Action needed. 9 days left to show our opposition to the proposed regulation changes!

[WildernessLocals]

There is around 25,000 members on this forum - and I’m damn certain not everyone has taken the time to do this. I have seen other threads about this that get tangled up in the weeds > here’s the action we need to take - If you value hunting in British Columbia the time to act is now. If this goes through it will be put in effect in 7A and 6 before the hunting season is even going this fall (passed this January) here are the steps folks.


https://apps.nrs.gov.bc.ca/ahte/content/close-peace-caribou-hunts-and-reduce-peace-moose-hunts-region-wide?fbclid=IwAR3iIPnwyunUz3o36wF3vNcWtvbertfPs0Dx bkNmZyLvW03g0O1jGpPtLI4


1. Go to the link above.
2. Login if you have a BCeID (this is the same as your hunting login) if you don’t have one you can register here. (Non residents and non hunters are allowed to comment as well (think mom, grandma, uncle etc))
3. Scroll to the bottom and Oppose! Leave a respectful comment. Here is mine - “As a British Columbian, I am deeply concerned that the province is negotiating away opportunities for sustainable hunting instead of confronting the cumulative effects of unsustainable resource extraction.” Don’t include profanity or anything not politically correct. It will hurt us.
4. Be stoked you did your part to save hunting in British Columbia. This is a slippery slope once it gets going. Many of us are reliving the grizzly ban in real time. We got our asses handed to us back then. Now is the time we stick together and make it happen.


Thanks everyone. If you get stuck or have a hard time getting it submitted. Let me know. I am happy to help.


- Ty @ Wilderness Locals

https://i.ibb.co/TKCjpcW/8362-E5-F1-7-B4-A-40-DF-8-D2-B-1380497-DE7-B6.jpg (https://ibb.co/LQGjbSN)
https://i.ibb.co/dmJkrqM/E5-FE1121-AD9-E-4743-BA88-3-B6-C1-E3-AD471.jpg (https://ibb.co/MB5Ps4S)
https://i.ibb.co/Bw6966Y/507-BE9-E2-F956-4334-85-F8-8-D542034-FAD6.jpg (https://ibb.co/Tr0s00N)
https://i.ibb.co/6HbZkq0/DB5-FB106-4-DBC-463-A-B746-6-FF8039-EC019.jpg (https://ibb.co/VgDNskY)
https://i.ibb.co/MRRH15h/2-B37-D26-B-0-D6-A-4152-B6-AA-CB4-B2-EEEEBA5.jpg (https://ibb.co/K99gszG)

[WildernessLocals]

Pictures showed up in the wrong order. But they are numbered.

[clarked]

Done, thank you!

[Cat catcher]

Done
thanks for making it simple for us.

[dmuth]

Thank you for the link and reminder, Done.

[justachip]

Done thanks for the link

[Ltbullken]

Posted my say! Opposed!

[1S1K]

Has the site changed? When I went online there was no “Oppose” button - only a chance to leave a comment.

[WildernessLocals]

Has the site changed? When I went online there was no “Oppose” button - only a chance to leave a comment.

Ensure you’re on the correct regulation proposal. It is still showing for most folks.

https://apps.nrs.gov.bc.ca/ahte/content/close-peace-caribou-hunts-and-reduce-peace-moose-hunts-region-wide?fbclid=IwAR3iIPnwyunUz3o36wF3vNcWtvbertfPs0Dx bkNmZyLvW03g0O1jGpPtLI4

[WildernessLocals]

Great job everyone so far. Let’s keep up the good work and see if we can make a difference here!! ��������

[adriaticum]

Done.
But I think this is a foregone conclusion.
I highly doubt hunter feedback counts for anything when politicos make a decision.

[rageous]

Is Mike Bridger is the 7B biologist? What’s his take on this? You would think they would have a lot of info on this?

[NO IDEAS]

Done; thank you

[Pharma]

I just got my PAL and still have yet to do my CORE, however I want these opportunities to be around for everyone to enjoy responsibly. Commented and Opposed.

[Harvest the Land]

Any idea how we can see the comments on the site after we leave our comments? Do they no longer allow us to see the comments?

[WildernessLocals]

Is Mike Bridger is the 7B biologist? What’s his take on this? You would think they would have a lot of info on this?



Put it this way - any Gov. Employee/Worker that we have on the podcast has to get the approval for what gov. Things they can talk about….

I can’t speak for Mike. But I have some off the records with Bios that are very very upset about this. I don’t think this is coming from regional bios at all. I think this is more bc gov policy than science.

[WildernessLocals]

Any idea how we can see the comments on the site after we leave our comments? Do they no longer allow us to see the comments?

normally - after they close. I’m not sure if this will be the same.

[WildernessLocals]

Done.
But I think this is a foregone conclusion.
I highly doubt hunter feedback counts for anything when politicos make a decision.


I don’t think you’re wrong - but I’m not about to lay down and take it dry - putting up a fight is the way forward.

[Jereky]

Complete guess here, but I assume the comments are not visible to the public because they are likely all negative. Hide it and the problem doesn’t exist. Sort of like how they handle the resource extraction process rather then tightening regulations they turn their head then give access to FN.

Saw a news article on Castanet today where a TNRD board member was asking the province to remove a group of FN protesters on the Transmountain site around Clearwater in the same manner as they dispersed convoy protesters at the border and other locations as they are causing harm to the local economy, national reputation and security. Interested to see if there is a response. The logic is there, why is one group protesting a national emergency and others are just exercising their democratic rights?

[rageous]

Put it this way - any Gov. Employee/Worker that we have on the podcast has to get the approval for what gov. Things they can talk about….

I can’t speak for Mike. But I have some off the records with Bios that are very very upset about this. I don’t think this is coming from regional bios at all. I think this is more bc gov policy than science.

I hear you. I’m sure Bridgers a good guy. The resident hunter is desperately trying to hold onto what they have. Is it unfair they are partly to blame for staying silent? Any CO/DFO/Biologist that knows whats going on for fish and wildlife can expose information but choose not to. I get it, simply stay low and stay employed.

Personal opinion vs Professional opinion align or differ…?
They know what’s goin on and are scared to speak up.

[Jagermeister]

My two bits worth.
”The Limited Entry Hunt (LEH) regulates the resident hunter’s harvest rate. We have witnessed that the only harvesters of wildlife contributing to the conservation of the province are the resident hunters. Where is the regulation change for the Guides and Outfitters? There is no change because they get preferential treatment. What do the First Nations contribute to the conservation effort? Nothing, because they exclude themselves. Maybe they should take the first step and start reporting their harvest numbers.”

