opinions, dump or not to dump

[Sikanni Stalker]

Hey all, this year I came back from guiding with my meat. 1 Buffalo and one moose. Shot the buff on Oct. 26 and the moose on Oct 31. I hung the meat from their kill dates in the airplane hanger until I left on the 5th. I went straight to the butcher(I ususally do this myself but this year I had to get back to work as I was up there almost two months.....anyway) I told the guy what I wanted and told him how long I had been hanging for and he said to me "somtime next week". Well I called the guy yesterday and asked him if my meat was ready and he says" not yet," he has been real busy. My dilema is I know bloody well that this meat should not be in a locker for a month in quarters. When I do my own stuff it is 10 days max. He claims he has everything"almost" frozen, but this can't be true either. What do I do, tell him to keep it, will it be wrecked? Sour?
It just seems he has done everything you shouldn't do. There is 1000 lbs or more there.

TIA

[Thunderstix]

That has been a little long for sure, but honestly I would not give up hope. If it were bad he most likely would have told you so. I think I would however drop by and check it out before you let him cut and wrap it.

[elkdom]

A lot of beef is aged 28 days, if it hasnt gotten warm , and it was cooled out proper after the kill there should not be aproblem!

[Dale]

I've hung moose for 28 days and it was fine. Only thing is there is a bit of waste because the outside layer dries out and is no good, but other than that it should be really tender.

[Murder]

Hang it till it falls down, proceed to scoop into bucket, and hang again. Should be fine eats.

[bruin]

I would agree, the outer crust will protect the inner tissue preventing spoilage. There are old stories of people hanging for extended periods and cutting the outer green layer off and eating the meat underneath. It will depend on the temperature of the cooler as well. Nearly frozen shoudl be fine

[Gateholio]

If it was cooled down prior to hanging, and the cooler is 4 degrees C or less, meat can hang for a long time, a month or more. 28 days is standard for beef, some places age it more.

[hunter1947]

I would trust the butcher ,if he has been in the business for a long time ,i hunted with a butcher years back ,he said that he sometimes convinced others to hang meat for up to 30 plus days ,but you have to have your cooler spot on for temperatures ,he said his cooler never got above 4+c and the low was 0 c. I would say your meat would be fine as long as the temperatures are not to hi in his cooler.

[p&p]

The Key Here Is The Cooler Temp. And What You Did Up North ,30 Days In A Well Vented Cooler Is Not Too Long For Me (ill Take 100 Lbs Of That Gone Bad Buff. I`ll Even Come & Get It .) L.o.l.

[Nooker77]

It should be fine..temp is the key...I dont think he would want 1000lbs of spoiled meat hanging in his cooler with all his beef/prk and other goodies with all the hastle meat cutters are going through tese days!! I would ask to see it before you spend your hard earned money on the c/w/f!! Good luck and good eatin this winter!!
Cheers!

[Tikka7mm]

I'd have to agree with Nooker. I don't think your butcher would want spoiled meat hanging in his cooler with all the other meat. If he says that he has your meat almost frozen then it should be good eating just as long as it was dealt with properly to begin with (ie cooled it down as soon as possible after the harvest and didn't let it get warm again). I would definitley want to see it myself before I paid for it. 1000.00 pounds of meat is substantial cost. It would be a real shame to waste that much buff and moose...those are two tasty animals. Good luck. I hope it works out for you.

[Will]

Aged = Yummy ! :D
No worries it will be the best Meat you've had I'm sure;-)

[eastkoot]

Why not go to the butchers and take a "sample" of each animal and try it before you spend the cash to have it processed ?? A few loin steaks from each should be a good indication..

[Sikanni Stalker]

Well thanks gang!, I was starting to panick a bit but like you all have said it should be fine. I know we have had the debate over hanging time s in here a few times, but his cooler is pretty good, he's a clean butcher and for sure he wouldn't want any rank meat in his cooler.

As for my part in it, both animals were skinned and hanging within a couple hours of the kill, and they were quartered within 1 hour as well.

Thanks again!

[Sikanni Stalker]

Well gang, the date is now the 9th of Dec. This guy still isn't done. He says moose is almost done, and the buff that was supposed to all be different sausages types, is frozen solid as burger. Not packaged by the way, just in a few totes. Now the sausage that is smoked may be ok, but the fresh stuff, won't it be rank now that it is frozen and then he'll thaw it to process and then re-freeze? This is getting rediculous. It hink he heas done this on purpose. Can I call the CO or somthing.

[M.Dean]

I wonder if you told him your going to post his name on this web site, and let everyone know what kind of work he does or could you phone and talk to another butcher, or someone that knows the business!!! Any one else in the area had a problem with this guy?

[Thunderstix]

Wow, this is getting wierd for sure.

