New record book?

[mntbowhunter]

I dont know about you guys but hunting seems like it is turning into a rich mans game. You see movies now such as the mossback films where someone is hunting a giant mule deer or elk and has six guys watching it for him till he gets to fly over and shoot it. Did he really hunt it??? Or the guys who go on guided hunts over and over and fill the pages of the record book with their name. My hunting partner (string fling) and I were talking about how great it would be to have a record book for the blue collared hunter who killed his animal on a do it yourself public land hunt with an over the counter tag. We are both only bow hunters so we were thinking of just an archery book but it doesnt have to be only that. What would everyone else thing of that???

[mark]

I do agree with you! You'll have to start keeping records for a while before ya can make a book, Ive got a blue collar, dun it myself entry to start ya off! :D

[tailgate77]

The Traditional bowhunters have a book like that. I read the magazine all the time and I really enjoy the "proper" way these guys hunt. Its more about the hunt than the kill, and the majority of the guys "do it the hard way" to quote Tred Barta. Unfortunalty the only way to get in the book is to hunt with a long, recurve or self-bow.

[Gateholio]

I think the idea is somewhat ironic, actually.
:smile:

[boxhitch]

Hows about The Wildlife Records Club of BC ? Its been around for awhile.

[hunter1947]

Go find a decent animal that lookes like a decent set of antlers on it ,then hunt it with your bow.

If it looks like it has a good mass on it ,take it to an offical scorer in your area and they will tell you if it will make any record books that was shot with a bow.

And yes a lot of record book animals are shot on fenced or private land.

[BiG Boar]

I dont know about you guys but hunting seems like it is turning into a rich mans game???

Turning into? Turning INTO!!? Hunting is a rich mans game period. Find one person who can hunt a fair amount and I am betting they arn't anywhere near the poverty line. Gas, vehicles, ammo, tags, and gear, and TIME OFF. It all costs a lot. Of course the RICH are going to have a huge advantage in being able to take the biggest game. But what are you going to do...put together a record book based on income? A person making $100,000/year and a person making $50,000/year and a person surviving on $25,000/year, You can't have all different record books. I mean think if a starving student even SEE's a damn Grizzly, does that make the record books?

[behemoth]

Last year my hunting buddy and I made a rule that our mulies couldn't be shot more than 5km from our houses. (We live in a small town). We both shot our deer.

We did it to prove a point, that you dont have to get up at 4am and drive 80 clicks into the bush to find a deer. This year, it's 10km for moose, can't wait!

[bighornbob]

Like Boxhitch said the BC record has been around for more then 30 years and I would bet that most of the animals in there are shot by the so called Blue Collar guys. The rich guys that buy all the tags etc etc in the states only really care about the Boone and Crockett book. I doubt that they rarely even enter their trophies in our book.

Like others have said where do you draw the line on record books. Right now there are record books for gun hunting, muzzle loader hunting, bow hunting, SCI that measures differently from B&C, and there is another that popped up a few years ago that does not take subtract side to side differences in antlers (a typical is a typical).

So now you want a seperate book based on income or a seperate book based on auction tags or private land kills. When would it end.

BHB

[mntbowhunter]

I think some of you are missing the point. The idea is to keep track of animals that are shot and hunted my "you". Not hunted by someone else and then just shot by that individual. People with high income can still go out and chase free ranging animals like the rest of us. I guess people are right though there are enough record books already and how would you regulate that? Just watching these mossback movies got me into a rant I guess?

[steel_ram]

It would be interesting so see what game was taken from season to season. Including spikes, immatures, calves etc. right up to the biggest head sets.

Record books are for braggers.

[CanuckShooter]

Turning into? Turning INTO!!? Hunting is a rich mans game period. Find one person who can hunt a fair amount and I am betting they arn't anywhere near the poverty line. Gas, vehicles, ammo, tags, and gear, and TIME OFF. It all costs a lot. Of course the RICH are going to have a huge advantage in being able to take the biggest game. But what are you going to do...put together a record book based on income? A person making $100,000/year and a person making $50,000/year and a person surviving on $25,000/year, You can't have all different record books. I mean think if a starving student even SEE's a damn Grizzly, does that make the record books?

The poor man that doesn't work has all the time off he needs, he doesn't have to buy tags because he gets sustenance permits, buys his gun and bullets with government handouts, doesn't need camo and cover scent because he knows that it's just a marketing ploy.....and lives in a rural neighborhood so he can hunt out his back door on foot. And he wouldn't put his name in the record book because he could sell that big rack for under the table cash......:eek:

Richman/Poorman....biggest animal is not the game that puts the food on your table so why worry yourself over it? With the current record books you get to find out what is possible to find.