[WildernessLocals]

I hear you. I’m sure Bridgers a good guy. The resident hunter is desperately trying to hold onto what they have. Is it unfair they are partly to blame for staying silent? Any CO/DFO/Biologist that knows whats going on for fish and wildlife can expose information but choose not to. I get it, simply stay low and stay employed.

Personal opinion vs Professional opinion align or differ…?
They know what’s goin on and are scared to speak up.

I think it’s plain to see what’s going on and it hasn’t been concealed at all. It’s pretty clear the regional bios are not behind this. Regardless I think many FN, Bios and hunters all feel the same on this. Government BS.

regardless - let’s all Try to get this thing so much traction they can’t ignore us. That’s my .02 anyway.

[IronNoggin]

There is around 25,000 members on this forum - and I’m damn certain not everyone has taken the time to do this. I have seen other threads about this that get tangled up in the weeds > here’s the action we need to take - If you value hunting in British Columbia the time to act is now. If this goes through it will be put in effect in 7A and 6 before the hunting season is even going this fall (passed this January) here are the steps folks.

Excellent first step. Every single one of should be doing this like yesterday.

It will make a MUCH larger difference if we all write our MLA's (cc'ing those as noted) expressing our concerns.

This is a modified template from the one I posted in the related BCWF thread:

I STRONGLY suggest every single one of us send this message to our MLA's with the appropriate cc's as noted:

Date

To:

I am writing to express my extreme concerns regarding your Government’s response to losing the Yahey vs BC (Blueberry River FN decision) wherein the Supreme Court of BC found that the Blueberry River First Nation’s treaty rights to hunt, trap and fish in their territory have been breached by allowing industrial development in Blueberry’s territory at an extensive scale.

Instead of focusing on wildlife management and habitat restoration in the region, and addressing the impacts of industrial activities while providing support for on-the-ground actions that benefit wildlife and habitat in Treaty 8 territory, your government decided to engage in secret backroom deals with the intent of punishing hunters & other recreational users of the area in question.

There is nothing in the court proceedings, findings and decision that specified that resident hunters are or were a problem whatsoever.

The proposed outcome of those secret dealings is to reduce moose hunting opportunities by fifty percent in Region 7b, make most of the area a Limited Entry Hunting Zone, and to completely eliminate all caribou hunting with the Region. Additionally they propose to increase the Guide Outfitter’s share of the remaining quota up to twenty-five percent from the stand nine percent in BC, representing a drastic increase in their allocation and further reducing resident hunting opportunities. This represents wildlife management by social decree, and about as far from scientific management as you can possibly get.

Note that the Peace region has the highest density moose populations in the province. The province’s own data indicates hunting is sustainable and that licensed hunter harvest is extremely low. Caribou populations in the area are also noted as “stable or expanding”. There is no conservation rationale for your government’s approach. It has now become obvious that your Government is willing to negotiate licensed BC hunters’ and recreationists’ opportunities away in favor of Site C, logging, and oil and gas.

This is a an extremely unsettling move by your government, using hunters as pawns and selling them out in order to continue, and actually escalate the very kind of industrial environmental degradation and damage that was the heart of the court case itself. The fact that your party is willing to sacrifice our access and ability to feed our families simply so business can proceed as “normal” is unacceptable. It has come to my attention that after the tentative agreement was in hand, the NDP Government immediately granted over one hundred and ninety industrial permits within the area in question. That I consider both disingenuous and intolerable.

Given your Government’s stated drive to harmonize hunting seasons and numbers in all of Northern BC, we are expecting this same type of secret dealings will occur in Region Six and elsewhere. In fact the Tahltan have already stated they will make sure of that. They also noted the desire of government to harmonize the seasons for moose and caribou in Northern BC, suggesting they will also soon seek a cessation of caribou hunting and a gross reduction of moose harvests by resident hunters.

The Yahey vs BC (Blueberry River FN decision) was about industrial activity, not hunting, and it is extremely inappropriate to punish hunters for the cumulative effects of industrial activity.

The type of division these types of deals create will not help with your stated goals regarding Reconciliation, but rather further fan the flames of distrust and anger between Indigenous and Non Indigenous groups.

Reducing or stopping hunting will not restore fish, wildlife and habitat resources. That takes money and political will, not regulation changes.

The historical BC wildlife / habitat funding graph line is flat as it moves right, and has been for too many years. When adjusted for inflation and growth it actually represents a significant decline in available resources dedicated to properly managing these resources. That level of funding is beyond inadequate, and very much represents the fact we are “managing to zero” in this province.

Finally I would like to note that Together for Wildlife and the Ministers Wildlife Advisory Council were not consulted while the 7B caribou closure and moose reductions were being negotiated. Together for Wildlife and the Ministers Wildlife Advisory Council were briefed on the proposal last week when it was publicly presented. The Minister and her staff failed to follow the procedures that the NDP government itself has set out for wildlife decision making. Instead it strongly appears she simply acted unilaterally...

As a British Columbian, I am deeply concerned that the province is negotiating away opportunities for sustainable hunting instead of confronting the cumulative effects of unsustainable resource extraction.

I am writing you today to directly pose this question: Will you please confirm that you and your Government will act now to protect resident hunter access in Region Seven and beyond from this serious infringement? Further, I directly request an answer to this pressing query.

I am looking forward to your timely response

Yours sincerely,

CC:

Premier John Horgan
( premier@gov.bc.ca )
PO BOX 9041 STN PROV GOVT VICTORIA, BC V8W 9E1

Katrine Conroy Minister of Forests, Lands, Natural Resource Operations and Rural Development
( FLNR.Minister@gov.bc.ca )
Room 248 Parliament Buildings
Victoria, BC V8V 1X4

Mike Farnworth Ministry of Public Safety & Solicitor General
(PSSG.Minister@gov.bc.ca )
PO Box 9282 Stn Prov Govt
Victoria BC V8W 9J7

Murray Rankin Minister of Indigenous Relations and Reconciliation
(IRR.Minister@gov.bc.ca)
Room 323 Parliament Buildings
Victoria, BC V8V 1X4

Nathan Cullen MLA for Stikine Minister of State for Lands and Natural Resource Operations & Chair of the Environment and Land Use Committee
nathan.cullen.MLA@leg.bc.ca
Room 027 Parliament Buildings
Victoria, BC V8V 1X4

[IronNoggin]

Ti find your MLA click here: https://www.leg.bc.ca/learn-about-us/members

[IronNoggin]

Add the following cc:

George Heyman Minster of Environment & Climate change Strategy
ENV.minister@gov.bc.ca
PO Box 9047 Stn Pov Govt
Rm 112, Parliament Buildings
Victoria BC
V8W9E2

