Bill C-21

[Hunter121]

Hey guys, last month an amendment has been added to the handgun ban (Bill C-21) that would ban semi-auto rifles and shotguns capable of accepting a detached magazine holding over five rounds. The proposed firearms to be banned includes many types of shotguns, Weatherby bolt action rifles, Ruger single shot rifles, as well as the famous SKS that many people enjoy for sport shooting and hunting.
Please get informed, sign the petitions and write letters to MP. Hunting is our way of life, we don't want that to be taken away from us. Here is some helpful links to stay up to date of where the Bill C-21 stands as of now. Also there a great article on MeatEater website taking about the firearms ban.

House of Commons:
https://www.ourcommons.ca/Committees/en/SECU/StudyActivity?studyActivityId=11814165

MeatEater
https://www.themeateater.com/hunt/firearm-hunting/what-hunters-need-to-know-about-the-canadian-rifle-ban

CCFR
https://firearmrights.ca/

[huntingfamily]

Thanks for sharing!

[Drillbit]

Carey Price speaks against firearms legislation Bill C-21 | CTV News (https://montreal.ctvnews.ca/i-am-not-a-criminal-habs-goalie-carey-price-speaks-against-controversial-firearms-bill-1.6180164)

[HarryToolips]

Thanks for sharing, and I agree, everyone should be writing their MP..

[Livewire322]

Thanks for sharing, and I agree, everyone should be writing their MP..

Saying that everyone should be writing their MP and setting the stage to blame your fellow gunnies for not doing enough is equivalent to saying there was no rain in a drought year because there wasn’t enough people praying for rain.
The liberals will ram this through and no amount of ink on paper is going to change that. Period.Any capitulation by the Liberals (as has been hinted at by Trudeau today), was more thank likely pre-baked into their amendment so they could gain brownie points for being ‘reasonable’ and make the conservatives look bad.

[Arctic Lake]

Hmmm. I think it better than doing nothing at all Livewire . Do you have suggestions ?
Arctic Lake
Saying that everyone should be writing their MP and setting the stage to blame your fellow gunnies for not doing enough is equivalent to saying there was no rain in a drought year because there wasn’t enough people praying for rain.
The liberals will ram this through and no amount of ink on paper is going to change that. Period.Any capitulation by the Liberals (as has been hinted at by Trudeau today), was more thank likely pre-baked into their amendment so they could gain brownie points for being ‘reasonable’ and make the conservatives look bad.

[HarryToolips]

Saying that everyone should be writing their MP and setting the stage to blame your fellow gunnies for not doing enough is equivalent to saying there was no rain in a drought year because there wasn’t enough people praying for rain.
The liberals will ram this through and no amount of ink on paper is going to change that. Period.Any capitulation by the Liberals (as has been hinted at by Trudeau today), was more thank likely pre-baked into their amendment so they could gain brownie points for being ‘reasonable’ and make the conservatives look bad.

As Arctic said, what do you suggest? Also keep in mind that it doesn't take long to send an email to MP(s)..

Cheers,

[Fallkniven]

Not sure if this is accurate(?), but The Western Standard are reporting NDP won't support the amendment>?

[Brew]

https://www.westernstandard.news/news/singh-says-ndp-will-not-support-bill-c-21-amendment/article_2a0833d2-7739-11ed-8d68-234a6b409880.html

not that I trust what Singh says

[Arctic Lake]

Well let’s see if they grab some , you know those stones !
Jag another hopeless case ! Spouts off “ oh the Liberals this the Liberals that “ But there he is keeping them in government
Arctic Lake
Not sure if this is accurate(?), but The Western Standard are reporting NDP won't support the amendment>?

[Arctic Lake]

Brew I don’t like Jag ! Is he not just saying this as it pertains to aboriginals ? He should be speaking for all of us ! More division ! Correct me if I’m wrong . I have an idea that they could drop yet another clause in there any one else guess what that might be ?
Arctic Lake

https://www.westernstandard.news/news/singh-says-ndp-will-not-support-bill-c-21-amendment/article_2a0833d2-7739-11ed-8d68-234a6b409880.html

not that I trust what Singh says

[Keta1969]

Brew I don’t like Jag ! Is he not just saying this as it pertains to aboriginals ? He should be speaking for all of us ! More division ! Correct me if I’m wrong . I have an idea that they could drop yet another clause in there any one else guess what that might be ?
Arctic Lake

The dipshit and that government are just stupid enough to grant an exemption to 1st nations. Each reserve will then become a hotbed for purchasing " illegal" firearms. A lot of the so called smuggled guns are already coming in through reserves. The dipshit liberals know this but it's hands off. F%%ing Singh will NEVER speak for us. His rural members are feeling the heat but the prize are all the dummies in the cities. Both sock boy and Jagmeet will cater to them.

[Otto1946]

Well, the NDP, will act as they have for decades and that would make Tommy Douglas, puke, IMO.

[caddisguy]

So food for thought here.

C-21 starts out as a "ban" and "buyback program" for "assault rifles" (which they suggest AR-15 variants are)

Then "Order In Council" adds it freezes handgun sales/transfers/imports/etc ... and that any center fire that holds more than 5 rounds, semi or not (like most Remington 870 or Mossberg 500 if you consider 1 & 3/4" shorties) is prohib... not even a freeze, no grandfathering, no buyback, no keeping until you die like handguns

Now single shots being added? And "variant" language? Like "we banned this random bolt action so any variant of a bolt action is banned" without definition of what variant is? Like any bolt action? Meh, the RCMP and judges bossed around by the feds will figure that all out later.

