Mandatory Bow Hunter Training

[Avalanche123]

I was in one of our local hunting/fishing stores when two young gentlemen walk in and inquire about buying a bow as they are going deer/moose hunting this weekend....

:shock: .....yep that was my reaction

So the saleslady proceeds to give them the salespitch on which bow is their best buy since they are new to the sport and they don't have much money

:shock::shock::shock:....yep that was my next reaction.

I wanted to suggest that they practise before they go hunting but was hoping the saleslady would have but didn't. (They were also very inexperienced hunters judging by what they were saying.)

I came away wondering that there was something quite wrong with the whole picture. I thought the best way to deal with this would be to have to present some type of card that said you passed a bow hunting training course before a bow would be sold to you. I am sure there is a better way....

The store wanted their money, the lads wanted a bow to go hunting with for this weekend......fortunately neither happened because they quickly realized it was too expensive for their budget.

I left feeling somewhat helpless as I can definitely see the void that exists with the present lack of training requirement and the potential consequences of it all.

[LOC]

I can't say I agree. We already need to have the CORE before being aloud to hunt. Which, if I remember, touches on bow hunting, and just as importantly touches on ethics.

That scenero is no different than someone walking into the same store, buying a new gun and scope having never shot before ( or is there a live fire requirement on either the FAC or CORE now?) and going hunting that evening, or a cross-bow (let's say they don't have an FAC).

They can do as much damage with a gun / cross-bow due to inexperience as they can with a compound.

My $0.02

[daycort]

They can do as much damage with a gun / cross-bow due to inexperience as they can with a compound.


My thoughts exactly. Wait until they wound an animal and it gets away. Then they will feel like real butt shmacks.

[Wild one]

I don't support mandatory bow hunter training at all. The gov does not need any more ideas on how to add fees. I have seen just as many rifle hunters(if not more)as bowhunters that need to spend more time in the range before they shoot at game. If this is a real problem than all hunters should have to prove they are capable not just bowhunters. The truth is I would have been blunt and told those young guys that they would not be ready to bow hunt by the weekend do to the practice need to shoot a bow properly.

[Dirty]

I can't say I agree. We already need to have the CORE before being aloud to hunt. Which, if I remember, touches on bow hunting, and just as importantly touches on ethics.

That scenero is no different than someone walking into the same store, buying a new gun and scope having never shot before ( or is there a live fire requirement on either the FAC or CORE now?) and going hunting that evening, or a cross-bow (let's say they don't have an FAC).

They can do as much damage with a gun / cross-bow due to inexperience as they can with a compound.

My $0.02


I totally agree with this. What is the difference between a rifle, shotgun, or bow? If you can't shoot you can't shoot. It all comes down to one thing: ethics. And like Kirby said once (Speaking of which, where the hell has Kirby been?), "Ethics are like underwear, everyone has them, it's just that some are shittier than others".

[Gateholio]

Making bow hunters pass a mandatory course is about the same as saying "we don't want any more bow hunters in BC"

It's just a weapon, it can be used or misused, just like a rifle, shotgun or handgun...

PS: it's not difficult to grasp the basic techniques of killing an animal at close range with a crossbow or compound, if you have a well set up bow and soem previous hunitng experience.

I killed animals 18 hours after picking up a crossbow and takign a few practice shots for the first time in 15 years, and I managed to shoot groups in a couple of inches with my buddy's compound, after not shooting bows in longer than 15 years...:-D

[Bow Walker]

Hunting in general - killing game animals, or birds - should require the 'hunter' to pass a "course" and earn a certificate of achievment before they can purchase a 'killing implement'.

Now, I realize that this is a fairly broad-based statement and that it has plenty of loopholes in it - but - it just might go a long way towards creating respect and responsibility in hunters.

....just my $2.00 worth (inflation's a bitch, ain't it?)

[rocksteady]

Being as inexperienced as they appear, I don't think they have a snowballs hope of actually getting close enough to take a shot.....(I Hope)

[Ron.C]

I don't think that bowhunter Education course needs to be manditory. The two key things all bowhunters must have in my opinion are shooting profficiency and ethics. It doesn't matter if you can accurately shoot 15 yards or 60 yards proficiently, you need to know how far you can accurately shoot and have the ethics and self control to stick to it. No course can teach this. Same goes for rifle hunting but I think it is too often abused by bowhunters.

[mcrae]

Maybe they could just beef up the bow hunting content in the CORE course? I think allot more guys are taking advantage of the bow seasons so it wouldn't hurt to update the bow hunting portion and touch on the subject a bit more..I know for me personally if I had to go out and take another course to bow hunt I would not bother...

[huntwriter]

I was in one of our local hunting/fishing stores when two young gentlemen walk in and inquire about buying a bow as they are going deer/moose hunting this weekend....

:shock: .....yep that was my reaction

So the saleslady proceeds to give them the salespitch on which bow is their best buy since they are new to the sport and they don't have much money

:shock::shock::shock:....yep that was my next reaction.

I wanted to suggest that they practise before they go hunting but was hoping the saleslady would have but didn't. (They were also very inexperienced hunters judging by what they were saying.)

I came away wondering that there was something quite wrong with the whole picture. I thought the best way to deal with this would be to have to present some type of card that said you passed a bow hunting training course before a bow would be sold to you. I am sure there is a better way....

The store wanted their money, the lads wanted a bow to go hunting with for this weekend......fortunately neither happened because they quickly realized it was too expensive for their budget.

I left feeling somewhat helpless as I can definitely see the void that exists with the present lack of training requirement and the potential consequences of it all.

Hunting is already over regulated and has to many mandatory obligations attached to it. Adding more will drive even more people away from our sport.

Going by your post the problem you encountered in that store will sort itself out.
These guys have no experience as hunters and never shot a bow, soon they will learn the hard way that hunting is not as easy as they may have thought and give up on the idea.

[brian]

You think they could have gotten close enough to even take a shot given their level of experience?


Maybe they could just beef up the bow hunting content in the CORE course?
My personal experience of the CORE course was it was a complete waste of time. But that may have just been my experience with my instructor. Now I'm having visions of some hunter who has never touched a bow training people for bow hunting? One of my main criticisms of CORE was the subject matter was way too broad to be taught in such a brief amount of time. You could only very vaguely scratch the surface of so many topics. To introduce yet more topics would only diminish the limited effectiveness of the course.

[Crazypop]

Maybe we could add that they have to go out with someone who has hunted with a bow...you guys should put your names in for a Bow-hunter apprentice program...probably might work!

