MY Traditional Hunting and Fishing Territory

[Fisher-Dude]

Today I was hunting in MY traditional hunting territory. I've been hunting there all my life, and my father and his friends have hunted there since before I was born. We have a cabin in MY traditional territory that my dad built almost 60 years ago.

Here's a picture of me and one of our hunting partners about 40 years ago in MY traditional hunting territory:


http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e70/Fisher-Dude/Traditional.jpg


We harvested many bucks there in the 1960s:


http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e70/Fisher-Dude/MeLouie.jpg


I've never seen a native up there in 47 years. I've never found any Indian burial plots, Innushuks, pictographs, healing stones, nor culturally modified trees, and believe me, I've looked for them for 47 years. In fact, MY dad and his friends made a culturally modified tree in the area in the late 1960s to mark OUR traditional hunting and fishing territory:


http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e70/Fisher-Dude/AAugscan0002-1.jpg


My dad and his friends hiked up the mountain during WWII and fished the lakes. They never saw any natives in the area either. This is MY traditional hunting area that I use for sustenance purposes to feed my family.

You're all welcome to use it, as long as you buy the proper tags and licenses and respect the fishing and hunting regulations, and hunt only within the seasons/rules as laid out in the regulations. There will be no hunting or fishing for anyone outside the seasons in the regulations, regardless of your race. Enjoy and respect MY traditional hunting and fishing territory.

[DV-67]

Awesome post. Thanks

[rishu_pepper]

Great. I'll come over and hunt your territory, FD. Just lend me your quad. :lol:

[dougan]

best post yet thanx!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

[Jelvis]

Dooood -- pass the peace pipe and tell us the name of that lake and mountain, you did'nt mention the location, so can't say whether your recollections are clear, or a little smokey, kinda hazy and fogged up a bit.
You sound like the first hunters there, so yah you own that spot. So tell me where it is so I won't trespass by mistake --
Jel -- I'm waiting ? Is it up the Beaver Dee ?

[Fisher-Dude]

Jelly, there's no fear of trespassing, as no one can be charged with trespassing on any of the traditional territories in BC. As I said, you're free to hunt and fish there. You just have to follow the regulations when you're in MY traditional territory, the same as everyone else. :-D

[BigBanger]

nice . family heritage .

[hunter1947]

FD I love seeing old photos like this have you got some more to post up ???.
Looks like your dad was some hunter ,nice bucks he has laying on the ground ,thanks for posting them http://www.huntingbc.ca/forum/images/icons/icon6.gif http://www.huntingbc.ca/forum/images/icons/icon6.gif.

[Spokerider]

Thats one real proud papa and his son there.
Cool pics, great topic!

[valleycowboy]

FD.....this has to be one of the best threads i have seen on here.
very well stated and i hope "others" read and obey the regulations.

[sheep.elk.moose fanatic]

very cool thread dude!!

[The Hermit]

+10 points for FisherDude!!

[6616]

Candidate for: "Thread of the Year"

[Little Hawk]

Awesome post FD!
You'll cherish those photos for the rest of your days as will future generations in your clan.
Hope you keep a 'hard-copy' of this post to pass on to your kids.

Nice pecker on tree-man there... ha ha!

[snowhunter]

So, before Columbus, nobody lived in what we today call the America's ?

From the pictures of the persons and the vegetation, I will find out where this hunting Sangri La is, and also let the Inuit's of Nunavut Nations know where they forgot to put up Inukshuks, when they took this, until now, unknown southern detour through British Columbia while migrating in the arctic :)

Before you know it, this secret hunting mecca will be full of modified tree's, First Nation and Inuit hunters and political activist.

I will also, as soon as possible, request the Nunavut Government to send a team to build Inukshuks on this land :)

For about the last 3000 years, most of the local Natives did not bury their deads, but cremated them, or put them up on a platforms, which did not leave any lasting burial monuments. Most ancient British Columbia burial grounds are therefore older than 3000 years.

[wetcoasthunter]

So, before Columbus, nobody lived in what we today call the America's ?

From the pictures of the persons and the vegetation, I will find out where this hunting Sangri La is, and also let the Inuit's of Nunavut Nations know where they forgot to put up Inukshuks, when they took this, until now, unknown southern detour through British Columbia while migrating in the arctic :)

Before you know it, this secret hunting mecca will be full of modified tree's, First Nation and Inuit hunters and political activist.

I will also, as soon as possible, request the Nunavut Government to send a team to build Inukshuks on this land :)

For about the last 3000 years, most of the local Natives did not bury their deads, but cremated them, or put them up on a platforms, which did not leave any lasting burial monuments. Most ancient British Columbia burial grounds are therefore older than 3000 years.


Thanks for the post.....buzzkill

[mrdoog]

Well done.
Must bring back a flood of memories everytime you see those photos.

[d6dan]

Great post FD. Always nice to see nostalgic pictures of hunters and game..Got any more?.:)

[pappy]

I was told by my father who was told by his father and grandfather, that if you wish to hunt on native land you must bring a gift to the chief as a sign of respect for their nation and land. thats what natives did thru history to not start wars over hunting and fishing territory.Now you have to remember "people" showed up took away their freedom stuffed them on reserves and then called this place a free country. And some of those "people'' still don't realize the impact that happened. I've talked to a chief over the phone without giving a gift and was given permission to hunt their land, that was a nice gesture on his part.

[Blainer]

I as well appreciate the pictures and the post.
Snowhunter,did Columbus deliver your h1n1 shot yet?

[pappy]

Those are cool pictures I wish my family had more than the few kicking around.

[frenchbar]

:cool:i will even make sure i wear my yzerman jersey when i hunt your T.H.T:mrgreen:

[venison4me]

man thats awsome, i vote you for president.everyone should have to play by the same rules.

[Chuck]

Fisher-Dude, your gesture of hospitality is a very generous and good thing to do. It's not that common to see this sort of thing done today and it's too bad really for all of us. My best wishes to you!

[gutpile]

great pictures but where is this place!:)

[hillclimber]

great post FD. love the tree:). so when are you gonna give out gps co-ordinates????

[moosehunter21]

I LOVE this post! Well put...

[betteroffishing]

thats all fine and dandy , but come near mine and ill charge you to enter and durring the offseason i'll make certain to kill anything of value so that you dont get any meat that me and mine need more than you and yours , lol

[snowhunter]

No, Columbus did not give me my H1n1 shoots, but he sure brought me some good looking women :)

[msawyer]

Fisher-dude...

Nice family hunting history... great read... Until you introduced the racist, anti-first nations rhetoric...