[muleychaser]

Definately watching some of those videos of guys paying big money to shoot a trophy a lifetime makes you think but truely where is the self accomplishment with that, all they are there for is pulling the trigger and that is it. When it is all said and done we all live a province that has more hunting oppurtunities than anywhere else in North America and with the proper homework anyone of us has an oppurtunity to harvest a trophy of a lifetime whenever we go afield, without paying huge money to do it. Hiking around the country is free of charge, at least until they (government) can figure out a way to charge us for it and get away with it....lol.

[muleychaser]

On another note it would be nice to see the Trophy Records of British Columbia stand out a little more in the public eye. I know it is volunteer time mostly but looking at other provinces and their record books it would be nice to see something along the lines of a more publicly known awards banquet with official scoring and presentations taking place at the event every year. Funds generated from ticket sales would cover costs of the event (hopefully) and without a doubt I bet alot of men and women from around the province would attend.

[steel_ram]

Record books are for braggers.

I take that back, remembering it was kind of cool seeing my 'trophies' and those of friends recorded in print for the first time. It's also kind of neat to see the history, where and when.

Those that make it some kind of credential are braggers. A few have been lucky enough to make a career out of it. If they couldn't compete in B&C, they went to P&Y, when Chuck cleaned up there, they moved onto the next.

[Steeleco]

Last year my hunting buddy and I made a rule that our mulies couldn't be shot more than 5km from our houses. (We live in a small town). We both shot our deer.

We did it to prove a point, that you dont have to get up at 4am and drive 80 clicks into the bush to find a deer. This year, it's 10km for moose, can't wait!


That's a cool gig if you can do it, some of us will get arrested if we hunt closer than 10K from home!!! :wink:

[6616]

Last year my hunting buddy and I made a rule that our mulies couldn't be shot more than 5km from our houses. (We live in a small town). We both shot our deer.

We did it to prove a point, that you dont have to get up at 4am and drive 80 clicks into the bush to find a deer. This year, it's 10km for moose, can't wait!

I live in a small rural subdivsion 5 km from the nearest town in the East Kootenay. I once harvested a mountain goat walking directly up the mountain right from my house. Last fall my neighbor shot a nice 4pt mulie buck right on his own property. It's great to live in a place like this if you don't mind the deer eating your garden.

[mark]

On another note it would be nice to see the Trophy Records of British Columbia stand out a little more in the public eye. I know it is volunteer time mostly but looking at other provinces and their record books it would be nice to see something along the lines of a more publicly known awards banquet with official scoring and presentations taking place at the event every year. Funds generated from ticket sales would cover costs of the event (hopefully) and without a doubt I bet alot of men and women from around the province would attend.

The BC record book comittee does do a awards banquet every 3 years, its a great time, this year it was in revelstoke apr. 19 I believe. I would have been there if it were not turkey weekend! And like someone else mentioned, Id bet that most of the BC book entries are unguided, or from blue collar type guys!

[dumprat]

Who cares about books? Go hunting because it is fun. Shoot a spike if ya want, shoot a biggie if ya want. All the books and the trophy bullsh*t does is give people an excuse to look down their noses at someone else because they don't measure up. Just more "My pee pee is bigger than yours" crap.

[mark]

Who cares about books? Go hunting because it is fun. Shoot a spike if ya want, shoot a biggie if ya want. All the books and the trophy bullsh*t does is give people an excuse to look down their noses at someone else because they don't measure up. Just more "My pee pee is bigger than yours" crap.

Dude its not mandatory!!!! Its a take it or leave it thing, each to his own so dont slam it! I for one love flipping through a record book seeing pics of all the amazing critters that have been harvested in the past!
Sounds like someone has a little pee pee!

[BCLongshot]

ha ha

Wow I guess I'm not going to talk trophy with you dumprat.

I'm always amazed at the size and beauty of our animals in B.C.

So thankful that Dad moved out here 43 yrs ago !

[dumprat]

The point I was trying to make is that if you need to have your name in a book to make yourself feel good about what you shot perhaps you are hunting for the wrong reasons.

[mark]

The point I was trying to make is that if you need to have your name in a book to make yourself feel good about what you shot perhaps you are hunting for the wrong reasons.

My point is, that if no-one ever submitted entries, there wouldnt be a book of records that some people enjoy! If you ever take a book worthy critter, youll feel pretty dam good about it! Submitting it to the record books is more for others to see and appreciate, it doesnt make you a rockstar! If people didnt post pics, and storys on this website, it would be much of anything now would it!!!

