Mechanical Broadheads

[325]

Are mechanical broadheads legal in BC for elk and moose??

[Bow Walker]

The only stipulation concerning broadheads is the cutting diameter. Mechs definetly fall well within the parameters of at least 7/8" cutting diameter.

Live long and prosper.

[Mr. Dean]

Live long and prosper.

And go kill your Elk and Moose.
Then post some pics! :p

[J_T]

There are a good selection of broadheads available. Why not move into a line that are dependable?

[The Hermit]

Referring to the IBEP course it appears to be the consensus that mechanicals are not recommended for large game. A solid one-piece two or three blade cut on contact broadhead is the best!

[calvin L]

They may not be recomended . But I can tell you I know they have killed moose (8) , elk (4) lots of bears and deer . I just got back from a grizz hunt and I had the 100 grain rocket steel head on the frt of my arrows . I will use them until I personaly have a problem . But I don't think I ever will .

calvin L

[Stone Sheep Steve]

They may not be recomended . But I can tell you I know they have killed moose (8) , elk (4) lots of bears and deer . I just got back from a grizz hunt and I had the 100 grain rocket steel head on the frt of my arrows . I will use them until I personaly have a problem . But I don't think I ever will .

calvin L

Yes, but you weren't worried because I was backing you up with a Montec:biggrin:.

SSS

[J_T]

Calvin and SSS, Yes, I agree, used with the right equipment and in the right situation they do work, however just like bullets, there are good mechanicals and cheap mechanicals. Not all perform the same.

A couple of other things to consider:

1) a mechanical should not be shot out of a bow less than 60 pounds.
2) a mechanical is most effective on broadside shots. quartering away shots may cause the head to skip on impact

There are extremely good solid, one-piece two blade or three blade broadheads on the market.

If for one minute there was a risk on the performance of the broadhead, I personally would not want to take it?

I'm not judging you, you've been successful with your combination. However if someone new to bowhunting is asking, I would steer away from the mechanical.

[Bow Walker]

J_T has hit the nail square on. Mechs do work well. There is a caveat involved though - on anything but a broadside (or very close to it) shot the shooter runs the risk of having the mechanical broadhead "skip" before it "grabs" and creates a wound.

The main reason for the skipping has to do with the angle of the shot and the angle of the blades on the broadhead. If the shot angle is severe enough it could almost match the angle of the blades in the broadhead. We're talking in and around 20 degrees here.

Even with the added blade in the tip of the mechanical (as opposed to the trocar tip) the risk of the arrow skipping along the animal's hide before the tip can catch and cut-to-enter is high enough that the shooter would be better served waiting for a better "presentation" by the animal in question.

Most mechanical heads have rear-ward deploying main blades. These blades need to be "pushed" to the rear by the animal's hair, hide, fat, and tissue as the broadhead enters the animal. On angled shots the front portion of the main blades can often catch and cause skipping before they enter the animal enough to open and begin cutting a wound channel.

If mechanical broadheads are your choice, I'd recommend that you choose ones that don't "pivot" towards the rear to become fully deployed. There are a number of heads on the market that have a different deployment method that goes a long way to help eliminate the possibility of skipping. I'd recommend that you do some research and/or testing of the various choices that are offered.

[Bow Walker]

Referring to the IBEP course it appears to be the consensus that mechanicals are not recommended for large game. A solid one-piece two or three blade cut on contact broadhead is the best!
This site has done exstensive testing of almost every broadhead that has been made and offered for sale. He has a ton of information to offer. All who hunt (or plan on hunting) with archery equipment will benefit from this site.

http://www.broadheadtests.com/index.html (http://www.broadheadtests.com/index.html)

[huntwriter]

In the past I have used mechanical broadheads and as pointed out by J_T found that some brands are better than others. A mechanical broadhead that preformed consistently well for me is the NAP Spitfire. But I am sure there are other brands too that perform well.

The best way to learn about which brands are good and which are not is to search the Internet for reviews and comparisons.

Personally I am not a great fan of mechanicals, I like the simplicity and dependability of fixed two / three and four blade broadheads. My current favorites for the past ten years are Magnus II 125 and NAP Thuderhead-Pro 125.

At the end it all boils down to what you’re a comfortable shooting and how much you trust the equipment and your proficiency to shoot. These three factors differ from person to person.