The federal government is more worried about pumps / levers that hold more than 5 than legal handguns, which neither are an issue?

Wtf is going on here. Some divide and conquer play against firearm owners for sure with the plan to take-give, but this is all very creepy.

I think the tactic here is with the 400 page "list" and banning a few single shot firearms is to make the debate about that, so gun owners and politicians defending gun owners will feel like they get a "win" if a few things are taken off the list, not realizing your average pump shotgun and many bolt actions are still banned by the general definition.

You know when you see CBC defending hunters this is a compromise deal, but the compromise will be short lived as long as the fine print exists. The "list" is a distraction.

Pretty bizarre right? Why are they worried more about levers and pumps that hold more than 5? No buyback, must be surrendered... handguns meh... you can keep em until you die that's fine, we'll collect em from your estate without compensation then, but taking away long guns you can shoot 100 yards is our to priority confiscate now.

Creepy.

I suppose when you consider our PM's own words it makes sense.

"I admire China's dictatorship and how it gives the ability to get things done"
"Canada is a country with no core identity or culture and will be the world's first post-national state"

His own words. You can look it up for yourselves.

Watching CPAC these days (I mean like the last several years) is pretty sad. Wouldn't it be nice if the speaker could say "Hey... you didn't answer the question, so answer the question or you're out" rather than booting out peeps who call out someone for lying or not answering a question. Anyone else watch this stuff live? It's brutal to watch, like dang this whole thing is a farce, makes WWE wrestling or soap opera stuff look more legit / better acting... and these are leaders of a country... good grief. Anyone see anything like this in their lifetime? I mean we have all seen politicians BS and major geopolitical stuff, but anything this far gone?

Seems like there is no legit discourse now... like "Okay you say you are banning assault/military rifles but why this single shot duck gun?" ... "To the opposition leader this is 30th anniversary of a massacre and we are doing our job to protect Canadian's from military assault style weapons unlike you guys who are paid for by the gun lobby thank you mister speaker!"

Anyone who states the obvious: "That is a lie"

Speaker: You're banned from the house for saying that and not apologizing. We can't call people out for things like blatantly lying. It messes up the whole acting script.

Yep.... this is our "country" now

[TheObserver]

So food for thought here.

C-21 starts out as a "ban" and "buyback program" for "assault rifles" (which they suggest AR-15 variants are)

Then "Order In Council" adds it freezes handgun sales/transfers/imports/etc ... and that any center fire that holds more than 5 rounds, semi or not (like most Remington 870 or Mossberg 500 if you consider 1 & 3/4" shorties) is prohib... not even a freeze, no grandfathering, no buyback, no keeping until you die like handguns

Now single shots being added? And "variant" language? Like "we banned this random bolt action so any variant of a bolt action is banned" without definition of what variant is? Like any bolt action? Meh, the RCMP and judges bossed around by the feds will figure that all out later.

The federal government is more worried about pumps / levers that hold more than 5 than legal handguns, which neither are an issue?

Wtf is going on here. Some divide and conquer play against firearm owners for sure with the plan to take-give, but this is all very creepy.

I think the tactic here is with the 400 page "list" and banning a few single shot firearms is to make the debate about that, so gun owners and politicians defending gun owners will feel like they get a "win" if a few things are taken off the list, not realizing your average pump shotgun and many bolt actions are still banned by the general definition.

You know when you see CBC defending hunters this is a compromise deal, but the compromise will be short lived as long as the fine print exists. The "list" is a distraction.

Pretty bizarre right? Why are they worried more about levers and pumps that hold more than 5? No buyback, must be surrendered... handguns meh... you can keep em until you die that's fine, we'll collect em from your estate without compensation then, but taking away long guns you can shoot 100 yards is our to priority confiscate now.

Creepy.

I suppose when you consider our PM's own words it makes sense.

"I admire China's dictatorship and how it gives the ability to get things done"
"Canada is a country with no core identity or culture and will be the world's first post-national state"

His own words. You can look it up for yourselves.

Watching CPAC these days (I mean like the last several years) is pretty sad. Wouldn't it be nice if the speaker could say "Hey... you didn't answer the question, so answer the question or you're out" rather than booting out peeps who call out someone for lying or not answering a question. Anyone else watch this stuff live? It's brutal to watch, like dang this whole thing is a farce, makes WWE wrestling or soap opera stuff look more legit / better acting... and these are leaders of a country... good grief. Anyone see anything like this in their lifetime? I mean we have all seen politicians BS and major geopolitical stuff, but anything this far gone?

Seems like there is no legit discourse now... like "Okay you say you are banning assault/military rifles but why this single shot duck gun?" ... "To the opposition leader this is 30th anniversary of a massacre and we are doing our job to protect Canadian's from military assault style weapons unlike you guys who are paid for by the gun lobby thank you mister speaker!"

Anyone who states the obvious: "That is a lie"

Speaker: You're banned from the house for saying that and not apologizing. We can't call people out for things like blatantly lying. It messes up the whole acting script.

Yep.... this is our "country" now

Stay tuned for digital dollar, and digital ID and the resulting social credit system(real danger) if everybody does not band together and "just say no" (looks highly unlikely, but I try to always stay optimistic).

Distraction tactics for sure.