[WildernessLocals]

Ti find your MLA click here: https://www.leg.bc.ca/learn-about-us/members


thanks IN - howl.org is putting together an automated form that should be available tonight that will email all of the BC MLAs in one shot too

[WildernessLocals]

Not sure if I should start a new thread or not. But as some incentive/reward for actually exercising our voices. I put together a giveaway from Kifaru, Mike Jones knife & tool, tyto, mtngear and a few other that are confirming what they are sending. It’s on our home page www.wildernesslocals.net

if you’ve already opposed this like everyone here so far. Go ahead and just click. You can still enter. Trying to create more buzz for those on the fence/ a little lazy.

thanks everyone

[IronNoggin]

Not sure if I should start a new thread or not. But as some incentive/reward for actually exercising our voices. I put together a giveaway from Kifaru, Mike Jones knife & tool, tyto, mtngear and a few other that are confirming what they are sending. It’s on our home page www.wildernesslocals.net (http://www.wildernesslocals.net)

if you’ve already opposed this like everyone here so far. Go ahead and just click. You can still enter. Trying to create more buzz for those on the fence/ a little lazy.

Excellent! Can this be shared to other forums & venues?
I have a few in mind...

Wondering...
Matt

[Jereky]

I think it’s plain to see what’s going on and it hasn’t been concealed at all. It’s pretty clear the regional bios are not behind this. Regardless I think many FN, Bios and hunters all feel the same on this. Government BS.

regardless - let’s all Try to get this thing so much traction they can’t ignore us. That’s my .02 anyway.

It’s all identity politics. Appear to be working for the flashy, splashy social issues while actually never doing anything to address the problems that cause the divisions. Being woke causes the snake to eat it’s own tail. We’re seeing it with all this green energy business. We live in the north. Everyone outside the lower mainland or larger centres it’s unfeasible to drive an electric car at this point in time due to lack of infrastructure. It’s untenable to rely on an electric heat pump in the winter in locations that routinely dip below -20 yet here we are having these issues foisted on us as residents and given no choice in the matter. It’s happened with salmon and steelhead where unless you’re a native you likely can’t even fish because there are none, yet FN are allowed and even encouraged to fulfill their ‘god-given’ rights at the detriment of the stocks. If everyone was so concerned about the health of the environment and the animals within it, ALL the stewards from every group would get together and figure it out. Clearly some groups don’t feel like they should be questioned and others don’t care. This is NDP/Liberal equality folks. You can keep working and funding all these initiatives and you’ll either like it or leave. Sad times indeed.

[WildernessLocals]

Excellent! Can this be shared to other forums & venues?
I have a few in mind...

Wondering...
Matt


wherever you want that you think it’ll make an impact.

[WildernessLocals]

The howl boys made it happen.

this email blast hits all the BC MLAs in one shot.

https://www.howlforwildlife.org/bcpeace

[Imdone]

Great job to those involved

[Jereky]

https://bcwf.bc.ca/peace-region-hunting-regulations/

BCWF LETTER OF OPPOSITION THAT GOES TO YOUR MLA BASED ON YOUR POSTAL CODE. EASY PEASY JUST PUT YOUR NAME EMAIL and POSTAL CODE IN. HIT SEND.

[IronNoggin]

wherever you want that you think it’ll make an impact.

Thank you Sir!

That may kick a few butts that desperately need to get into action!

Many Thanks!!
Nog

[5jackz]

Done.
Copy and pasted your well chosen words and added a couple of my own .
Thank you for sharing this .

[reloader60]

done also ,what a racist idea.

[B Swift]

Got it done.

[eric]

Done, and donated to the howl for wildlife group

[WildernessLocals]

Done, and donated to the howl for wildlife group


nice! Howl is a badass org

[Kilwinning]

Done, amongst others.

[mooseknuckler]

Done and spreading the word to others.

[Sitkaspruce]

not to be confused with

https://howl2horgan.org/ What a BS site!!! LOL!!

With the f&cked up closure in the Peace, I wonder if they will stop the wolf kill as there is no need to worry about moose and caribou populations..... except where the FN are running the caribou recovery program.

As for the regional Bio's, they have nothing to do with this and it was dropped in their lap just like everyone else. I wouldn't be surprised to see the a lot of the good ones leave as this BS is happening all over and they will soon be cut out of the picture and be more like support staff to the UNDRIP way of managing wildlife. After all, the UN knows what is best for BC.....

send in your letters, make sure your fellow hunters are aware, leave your comments and keep on fighting!!! This is in my backyard and pisses me off!!

Cheers

SS

[walks with deer]

There is around 25,000 members on this forum - and I’m damn certain not everyone has taken the time to do this. I have seen other threads about this that get tangled up in the weeds > here’s the action we need to take - If you value hunting in British Columbia the time to act is now. If this goes through it will be put in effect in 7A and 6 before the hunting season is even going this fall (passed this January) here are the steps folks.


https://apps.nrs.gov.bc.ca/ahte/content/close-peace-caribou-hunts-and-reduce-peace-moose-hunts-region-wide?fbclid=IwAR3iIPnwyunUz3o36wF3vNcWtvbertfPs0Dx bkNmZyLvW03g0O1jGpPtLI4


1. Go to the link above.
2. Login if you have a BCeID (this is the same as your hunting login) if you don’t have one you can register here. (Non residents and non hunters are allowed to comment as well (think mom, grandma, uncle etc))
3. Scroll to the bottom and Oppose! Leave a respectful comment. Here is mine - “As a British Columbian, I am deeply concerned that the province is negotiating away opportunities for sustainable hunting instead of confronting the cumulative effects of unsustainable resource extraction.” Don’t include profanity or anything not politically correct. It will hurt us.
4. Be stoked you did your part to save hunting in British Columbia. This is a slippery slope once it gets going. Many of us are reliving the grizzly ban in real time. We got our asses handed to us back then. Now is the time we stick together and make it happen.


Thanks everyone. If you get stuck or have a hard time getting it submitted. Let me know. I am happy to help.


- Ty @ Wilderness Locals

https://i.ibb.co/TKCjpcW/8362-E5-F1-7-B4-A-40-DF-8-D2-B-1380497-DE7-B6.jpg (https://ibb.co/LQGjbSN)
https://i.ibb.co/dmJkrqM/E5-FE1121-AD9-E-4743-BA88-3-B6-C1-E3-AD471.jpg (https://ibb.co/MB5Ps4S)
https://i.ibb.co/Bw6966Y/507-BE9-E2-F956-4334-85-F8-8-D542034-FAD6.jpg (https://ibb.co/Tr0s00N)
https://i.ibb.co/6HbZkq0/DB5-FB106-4-DBC-463-A-B746-6-FF8039-EC019.jpg (https://ibb.co/VgDNskY)
https://i.ibb.co/MRRH15h/2-B37-D26-B-0-D6-A-4152-B6-AA-CB4-B2-EEEEBA5.jpg (https://ibb.co/K99gszG)

Agreed will be petitioning tommorow all who have not sent in yet...all that i have in my contacts.