While I sense your pain and frustration, you need to accept that first nations matters are complex, socially, legally and politically, with no simple or painless answer... The sooner we start to show some empathy and respect, the sooner these difficult issues may start to be resolved... To simply dismiss the first nations perspective will not contribute to any positive outcome... Not now and not in the future...

"Post of the year"... I think not...

Best regards

Mike Sawyer

[mark]

Fisher-dude...

Nice family hunting history... great read... Until you introduced the racist, anti-first nations rhetoric...

While I sense your pain and frustration, you need to accept that first nations matters are complex, socially, legally and politically, with no simple or painless answer... The sooner we start to show some empathy and respect, the sooner these difficult issues may start to be resolved... To simply dismiss the first nations perspective will not contribute to any positive outcome... Not now and not in the future...

"Post of the year"... I think not...

Best regards

Mike Sawyer

1 LAW FOR All PERSONS BORN IN CANADA!
No more racism or jealousy!
Immigrants on probation for life, screw up, get a plane ride home!
Problems solved!

Nice pics FD! :)

[Salty]

FD I'm confused. The pics are awsome and all but I don't see any road hunting so I think its all bs . :tongue:

I have traditional land too. But its all bug kill now :-?

[snowhunter]

Any knowledgeable person can tell you, that the pre-Columbian Inuit people have never ever ventured or lived in British Columbia, and because of that, no matter how hard you look, you will not find any ancient Inukshuk's in British Columbia, as you claim you have looked for, but never found in your "private, British Columbia family hunting grounds".

Please stop these phobias, and enjoy what you have, and stop hunting for shadows of the past and present, First Nations history of British Columbia and the America's, which you clearly do not understand, by claiming, among others, that you have never found any ancient Inukshuks in B.C., and therefore you are the first to hunt these land :)

[Gateholio]

Actually, there is an Inukshuk in Pemberton. Weird, but true.

[Ambush]

that you have never found any ancient Inukshuks in B.C., and therefore you are the first to hunt these land :)

He knows that. I'm just really surprised that you are taking him literaly.

Those are great pics from the old days, good times in a more innocent world.

The message is true and timely.

[snowhunter]

Inukshuk's was originally only made by Inuit. Reproduction Inukshuk can be made by anyone.

It would be as naive, if a First Nations persons, who lived or travelled in Europe, publicly, started to claim to be the first person to set foot and hunt certain parts of Europe, as it is for this particular British Columbian to makes this bizarre claim here in B.C. :)

[boxhitch]

Whats all the fuss about ?
You think F-D is the only guy with a long family association with a hunting area? anywhere?
His tradition even dates back to pre-contact......

and he is OK now, it was nothing that penicillin couldn't fix.

[boxhitch]

Inukshuk's was originally only made by Inuit.
With a specific purpose. Nothing to do with BC or the five ring circus.

[Kody94]

Fisher-Dude, awesome post! Loved it. The pic's are priceless and the sentiment even more so.



Fisher-dude...

Nice family hunting history... great read... Until you introduced the racist, anti-first nations rhetoric...

While I sense your pain and frustration, you need to accept that first nations matters are complex, socially, legally and politically, with no simple or painless answer... The sooner we start to show some empathy and respect, the sooner these difficult issues may start to be resolved... To simply dismiss the first nations perspective will not contribute to any positive outcome... Not now and not in the future...

"Post of the year"... I think not...

Best regards

Mike Sawyer

Acknowleging (and even celebrating) the hunting heritage and connection to the land that non-FNs feel is not (necessarilly) a slight against FNs. Dismissing the perspective of non-FN resident hunters in FN related matters has been all to common and equally does not contribute to positive outcomes.

JMHO,
4Ster

[Seeadler]

Wow, where is this virgin territory, I assume that there is no sign of prospectors or trappers, loggers or miners either?

[Fisher-Dude]

Wow, where is this virgin territory, I assume that there is no sign of prospectors or trappers, loggers or miners either?

There are prospectors, trappers, and loggers in the area. I too utilize the forest resource, gathering firewood from MY territory, all pursuant to a duly issued MoF firewood permit of course. We ALL have to follow the same rules, regardless of whom we are, in MY traditional hunting and fishing territory! :wink:

[snowhunter]

You are a self proclaimed "Land Baron", with a definete territory which you claim as your own, which you now feel gives you the rights to challenge if there ever has been any First Nations people on "your territory".

Wondering if you also have changed your name to "Napoleon" ?

You should google and contact (Prince) Cavan van Ulft, who has claimed Hans Island, together with the Government of Canada and Denmark.

Some years ago, I run into another "individual", who had claimed a piece of British Columbia for himself, who had blocked off a bridge with his car, and denied access to anyone to his "private territory" .

RCMP told me later, that they had one hell of a hard time in arresting this "man", who voluntarily had been off his prescribed "medications" for few days :)

[Blainer]

I don't believe this thread was to be taken literally,but I do believe that most got the just of it.

[Devilbear]

This is an OUTSTANDING post and it so clearly shows the savage bigotry, historical-archaeological ignorance and materialistic greed of the members of one certain racial group and their opportunistic supporters here in B.C.

(I claim ALL of B.C. as MY "traditional territory" and will ONLY share it with others just like me. Why not, we whose ancestors built Canada from a land sparsely populated by Neolithic cannibals, who had NEVER formed a single nation where Canada now is, have THE REAL RIGHTS in this territory.)

Geez, is that "racist", well, suck it up, Canada belongs to ALL of us, who are citizens here, aboriginal, mixed race, "old family" descendants, naturalized immigrants and, even Gatehouse, tutu, spear and all!

The very idea of special rights based on race should outrage EVERY Canuck and the term "first nations" is a recently devised bit of "political bafflegab" intended to con all Canadians to the benefit of a few and I do not use it and will not recognize it......ONE CANADA FOR ALL!!!!

[KodiakHntr]

This is an OUTSTANDING post and it so clearly shows the savage bigotry, historical-archaeological ignorance and materialistic greed of the members of one certain racial group and their opportunistic supporters here in B.C.

I claim ALL of B.C. as MY "traditional territory" and will ONLY share it with others just like me. Why not, we whose ancestors built Canada from a land sparsely populated by Neolithic cannibals, who had NEVER formed a single nation where Canada now is, have THE REAL RIGHTS in this territory.

Geez, is that "racist", well, suck it up, Canada belongs to ALL of us, who are citizens here, aboriginal, mixed race, "old family" descendants, naturalized immigrants and, even Gaterhouse, tutu, spear and all!

The very idea of special rights based on race should outrage EVERY Canuck and the term "first nations" is a recently devised bit of "political bafflegab" intended to con all Canadians to the benefit of a few and I do not use it and will not recognize it......ONE CANADA FOR ALL!!!!


