Region 5 Mule deer seasons

[Gateholio]

Apparently there will be no change to the seasons at this time.

[dana]

And they say our bitchin accomplishes nothing? :)

[Fisher-Dude]

To whom did you biatch besides us already-converted internet junkies? ;)

Good to hear that cooler heads prevailed, and that sperm supply is recognized as just that.

[patbrennan]

Clarke, is that from a reliable source?
Good news, for me, if it is true!:lol:

[6616]

Tom Ethier has stated in a letter to the BCWF that the proposed changes have been postponed until 2009 so they can conduct a more intensive evaluation of mule deer in Region 5 and to consult stakeholders. It's not over, just delayed, but with a much better chance that common sense and science will prevail.

[Wildman]

What were the proposed changes anyway?

[hunter1947]

What were the proposed changes anyway?
To put all mule deer on LEH in region 3.

[Wildman]

To put all mule deer on LEH in region 3.

Thanks Wayne.

[guest]

Wayne, I personally know a biologist from Kamloops, Where did you hear that one??
What the Region 3 guys are worried about with region 5 having big changes is all the pressure moving to 3.
C/T

[Fisher-Dude]

I'm hunting in Clearwater this year, to hell with my annual hunt in region 5! :D

[hunter1947]

Wayne, I personally know a biologist from Kamloops, Where did you hear that one??
What the Region 3 guys are worried about with region 5 having big changes is all the pressure moving to 3.
C/T
From a biologist in Victoria ,I heard it will be implemented next year.

[guest]

Not Likely !!
Can you Imagine the S--T hitting the fan then !!

I do bet though it got the attention of many a region 3 hunters....lol to funny!

Region 5 guys ( managers and the powers to be ) have screwed up their region. Now they are dealing with the effects, or will next year. Lets hope the same people don't influence those in other regions. It's like region 4 years ago, the old managers screwed it up good, now theres more good bulls then ever, lets hope they keep the 6 rule there too!

Just one guys opinion.
C/T

[hunter1947]

Not Likely !!
Can you Imagine the S--T hitting the fan then !!

I do bet though it got the attention of many a region 3 hunters....lol to funny!

Region 5 guys ( managers and the powers to be ) have screwed up their region. Now they are dealing with the effects, or will next year. Lets hope the same people don't influence those in other regions. It's like region 4 years ago, the old managers screwed it up good, now theres more good bulls then ever, lets hope they keep the 6 rule there too!

Just one guys opinion.
C/T
Are you saying that I am full of BS ??.

[sfire436]

I also know someone personaly, who knows the biologist personaly, and I have to agree with Curly top. Aint gonna happen.

[guest]

Not at all, take it as you want though.
Think about it, all of 3 LEH, there would be such an out cry from Pemberton to Little Fort, Boston Bar to Cache Crickby, no way!
There is not a region in the province thats all leh for deer. And region 3 won't be the first. The managers that understand us hunters are there to look after the populations primarly, and try to keep us all happy. The leh, is some of the last resort moves to at least give some opportunity. Region 3 is not hurting in deer population like 5 is. For years 5 kept any buck open and allowed 2 buck harvest, this for sure has brought down the number of mature bucks, hence their trouble now.
Another problem with game management is that our senior managers are soon retireing, and there is not a ton of interest for people to take their place. The government of today does not sweeten the pie so to speak to make others want a career in game management and biology. It's sad really. Fred Harper, Doug Jury and others are great examples of managers that lead by example, there hearts are in the right place. They want opportunity for you I and everyone else. Going LEH takes that away.
Just think of the outcry from resident hunters of the Thompson/Nicola
region going all LEH.......NOT!

[horshur]

I'm hunting in Clearwater this year, to hell with my annual hunt in region 5! :D

If yah do bring a new hunter and I'll make sure you have some good info on roads and some decent ridges to walk.