[leadpillproductions]

Done signed everyone I could . would sign my dog up to if he had a email

[WildernessLocals]

Done signed everyone I could . would sign my dog up to if he had a email

good work fellas. Keep at er.

[rageous]

“This has nothing to do with science, it’s a result of the court ruling.”
“Treaty 8 believe’s there is not enough moose when our studies show moose are stable and support the current regulations”

Don’t fall for this leh proposal everyone…

Absolutely no LEH. Keep a broad GOS season to spread any pressure out. Harmonize regional seasons.
FN and Resident can absolutely hunt together during same periods. Absolutely do not separate resident vs FN seasons.
Nothing will ever jeopardize FN rights to hunt and fish.

[WildernessLocals]

“This has nothing to do with science, it’s a result of the court ruling.”
“Treaty 8 believe’s there is not enough moose when our studies show moose are stable and support the current regulations”

Don’t fall for this leh proposal everyone…

Absolutely no LEH. Keep a broad GOS season to spread any pressure out. Harmonize regional seasons.
FN and Resident can absolutely hunt together during same periods. Absolutely do not separate resident vs FN seasons.
Nothing will ever jeopardize FN rights to hunt and fish.


last thing we need is it to be resident v. FN. i think you raise very valid points here

[Redthies]

My comment said “ALL British Columbians should abide by the same science based hunting regulations, regardless of race or ethnicity”.

[Drillbit]

Just added 4 from my family.

[rageous]

Can this thread be made a sticky? Mods?

[sjhawes]

Opposition and comment submitted. Thank you for sharing.

[Astepanuk]

Opposed and Comment Submitted From a Non resident from Alberta.

[HappyJack]

I sent letters off to the Minister, my MLA and the Premier and opposed and commented. Been sharing this news widely as there are still a lot of resident hunters that haven't heard a peep about it. Our mainstream news sources aren't covering it at all.

[J_T]

not to be confused with


As for the regional Bio's, they have nothing to do with this and it was dropped in their lap just like everyone else. I wouldn't be surprised to see the a lot of the good ones leave as this BS is happening all over and they will soon be cut out of the picture and be more like support staff to the UNDRIP way of managing wildlife. After all, the UN knows what is best for BC.....


Cheers

SS

This is an important point. Initially there were two distinct discussions. The transparent and open discussion about wildlife management and possible regulation amendments, and the second is the clandestine high level Government negotiation with Indigenous people. The Treaty 8 decision was a surprise to most people on all sides. It coincidently was released during the regulation amendments. Prior to the Treaty 8 decision coming out, I did see that many of the MU's in the north were shifting toward LEH. I had numerous discussions with Gov staff about the cost of shifting to LEH. So many things to consider. And then we learned about Treaty 8. FYI, we will see lost opportunity and LEH implemented further now to "control" hunters as they shift to other MU's. With LEH there is a very real risk to end resident hunting within a generation due to lost opportunity, choice, skills and traditions relative to the hunt.


My comment said “ALL British Columbians should abide by the same science based hunting regulations, regardless of race or ethnicity”.
I'm feeling with current Government focus and legislation, this position - while I might support it personally - is an untenable position given our current political climate.

[tigrr]

Done with gusto.

[dellis]

Opposed, it'll likely fall on ears fully deafened by racist policies though.......

Darcy

[Quesnel Kid]

comment posted. Thank you for making this post and including detailed instructions on how to comment.

[rageous]

Maybe residents should reach out to treaty 8 and express our shared values?
Advocate science. Listen to Biologists on the moose/caribou numbers.

We all want heathy wildlife. I acknowledged FN rights to hunt and fish.
But in this case there are healthy enough populations to support the current regulations.
indicating this proposal is an over reach.

[Brew]

Thanks for starting this thread. Got it done

[DJK]

Done. We've got to address this BS now. Thanks for the link.

[IronNoggin]

Send in your letters, make sure your fellow hunters are aware, leave your comments and keep on fighting!!! This is in my backyard and pisses me off!!


AbSo****ingLutely my Friend! https://www.tnof.ca/styles/default/xenforo/smilies/Pozitive.gif

Get those letters rolling folks!
There are now at least three options to use, the BCWF, The Howling linked above, and the template I provided.
All are damned easy to use. And we should all be using every single one of them to voice our concerns!

I've hunted that area on and off for 25 years.
And yeah, I am extremely pissed off too.

It takes NUMBERS to scare them back into some form resembling reality.
Please do your part to ensure we are doing so!!

Cheers,
Nog

[elch jager]

done


I oppose this reduction of access for licensed resident hunters in BC.


The province is doing precious little to rehabilitate habitat, monitor ALL wildlife harvest by ALL user groups and regulate forestry practices to align with a sustainable harvest.


Hunting provides deep, central life meaning for many participants and their families and, in many cases, core identities to social, conservation, and cultural groups throughout the world. Among themes that have been identified are a historical connection to a time they value, an honest relationship with nature, and pursuit of the ideal of self -reliance.


Further, hunting often elicits a deep passion among participants that transcends gender, race, and socioeconomic class. Additionally, outdoor pursuits such as hunting help teach valuable lessons in ethics and responsibility and help participants develop a conservation and land ethic. These important values often extend beyond participants to families, friends, and acquaintances.


Hunting has many social values, including recreation, subsistence, heritage, utilization of the harvestable surplus to benefit people.


Within this context, the notion of denying Resident hunters access to this publicly owned resource is unacceptable.

[Sitkaspruce]

https://apps.nrs.gov.bc.ca/ahte/content/close-peace-caribou-hunts-and-reduce-peace-moose-hunts-region-wide

Bump this up, insider told me that only ~1800 comments so far. Out of ~100000 licenced hunters, less than 2% have filled out consultation. Why?? People need to fill this out, there might be a few cracks starting.

And for all those who think that this is ONLY in the Peace needs to wake the hell up!! Already, FN on the west side of the Rockies are watching and asking about how they can restrict BC residents from fish and wildlife. Thats the ultimate goal in the Peace. There is no conservation concern, only the concern of TOO MANY BC RESIDENT HUNTERS ARE HUNTING ON CROWN LAND....land that ALL of us are entitled to. But that is being taken away; the Peace, areas of the Caribou and especially on the west coast with respect to salmon and shellfish. Death by a thousand cuts!