[Bow Walker]

This particular style of mechanical broadhead seems to address the problem of "skipping" very well. It's the Undertaker by Trophy Ridge. Not that I'm recommending this as the best one - it's just an example.

http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/data/500/undertaker-steps.jpg (http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/showphoto.php?photo=9457)

[Kitimat Killer]

I would have to say Grim Reapers Rasortips all the way but thats just me

[loki]

I find it funny how a simple question about archery around here always causes a debate that a lot of times isn't even close to the question that was asked. The question is are they legal, not anything about ethics, performance, etc.


Are mechanical broadheads legal in BC for elk and moose??

Yes they are. Enjoy your hunt and report back to us how the mech head performs. If you're going to do any testing before the hunt, give us a report on the heads you used and their performance. :)

[Bow Walker]

loki - it's called hunters helping hunters. You should know that.

Besides which, advice is the cheapest thing that anyone can give another. Whether or not said advice is ever used is a non-issue, just offering help is the name of the game.

[Archer]

I like NAP spitfires myself. I've put them into a few animals and they have performed quite well. They do create MASSIVE holes, which is never a bad thing.

[Bigbear]

Have a Look at the Grim Reaper tests on U TUBE They are Very extensive tests. I Use them My self and They do work very well . Even on quite sharp Quarter away shots .:biggrin:

[Bow Walker]

Many shooters/hunters use expandable broadheads with great success. There has to be something to them.

For me though, it's fixed blade heads. Not replaceable blades heads, but fixed.

[GoatGuy]

Calvin and SSS, Yes, I agree, used with the right equipment and in the right situation they do work, however just like bullets, there are good mechanicals and cheap mechanicals. Not all perform the same.

A couple of other things to consider:

1) a mechanical should not be shot out of a bow less than 60 pounds.
2) a mechanical is most effective on broadside shots. quartering away shots may cause the head to skip on impact



Why should mechanicals be shot out of a minimum 60 lbs bow?


How often does the head 'skip' on a quartering away shot?

[Bow Walker]

Why should mechanicals be shot out of a minimum 60 lbs bow?


How often does the head 'skip' on a quartering away shot?
Today's expandable heads are much better engineered than they were even 5 years ago. There are even heads out there that are fully functional when shot from "lower" poundage bows - those on the high 40's and the low 50's.

[J_T]

How often does the head 'skip' on a quartering away shot? Once would be one time to many. Wouldn't it? Sure there are always factors that will impact all equipment types, flights and penetration. I was just providing an opinion on a mechanical. Raising a question of doubt might provide a potential user motivation to investigate further.


Why should mechanicals be shot out of a minimum 60 lbs bow?
I don't profess to be the science behind the statement, however I have read information and I have talked to guys who are much more in the know about equipment performance than I, I have respect for their skills and I have listened to them. I suspect if a bowhunter thought about it, he/she would be able to deduce the answer, or investigate further. Do I have the source at my fingertips. No.

[Stone Sheep Steve]

I think GG would support banning mechanical broadheads right after they ban Partitions:grin:.

SSS

[Onesock]

:smile:I guess GG must use mechanical broadheads, eh !!!!!! ME ME ME.

[Stone Sheep Steve]

:smile:I guess GG must use mechanical broadheads, eh !!!!!! ME ME ME.

Are you kidding me? His bow is so old the wheel on it is made of stone. Probably too slow to deploy those "wings":-D.

SSS

[GoatGuy]

:smile:I guess GG must use mechanical broadheads, eh !!!!!! ME ME ME.

Must be. You've got me pegged.

Funny though, I've looked around in my bow box and I can't seem to find any mechanical broadheads. Weird?

I don't even think they had mechanical broadheads when my bow was made :roll:

Bizarre that I also don't own a quad but don't support a ban on quad operations during the morning and evenings. Weird?

Also bizarre that I don't own a crossbow but I support them as legal archery tackle as well. Weird?

Also bizarre that I'm not a youth hunter but I also support youth seasons.
Weird?

Bizarre that I'm benefiting from excellent hunting because there aren't any hunters left yet I want to see more hunters. Weird?


If it's all about me you must be the most considerate person in the world.

[GoatGuy]

Once would be one time to many. Wouldn't it? Sure there are always factors that will impact all equipment types, flights and penetration. I was just providing an opinion on a mechanical. Raising a question of doubt might provide a potential user motivation to investigate further.

One time a guy wounds an animal would theoretically too many but we don't have rules that stipulate you have to quit hunting if you wound an animal.

Generally one who provides answers tries to support that with facts.



I don't profess to be the science behind the statement, however I have read information and I have talked to guys who are much more in the know about equipment performance than I, I have respect for their skills and I have listened to them. I suspect if a bowhunter thought about it, he/she would be able to deduce the answer, or investigate further. Do I have the source at my fingertips. No.