Your right caddis it is crazy times, acting sums it up pretty well, it isn't these "lEaDeRs" whose faces are on the tv coming up with this stuff. They aren't that smart but good at what they do for sure, the social engineering is mind boggling to say the least to what they have molded the population into in the last 20 years. Just look at the average family unit these days and divorce rates, the nuclear family is almost becoming a thing of the past. Too bad really. They are attacking way more than firearm ownership.

[browningboy]

Stay tuned for digital dollar, and digital ID and the resulting social credit system(real danger) if everybody does not band together and "just say no" (looks highly unlikely, but I try to always stay optimistic).

Distraction tactics for sure.

Your right caddis it is crazy times, acting sums it up pretty well, it isn't these "lEaDeRs" whose faces are on the tv coming up with this stuff. They aren't that smart but good at what they do for sure, the social engineering is mind boggling to say the least to what they have molded the population into in the last 20 years. Just look at the average family unit these days and divorce rates, the nuclear family is almost becoming a thing of the past. Too bad really. They are attacking way more than firearm ownership.

Very true indeed!

[TheObserver]

With trudeau saying things like "Canada is a country with no core identity or culture and will be the world's first post-national state"

It really makes one think that these puppet "leaders" race with each other to complete the agenda's and they get like a prize/bonus at the end lol

True scum of the earth and wouldn't want to be them on Judgement Day.

My 0.2 cents

[browningboy]

Surprised firearm owners in Ontario dont go and protest outside the parliament building? Actually not that surprised, it must just be a conspiracy theory, it will all be better soon! Lol

[browningboy]

With trudeau saying things like "Canada is a country with no core identity or culture and will be the world's first post-national state"

It really makes one think that these puppet "leaders" race with each other to complete the agenda's and they get like a prize/bonus at the end lol

True scum of the earth and wouldn't want to be them on Judgement Day.

My 0.2 cents


The thing is he needs the votes, the majority of the MPs support it? All getting paid off, and we will just stand by with our heads in the sand wondering what happened? Thinking it was all tinfoil hat conspiracy theories… you’ll see

[TheObserver]

The thing is he needs the votes, the majority of the MPs support it? All getting paid off, and we will just stand by with our heads in the sand wondering what happened? Thinking it was all tinfoil hat conspiracy theories… you’ll see

My opinion, again just my 0.2 cents. Is a very unpopular one, I am sure many guys on here will read this and shake their head at me lol. I do not think voting has mattered, for a long time Brother. Gives the populace the illusion that they actually have a say and make decisions and their opinions are important and in turn does not cause massive rebellion. These people never like to relinquish power. Things are still controlled, they just do it in a much smarter fashion than say 1000 or 500 years ago.

I don't have anything against voting, and would love it if I was wrong. But personally I don't think i'm far off.

[Brew]

Brew I don’t like Jag ! Is he not just saying this as it pertains to aboriginals ? He should be speaking for all of us ! More division ! Correct me if I’m wrong . I have an idea that they could drop yet another clause in there any one else guess what that might be ?
Arctic Lake

For sure it’s a setup for another racial two tier clause.

[HarryToolips]

Stay tuned for digital dollar, and digital ID and the resulting social credit system(real danger) if everybody does not band together and "just say no" (looks highly unlikely, but I try to always stay optimistic).

Distraction tactics for sure.

Your right caddis it is crazy times, acting sums it up pretty well, it isn't these "lEaDeRs" whose faces are on the tv coming up with this stuff. They aren't that smart but good at what they do for sure, the social engineering is mind boggling to say the least to what they have molded the population into in the last 20 years. Just look at the average family unit these days and divorce rates, the nuclear family is almost becoming a thing of the past. Too bad really. They are attacking way more than firearm ownership.
Yup and with the digital dollar and ID etc, comes more control...so were all going to have to combat this to the best of our abilities, and I hope that any members of the police and military that don't want to be pawns for a communist regime will join us....we need to refuse and resist...this is all part of the WEF's plan, UNagenda 2030...

[REMINGTON JIM]

For sure it’s a setup for another racial two tier clause.

Absolutely it’s there Agenda. ! :mad: RJ

[Arctic Lake]

Caddis you have made a lot of good points ! Why is it okay to never answer questions in Question Period and that’s okay ?But you state a fact like Raquel Dancho did and you get ejected from the house ?
Is should be mandatory to answer the question put forwarded to a member in the house !

The whole government system is corrupt ! It needs a whole revamp ! How could this be done I’m not sure but it needs to be done ! The elites have too much control . We are loosing everything gained since generations before us fought against such things when unjust kings ruled !
Arctic Lake
So food for thought here.

C-21 starts out as a "ban" and "buyback program" for "assault rifles" (which they suggest AR-15 variants are)

Then "Order In Council" adds it freezes handgun sales/transfers/imports/etc ... and that any center fire that holds more than 5 rounds, semi or not (like most Remington 870 or Mossberg 500 if you consider 1 & 3/4" shorties) is prohib... not even a freeze, no grandfathering, no buyback, no keeping until you die like handguns

Now single shots being added? And "variant" language? Like "we banned this random bolt action so any variant of a bolt action is banned" without definition of what variant is? Like any bolt action? Meh, the RCMP and judges bossed around by the feds will figure that all out later.

The federal government is more worried about pumps / levers that hold more than 5 than legal handguns, which neither are an issue?