So please, fill out the consultation and even if you are not much for comments, at least click opposed and state to use science and not social to manage fish and wildlife. If we don't at least speak up, they will think that nobody cares and they will apply this in other places in BC.

SPEAK UP OR LIVE WITH THE CONSEQUENCES!!

Cheers

SS

[bearvalley]

Here’s a couple of suggestions:
-Hit the media.
-Organize Town Halls like was done with the allocation issue.
-File an injunction…..government didn’t follow protocol.
Letter writing might get it done but it didn’t cut it for the grizzly hunt.

[Arctic Lake]

What about a massive protest ! Where would a good location be ?
Can you imagine if everyone on HBC attended !
Central B.C. Location or thereabouts or Vancouver ?
Just don’t want my 30 year old truck impounded or my bank account frozen !
Arctic Lake

[Shuswap guy]

Signed by wife, brothers , dad, and myself. My bro asked the question, "how does proposed regulation affect guide outfitter operations? Is their allocation impacted"?

Also sent letters via Wild Sheep Society: https://www.wildsheepsociety.com/actnow/

[bearvalley]

Signed by wife, brothers , dad, and myself. My bro asked the question, "how does proposed regulation affect guide outfitter operations? Is their allocation impacted"?

Also sent letters via Wild Sheep Society: https://www.wildsheepsociety.com/actnow/
I’ll answer this but won’t be drawn into the allocation ditch some like crawling in.
First..7B was managed with the Soft 10 regulation and GOS for all licensed hunters.
When a new hunt is propose under the guidance of the Allocation Policy for a Category A hunt the allocation splits are 75/25
The 25% given to the guides is a hard number.
The AAH for 7B has been determined to be 646 moose….half of the past harvest of 1292 therefor at 25% there would be 162 bull moose split amongst approximately 30 Guide Outfitters.
If the resident allocation would be 485 moose using the 75% with a multiplier of 3.6 applied to put forth the number of LEH permits issued.
That would mean there will be 1743 ANY BULL LEH authorizations put out to harvest 485 bull moose.
Government seems to be going away from the allocation policy and leaning towards 10% going to the guides and that will be 65 moose.
Using the same multiplier and formula the licensed residents on 90/10 will see:
646 x 90% = 581.4
581.4 x 3.6 = 2093 LEH remits.
So, to summarize either 1743 or 2093 licensed BC resident hunters and either 162 or 65 non resident hunters will be hunting moose under an ANY BULL season with the Ministers proposal instead of the 6000 plus that hunted under the Soft 10 GOS in past years.

[Shuswap guy]

Thanks for the info Bear Valley.
I’ll answer this but won’t be drawn into the allocation ditch some like crawling in.
First..7B was managed with the Soft 10 regulation and GOS for all licensed hunters.
When a new hunt is propose under the guidance of the Allocation Policy for a Category A hunt the allocation splits are 75/25
The 25% given to the guides is a hard number.
The AAH for 7B has been determined to be 646 moose….half of the past harvest of 1292 therefor at 25% there would be 162 bull moose split amongst approximately 30 Guide Outfitters.
If the resident allocation would be 485 moose using the 75% with a multiplier of 3.6 applied to put forth the number of LEH permits issued.
That would mean there will be 1743 ANY BULL LEH authorizations put out to harvest 485 bull moose.
Government seems to be going away from the allocation policy and leaning towards 10% going to the guides and that will be 65 moose.
Using the same multiplier and formula the licensed residents on 90/10 will see:
646 x 90% = 581.4
581.4 x 3.6 = 2093 LEH remits.
So, to summarize either 1743 or 2093 licensed BC resident hunters and either 162 or 65 non resident hunters will be hunting moose under an ANY BULL season with the Ministers proposal instead of the 6000 plus that hunted under the Soft 10 GOS in past years.

[HappyJack]

How was the past harvest determined? 1292?? For starters that can't even be close to the actual number in the whole of 7B, ridiculous, did they drop a zero?

[sakohunter]

Comments and opposition posted

[IronNoggin]

Received a reply from Peter Milobar - MLA Kamloops - North Thompson - Finance Critic

Thank you for your email expressing your concerns regarding the hunting closures being proposed in Region 7b.
As Official Opposition we are also concerned with how things are happening and our MLA's from that area have taken the lead on this issue. They have recently sent a letter, which I have attached for your information. I will make sure to let them know that this issue is also impacting many people from my riding and that they fully understand this.
Thank you again for taking the time to email me.

LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY
of BRITISH COLUMBIA
BC Liberal Official Opposition
Parliament Buildings
Victoria, BC V8V 1X4
T: 250-356-6171
BY EMAIL

Honourable Katrine Conroy
Minister of Forests, Lands, Natural Resource Operations and Rural Development
Parliament Buildings
Victoria, BC

March 4, 2022

Dear Minister:

British Columbians are concerned about declining ungulate populations. Decisions surrounding
wildlife management in the province of British Columbia must be science-based and not
political. The vast majority of hunters support science-based wildlife management and are
willing to see reductions in wildlife harvest levels to help ungulate populations recover as
needed.

Constituents concerned with the decision to significantly reduce moose hunting opportunities
in Region 7B in north-eastern British Columbia have written to the Official Opposition, asking
for clarity on the government’s decision-making process. You will find these letters enclosed.

When decisions are made behind closed doors, rumours thrive. When wild salmon returns are
down, all invested parties see restrictions on what can be harvested. This is done publicly and
transparently so that everyone can understand the steps that are being taken. In a similar
fashion, the management of ungulate harvest levels should see reductions across the board
when science demonstrates it is required. It is incumbent on the government to be transparent
with British Columbians and provide the rationale for its recent decision. The Official
Opposition calls on the government to:

• open, meaningful conversations about wildlife management to all concerned parties;

• assure British Columbians have fair and equal access to ungulates similarly as to how
wild salmon populations are managed;

• disclose the data surrounding ungulate populations in the area;

• provide a list of stakeholders the government consulted prior to making the decision;

and

• disclose any economic impact studies on the local area resulting from a reduction in
moose hunting.

The right to hunt and fish by Indigenous Peoples is enshrined in the Canadian constitution. It is
important to uphold these rights so that transparent, science-based decisions regarding
ungulate populations can be supported by all. Thousands of British Columbians rely on hunting
to feed their families and hunters are well-aware of the need for strong wildlife management
practices to ensure wildlife populations are healthy and sustainable for the future.

We look forward to your prompt response.

