single barbless....

[ratherbefishin]

with BC regs requiring single barbless in non tidal water-why don't lure manufacturors offer single barbless as well as the traditional barbed treble hooks?-I was looking through the latest Cabellas spring fishing catalogue-and almost all spinning lures have trebles-I didn't see anything else

[Fisher-Dude]

There's no blanket restriction in non-tidal waters for single barbless. Read your regs again. Single barbless is more of an exception than the rule.

And why would an American catalogue list lures specifically for certain restricted waters in parts of BC? :confused:

[bsa30-06]

with BC regs requiring single barbless in non tidal water-why don't lure manufacturors offer single barbless as well as the traditional barbed treble hooks?-I was looking through the latest Cabellas spring fishing catalogue-and almost all spinning lures have trebles-I didn't see anything else

i noticed that aswell.Was in crappy tire awhile ago and was looking at the fishing stuff and noticed that at that time there was not a single barbless hook on the shelf.

[Ddog]

its called pliers,,you hold the hook and line up the pliers on top and bottom of the barb, then squeeze, the barb is then squished rendering the hook barbless.

most lures also have a split ring so you can change the treble to a single if necessary, and if there isnt one (split ring) then you snip the treble off and put a split ring on and your single barbless hook.
this maybe takes 2 minutes to do at tops. The manufacture of lures has a huge market across the world and lots of regs are different, so i would prefer the lure without a hook so i can put my own on.

[Fisher-Dude]

http://www.polymerclaypit.co.uk/acatalog/pliers.jpg

[PGK]

Single barbless on all moving water in BC. Plus some designated lakes. That's more rule than exception, if you ask me. Everything I tie or own is crimped. If you're crimped, you're legal everywhere. It's called simplification. But the government missed that boat :lol:

[ratherbefishin]

Yes, I clip the two hooks and crimp the barb on trebles to make them legal too-but that alters the balance and operation-a larger single is more effective than a small clipped treble.I suggest that with more jurisdictions going to catch and release, lure companies would gain more in credability than they would lose by offering single barbless-at least as an option.They could even offset the small cost increase by advertising they were offering the choice in the interests of fish conservation.But take a look at the lure catalogues yourself-none of the popular lures come with single barbless-they are virtually ALL barbed trebles.But as long as the consumer doesn't ask for it -chances are they won't get it.But if I'm standing at the rack and see two brands of lures-one set up with single barbless,and the other with a barbed treble that I have to clip and pinch-I'm reaching for the lure ready to use,and its that simple.I also suggest once one lure manufacturor offers single barbless-the rest will follow suit rather than lose market share-its just common sense marketing

[Fisher-Dude]

Single barbless on all moving water in BC. Plus some designated lakes. That's more rule than exception, if you ask me. Everything I tie or own is crimped. If you're crimped, you're legal everywhere. It's called simplification. But the government missed that boat :lol:

Nobody asked you.

There's research being done right now to get rid of the single barbless restriction on Okanagan Lake. What we are finding is an INCREASED mortality for trout with the big single barbless compared to the smaller trebles. The single barbless are puncturing the brain cavities of the Gerrards because of their size and the way the fish are striking the Lymans and Apexes. With the smaller trebles, the fish tend to get hooked on the periphery of the mouth, and have a better survival chance. I'll keep ya updated as this progresses.

[ianwuzhere]

most lures are prolly made where this regulation is not in place. Most spinners now have trebles but often have a single barbed in the pack as well.
Ive noticed that too fisherdude where apex and other large single hooks will protrude thru the eye of the fish or elsewhere making it hard to release them, as they bleed out a lot. mite just have to go with smaller single hook to be safer as most of the apex etc come with pretty large single hooks. I have caught fish where i suspect have had a big single hook thru the eye and it has healed up and the fish was healthy, so their is proof that one can live with only one eye;)

[Benthos]

As a side..

it is of note that even if single barbless hook is required, one can still utilize an 'artificial lure' with multiple single barbless hookS.

if using a fly or hook attached directly to the line, yes, you are limited to one single barbless hook. BUT, if you use an artifical lure, there is not limit on the number of single barbless hooks you have on it.