Wtf is going on here. Some divide and conquer play against firearm owners for sure with the plan to take-give, but this is all very creepy.

I think the tactic here is with the 400 page "list" and banning a few single shot firearms is to make the debate about that, so gun owners and politicians defending gun owners will feel like they get a "win" if a few things are taken off the list, not realizing your average pump shotgun and many bolt actions are still banned by the general definition.

You know when you see CBC defending hunters this is a compromise deal, but the compromise will be short lived as long as the fine print exists. The "list" is a distraction.

Pretty bizarre right? Why are they worried more about levers and pumps that hold more than 5? No buyback, must be surrendered... handguns meh... you can keep em until you die that's fine, we'll collect em from your estate without compensation then, but taking away long guns you can shoot 100 yards is our to priority confiscate now.

Creepy.

I suppose when you consider our PM's own words it makes sense.

"I admire China's dictatorship and how it gives the ability to get things done"
"Canada is a country with no core identity or culture and will be the world's first post-national state"

His own words. You can look it up for yourselves.

Watching CPAC these days (I mean like the last several years) is pretty sad. Wouldn't it be nice if the speaker could say "Hey... you didn't answer the question, so answer the question or you're out" rather than booting out peeps who call out someone for lying or not answering a question. Anyone else watch this stuff live? It's brutal to watch, like dang this whole thing is a farce, makes WWE wrestling or soap opera stuff look more legit / better acting... and these are leaders of a country... good grief. Anyone see anything like this in their lifetime? I mean we have all seen politicians BS and major geopolitical stuff, but anything this far gone?

Seems like there is no legit discourse now... like "Okay you say you are banning assault/military rifles but why this single shot duck gun?" ... "To the opposition leader this is 30th anniversary of a massacre and we are doing our job to protect Canadian's from military assault style weapons unlike you guys who are paid for by the gun lobby thank you mister speaker!"

Anyone who states the obvious: "That is a lie"

Speaker: You're banned from the house for saying that and not apologizing. We can't call people out for things like blatantly lying. It messes up the whole acting script.

Yep.... this is our "country" now

[wideopenthrottle]

does anyone know when the last batch of NDP mps will qualify for their pension?....maybe that is when they will stop backing trudeau

[HarryToolips]

does anyone know when the last batch of NDP mps will qualify for their pension?....maybe that is when they will stop backing trudeau

They won't stop backing the Turd and the Libs because, they too are members of the WEF..

[Livewire322]

Hmmm. I think it better than doing nothing at all Livewire . Do you have suggestions ?
Arctic Lake
I disagree that it is better than nothing. It’s a waste of time, and that is arguably worse than nothing. Email campaigns are nothing more than a mental-masterbation exercise meant to make one feel like they’ve done something. As I wrote - and excuse to blame others for not having done enough when the inevitable conclusion comes about.


As Arctic said, what do you suggest? Also keep in mind that it doesn't take long to send an email to MP(s)..

Cheers,
Emails carry absolutely no weight. As someone who gets hundreds of emails a day for work, I can confidently say that the best way to engage with someone is a phone call or a meeting. Printed letters are a far second (simply because they stand out). Emails/form letters are nothing more than a virtue signaling exercise to make yourself feel good.


Caddis you have made a lot of good points ! Why is it okay to never answer questions in Question Period and that’s okay ?But you state a fact like Raquel Dancho did and you get ejected from the house ?
Is should be mandatory to answer the question put forwarded to a member in the house !

The whole government system is corrupt ! It needs a whole revamp ! How could this be done I’m not sure but it needs to be done ! The elites have too much control . We are loosing everything gained since generations before us fought against such things when unjust kings ruled !
Arctic Lake

To be clear, she called someone a liar, which is against parliamentary rules. She could’ve been smart about it and insinuated they were lying by saying “your version of the truth doesn’t match reality” or something creative like that, instead, she broke a rule and capitalized on the consequence.
Is the parliamentary game of never answering questions stupid? You bet! It’s mind numbing to watch any of the politicians banter back and forth with questions that are never answered.
Is breaking the rules and whining about the consequences the way to change things? No. That’s what the ****ing eco warriors do, and the general consensus on this forum is that those types of people are shyte, so why act like them?

If people are serious about making a change, they need to become involved politically. Show up at your MP’s office and talk with them, respectfully, about the issues you want solved. Writing a letter and washing your hands of the process is not the way to win. Show up to rallies, and if there isn’t a rally, organize one. If your MP is a twat about guns, engage with their competitor (or become their competitor) and campaign to get the MP out of office. We need more hardworking, common folk as politicians and less retired lawyers.

[wideopenthrottle]

They won't stop backing the Turd and the Libs because, they too are members of the WEF..

oh ya...i forgot about the bigger trough for those pigs to eat at

[Redthies]

Sooooo glad I don’t have kids. The world of the future is no place to live. I might take up smoking and go buy a pack of unfiltered Camels…

[Redthies]

And since you guys are likely more read up on “the list” than I am, where do muzzle loaders fall? Most are at or larger than .50 cal, so are they now prohibited? Can just see someone that owns one going on a rampage. They’d get at least 3 shots off per hour:roll: that might hit the side of a barn…

Does a .50 black powder make 10,000 joules? I highly doubt it.

[caddisguy]

And since you guys are likely more read up on “the list” than I am, where do muzzle loaders fall? Most are at or larger than .50 cal, so are they now prohibited? Can just see someone that owns one going on a rampage. They’d get at least 3 shots off per hour:roll: that might hit the side of a barn…

Does a .50 black powder make 10,000 joules? I highly doubt it.

