reg changes

[Koot]

I am wondering if anyone can fill me in on the following?

-Did they change the Mule deer season in Nov in reg 5?

-Did they change the east Kootenay elk point restrictions?

-Did they open spike fork moose in reg 4?

Thanks,
Koot

[finish]

I'm not sure about the elk points, I do know they changed the LEH elk from 1 month seasons to 10 day seasons....wierd!! Maybe there will be a point reduction coming, hopfully not three and better, I'd be happy with a 5 point season.
Anyone else know about this?

[Ride]

From what i have heard from a CO there will be no GOS kootenay bull elk season and there will be a spike fork moose season in Region 4. Don't know about the mule deer possible changes.

[Jetboater]

Ride... I dont know where you got that info but I would wait and see what comes from the regs... I cannot see no GOS for elk... might as well shut down the gang ranch for muleys if thats the case....

[finish]

Gos? sorry guys but what is that?

[kennyj]

General open season.
Ken

[6616]

-Did they change the east Kootenay elk point restrictions? Not yet

-Did they open spike fork moose in reg 4? Not yet

[hunter1947]

I'm not sure about the elk points, I do know they changed the LEH elk from 1 month seasons to 10 day seasons....wierd!! Maybe there will be a point reduction coming, hopfully not three and better, I'd be happy with a 5 point season.
Anyone else know about this?
I do hope they do one change in the EK and that being a 5 point two week season on them.

[budismyhorse]

1. Not sure about that.
2. No
3. No

6616 is saying "not yet" which is good news. but from what I have heard, the moose change crashed and burned in Victoria. Too bad, I was buying heavier broadheads for the occation...

[finish]

Agreed!!! 5 Point season for a couple weeks would be great!!!!!!!!!!

[6616]

1. Not sure about that.
2. No
3. No

6616 is saying "not yet" which is good news. but from what I have heard, the moose change crashed and burned in Victoria. Too bad, I was buying heavier broadheads for the occation...

"No" for this fall, but maybe in the future,,,, who knows?

[kenkell1]

Talked to a CO yesterday and he said that spike/fork moose will be open for region 4 this year.

[Fisher-Dude]

I've seen 4 or 5 spike/forks in the EK in 30 years. I've killed one in region 8 in the past 12 years since the regs were changed. Don't buy another deep freeze thinking you'll have a spike/fork moose in your freezer this year!

The reality is that they are the most difficult ungulate to identify as being legal...you have to look at them to be sure an extra point ISN'T there, where with, say a 4 point mulie, once you confirm 4, you can pop 'em without worrying that they may have a hidden sticker that you didn't see. It's really difficult, and most of they time they bolt before you can make a positive ID.

The upside is that now, instead of saying to myself, "oh, another moose, ho-hum" when I'm elk hunting, I'll get a bit of an adrenaline rush seeing a swamp donkey in the EK. :-D

[browningboy]

Talked to a CO yesterday and he said that spike/fork moose will be open for region 4 this year.

Well Flathead here I come, going for my bull elk but now have a back up plan! Wasn't sure if I was going to go but now this makes it interesting, but I just wish the regs would come out sooner than the late summer!

[Stone Sheep Steve]

I've seen 4 or 5 spike/forks in the EK in 30 years. I've killed one in region 8 in the past 12 years since the regs were changed. Don't buy another deep freeze thinking you'll have a spike/fork moose in your freezer this year!

I don't know about that FD. I have a buddy who's a hardcore road hunter like yourself and he's taken Reg 8 immies in 4 of the last 5 years. Looking at the harvest data for Reg 8 shows that we took more immies than LEH bulls by quite a bit(can't remember the numbers off hand). Maybe we just have weaker genetics in the OK?? Dunno:???:.

Don't leave home without a tag!

SSS

[bighornbob]

I'm not sure about the elk points, I do know they changed the LEH elk from 1 month seasons to 10 day seasons....wierd!! Maybe there will be a point reduction coming, hopfully not three and better, I'd be happy with a 5 point season.
Anyone else know about this?