[ratherbefishin]

I'd sure like to see research on the mortality results of treble vs single barbless hooks,including hook size .But for the purposes of releasing there is no question-single barbless is far easier

[Fisher-Dude]

As a side..

it is of note that even if single barbless hook is required, one can still utilize an 'artificial lure' with multiple single barbless hookS.

if using a fly or hook attached directly to the line, yes, you are limited to one single barbless hook. BUT, if you use an artifical lure, there is not limit on the number of single barbless hooks you have on it.

Can you help us find this in the regs? Single, to me, means ONE.

[ultramagbob]

Nobody asked you.

There's research being done right now to get rid of the single barbless restriction on Okanagan Lake. What we are finding is an INCREASED mortality for trout with the big single barbless compared to the smaller trebles. The single barbless are puncturing the brain cavities of the Gerrards because of their size and the way the fish are striking the Lymans and Apexes. With the smaller trebles, the fish tend to get hooked on the periphery of the mouth, and have a better survival chance. I'll keep ya updated as this progresses.

LOL
is this study be dne by BCWF or fisheries?

[500grhollowpoint]

Or by huntingbc...lol.

[Benthos]

Can you help us find this in the regs? Single, to me, means ONE.



angle … fish (with or without a rod) with
one fishing line to which only one hook,
one artificial lure OR one artificial fly is
attached.

hence, if your line is attached to a single hook or fly, only one is allowed. however, the regs fail to state a definition of 'artificial lure', to which more than one 'single barbless hook' can be attached (e.g. in a lake that is specified as single barbless hook water, you can legally use a large flatfish for example, with 2 or 3 single barbless hooks on it). you are still only using one artificial lure, and you are complying using only single barbless hook(s)

unless something has changed in this years regs, i know i am right (last year i had this confirmed). i got it in writing a few years ago from the guy in victoria who writes the regs (i keep it in my tackle box in case i am ever questioned!).

[mountainman]

So as Alberta has done is barbless hooks only, some lakes have size limits on the hooks (point to shank). As we all know B.C. is a little behind us here in Alberta :eek: maybe this should be considered as well in B.C. This to me makes good sense, reduces mortality and adds a bit more skill required to catch fish. Plus when you are catching 100-200 walleye a day much easier to release them quick and unharmed. :biggrin:

[ratherbefishin]

we've been required to use barbless hooks for salmon for years-and I don't find much more diference in losing fishif play them well and keep the slack out . The only real advantage I see to barbed hooks is bait fishing-the barb helps keeps the bait on

[PGK]

Nobody asked you.

There's research being done right now to get rid of the single barbless restriction on Okanagan Lake. What we are finding is an INCREASED mortality for trout with the big single barbless compared to the smaller trebles. The single barbless are puncturing the brain cavities of the Gerrards because of their size and the way the fish are striking the Lymans and Apexes. With the smaller trebles, the fish tend to get hooked on the periphery of the mouth, and have a better survival chance. I'll keep ya updated as this progresses.

Nobody NEEDS to ask me, you loudmouth! This is an open forum and you WILL get my opinion on fisheries issues! Get used to me, I am NOT going anywhere.

[Fisher-Dude]

Get used to me, I am NOT going anywhere.

You'll get yerself punted, sooner or later! :lol:

[Fisher-Dude]

So as Alberta has done is barbless hooks only, some lakes have size limits on the hooks (point to shank). As we all know B.C. is a little behind us here in Alberta :eek: maybe this should be considered as well in B.C. This to me makes good sense, reduces mortality and adds a bit more skill required to catch fish. Plus when you are catching 100-200 walleye a day much easier to release them quick and unharmed. :biggrin:

"Two American fisheries scientists, Dan Schill and Rod Scarpella, reviewed the results of several studies on barbed and barbless hooks and published their results in the November 1997 issue of the North American Journal of Fisheries Management. In their results they found that the difference in hooking mortality was insignificant. Fish caught on barbed flies or lures and released suffered a mortality rate of 4.5 per cent against a rate of 4.2 per cent for barbless hooks."