It's not just about the list, it's about specs like bore diameter, joules, etc like you mention. There are more firearms that will be prohib by the wording in C21 than there are on the actual list. I think the list is a bit of a distraction from the catch-all language that catches way more. .50 black powder would have to check the bore diameter limit in the bill, but I think that is covered.

The bill seems to go as far as banning pump / lever / bolt actions that hold more than 5, even with tube mags. And in the case of pump action shotguns, anything that holds more than 3x 2 & 3/4" since 1 & 1/3" shorties are readily available and it would be able to hold more than 5 of those.

And then there is the term "variants" without any definition of what a "variant" is. They are leaving that open to later interpretation from the RCMP to decide what is a variant and such decisions would be decided by a judge at the expense of whoever gets charged and wants to fight it at their expense. We could find in the years to come that all bolt actions are banned because any bolt action is a variant of some other bolt action that happens to yield more than 10000 joules, or one that can accept a shorter barrel, or one that was marketed as "tactical", etc. The vague definitions are far more reaching than the list, which is very reaching in itself. So many backdoors open for mission creep to ban virtually any firearm.

This obviously isn't about public safety, so not much point trying to rationalize whether or not someone would / could feasibly use any of these firearms effectively to harm others. If you have been watching CPAC, every time an MP asks "You say you are not banning hunting rifles, then why are these SINGLE SHOT rifles being banned?" ... Minister of Public Safety always just jumps up and does his song and dance "We're taking these assault weapons designed to kill the most amount of people in the shortest amount of time and near the anniversary of the polytechnique massacre, how dare the conservatives disregard these victims in favor of the GUN LOBBY"

There is no logic what is being banned by this bill and definitely no logic when it comes to discourse in the house.

They just snuck in a last minute amendment to Bill C11 just like they did with C21 for total internet censorship. Seems to be a new tactic to completely change the scope of the bill before the final reading.

[Arctic Lake]

Yep I just don’t see where “You will own nothing and be happy “ is going to be a great place to live !
Sorry for the derail but I think it’s all connected .
Arctic Lake
Sooooo glad I don’t have kids. The world of the future is no place to live. I might take up smoking and go buy a pack of unfiltered Camels…

[Arctic Lake]

Caddis and others ! This whole Bill C21 is wrong ! It’s about disarmament ,no firearms in the hands of a countries citizens .The Liberal government are in the process of doing this . Anyone who has an ounce of active brain matter can see that the problem is not with what they banning and who owns them . It is individuals that are involved in crime and using illegally obtained firearms to commit crime that is the problem !
I detest this government !
Arctic Lake
It's not just about the list, it's about specs like bore diameter, joules, etc like you mention. There are more firearms that will be prohib by the wording in C21 than there are on the actual list. I think the list is a bit of a distraction from the catch-all language that catches way more. .50 black powder would have to check the bore diameter limit in the bill, but I think that is covered.

The bill seems to go as far as banning pump / lever / bolt actions that hold more than 5, even with tube mags. And in the case of pump action shotguns, anything that holds more than 3x 2 & 3/4" since 1 & 1/3" shorties are readily available and it would be able to hold more than 5 of those.

And then there is the term "variants" without any definition of what a "variant" is. They are leaving that open to later interpretation from the RCMP to decide what is a variant and such decisions would be decided by a judge at the expense of whoever gets charged and wants to fight it at their expense. We could find in the years to come that all bolt actions are banned because any bolt action is a variant of some other bolt action that happens to yield more than 10000 joules, or one that can accept a shorter barrel, or one that was marketed as "tactical", etc. The vague definitions are far more reaching than the list, which is very reaching in itself. So many backdoors open for mission creep to ban virtually any firearm.

This obviously isn't about public safety, so not much point trying to rationalize whether or not someone would / could feasibly use any of these firearms effectively to harm others. If you have been watching CPAC, every time an MP asks "You say you are not banning hunting rifles, then why are these SINGLE SHOT rifles being banned?" ... Minister of Public Safety always just jumps up and does his song and dance "We're taking these assault weapons designed to kill the most amount of people in the shortest amount of time and near the anniversary of the polytechnique massacre, how dare the conservatives disregard these victims in favor of the GUN LOBBY"

There is no logic what is being banned by this bill and definitely no logic when it comes to discourse in the house.

They just snuck in a last minute amendment to Bill C11 just like they did with C21 for total internet censorship. Seems to be a new tactic to completely change the scope of the bill before the final reading.

[Redthies]

I’m sure glad I sold every gun I had for huge profits back in the scare of 2019. I will fight for your rights my brothers!

[TheObserver]

Where is the gun clubs on this?

Wouldn't them communicating with each other nationwide, calling and or emailing members and organizing something be the most effective way to gather PAL holders that are against this? There is strength in numbers and voices

[tadpole]

copied from another forum

People say firearms owners should be willing to compromise.

Where has that got us? Or the general population?

Peaceful, responsible, and safety-conscious firearms owners:
Well, let's put some context around our answer first.

• In 1913, you required us to have a permit to carry a handgun.
We complied. There was no discernible reduction in violent crime.

• In 1920, you required us to have a permit to possess any firearm, regardless of where it was stored.
We complied. There was no discernible reduction in violent crime.

