Elk..... or, Moose?

[TheObserver]

Started scouting this weekend, and will be going back every second weekend and learning as much about the land, and finding the sign, and maybe even catching a glimpse, as I am able to before opening to zero in on the few spots in the larger area that I think I may be able to make something happen.

I was wondering what your guys take on these rubs are, if you guys can tell if they are Elk or Moose, there are also WT and MD here but I hear the Deer go lower before the rut(MD anyway), but may not be accurate. Anyhow some of these rubs are much to large to be Deer. On this one sidehill in particular as you will see whatever this is is ATTACKING the Birch/Aspen(not sure which trees they are).

I know Elk tines are sharp and Moose dull, I don't have much experience differntiating the two in terms of their sign (rubs/scat/tracks) I have only been a Deer hunter up until this year.

https://i.imgur.com/hs6C54h.jpg?1

https://i.imgur.com/UZqFDH9.jpg?1

https://i.imgur.com/KMlw1VO.jpg?1

https://i.imgur.com/3K2FrDB.jpg?1

https://i.imgur.com/svFu25Y.jpg?1

All last years, found some ones from the year before and previous years, some don't look that tall in the photos but some were as tall or taller than me and I am 6'3.

Also the scat I have found I am sure there are both Elk and Moose, Elk seems to be more shorter and rounder and more of a teardrop shape with dimple? Where as most of the Moose scat I have found over the years tend to be like the shape of the tip of my inner middle finger

[TheObserver]

https://i.imgur.com/RhDA5hN.jpg?1

https://i.imgur.com/fvl1HEQ.jpg?1

https://i.imgur.com/2FBPkWS.jpg?1

https://i.imgur.com/Sd4i398.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/v4ykAUs.jpg

[TheObserver]

https://i.imgur.com/rAdiaz4.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/lEt264c.jpg

And this track? I think it's Elk not Moose not sure though. If anybody could weigh in it would be greatly appreciated!

[HarryToolips]

You are correct on the general description of the scat but, I have seen moose for example have scat that looks like that of elk, because of how much water was in their forage at the time...proven by trail cams...

Also, whitetails will generally rut lower in elevation than MD, but it's not always the case..

Based on the pics, the habitat looks more like elk preferred habitat ? I'd hang a cam or two to confirm..

[TheObserver]

You are correct on the general description of the scat but, I have seen moose for example have scat that looks like that of elk, because of how much water was in their forage at the time...proven by trail cams...

Also, whitetails will generally rut lower in elevation than MD, but it's not always the case..

Based on the pics, the habitat looks more like elk preferred habitat ? I'd hang a cam or two to confirm..

I thought so, I seen my first confirmed Elk scat this year at a BT spot because no Moose only Rosie Elk and BT are there. That makes sense! also sometimes it is kind of clumped together I guess when certain food/conditions make it that way with Deer and Elk.

That is what I am after so I hope so! first time going up there and I was able to locate some pretty good stuff so hopefully it keeps getting better as I get up there more and work harder at it, I put one cam up a little further up the valley with a trail heading down a ridge with what I think was Elk poo, so fresh it was wet and smelled! piles like that all over this sidehill. Not as many rubs though, But I will put up a cam where I found all these rubs.

Whatever has been thrashing those trees he has been doing it in the same spot for several years or other Bulls have been.

First time using cams this year, I can't believe I am just finding these now they are SO cool man! hahah love using them!

[HarryToolips]

Cams are fun for sure...is this in an area with an elk GOS? Generally with elk, not only is habitat key, but getting away from pressure is important, so if it's an area away from roads you could be in business...learn the gutless method if you haven't already..

[TheObserver]

Cams are fun for sure...is this in an area with an elk GOS? Generally with elk, not only is habitat key, but getting away from pressure is important, so if it's an area away from roads you could be in business...learn the gutless method if you haven't already..

Are they ever! Yes GO (hopefully still that way when the bloody regs come out!) There is area there that has no roads and is hard to access, I have seen videos on it but will study it now, thanks!

[HarryToolips]

You're welcome, good luck!

[walks with deer]

Track is elk.

[high horse Hal]

going out on a limb, I'd say elk rubs

[hunterdon]

Although a few photos are a little difficult to call without closer inspection preferably in person. But, definitely not moose. Rubs are way too low. Some rubs are definitely deer and some may be elk. Elk and moose rub much earlier in the fall because they rut much earlier, and deer not until late October/November.

However, deer, elk and moose will rub the velvet off their antlers usually in August. Sometimes in early September also.

Track looks like a younger elk. Female is my call. Some trees in photos are Poplar (the nice smooth greenish bark) and some are balsam fir (the blister like bark). A few others are a little difficult to call without closer inspection. Most likely that balsam fir photo was up higher elevation, where balsam fir like to grow.

Hope that helps..

[browningboy]

Agree with the above post ^^, rubs are too low for a moose so elk and deer are my bet..

[wideopenthrottle]

first couple of trees were alders... definite elk print (more cow like with rounded toes than moose or deer which are more pointy)...looks like a great spot

[TheObserver]

Hey thanks for the replies guys! Any information does help, I can not wait to get back up there next week, and to check the cam

[HarryToolips]

Just remember they may not be there all year long, the key is the right place at the right time...