Adding another course would be like making people take a road test for a bike after they take a road test for a car...same rules....diffent vehicle...
Maybe we should even get tested when we buy a quad...I never quaded before...can I go into the muskeg...why not! :shock:

[tomahawk]

You think they could have gotten close enough to even take a shot given their level of experience?

My personal experience of the CORE course was it was a complete waste of time. But that may have just been my experience with my instructor. Now I'm having visions of some hunter who has never touched a bow training people for bow hunting? One of my main criticisms of CORE was the subject matter was way too broad to be taught in such a brief amount of time. You could only very vaguely scratch the surface of so many topics. To introduce yet more topics would only diminish the limited effectiveness of the course.

I'm sure there are good substantial reasons for your thinking "the CORE course was a complete waste of time" (although I don't know what they would be), however I don't understand why you would think that way?

You were not born with most of the knowledge that you learnt in CORE, perhaps you learnt from a friend or relative but surely you picked up some good animal and bird knowledge, ethical behaviour, understanding of the regulations etc etc from your instructor? If not I would suggest you contact BCWF and let them know about your experience with that instructor!

Tom

[ElkMasterC]

Absolutely.

Either a course, or proficiency test should be administered.

Contrary to what some have said it's not "the same as a shotgun or rifle" (paraphrase). The arc on a crossbow bolt or long arrow is a world apart from the arc and hitting power of a bullet or slug.
The judgment of range to the animal is crucial, and the other factors, such as shot placement, obstructing brush etc are exponentially more important.

Add to the fact that there are thousands that just buy a crossbow as they would a shotgun, but with an eye to merely extending their season, and with little or no interest in archery, or learning the finer points of a fine sport, and you have a recipe for disaster.

Anyone that's a huge fan of my posts, and hey....who isn't!!??.... :roll: .. knows I don't like crossbows. They're like training wheels. You can use it if you need it for a year or two...then get serious.
Then it's just embarrassing to be seen with one. Unless you have a disability...or are required to wear a Hockey Helmet when you go outside the house.

No statistics can ever be really available for the numbers of animals wounded that live, and that are wounded and lost to become Coyote Fodder, but I'm confident that those numbers could be significantly reduced with mentoring and education. And the only way to keep most people honest is to make them pass a test. Sad but true, it's just human nature.
Most people do what they think they can get away with.
If you bridle at that remark, look at human history.

(Wow...I used a hunter education thread...and twisted it to rag on crossbows again......Man, I'm good!)

Let the SH*T storm begin!!!

[Avalanche123]

Regardless if you agree of disagree (which is fine), the point I was trying to get across was how shocked I was when the store when I overheard the conversation.

My personal ethics are a little different as is my bowhunting confidence when it comes to getting it right. I did not go hunting for two yrs from the time I got my bow. Some folks are ok to go after a few hours of practise, others wait yrs. We all live with our decisions.

So again I could careless about the weapon. It could have been a rifle or shotgun. It was a bow so I put this in the bow forum.

I've always viewed education as a good thing. Mandatory was a poor choice of word on my part.

[Bowzone_Mikey]

Adding another course would be like making people take a road test for a bike after they take a road test for a car...same rules....diffent vehicle...
! :shock:
...

So you are in favor of a bow hunting test since there actually is a road test for a class 6 licence even tho you have a 5

CORE needs a revamp ... as i am of the opinion that it was a waste ...heres why ... who cares the history of the shot gun and how they came up with 20 gauge, 12 gauge etc.. there was very little on animal ID except for Birds ... well I aint a bird hunter ('xept Turkey)...nothing on shot placement , care in the feild with a downed animal ... some touched on ethics ie: posted land etc...

[Crazypop]

...

So you are in favor of a bow hunting test since there actually is a road test for a class 6 licence even tho you have a 5
Exactly! just another money grab used by the govt!
:-x

[Avalanche123]

Too bad training is viewed as a money grab and not an educational tool....

With the negative press towards hunting in general we are only as strong as our weakest links. I think a well run well thought out course taught by talent instructors would be a good thing. (If that were possible....)

[Gateholio]

It's always interesting to see a group of people attempt to kill participation in thier chosen activity by over regulating qualifications and equipment.:biggrin:

[Crazypop]

I really don't think training is the Idea, we have to do some sort of course before we get a hunter number, True.
Ok, now in order to be a bow hunter you must do no course but the core should be enough...and people should understand you have to practice...but to make a MANDATORY course would be detrimental. It would be like the course in order to purchase firearms. Next thing you know we will have to register or bows...(i am going on a tangent reeling it in now).
If there were a course like the ones they put on for learning to ride motorcycles that is an optional course that you go to to learn cause you want to, that would be more benifical in my mind.
IE: HOW TO be a BETTER bowhunter....

So, no not saying education is bad...Mandatory education is bad

[Avalanche123]

It's always interesting to see a group of people attempt to kill participation in thier chosen activity by over regulating qualifications and equipment.:biggrin:

Sorry to hear that's your impression of this. It certainly isn;t mine.

[Gateholio]

I
If there were a course like the ones they put on for learning to ride motorcycles that is an optional course that you go to to learn cause you want to, that would be more benifical in my mind.
IE: HOW TO be a BETTER bowhunter....

So, no not saying education is bad...Mandatory education is bad


There is the IBEP course. Makes much more sense to me to encourage peopel to take it, rather than force them to.:smile:

[Gateholio]

Sorry to hear that's your impression of this. It certainly isn;t mine.

It may not be your impression, but a mandatory course will not encourage participation, nor will limiting weapons choice.

[Mr Cam]

I've bought a tag and I'm going to shoot a deer with my crossbow. But I will only be allowed if I am disabled, by law.

When you hit 50 I'm going to scream for eye examinations, and requalification every 2 years.

Semi-auto rifles should be banned because nobody needs them.

And make sure you drive a wedge between all of your sporting pursuits, because the government will take care of us all, and legislate ethics.

you guys make me sick, Mr Cam, an inexperienced hunter out

I don't want to be associated with you anymore.