• In 1932, you required us to provide a reason (only two were permissible) for having a handgun.
We complied. There was no discernible reduction in violent crime.

• In 1934, you required us to locally register our handguns.
We complied. There was no discernible reduction in violent crime.

• In 1938, you required us to renew our registration every five years.
We complied. There was no discernible reduction in violent crime.

• In 1951, you required us to centrally register our handguns.
We complied. There was no discernible reduction in violent crime.

• In 1969, you designed the classification system so certain firearms could be prohibited on a whim.
We complied. There was no discernible reduction in violent crime.

• In 1977, you prohibited automatic firearms.
We complied. There was no discernible reduction in violent crime.

• In 1979, you introduced screening and safety courses.
We complied. There was no discernible reduction in violent crime.

• By 1994, you required a photo and two references to apply for a Firearms Acquisition Certificate, imposed a mandatory 28 day waiting period, made safety courses mandatory, expanded the background check and screening, reclassified certain firearms, introduced regulations for storage, transportation, and use, and prohibited standard capacity magazines.
We complied. There was no discernible reduction in violent crime.

• In 1995, you introduced licensing to have and buy firearms, and to buy ammunition.
We complied. There was no discernible reduction in violent crime.

• In 1996, you required us to get your Authorization to Transport certain firearms, and authorizations to carry certain firearms in very limited conditions.
We complied. There was no discernible reduction in violent crime.

• In 1997, you regulated shooting clubs, shooting ranges, and gun shows.
We complied. There was no discernible reduction in violent crime.

• In 2001, licensing became mandatory.
We complied. There was no discernible reduction in violent crime.

• In 2003, you required all firearms to be registered.
We complied. There was no discernible reduction in violent crime.

• In 2015, you introduced firearms prohibitions for those convicted of domestic violence.
We complied. There was no discernible reduction in violent crime.

• In 2019, you passed C-71, which would pave the way for circumventing parliament, and to ignore the experts' analyses (law enforcement, firearms functional experts, community groups, etc.)which you claimed to base policies on, in any further restrictions.
We complied. There was no discernible reduction in violent crime.

• In 2020, you prohibited some 1500 models of firearms for absolutely no reason than political pandering and cowardice in addressing escalating violent crime.
We complied. There was no discernible reduction in violent crime.

• In 2021, you reduced judicial consequences for those illegally using their illegally acquired and already prohibited firearms.
It didn't affect us, as it didn't apply to us, and violent crime rates continued to climb at an alarming rate.

• In 2022, you banned the sale, purchase, and transfer of handguns.
We complied. Violent crime rates continued to climb.

• Also in 2022, you proposed this latest piece of absolutely useless, enormously costly, and completely counter-productive measure of prohibiting even hunting rifles and shotguns, even though the statistical significance of them or their owners being involved in violent crime registered at the extreme right of the decimal place.

And yet violent crime continues to escalate.

So, what compromises or concessions are we willing to make at this point in what has been over a hundred years of faulty logic, intentionally deceptive public messaging, malicious and misdirected prosecution, and bad faith negotiations, while completely ignoring the contributing factors and root causes of those most at risk of violent behavioral trajectories, AND increasing your leniency for those who actually commit horrifically violent crimes?

Absolutely none...

[browningboy]

The answer is the same on many threads, “It’s a conspiracy theory, take off your tin hat”

[wideopenthrottle]

and if anyone had any doubt about ontario and its dreamy adoration of trudeau and his handouts look at the Mississauga byelection....disgusting is all i can say

[HarryToolips]

and if anyone had any doubt about ontario and its dreamy adoration of trudeau and his handouts look at the Mississauga byelection....disgusting is all i can say
Yup, dumb, lost sheep they are....as mentioned by another member in a different thread, we should all look to support the Maverick party and separate with Alberta, maybe Saskatchewan wants to join...problem is in BC we have too many Libtard-NDP supporters on the coast and Island...perhaps they can be the new Canadian version of Alaska if they don't want to join the rest of BC and the West that would most likely be proponents of separation..

[spock]

The issue isn't one between the provinces, most of ontario outside of toronto is solid blue, when my brother lived in rural ontario he said it wasn't much different culturally than Alberta. The real issue is Canada's population is one of the most urbanized in the world. Where I live in the Fraser Valley I hear gunshots almost everyday during waterfowl season, some of them not far from my workplace and I don't even bat an eye, in that context gunshots are not scary, if I lived in a dense urban area people would notice because it would be something bad happening, add to that we have ciities full of immigrants that have left countries that are quite violent. Do I agree with C-21? Absolutely not. Is this type of thing likely to shore up Liberal support in our 3 biggest cities? Yes do they need rural support to win elections? No they have won 3 without it.

[Harvest the Land]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZKrPm4I4Xdo&t=887s

[browningboy]

Just don’t comply.

[TheObserver]

Just don’t comply.

^ most powerful way to beat this, i'm hoping many will

[Bigdoggdon]

You watch. The Libs will back down on the C-21 "Ammendment" and say after listening to the public they'll admit the Ammendment went too far and make it sound like they're doing us a favor. Meanwhile they'll still put through the initial OIC ban and the handgun ban.

[TheObserver]

You watch. The Libs will back down on the C-21 "Ammendment" and say after listening to the public they'll admit the Ammendment went too far and make it sound like they're doing us a favor. Meanwhile they'll still put through the initial OIC ban and the handgun ban.