[Will]

Well gang, the date is now the 9th of Dec. This guy still isn't done. He says moose is almost done, and the buff that was supposed to all be different sausages types, is frozen solid as burger. Not packaged by the way, just in a few totes. Now the sausage that is smoked may be ok, but the fresh stuff, won't it be rank now that it is frozen and then he'll thaw it to process and then re-freeze? This is getting rediculous. It hink he heas done this on purpose. Can I call the CO or somthing.
Well yep now I'd be abit concerned.....:-?

[boxhitch]

If its frozen hard, it isn't aging (rotting). There is a risk of contamination when thawing for processing, but no diff than fresh meat.
Myself, I would consider it all sausage meat. Have him keep the various aged batches seperate, for taste comparison.
I have some doubt if you will actually be getting your own meat back, just make sure the volume is clear and correct.

[3kills]

Well gang, the date is now the 9th of Dec. This guy still isn't done. He says moose is almost done, and the buff that was supposed to all be different sausages types, is frozen solid as burger. Not packaged by the way, just in a few totes. Now the sausage that is smoked may be ok, but the fresh stuff, won't it be rank now that it is frozen and then he'll thaw it to process and then re-freeze? This is getting rediculous. It hink he heas done this on purpose. Can I call the CO or somthing.
this guys sounds like an idiot and it is guys like him that give butchers a bad name... as for the refreezing as long as it is frozen solid it should be fine alot of butchers that make sauseage freezer it and do it later in the slow time...

[Wildfoot]

when you get it.. leave it outside for a few days at -10 or lower and it should kill off most germs. even if its been refrozen a couple of times. My sausage meat last year was refrozen twice before being ground and turned into sausage. No one has died yet...........

[pointandshoot]

sorry wildfoot but i'm gonna have to disagree with you there. freezing only slows down bacteria growth does not kill it, the only way to kill bacteria is by heat. if you were to take a piece of meat and freeze it, then thaw it at a later date, the bacteria would pretty much pick up where it left off.

[Walksalot]

If the cooler is properly designed and operated then there should be no problem hanging an animal like a moose or buffalo for a month. If it were a deer then dehydration could be an issue.
Grinding sausage meat into burger and then freezing it is done but if I understand it correctly the sausage meat should be frozen in chunks and then ground at the time of making sausage.

[hunter1947]

Well gang, the date is now the 9th of Dec. This guy still isn't done. He says moose is almost done, and the buff that was supposed to all be different sausages types, is frozen solid as burger. Not packaged by the way, just in a few totes. Now the sausage that is smoked may be ok, but the fresh stuff, won't it be rank now that it is frozen and then he'll thaw it to process and then re-freeze? This is getting rediculous. It hink he heas done this on purpose. Can I call the CO or somthing.
Hell no ,i have had frozen meat in the freezer for two years ,i then have to do something with it so i take it out of the freezer and take it to the butcher keep it frozen when you take it to the butcher. Then get him to make it into peperonies and sausages. I have done this for 40 years and never had a problem ,tastes as good as the day i shot the animal.http://www.huntingbc.ca/forum/images/icons/icon12.gif.

[3kills]

If the cooler is properly designed and operated then there should be no problem hanging an animal like a moose or buffalo for a month. If it were a deer then dehydration could be an issue.
Grinding sausage meat into burger and then freezing it is done but if I understand it correctly the sausage meat should be frozen in chunks and then ground at the time of making sausage.
yes usually it is frozen in chunks or pieces of trim or whatever but some times u do have ground that is turned into sausage...like was said as long as it was get cold while it gets thawed enough to finish the sausage makin it should be fine....it has to stay out of the danger zone....

[Blktail]

Your steaks at the Keg are aged 28 days.
You shpould be OK. Probably won't even get sick.:wink:

[mrdoog]

I'd like to see some pictures of the .5 ton of meat.

[boonerbuck]

DUMP IT!!!!!!

....in my freezer!!

[Farmer]

I would be very concerned about the meat. A beef can hang for 28 days but beef are killed in a controlled environment. They are stunned or head shot and bled immediately. Wild game tends to be shot elsewhere so blood penetration of muscle etc is a good possibilty. Also large wild game normally is gutted and quartered on the ground so there is a possibility for some contamination. I am not suggesting that you did not take good care of your meat or make a poor shot, but a month is a long time for wild meat to hang. I would find a new butcher in the future.
Gord

[MEATMAN30_06]

sounds to me your butcher has taken on to much to handle, there is no way game should hang for a month? 7-10 days max! it's not going to get any more tender. what ends up happening is you loose more meat in the bone can. as far As you're meat being eatable? if the temp. was controlled,? and the cutter did a good job buy cutting away all the grossness it should be fine. but for sure you wont get back as much usable meat as what you would have if it was cut sooner.

[Wildman]

sorry wildfoot but i'm gonna have to disagree with you there. freezing only slows down bacteria growth does not kill it, the only way to kill bacteria is by heat. if you were to take a piece of meat and freeze it, then thaw it at a later date, the bacteria would pretty much pick up where it left off.

pointandshoot is correct, see link.

http://www.uga.edu/nchfp/questions/FAQ_freezing.html#7

Does freezing kill germs?
Freezing does not kill all bacteria, yeasts and molds present in food, but it does prevent their multiplication if the food is held at 0°F or less. When thawed, the surviving organisms can multiply again.

