View Full Version : WTF! weird mulie buck with pics
huntinnewbie
10-27-2009, 01:54 PM
My son shot this on Monday morning in the Savona area. He was with a group of does. It took a long time to even see these antlers and at first my son thought he had a leaf stuck to his head.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v138/debbienight/hunting/Coalmonthunting2009006-1.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v138/debbienight/hunting/Coalmonthunting2009007.jpg
He is a little thin and had a very thin neck.
He had a lump on one front leg at the knee joint.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v138/debbienight/hunting/Coalmonthunting2009011.jpg
His coat was quite long and very grizzled grey colour compared to another buck taken by daughter-in-law from same area a week before.
Here's the weird buck's coat:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v138/debbienight/hunting/Coalmonthunting2009013.jpg
Here's last weeks buck:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v138/debbienight/hunting/Coalmonthunting2009014.jpg
Is he not very pretty or is it just me?
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v138/debbienight/hunting/Coalmonthunting2009008.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v138/debbienight/hunting/Coalmonthunting2009016-1.jpg
Any feedback would be appreciated. Is he really old, suffered an injury. Did we do him a favour?
What do you all think?
P.S. jelvis, we took your word on the quality of bucks in the Loops area............lol
looks old to me his face is quite grey
does he count for a 4pt on the left?
It is a cross between a deer and the exceptionally rare and ellusive pigmy immature moose.
How were his teeth? Did he have any damage to his testicles?
Angel
10-27-2009, 01:58 PM
Looks like a sick deer IMO. I would try and find out a little more info before eating that buck. Was the liver in decent shape or did it have white coloring or spots on it? Interesting non the less.
huntinnewbie
10-27-2009, 02:01 PM
Teeth looked fine, I know about aging sheep or goats but not sure with deer. he looked to have 2 sets of full grown teeth and 2 sets of small ones on the bottom jaw.
Couldn't really get his mouth open wide enouigh to see the back but they seemed to be all there from what we could see.
Yes, he had both his boys. That was the first thing I asked my son. He said they were both there although they may have been a little on the small side.
bforce750
10-27-2009, 02:03 PM
Yup definatly a hermaphrodite:eek:
huntinnewbie
10-27-2009, 02:03 PM
They said everything inside the buck looked fine, they even cut the liver open and looked closely. He was behaving as a normal buck when they saw him, although he did stand and stare at them giving them opportunity to shoot.
BlacktailStalker
10-27-2009, 02:09 PM
Product of a hermaphrodite doe bred by a jackalope.
he still looks old to me. A friend of mine went through school to be a CO. Funnie thing he's a border guard. But he told me once that if you have a deer with a deranged right antler it was hit hard on his left rump. vise versa for the left antler. Your deer has both antlers deranged. And i have heard that if an animal makes it to old age their antlers dont form right due to a lack of hormones being produced.
i say he is an old fart.
huntinnewbie
10-27-2009, 02:11 PM
Actually I thought a rare pigmy moose crossed with a miniature water buffalo.
huntinnewbie
10-27-2009, 02:24 PM
Your friend is correct. An injury to the left rear may produce a malformed antler on the opposite front. Got something to do with what side of the body the brain controls. It was hard to tell but he had one back leg that looked like it may have been injured a long time ago, however that doesn't explain both antlers being the way they were.
brotherjack
10-27-2009, 02:24 PM
does he count for a 4pt on the left?
I was just wondering that too. On the second photo, I see 4 points, not counting the brow tine. Assuming that each point is the full 2.5cm, I would say, yep, that's a 4 point for legal purposes. :)
That's cool. Smallest 4 point, EVER!... :)
huntinnewbie
10-27-2009, 02:27 PM
I was just wondering that too. On the second photo, I see 4 points, not counting the brow tine. Assuming that each point is the full 2.5cm, I would say, yep, that's a 4 point for legal purposes. :)
That's cool. Smallest 4 point, EVER!... :)
Never thought of it that way, do we win a prize?
however that doesn't explain both antlers being the way they were.
Ya that is why i was sayng i think he is old and having trouble producing hormones to build antlers. His face looks way too grey
weatherby_man
10-27-2009, 02:40 PM
I'm thinking old guy as well. Need to see those teeth and see what shape they're in, if hes as old as he looks I would think they should be worn pretty good. Could it just be a genetically inferior specimen (not quite a hermie)?
