my friends. I do not do so now as I have too much to lose in terms of a confiscation of my quite valuable ballistic weapons collection.

I worked among Grizzlies, alone, for many years and I have customized weapons for that purpose, however, in certain circumstances, I would carry my Ruger Redhawk STS. 5.5" .44 Mag. loaded with my "bear loads", regardless of whether a given R.C.M.P. detachment would issue me a permit or not. Frankly, I will not have a "Mountie", especially one born in another country telling me what I can do in the bush and that's that.

We Canadians are FAR too willing to allow politicians, bureaucrats, self-appointed "experts" such as "Wendy" and other social engineers to tell us what we should/should not do and I am godam sick of it and will do what MY conscience tells me is right and to hell with those who try to stop me.

During the recent election, Ujjal Singh Dosanjh, who came to Canada in 1967 and Sukh Singh Dhaliwal, who came to Canada in 1984, BOTH strongly advocated a (quote) "gunfree Canada"; I was working with guns when these guys came here and was born here and NOBODY is taking my guns away, no matter what I have to do to stop them.

I find it interesting that these individuals strongly support the "right" of their immigrant Sikh fellows to carry deadly, razorsharp daggers, yet, they think they have the right to ban MY choice of weapons and interfere with my cultural traditions.....this is one example of what is wrong with Canada at present.

I have also spent many years working the streets of Vancity and in hospital emerg. rooms; I live in what the V.P.D. patrol cops refer to as "Ho Chi Minh Trail". I have actually had to use one of my handguns to chase an intruder out of my home....he ran, so, I didn't shoot him.

I know from experience that handguns are NOT the problem, drugs, "soft" enforcement/punishment standards and lax immigration standards plus the "punk" attitude fostered in our "video culture" are the real cause of contemporary social decay. So, I favour CCW by anyone who does not have a violent, criminal record or severe mental illness; I would not bother in town, but, would while backpacking.

[huntwriter]

Well said kutenay.

[Dan Webster]

I'm not Canadian but +1 to the last post.

PS. At least you guy's kept your small arms, our pistols now have to have a steel rod welded to the back to back of them to give them an overal length of 24" and have at least 12" barrels and .22 is the only allowed calibre in semi-autos.

[brotherjack]

Wow! I imagine it would weed out the boys from men. although kinda barbaric dont ya think? thats just my opinion but you would think it would lead to a little more suffering than normal. And ive always thought hunting is a hell of a lot less barbaric than the way they do it at a slaughter house. Shoot......kill USUALLY clean and quik.......I guess if you were especially good with a knife would be ok. Dont know that i would take part in that type of hunting.....but to each his own

Actually, it's a lot cleaner method than you might think, if done right. My dad is old enough to have lived in a shack back in the bush down in Florida when he was a youngster fresh off the farm with a wife and kid to feed (my much older sister, not me). He didn't make enough money for food for all three of them, and he didn't have a gun, so he hunted wild hogs with his knife and fished without a pole. Anyway, as to hog hunting with a knife, he says there's a technique to it, that goes as follows:

Once you've found your hog, just start chasing it. You don't have to run full-tilt, but you want to be going faster than a jogging pace. Just settle in and pace yourself, because you're going to do this for about 45 minutes. If there's a bunch of hogs around, whatever you do, don't get distracted - stay on the hog you started with. Don't let up, or take a rest, just keep after him and don't let it stop to rest.

After about 45 minutes (give or take a while), the hog will get tired and stop running and just stand there. Then you just go up to the stationary hog, make quick work of it with your knife, and you have your hog.

[CanAm500]

Well said Kutenay!

That is exactally what is happening in todays politics. Lets hope with a new government it will change. I know alot of people around Lake Cowichan that carry their rifles and such while hicking here, my mom wants to take a hike up some mountian one of these days. Dad said that if we are going to go and do that, he is going to bring the 12 gauge and he will allow me to take my rifle along.
As with home defense with firearms, would the RCMP (or other police agances) rather investagate a murder of a family (having no self defense) or would they rather investagte someone shot while trying to enter your house with a weapon. Peronsally if I was a cop, I would rather investagate a robber shot rather then lets say a family.