Kinda blows the mortality theory from barbed hooks all to shit, doesn't it? ;)

What are we attempting to achieve with barbless regs? Are we trying to discourage kids and newbies from taking up fishing by "requiring more skill" to land a fish? Or, are we trying to encourage more people to take up an interest in fishing? In BC, we are attempting the latter, and therefore with proven negligible mortality increases and marked increases in successful landing of fish, there's no need for barbed hooks. You Alberta cowboys can fish barbless all you want, thinking it makes a difference. :lol:

[ratherbefishin]

was there any research done on mortality based on single vs treble hooks?

[PGK]

We've had this discussion before. There is literally no good evidence for either side. The methods of some are flawed, and the results of others are doctored to meet an agenda.

The fact of the matter is that SIMPLIFICATION is one standard for the entire province like Alberta has done. It's really not that difficult to crimp every hook in your box, nor does it lower catch rates like some will come on here and loudmouth off about. Ask the Albertans!

[killman]

Just ban catch and release and there is no need to debate. Besides it is just plain cruelty to fish!

[Gateholio]

Just ban catch and release and there is no need to debate. Besides it is just plain cruelty to fish!

I agree..If there isn't a sustainable amount of fish that can be retained, then why do we allow people to hook them, harass them and then release them, with a chance they will die anyway?

I'd never hook a deer in the mouth, yard it in then release it, so why do we allow this to happen to the poor little fishys?
:biggrin:

[killman]

Kind of like shooting a animal in the leg, taking some pics and letting go, hoping it will live.

[Dirty]

I'd never hook a deer in the mouth, yard it in then release it, so why do we allow this to happen to the poor little fishys?
:biggrin:

Ask PGK, he has an answer to all the questions. It might take a while to get an answer, he is busily filling out his papers to become a permanent resident of Alberta.

[Salty]

I agree..If there isn't a sustainable amount of fish that can be retained, then why do we allow people to hook them, harass them and then release them, with a chance they will die anyway?

I'd never hook a deer in the mouth, yard it in then release it, so why do we allow this to happen to the poor little fishys?
:biggrin:

For many reasons. I could be fishing for spring salmon in the chuck and catch a coho in a closed area. Or fishing for rainbows in a lake chocker block full of them but catch a bull trout in a conservation area. Maybe I'll hook a huge female trout almost dripping with eggs and think it might be a good idea to let her go. Getcherheadoutta the glue bud :lol:

[Browningmirage]

need to get some more opinions on trebles here. I am curious as to what people think about these little pains.


I agree..If there isn't a sustainable amount of fish that can be retained, then why do we allow people to hook them, harass them and then release them, with a chance they will die anyway?

I'd never hook a deer in the mouth, yard it in then release it, so why do we allow this to happen to the poor little fishys?


This will get into an ethical debate pretty quick, and I have considered both sides. Last year, I was catch and releasing salmon, after a coworker had put the bug in my ear as to why i would torture fish like that. I had a nice salmon on, and I was all alone, and all the sudden all I could think of was that I was torchuring the fish. I released it, then went and thought about it for a good hour, surrounded by some of the best fishing I have seen.

It is a tough question, and although I will continue to catch and release, I still consider it sometimes when I go out.

A buddy of mine said he will keep a single trout each year, just to remind him that he is still having an impact, even though he catches and releases.

I guess you could compare it to hunting. None of us need to hunt, its far cheaper to buy the meat. But then you have to think about what we are missing when we dont.

[kootenayelkslayer]

I'm all for barbless hooks. There's nothing like the satisfaction of making a clean release.

http://i137.photobucket.com/albums/q223/mikeb04/108_1635.jpg

http://i137.photobucket.com/albums/q223/mikeb04/108_1637.jpg

[killman]

Is that your blood all over the snow?:lol:

[Gateholio]

For many reasons. I could be fishing for spring salmon in the chuck and catch a coho in a closed area. Or fishing for rainbows in a lake chocker block full of them but catch a bull trout in a conservation area. Maybe I'll hook a huge female trout almost dripping with eggs and think it might be a good idea to let her go. Getcherheadoutta the glue bud :lol:

But in all of these examples, you are not deliberately setting out to catch and torture a fish, it is a by product of you attempting o sustainably harvest some fish!:cool:

[Gateholio]

I guess you could compare it to hunting. None of us need to hunt, its far cheaper to buy the meat. But then you have to think about what we are missing when we dont.