How did it turn out by the way?

[hunter1947]

I have been told that bacteria grows in all meat and if you don't want to get sick cook it so it is well done. Some people think they got a one day flue at times ,most cases it is because of the food they eat the day before that was carring the bacteria.

[Upearly]

I agree with what hunter1947 said regarding people not realizing that usually the "24 hour flu" is a direct result of recently ingested food being "off". To add to this: I was taught that ptomaine poisoning, from dairy and meat (esp. pork) products, is the mildest and most common form of food poisoning, and can be avoided by killing the growing bacteria with enough heat while cooking. With poultry products, however, the bacteria (salmonella) are also killed by heat but you still get VERY sick because the toxins present in the organism are still there and are NOT destroyed by heat. Cooking it well will still not prevent you from getting sick from it. This also applies to botulism (the worst and most dangerous type) which can occur from improperly sealed canned goods.

[ryanb]

I feel bad for the few honest and quality butchers there are out there...but there are just TOO many that do poor work, steal meat, and overcharge. I personally can't take meat to a butcher anymore because of bad experiences...

[Will]

I feel bad for the few honest and quality butchers there are out there...but there are just TOO many that do poor work, steal meat, and overcharge. I personally can't take meat to a butcher anymore because of bad experiences...
Sadly this is more and more the norm..........:-(

[Gateholio]

I just heard the other day abotu a butcher in Abbotsford who has been charged with all sort of wildlife infractions, including accepting illegal meat and selling meat...

Apparently this was a major bust. Well done on the CO's part, IMHO!!

One of the problems with the butchers is that they get busy all at once (with wild and domestic animals being slaughtered at similar times) and have storage, hanging, freezer issues. And then there is the other thing- Most hunters don't want to pay a decent amount to have their animals butchered- Which means corner cutting- And practices such as mixing everyones meat together to make sausages.

[meat keeper]

I talked to my butcher and hunting buddy he tells me 7 to 10 days for deer.when it comes to larger game 21 to 28 days is perfect .longer than that and you will lose alot not that you should dump it just dump this guy as your butcher

[tooley]

probably ok I'd find a new butcher

[RiverOtter]

My butcher cuts my game within 3 days of me delivering it. I asked him about hanging it longer to age it and he said it is not like a beef. Elk,moose and deer don't have marbling(fat speckled throughout the meat) or significant fat covering, compared to beef for example and thus dry out more when hanging.

Now, I am not a butcher, but I can say from experience that my wild game is pretty tender and tasty. I do my aging in marinade if I want my meat softer. YMMV

PS, I would be very concerned if I my meat had been treated the way Sikanni Stalkers was/is. That is a shitt load of meat and you pay good money to have it cut; I'd be pizzed.

RO

[Iron-Head]

My grandpa said they used to hang pheasants by the head until the body rotted free from the neck, only then was it considered good to eat.:redface:
Your meat should be fine assuming it has been kept in a proper storage container and at a good temperature.

[longleader]

I agree with what hunter1947 said regarding people not realizing that usually the "24 hour flu" is a direct result of recently ingested food being "off". To add to this: I was taught that ptomaine poisoning, from dairy and meat (esp. pork) products, is the mildest and most common form of food poisoning, and can be avoided by killing the growing bacteria with enough heat while cooking. With poultry products, however, the bacteria (salmonella) are also killed by heat but you still get VERY sick because the toxins present in the organism are still there and are NOT destroyed by heat. Cooking it well will still not prevent you from getting sick from it. This also applies to botulism (the worst and most dangerous type) which can occur from improperly sealed canned goods.

So true, most of the short lived "gut" problems can be traced back to something we ate.

I do think the botilism toxin is heat sensitive; that is, cooking at a proper temp. for the correct time will neutralize the stuff. That is why it is recommended that home canned low acid foods be cooked prior to eating. Still scares me though, bad stuff.

[scottgreen]

just keep it cooled properly and it'll be fine :P

[Wildman]

Whatever happened to your meat? It has been almost a month since your post.

[Blktail]

Longleader

BOTULISM TOXIN CAN'T BE MADE SAFE WITH HEAT!

Heating during the canning process will kill the botulinium bacteria. If it is not killed, it will grow and produce the botulism toxin. The toxin is not destroted by reheating or cooking. That is what has made it such a dangerous toxin. Fortunately botulism is not usually a problem with spoiled fresh meat. It requires an anoxic environment to grow (inside a can for example). The problems from spoiled meat are different and result from infection with salmonella and many other nasties, most of which can be killed with cooking. I am not sure if any of the other bugs make nasty toxins.

[Will]

This thread gave me the runs..........