[Jelvis]

ALL LEH Mule Deer with no General Open Season in all of Region 3 in 2009? What do you think it will do?
All Reg 3 leh for mule deer. Never thought of that I guess things do change over the years. Jel-big change for locals

[hunter1947]

Not at all, take it as you want though.
Think about it, all of 3 LEH, there would be such an out cry from Pemberton to Little Fort, Boston Bar to Cache Crickby, no way!
There is not a region in the province thats all leh for deer. And region 3 won't be the first. The managers that understand us hunters are there to look after the populations primarly, and try to keep us all happy. The leh, is some of the last resort moves to at least give some opportunity. Region 3 is not hurting in deer population like 5 is. For years 5 kept any buck open and allowed 2 buck harvest, this for sure has brought down the number of mature bucks, hence their trouble now.
Another problem with game management is that our senior managers are soon retireing, and there is not a ton of interest for people to take their place. The government of today does not sweeten the pie so to speak to make others want a career in game management and biology. It's sad really. Fred Harper, Doug Jury and others are great examples of managers that lead by example, there hearts are in the right place. They want opportunity for you I and everyone else. Going LEH takes that away.
Just think of the outcry from resident hunters of the Thompson/Nicola
region going all LEH.......NOT! I better step in and stop this befor it gets out of hand ,LOL, I'm just trying to crank you guys up ,LOL ,region 3 is fare from becoming an LEH region ,LOL ,has some going ,good way to start the weekend :lol: :lol:.

[guest]

Is it April 1st again.........???
Goodin 47!
I figured as much??
I'm going looking for your camera RIGHT NOW!!!!
C/T

[Angel]

thats not even funny..............:-|. my mule deer honey hole is in reg 3... got us going tho.

[Fisher-Dude]

If yah do bring a new hunter and I'll make sure you have some good info on roads and some decent ridges to walk.

You know me Andy, I'm gonna teach the boy to road hunt, so yes, road info would be valuable! :wink:

One $hit and I applied for shared moose with a couple of newbie hunters. It will be cool to show them the ropes on swamp donkeys. I hope we get drawn, I'm looking forward to getting these guys hooked on huntin'! We'll all be buying moose tags BTW. :biggrin:

With exploding deer populations in most of the province, I doubt we'll see any buck LEH any time soon, anywhere. The comments that we need mature bucks to do the breeding isn't really true - a sperm supply is what is needed, be it a younger 2 point or an older 4 point. The genetics of the two point may well produce bigger, healthier offspring than the 4 point. The region 5 buck:doe ratios have slipped a bit in a FEW of the surveyed areas, but none appear to be critical. Dumping a few more does is one way to give the ratio a boost, especially when some farm fields have 100+ flat tops grazing in them every day. :?

[Derek_Erickson]

What biologist?

Doug Jury?

[GoatGuy]

There is not a region in the province thats all leh for deer. And region 3 won't be the first. The managers that understand us hunters are there to look after the populations primarly, and try to keep us all happy. The leh, is some of the last resort moves to at least give some opportunity. Region 3 is not hurting in deer population like 5 is. For years 5 kept any buck open and allowed 2 buck harvest, this for sure has brought down the number of mature bucks, hence their trouble now.


Biologically this isn't the end of the world - this 'issue' was driven primarily by politics. Mature bucks aren't a must have and you can run buck:doe ratios right down to 10:100 without affecting population growth or timing (fecundity) too much. None of the surveyed areas are close to this. Also harvesting some does (antlerless GOS) will brings things in line in a hurry and might even increase productivity (produce more bucks).

Aside from that, there's a very simple answer to this whole issue. If the other regions of the province were willing to loosen things up a bit this would not be a discussion. Cut loose some antlerless LEH's in other regions (more in some areas, and actually shoot some does in others), actually shoot some wt's instead of harvesting a handful of does and a 1 buck bag limit, extend the length of some of the mule areas that are 4pt only or in other areas actually have an any buck season instead of a 4 pt or better that's anywhere from 21 days to 2 months. Spread the pressure around and you won't have to restrict the harvest in region 5 or anywhere else.

With pretty much the only mule deer any buck season from Nov 1-20 across the entire friggen' province what exactly do people think is going to happen? Hunters go after opportunity and the perception of success. As much as some people like to think antler restrictions don't affect hunters, they do - it's a fact of life. Hunters are opportunistic predators and for most the easiest road to success is the one they choose.


Until we start to open things up and spread the pressure around we'll keep whittling piece by piece pushing pressure into smaller areas until such a time as we need LEH. Moose got pounded in the early 80s due to seasons that were too liberal in some areas. So we started cutting back and back and back and that's exactly why it's on LEH across almost the entire province now. Really, we're only harvesting probably 15-20% fewer moose than we were on GOS and we now have half the hunters. We're now to the point where we have bull:cow ratios as high as 84:100 in some areas!!! And we can't even get an immature bull moose season in region 4, which had one of the longest standing GOS on moose across the province.:eek:

We've gotta start looking at the big picture instead of worrying about the mu we hunt or our own backyard.