Why is forming a "Nation" a requirement for you? Just because someone else's values aren't yours does that make theirs less important?

[Ruger4]

Thanx Pat , cool post .....

[whitespringer]

Love the heritage. Puts it all in perspective. Thx.

[stitch]

In one word "CLASSIC"...love the post FD

[Fisher-Dude]

You are a self proclaimed "Land Baron", with a definete territory which you claim as your own, which you now feel gives you the rights to challenge if there ever has been any First Nations people on "your territory".

Wondering if you also have changed your name to "Napoleon" ?

You should google and contact (Prince) Cavan van Ulft, who has claimed Hans Island, together with the Government of Canada and Denmark.

Some years ago, I run into another "individual", who had claimed a piece of British Columbia for himself, who had blocked off a bridge with his car, and denied access to anyone to his "private territory" .

RCMP told me later, that they had one hell of a hard time in arresting this "man", who voluntarily had been off his prescribed "medications" for few days :)

I'm not claiming to be a land baron at all. I'm claiming MY traditional hunting and fishing territory to be open to use by all peoples, regardless of their race, or, in Gatehouse's case, cross-dressing orientation. I would welcome the pink tutu clad samsquantch into MY traditional territory, as long as he purchased the required licenses and followed the fish and game regulations, which I know he will. All people will have to purchase tags and licenses and follow the regulations.

I won't keep anyone out, unlike the desires of others in other areas. They simply have to contribute financially to the management of the fish and wildlife resources by purchasing tags and licenses, and maintain conservation levels by following seasons and bag limits. It's a small price to pay to hunt and fish in MY traditional hunting and fishing territory.

Welcome, my spear-chucking friend...enjoy your stay. :smile:

http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e70/Fisher-Dude/Gate_Clarke_Spear.jpg

[garyt]

hi tod i m half native myself and follow the regs as they should be. you should remember who made the rules and regs up. i believe it was the government that was voted in by everyone. well at least those that care to vote and not those that just bitch about everything. sure theres a few things that may not be great about native rights but surely things aren t as bad as you make them out to be. thats my opinion to share also, for those that care thks gary

[Jelvis]

Hey dooood, I was hunting in your traditional area and I had an accident on your access road because it was washed out and you did'nt maintain the road to acceptable safety standards and you failed to erect a warning sign, I'm crippled now, paralyzed from the waist down and I started a lawsuit against you for damages past present and future, see you in court.
Jel -- your area you said, and it happened on it, so your responsible for the damages.
You'll be getting a letter from my lawyer soon.
Get ready to pay for your lack of safety standards for your area.

[ratherbefishin]

its a very interesting perspective[I didn't say right or wrong] but for the sake of the discussion,lets say I agree with you-it IS your ''traditional hunting and fishing territory''going back several generations.Now lets make it interesting-lets say I come along,and kick you off, sell ''your'' land to MY friends and tell you not to come back-or play by MY rules...and when you protest-say your claim to land doesn't apply anymore because I have more friends than you do....

Or perhaps we should say that ownership of land does not extend to the next generation-it all reverts back to the government ....how would that sit?

Historically,land was carved up and allocated to various groups-the ONLY people who were left out were the orginal people living there....later on reserves prevented settlers and hordes of gold rush miners taking everything.

Maybe to make it a bit more personal-lets say 200 million chinese landed on our shores,planted THEIR flag and took over-saying THEY needed the land and anyway- we were ''underutilizing'' it and didn't need so much land anyway.....Of course-they would hold free and democratic elections and create THEIR own laws -but hey-we could vote if we wanted to couldn't we?......Kinda changes things doesn't it?

These aren't simple issues, and NOT addressing them does nobody any good-all we end up with is confrontation.Some forward thinking bands HAVE created jobs and income for their members by exploiting the hunting and fishing opportunities,and this breaks the welfare syndromn.

Note-I am NOT advocating ''giving back'' all of BC,paying billions of dollars, continuation of the welfare system[the worst thing we ever introduced]nor am I advocating the status quo-where abuse is clearly taking place ie-killing game and leaving it just because its somebodies perceived ''right'' to do so.But somewhere ,sometime ,somehow we have to come up with a fair and equitable solution-roadblocks and irresponsable hunting and fishing do no good to anybody,least of all the resource.Right now it seems to me the only people profiting are the lawyers...

[Ozone]

Hey dooood, I was hunting in your traditional area and I had an accident on your access road because it was washed out and you did'nt maintain the road to acceptable safety standards and you failed to erect a warning sign, I'm crippled now, paralyzed from the waist down and I started a lawsuit against you for damages past present and future, see you in court.
Jel -- your area you said, and it happened on it, so your responsible for the damages.
You'll be getting a letter from my lawyer soon.
Get ready to pay for your lack of up keep in your families territory.

To bad others couldnt be held legaly responsable when crossing "their" land.

[snowhunter]

I do'nt know about Gatehouse being a cross dresser. I do not what about him, that makes very good looking women go after him ? I do'nt think he is rich. I think the sexy women go after him, and take advantage of his innocense, because he is the artist type :)

[Gunner]

I do'nt know about Gatehouse being a cross dresser. I do not what about him, that makes very good looking women go after him ? I do'nt think he is rich. I think the sexy women go after him, and take advantage of his innocense, because he is the artist type :)Nawww,It's cause' he's such a good cook!:mrgreen: Gunner

[gary murray]

Now now guys. Beauty is only skin deep. :-D

[seanps]

its a very interesting perspective[I didn't say right or wrong] but for the sake of the discussion,lets say I agree with you-it IS your ''traditional hunting and fishing territory''going back several generations.Now lets make it interesting-lets say I come along,and kick you off, sell ''your'' land to MY friends and tell you not to come back-or play by MY rules...and when you protest-say your claim to land doesn't apply anymore because I have more friends than you do....

Or perhaps we should say that ownership of land does not extend to the next generation-it all reverts back to the government ....how would that sit?

Historically,land was carved up and allocated to various groups-the ONLY people who were left out were the orginal people living there....later on reserves prevented settlers and hordes of gold rush miners taking everything.

Maybe to make it a bit more personal-lets say 200 million chinese landed on our shores,planted THEIR flag and took over-saying THEY needed the land and anyway- we were ''underutilizing'' it and didn't need so much land anyway.....Of course-they would hold free and democratic elections and create THEIR own laws -but hey-we could vote if we wanted to couldn't we?......Kinda changes things doesn't it?

These aren't simple issues, and NOT addressing them does nobody any good-all we end up with is confrontation.Some forward thinking bands HAVE created jobs and income for their members by exploiting the hunting and fishing opportunities,and this breaks the welfare syndromn.