[todbartell]

I think the idea is somewhat ironic, actually.
:smile:


What do you think is ironic? Because I am thinking irony, too!! :lol:

[hunter1947]

I shot a mule deer just outside a small town in BC you could walk to the spot I shot it from this town this deer is in the BC record books.

In some cases to do with where you live ,it being a farm or maybe a home just outside of a town you could put one in the book buy hunting from your home.

[bighornbob]

Who cares about books? Go hunting because it is fun. Shoot a spike if ya want, shoot a biggie if ya want. All the books and the trophy bullsh*t does is give people an excuse to look down their noses at someone else because they don't measure up. Just more "My pee pee is bigger than yours" crap.

Heard the same thing a few times from various guys until the guys shoot something big and guess what, it ends up being in the record book.


The record books are actually meant to show off the animal and not the hunter. That is why if somebody gets caught paoching only the name of the hunter is removed, the animal stays in there. Same reason picked up heads are allowed, because its showing off the animal, not the guy who tripped over it or found it in the ditch after it was hit by a car.

BHB

[BiG Boar]

I one day hope to take a record animal. Who knows if I ever will. Usually it comes down to who is hunting the most and out in the field the most. Then again you could get lucky and the first fist you ever catch on the fly is a 10 lbs Rainbow. I didnt even know how to cast properly! Was a record for the lake it was in. Wierd thing was that it was all cheap gear Bought at Canadian tire.

[Gateholio]

What do you think is ironic? Because I am thinking irony, too!! :lol:


Because the thread starte complains about the record book being a "rich mans" sport- Or "elite" to use a similar term.

But the proposed book is also an 'elitist" book- "you can only enter your animals in this book if you hunt this way"

So it's somewhat ironic.

I have shot 3 book animals, and none of them are in any record book, because I just don't care. Maybe when I get the #1 ram this year, I will enter it.:razz:

[Stone Sheep Steve]

Looking forward to the "Gatehouse Ram" replacing the "Chadwick Ram" in sheep hunting folklore:cool:.

He's out there Clarke! Go get him!

I'm with BHB on this one......The BC book (at least to me) is more about what this province is capable of producing. Is the Chadwick Ram about L.S. Chadwick or the incredible ram that he took which this province produced???

Now, I can't say that I don't pay attention when I repeatedly read the same surname over and over with different species. Several names come to mind.......Caputos, Dalziels, Pringle, Dougans, Klingsat, Tickell to name just a few..........and many others. Were these guys great hunters
(most likely) or just rich with some ambition?? Doesn't really matter to me. These are just a few names that you can read but there are many others that are lower profile with "horn" sheds that make you shake your head:shock:.

To each their own. Enter them or don't enter them........


SSS

[Recordram]

What about the guy/girl who is a blue collar work who is the guide. I can personally say that I have had as much satisfaction guiding a record book animal as if I was the person shooting it. They are right, it is the rich guy that gets his name and picture and awards given to him by the different organizations. The guides do all the work. Big deal, the memories I got and pictures are worth every bit as having that animal stuffed and hanging on my wall. Don't tell me that you can't afford to hunt is these far off locations in the Beautiful Province of BC. You save your money over time and then gitr done! It might take some time to raise the funds but the animals are all out there.

[Seeadler]

Not sure I see the point. Who really cares about the record book? Take whitetailed deer, most areas cannot compete with the deer that come out of AB and SK, does this make them any less challenging to hunt? Or moose, are the moose in northern BC any smarter than the moose in souther BC? Because they certainly are larger. Or just about any species you can name, certain areas tend to dominate the record books.

[bighornbob]

Not sure I see the point. Who really cares about the record book? Take whitetailed deer, most areas cannot compete with the deer that come out of AB and SK, does this make them any less challenging to hunt? Or moose, are the moose in northern BC any smarter than the moose in souther BC? Because they certainly are larger. Or just about any species you can name, certain areas tend to dominate the record books.

For someone who does not care for the record book I find it funny that you use it as a reference book. Posted by you in the Turkey Tag post "When did whitetails supposedly make it too BC? The B&C book has an entry in the non-typical section from 1905"

Obviously you own a record book and use it to look up information. As others have said its a great source of information. I probably pick up my British Columbia record book up more then any other book. As you pointed out, some great info in there. They could remove the names of the hunters and as long as size and localality of kill was still there I would still read it. I am sure the names are included becuase if no recognition was given to the hunter, who would details of their trophies.