If we continue to regulate ourselves based on "guys I've talked to" we will continue to kill hunters off. We've got bill c-68 thanks to "guys I've talked to".

[Onesock]

We are all entitled to our opinion. Mechanical broadheads fail more than non-mechanical broadheads. It is in all bowhunters best interest to use the best broadhead they can, and mechanical broadheads are not the answer. Bowhunting is tough enough without having to wonder if your broadhead will work or not!.

[J_T]

I didn't feel I was contributing to a provincial decision with that statement. I was providing a relatively new hunter with my opinion. It seemed others that commented agreed.


Generally one who provides answers tries to support that with facts.Why? This is a "chat site". I don't have to hold my opinion, simply because I don't have a study to support it.

Many of my opinions are not based on things I've read or studies I have done, but are based on experience and the experiences of others. Experience is not a bad source for decision making.

The experience of you and of government suggest hunters are selfish and only care about themselves and their honeyhole. We've not got a documented survey to prove such, but your milking it. (I do agree though)

Guys I've talked to are intelligent. And I disagree that forming decisions based on human nature and human reaction will kill off hunters. We should count on human nature to increase participation. Give hunters the opportunity to harvest and they will participate.

While there are no rules against wounding, it is important to reduce it, wherever there is potential for it. I certainly wasn't suggesting someone who wounds, quit hunting. I've wounded.

Why are you doing this? Why are we having this conversation where I feel you are attempting to discredit at every turn? Why is it every time I post, you challenge up the ying yang? It certainly is not my preference.

You base your position on science, I base mine more in experience and human nature. Both positions can be compatible and I prefer working together.

[sealevel]

do you really know that Onesock ??

[Onesock]

:frown:Yes Sealevel. I have seen mechanical heads fail. The head was a Spitfire. The animal had to be tracked down some 51/2 hrs later and shot again. The unopend Spitfire was found in the animal. Again UNOPENED. The only advantage I can see to using mechanical broadheads is the user does not have to spend any time tuning his bow to shoot them. Are there other advantages using to them?

[Stone Sheep Steve]

We are all entitled to our opinion. Mechanical broadheads fail more than non-mechanical broadheads. It is in all bowhunters best interest to use the best broadhead they can, and mechanical broadheads are not the answer. Bowhunting is tough enough without having to wonder if your broadhead will work or not!.

And if you compare the performance of a traditional bow with a modern compound bow you might consider not going with a traditional??? Get my point??
You wouldn't shoot an animal @35 yds with a traditional bow......but that would be okay for a proficient compound shoooter??
Maybe avoid steep quartering away shots with a mechanical broadheads??

Like traditonal bows and compounds, mechanical broadheads will kill just fine if we stay within their limits.......Partitions vs Ballistic tips vs TSX's the debate is endless. I wouldn't take the same shot if I had a bone-busting TSX in the pipe vs if I had a quick expansion ballistic tip in the pipe. They will all kill efficiently.........if we pick our shots.
Just stay within your and your equipment's limits and you be just fine.

From a newer bowhunter's perspective I find that there is a lot less expertise required to get mechanicals to fly like field points than cut on contacts. We all can't start out as experts.
And as a newer bowhunter I must limit my shots more than a veteran of the sport.....distances and angles.

SSS

[Onesock]

No one would really shot a bullet if that bullet had a tendency for failure would they. If like you say a partition or TSX is a better bullet why not shoot the best one for the job. Sierra makes very accurate bullets but I don't see anyone on here saying to shoot them just because they are accurate. Learing about your equipment and how to use it is what hunting is all about. Or do we want to turn hunting into an instant thing where you purchase the latest and greatest (quad, rangefinder, GPS, 1000yd rifle, biggest 4X4, helicopter,on and on). Ah,shoot what you want.

[GoatGuy]

I didn't feel I was contributing to a provincial decision with that statement. I was providing a relatively new hunter with my opinion. It seemed others that commented agreed.

Why? This is a "chat site". I don't have to hold my opinion, simply because I don't have a study to support it.

Many of my opinions are not based on things I've read or studies I have done, but are based on experience and the experiences of others. Experience is not a bad source for decision making.

The experience of you and of government suggest hunters are selfish and only care about themselves and their honeyhole. We've not got a documented survey to prove such, but your milking it. (I do agree though)

Guys I've talked to are intelligent. And I disagree that forming decisions based on human nature and human reaction will kill off hunters. We should count on human nature to increase participation. Give hunters the opportunity to harvest and they will participate.