Note-I am NOT advocating ''giving back'' all of BC,paying billions of dollars, continuation of the welfare system[the worst thing we ever introduced]nor am I advocating the status quo-where abuse is clearly taking place ie-killing game and leaving it just because its somebodies perceived ''right'' to do so.But somewhere ,sometime ,somehow we have to come up with a fair and equitable solution-roadblocks and irresponsable hunting and fishing do good to anybody,least of all the resource.Right now it seems to me the only people profiting are the lawyers...

Agreed!

....

[Jelvis]

Hey Dooooood, pass the peace pipe lol, hey doooood if that's your traditional area, then why do you hunt in other areas then, because if it's not your traditional area you have different rules then so we're not equal like your dreaming about ? lol -- only on your traditional lands my friend, lol
Stay on there and you should only be using the old methods, your ancestors used horses and carts, old trucks, flint locks and muzzle loaders if you want to have your claim on an area ?
Jel -- yah see where this is going ? lol mine, mine, mine, ours. Opened up a new problem eh ?
Stay off my mountain unless you do everything I say is right lol Bite Me, the Dooood abides --
Your limiting your self and painting your self in a corner.hahah

[Snuneymuxw Hunter]

Consider your self lucky the FN's allowed your family to llive where they have been for all of these years. But that could be coming to an end end soon. There are Treaty's being signed all over Canada right now. And I'm sure you will see soon enough.

Your government had taken everything away from Fn's in the past and now it is time FN's get it all back.

I'm sorry you feel the way you do.

How about I take you away from your home and family prohibit you from speaking you language, strip you of your culture if you have one?
Start a new form of Residential school for you live in. In this school you will be beat if you speak your language, you will engage in extra curicular activities during the late night with the priest and you will have no say.
You will be forced to learn FN's language and that is all you will speak. Disobey and you will be beaten.
That is only a fraction of what FN's have had to live with.
Would that be fair Iif I were to do that to you and your family???????
Your racial remarks are I do feel sorry for you, And anyone that agrees with you.

*insults removed..

[joed4040]

Well said Ratherbefishin.

[Snuneymuxw Hunter]

I love the Douglas Treaty!
" The Right To Hunt & Fish As Formerly"
24-7-365

[Stone Sheep Steve]

Consider your self lucky the FN's allowed your family to llive where they have been for all of these years. But that could be coming to an end end soon. There are Treaty's being signed all over Canada right now. And I'm sure you will see soon enough.

Your government had taken everything away from Fn's in the past and now it is time FN's get it all back.

I'm sorry you feel the way you do.

How about I take you away from your home and family prohibit you from speaking you language, strip you of your culture if you have one?
Start a new form of Residential school for you live in. In this school you will be beat if you speak your language, you will engage in extra curicular activities during the late night with the priest and you will have no say.
You will be forced to learn FN's language and that is all you will speak. Disobey and you will be beaten.
That is only a fraction of what FN's have had to live with.
Would that be fair Iif I were to do that to you and your family???????
Your racial remarks are examlpe of how small your brain is, I do feel sorry for you, And anyone that agrees with you.

I don't think you're going to find too many people who would disagree that there were many travesties in the lifes of FN's peoples. Not cool at all but certainly not limited to here in Canada. History shows it was world wide.

There seems to be greatly varying attitudes in different Bands here in BC. There are those that are using the "tools" that they have and are making "positive changes"....... contributing to society and the ecomony and trying to change the attitudes of the public towards FN peoples.......and there are those Bands that want to only live in the past and focus on those past travesties. The difference in attitudes has to do with their leadership......or lack there of.

The World has changed greatly in the past couple hundred yrs....and will continue to change.....and not just here in BC. Unfortunately, we can't turn back the clocks:neutral:.

Look back or look forward??? The Choice is yours.


Respectfully,

SSS

[Fisher-Dude]

Some people are confused. There's no racism in MY traditional territory, as all people, regardless of race, are treated the same. They are welcome to hunt and fish. They all have to follow the same rules. No one is shut out. No one is denied access based on their race. They can hunt and fish side by side, and share the same campfires. It's the management model with the least racism of any area in the province.

How can everyone enjoying the same area, all with the same opportunities, be racist? I would challenge that areas that don't treat everyone the same, and foster resentment because some people are treated differently, are areas where racism flourishes.

[frenchbar]

Some people are confused. There's no racism in MY traditional territory, as all people, regardless of race, are treated the same. They are welcome to hunt and fish. They all have to follow the same rules. No one is shut out. No one is denied access based on their race. They can hunt and fish side by side, and share the same campfires. It's the management model with the least racism of any area in the province.

How can everyone enjoying the same area, all with the same opportunities, be racist? I would challenge that areas that don't treat everyone the same, and foster resentment because some people are treated differently, are areas where racism flourishes.
That was good Dude ..well put !

[bad arrow]

Some people are confused. There's no racism in MY traditional territory, as all people, regardless of race, are treated the same. They are welcome to hunt and fish. They all have to follow the same rules. No one is shut out. No one is denied access based on their race. They can hunt and fish side by side, and share the same campfires. It's the management model with the least racism of any area in the province.

How can everyone enjoying the same area, all with the same opportunities, be racist? I would challenge that areas that don't treat everyone the same, and foster resentment because some people are treated differently, are areas where racism flourishes.

That sounds rosie, until your traditional area becomes saturated with your non-racist hunting friends. Why would you limit yourself to a particular territory? it sounds limiting to me. Traditional territory when referring to native bands has been around for hundreds if not thousands of years and only was applied between nation to nation. If you want your own territory then ok, but you already have the confines of an entire province, why limit yourself the way 1st nations (indians) are?

[Casagrande]

I love the Douglas Treaty!
" The Right To Hunt & Fish As Formerly"

24-7-365
I assume this means pre-white contact - walking from a teepee with flint tools, wooden bow etc. For those who will not move on from the ugly shadows of the past there is no prospect for a better future. The status quo doesn't work and never has. Is there a better system than everyone being treated equally and opportunity for all? Not that I know of.

[OOBuck]

Some people are confused. There's no racism in MY traditional territory, as all people, regardless of race, are treated the same. They are welcome to hunt and fish. They all have to follow the same rules. No one is shut out. No one is denied access based on their race. They can hunt and fish side by side, and share the same campfires. It's the management model with the least racism of any area in the province.

How can everyone enjoying the same area, all with the same opportunities, be racist? I would challenge that areas that don't treat everyone the same, and foster resentment because some people are treated differently, are areas where racism flourishes.