[Camp Cook]

I had a meeting with Ujjal Desanjh during this last election in regards to his backing the handgun ban and stating to the media that we don't use handguns to shoot bears.

During our conversation he just totally slimmed his way around answering any questions directly. I've never seen anything like it before. Even when I brought up that I do and have legally shot black bears with handguns he was able to sugar coat his answers.

All Lieberals have hidden agendas to get rid of firearms in this country and they talk about the CPC having a scary hidden aganda.

[The 'Hummer']

I firmly believe that the use and ownership of ALL firearms or ANY other type of weapon is my fundamental BIRTHRIGHT and that of all other Canadians, without exception. I own pistols, have for nearly 40 years and have carried while working and recreating in the bush as did many of my friends. I do not do so now as I have too much to lose in terms of a confiscation of my quite valuable ballistic weapons collection.

I worked among Grizzlies, alone, for many years and I have customized weapons for that purpose, however, in certain circumstances, I would carry my Ruger Redhawk STS. 5.5" .44 Mag. loaded with my "bear loads", regardless of whether a given R.C.M.P. detachment would issue me a permit or not. Frankly, I will not have a "Mountie", especially one born in another country telling me what I can do in the bush and that's that.

We Canadians are FAR too willing to allow politicians, bureaucrats, self-appointed "experts" such as "Wendy" and other social engineers to tell us what we should/should not do and I am godam sick of it and will do what MY conscience tells me is right and to hell with those who try to stop me.

During the recent election, Ujjal Singh Dosanjh, who came to Canada in 1967 and Sukh Singh Dhaliwal, who came to Canada in 1984, BOTH strongly advocated a (quote) "gunfree Canada"; I was working with guns when these guys came here and was born here and NOBODY is taking my guns away, no matter what I have to do to stop them.

I find it interesting that these individuals strongly support the "right" of their immigrant Sikh fellows to carry deadly, razorsharp daggers, yet, they think they have the right to ban MY choice of weapons and interfere with my cultural traditions.....this is one example of what is wrong with Canada at present.

I have also spent many years working the streets of Vancity and in hospital emerg. rooms; I live in what the V.P.D. patrol cops refer to as "Ho Chi Minh Trail". I have actually had to use one of my handguns to chase an intruder out of my home....he ran, so, I didn't shoot him.

I know from experience that handguns are NOT the problem, drugs, "soft" enforcement/punishment standards and lax immigration standards plus the "punk" attitude fostered in our "video culture" are the real cause of contemporary social decay. So, I favour CCW by anyone who does not have a violent, criminal record or severe mental illness; I would not bother in town, but, would while backpacking.
Like a lot of you, I have some serious concerns on gun control, especially after Paul Martin's pre election proposed strategy to institute a ban on handguns.:!:In addition to three letters to the T.C editor prior to the election, I made my my position known to elected federal reps and election 'hopefuls'. I did receive a reply & clarification of their position from Norm Sowden, the PC candidate as well as Jean Crowder of the NDP. I also sent something similar to a number of provincial govt. members, including Mr. Campbell. I didn't really expect to get a response from the 'Social Credit' Liberals, and I wasn't disappointed.:roll: Jean Crowder & her people made a couple of requests for a meeting, and that meeting took place yesterday afternoon. :neutral: The purpose was to discuss aspects of and voice concerns on gun control and firearms legislation. The meeting was originally set for half an hour but ended up taking the best part of an hour. As it was schedualed for a relatively short duration, I went in with notes so as not to miss too many concerns of the law abiding gun owners. She seems to have a good grasp of our position, asked some good questions & expressed some valid concerns from other sectors of the constituency. I feel the procedings went well and have offered to participate in any future 'dealings' on the subject. Over all, the 'official' position of the NDP on gun control probably doesn't differ much from that of the Liberals. How much good did or will the meeting actually do?:?: Who knows but at least she was interested enough to open some constructive dialogue.