[TheObserver]

Just remember they may not be there all year long, the key is the right place at the right time...

Yeah these Elk definitely go lower to a wintering grounds I have seen them there in Nov, that is why I am trying to find rubs and rut activity so hopefully they will be there or at that elevation close by come Sept-Oct.

I will be spending a lot of time scouting until opening, every second weekend for sure and maybe more if i'm able too. Soak up and learn as much as I can and hopefully find where they will be

[J_T]

Yeah these Elk definitely go lower to a wintering grounds I have seen them there in Nov, that is why I am trying to find rubs and rut activity so hopefully they will be there or at that elevation close by come Sept-Oct.

I will be spending a lot of time scouting until opening, every second weekend for sure and maybe more if i'm able too. Soak up and learn as much as I can and hopefully find where they will be

I think it's important to understand, for elk, rubs are not always associated with hunting season and the rut. Lots of rubbing occurs by young bulls, who figure out the rut a bit late, IE; November. And Bulls rub in the winter and they definitely rub a lot in the spring as the antlers are coming off. Gotta work hard to get the grunge off the shaggy mane.

[Linksman313]

I would say elk rubs as well, maybe a single bachelor?, herd rubs i have found in my region are completely thrashed no trees untouched in a 20ft or so area.
Great find and i would say camera time
i will mention that my spring cams are full of bachelors and underage bulls, come hunting season - crickets
big animals move a long distance fast, a suggestion for success is ranging this rub with all the other factors Elk need (water/seclusion/food/access to mating areas) somewhere in the middle you will find "the spot"
Good luck sir, this is a great start

[TheObserver]

I think it's important to understand, for elk, rubs are not always associated with hunting season and the rut. Lots of rubbing occurs by young bulls, who figure out the rut a bit late, IE; November. And Bulls rub in the winter and they definitely rub a lot in the spring as the antlers are coming off. Gotta work hard to get the grunge off the shaggy mane.

Okay, I thought there was just the two main times they rubbed, to get rid of the velvet and the rut.

I may be wrong here but the velvet rubbing is more gentle and tickling like, whereas the rut is when they really impart scent from the forehead gland and beef up the neck muscles and really wreck the trees?

[TheObserver]

Just remember they may not be there all year long, the key is the right place at the right time...

I have gotten great advice from this site, and especially one good man in particular. I have also bought and read 3 books. One question I have is when they go up as the snow melts and the higher quality feed starts to grow in the spring are they generally at that height in the rut when the season is on?

I know they will travel lots daily in elevation for food and water and then back up to bedding areas, I was told and read they generally will go down at night and feed etc and go up in the morning to bed higher.

Also I really appreciate the feedback guys!

[TheObserver]

I would say elk rubs as well, maybe a single bachelor?, herd rubs i have found in my region are completely thrashed no trees untouched in a 20ft or so area.
Great find and i would say camera time
i will mention that my spring cams are full of bachelors and underage bulls, come hunting season - crickets
big animals move a long distance fast, a suggestion for success is ranging this rub with all the other factors Elk need (water/seclusion/food/access to mating areas) somewhere in the middle you will find "the spot"
Good luck sir, this is a great start

I got one cam up already that I will be checking weekend after next not at the major rubbing sites but I have 3 cams in total for this area so will be putting at least one up there.

There are two large areas here with literally no access at all, they both have lots of water, one has north and south facing slopes. I started to go in there last weekend but there was still snow on the way in and it was very loud trying to sneak through there didn't want to spook everything. But not much was left an with the way it was melting I figure weekend after next it will be gone and I am going to head in there see what I find and put cams up.

When you say mating areas just a secluded place where they do the do every year sort of thing? flat I am guessing lol

[HarryToolips]

I have gotten great advice from this site, and especially one good man in particular. I have also bought and read 3 books. One question I have is when they go up as the snow melts and the higher quality feed starts to grow in the spring are they generally at that height in the rut when the season is on?

I know they will travel lots daily in elevation for food and water and then back up to bedding areas, I was told and read they generally will go down at night and feed etc and go up in the morning to bed higher.

Also I really appreciate the feedback guys!

Hey no prob...elevation wise they can be anywhere as long as they have their basic needs covered as per the post above...my partner and I harvested a 6 pt last year in the sub alpine...

[J_T]

Okay, I thought there was just the two main times they rubbed, to get rid of the velvet and the rut.

I may be wrong here but the velvet rubbing is more gentle and tickling like, whereas the rut is when they really impart scent from the forehead gland and beef up the neck muscles and really wreck the trees?A lot of observations are geographic location dependent. The routine of animals can be a bit different in different areas of the province. I agree with your comment damage to trees in rubbing off the velvet is different than the angry frustration of a bull coming into the rut. In my experience (the areas I hunt), bulls disappear between Aug 10th and reappear with antlers cleaned off around Aug 20th. Summer range.

[TheObserver]

Hey no prob...elevation wise they can be anywhere as long as they have their basic needs covered as per the post above...my partner and I harvested a 6 pt last year in the sub alpine...

Okay got it, congrats by the way I seen the pics of the Bull when I first started going on this site, nice!