The "ONE's" that didn't get your post and are now playing the racist card aren't worth wasting your time trying to explain it to..

Great post.. I might see you there.

[OOBuck]

Consider your self lucky the FN's allowed your family to llive where they have been for all of these years. But that could be coming to an end end soon. There are Treaty's being signed all over Canada right now. And I'm sure you will see soon enough.

Your government had taken everything away from Fn's in the past and now it is time FN's get it all back.

I'm sorry you feel the way you do.

How about I take you away from your home and family prohibit you from speaking you language, strip you of your culture if you have one?
Start a new form of Residential school for you live in. In this school you will be beat if you speak your language, you will engage in extra curicular activities during the late night with the priest and you will have no say.
You will be forced to learn FN's language and that is all you will speak. Disobey and you will be beaten.
That is only a fraction of what FN's have had to live with.
Would that be fair Iif I were to do that to you and your family???????
Your racial remarks are I do feel sorry for you, And anyone that agrees with you.

*insults removed..

Well, I'm sorry you think the way you do.

You, FN? & the government of this country can sign all the f--king treays you want, I ain't moving or paying for your ancestor or my ancestors mistakes.

Why do you or your future generation have more rights than me or my family? If I really spelled it out to you the way I wanted to I would get kick off the site. Time to start playing by the rules like the rest of us instead of being the kid in the corner of the sand box whining you don't have as much sand as the kid at the other end! Boo freakin Hoo! not only that but the government of this province & country can kiss my A$$

[Brambles]

I guess your traditional hunting territory only extends as far as you can shoot off the road, in that case I Hope there are lots of switchbacks cause the rumor is you don't let boot leather hit the ground unless you have to pee or take a shot.

Good photo's, good post. Are they your deer and elk too?

[325]

I agree that the FN were treated poorly by our government. I don't think anybody would argue that. However, I do not think ANY group in Canada should receive preferrential treatment or special privelages, other than maybe the disabled. The Indian Act was and is a huge mistake. It has not worked. It's time to move forward as equal Canadians as any other action will only yield resentment and future conflict. I am as Canadian as anybody else, and I will not concede that FNs are any more special than me or my children
It seems to me that many FN have a huge chip on their shoulder (I've lived on 2 reservations). That "chip" will not be removed by more hand-outs, land concessions, etc. The only solution is to scrap the Indian Act and limit the rights and privelages of FN to that of all Canadians.

[Blainer]

I appreciate that you have offered medical for all within your traditional hunting territory,and now that the internet is also available on your territory,it is second to none.

[ohno]

or take a shot.

Not neccessarily :)

[Devilbear]

The "ONE's" that didn't get your post and are now playing the racist card aren't worth wasting your time trying to explain it to..

Great post.. I might see you there.

That about says it.

[weatherby_man]

F-D, great posting.

To those bringing out the racist and reparations song and dance,,,,

We have ALL been mistreated at one time or another during mans history. Where do I line up for the reparations given to my people who SLAVED, were KILLED, and TORTURED under much worse conditions then the natives in Canada ever experienced?

Suck it up Sally, and move on.

[Devilbear]

Well, I'm sorry you think the way you do.

You, FN? & the government of this country can sign all the f--king treays you want, I ain't moving or paying for your ancestor or my ancestors mistakes.

Why do you or your future generation have more rights than me or my family? If I really spelled it out to you the way I wanted to I would get kick off the site. Time to start playing by the rules like the rest of us instead of being the kid in the corner of the sand box whining you don't have as much sand as the kid at the other end! Boo freakin Hoo! not only that but the government of this province & country can kiss my A$$


Even better!!!!

[Jelvis]

another thread bites the dust, and another thread bites, and another thread bites, another thread bites the dust, and another thread is dead, and gone, down hill faster than the Jamaican bob sled team. Hahaa another one bites the dust, the same way as all the others go -- cowboys and indians -- another one bitez the dust --
Jel -- John Wayne and Ko chees -- Another thread goes down hill fast lol -- > that away >>>>>>
so long Pard

[rattling_junkie]

The so-called "Native issue" is a very sensitive and complicated one. It was terrible how the Natives were treated and even more of a travesty how the treaties were formed. I suggest to anyone to actually study the history of the treaties, you will see what I mean. So I can definitely understand why the Native population feels slighted.

Although, there comes a point when people must move on (said in previous post) and try to mend their lives. My ancestors were persecuted for their religion all over the world and now are some of the most successful (economically) people around.

I admit that I have ambivalent feelings towards the whole debate. On one side I am pro-Native but on the other I feel they need to move on. I am convinced that my ambivalence is evidence for the complication of the subject.

I urge my fellow Canadians (of all races) to learn the history and to put yourselves in one another's shoes. In this manner we can come to a resolution instead of always fighting for our piece of the pie.

[Devilbear]

...to actually study the history..., really, would you care to comment on "Huronia", what it was, who founded it and WHO destroyed it?

Perhaps, you might elucidate the Beothuk situation and WHO slaughtered them?

The "treaties", you refer to, would that include the "Nishga" agreement brought about by "Boy Stalin" Glen Clark, that the OTHER aborigines in that region would not accept?

What about cannibalism, slavery and rituals that totally destroyed the ability to survive a winter that these peoples practised. WHO dealt with this and TRIED to stop the eating of one tribe's members here on the BC coast by their neighbours. NO, you say???? Wellllll, why did they have "war canoes"?????

Research "the Seneca cornfields", "The Marquis de Tracy" and the bloodshed between the various tribes that WHITE pioneers stopped and, THEN, tell me just how horrible we were to these Neolithic primitives.

Oh, and read the comments by "Chief" Bill Wilson, who boasted about his grandfather's SLAVES serving him in the 1950s, here in BC.....published in the "Sun", just last year and available through "Google".

...slighted....??????, my ass, the REAL problem is that we have been TOO generous, TOO tolerant and put up with outrages such as "Caledonia", "Oka" and so forth...when we should use our armed forces to stop such violence.

[rattling_junkie]

Devilbear,

Talk about living up to your handle! Way to try and build bridges.

I know a lot of what you talk about but please also mention the bloody history of Europe because it is so much more "civilized" (ya right).

Sounds like you got all the answers. You should run for PM and bring them forward. The implementation of armed forces seems like a rather civilized and well educated one.

[325]

I think one of the big issues is that FN perceive "whites" as having all kinds of advantages in our society. I wonder if FN had to earn their own money, pay outrages taxes and mortgage their own houses, if they would still be so pissed at "whitey". I'm sure they wouldn't. The grass is always greener. Hand-outs are the baine of the FN..they need to stop.