[Edward Teach]

I have a bow I can hunt with, and I'm just now getting to the point where I'm reasonably satisfied with shot groupings. I haven't even begun to tune broadheads yet. I'm not ready to hunt with it.
The likely scenario is that jokers like these wouldn't even come close to a deer.
The worst case scenario is they might wound one and it runs off and dies someplace and isn't recovered.
Nevertheless, I don't want to see more regulation, but I would like to see an emphasis placed on training and dammit, the stores have a responsibility to at least encourage that. Sending some clown off with a new bow that he doesn't know how to shoot is irresponsible of them, and that's actually a store I'd like to not spend money in.
I was in Boorman Archery one day and some clown came in and wanted to buy some stuff and he didn't have a clue. He had a bow that some friend gave to him that he didn't know how to shoot, didn't know what the weight or draw length was, and he wanted to start screwing around with releases (he didn't know much about them either and was shopping price, not function), but the sales guy at least tried to talk sense into him. He told him he could sell him stuff but if he didn't know what he was doing, he wouldn't be very happy and could very well wind up hurting himself or screwing up a perfectly good bow. I give the guy points for at least trying to help Bozo to see that he really needed to educate himself before doing anything rash.

[Avalanche123]

It may not be your impression, but a mandatory course will not encourage participation, nor will limiting weapons choice.

GH, If you read back, I took the word Mandatory out of my statement as I released it was a poor choice of words.

I agree, mandatory anything usually limits participation.

I still feel there is a flaw with the process. Getting bowhunting numbers to increase at all costs isn't anyones intention either I believe. I feel that there is alot to gain by having better informed hunters (regardless of weapon) on a whole.

[moosecaller]

No one forces you to practice shooting in order to be a hunter. I have seen people that have been shooting for years both rifle and bow and still have a flinch or pull shot that could not be missed by most if they tried. Practice or education does not make up for natural talent or abilities, some people just plain can't shoot, do we need to have every hunter regardless of weapon of choice qualify before we allow them out in the bush, "you can't hunt because you are a crappy shot" Training has it's place but if you don't have the apptitude for the sport are you open to being banned from it? If that was the case what about all thise a$$clowns we come across during our daily drives that cannot drive properly, they have gone through the training,testing and someone has OK'd them to join the rest of us. How much more do we want big brother regulating us in our daily activities? Who sets the standard? Find a system without a flaw and someone will think one up!

[Remington]

I think the majority of people that buy a bow with the intent to hunt with do shoot and practise often enough before hunting season regardless of any programs that are available out there.

If 2 guys buy a bow a few days before a bow season with no previous experience that would be highly unethical imo and I Can see why some would want people to at least practice with their equipment before they head to the field. Its just plain common sense but there are a fair amount that obviosly seem to lack it!:biggrin:

[rocksteady]

I've bought a tag and I'm going to shoot a deer with my crossbow. But I will only be allowed if I am disabled, by law.

When you hit 50 I'm going to scream for eye examinations, and requalification every 2 years.

Semi-auto rifles should be banned because nobody needs them.

And make sure you drive a wedge between all of your sporting pursuits, because the government will take care of us all, and legislate ethics.

you guys make me sick, Mr Cam, an inexperienced hunter out

I don't want to be associated with you anymore.


??????????? WOW.......Prozac needed ????

[junior]

It's too bad some people aren't born with a touch of ethics...

[OOBuck]

Ok, just because you pass your PAL does this mean you are proficient with a rifle or shotgun now does it!

Maybe there needs to be an IQ test to see if your stupid or wether you will spend the time and become proficient with any weapond of choice.

Ya thats it! A mandatory stupid test, square peg round hole type test that will solve all the problems.

[huntwriter]

Ok, just because you pass your PAL does this mean you are proficient with a rifle or shotgun now does it!

Maybe there needs to be an IQ test to see if your stupid or wether you will spend the time and become proficient with any weapond of choice.

Ya thats it! A mandatory stupid test, square peg round hole type test that will solve all the problems.

Why strop there? I also would like to see and IQ test for parents BEFORE they can have children and while we’re at it. I also would like to see an IQ test BEFORE can drive a car. I see on a daily basis more stupid parents and road users than I see hunters in one year.;)

[The Hermit]

Spare cave for rent...

[OOBuck]

Why strop there? I also would like to see and IQ test for parents BEFORE they can have children and while we’re at it. I also would like to see an IQ test BEFORE can drive a car. I see on a daily basis more stupid parents and road users than I see hunters in one year.;)

We could weed out the really stupid ones by putting a number system into place like they have at a dry cleaner.. Call out the number and you lost your ticky or have to take off you socks & shoes to figure out your number, REJECT!:-D LOL

[mmcleodk]

I think it should be mandatory to the same level the PAL is mandatory, where you can bowhunt without a bow license if your accompanied but have to get a license in order to hunt by yourself with one.

I think it should be given equal education as the PAL, but I also think it should be similarly priced if not cheaper, make it a quick course just covering the basics (I loved IBEP but it might deter people from getting started into bowhunting)

[Mr Cam]

It's too bad some people aren't born with a touch of ethics...


and I or you or the government can't change it.

The only positive contribution you can make is to teach younger or less experienced people to be accountable for their decisions.

[brian]

I'm sure there are good substantial reasons for your thinking "the CORE course was a complete waste of time" (although I don't know what they would be), however I don't understand why you would think that way?

Sorry to go way back to this Tomahawk, yes it was probably my experience with my instructor. He spent very little time on species identification, he tried to teach survival techniques but didn't have the background in them. I have a background in first aid and can tell you this guy didn't know that either when he tried to teach it. He even gave some dangerous misinformation on hypothermia and heat loss. And he spent no time on ethics saying just read the book. The course was like taking a course to pass an exam rather than delivering knowledge. So now you may understand why I would think that way.

[tooley]

You guts don't have to worry,the first time a newbie shoots their bow for the first time and loses their $15 arrow, they will soon learn how to shoot properly~

[threedhunter]

spent a long time today having a confab with a co. he has suggested that if we want a rural bowhunting season with landowner consent, we may have to prove proficiency and have sufficient insurance. he suggested the ibep course and british columbia archery association membership.

[blacklab]

CO's like rules more than any group of people I know. Seems they are always looking for new regulations that will reduce hunter numbers, and a mandatory bow course would accomplish just that.

[huntwriter]

I am not surprised to hear that a CO is in favor of bowhunting education. Government and government officials whole purpose is to regulate everything and given the chance they would intrude into our bedroom s too. Oh, hang on a minute. The government already does that.

The National Bowhunter Education Organization lobbies hard to make their education program mandatory everywhere in North America. I can see that in ten years from now hunters, just like in Europe, will have to dig very deep into their pockets to afford hunting. Hunters will also need larger wallets to carry all the licenses, prove of insurance, PAL, Bowhunter license, proficiency test and other necessary paperwork with them. Perhaps we also will see legislation, like in Germany, were hunters get an assigned hunting area and stand locations safety inspected by the government, and paid for by the hunter.