BHB

[Ron.C]

Personally, I could care less about a record book. If guys with all the money/time and connections are the ones to tag out on book animals year after year and set new records, so be it. All I can say about that is I wish I had their money/time and connections and if I did, you bet you @$$ I would take advantage of it just as they do! But I don't so having said that, I have never taken a book class animal, but hopefully when and If I do, I would like to think that I'll get more enjoyment and satisfaction by looking at it hanging over my fireplace everyday then worrying about how it measures up aginst someone elses animal. My personal hunting goals are to simply try to take a larger deer/elk than I have already taken.

[Seeadler]

For someone who does not care for the record book I find it funny that you use it as a reference book. Posted by you in the Turkey Tag post "When did whitetails supposedly make it too BC? The B&C book has an entry in the non-typical section from 1905"

Obviously you own a record book and use it to look up information. As others have said its a great source of information. I probably pick up my British Columbia record book up more then any other book. As you pointed out, some great info in there. They could remove the names of the hunters and as long as size and localality of kill was still there I would still read it. I am sure the names are included becuase if no recognition was given to the hunter, who would details of their trophies.

BHB

What is your point? I also own a book titled "World's Most Powerful Rifles and Handguns" and yet I don't own a magnum or a truly big bore rifle. Yes, the B&C record book is a valuable reference and my copy is at least one edition (1993) out of date and came out of the bargain bin since there is no way I am going to pay $70+ for it. If I ever take a top five animal I would almost certainly have it scored and entered. But if I get a 171 point whitetail or 195 1/8 muley I am not going to waste the time and gas to go and have it measured just to see my name in print.

I just don't see the point of yet another record book. Do I think B&C is the be all and end all? No, I think deducting measurements is pretty goofy when the whole point seems to be measuring what is biggest.

Instead of trying for some record book, why not try to find the biggest animal in your MU? Or how about this, try finding the smallest 4 point muley or the smallest 6 point elk.

[dumprat]

I shot a bear that would go fairly high in the "BOOK' Did I put it in? NO! All the record book type stuff does is give a certain type of guy a reason to look down their nose at other hunters. This type of thinking is the biggest way to drive away new hunters. Be proud of what you shot. If it is a limit of buffel heads or a spike buck, who has the right to call it not good enough? You want a book to put it in, buy a photo album.

[mark]

I shot a bear that would go fairly high in the "BOOK' Did I put it in? NO! All the record book type stuff does is give a certain type of guy a reason to look down their nose at other hunters. This type of thinking is the biggest way to drive away new hunters. Be proud of what you shot. If it is a limit of buffel heads or a spike buck, who has the right to call it not good enough? You want a book to put it in, buy a photo album.

Dude have you ever met someone with a book entry that "Looks down their nose at other hunters" Give me a break, where the heck do you even dream up this idea????????????????? If you dont like the book, then dont buy it, dont look at it, but dont slam it, as it doesnt hurt anyone!

[Dannybuoy]

Yeah I gotta agree with what Mark has been saying .... I dont see the need for a "new" book though .... The BC book and the B & C are fine ...and yeah the ol bow hunters need their book too !

[mark]

Yeah I gotta agree with what Mark has been saying .... I dont see the need for a "new" book though .... The BC book and the B & C are fine ...and yeah the ol bow hunters need their book too !

I believe its called "Pope & Young" :lol:

[huntwriter]

There are so many different trophy record books published these days that it is hard to keep track of it. I see no reason to add another book. Why a “blue collar book”? What’s next a female hunter book and a youth hunter book?

Sure it’s fun to read these books and see what others got but nobody really cares other than diehard trophy hunters.

Dumprat have you actually meet any hunters with entries in the book? I have, quite a few actually, and can assure you that none of them looks down their noses. I am sure there might be the odd one but that is not so as rule. Trophy hunters work very hard and make many sacrifices, including financially, to get the animal they want.

[Gateholio]

I shot a bear that would go fairly high in the "BOOK' Did I put it in? NO! All the record book type stuff does is give a certain type of guy a reason to look down their nose at other hunters. This type of thinking is the biggest way to drive away new hunters. Be proud of what you shot. If it is a limit of buffel heads or a spike buck, who has the right to call it not good enough? You want a book to put it in, buy a photo album.

There are *some* guys obsessed with score and look down thier noses. They are few and far between. There are many more hunters obsesed with size (which also can translate to score) but dont' look down noses.


BTW I never got the point of obsessing over "book" or "net" score. Gross score is much more telling, much more interesting.:D

[BCRiverBoater]

On point everyone is forgetting is that trophies come in many ways. You take your child out and he/she gets her first animal it is a trophy. Your first ram no matter what size is a trophy. It is the stories and pictures that make the trip memorable and should never be forgotten. Yes the record books are nice but they do not effect my hunt or will not effect my future hunts. Hunting strictly for the book takes a lot away from the whole idea of hunting.

