A New Threat to the Cariboo Region

[Bigbear]

Friends of Churn Creek Protected Area Society



Draft Meeting Summary – as at 18 April 2009


Date: 18 April 2009 Time: 12:30pm to 5:00pm

Location: ThompsonRiversUniversity, 1250 Western Ave., WilliamsLake, BC

Present (for at least part of the meeting):



Mike Simpson of Fraser Basin Council opened the meeting by welcoming participants, and indicating that his role is to remain neutral and facilitate discussion and points of agreement. Mike reviewed the agenda and received endorsement from participants.

Mike acknowledged the members of the steering committee who initiated Friends of Churn Creek (FCC) and who initiated today’s meeting:

Chris Harris narrated a slide show of his involvement with Churn Creek since 2005.

1.Why form a “Friends of” Organization

Mike Kennedy provided a rationale of why to form a “friends of” organization. The main reason is to support the implementation of the management plan for Churn – BC Parks has insufficient resources to do this on their own. A “friends of” organization does not replace or take over the management, but assists with it.

There was discussion regarding the pressures facing Churn Creek. They involve human and non-human elements, including hunting, access control, invasive plants, ecosystem function, and climate change to name just a few.

There was discussion about Aboriginal and cultural heritage values in Churn Creek. Specifically how economic development, tourism, land use and cultural heritage planning that are undertaken by first nations could be complemented by Friends of Churn Creek, and vice verse.

2.Background on Management Plan for Churn Creek Protected Area

Glen Davidson provided an overview of the history of Churn Creek Protected Area, the management plan, and the resources in the protected area.

[Bigbear]

Part 2 1.BC Parks Support for the Friends of Churn Creek

Tony Fiala and Tom Hughes were unable to stay for the meeting, but voiced their support for the establishment of Friends of Churn Creek in the Local Advisory Group meeting in the morning.

2.Draft Constitution and Bylaws

Mike Simpson provided a handout of the draft constitution and bylaws that the steering committee had developed. It was indicated that the draft constitution was prepared to give something to look at for this meeting, but that it could be discarded if members felt it was inappropriate to have drafted it.

Those present who wished to become members completed and paid for their membership before small group work began after coffee break.

3.Small Group Work

Members were randomly grouped and assigned the following questions to address in 45 minutes:
§Are any changes needed to the draft constitution?
§Are there any changes to the default bylaws that you want to propose?
§Do you agree with having more than 5 directors in the default bylaws?
§What kinds of activities, initiatives or projects do you want to see happen for 2009?

4.Reporting Back from Small Groups

Draft Constitution
Items in yellow were proposed additions.

WHEAREAS: the vision of the management plan for Churn Creek Protected Area is to “…conserve and restore nationally significant grasslands and wildlife populations while maintaining a viable, year-round working ranch. The fragile nature of the grasslands and wetlands and their importance for wildlife habitat are recognized in the plan. Protected Area management also reflects the historic importance of the Churn Creek ecosystems for First Nations, ranchers, hunters, miners, and recreational users. Traditional use of the area by First Nations will continue.”

1.The name of the society is The Friends of Churn Creek Protected Area Society
2.The purposes of the society are:
a.To provide public education – including but not limited to generation of brochures, signage, interpretation activities, demonstration of land and resource management activities such as ranching, and management of cultural heritage resources
b.To assist in research and monitoring – including but not limited to obtaining funds and resources, encouraging the collection of baseline ecosystem data, and encouraging graduate student research
c.To enhance visitor experience – including but not limited to improving camping and other recreation facilities and developing interpretation resources
d.To encourage a friendly presence in the area especially during peak activity times – observers, interpreters and a general presence (check with Parks?)

[Bigbear]

Part 3
a.To support management planning – including but not limited to participation in management planning processes, and assisting with the implementation of the management plan
b.To promote grasslands values in the Fraser and ChilcotinRiver corridors.

It was discussed and agreed that there should be revisions to the constitution to ensure that FCC can achieve charitable status. FCC should take the time to get the constitution right to achieve charitable status, rather than finalize it at the meeting. This draft should be circulated to other “Friends of” groups and non-profit societies that have charitable status.