It puzzles me that the government is the only institution that believes that stupidity can be regulated out of existence by making laws and regulations to make it tougher for the vast majority of us. Fact is that the government couldn’t care less about safety or ethics. To them its strictly all about getting at our money and finding news ways of doing it and mandatory bowhunter education is just another scam to do that.

Hunter education organizations are quickly to point out that since they have become mandatory accidents and sloppiness have drastically dropped. This is an outright lie. What has drastically dropped is the numbers of hunter and with that accident numbers went down too. Twenty years ago the number of hunters was more than double of what they are now. With more hunters in the woods there where also more accidents and with less hunters the accident numbers went down. The American recreational accident statistic (America is the only country having a accident statistic based on individual recreational activity) hunting remained at an almost constant low of 0.2% per 1000 participants since the start of compiling statistics of this nature some 40 years ago. This makes hunting safer than basketball, rollerblading or even tennis.

If mandatory bowhunter education would come about, I would hang my bow on the wall and that is the sentiment I hear from many hunters in America and Canada.

In fact when New York introduced a mandatory bowhunter education and proficiency course ten years ago (the first state to do so) the numbers of bowhunters dropped below the half point and ever since they had trouble bringing the numbers back up again. Two years ago NY finally abolished this nonsense and numbers are steadily growing again. By advocating a mandatory bowhunter course archery hunting organizations and bowhunters shoot themselves in the foot (no pun intended.)

[GoatGuy]

The National Bowhunter Education Organization lobbies hard to make their education program mandatory everywhere in North America. I can see that in ten years from now hunters, just like in Europe, will have to dig very deep into their pockets to afford hunting. Hunters will also need larger wallets to carry all the licenses, prove of insurance, PAL, Bowhunter license, proficiency test and other necessary paperwork with them. Perhaps we also will see legislation, like in Germany, were hunters get an assigned hunting area and stand locations safety inspected by the government, and paid for by the hunter.

It puzzles me that the government is the only institution that believes that stupidity can be regulated out of existence by making laws and regulations to make it tougher for the vast majority of us. Fact is that the government couldn’t care less about safety or ethics. To them its strictly all about getting at our money and finding news ways of doing it and mandatory bowhunter education is just another scam to do that.

Hunter education organizations are quickly to point out that since they have become mandatory accidents and sloppiness have drastically dropped. This is an outright lie. What has drastically dropped is the numbers of hunter and with that accident numbers went down too. Twenty years ago the number of hunters was more than double of what they are now. With more hunters in the woods there where also more accidents and with less hunters the accident numbers went down. The American recreational accident statistic (America is the only country having a accident statistic based on individual recreational activity) hunting remained at an almost constant low of 0.2% per 1000 participants since the start of compiling statistics of this nature some 40 years ago. This makes hunting safer than basketball, rollerblading or even tennis.

If mandatory bowhunter education would come about, I would hang my bow on the wall and that is the sentiment I hear from many hunters in America and Canada.

In fact when New York introduced a mandatory bowhunter education and proficiency course ten years ago (the first state to do so) the numbers of bowhunters dropped below the half point and ever since they had trouble bringing the numbers back up again. Two years ago NY finally abolished this nonsense and numbers are steadily growing again. By advocating a mandatory bowhunter course archery hunting organizations and bowhunters shoot themselves in the foot (no pun intended.)




You're a sharp cookie. I think mandatory bowhunter education will be devastating to bowhunter numbers.

This is another case of somebody putting a solution ahead of a problem. Also another case where actually doing some research or having an understanding of other jurisdictions and implications of regulations is extremely beneficial.

You'll be an asset to hunters and bowhunters in BC.

[ElkMasterC]

I am not surprised to hear that a CO is in favor of bowhunting education. Government and government officials whole purpose is to regulate everything and given the chance they would intrude into our bedroom s too. Oh, hang on a minute. The government already does that.


Explain that, please.
Oh, and please provide a link to your articles, as I would love to read some, Huntwriter.

[Kirby]

And like Kirby said once (Speaking of which, where the hell has Kirby been?), "Ethics are like underwear, everyone has them, it's just that some are shittier than others".

Still around just not getting much time online. And I believe it was StoneChaser who once came up with that beautiful pharse(to give credit where credit is due).

And Mandatory bowhunter education is a horrible idea unless you want to destroy bowhunter numbers... but thats just my .02 from what little I've read and talked with other hunters.

Oh and for what its worth I see little difference between the guy that buys a brand new bow 3 days before the season and the guy who buys a rifle right before the season shoots 5 shots and says good enought... with the exception that most of those guys aren't good enough to get within bow range to begin with, however can get within rifle range.

Kirby

[blacklab]

I've listened to a lot of hunters over the years. When the CORE hunter training was made mandatory, a lot of them said great less hunters more foe me. When steel shot was made mandatory they said fewer hunters, more for me. When the gun registry came along they said fewer hunters more for me. Now mandatory bow hunter training. More for ME!!
I also know all of the above regulations were endorsed by a majority of C.O.'s in this province.

[Gateholio]

Explain that, please.
.


That's pretty simple- Government bodies LOVE regulations that they can regulate. Keeps thir budgets inflated.:-P

[Kirby]

I've listened to a lot of hunters over the years. When the CORE hunter training was made mandatory, a lot of them said great less hunters more foe me. When steel shot was made mandatory they said fewer hunters, more for me. When the gun registry came along they said fewer hunters more for me. Now mandatory bow hunter training. More for ME!!


And now we have the lowest hunter numbers ever. Maybe they were right restrictions = less hunters

Kirby

[Gateholio]

And now we have the lowest hunter numbers ever. Maybe they were right restrictions = less hunters

Kirby


I don't know how many people I have talked to over the years who want to try hunting, but when I tell them they need to get do a PAL course and a CORE course, they kinda lose interest..

[GoatGuy]

And now we have the lowest hunter numbers ever. Maybe they were right restrictions = less hunters

Kirby

Solutions for problems that don't exist......................

Some days I think we'll never learn.

[aggiehunter]

Yup I sure would quit bowhunting if I had to take me a course, hell I'd quit driving my car, my boat, get rid a my guns, quit umpiring, forget firstaid, my job, skydiving...hell I'd quit er' all and stay home and watch TV cause there aint' no course for that ,just damned instructions.