Sincerely,

John Rustad, MLA Nechako Lakes
Dan Davies, MLA Peace River North
Mike Bernier, MLA Peace River South

[CheesyLimper]

I got the same reply. Crickets so far from Nathan Cullen (my MLA) despite several different messages from myself, my wife and friends. His lack of response does not surprise me a bit.


Received a reply from Peter Milobar - MLA Kamloops - North Thompson - Finance Critic

Thank you for your email expressing your concerns regarding the hunting closures being proposed in Region 7b.
As Official Opposition we are also concerned with how things are happening and our MLA's from that area have taken the lead on this issue. They have recently sent a letter, which I have attached for your information. I will make sure to let them know that this issue is also impacting many people from my riding and that they fully understand this.
Thank you again for taking the time to email me.

LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY
of BRITISH COLUMBIA
BC Liberal Official Opposition
Parliament Buildings
Victoria, BC V8V 1X4
T: 250-356-6171
BY EMAIL

Honourable Katrine Conroy
Minister of Forests, Lands, Natural Resource Operations and Rural Development
Parliament Buildings
Victoria, BC

March 4, 2022

Dear Minister:

British Columbians are concerned about declining ungulate populations. Decisions surrounding
wildlife management in the province of British Columbia must be science-based and not
political. The vast majority of hunters support science-based wildlife management and are
willing to see reductions in wildlife harvest levels to help ungulate populations recover as
needed.

Constituents concerned with the decision to significantly reduce moose hunting opportunities
in Region 7B in north-eastern British Columbia have written to the Official Opposition, asking
for clarity on the government’s decision-making process. You will find these letters enclosed.

When decisions are made behind closed doors, rumours thrive. When wild salmon returns are
down, all invested parties see restrictions on what can be harvested. This is done publicly and
transparently so that everyone can understand the steps that are being taken. In a similar
fashion, the management of ungulate harvest levels should see reductions across the board
when science demonstrates it is required. It is incumbent on the government to be transparent
with British Columbians and provide the rationale for its recent decision. The Official
Opposition calls on the government to:

• open, meaningful conversations about wildlife management to all concerned parties;

• assure British Columbians have fair and equal access to ungulates similarly as to how
wild salmon populations are managed;

• disclose the data surrounding ungulate populations in the area;

• provide a list of stakeholders the government consulted prior to making the decision;

and

• disclose any economic impact studies on the local area resulting from a reduction in
moose hunting.

The right to hunt and fish by Indigenous Peoples is enshrined in the Canadian constitution. It is
important to uphold these rights so that transparent, science-based decisions regarding
ungulate populations can be supported by all. Thousands of British Columbians rely on hunting
to feed their families and hunters are well-aware of the need for strong wildlife management
practices to ensure wildlife populations are healthy and sustainable for the future.

We look forward to your prompt response.

Sincerely,

John Rustad, MLA Nechako Lakes
Dan Davies, MLA Peace River North
Mike Bernier, MLA Peace River South

[IronNoggin]

I got the same reply. Crickets so far from Nathan Cullen (my MLA) despite several different messages from myself, my wife and friends. His lack of response does not surprise me a bit.

Everyone should be adding him to their cc / distribution lists:

Nathan Cullen MLA for Stikine Minister of State for Lands and Natural Resource Operations & Chair of the Environment and Land Use Committee

nathan.cullen.MLA@leg.bc.ca
Room 027 Parliament Buildings
Victoria, BC V8V 1X4

[carnivore]

My opposition to the changes and my comments have been posted.

[WildernessLocals]

good work everyone who has completed the action and passed it on to friends and family.

to say it - without saying it: the BC resident hunter turnout has been absolutely disgraceful - all sources and analytical data on all the engagement pages right now look like around 2% of hunters have acted on this. Quite frankly it’s embarrassing.

There is 7 days left. We need to show up.

as of right this second 2,311 people have viewed this post - if that means everyone that’s viewed it has taken action - great, but I think that’s being optimistic.

let’s share the crap outta this and get some momentum going on this. Thanks y’all.

[notahypocrite]

Did my part. Thanks for bringing it to my attention.

[WildernessLocals]

Did my part. Thanks for bringing it to my attention.


thanks. Share it far and wide guys. 7 days left.

[444marlin]

Posted my opposition comments today. Thankyou for making out easy.

[whognu]

done, thanks for nudging my apathetic laziness.............

[balian]

Posted my response and shared with all of my hunting friends. Will make some calls to remind them again too. Thanks

[Arctic Lake]

Will get it done in the next day or so . Seems like a pathetic response so far . I wonder how many hunters don’t know about this though . If it changes , then you will here the bitching ! Just like elections ! What the hell is wrong with people !
Arctic Lake

[CheesyLimper]

Honestly, a big part is just sheer laziness. I have one hunting buddy who has gone out with me for moose three years in a row, had a blast each time. I have told him to sign the letters/send the emails/comment on the proposed changes for the last three days. I sent him all the links and a copy of Iron Noggin's letter. I am 100% sure he won't sign them/send them/comment. Then come moose hunt time, he'll be surprised and outraged that the season is gone.


Will get it done in the next day or so . Seems like a pathetic response so far . I wonder how many hunters don’t know about this though . If it changes , then you will here the bitching ! Just like elections ! What the hell is wrong with people !
Arctic Lake

[DJK]

FirstLite is posting about this issue on Instagram, hopefully that will spread the word a little further.

[Deer_Slayer]

Our vote or voice means nothing. The NDP and the woke movement are plowing along and will eliminate hunting entirely. I warned about this years ago and nobody did a thing. If the grizzly hunt wasn't a wake up call, then what do we need? Hunting will be for the rich Chinese in less than 5 years. Just wait and see.

[Arctic Lake]

Pisses a fella off doesn’t it ! Try to light a fire under his butt ! I’m going to reach out to 4 hunters that I know hopefully they will do the deed !
Arctic Lake
Honestly, a big part is just sheer laziness. I have one hunting buddy who has gone out with me for moose three years in a row, had a blast each time. I have told him to sign the letters/send the emails/comment on the proposed changes for the last three days. I sent him all the links and a copy of Iron Noggin's letter. I am 100% sure he won't sign them/send them/comment. Then come moose hunt time, he'll be surprised and outraged that the season is gone.

[WildernessLocals]

Pisses a fella off doesn’t it ! Try to light a fire under his butt ! I’m going to reach out to 4 hunters that I know hopefully they will do the deed !
Arctic Lake

keep in mind you don’t need a core to do this. In fact you don’t even have to be a resident. So anyone anywhere you know that will do it, can and should. I appreciate how much our community has come together the last week to make the waves we are making - hopefully it moves the needle some.

i have to admit. I’m feeling pessimistic at the moment about all this.