Draft Bylaws
The bylaws of the society are those set out in Schedule B to the Society Act, located at http://www.fin.gov.bc.ca/registries/corppg/forms/reg20.pdf with the following variations, deletions and additions:

1.Bylaw 25(2) of Part 5 – Directors and Officers – to be revised to:
The number of director positions must be 8 or a different number determined from time to time at a general meeting, but no less than 5.

No other changes from the default bylaws were proposed. The membership accepted the above variation from the default bylaws.

Activities, Projects or Initiatives for 2009
The following ideas were reported back from the small groups:
§Signage – recreation trails, ATV use, educational signs (e.g., don’t drive on grasslands, weed ID signs)
§Website page and link on others (GCC, BC Parks) – register a domain name
§Elder college course around putting material together for a course
§Guided trips – commercial or otherwise – charge to bring people on guided trips, $ for FCC
§Collaboration with cultural tourism planning and activities of Canoe/Dog Creek First Nation
§Observer and interpreter presence especially at peak activity times
§Fund raising – for FCC, and hire someone with experience in grant writing
§Piggy back on existing community events to promote FCC, raise funds, sell memberships
§Helping facilitate comprehensive fencing and water management planning and implementation
§Field guidebook – sell it as a fundraiser. Guidebook on grasslands corridor, focusing on Churn.
§Document first nations history and culture in Churn – and work with first nations to ensure this is desirable and to collaborate
§Inventory invasive plants in Churn – beyond known sites – get on a workplan of MFR, MOE, MAL
§Field tours for members – break the area into natural zones – tour different areas
§History of mining and settlement in the area – document, identify sites, guidebooks
§Inventory red and blue listed species
§Monitoring the benchmark areas, and compare to other grasslands areas
§Collect information for the creation of interpretive resources
§Riparian enhancement along lower Churn for fisheries (outside of PA)
§Organize, facilitate or participate in weed pull days – involve CRD, CCCIPC, IPC

[Bigbear]

Part 4
There was no objection noted to any particular suggestion in the above list of projects.

1.Election of Directors and Officers


.

It was agreed that secretary and treasurer positions should be given to 2 different directors, rather than combining them. The following were nominated for office, and accepted:



2.Next Steps

The following next steps were identified

Directors meet, finalize constitution as suggested above, and file papers for incorporation
Directors look at list of activities and flesh out details
Clarify membership and other details, and bring to next AGM
Register domain name for a website
Members present indicated that they agreed that their contact information could be distributed amongst the membership
The meeting was adjourned at 5:00pm.


Some of this stuff is Good but I can see the underlying Threat , that could ultimatly lead to restricting access to the area for Hunting, Fishing and Camping

Kelly

[f350ps]

Nothing good can come out of this! Thanks for the heads up. K

[islandboy]

Nothing good can come out of this! Thanks for the heads up. K

:idea: Suggested reading; Fountainhead, by Ayn Rand

Those that can, do. Those that cannot, want control. :frown:

[PGK]

How is this bad!? They don't want to turn it into a National Park, they want to put money and manpower into an area that can really use it!

[Fisher-Dude]

How is this bad!? They don't want to turn it into a National Park, they want to put money and manpower into an area that can really use it!

"There was discussion regarding the pressures facing Churn Creek. They involve human and non-human elements, including hunting, access control, invasive plants, ecosystem function, and climate change to name just a few."

The FIRST one they took a shot at as a problem in the area. Methinks Tinney is drinkin' Koolaid with the antis these days.

[PGK]

Hunting isn't a pressure on the churn creek area? It's probably the number one resource use in he entire area. Why wouldn't it go first???

[Fisher-Dude]

Sure, close down hunting and let the Birkenstocks trample the grasslands instead. Ai-carumba!

[Bigbear]

One Part They want to fix it up, get rid of all the Intrusive elements eg, Hunters , Quad groups , other uses, Then Charge people for Guided tours. something funny there.

A Friendly Presence. I suppose this means A Bunch of Granola Crunchers , Standing around with signs and Blockading, and singing koom Biaaa.