[harder rd]

proficiency test should be administered. for rifle and bow a like. How hard would it be to get tested once a year . I would have no proplem going to a range befor the season some time to get tested. I go to the range to sight it any way . maybe proof that you passed a proficiency test befor you can buy a tag would work . not sure about all the logistics, but I would have no problems with something like that . It may even make the woods a little safer, not haveing every one sighting in there rifles on a stump on opening morning. I am sure you have all seen that happen. And if a simple hunting skill test like shooting is going to stop people from hunting. They were never realy into it in the first place.

[Kirby]

And if a simple hunting skill test like shooting is going to stop people from hunting. They were never realy into it in the first place.

thats the approach we need, lets increase difficulty and pain in the ass.:roll:

Do people not understand our sport is on the decline? there are fewer hunters all the time... we don't need to make it HARDER to hunt!!! We need to make it easier. Increased restriction does nothing but hurt the sport.

Kirby

[J_T]

Why is it always about accuracy? I would suggest as a bow hunter it's more about blood trailing.

Taking an animal with a bow (or rifle) has little to do with accuracy. It has mostly to do with the user's confidence that under the conditions he is faced with, that he can make the shot. And some instructor with a badge is going to judge us???? I think not.

If I were forced to take an accuracy proficiency shot, I'd walk up to within a metre of the target and poke my arrow into the bulls eye. Telling me to take a shot from 20 yards or I can't hunt is a joke. As a rule I don't take 20 yard shots at animals.

Killing an animal has to do with intelligent decisions made by the killer, not the equipment.

Shooting in your back yard everynight ensures your instincts and your equipment is functioning, it does little to improve your intellect. Just because you can make a shot at 40 yards or 60 doesn't mean you should take it in a killing situation.

At least bowhunter education provides bow hunters with the opportunity to develop skills that will both enhance their experience and provide more likelihood of success. Now that might, improve intellect.

Can we get off this accuracy yank?

[Mr Cam]

Wow, "mandatory bow hunter training" is still at the top of the forum, after a couple of months, my instincts were right, unfortunately. That's pretty sad.
Be accountable, take a novice out to the range, give advice, and pass down experience to others, it's up to you as a participant in the sport. A gutshot animal should be enough of a inspiration to impart the reality of sound reasonning.
Anyone who believes this is a government responsibility should look inward. What have you done? Are you accountable? Do you really think the government will legislate ethics, and experience, or skill?
I live on Vancouver Island and there is a ton of baby boomers, older people, from all over, there is a wealth of knowledge to share. But it kinda reminds me of the Legion, cheap beer, and no atmosphere, kinda like here.

I'm happier now that elkmasterc is on my ignore list, his devisiveness would wreck a bowling leauge. I guess some think that the government or themselves could write a manual for throwing a ball, but getting consistent strikes is out of their control, regardless of equipment, form or criteria.
Please kill this thread, it's emberassing.

[blacklab]

We better start a thread demanding mandatory poacher training. The way some of you people think poachers will be the only ones left to hunt.

[kayjayess]

I agree 100% that there should be no additional formal training for bow hunters. Really at the end of the day CORE is good and gives you the basics but the really learning is out there with a mentor. Most of us have had the advantage of being mentored at some point whether it was starting at age 5 by your father of later in life by a friend that has hunted. I took a hunter education program when I was an early teen but the formal training I received paled in comparison to the field training I received from my father for the previous ten years.

Most responsible hunters will take advantage of being mentored by others. There will always by the odd dumb @ss that sneaks through a course/exam and goes out and gives hunters a bad name. I think the solution is good mentoring and not so much formal training. We are all stewards of this great sport and the more we can assist new hunters the better off we all are.

[aggiehunter]

Why are there so many shitty bowhunters out there then?

[GoatGuy]

Why are there so many shitty bowhunters out there then?

How many is so many and why are they so bad?

[huntwriter]

There will always by the odd dumb @ss that sneaks through a course/exam and goes out and gives hunters a bad name.

You’re right about that. The guy that shot an arrow at me many years ago, turned out to be a bowhunter education instructor from a “notable” bowhunter organization. He was not anymore after I was done with him.

That experience taught me all I needed to know about hunter education and making it mandatory would not make a dime of difference. Tell you what it would do though. We would loose more hunters, a lot more. They lost a lot of bowhunters, even experienced ones, in the state of New York when they introduced that insanity of mandatory bowhunter and proficiency courses. Now that New York thankfully removed that “obligation” and made it optional numbers are climbing steadily again.

A sure way to eliminate hunting is to over regulate it and attach a lot of mandatory obligations to it. It's already bad and we don't need more hassle. Not so long ago I told a person that showed an interest in hunting what he all needed to do before he can go hunting. After he was done looking at me in disbelieve he said, “I can fly an airplane with less hassle than I can go hunting. I think I don’t want to go hunting after hearing this.” He must know because he flies a small airplane for recreation and hobby.

[GoatGuy]

You’re right about that. The guy that shot an arrow at me many years ago, turned out to be a bowhunter education instructor from a “notable” bowhunter organization. He was not anymore after I was done with him.

That experience taught me all I needed to know about hunter education and making it mandatory would not make a dime of difference. Tell you what it would do though. We would loose more hunters, a lot more. They lost a lot of bowhunters, even experienced ones, in the state of New York when they introduced that insanity of mandatory bowhunter and proficiency courses. Now that New York thankfully removed that “obligation” and made it optional numbers are climbing steadily again.

A sure way to eliminate hunting is to over regulate it and attach a lot of mandatory obligations to it. It's already bad and we don't need more hassle. Not so long ago I told a person that showed an interest in hunting what he all needed to do before he can go hunting. After he was done looking at me in disbelieve he said, “I can fly an airplane with less hassle than I can go hunting. I think I don’t want to go hunting after hearing this.” He must know because he flies a small airplane for recreation and hobby.

Huntwriter, I'm convinced you're the only fellow who's actually done some research before posting. Your posts are shocking and refreshing all at the same time. You are however going against the grain. Watch you don't get labeled.


And yes, you're right, anyone with two feet and a heart beat can become a pilot! AC's hiring criteria: IQ and shoe size match, you're hired!

[huntwriter]

Watch you don't get labeled.

Lol. I am already labeled, someone recently wrote about me and said “Othmar is one of the great statesmen of hunting.” I have to say that I rather like that label, especially in connection it was written. I am a tireless fighter to preserve our hunting heritage and the right to hunt for all. In addition I am actively engaged in recruiting new hunters through various activities. I have been a supporter of making crossbows legal archey equipment for all hunters in America during archery season at a time when everybody thought crossbows were evil. I supported women in the hunting community way back when most believed that a woman’s place is behind the stove and in the bed. Although I am a hunter education instructor I believe hunter education should be optional.