[Bugle M In]

Honestly, a big part is just sheer laziness. I have one hunting buddy who has gone out with me for moose three years in a row, had a blast each time. I have told him to sign the letters/send the emails/comment on the proposed changes for the last three days. I sent him all the links and a copy of Iron Noggin's letter. I am 100% sure he won't sign them/send them/comment. Then come moose hunt time, he'll be surprised and outraged that the season is gone.
A lot of truth on your words above.
I have a couple of partners that I send stuff to to help take action also.
But often times when I ask if they did, I find out they were too busy.
But they bitch about it while out hunting.
There are probably way more hunters that are too busy to do it.
And very few who do.

[Arctic Lake]

Thanks for the information !
Arctic Lake

keep in mind you don’t need a core to do this. In fact you don’t even have to be a resident. So anyone anywhere you know that will do it, can and should. I appreciate how much our community has come together the last week to make the waves we are making - hopefully it moves the needle some.

i have to admit. I’m feeling pessimistic at the moment about all this.

[walks with deer]

Keep this at the top.

[walks with deer]

Agreed all we can to is try before we cry...i have contacted hundreds of people and sent them the temolate.

[WildernessLocals]

Agreed all we can to is try before we cry...i have contacted hundreds of people and sent them the temolate.


i compiled all the action you can take short of booking to talk to your mla

https://linktr.ee/Wildernesslocals

[IronNoggin]

i compiled all the action you can take short of booking to talk to your mla

https://linktr.ee/Wildernesslocals

You really should incorporate a copy of the template letter I provided...


Crickets so far from Nathan Cullen (my MLA) despite several different messages from myself, my wife and friends.

I wrote him directly, basically demanding an answer to my queries. Let you know if he bothers to respond.

I am also booking an appointment with my MLA on an ASAP basis.

Taking this up a step, I am contacting a few folks I have worked with in the past in the press.
Don't know if they will bite, but I believe some may well see the merit of the story in this case...

To those that have Stepped Up and made their concerns known - Well Done!! https://www.tnof.ca/styles/default/xenforo/smilies/Pozitive.gif
You are doing your part to try and preserve our Hunting Heritage!!

To those who haven't yet, please get on with it!
We NEED numbers to overturn this.
Numbers we may not realize without your help!!

Cheers,
Nog

[Grizzlydick]

I 2 made it be heard.
Regardless if one is onboard or not, it is the fact that elected people make decisions without all parties input.
Sure we may not agree, but lets be open and no back room BS.

[WildernessLocals]

the last paragraph will make you sick. 23 hours ago would’ve made this March 15/16

https://i.ibb.co/xmjQ9ct/AD0-C413-F-7-C2-B-451-C-A69-C-48-A871-B0-FBC1.jpg (https://ibb.co/8z5VvRL)

[WildernessLocals]

Nog - I would but I actually only included the automated forms that howl, bcwf and WSSBC have created. I can add it as a text doc if you like but i am having a hard enough time getting guys to even use their name and email on a predone form. I’m not sure many beyond us here will actually take the time to email a letter that isn’t pre done for them. I do really appreciate your effort tho - I said on the podcast that goes up tonight - I don’t understand why this isn’t 100,000 strong - everyone should be running around like their hair is on fire. Yet we’re barely at 2% (allegedly)

[bc7mm]

Done thx for the link.

[yama49]

The howl boys made it happen.

this email blast hits all the BC MLAs in one shot.

https://www.howlforwildlife.org/bcpeace

I agree 2400 signed 12000 members here. Time to set up, more pressure the better.

[fishhunt]

Done and having other send letters as well. Most people don't know about this. I usually give all my hunting partners a heads up when the proposed regs come out and this wasn't included when I was looking at them months ago. Most people have no idea this has even been proposed.

[s a]

Put my comments in. Thanks for the info

[WildernessLocals]

Done and having other send letters as well. Most people don't know about this. I usually give all my hunting partners a heads up when the proposed regs come out and this wasn't included when I was looking at them months ago. Most people have no idea this has even been proposed.


Yep!!! That’s all we’re trying to accomplish - is make sure people see it and act. The visibility of this thing has been absolutely crap. Everyday I get tons of people messaging on social media etc saying they had no idea this was going on even.

[Imdone]

Transparency, just another move by Government to hide information from the public.

Any move or deal like this should have all hunters input for consultation, every licenced hunter should have been notified.

Back room deals stink of wrong doing. Government knows they are screwing over the general hunting population.

[HappyJack]

Transparency, just another move by Government to hide information from the public.

Any move or deal like this should have all hunters input for consultation, every licenced hunter should have been notified.

Back room deals stink of wrong doing. Government knows they are screwing over the general hunting population.

Exactly!! In a democratic society we should have had a vote on it.

[HappyJack]

Do we have any radicals on VI?? Do some picketing outside the legislature or something to get this on the news!! Get naked!! That usually works.

[IronNoggin]

Note that the government survey states that comment will be shut down at midnight on the 23rd of March.
However, their own backgrounder and other related pages mark that as the 22nd.

Time to get on with submitting your comments folks.
And it would really be beneficial if we all fired off a letter or two as noted above...

Cheers,
Nog

[Grizzlydick]

Exactly!! In a democratic society we should have had a vote on it.

Especially the ones that are paying TAXES

[DannyO]

I have a question I can’t seem to find an answer too, this proposed ban stems from a lawsuit against the government by the Blueberry River First Nation.
Has there been any public comment from the BRFN on this proposal?

[IronNoggin]

I have a question I can’t seem to find an answer too, this proposed ban stems from a lawsuit against the government by the Blueberry River First Nation.
Has there been any public comment from the BRFN on this proposal?

Why would they?

They get to keep the bribes (for that is what they are) for allowing industry onto their areas, keep the royalties pouring in from the same, and now command all caribou hunting and kill off half of the non FN moose hunting. All 197 of them.

It's a win win win all the way to the bank.
Why pray tell would they make any noise about it whatsoever?