While there are no rules against wounding, it is important to reduce it, wherever there is potential for it. I certainly wasn't suggesting someone who wounds, quit hunting. I've wounded.

Why are you doing this? Why are we having this conversation where I feel you are attempting to discredit at every turn? Why is it every time I post, you challenge up the ying yang? It certainly is not my preference.

You base your position on science, I base mine more in experience and human nature. Both positions can be compatible and I prefer working together.

Because your opinion is not strictly related to a chat site and your ideas are seldom supported by anything other than 'experience' of the people you hang around with. The reason you hang around with them is because the have the exact same frame of mind as you do (same with everybody else, I know) which diverges with in excess of >95% of the population.

Most of those ideas alienate hunters that don't share the exact same mindset as you and there's generally no consideration given to the hunting population.

What's most frustrating is I find myself dealing with this stuff when there are other things I could be dealing with. I have to answer questions about this kind of stuff all the time and dig up references and actually see what's going on in other parts of NA too see if this idea is true or if the preamble is one statistic taken completely and totally out of context. I have to take the time to properly research one of these 'ideas', and pass the research on or put an informed opinion together.

When I hear about quad bans, shortening the gos buck season because there aren't enough in the bow season, cutting the bag limit back for gun hunters because there aren't enough, banning types of broadheads, banning crossbows, closing youth seasons because its dangerous, and that goats are now a recruitment species I can't help but shake my head and wonder what it'd be like if everybody wasn't trying to cut everybody else out.

It's funny, I was fishing with a fella the other week who's probably the most, if not one of the most famous fly fishers (who's still alive) in the province a couple weeks ago and was astounded really. Here's essentially what he said:

All the guys I know who are involved in clubs think that every lake should be trophy, fly-fishing, bait ban, single barbless only. They think lakes like Kidd, Sawmill, Peterhope, Dragon (etc) fit the ideal lake. They talk about wanting to get more kids into fishing so they start them out by taking them chironomid fishing on a trophy lake where they might catch one or two fish and they can't understand why the kids won't stick with it.

We've got it all wrong, he said.

Kids don't care they caught a 10 lber, they want to go fishing with a worm and a bobber and catch fish all day. The only thing worse than not catching a fishing is having to throw one back. I really don't care if a guy's fishing with worms as long as he's out fishing. Doesn't bother me if he puts by as I'm anchored up. Don't care if he keeps his limit or what kind of gear he uses. Fly fishers have to change their way in thinking if they want to see fishing continue. I see the same thing happening with hunting, he said.

Those aren't my words, they're his. Funny we're both fly only guys but we had to chuckle as the parallels between hunting and angling are very clear.

At some point hunters and anglers are going to realize that not everyone does it the exact same way and just because a guy likes to drag a flatfish or likes to road hunt doesn't mean we should be kicking him out or telling him to move on.

You're a guy with two function feet and we live in a huge province - there's always an empty lake or a hillside without boot tracks. If you choose to hunt busy areas that's great but please don't tell hunters and anglers they can't hunt/fish here when you're there unless they're willing to pick up a fly rod, take up catch and release, quit using their quad or pick up a bow.

Human nature is very correct.

[daycort]

GG,

That ^^^^^^^^^^ up there was well put.

I say if you are under 6'1" you can't hunt with a mech broadhead.
you are probably not strong enough to pull back the 80# bow it takes to deploy the blades.

What ya think??



LOL.

[sealevel]

:frown:Yes Sealevel. I have seen mechanical heads fail. The head was a Spitfire. The animal had to be tracked down some 51/2 hrs later and shot again. The unopend Spitfire was found in the animal. Again UNOPENED. The only advantage I can see to using mechanical broadheads is the user does not have to spend any time tuning his bow to shoot them. Are there other advantages using to them?So what you are saying is because someones spitfires didn`t open all mechanicals are no good. Other reasons for shooting mechanicals . you can use smaller fletching when hunting in wind larger cut maybe just cause you want to. Oh i don`t use them i use muzzy

[Bowzone_Mikey]

So what you are saying is because someones spitfires didn`t open all mechanicals are no good. Other reasons for shooting mechanicals . you can use smaller fletching when hunting in wind larger cut maybe just cause you want to. Oh i don`t use them i use muzzy

I use em for that excat same reason ... i can use smaller Vanes ..Never had one fail on me in 7 years nor has my friend in 15 years had one fail to open, skip out etc....