If we want to eat meat, an animal must die, whether it is a cow or a deer. But you don't have to torture it.:wink:

[Browningmirage]

If we want to eat meat, an animal must die, whether it is a cow or a deer. But you don't have to torture it.:wink:

true...but what about the outdoor experience. Far more evil ways to spend a day

[Gateholio]

true...but what about the outdoor experience. Far more evil ways to spend a day

What is more evil than torturing an innocent fish? Hmmm.... Maybe torturing puppies is more evil...:mrgreen:

[Fisher-Dude]

I'm all for barbless hooks. There's nothing like the satisfaction of making a clean release.

http://i137.photobucket.com/albums/q223/mikeb04/108_1635.jpg

http://i137.photobucket.com/albums/q223/mikeb04/108_1637.jpg

Keeeerist Almighty! There's another DEAD fish with all that blood! Why let it go so it suffers and dies? Why not bonk it on the head and if you don't want to eat it, give it to someone who does. Brutal!

[PGK]

Hahahahaha YEAH BABY BLEED THAT SUCKER!!!!!!

[ratherbefishin]

single barbless certainly does make for an easier quicker release-with less chance of injury-twisting hooks trying to get them out inevitably results in tissue damage and bleeding, plus longer time before releasing.but just to confirm my earlier findingI went back and looked at the cabellas spring catalogue again-not one single manufacturor offered singles-everything was trebles

[Fisher-Dude]

single barbless certainly does make for an easier quicker release-with less chance of injury-twisting hooks trying to get them out inevitably results in tissue damage and bleeding, plus longer time before releasing

It would seem from the bloodbath above, by a barbless hook, and by the ??? minutes of glory shots, that this isn't the case.

Hmm, lookit the bootprints out to that other hole. Isn't it illegal to ice fish with two lines? :lol:

[kootenayelkslayer]

Keeeerist Almighty! There's another DEAD fish with all that blood! Why let it go so it suffers and dies? Why not bonk it on the head and if you don't want to eat it, give it to someone who does. Brutal!

Hahaha, classic. It was just a few cuts from the line.

[ultramagbob]

LOL I hate fisherman just about as much as hunters..Every dipshit with a rod or rifle is a expert

[PGK]

There isn't even a rod in the picture. Clearly he has learned well, and used his ninja skillz to slaughter that feesh. Hammer down boys, well done

[Fisher-Dude]

From the regulations:

"Any legal fish that is deeply hooked, hooked around the gills, or BLEEDING should be retained as part of your quota."

Line cuts - yeah, you tried to pull that bullshit on us the last time you were called out for exactly the same thing. I have NEVER seen a fish bleed from line cuts, and it's plain from the photos that that fish is bleeding from the mouth. You are surrounded by the best bullshitters in BC on this forum - don't try to feed us any!

[ultramagbob]

The blood was from the fin fish he was using as bait

[Fisher-Dude]

The blood was from the fin fish he was using as bait

HA!
HA!
HA!
HA!
HA!
HA!
HA!
HA!
HA!
HA!
HA!
HA!
HA!
HA!
HA!
HA!
HA!
HA!
HA!
HA!
HA!
HA!
HA!
HA!
HA!
HA!
HA!
HA!
HA!
HA!
HA!
HA!
HA!
HA!
HA!
HA!

[PGK]

From the regulations:

"Any legal fish that is deeply hooked, hooked around the gills, or BLEEDING should be retained as part of your quota."

Line cuts - yeah, you tried to pull that bullshit on us the last time you were called out for exactly the same thing. I have NEVER seen a fish bleed from line cuts, and it's plain from the photos that that fish is bleeding from the mouth. You are surrounded by the best bullshitters in BC on this forum - don't try to feed us any!