100 percent they are slimeballs

[tadpole]

Trudeau's attempt at gun control so bad that it's shockingIt was just about a month ago that the Trudeau Liberals made a decision that derailed a piece of legislation that was broadly popular. In the ensuing weeks, it’s been shocking to watch how badly they’ve handled this situation.


Bill C-21, sold to the public as a way to enact a handgun freeze and to ban what the government describes as “military-style assault weapons,” had strong public backing. That is, until the Liberals went too far and added hundreds of hunting rifles and shotguns to the banned list.


“Our intent with this legislation is to target guns designed for the battlefield, not once commonly used for hunting,” Trudeau said.



The problem is, of course, that his legislation — and amendments his own government tabled on their own bill — do target hunting rifles and shotguns. His government has also had horrible messaging on this from the start, telling people they were lying despite a list in black and white showing the indisputable truth.


“All Canadians want to see less gun violence in this country, that’s what we’re going to deliver,” Trudeau said Wednesday while defending his bill.


I wish that were true because no one wants more gun crime except the criminals; Trudeau’s plan won’t deliver though. He’s made it easier for criminals to get bail, scrapped mandatory minimum sentences for gun smuggling and using a gun in the commission of a crime, while making life more difficult for law-abiding, licensed gun owners.


If the hundreds of gun models added to the banned list remain there, it will also push up the cost of the government’s gun buyback program. That was said to cost a few hundred million when first announced but that figure was estimated to be just over $1 billion before these new guns were added.


It could rise to several billion dollars if the government extends compensation for the ban.


At every step of the way, the Trudeau government has shown that they didn’t really think their plans through on this file. The amendments and addition of hunting guns to the banned list was another example of this.


Allowing this issue to linger over Christmas and into the new year is nothing less than shockingly bad politics.


https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/other/lilley-trudeau-s-attempt-at-gun-control-so-bad-that-it-s-shocking/ar-AA15hvTq

[Harvest the Land]

Just in case any of you needed another reason to move to Alberta

https://thecountersignal.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/12/albertansenough-1024x576.jpg

Alberta seizes power from ‘hostile’ federal government’s gun grab

Alberta Attorney General Tyler Shandro issued a stern notice to the Trudeau Liberals, announcing the province is seizing back constitutional power from the feds to protect legal gun-owners from being persecuted under Bill C-21.

“First, as Alberta’s attorney general, I have directed that the Alberta crown prosecution service takeover the handling of charges involving the Firearms Act starting January 1st 2023.”

He said as things currently stand, the federal government handles these matters.

Shandro’s announcement on Wednesday effectively protects legal gun owners from suddenly becoming criminals if Bill C-21 comes into force.

This is absolutely massive. A sitting attorney general of a province has now openly said that a federal law will not be enforced in Alberta. The Rubicon has been crossed.

We can only hope that Alberta and other provinces continue to stand up to Trudeau and his ridiculous and increasingly tyrannical policies and laws.

Alberta seizes power from ‘hostile' federal government's gun grab - The Counter Signal (https://thecountersignal.com/alberta-seizes-power-from-hostile-federal-government/?utm_source=The+Counter+Signal&utm_campaign=96654dd678-EMAIL_CAMPAIGN_2022_12_15_09_13&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_-96654dd678-%5BLIST_EMAIL_ID%5D)

[Dannybuoy]

Just in case any of you needed another reason to move to Alberta

https://thecountersignal.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/12/albertansenough-1024x576.jpg

Alberta seizes power from ‘hostile’ federal government’s gun grab

Alberta Attorney General Tyler Shandro issued a stern notice to the Trudeau Liberals, announcing the province is seizing back constitutional power from the feds to protect legal gun-owners from being persecuted under Bill C-21.

“First, as Alberta’s attorney general, I have directed that the Alberta crown prosecution service takeover the handling of charges involving the Firearms Act starting January 1st 2023.”

He said as things currently stand, the federal government handles these matters.

Shandro’s announcement on Wednesday effectively protects legal gun owners from suddenly becoming criminals if Bill C-21 comes into force.

This is absolutely massive. A sitting attorney general of a province has now openly said that a federal law will not be enforced in Alberta. The Rubicon has been crossed.

We can only hope that Alberta and other provinces continue to stand up to Trudeau and his ridiculous and increasingly tyrannical policies and laws.

Alberta seizes power from ‘hostile' federal government's gun grab - The Counter Signal (https://thecountersignal.com/alberta-seizes-power-from-hostile-federal-government/?utm_source=The+Counter+Signal&utm_campaign=96654dd678-EMAIL_CAMPAIGN_2022_12_15_09_13&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_-96654dd678-%5BLIST_EMAIL_ID%5D)
Maybe everyone should send this to their MLA , especially those with NDP reps

[tadpole]

Alberta says it will take control of prosecutions for banned firearms from Ottawa

Alberta’s justice minister says provincial prosecutors are to take over the handling of charges under the federal Firearms Act starting in the new year.

Tyler Shandro says he is also advising Alberta’s prosecutors that the province does not consider it to be in the public interest to go after law-abiding owners of banned weapons – although he can’t tell them when to lay charges.

Shandro says he has written to his federal counterpart, David Lametti, to advise him of the change starting Jan. 1 and says it is being done using existing constitutional rules and does not involve Alberta’s recently passed sovereignty act.

Shandro says he is advising prosecutors that if they plan to charge someone for having a banned weapon, they should consider whether the person owned the weapon before the ban and whether the owner is being charged with crimes related to using it.