[ufishifish2]

A couple comments will quickly be made by meself, then I am going out for an evening hunt to forget about this maddening topic.
This crap will not end until everyone is treated equally. No special treatment for anyone. We, as Canadians, can't affort to be paying out Billions and Billions of dollars for errors made in the past. Eventually the well will run dry. What then??? Just like cigarettes, time to start the weening process.
In nature, it has always eventually ended up being "Survival of the fittest." Spoon feeding the Natives is continually making their people weaker, and unable to keep up with the ever changing times.
Everyone is equal in my eyes, no worse, and certainly no better.
Way to go F-D, great thread. I think I get it, then again.......

[Spokerider]

The so-called "Native issue" is a very sensitive and complicated one. It was terrible how the Natives were treated and even more of a travesty how the treaties were formed. I suggest to anyone to actually study the history of the treaties, you will see what I mean. So I can definitely understand why the Native population feels slighted.

Although, there comes a point when people must move on (said in previous post) and try to mend their lives. My ancestors were persecuted for their religion all over the world and now are some of the most successful (economically) people around.

I admit that I have ambivalent feelings towards the whole debate. On one side I am pro-Native but on the other I feel they need to move on. I am convinced that my ambivalence is evidence for the complication of the subject.

I urge my fellow Canadians (of all races) to learn the history and to put yourselves in one another's shoes. In this manner we can come to a resolution instead of always fighting for our piece of the pie.





Well put....

*most* Canadians recognize [ IMHO ] that severe injustices have been perpetrated on the FN peoples. YES, is was bad, wrong and deplorable! But it happened.

However, just WHEN are we willing to "move on" as CANADIANS?? Will it be this generation perhaps? 10 years from now? Fifty years from now? 100 years from now? Ever??

Just what drives this seemingly insatiable appetite for restitution by our Canadian FN peoples? Greed? Dispair? Anger? Pride? WHEN will enough restitution be "enough"? WHEN will this wrong be righted??

Will there EVER be "forgiveness" for the wrongs our past Canadian government committed? To forgive, is to accept, and acceptance is a necessary step in "moving on".

[Devilbear]

Devilbear,

Talk about living up to your handle! Way to try and build bridges.

I know a lot of what you talk about but please also mention the bloody history of Europe because it is so much more "civilized" (ya right).

Sounds like you got all the answers. You should run for PM and bring them forward. The implementation of armed forces seems like a rather civilized and well educated one.


I agree, that is the gist of my post, ALL HUMANS HAVE, DO and CAN kill, maim, rob, torture, rape and otherwise misuse other humans; the only way to try to prevent this is total equality for all Canadians.

No, I do not have ...all the answers... and have never claimed to, however, I DO seriously study history and avoid making the sort of egregious errors you made in the post to which I responded.

Oh, and I HAVE NEVER suggested using Canada's forces on ANYONE, except terrorists who harass and threaten other Canadians and destroy their property....is that not what our forces are for?

Given that you ...know about... the few incidents I mentioned, could you explain to me your interpretation of what the news "blackout" of "Gore Creek" was/is all about?

[OOBuck]

Think of this, even by the "political correct" term now used for Natives by Natives & the government imposes something.

"FIRST" first at what?

You were here first?
The government deals with you first?

Time for this shit to stop!!

[Devilbear]

Yup, it is a deliberate distortion of a term which has been invented to give credence to a false claim of primary rights by one ethnic minority here in Canada.

It is reminiscent of Josef Goebbel's "Big Lie" technique.

[325]

Think of this, even by the "political correct" term now used for Natives by Natives & the government imposes something.

"FIRST" first at what?

You were here first?
The government deals with you first?

Time for this shit to stop!!

Agreed. Most of the people who support major land concessions, etc, are not hunters and are not peope who have lived on/near reservations. Unfortunately most are ignorant urbanites who base their opinion on Hollywood lionization of natives with such movies as "Dances with Wolves".

Read the autobiographies and journals of trappers, prospectors and fur-traders to get a more realistic picture of the lives of natives early post-Euorpean contact. Definately no eden.

First Nations is a politicaly-driven bullsh!t moniker. We are all just Canadians (for the record, I don't like indo-Canadian or African-Canadian or any other divisive handle).

[bad arrow]

Most of these posters aren't even close to the topic at hand, an aboriginal right to hunt in traditional territory is not what its cracked up to be, you are confined to a very small area in truth, and furthermore, if you buy a licence you can hunt the entire province. An aboriginal right to hunt is very limiting, check into it, I wonder at times if this site is not a platform for some hate-mongering group that preys on the weak minded people I call sheep. Its not about the wrongs that were comitted by anyones ancestors, its about Canada's relationship with its aboriginal people that brings about hunting right's, it has nothing to do with anyone else, period, As I said earlier, traditional territory was established long before you showed up, between the nation's, why is it your business now? its not. Look who's pulling the race card, in all honesty, some of your comments are pathetic and nothing more than school yard bullying and the mentality of school children, or should I say sheep, just when I put my velcro gloves away for the winter.

[wetcoasthunter]

Most of these posters aren't even close to the topic at hand, an aboriginal right to hunt in traditional territory is not what its cracked up to be, you are confined to a very small area in truth, and furthermore, if you buy a licence you can hunt the entire province. An aboriginal right to hunt is very limiting, check into it, I wonder at times if this site is not a platform for some hate-mongering group that preys on the weak minded people I call sheep. Its not about the wrongs that were comitted by anyones ancestors, its about Canada's relationship with its aboriginal people that brings about hunting right's, it has nothing to do with anyone else, period, As I said earlier, traditional territory was established long before you showed up, between the nation's, why is it your business now? its not. Look who's pulling the race card, in all honesty, some of your comments are pathetic and nothing more than school yard bullying and the mentality of school children, or should I say sheep, just when I put my velcro gloves away for the winter.


Its my business because its my f'in money that goes to fund these claims. The indians are still acting like they have zero chance at success, still playing the victim, acting like they don't already get more from government than the rest of us. Most of us are just saying lets all be equal, play under the same set of rules, how is that racist oh educated one? BTW, racism isn't the sole domain of the whites, get over yourself if you think otherwise.

It still boggles the mind why it takes these groups 150 years to realize they have rights over certain parts of land that has been occupied by others for over 100 years???? Did they not see what was going on? Why didn't they take action to stop developement on this land if it was so "sacred" to them? My guess is back in the day they felt the land was worthless so why bother, but now that its worth millions its time to make a stink. I would say this inaction on their part implied that the taking of this land was acceptable, hope the courts see it this way too. You snooze you lose.

[325]

It seems to me, that you have already imbibed all too many of the ...wobbly pops... that you refer to and I would not want to encourage you to further incomprehensible and historically ludicrous rants like these two. So, NO, I would not even consider drinking with you, anywhere or anytime.