Before the pro-mandatory (bow)hunter education advocates jump all over me and tear me to bits let me inform you of a fact. Wherever hunter education is an option the classrooms are full and I believe that these students learn more simply because they want to be there and they want to learn. These young and novice hunters are eager to learn, they don’t go to these classes because they have to go. Therefore these hunters will absorb more of what they learned and will be more likely to apply what they have learned in the bush.


Conversely, I have been told more times than I care to remember by students in mandatory hunter education class, ”I am only here because I have to.” Meaning, they want to get it done and over with. I have never received a thank you note from a mandatory hunter education course student, but I have a big file folder full of such notes from optional class students. Not that it this matters but it does explain the spirit of the students. Free Will versus Force.

I see the students and the willingness, or lack of it, to participate in mandatory classes and in optional classes and let me inform you the difference is like day and night. Having said that I might add that optional classes offer more in the way of student participation and interactivity, it costs a bit more too, than the rather boring “sit and listen” approach of the mandatory hunter education courses.

I am very fortunate in that I get to talk and communicate with an awful lot of hunters all over North America and with hunting industry folks too trough my writing, seminars and promotioanl apperances. This has given me a much broader view of the hunting community and to a degree. It also permits me to feel the pulse of the hunting community at large and I can tell it is a very different pulse from what we’re told by the “high and mighty”. There is a real fear, justifiably so, that all these new legislations, stricter and more rules and ever more obligations will kill hunting for all of us.

I have to agree with that common fear. If you want to regulate hunting out of existence then go ahead make a mandatory bowhunter education course. Heck, why stop there. License bows and arrows too, bring in a ATV eduactgion course and license too. But I tell you what, it will not make any difference whatsoever. A slob will be a slob no matter what.


By the way, we focus so much on the bad things that happen in our community we forget that hunters by large are some of the most ethical and moral people in any recreational activity and we can be proud of the fact that hunting has one of the lowest accident rates of any recreational activity. Not bad going if you consider that we use firearms and bows instead of tennis rackets and roller blades. Let’s focus on the good things that happen in our community and on the good things we hunters do for all. We can't all be saints because we are only human and that is alright by me too. Hunting is good, hunting is great and the few bad appels don't worry me because there is much more elsewhere.


Sorry I was on a roll here…there might be an article somewhere in here.;-)

[GoatGuy]

Lol. I am already labeled, someone recently wrote about me and said “Othmar is one of the great statesmen of hunting.” I have to say that I rather like that label, especially in connection it was written. I am a tireless fighter to preserve our hunting heritage and the right to hunt for all. In addition I am actively engaged in recruiting new hunters through various activities. I have been a supporter of making crossbows legal archey equipment for all hunters in America during archery season at a time when everybody thought crossbows were evil. I supported women in the hunting community way back when most believed that a woman’s place is behind the stove and in the bed. Although I am a hunter education instructor I believe hunter education should be optional.

Before the pro-mandatory (bow)hunter education advocates jump all over me and tear me to bits let me inform you of a fact. Wherever hunter education is an option the classrooms are full and I believe that these students learn more simply because they want to be there and they want to learn. These young and novice hunters are eager to learn, they don’t go to these classes because they have to go. Therefore these hunters will absorb more of what they learned and will be more likely to apply what they have learned in the bush.


Conversely, I have been told more times than I care to remember by students in mandatory hunter education class, ”I am only here because I have to.” Meaning, they want to get it done and over with. I have never received a thank you note from a mandatory hunter education course student, but I have a big file folder full of such notes from optional class students. Not that it this matters but it does explain the spirit of the students. Free Will versus Force.

I see the students and the willingness, or lack of it, to participate in mandatory classes and in optional classes and let me inform you the difference is like day and night. Having said that I might add that optional classes offer more in the way of student participation and interactivity, it costs a bit more too, than the rather boring “sit and listen” approach of the mandatory hunter education courses.

I am very fortunate in that I get to talk and communicate with an awful lot of hunters all over North America and with hunting industry folks too trough my writing, seminars and promotioanl apperances. This has given me a much broader view of the hunting community and to a degree. It also permits me to feel the pulse of the hunting community at large and I can tell it is a very different pulse from what we’re told by the “high and mighty”. There is a real fear, justifiably so, that all these new legislations, stricter and more rules and ever more obligations will kill hunting for all of us.

I have to agree with that common fear. If you want to regulate hunting out of existence then go ahead make a mandatory bowhunter education course. Heck, why stop there. License bows and arrows too, bring in a ATV eduactgion course and license too. But I tell you what, it will not make any difference whatsoever. A slob will be a slob no matter what.


By the way, we focus so much on the bad things that happen in our community we forget that hunters by large are some of the most ethical and moral people in any recreational activity and we can be proud of the fact that hunting has one of the lowest accident rates of any recreational activity. Not bad going if you consider that we use firearms and bows instead of tennis rackets and roller blades. Let’s focus on the good things that happen in our community and on the good things we hunters do for all. We can't all be saints because we are only human and that is alright by me too. Hunting is good, hunting is great and the few bad appels don't worry me because there is much more elsewhere.


Sorry I was on a roll here…there might be an article somewhere in here.;-)

You read my mind.

[aggiehunter]

You guys could meet and hug!

[Mr Cam]

You guys could meet and hug!

I'll hug them both!

Teach the less experienced and youth how to field dress, skin, hang, butcher, cure, smoke, can, jerk, tan, freeze, sausage, and recipes.
There is so much more than having a "dead deer," it's exciting, and hauling it out of the bush is only the start. They don't teach you that in school, it gets passed down by elders in the community and your family, if you're lucky enough to have a father or an uncle who can teach you.

Take the time to pass on your knowledge, in person, and you'll do a service that trancends time.

The government can't compete.....

[bow_tech_kaldan]

as a person who just bought his first bow, I would have no problem with this... I am not going to use it out in the field for a year, to me its like fly fishing, you start casting on that grass at the park then you go to the water

[huntwriter]

I'll hug them both!

Teach the less experienced and youth how to field dress, skin, hang, butcher, cure, smoke, can, jerk, tan, freeze, sausage, and recipes.
There is so much more than having a "dead deer," it's exciting, and hauling it out of the bush is only the start. They don't teach you that in school, it gets passed down by elders in the community and your family, if you're lucky enough to have a father or an uncle who can teach you.