Anyways, there will be no change in reg 5 for this year but I'm sure this will be on deck again next fall and change will come. Unless hunters pull out of the NIMBY phase we'll start closing opportunity down region by region until we've got ourselves on LEH.

[hunter1947]

Is it April 1st again.........???
Goodin 47!
I figured as much??
I'm going looking for your camera RIGHT NOW!!!!
C/T LOL ,:lol::lol::lol:.

[Flingin' Sticks]

I grew up and Learned to Hunt in 100 Mile House and Williams Lake, and I'll tell you that there is NOT a shortage of mature Deer in this area. In my eyes, there is a problem with the buck:doe ratio, but even that isn't critical.

The main reason that region 5 is looking at any changes is because there are a few G/O who figure that they own the entire population and are ENTITLED to the mature bucks. we had the same issue about 4 years ago with the G/O taking it to the MOE (I think) to reduce are season. It took a petition to shoot that down then.

[mark]

I grew up and Learned to Hunt in 100 Mile House and Williams Lake, and I'll tell you that there is NOT a shortage of mature Deer in this area. In my eyes, there is a problem with the buck:doe ratio, but even that isn't critical.

The main reason that region 5 is looking at any changes is because there are a few G/O who figure that they own the entire population and are ENTITLED to the mature bucks. we had the same issue about 4 years ago with the G/O taking it to the MOE (I think) to reduce are season. It took a petition to shoot that down then.

I also grew up in 100 mile and have hunted there all my life and still do every year. I also got alot of buddies in 100 mile who are pretty serious mule deer hunters. From all that I have gathered myself and from buddies is that mature bucks have been alot harder to find in the past 2-3 years. No-one I know has got a real good buck around there in the past 2 years! I havnt heard of GO issues either. Just my opinion!

[wsm]

with gas prices like this lets see how many people get into reg 5 besides the locals. i personally know 3 people the go to region five for deer every year. but have said they wont go that far unless they get a moose draw. they used to go for deer regardles of weather they got a draw. if there are many other people like this i would think it would mean less hunters, possibly a smaller harvest. my 2 cents

[ruttinbuck]

Biologically this isn't the end of the world - this 'issue' was driven primarily by politics. Mature bucks aren't a must have and you can run buck:doe ratios right down to 10:100 without affecting population growth or timing (fecundity) too much. None of the surveyed areas are close to this. Also harvesting some does (antlerless GOS) will brings things in line in a hurry and might even increase productivity (produce more bucks).

Aside from that, there's a very simple answer to this whole issue. If the other regions of the province were willing to loosen things up a bit this would not be a discussion. Cut loose some antlerless LEH's in other regions (more in some areas, and actually shoot some does in others), actually shoot some wt's instead of harvesting a handful of does and a 1 buck bag limit, extend the length of some of the mule areas that are 4pt only or in other areas actually have an any buck season instead of a 4 pt or better that's anywhere from 21 days to 2 months. Spread the pressure around and you won't have to restrict the harvest in region 5 or anywhere else.

With pretty much the only mule deer any buck season from Nov 1-20 across the entire friggen' province what exactly do people think is going to happen? Hunters go after opportunity and the perception of success. As much as some people like to think antler restrictions don't affect hunters, they do - it's a fact of life. Hunters are opportunistic predators and for most the easiest road to success is the one they choose.


Until we start to open things up and spread the pressure around we'll keep whittling piece by piece pushing pressure into smaller areas until such a time as we need LEH. Moose got pounded in the early 80s due to seasons that were too liberal in some areas. So we started cutting back and back and back and that's exactly why it's on LEH across almost the entire province now. Really, we're only harvesting probably 15-20% fewer moose than we were on GOS and we now have half the hunters. We're now to the point where we have bull:cow ratios as high as 84:100 in some areas!!! And we can't even get an immature bull moose season in region 4, which had one of the longest standing GOS on moose across the province.:eek:

We've gotta start looking at the big picture instead of worrying about the mu we hunt or our own backyard.


Anyways, there will be no change in reg 5 for this year but I'm sure this will be on deck again next fall and change will come. Unless hunters pull out of the NIMBY phase we'll start closing opportunity down region by region until we've got ourselves on LEH.

GG you should ba a carpenter.
You have hit the nail squarely on its head.
Summed up totally.RB