Now, I have absolutely NO intention of sending you a PM, gawd, what a thought! So, not to worry, your ravings and hallucinations are safe from me!

One little question, tho', just EXACTLY what percentage of un-altered aboriginal blood/heritage do YOU actually have? Are you a pure "Shuswap" or a "Metis", perhaps, OR, could you be MOSTLY "whitey" and use the small amount of aboriginal ancestry you have to "work the system"......tell us true, jelly, do.....


My step-daughter has a metis card. She's a natural blonde with blue eyes. It just so happens that her grandmother was a native. I told her I didn't approve of her getting the card, but she thinks, correctly, that it may open some doors for her. Just glad my heard-earned tax dollars can support this kind of absurdity...

The only way to end this perpetual idiocy is to make all Canadians equal.

[bensonvalley]

I laugh everytime I decode those posts!

[Johnnybear]

I laugh everytime I decode those posts!

If you have the decoder you are looking to make some money there feller:-D.


In all seriousness my take on FD's post is that he is refering to ALL of the huntable land of British Columbia. If so then great thread FD. I haven't found anything he has posted as being racial at all. Any racial comments have come after the original post.

[Devilbear]

The rules of this forum prevent me from making the appropriate response to the defamatory, racist, historically false and snivelling nonsense contained in this post.

So, I shall only say that this is exactly WHY there is growing antagonism among Canadians to those who consider themselves of "special" status and, given the on-going situations such as "Oka", "Gustafsen Lake" and "Caledonia", I can forsee a terrible end to it all.

I could go on, at length, with the REAL history of Louis Riel and so forth, but, I will not bother as comments like this are what one expects, considering the source and are hardly worth the energy.

[Casagrande]

Like all tribes,clans (etc) of all colours, world wide we generally evolved into nations, seeking to support ourselves and exploit others for our own survival. The concept of traditional territory among the various tribes is a fallacy. Do you honestly think that as the various bands of people began to inhabit North America that it was done so harmoniously? They fought each other for the best areas containing the best resources. Raiding parties? This has been the history of the human race. Whites have done it to each other as have blacks, browns, reds, yellows. The idea of traditional territory is ever changing, never constant.

[j270wsm]

It still boggles the mind why it takes these groups 150 years to realize they have rights over certain parts of land that has been occupied by others for over 100 years???? Did they not see what was going on? Why didn't they take action to stop developement on this land if it was so "sacred" to them? My guess is back in the day they felt the land was worthless so why bother, but now that its worth millions its time to make a stink. I would say this inaction on their part implied that the taking of this land was acceptable, hope the courts see it this way too. You snooze you lose.

According to the Indian chief's, like chief Joseph of the Nez perz and Sitting Bull, the natives didnt own the land they took care of and used the land.

[Devilbear]

My, my, CG, how terribly lacking in trendy political rectitude you are!!!

The ONLY peoples on Earth who ALWAYS lived in utter harmony with each other were the Neolithic primitives of North America, don't you KNOW that???

This, of course, is WHY they called their young males "warriors".........

LAFFIN' :) :) :)

[mike_b]

Fisher-dude, great post and great pics.

I'm sorry to say though that I didn't get to read your whole thread; got tired of some of the pissin' and moanin'.

It's really to bad that such an awesome thread went for shit so damn quickly.....

[Laurence_Erickson]

truly a great post fd. memories is what it is all about

[bad arrow]

I hope the indians get everything they want, road closures and access to all the land, I hope they kick some sorry assess out of the bush. This site is run by whites for whites, thats obvious.

[Fisher-Dude]

Some of you get the gist of my thread. Some think I'm threatening to "take something away from them", even though they have no friggin' clue where I'm talking about. It's interesting that such a culture of entitlement exists in some people's minds, even when they don't know where/what I'm saying is MY traditional territory.

Mike_b, the thread is getting people to express their opinions, and that's good. I think it helps us understand the issues better.

I was speaking with a fellow at a fish & game meeting last night. He and I both talked about when we were kids how we hung out with the Indian kids, catching frogs, snakes, turtles, and minnows together. He talked about how the races are now very segregated socially, more than they ever have been. He said he sees hatred from both races toward one another, and he felt it was getting worse by the day. I think the government needs to stop and look at how, in their attempts to attone for whatever happened many years ago, they've actually caused a deep division among people instead of bringing them together to live harmoniously.

In MY traditional territory, everyone can hunt and fish side by side, but they all have to follow the same rules and regulations, so that no resentment is fostered. It's a win/win. :smile:

[bad arrow]

You dont have any traditional territory, get it, you have the run of the whole province and the whole of Canada, your post was intended to demoralize the aboriginal community on site, many of your previous posts are similiar in nature, cut the BS, bringing people together in harmony, *****

[Sitkaspruce]

You dont have any traditional territory, get it, you have the run of the whole province and the whole of Canada, your post was intended to demoralize the aboriginal community on site, many of your previous posts are similiar in nature, cut the BS, bringing people together in harmony, *****

Bad Arrow

So do you have the run of the entire province and all of Canada. Why do you make it like you do not??

So please tell us what your vision of the future should be. I know it will kick up a few remarks but I am curious as to what your thoughs on how we should harmonize so that this stuff does not pi$$ you off.

Nobody should have traditional terrirtory, it should be for one and all to use, with the same rules for everyone, no segragetion, no "special rules", no one user being treated differently, no "Holder" of the land and finally no one group holding another "Hostage" with roadblocks, threats and protests.

I think that the post by FD was to see that WE all have the same rules, regardless of race, colour or history.

Think about it, no more segragation by race in BC, no more of the posts that pi$$ you off and no more precieved "Racisim"

What an even better province we would be living in if that happened.

Cheers

SS

[Gateholio]

Posts that are personal in nature will keep getting deleted. Let's keep the personal stuff off the thread, please.

[lunatic]

You're definately right about the two races drawing further apart. My wife was recently at an event that was attended by a mixture of whites and natives. As my wife is the friendly sort, she attempted to socialize with a couple of different native woman and was snubbed big time. We have a few close friends in Dawson Creek that are native and we were discussing this with them. They were as disgusted as we were. There are definately a good number of prejudice natives out there.

[Devilbear]

FD, I understand what you have tried to do here and I greatly respect you for your attempt to bring a little levity and even some gentle reality into this sad situation. However, your friend at the meeting was right and I have seen the same thing since the early '60s; I honestly doubt that the current disastrous state of affairs CAN be "fixed" and I view the future of Canadian-aboriginal affairs with sorrow and a sense of loss.