Take the time to pass on your knowledge, in person, and you'll do a service that trancends time.

The government can't compete.....

Funny thing you should mention that Mr Cam. I have been working for the last half year on material for a “game processing” course. I think by next year I will be ready with it. You’re right, everybody talks about scouting, tactics, the best rifle/bow to kill the critter with and shot placement. But nobody addresses how to convert the dead animal into quality table fare.


Many years ago I use to give such courses for hunters and we used a goat or lamb for demonstration and sometimes I used road kill deer, we had plenty of those in Illinois. The course was an absolute hit and always full to the last seat. I always knew growing up in a meat processor family and learning the trade would come in handy one day.

[aggiehunter]

Mr. Cam, I like your words and sorry for the delay in replying. We all must help others in some way. We all don't have Fathers and Uncles who can teach us how old a drop of blood is, and where it came from. IBEP can give you the edge you need and we should not discourage education with resect to our pursuit.

[Fisher-Dude]

And yes, you're right, anyone with two feet and a heart beat can become a pilot!

Apparently so.


Yup I sure would quit bowhunting if I had to take me a course, hell I'd quit driving my car, my boat, get rid a my guns, quit umpiring, forget firstaid, my job, skydiving...hell I'd quit er' all and stay home and watch TV cause there aint' no course for that ,just damned instructions.

I don't know of too many bow hunters who, having passed the safety portion of CORE, would be any better at not killing a fellow hunter if they took the IBEP and learned how to tell how old a drop of deer blood is. I do know of a few pilots though who are better at protecting the lives of their passengers by getting their pilot's license after they get their driver's license. Aggie, your analogies are falling flat.

[sealevel]

A vollentary bow hunter training might not be a bad thing. ... But i am strongly aposed to a mandatory course. Ethic`s can`t be taught in a one day course by someone how thinks he`s gods gift to bowhunting.


Hunters will still make bad shots and loose animals . Deer will get hit by cars. Moose will get run over by trains . And at the end of it all hunters will still look bad in the eyes of the urban dwellers.

[aggiehunter]

FisherDude, IBEP is more about bowhunting deer which includes finding them after the shot and not killing yourself in a tree. My flat analogies only point to things that require education, thats all.

[Will]

A slob will be a slob no matter what.
That hit the nail on the head...........;-)

[Onesock]

You are correct, a slob will be a slob and all the courses in the world won't change that. But what about the guys that aren't slobs that just don't know about bowhunting. About falling out of treestands about blood trailing, because most rifle shot deer don't go too far. There are lots of things to learn. But you are right, let the newbies fall out of the tree's, I guess they will know better next time, won't they.

[Fisher-Dude]

You are correct, a slob will be a slob and all the courses in the world won't change that. But what about the guys that aren't slobs that just don't know about bowhunting. About falling out of treestands about blood trailing, because most rifle shot deer don't go too far. There are lots of things to learn. But you are right, let the newbies fall out of the tree's, I guess they will know better next time, won't they.

They'll probably fall and break their new crossbows, you know, the ones they just bought 3 hours earlier at Walmart.

Wouldn't the safety harness you buy at the outdoors store have directions so you know how to attach it? Can't see any manufacturer taking on the liability of selling them without a full set of instructions! Do you have to go to school to learn how to snap buckles together?

[Will]

But you are right, let the newbies fall out of the tree's, I guess they will know better next time, won't they.
Let the novices Fall out of the trees ?.......chances are far greater they will drive thier truck into one on the way to thier favourite hunting hole...... but then we already do have mandatory driver training and licensing so we can all be safer knowing vehicle accidents never happen.....right ? :lol:


But just the same watch out where you put your tree stand.......;)

[Fisher-Dude]

Let the novices Fall out of the trees ?.......chances are far greater they will drive thier truck into one on the way to thier favourite hunting hole...... but then we already do have mandatory driver training and licensing so we can all be safer knowing vehicle accidents never happen.....right ? :lol:


But just the same watch out where you put your tree stand.......;)

Now THAT'S how an analogy is used! Thanks Will!

Maybe aggie should go to mandatory analogy school before he's allowed to post on HBC? :lol::lol::lol:

[aggiehunter]

FD, That's actually a comparison, not an analogy. Where the hell is Goatguy when you need him?

[Onesock]

:sad:Can you imagine how many car accidents there would be if we never had to pass a test to drive????????????? FD- You had to pass a drivers test before you could hunt, why shouldn't bow hunters?

[Will]

FD- You had to pass a drivers test before you could hunt, why shouldn't bow hunters?
Actually nobody needs to pass a "driver's test" before they can hunt.............unless they are Road Hunters;)

Training courses and such....good ideas no doubt.
Making them Mandatory.... not so good for the reasons already mentioned by some.

[6616]

I never did take the IBEP course, but I certainly would have if I had the chance, it just wasn't readily available. I'd agree with "highly recommended" but not mandatory.

[Coyote]

Interesting read this post.

I am curious

To those who havent taken it ...what do you thing the course teaches? It's an honest question. I'd like to know what the general perception is concerning the course. Nothing to do with being mandatory or not.

'yote

[sealevel]

Coyote i would say it will teach high %ag shots compared to low. Ethic`s will be someone`s opionon . tracking and game recovery and safety all good stuff . Take out the mandatory and i would take it if its offerd.

I am to busy renewing my falling ticket.

[Will]

To those who havent taken it ...what do you thing the course teaches? It's an honest question. I'd like to know what the general perception is concerning the course.
I'll bite.......
Here's my A$$umptions:smile:

I'd guess it emphasizes shot Placement, safety, etc.etc.

All good things no doubt about it.......but a mandatory course specifically for Bowhunters is just another wedge between the Hunting fraternity IMO.

Talk to a few perspective Hunter wannabe's and you soon realize the general consensus is there is alot of BS involved already.......long gun safety course to get a PAL, then take the CORE to get your Number, now if you show some interest in Bowhunting well here's yet another course for you to get.
Sadly most simply lose interest and move on:cry:

We should be Educating Hunters young and old without question but it should be done in a manner that doesn't seem over regulated etc.....easier said then done I admit.

Why not simply push for a More "in depth" CORE program which I'm sure Most will agree is getting pretty "out dated" and could use a little refreshing anyways to say the least.....?

[6616]

Why not simply push for a More "in depth" CORE program which I'm sure Most will agree is getting pretty "out dated" and could use a little refreshing anyways to say the least.....?

The CORE course is updated evey few years. The latest update was 4 years ago and another set of revisions is currently awaiting Ministry approval.