If they lowered the seasons for cow/calfs I would think they are going to open up some sort of bull season (3 point or better or 5 point or better) for some part of the season. There is no reason to drop the time for flat tops as the elk are doing better then ever.

BHB

[kenkell1]

Well Flathead here I come, going for my bull elk but now have a back up plan! Wasn't sure if I was going to go but now this makes it interesting, but I just wish the regs would come out sooner than the late summer!
X2 wished the regs would come out sooner.

[6616]

If they lowered the seasons for cow/calfs I would think they are going to open up some sort of bull season (3 point or better or 5 point or better) for some part of the season. There is no reason to drop the time for flat tops as the elk are doing better then ever.

BHB

The antlerless seasons in some of the x-zones were shortened so they could have an early and a late season thus enabling them to issue more authorizations.

There is no change to bull antler point regulations planned for this fall.

[Fisher-Dude]

Well Flathead here I come, going for my bull elk but now have a back up plan! Wasn't sure if I was going to go but now this makes it interesting, but I just wish the regs would come out sooner than the late summer!

Just great. Another Coastal Warrior pounding the roads with his quad and scaring all the game off. Just what we need. :roll:


















LOL! :biggrin:

[Fisher-Dude]

I don't know about that FD. I have a buddy who's a hardcore road hunter like yourself and he's taken Reg 8 immies in 4 of the last 5 years. Looking at the harvest data for Reg 8 shows that we took more immies than LEH bulls by quite a bit(can't remember the numbers off hand). Maybe we just have weaker genetics in the OK?? Dunno:???:.

Don't leave home without a tag!

SSS

How does he sit in the truck all day with that horseshoe in his butt?

I always pack a moose tag. However, I've learned to expect absolutely nothing and rejoice in the occasional miracle when it comes to spike/forks. We took more immies in reg 8 because the LEH numbers are miniscule (191 total tags with what I believe is < 50% success). 3 tags in 8-10 for all of October? Good grief Brian H! :frown:

[GoatGuy]

.. I cannot see no GOS for elk... might as well shut down the gang ranch for muleys if thats the case....


Yep, shutting 'er right down - we need more animals!!!!!

Get them elk, deer and moose to starve themselves to death. Feed the wolves!!! Big winter kill, high pred population and we're on the slowwwwwww road to recovery.


All LEH all species all across the province.


It must be true; I heard it (among other things) in Cranbrook.:eek:

[6616]

How does he sit in the truck all day with that horseshoe in his butt?

I always pack a moose tag. However, I've learned to expect absolutely nothing and rejoice in the occasional miracle when it comes to spike/forks. We took more immies in reg 8 because the LEH numbers are miniscule (191 total tags with what I believe is < 50% success). 3 tags in 8-10 for all of October? Good grief Brian H! :frown:

So hunting opportunities went from 191 (say 250 with shared hunts) to ----- ??? how many people buy moose tags now in hopes of bagging a spike/fork,,,, 500 to 1000,,,, or more ???. A great recruitment/retention tool..!

The spike/fork harvest is almost completely compensatory due to their high natural mortallity rate, it's almost a fail safe season, and provides huge opportunities, and the harvest does "not" count against resident allocation. It's a dream come true, maybe we could use something like that for elk too...! The UBBC suggested a 3pt and smaller season for elk in the East Kootenay, will be interesting to see how that is rec'd. Might be a winning idea...what do you guys think?

[6616]

It must be true; I heard it in Cranbrook.:eek:

I told you to stick to beer in Cranbrook, now look what happened, you've gone nuts...!

[Fisher-Dude]

So hunting opportunities went from 191 (say 250 with shared hunts) to ----- ??? how many people buy moose tags now in hopes of bagging a spike/fork,,,, 500 to 1000,,,, or more ???. A great recruitment/retention tool..!

The spike/fork harvest is almost completely compensatory due to their high natural mortallity rate, it's almost a fail safe season, and provides huge opportunities, and the harvest does "not" count against resident allocation. It's a dream come true, maybe we could use something like that for elk too...! The UBBC suggested a 3pt and smaller season for elk in the East Kootenay, will be interesting to see how that is rec'd. Might be a winning idea...what do you guys think?