That mutant buck spent too much time under the power lines! I'm sure he'll taste fine though.
huntwriter
10-27-2009, 02:53 PM
Antlers: Looks like some genetic problem or accident when the antlers started to grow.
Age: Grey hair and body shape are not a reliable source to estimate age. Show me a picture of the top and bottom molars (top view) and I will be able to give you the bucks age to within +/- a half year.
Shooter
10-27-2009, 02:54 PM
What do you look for with the top and bottom molars?
bforce750
10-27-2009, 02:56 PM
I was just wondering that too. On the second photo, I see 4 points, not counting the brow tine. Assuming that each point is the full 2.5cm, I would say, yep, that's a 4 point for legal purposes. :)
That's cool. Smallest 4 point, EVER!... :)
THATS LIKE 15BC :smile:
T300WSM
10-27-2009, 03:11 PM
He looks old and drank out of Kamloops lake all his life.
BearStump
10-27-2009, 04:03 PM
I think you did him a favor. he wasnt gonna get no action from the she deer this fall with a rack like that.
huntwriter
10-27-2009, 04:06 PM
What do you look for with the top and bottom molars?
The age of a deer can be quiet accurately estimated by the teeth. Do do that it needs a bit of experience but can be easily learned by anyone.
From birth to the age 1 to 1 1/2 years the number and shape of the permanent incisors are a good indicator of the age and relatively easy to see for the layman.
After the age of 1 1/2 when all incisors are permanent and properly set it gets a bit more complicated. By looking at the number, shape, tooth wear (condition of the Lingual Crests, Cusp, Enamel and Dentine and to a lesser degree colour) , setting of the molars and premolars we can with accuracy determine what age the deer is.
I say "quite accurately" because there are other influences such as diet, nutrition and health that can influence the condition of the teeth that in turn may make deer teeth look younger or older than they are. Especially the type of diet has a great influence on the tooth wear factor. For example a deer that feeds predominantly on agricultural crop (soft food) has less wear on the teeth than the same age deer feeding predominantly on harder woodland and alpine vegetation.
Shooter
10-27-2009, 04:09 PM
Ok so what if there are no molars? Young or old?
huntwriter
10-27-2009, 04:11 PM
I think you did him a favor. he wasnt gonna get no action from the she deer this fall with a rack like that.
Rack size has no influence on breeding opportunity. Fact is that the younger and smaller antlered bucks do most of the breeding and not, as often assumed, the big trophy bucks.
i did it alot when i was young as well, but now im older and just act tough around my friends
huntwriter
10-27-2009, 04:13 PM
Ok so what if there are no molars? Young or old?
Then the deer will starve to death. Can't eat without teeth.;-)
Shooter
10-27-2009, 04:14 PM
I ask because a friend shot a 2 point last weekend and we were trying to figure if it was an old revert deer with poor genes or a young deer with great genes. The rack had good mass like a more mature deer would have and the rack was fairly high yet it had very weak forks. Also the rack didn't barrow out much. When we looked at the teeth we found the fronts were worn a bit and it had no back molars. Whats your oppinion on that? Also it was a fairly large bodied deer but the face seemed a little grey yet slender like a young deer.
LUCKY
10-27-2009, 04:22 PM
Thanks for knocking him out of the gene pool!
I wouldn't eat it but might mount it for a conversation piece.
LUCKY
doubled
10-27-2009, 04:22 PM
Old deer would be my guess.
huntwriter
10-27-2009, 05:27 PM
I ask because a friend shot a 2 point last weekend and we were trying to figure if it was an old revert deer with poor genes or a young deer with great genes. The rack had good mass like a more mature deer would have and the rack was fairly high yet it had very weak forks. Also the rack didn't barrow out much. When we looked at the teeth we found the fronts were worn a bit and it had no back molars. Whats your oppinion on that? Also it was a fairly large bodied deer but the face seemed a little grey yet slender like a young deer.
As I stated before, the color of the face is not always a reliable indicator of age and neither is the Roman nose shape often associated with a old buck.
The thing with the genes and antler size is the most difficult thing to explain to hunters. Despite all the myth we read, fact is that it is near impossible to tell if a young buck has the genes to grow huge antlers or not. A two year old spike or fork buck can develop massive antlers by the time he is four.