[Coyote]

Not concerned about mandatory or otherwise. Also not trying to hijack the thread. Just want to know what people's perception is.

I'd also like to know, of those who have taken it, what did you think?

No hidden agenda here, just want some non-political honesty and opinions concerning the course.

'yote

[Onesock]

FD- This is a little late but I wouldn't have a problem with the x-bow hunter if he had to take the IBEP bow hunting course.

[Fisher-Dude]

FD- This is a little late but I wouldn't have a problem with the x-bow hunter if he had to take the IBEP bow hunting course.

Do you have a problem with the traditional bow guy who hasn't taken the course? Should he be punted from BOW ONLY season and have to hunt with the rest of us bums in GOS, as you suggest for the crossbow guys?

[aggiehunter]

FD, You guys in the GOS are still killin 90 percent of the game, hardly what I would call "Bums".

[Will]

The CORE course is updated evey few years. The latest update was 4 years ago and another set of revisions is currently awaiting Ministry approval.
Interesting...thanks for enlightening me.:o

[Onesock]

Actually I think all bow hunters should have to take the course. What the MANDATORY course would do is stop the guys from buying x-bows on Friday and hunting on Saturday. Most guys that hunt with compounds or traditional gear shoot there bows for months before the season starts. I have yet to see one x-bow at a 3-D shoot and for sure they are welcome there. As someone said on here before I will borrow a x-bow for the late season. This in unacceptable as far as I am concerned. He couldn't just borrow a firearm without the proper courses now could he? I am not against any hunter who practices and knows the limitations of his/her weapon. Shooting a x-bow 3-4 days before bow season does not a bowhunter make!
FD maybe you have a hidden agenda. Maybe you want to see bow seasons discontinued.

[Stone Sheep Steve]

I'll gladly take the course if she's the instructor:smile:

http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/data/500/medium/what_kinda_bow1.jpg

Can't guarrentee that I'll remember anything:redface:


SSS

[Onesock]

Of course she is the instructor!!!!!!!!!

[Fisher-Dude]

Actually I think all bow hunters should have to take the course. What the MANDATORY course would do is stop the guys from buying x-bows on Friday and hunting on Saturday. Most guys that hunt with compounds or traditional gear shoot there bows for months before the season starts. I have yet to see one x-bow at a 3-D shoot and for sure they are welcome there. As someone said on here before I will borrow a x-bow for the late season. This in unacceptable as far as I am concerned. He couldn't just borrow a firearm without the proper courses now could he? I am not against any hunter who practices and knows the limitations of his/her weapon. Shooting a x-bow 3-4 days before bow season does not a bowhunter make!
FD maybe you have a hidden agenda. Maybe you want to see bow seasons discontinued.

I'll ask again - should a traditional bow hunter who hasn't taken the course be punted into the GOS, as you believe crossbow hunters should?

The only agenda I have is more opportunity for everyone with whatever weapon they wanna use. Bow hunters get Sep 1 to Dec 10 here - longest season of anyone.

[huntwriter]

Actually I think all bow hunters should have to take the course. What the MANDATORY course would do is stop the guys from buying x-bows on Friday and hunting on Saturday.

So what you’re saying is that because of a few irresponsible people every bowhunter should have to suffer, spend more money to make yet another mandatory course that will prevent nothing of what you fear. NICE!

I tell you what. I love bowhunting been doing it for many years but if mandatory bowhunter education would come about I would hang my bow on the wall for good and so would many others. But I guess that would be fine by you then you have bowhunting season all to yourself or maybe not. Maybe, the government would scrap bow season because of lack of participation. Always be careful what you wish for it could backfire on you.

Oh by the way, I talked to an archery rep on a hunting show and he told me that compound bow sales go dratically up a week or two before the season opens.


Most guys that hunt with compounds or traditional gear shoot there bows for months before the season starts. So does the majority of crossbowhunters, just because you do not see them at the range doesn’t mean they don’t shoot. When I shoot my crossbow I do it under the week during hours when most others have to work. Why? Because I am getting tired of putting up with the attitudes some of the “holier than thou” bowhunters display. The immature sniggering and uneducated comments.

Oh, let me tell you a very short story. One time a guy was making fun of me, saying, “Can’t shoot a proper bow eh!” Without saying a word I walked back to my truck and got my compound out, walked back to the range and whacked six arrows one after the other at the 30 yard target into 2” circle. The look on the other guys face was priceless. Now he looked like the moron he was. Never judge a book my its cover.


I have yet to see one x-bow at a 3-D shoot and for sure they are welcome there. Small wonder, for years and years crossbow hunters have been treated by bowhunters and bowhunting organizations like a cancerous tumor. Crossbow hunters have been willfully maligned, ridiculed and outcast.

Now that many bowhunting organizations and clubs smell the bacon (money) with the raising popularity of crossbows they are all of a sudden welcome. Would you follow an invitation from the same guy that kicked you in the ass all these years? I didn’t think so.

I have visited an archery tournament – as a writer - were crossbow shooters have been invited. The organizers were polite enough but the majority of the archery crowd welcomed the crossbow shooters like a flea invested dog in a living room. You couldn’t avoid hearing the sniggering and stupid comments and jokes if you tried. The crossbow shooters had no reason to mingle with folks like that so they stayed in the corner and waited their turn to shoot and then went home never to return again.

[Avalanche123]

I'd take a mandatory anything course from her! :smile: LOL


I'll gladly take the course if she's the instructor:smile:

http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/data/500/medium/what_kinda_bow1.jpg

Can't guarrentee that I'll remember anything:redface:


SSS

[Onesock]

Huntwriter. If I believd in anything as strongly as you seem to believe in the x-bow I would try and change peoples perception of them. I believe in bowhunting quite strongly and fight tooth and nail for it. We have welcomed x-bow shooters at the 3-D shoots in Courtenay for years and never had 1 person show up. Shit, show up and show us nonbelievers what you are made of. Sorry thats a lie. We had one young lad confined to a wheel chair show up last year and even set out special targets with access for his wheel chair so that he could shoot.
The bowhunting organizations that I belong to have had many complaints from conservation officers regarding x-bow offences. I believe most of these offences would not have taken place had the owner of the x-bow had the appropriate education for bow hunting and the use of his weapon. This is the last you will hear from me on this topic as it is going nowhere.

[aggiehunter]

At the KCSA shoot near Penticton last year we had 3 xbow shooters. They looked like they had fun and no one made fun of them that I noticed.