[PGK]

Arg. Noone is going to shut down hunting in th churn. Quads are brutal to the landscape, now we're dealing with throttleneck attitudes, erosion, grassland destruction, invasive plant and pathogen entry via unwshed quads etc etc... Increased qud restrictions I could see, why not? I think you're doing a pretty big over reaction. Do you know these people? Have you talked to them? Or did you just see "Friends of" and jump to the worst case scenario?

[Fisher-Dude]

Quads are outlawed in Churn already, so that's a dead issue. This group wants to lock us out so they can hold eco-tours. Don't fool yourself into thinking otherwise.

[PGK]

Quads are outlawed in Churn already, so that's a dead issue. This group wants to lock us out so they can hold eco-tours. Don't fool yourself into thinking otherwise.

Who is in the group? How do you *know* this?? Have you been to their meetings? Have you talked with them?

[f350ps]

As I said before, nothing good will come out of this!! K

[PGK]

As I said before, nothing good will come out of this!! K

Because we've all jumped on the bandwagon that as soon as somebody is 'friends of' something, they must be anti hunting granola chewing hippy weirdos? The stereotype doesn't fit...

[f350ps]

Well call me Paranoid why don't ya? I've seen a few "Friends of" outfits over the years and so far hunters haven't been on their "Friends of" list. It looks like there looking for members PGK so why don't ya join up and tell us what ya think of it. Don't forget to tell them that you hunt, I'm sure they'll give ya a great big hug. K

[boxhitch]

conserve and restore nationally significant grasslands and wildlife populations while maintaining a viable, year-round working ranch. The fragile nature of the grasslands and wetlands and their importance for wildlife habitat are recognized in the plan. Protected Area management also reflects the historic importance of the Churn Creek ecosystems for First Nations, ranchers, hunters, miners, and recreational users.
Grasslands and wildlife vs. a viable working ranch.........no wonder Parks can't deal with it.
Good to see a watchdog group.

[boxhitch]

Quads are outlawed in Churn already, so that's a dead issue. This group wants to lock us out so they can hold eco-tours. Don't fool yourself into thinking otherwise.Eco-tours would be summer based, hunting is Fall season. With co-operation they can co-exist.

[PGK]

I don't see an issue. I'm sure they have contact information. Email / phone them up and find out what their POV is on hunting. I imagine that seeing as they say they want to be involved in the active management that the government does not have the money or manpower to accomplish, they would be toe-ing the Parks line. I saw something in there about research opportunities, maybe (god forbid!!) they can finance a research proposal that would actually benefit the game species of the area.....oh hey.....maybe everyone isn't against hunting.

This is the 21st century folks, ''anti-hunters'' are the way of the past. There will always be lunatic antis, but they aren't the norm. There may be lots of people out there who don't hunt and are involved in conservation or environmentalism, but that doesn't mean they aren't educated about hunting, even if they don't wish to participate...

[boxhitch]

This is the 21st century folks, ''anti-hunters'' are the way of the past. There will always be lunatic antis, but they aren't the norm.
What color is the sky in your world ?
Lately, some of your stuff actually sounds reasonable, almost respectful, and then you spew this.

[PGK]

What color is the sky in your world ?
Lately, some of your stuff actually sounds reasonable, almost respectful, and then you spew this.

Anyone involved in legitimte conservation efforts partnered with parks or the ministry are not going to be anti hunting loonies. Yeah, they're out there. Lots of them. But nothing they do is legitimate anymore. They pandor to the uneducated and uninformed. Noone with half a brain or any level of education in biology takes 'anti hunting' seriously anymore.

[Devilbear]

Excuse me, but, I do not suffer from any deficiencies of intellect, or as you incorrectly term it...brain...and I was an "A student" in ALL my courses, not only Biology.

I make this point because, you are "dreaming in technicolour" if you think that McAllister and his vile crew who have obtained the endorsements of world figures such as Dr. Jane Goodall, Deepak Chopra, the Kennedy scions and various other such influential types are not ...taken seriously... by governments in most North American jurisdictions, including B.C.

Denigrating your enemies in personal terms may be titillating and even self-satisfying, however, it is a sure method of courting disaster. The "antis" just like their soulmates, the "Wendies", ARE NOT STUPID...and that is WHY they are WINNING, as witness the recent closures of bear hunting on the coast by the Campbell administration.