For a lot of the big money hunters, the book means more than the hunt or the kill itself. I know a few guides who have guided book rams and the hunter drops the ram, takes a measurement to confirm record and say okay lets go get a goat. They do not take the time for pictures, do not thank the guide or anything....just lets go kill something else.

If I ever come to that point in my hunting I know it will be time to quit.

[dumprat]

You hit the nail on the head riverboater. And yes there are quite a few hunters out there that always gotta put other people's kills down. It is a real turn off for young guys and new hunters.

[mntbowhunter]

I totally agree any animal that you take is special and it doesnt have to be a record book animal to be special. I took a friend out last season and he arrowed a mule deer doe and he was so excited you couldnt beat the smile off his face. It was awsome! But that doesnt mean that you cant try and harvest a record book animal? If you like trophy hunting fine, if you dont thats great too. As long as people are out in the bush enjoying our province thats what matters. If you dont like trophy hunting dont post on this topic. I only bowhunt so you wont find me posting about gun hunting questions cause I dont know what the heck I am talking about.

[BCRiverBoater]

I have no problem with record books and the dream of getting in your name in one. I just do not think having new books to get more people in or to get the average guy in adds to the sport of hunting. I just do not want the books to over shadow why most of us hunt. We can always dream but please do not forget why we love to get outdoors etc.

[Gateholio]

ting.

For a lot of the big money hunters, the book means more than the hunt or the kill itself. I know a few guides who have guided book rams and the hunter drops the ram, takes a measurement to confirm record and say okay lets go get a goat. .

To that point- One of my good friends is a guide with a well know outfit in BC. He has told me how a hunter has killed a (very good) animal, been *incredibly* happy, overjoyed..then they get it back to base camp, put a tape on it, and the hunter is unhappy, since it wasn't high in the books...

He can never understand that a tape measure means more than the trip, the hunt, the stalk, the successful kill, etc...

Frankly, I can't either, and I think that Jeff Cooper was right when he said "I find a tape measure mildly offensive in hunt camp":mrgreen:

[Stone Sheep Steve]

...
Frankly, I can't either, and I think that Jeff Cooper was right when he said "I find a tape measure mildly offensive in hunt camp":mrgreen:

I like that one:).

SSS

[boxhitch]

Frankly, I can't either, and I think that Jeff Cooper was right when he said "I find a tape measure mildly offensive in hunt camp":mrgreen:I won't even pack one. My answers to 'How big is he?' are usually 'Full curl' or 'between 36 and 40, I'm a bad guesser'.

[horshur]

The record book records exceptional animals....to have your name in the same section as one of the greatest american presidents is a humbling experience.

[boxhitch]

to have your name in the same section as one of the greatest american presidents is a humbling experience.Hmmm?
I have a book signed by T. Roosevelt, so if I sign it too, will we both be humbled ?

[horshur]

Hmmm?
I have a book signed by T. Roosevelt, so if I sign it too, will we both be humbled ?

it is entirely anti climatic....the chase is much better than the finnish.

Holy shit it qualifies...congratulations...you will recieve you certificate in the mail.....

and there in a book written down as a historical record your name along with an American president.....

can't speak for you.

[Avalanche123]

For myself, anything that I am fortunate enough to take with my bow is more than enough for me. However as others have said, I do find it educational to see trophy sized animals and where they were taken. The area the animal was taken is much more meaniful than who did the killing in my opinion.
To each their own. People have different hunting priorities and it is a shame they get caught up in the "tale of the tape" as opposed to the experience.
I always find it interesting to see this forum act as a "recording" venue for peoples pics once hunting season rolls around, regardless if trophy size or not.

[bigelow]

You are just asking for a level playing field my friend. In life however it doesn't exist, therefore be happy with your own success!

[mntbowhunter]

You are just asking for a level playing field my friend. In life however it doesn't exist, therefore be happy with your own success!

Good Point!!

[steel_ram]

Don't forget, the accepted B&C method of measurement, perhaps necessary to standardise things, only measures antlers that way. A huge deer rack, with a few extra points, broken points or interesting features may get deducted out of the book measure typically, or not be crazy enough to make it non-typical.

Old, mature, educated, therefore challenging bucks may never grow horns to meet credentials of record books, only because they don't live in the right area.

I prefer flipping through books like "trophy deer of B.C." to prime my dreams. It's not a score book.

[mntbowhunter]

I own the trophy deer of B.C books too, yeah there awsome.