He says the aim is to prevent criminalizing people who bought the guns in good faith before the ban and continue to use them responsibly.

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/canada/alberta/article-alberta-says-it-will-take-control-of-prosecutions-for-banned-firearms/

https://edmonton.ctvnews.ca/alberta-says-it-will-take-control-of-prosecutions-for-banned-firearms-from-ottawa-1.6196567

https://calgary.citynews.ca/2022/12/15/alberta-firearms-act-gun-ban/

[Harvest the Land]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3jOJ-h4HbkI

[tadpole]

Attorney general issues protocol to Crown prosecutors

Alberta’s attorney general has issued a protocol for dealing with charges related to the federal firearms ban.
“Albertans should not automatically be considered criminals because they own a firearm that was legally purchased and possessed. This new protocol for prosecutors will help prevent otherwise law-abiding individuals from facing criminal charges and potential time in jail. At the same time, law enforcement and prosecution resources can be prioritized for actual violent and repeat offenders while not further clogging our already busy courts.”

Tyler Shandro, Minister of Justice

[Harvest the Land]

People who know nothing about firearms should never be in a position to regulate firearms. Pretty unreal to see a member of the State media really biting the hand that feeds


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8fRhgk9LZ1Q&t=328s

[Ourea]

With trudeau saying things like " Canada is a country with no core identity or culture and will be the world's first post-national state"

It really makes one think that these puppet "leaders" race with each other to complete the agenda's and they get like a prize/bonus at the end lol

True scum of the earth and wouldn't want to be them on Judgement Day.

My 0.2 cents

^^^^^^^^^^
How about that one.

My challenge to Trudeau's BS line is why are FN being treated like they run the country. You can't start any public school day without recognizing FN entitlement. Go to any municipal activity, pretty much every corporation has banners up, FN recognition on printed materials. ( I am going somewhere with this ).....As it was stated here, reservations and FN in general, can possess pretty much any prohibited and restricted weapons.

These will end up into Canadian communities and gangs. Gangs are bringing prohibited weapons on their own as well. All this ridiculous bill does is create more demand in the illegal markets and crush legal ownership. I would be so pissed if I had a gun shop, being legislated of business is BS.

FN with the AR15 excemption

[180grainer]

Just don’t comply.
That's what has to happen. Even if this bill was stopped, the intention of disarming law abiding Canadians would continue and you'd find yourself right back here again at some point. If a substantial number of Canadians refused to comply, there's absolutely nothing the Government could do about it. They can't arrest everyone or throw everyone in jail and eventually they'd look like a bunch of freaking morons. Even more so than they already do.

[180grainer]

People who know nothing about firearms should never be in a position to regulate firearms. Pretty unreal to see a member of the State media really biting the hand that feeds


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8fRhgk9LZ1Q&t=328s
Mendicino is such a bag of shit.

[Ourea]

Over 7,000,000 Wichester model 94's sold. I don't have any breakdown for Canada or what percentage have the longer barrels that will accommodate 6 rounds.
It is one of the most popular guns ever made.

Here is the kicker..... a model 94 30.30 was used in the highly reported murder in Ottawa in 2014.
Coincidence that the model 94 is being targeted ?

[Arctic Lake]

Trudeau and his ilk can pound sand ! All the violent crime going on involving illegally obtained firearms is not being committed by US !
Arctic Lake

[Bustercluck]

I’m still shocked about the ruger #1. I can understand the concept of banning the 10k joules thing even though I don’t agree with it, but come on man. A single shot falling block in 6.5 creedmoor(or similar) being banned.

The liberals must’ve watched quigley down under and started pissing their pants.

[Arctic Lake]

Let’s get B.C. to do the same !
Arctic Lake
Attorney general issues protocol to Crown prosecutors

Alberta’s attorney general has issued a protocol for dealing with charges related to the federal firearms ban.
“Albertans should not automatically be considered criminals because they own a firearm that was legally purchased and possessed. This new protocol for prosecutors will help prevent otherwise law-abiding individuals from facing criminal charges and potential time in jail. At the same time, law enforcement and prosecution resources can be prioritized for actual violent and repeat offenders while not further clogging our already busy courts.”

Tyler Shandro, Minister of Justice

[Gateholio]

I’m still shocked about the ruger #1. I can understand the concept of banning the 10k joules thing even though I don’t agree with it, but come on man. A single shot falling block in 6.5 creedmoor(or similar) being banned.

The liberals must’ve watched quigley down under and started pissing their pants.

It's not that shocking if you understand that Liberals have long desired the complete disarmament of Canadians.

NONE of the gun control measures over the last 100 years have resulted in a reduction of crime, and they know it. So why do they do it? Disarmament and votes from the ignorant.

[Bigdoggdon]

You watch. The Libs will back down on the C-21 "Ammendment" and say after listening to the public they'll admit the Ammendment went too far and make it sound like they're doing us a favor. Meanwhile they'll still put through the initial OIC ban and the handgun ban.

Yep, called it

[Arctic Lake]

I would like to see a complete reversal of the handgun freeze / ban . It does nothing to stop criminals from using them in crime !
Arctic Lake

[Redthies]

I would like to see a complete reversal of the handgun freeze / ban . It does nothing to stop criminals from using them in crime !
Arctic Lake

Look at CCFR supplied stats: gang violence up 92% and violent crime up 33% since Turd took control…