I guess you haven't caught very many fish then?

[Fisher-Dude]

Does fin fish as bait stay on a barbless hook? Maybe you could pinch the barb on a baitholder...:biggrin:

[kootenayelkslayer]

Haha this is going well... We took those pictures just for you FD

[Fisher-Dude]

This one too? Looks like you boys make a habit of breaking the regulations which state that bleeding fish should be retained as part of your quota.

http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg126/Tako870/2009W-55.jpg

[PGK]

The above fish never bled a drop. The blood was from a previous fish which browningmirage slaughtered for dinner. Happy? Oh wait, no you won't be. You'll just call me a liar

[kootenayelkslayer]

This one too? Looks like you boys make a habit of breaking the regulations which state that bleeding fish should be retained as part of your quota.


You're priceless... and about as predictable as a morning bowel movement.

[ultramagbob]

Happy? Oh wait, no you won't be. You'll just call me a liar

LOL
You are Mr. Ethics yet yours a very questionable..shame on you.

[Fisher-Dude]

The above fish never bled a drop. The blood was from a previous fish which browningmirage slaughtered for dinner. Happy? Oh wait, no you won't be. You'll just call me a liar

What do you call that red stuff dripping from its gills into the blood splatter on the ice? Cherry Koolaid?

[kootenayelkslayer]

Alright FD, I'll put you out of your misery. I thought you would've noticed, but the fish in the pictures had already been bonked. We spilt a lil blood on the ice to take the piss out of you for getting so wound up over the pictures PGK posted way back.
Happy belated April Fools. Thanks for the laugh!

[Fisher-Dude]

Alright FD, I'll put you out of your misery. I thought you would've noticed, but the fish in the pictures had already been bonked. We spilt a lil blood on the ice to take the piss out of you for getting so wound up over the pictures PGK posted way back.
Happy belated April Fools. Thanks for the laugh!

Feeble lie. You'll have to do better than that.

[PGK]

Yeah just like I told you. He's right and everyone else can go suck lemons. What a winner

[kootenayelkslayer]

Feeble lie. You'll have to do better than that.

Come on now, be a good sport. You've been had, take it like a man.

[Fisher-Dude]

Come on now, be a good sport. You've been had, take it like a man.

That's quite funny. What about those fishing regs re: bleeding fish?

[kootenayelkslayer]

That's quite funny. What about those fishing regs re: bleeding fish?

What about them? I think you're missing the joke here... Thanks for coming out though.

[Gateholio]

You guys are silly.

Try not to insult each other , ok?

[PGK]

That's quite funny. What about those fishing regs re: bleeding fish?

The fish died, and was retained.

The months old fish you dragged back into it was not bleeding.

What is the issue? Besides calling us liars?????????????

[Dirty]

LOL
You are Mr. Ethics yet yours a very questionable..shame on you.

Can I add... PGK by day.. Mr.Perfect by internet.
http://www.penguin.com.au/covers-jpg/9781846462832.jpg

[500grhollowpoint]

Wow this is ******ed. I Don't know what is stupider, this thread or me for posting in it.

[Gateholio]

Wow this is ******ed. I Don't know what is stupider, this thread or me for posting in it.

Probably you.......
;-)

[Fisher-Dude]

Try not to insult each other , ok?

What fun would that be?

[Stone Sheep Steve]

Come on now, be a good sport. You've been had, take it like a man.

Barbed Hook, line and sinker!!!:lol:

SSS

[ianwuzhere]

i thought the same thing as you fisherdude when i saw them taking a pic of putting that fish back in the hole. i think these guys just strive to start arguments and get people going by saying stuff like "line cuts" etc, - they must have been banned from the teletubby website!;)
- but back to the single barbless hooks, i release lots of fish but like to keep nice ones for supper once and a while so i dont pinch my barbs until i have to as i think a barb increases my chances.

[abbyfireguy]

And I thought being a parent to two teenagers left me shaking my head..Sheesh...cabin fever or what:cool:!!