My impression is that GG is right about this group.

[PGK]

Excuse me, but, I do not suffer from any deficiencies of intellect, or as you incorrectly term it...brain...and I was an "A student" in ALL my courses, not only Biology.

I make this point because, you are "dreaming in technicolour" if you think that McAllister and his vile crew who have obtained the endorsements of world figures such as Dr. Jane Goodall, Deepak Chopra, the Kennedy scions and various other such influential types are not ...taken seriously... by governments in most North American jurisdictions, including B.C.

Denigrating your enemies in personal terms may be titillating and even self-satisfying, however, it is a sure method of courting disaster. The "antis" just like their soulmates, the "Wendies", ARE NOT STUPID...and that is WHY they are WINNING, as witness the recent closures of bear hunting on the coast by the Campbell administration.

My impression is that GG is right about this group.

Does using your GPA as an axe handle make you feel good?

[PGK]

My concern is that what seems like to me to be a very well intentioned group is about to be bludgeoned to death by the assumptions and fear mongering that are so prevalent in the hunting community. There is never any middle ground with most on this site. It is 'them' or it is 'us', and that is a really sad thing.

[Gunner]

I don't see an issue. I'm sure they have contact information. Email / phone them up and find out what their POV is on hunting. I imagine that seeing as they say they want to be involved in the active management that the government does not have the money or manpower to accomplish, they would be toe-ing the Parks line. I saw something in there about research opportunities, maybe (god forbid!!) they can finance a research proposal that would actually benefit the game species of the area.....oh hey.....maybe everyone isn't against hunting.

This is the 21st century folks, ''anti-hunters'' are the way of the past. There will always be lunatic antis, but they aren't the norm. There may be lots of people out there who don't hunt and are involved in conservation or environmentalism, but that doesn't mean they aren't educated about hunting, even if they don't wish to participate...


What color is the sky in your world ?
Lately, some of your stuff actually sounds reasonable, almost respectful, and then you spew this.That's the funniest thing that PGK has come up with yet! There must be something in the water up there,or he lives too close to the pulp mill!:-o:-o:-o Gunner

[boxhitch]

Anyone involved in legitimte conservation efforts partnered with parks or the ministry are not going to be anti hunting loonies.
They don't have to be loonies to have effect. A closure here , a restriction there, it all adds up.


Yeah, they're out there. Lots of them. But nothing they do is legitimate anymore.
Right. Any plans to hunt QCI bear? Ever sat in on a district council meeting where a motion to ban firearms is on the table ?


They pandor to the uneducated and uninformed.
95% of BC residents fall in this catagory, when it comes to hunting. And they do pick sides.


Noone with half a brain or any level of education in biology takes 'anti hunting' seriously anymore.
Tell that to the Prof that believes GBears are on the brink of extinction. Not all schools are created equal.

[Devilbear]

[quote=PGK;459706]My concern is that what seems like to me to be a very well intentioned group is about to be bludgeoned to death by the assumptions and fear mongering that are so prevalent in the hunting community.

So, you are ASSUMING that this group will be ...bludgeoned..., etc.?

May I ask why your ASSUMPTIONS are more valid than those of ...the hunting community...that you seem to consider to be of lesser intellectual ability than you apparently consider yourself to be?

I do not see anything posted in this thread that is more than simple concern for the activities of a newly forming group that may have a negative impact on our hunting. When the situation of past years is considered, it is, IMHO, quite understandable WHY hunters here and elsewhere would be concerned about another "environmental" group forming in one of B.C.'s major traditional hunting areas.

If, we hunters do not exercise constant and sceptical vigilance, the "antis" WILL prevail and our hunting will be a mere memory and within a very few years. Consequently, the attitudes expressed on this thread ARE valid and I applaud those, even though they may not be students of biology at a provincial institution, who care enough to express them.

[Bigbear]

As you Can see in some of the other posts on region 5 and the more restrictions we have on us here. The 1rst Nations was the end to a General spike moose season west of here. They also wanted deer included in that , but that managed to get put off. It just seems that when ever there is a group of people that want to go eco friendly, which is nothing wrong with that, But not go to the extreme on it, But it seems Hunting restrictions are The 1 on the list.