[J_T]

Because your opinion is not strictly related to a chat site and your ideas are seldom supported by anything other than 'experience' of the people you hang around with. The reason you hang around with them is because the have the exact same frame of mind as you do (same with everybody else, I know) which diverges with in excess of >95% of the population.

Most of those ideas alienate hunters that don't share the exact same mindset as you and there's generally no consideration given to the hunting population.

What's most frustrating is I find myself dealing with this stuff when there are other things I could be dealing with. I have to answer questions about this kind of stuff all the time and dig up references and actually see what's going on in other parts of NA too see if this idea is true or if the preamble is one statistic taken completely and totally out of context. I have to take the time to properly research one of these 'ideas', and pass the research on or put an informed opinion together.

When I hear about quad bans, shortening the gos buck season because there aren't enough in the bow season, cutting the bag limit back for gun hunters because there aren't enough, banning types of broadheads, banning crossbows, closing youth seasons because its dangerous, and that goats are now a recruitment species I can't help but shake my head and wonder what it'd be like if everybody wasn't trying to cut everybody else out.

It's funny, I was fishing with a fella the other week who's probably the most, if not one of the most famous fly fishers (who's still alive) in the province a couple weeks ago and was astounded really. Here's essentially what he said:

All the guys I know who are involved in clubs think that every lake should be trophy, fly-fishing, bait ban, single barbless only. They think lakes like Kidd, Sawmill, Peterhope, Dragon (etc) fit the ideal lake. They talk about wanting to get more kids into fishing so they start them out by taking them chironomid fishing on a trophy lake where they might catch one or two fish and they can't understand why the kids won't stick with it.

We've got it all wrong, he said.

Kids don't care they caught a 10 lber, they want to go fishing with a worm and a bobber and catch fish all day. The only thing worse than not catching a fishing is having to throw one back. I really don't care if a guy's fishing with worms as long as he's out fishing. Doesn't bother me if he puts by as I'm anchored up. Don't care if he keeps his limit or what kind of gear he uses. Fly fishers have to change their way in thinking if they want to see fishing continue. I see the same thing happening with hunting, he said.

Those aren't my words, they're his. Funny we're both fly only guys but we had to chuckle as the parallels between hunting and angling are very clear.

At some point hunters and anglers are going to realize that not everyone does it the exact same way and just because a guy likes to drag a flatfish or likes to road hunt doesn't mean we should be kicking him out or telling him to move on.

You're a guy with two function feet and we live in a huge province - there's always an empty lake or a hillside without boot tracks. If you choose to hunt busy areas that's great but please don't tell hunters and anglers they can't hunt/fish here when you're there unless they're willing to pick up a fly rod, take up catch and release, quit using their quad or pick up a bow.

Human nature is very correct.So, you're saying, I'm creating work for you. Are you being paid? Sounds like a win win to me.

[Ambush]

How do you know when a mechanical didn't open? Shoot a target, pull it out, it's closed. Shoot an animal, pull it out, it's closed. The blades close when the arrow is pulled backwards. You CAN tell by examining the entrance [and exit] holes. In my opinion, a cheap fixed blade is worse than a quality mechanical. Maybe we should just ban cheap junk.

If we can go on personal experience alone, then I am completly satisfied with Spitfires. Good flight, huge wounds, never had or seen a failure.

But my experience has only been with bows at 70lbs, 29" DL and arrows weighing nearly 500gr.

The mechanicals of today are not the mechanicals of even 5 years ago.

If you don't like'em, don't shoot'em!!

[Bow Walker]

My first "broadheads" were Spitfires. 2-bladed variety. They don't make them anymore - just the three bladed ones. I switched to replaceable blades cause I lost confidence in them...don't know why, just did.

I soon made my last switch to fixed blades and have been happy ever since.

I'm not telling or advising hunters to not use mechanicals, but there are much better heads out there....

[The Hermit]

It would be fun to take the same bow and shoot ten identical arrows with 100gr cut on contact broadheads and the same arrows with 100 gr mechanicals and on average measure the difference in penetration on the same target.

I would bet a couple beers and a plate of nachos that these...

http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/data/500/undertaker-steps.jpg

would not penetrate as far as these...

http://shop.3dshoots.com/images/g5/montec.jpg

take one of each, stand them upright and pull a piece of cowhide down on them till they cut thru. Which one took more force?

[GoatGuy]

So, you're saying, I'm creating work for you. Are you being paid? Sounds like a win win to me.