We got the immy season in reg 8 as soon as they deemed GOS any bull to be too liberal (1995ish?). So, we went from GOS to LEH and immies. Moose hunter numbers around here subsequently went in the crapper.

Now, for reg 4 where all there has been for 15ish years is high-odds LEH, the ADDITION of spike/fork is great for R&R. However, I don't expect too many moose to be shot using the model in reg 8 of relatively low harvest numbers. I still believe that reg 4 moose can go GOS any bull with a concurrent 3 point elk season and an aggregate bag limit of one.

Is that proposal from the UBBC for 3 point and smaller for bow only, an additional season, or to replace 6 point GOS?

[6616]

Is that proposal from the UBBC for 3 point and smaller for bow only, an additional season, or to replace 6 point GOS?

Correct me if I'm wrong J_T, but I believe it's for a GOS for a limited time frame Pat (a week or ten days), x-zones only, in addition to and overlapping the full length 6pt GOS, and open to all hunters.

[Fisher-Dude]

Correct me if I'm wrong J_T, but I believe it's for a GOS for a limited time frame Pat (a week or ten days), x-zones only, in addition to and overlapping the full length 6pt GOS, and open to all hunters.

Additional opportunity. Two thumbs up!

[J_T]

Correct me if I'm wrong J_T, but I believe it's for a GOS for a limited time frame Pat (a week or ten days), x-zones only, in addition to and overlapping the full length 6pt GOS, and open to all hunters.Thanks for alerting me to this thread Andy.

The UBBC proposal is for a 3 pt (or 5pt at the MOE discretion) or LESS bull elk season in zone X (only). The proposal suggests this season would immediately follow the Jr/Sr cow/calf open season. (Sept 21 - 26, but again at the discretion of the Ministry [science] 5 or 10 days). The proposal is for a GOS. Yes, it would overlap the existing 6pt GOS season.

FD, that would include you, on your quad, with a rifle. (I have to admit, Detroit is looking pretty tough right now)

This would not be in place for fall 2008.

What we support is science based management that meets over arching provincial objectives (R&R and sound wildlife management), rather than politically charged emotional or protectionist reactionary management.

Some might ask, or be surprised why a GOS is brought about by a bowhunting organization. We are hunters first. We have submitted what may become the start of a more diverse elk hunting/elk management plan for Reg 4. (it requires understanding and collaboration) I don't believe the bowhunting community is always only focused on bringing about archery/bow only seasons all the time. We want to strive for a plethora of opportunity catering to the needs and wants of all.

[browningboy]

Just great. Another Coastal Warrior pounding the roads with his quad and scaring all the game off. Just what we need. :roll:

















LOL! :biggrin:

You forgot to mention pounding the beer too!:biggrin:
Where we go, the witch's tit is all hiking, unfortuneatley! LOL I'm being a little more eco friendly.8-)

[Fisher-Dude]

FD, that would include you, on your quad, with a rifle. (I have to admit, Detroit is looking pretty tough right now)



Thanks for thinking of me Jim! :biggrin:

Hopefully, we can get past the politics ruling these seasons and put the science to work!

PS - did you go out and buy your Nick Lidstrom jersey yet?

[6616]

Some might ask, or be surprised why a GOS is brought about by a bowhunting organization. We are hunters first. We have submitted what may become the start of a more diverse elk hunting/elk management plan for Reg 4. (it requires understanding and collaboration) I don't believe the bowhunting community is always only focused on bringing about archery/bow only seasons all the time. We want to strive for a plethora of opportunity catering to the needs and wants of all.

That makes perfect sense since there are bow-only hunters, but additionally there are a very large number of hunters who hunt with archery tackle from Sept 1st to 9th, with a rifle from Sept 10th until the late bow seasons open, at which time they switch back to their archery tackle. Opportunities abound for the versatile hunter.

[whitetailsheds]

Are the regs/ synopsis out? Or is this all gossip/ rumours from "really good sources"?

[6616]

Are the regs/ synopsis out? Or is this all gossip/ rumours from "really good sources"?