It seems that any thread here brings out much the same "crew" of the "entitled" who can make any slurs they wish concerning others in respect of age, religious beliefs or lack thereof and even insinuate improper behaviour among other people's forbearers...WITHOUT the slightest proof or verifiable historical record. I doubt that this will stop and the extreme racism demonstrated by these few malcontents simply lowers the discussion to a level commonly associated with the sort of "beer parlours" that decent people would never enter. So, I have simply put a few of these "legends in their own minds" on "ignore" and intend to avoid further interaction with them, why waste time and energy on such types?

I kinda think that any thread concerning anything to do with aborigines will quickly become a venue for racist drivel about how the "entitled" have "rights" and what bad people "whiteys" are and so on and so forth. I have had enough of this crap and intend to ignore such threads in future; we obviously have a conflict coming here in Canada and we should reserve our energy to deal appropriately with that.

Again, damm good posts and "we will overcome"!

[frenchbar]

You're definately right about the two races drawing further apart. My wife was recently at an event that was attended by a mixture of whites and natives. As my wife is the friendly sort, she attempted to socialize with a couple of different native woman and was snubbed big time. We have a few close friends in Dawson Creek that are native and we were discussing this with them. They were as disgusted as we were. There are definately a good number of prejudice natives out there.
I find it the total opposite with the white people and first nations people in the area i live . They get along well together..hopefully always will.Ive hunted with first nations freinds on and off traditional territorys and will in the future..

[Vital Shock]

GREAT post. Awesome pictures.

[Blainer]

I hope the indians get everything they want, road closures and access to all the land, I hope they kick some sorry assess out of the bush. This site is run by whites for whites, thats obvious.That is a pretty bold statement you made,as you sit on the internet and possibly turn the electric heat up in your home,while eating potatoe chips.
But then again if you don't like the other posts,you can retire in front of the t.v. or play game boy or possibly jump in your fancy truck and head to safeway for dinner.
Did we bring nothing to the table to improve your way of life?
God forbid you get ill and need hospital fascilities.

[OOBuck]

I hope the indians get everything they want, road closures and access to all the land, I hope they kick some sorry assess out of the bush. This site is run by whites for whites, thats obvious.

This site is run by hunters for hunters, when such topics come up as land restriction & road blocks that restrict hunting access come up, its an open topic.

FD's post simply brought to light the ridiculous thought of anyone (creed color or race) thinking that they had more right or entitlement to the land.

You threaten violence? Not really a good idea when FN make up only 5% of the population. It's not a good idea to throw rocks at glass houses.

[OOBuck]

You dont have any traditional territory, get it, you have the run of the whole province and the whole of Canada, your post was intended to demoralize the aboriginal community on site, many of your previous posts are similiar in nature, cut the BS, bringing people together in harmony, *****

As you should have the run of the entire province. His post was to only bring to light the how each and everyone of use is equal, maybe once you get that your views might change..

[CT.45]

If the indians want all the land and rights and what-not. To preserve their way of life, no worries.
Give back the houses, vehicles, guns, sleds, quads, modern medicine, and everything else the 'whitey' gave you. Go back to living in huts, teepees, dugouts, etc... Wander from place to place with only what you made from skins on your back and feet. Give back the wheel, you didn't even have that while the 'whiteys' were circumnavigating the globe. This crap has to stop.
There is no fairness in Canada, you indians are right. It is not fair to me or my kids. The indians seem to be more openly racist than the 'whiteys' in my mind.
These treaties are so outdated, they say we have to give pelts as payment. When did pelts turn in to millions of dollars.
My great grandfather quit the church and the government back in the 20's in the Carcross when he was employed at a resdential school. He could not stomach what the church was doing to these people.
Much later when I was born and living in the Yukon, my brother and I were subjected to beatings and mugging from the local indians as we were white. Once, a group of teens beat my brother up, took his boots and coat, even though they would not have fit them, and left him in a snowback at -35. Why? He was white. The clothes were found on the next street the next morning.
FU with your racism. You are a defeated peoples who rolled over for a bottle of whiskey and can of tobacco.
You want you culture and heritage so bad, no worries you can have it. Give back all the money and technology.
Don't want to do that? Get with the program, get your kids in school, quit drinking and drugging it up, get a job, pay taxes, save for retirement, pay a mortgage off, live like the rest of the world.
I have personally and terribly suffered at the hands of indians, I want some money now.

[bad arrow]

That is a pretty bold statement you made,as you sit on the internet and possibly turn the electric heat up in your home,while eating potatoe chips.
But then again if you don't like the other posts,you can retire in front of the t.v. or play game boy or possibly jump in your fancy truck and head to safeway for dinner.
Did we bring nothing to the table to improve your way of life?
God forbid you get ill and need hospital fascilities.

Lets be clear, I dont have indian status, dont get grant money, truck is almost 30 years old, and as for my way of life being improved, who is you and what did you bring? you talk like you gave me everything. Every cultural group on earth has contributed to my and your way of life. Traditional territory aint all its cracked up to be but its there, as I stated before in historic documents and manuscripts, regardless of what others may say, all sorted out by warfare and treaties and always changing, prove that it wasn't.

[Elkhound]

We do not want to lock this thread so just keep it civil. For years as a kid my family grew up on reserve property and we were one of the two white families who were in their school. We never suffered from abuse or racism. Very fond memories of my friends from that time.

People lose track of what the real message is here. We should all be treated like equals and the rest of us should not have to pay for things that had nothing to do with us so many years ago.

Keep it civil or we will lock it down.

[bad arrow]

I also think that this site needs 1-2 aboriginal moderators, for obvious reasons, what, is that pulling the race card? aboriginals are called drunks lazy, and other stuff but it still stays, I think the vikings should have been killed because they were good for nothing but a good myth at best and I get deleted.

[Elkhound]

I also think that this site needs 1-2 aboriginal moderators, for obvious reasons, what, is that pulling the race card? aboriginals are called drunks lazy, and other stuff but it still stays, I think the vikings should have been killed because they were good for nothing but a good myth at best and I get deleted.


Hmmmmm So here I am an admin and I just said how great the aboriginals were and thats not good enough for you. Interesting.

I guess I do have to lock this one after all. Calling a race lazy is one thing...saying they should all be killed is not in the same league. Think about it.

[Gateholio]

I also think that this site needs 1-2 aboriginal moderators, for obvious reasons, what, is that pulling the race card? aboriginals are called drunks lazy, and other stuff but it still stays, I think the vikings should have been killed because they were good for nothing but a good myth at best and I get deleted.

Your personal attack posts, as well as many other personal posts- were deleted. Personal attack post will continue to get deleted.