If I was being paid for this I'd be a multi-millionaire several times over.............................................. ................

point is there could be more time spent on more important things like creating more hunters or more animals.

[The Hermit]

Because your opinion is not strictly related to a chat site and your ideas are seldom supported by anything other than 'experience' of the people you hang around with. The reason you hang around with them is because the have the exact same frame of mind as you do (same with everybody else, I know) which diverges with in excess of >95% of the population.

Most of those ideas alienate hunters that don't share the exact same mindset as you and there's generally no consideration given to the hunting population.

What's most frustrating is I find myself dealing with this stuff when there are other things I could be dealing with. I have to answer questions about this kind of stuff all the time and dig up references and actually see what's going on in other parts of NA too see if this idea is true or if the preamble is one statistic taken completely and totally out of context. I have to take the time to properly research one of these 'ideas', and pass the research on or put an informed opinion together.

When I hear about quad bans, shortening the gos buck season because there aren't enough in the bow season, cutting the bag limit back for gun hunters because there aren't enough, banning types of broadheads, banning crossbows, closing youth seasons because its dangerous, and that goats are now a recruitment species I can't help but shake my head and wonder what it'd be like if everybody wasn't trying to cut everybody else out.

It's funny, I was fishing with a fella the other week who's probably the most, if not one of the most famous fly fishers (who's still alive) in the province a couple weeks ago and was astounded really. Here's essentially what he said:

All the guys I know who are involved in clubs think that every lake should be trophy, fly-fishing, bait ban, single barbless only. They think lakes like Kidd, Sawmill, Peterhope, Dragon (etc) fit the ideal lake. They talk about wanting to get more kids into fishing so they start them out by taking them chironomid fishing on a trophy lake where they might catch one or two fish and they can't understand why the kids won't stick with it.

We've got it all wrong, he said.

Kids don't care they caught a 10 lber, they want to go fishing with a worm and a bobber and catch fish all day. The only thing worse than not catching a fishing is having to throw one back. I really don't care if a guy's fishing with worms as long as he's out fishing. Doesn't bother me if he puts by as I'm anchored up. Don't care if he keeps his limit or what kind of gear he uses. Fly fishers have to change their way in thinking if they want to see fishing continue. I see the same thing happening with hunting, he said.

Those aren't my words, they're his. Funny we're both fly only guys but we had to chuckle as the parallels between hunting and angling are very clear.

At some point hunters and anglers are going to realize that not everyone does it the exact same way and just because a guy likes to drag a flatfish or likes to road hunt doesn't mean we should be kicking him out or telling him to move on.

You're a guy with two function feet and we live in a huge province - there's always an empty lake or a hillside without boot tracks. If you choose to hunt busy areas that's great but please don't tell hunters and anglers they can't hunt/fish here when you're there unless they're willing to pick up a fly rod, take up catch and release, quit using their quad or pick up a bow.

Human nature is very correct.

You two guys need to sit down together over a couple pints!

[Grantmac]

It would be fun to take the same bow and shoot ten identical arrows with 100gr cut on contact broadheads and the same arrows with 100 gr mechanicals and on average measure the difference in penetration on the same target.

I would bet a couple beers and a plate of nachos that these...

http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/data/500/undertaker-steps.jpg

would not penetrate as far as these...

http://shop.3dshoots.com/images/g5/montec.jpg

take one of each, stand them upright and pull a piece of cowhide down on them till they cut thru. Which one took more force?

I think with the current equipment that underpenetration really isn't much of an issue, most shots are passthrough. So perhaps we need to start thinking about transfering as much force and damage to the animal as the point passes through.
I really don't have an opinion on this subject on the whole, but I am facinated as to the logic of each choice. Personally I'd rather a scary sharp 2-blade trade-point or some flint, but I like things rustic.
Cheers,
Grant

[Bow Walker]

I've shot bag targets - ones stuffed to the gills and packed tight with plastic materials such as shopping bags and shrink wrap - with both the afore mentioned Spitfires and with the Montecs. The target bags were at least 18" thick. The shots were with the same bow, from the same distance, using the same arrows.

Both broadheads blew through the target bags on the first and second shots, although the second shot did not pass through quite so easily as the first - blades were duller.

Both the mechanical and the fixed did not pass through on the third shots - or any subsequent shots - until sharpened. As I recall (A.I.R.) the fixed blade head did penetrate further ,when dull, than the mechanical head.

What does this mean? Probably nothing, but it does form some sort of informal test, and I stress the word informal.