These are merely proposals that have been submitted to the regional advisory committee by stakeholders. They have yet to be considered by MOE or subjected to broad based public consultation. They are for future consideration only and wouldn't likely happen until 2009 at the earliest. Just kicking ideas around.

[GoatGuy]

Might be a winning idea...what do you guys think?


I think it should be at least a 41 day 3 pt or better season - at the minimum. We already know that it works with far fewer elk.

I don't know why the bull season's always the topic of discussion.

The bull harvest was not the reason the population went down.

The bull harvest was never the problem.

There wasn't an issue with fecundity or delayed calving. Managing under a 6pt regulation is strictly a social issue which was confused with management and quite frankly it's garbage. It had nothing to do with the decline and marginally encouraged the bounce back of the elk population - most of that can be attributed to artificially limiting participation and killing off hunters which resulted in reduced harvest. Why we're even having this discussion instead of dealing with habitat issues (the real problem) is beyond me. This should just be done.

The issue for management right now is cow and calf harvest not this fail-safe 6pt season!!!!!!

The problem is harvesting the cow/calf component to bring the population down and manage at sy. That's why the population crashed before and that's the discussion that should be happening. That's how you manage them and bring them down. I think the only animal where antler restrictions have demonstrated any kind of value is for moose and that's marginal at best - most of it's success can also be attributed to a decline in hunter numbers and participation as well.

The rest of these antler restrictions (4 pt mule deer, 4 pt white-tailed deer and 6 pt elk) are garbage. That's been shown in every state they've tried them all along the east and west coast. The only way to grow bigger animals is to shoot fewer of them.

Want big elk and deer put them on LEH.

Lots of fun getting drawn once every 5 years to go hunting.:evil:

[J_T]

PS - did you go out and buy your Nick Lidstrom jersey yet? Well, you know I believe that a team must have a Canadian as Captain to win it all. But I do like the wings logo, and I kind of like the colour red. Perhaps a hat.


Managing under a 6pt regulation is strictly a social issue which was confused with management and quite frankly it's garbage. It had nothing to do with the decline and marginally encouraged the bounce back of the elk...... I have always agreed with that statement.

[boonerbuck]

I scanned through this thread and didnt see anyone clarify the rumoured changes to Muley season in region 5. I aslo havent had time to look at the online regs(dial up:mad:).

I talked with the Quesnel Rod and Gun Club and they said there will be no changes to Muley season. This was just last week.

[Fisher-Dude]

This is why we have a problem with large ungulate populations (ie region 4 elk) from years of conservative harvests:

From Ecodomain Consulting, 2008:


"Maintaining moose populations at or above carrying capacity increases the risk of the consequences of overpopulation including disease epidemics or starvation during severe winters. Rea and Child (2008 ) reported that an extraordinarily deep snow pack (approximately double the average) during the winter of 2006- 07, was believed by some Ministry of Environment staff to be responsible for as much as a 70% decline in Moose numbers in northeastern British Columbia. This die off of moose followed thirty years of conservative harvests resulting in some of the highest moose densities recorded in North America (Hatter 1998 ). Despite this, at the time, the regulations in place were designed to continue increasing the densities of moose in the south Peace River Subregion (J. Elliot, Retired Wildlife Section Head, pers. comm.; Hatter 1998 )."


I hope we can all learn from this when we speak about wanting to continue with restrictive regulations when populations are at/above carrying capacity. ;-)

[tufferthandug]

I heard "NO CHANGE IN REGION 5" for the November season. It will stay as it was.

[Koot]

Thanks for the resonses guys.I have three new hunters that just finished their core that I think I will take for some Does this Nov.Wantted to make sure I could still hunt bucks.
I see at least one spike fork in reg 4 every year.Hope my luck will continue!
Koot

[6616]

I see at least one spike fork in reg 4 every year.Hope my luck will continue! Koot

There will be no spike/fork moose season this fall in region 4, but if funding for the monitoring program can be found it will be reconsidered for next year.

[daycort]

is there going to be any major changes to region 7b this year? Anybody have the skinny on this Q.

[GoatGuy]

is there going to be any major changes to region 7b this year? Anybody have the skinny on this Q.

yes

Mostly in the ag zone though.