Conversely, a three year old buck with an average antler size can stay like that all his life. There is really no telling how a buck develops in antler size unless we know what his father and grandfather looked like. Or how about the little publicized fact that the mother of the buck has as much genetic influence in a bucks antler development as the father does. Are you confused yet.:smile: Antler development is a very complicated science.
The bottom line is this. The only way we can ever find out if a buck develops trophy status without knowing his parents is to let him grow to the age of four to five years. This is the age that scientists have determined to be the peak of antler development.
Teeth:
What you describe to me sounds unbelievable. Which is not that I do not believe you. It sounds unbelievable because there is simply no way that a deer can survive without molars. A deer can survive with some molars but not without any molars at all.
Molars are what the deer needs to chew the food and the cud. The incisors (front teeth) only function is to cut the food. The deer can not chew with the incisors.
As deer become old they wear the molars down to the point where they become useless or fall out, which begins at about the age of 9 to 10 years. Eventually the teeth are worn so flat or fell out that the deer starves to death. But it never comes to that in the wild because the deer will become to weak to move long before the last molar becomes useless. Once the deer is to weak to move much it becomes predator food.
Having explained all that I really do not know what to tell you about your findings. It's a miracle to me that I never encountered before. Unless you mean with back molars the actual molars. There are two sets of molars on either side of the lower jaw. The first set, the first 3 from the front, are the premoalrs and the second set, the fourth, fifth and sixth are the molars. Where all molars missing or just one set?
The Hermit
10-27-2009, 05:29 PM
Halloween Zombie Buck!!
Ltbullken
10-27-2009, 05:50 PM
It's a Chernoble Buck! :eek: Don't eat it!!
Shooter
10-27-2009, 05:51 PM
To be honest I never really checked personally. The head was pretty rigored and I was standing there as he ran a screwdriver up and down the jaw and there was definately no sound of the screwdriver hitting teeth. I don't know much on the subject and wasn't sure when they grow them in or conversly whether they begin to lose them as they get older. I just looked up some pictures on deer jaw configuration and see that there is a large space between the incisors and the molars so perhaps that was where the screwdriver was sliding.
BTW sorry for the Hi-jack.
martyonthewater
10-27-2009, 06:02 PM
looks like 60 - 75 lbs of meat in the freezer to me
theK.G.B
10-27-2009, 06:33 PM
from what i've heard. a previously wounded animal can have growth and coulour defects in the horns and hyde due to lack of body energy put into normal antler groth. instead it focuses it's energy on the wound? i dont "know" if this is true but it may help.
tooty
10-27-2009, 06:57 PM
Don't eat that,GIVE IT TO ME.:eek:
CamoChris30-30
10-27-2009, 07:18 PM
Never thought of it that way, do we win a prize?
What do you mean we. Mom
huntinnewbie
10-27-2009, 07:59 PM
What do you mean we. Mom
Well you shot it but I posted the thread.............:roll:
did you check for any pot plantations in the area, could be he got into some good ol BC bud during the summer
mud-dog27
10-27-2009, 08:38 PM
and i thought my last 2 mulies were weird lookin
hunter1947
10-28-2009, 04:06 AM
That deer has to be a cross of some sort ,http://www.huntingbc.ca/forum/images/icons/icon6.gif deer.
Ltbullken
10-28-2009, 09:09 AM
Well, what ever it is, thank goodness you took it out of the gene pool!
huntinnewbie
11-18-2009, 08:08 AM
For those of you wondering the age of this buck. Butcher took a look in the deers mouth and said he was a young one. This butcher does tons of deer every year. Guess he was just a weirdo but young never the less. My son had him made into farmer sausage etc. I tried some fried up and it was great.
Crazy little thing...a buck is a buck tho, good goin!
Its mho all 'young' things are more than a little weird....
250 sav
11-18-2009, 10:35 AM
there was some fallow deer in the savona area that escaped and were running wild 10-15 years ago I wonder if some of the genetics got into the genepool I thought the locals took out the fallow deer in short order but it was in the fall. who knows?
whitetail2009
11-22-2009, 05:28 PM
Hmm interesting pic,and replies. In 1999 I shot a whitetail with a small and odd rack 3x3, I will dig up pics and repost under odd 3x3 whitetail rack
Chasinracks
11-22-2009, 05:53 PM
That mutant buck spent too much time under the power lines! I'm sure he'll taste fine though.
Was thinking the same thing or maybe a microwave transmission in the area
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.2 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.