So. Take this free info and $4.50 and go get a latte, you'll be happier thinking it over with a coffee.

[J_T]

Because your opinion is not strictly related to a chat site and your ideas are seldom supported by anything other than 'experience' of the people you hang around with. The reason you hang around with them is because the have the exact same frame of mind as you do (same with everybody else, I know) which diverges with in excess of >95% of the population.

Most of those ideas alienate hunters that don't share the exact same mindset as you and there's generally no consideration given to the hunting population. And this statement is really hijacking a thread about a hunter that asked a question. Your statement above is a judgement of me, my knowledge and any circles of influence you might consider.

I hang with the old, the young, with rifle hunters, with all element of bow hunters, with trophy hunters, with meat hunters, hunters that use quads, guys who like to hunt front country and guys who like to hunt backcountry, I hang with guys that are looking at something new in a sporting lifestyle they love.

If I have a point to make in this response, it is that if you took the time you would find our objectives are not likely that different, our passion the same.

Hermit is exactly correct. To really move forward, it takes teamwork and ideas from a number of sources. Not just one. Let's explore the possibilities for gain, not push back on them. Not everything has a science behind it in life. And not every new idea can be based on some similar event, because it's new. It has to be thought out and considered, perhaps implemented slowly. But I can tell you, when we move an idea forward, the primary objective is hunter participation. All hunters.


When I hear about quad bans, shortening the gos buck season because there aren't enough in the bow season, cutting the bag limit back for gun hunters because there aren't enough, banning types of broadheads, banning crossbows, closing youth seasons because its dangerous, and that goats are now a recruitment species I can't help but shake my head and wonder what it'd be like if everybody wasn't trying to cut everybody else out. And this is where you are forming a judgement without understanding. A bit of fear mongering perhaps, some comments above I have no idea about.

[xtremearchery]

I have used many different broadheads. I currently use slick trick 100gr mags. They fly true like field points and leave a nice large hole for a fixed blade. I also use the new Rage expandables. They are awesome! No deflections and no loss of ken. energy. It really comes down to personal pref. Find a broadhead that your bow likes to shoot and stick with it. They will all do the trick.

[325]

Thanks for all the info...

I'll be trying Grim Reapers mechanicals this fall. From what I hear, they are awesome.

[Wildfoot]

F&#% mechanicals. Fixed heads work perfectly, no need to improve on perfection.

[325]

Wow.

I have hunted big game for 22 years....but only got into archery over the last year. So far, I am really enjoying it...I do a lot of shooting with another "newby", so we have a good time.

I find, however, that bow hunters tend to have harsh opinions about certain subjects (i.e crossbows...mechanical broadheads). Will I become an elitist, judgmental @ss ( I mean, more so than I already am) if I continue with archery?? Just wondering

[bcfarmer]

ROTFLMAOhttp://www.huntingbc.ca/forum/images/icons/icon10.gif




Wow.

I have hunted big game for 22 years....but only got into archery over the last year. So far, I am really enjoying it...I do a lot of shooting with another "newby", so we have a good time.

I find, however, that bow hunters tend to have harsh opinions about certain subjects (i.e crossbows...mechanical broadheads). Will I become an elitist, judgmental @ss ( I mean, more so than I already am) if I continue with archery?? Just wondering

[threedhunter]

in answer o your original question, yes you can hunt moose and elk with mechanicals.what you shoot will dictate if they perform properly or not.as to he second question, if you stay in archery and have an open mind, are willing to learn and put into practise what you are taught, then youprobably will not become an eelliittiisstt or archery snob.some of us out here learn new things from other archers everytime we converse/shoot with others. others stick thier heads into personal oderous openings and refuse to learn/acknowledge other styles of shooters.just my observations over 30 plus years in archery,threedhunter.:| the judgemental part is probably already instilled in you, wether you excercise that option is up to you.live and learn, every day.

[Bow Walker]

"Assholes" are made - not born.

I don't think you have to worry.

[Kody94]

Wow.
I find, however, that bow hunters tend to have harsh opinions about certain subjects (i.e crossbows...mechanical broadheads). Will I become an elitist, judgmental @ss ( I mean, more so than I already am) if I continue with archery?? Just wondering

Ha! :)

Archers don't have a monopoly on judgemental azz'ism, or elitism for that matter.

Bring up any of the following topics and you'll find your fair share of both among rifle hunters, and about every other kind of hunter:

deer hybrids
antler point restrictions
hunter recruitment strategies
270 vs 30/06
375 Ruger vs 375 H&H
LEH
Guide allocations
long range "hunting"
headshots
ATVs
brands of backpacking equipment and boots
45/70's for dangerous game (especially Africa)
bolt action vs double rifle in Africa
Control round feed versus pushfeed
Sierra Matchkings on game

...shall I go on? ;)

Cheers,
4ster

[The Hermit]

I dig this kind of mechanical!! :arrow:

http://www.popgadget.net/images/bionic-woman-free.jpg

But not this kind :arrow:

http://images1.comstock.com/Imagewarehouse/BX/SITECS/NLWMCompingVersions/35751-36000/bxp35999.jpg

Now if we can add something about gourmet food this thread should be complete!

[Bow Walker]

Did sorta go astray here didn't we?

[threedhunter]

nah, we never go astray,thats a nother hunting form isn't it? sometimes we just wander off track.a little.sure stirs emotions though.yup, all manner of discussion leads far and wide.hey peaple have a great fathers day, even if your not a father.threedhunter.:biggrin:

[Bowzone_Mikey]

hunting ... for a rise ?

some people just think that mechs are an easy anser ... just slap em on the end of yer arrows and go ... I personally have never had a problem with em .... mind you I think about what I am doing ... am I gonna take a hard 1/4 shot ...probally not even with fixed heads I wouldnt ..with a rifle .. ya I will ...because rifles and bullets kill from the shock inflicted .. archery kills are from bleeding the animal out ... its two totally differant ways to get the same result (ie: meat inda freezer).

That said .. My bow is pretty snotty and fast and generates alot of KE.

Have I used Mechs on Moose and Elk etc?... Elk yes. sucessful? Yes .. Moose no as I havent gone after Moose with archery tackle ... I plan to this year as long as I get a draw and plan on using the same Broadheads as i would on Elk or Deer ..will i be succesfull? only if I get position for a good shot

[GoatGuy]

And this statement is really hijacking a thread about a hunter that asked a question. Your statement above is a judgement of me, my knowledge and any circles of influence you might consider.

I hang with the old, the young, with rifle hunters, with all element of bow hunters, with trophy hunters, with meat hunters, hunters that use quads, guys who like to hunt front country and guys who like to hunt backcountry, I hang with guys that are looking at something new in a sporting lifestyle they love.

If I have a point to make in this response, it is that if you took the time you would find our objectives are not likely that different, our passion the same.

Hermit is exactly correct. To really move forward, it takes teamwork and ideas from a number of sources. Not just one. Let's explore the possibilities for gain, not push back on them. Not everything has a science behind it in life. And not every new idea can be based on some similar event, because it's new. It has to be thought out and considered, perhaps implemented slowly. But I can tell you, when we move an idea forward, the primary objective is hunter participation. All hunters.

And this is where you are forming a judgement without understanding. A bit of fear mongering perhaps, some comments above I have no idea about.

I'll save a long post. You don't know and don't 'hang' with all hunters - your suggestions and 'possibilities' reflect that. Most hunters don't want to be told they can't use their quad in the morning or evening, or that they can't use mechanical broadheads, or that they have to take a mandatory course to become a licensed bowhunter or buy a friggen' turkey tag. It really couldn't get any worse - fear mongering, right!

I've spoken with hunters and managers across NA and most of the stuff you come up is nothing short of absolute garbage. I cannot find any other word for it.

I'll start a couple of polls for you, seeing as HBC is apparently reflective of the hunter population, because most of our hunters across the province are young enough to use the internet and also have access to it. :roll: After all, that's what you're using to support your 'possibilities'.

[greybark]

:? Hey Goatguy , I find your attitude when dealing with others in particular with J_T apallingly arrogant . J-T in his posts with you appears to be resonable and willing to "talk" things out in a co-operative and intellegant manner . YOU on the other hand appear to bully with a mixture of facts and intimitation with the idea that only your opinion counts .
Cheers
Sorry for the highjack 325 ....

[GoatGuy]

:? Hey Goatguy , I find your attitude when dealing with others in particular with J_T apallingly arrogant . J-T in his posts with you appears to be resonable and willing to "talk" things out in a co-operative and intellegant manner . YOU on the other hand appear to bully with a mixture of facts and intimitation with the idea that only your opinion counts .
Cheers


That's unfortunate.


When somebody comes up with something that has some merit and doesn't alienate 'everybody but me' I'm all ears - until the time comes I won't have any of it.

[Bow Walker]

OK guys - this thread has run it's useful life. Time to close it and suggest the "Open Chat" forum for your "debate"?.....