That said, both they and the government did note what they were going to do with regards to their reaction over the court findings. Oddly enough the vast majority of that simply slid off the table:

https://news.gov.bc.ca/releases/2021IRR0063-001940

Three days remain to get your comments into the government survey:

https://apps.nrs.gov.bc.ca/ahte/content/close-peace-caribou-hunts-and-reduce-peace-moose-hunts-region-wide

[mooze]

this is a blanket proposal that goes geographically beyond the traditional land of the applying FN, it ignores the generations of "settlers" who have lived of the land similarly and have provided unmatched input into game conservation. It creates an unequal and divided society. It also does not address the environmental impact of the energy and mineral projects that were the cause of the court injunction in the first place, this should be remedied first by optimizing industrial impact/encroachment, measures to remediate impact during development and after closure of the projects instead of creating social inequality within the northern communities.

my comments

[HarryToolips]

this is a blanket proposal that goes geographically beyond the traditional land of the applying FN, it ignores the generations of "settlers" who have lived of the land similarly and have provided unmatched input into game conservation. It creates an unequal and divided society. It also does not address the environmental impact of the energy and mineral projects that were the cause of the court injunction in the first place, this should be remedied first by optimizing industrial impact/encroachment, measures to remediate impact during development and after closure of the projects instead of creating social inequality within the northern communities.

my comments

Very well said...

In summary, I mentioned regulated hunting for select males is not even close to the primary cause of species decline, in addition to the resource extraction environmental impacts, there are other habitat issues as well as predator issues that should be addressed.. don't attack the group that induces money and value to our wildlife resource..

[HappyJack]

The odd thing is the court ruling is in regards to their ability to hunt closer to home with less competition, so why implement LEH over the entire MU? Unless there was someone else in the mix that we don't know about lobbying for it??

[IronNoggin]

this is a blanket proposal that goes geographically beyond the traditional land of the applying FN, it ignores the generations of "settlers" who have lived of the land similarly and have provided unmatched input into game conservation. It creates an unequal and divided society. It also does not address the environmental impact of the energy and mineral projects that were the cause of the court injunction in the first place, this should be remedied first by optimizing industrial impact/encroachment, measures to remediate impact during development and after closure of the projects instead of creating social inequality within the northern communities.

Well said indeed!!! https://www.tnof.ca/styles/default/xenforo/smilies/Pozitive.gif

I very much hope you sent those comments in!
This is exactly the kind of message we need them to get!


The odd thing is the court ruling is in regards to their ability to hunt closer to home with less competition, so why implement LEH over the entire MU? Unless there was someone else in the mix that we don't know about lobbying for it??

The court ruling said NO SUCH THING.
What they did say was:

"Justice Burke found that BRFN’s Treaty 8 rights depend on healthy populations of moose and other wildlife so that the BRFN members have a chance at being successful on their hunts and do not need to travel far from or outside of their territory to find game (para 437)."

It is widely recognized that the area in question has the largest moose population in the Province, and that both theirs, and the Caribou herds are "stable or increasing". Their populations are therefore recognized as meeting the litmus test of being "healthy".

Hunting came into the picture when the NDP government decided it was a decent trading chip to offer rather than actually addressing environmental concerns. There is zero reason to half the moose tags, cut completely the caribou hunting, and impose an LEH in the Region other than an overt bribe to continue with ever expanding industrial activities. Period.
The FN's however agreed to go with that tradeoff... for now...

2 days left to get those comments in folks!

https://apps.nrs.gov.bc.ca/ahte/content/close-peace-caribou-hunts-and-reduce-peace-moose-hunts-region-wide

Nog

[mooze]

[QUOTE=IronNoggin;2330075]Well said indeed!!! https://www.tnof.ca/styles/default/xenforo/smilies/Pozitive.gif

I very much hope you sent those comments in!
This is exactly the kind of message we need them to get!


that was my comment when I OPPOSED.

cheers!

[CheesyLimper]

Might be posted elsewhere, but read the notification. No caribou permits being issued in region 6 either....hmmmm. I guess that's the "harmonizing" region 6 and 7 they proposed way back before we knew exactly what that meant.
https://www2.gov.bc.ca/gov/content/sports-culture/recreation/fishing-hunting/hunting/permit-to-accompany

[DJK]

I received this in a response to my email to Peter Milobar, MLA Kamloops-North Thompson:


Additionally, you may be interested in attending the upcoming virtual townhall:


Date: Wednesday, March 30, 2022
Time: 5:30-7:00pm PDT
Topic: Government's changes to hunting regulations
Register: Eventbrite <https://can01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.eventbrite.ca%2Fe%2Fpropose d-hunting-regulations-virtual-roundtable-with-the-bc-liberal-caucus-tickets-298262881307&data=04%7C01%7CJulie.Dormer%40leg.bc.ca%7Cd21c36c2 854244502b4608da08f86b9a%7C68f96eb1b9544ae9ab6a9a5 13408ba40%7C0%7C0%7C637832160292611083%7CUnknown%7 CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiL CJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=rrkX%2FTgFWzUC%2FmIm8jJ4odq8RVXf8HFq4TdF0ri2 x20%3D&reserved=0> after registration and closer to the townhall date, attendees will receive a Zoom link


Tune in, should be informative.

[walks with deer]

I received this in a response to my email to Peter Milobar, MLA Kamloops-North Thompson:


Additionally, you may be interested in attending the upcoming virtual townhall:


Date: Wednesday, March 30, 2022
Time: 5:30-7:00pm PDT
Topic: Government's changes to hunting regulations
Register: Eventbrite <https://can01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.eventbrite.ca%2Fe%2Fpropose d-hunting-regulations-virtual-roundtable-with-the-bc-liberal-caucus-tickets-298262881307&data=04%7C01%7CJulie.Dormer%40leg.bc.ca%7Cd21c36c2 854244502b4608da08f86b9a%7C68f96eb1b9544ae9ab6a9a5 13408ba40%7C0%7C0%7C637832160292611083%7CUnknown%7 CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiL CJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=rrkX%2FTgFWzUC%2FmIm8jJ4odq8RVXf8HFq4TdF0ri2 x20%3D&reserved=0> after registration and closer to the townhall date, attendees will receive a Zoom link


Tune in, should be informative.

Yes signed up...

Come on looky loues get in there.

[Imdone]

Web site said it will be Down March 22.

Get er Done.

I'm done ...... Also Called out the NDP liars for not using TOGETHER FOR WILDLIFE and supporting ALL BC RESIDENTS

[IronNoggin]

... that was my comment when I OPPOSED.

cheers!

AWESOME!!
Many Thanks Indeed!!

This will not only effect us, but those we take along from other parts of the Country...

Permit to Accompany Non-Resident or Non-Resident Aliens to Hunt Big Game
Due to proposed regulation changes in Peace, Skeena, and Omineca regions, Permit to Accompany applications for moose and caribou in these regions are not being reviewed. We recommend submitting applications for moose and caribou after June 1, 2022.

Note that Region Six has already been included...

https://www2.gov.bc.ca/gov/content/sports-culture/recreation/fishing-hunting/hunting/permit-to-accompany

[Bugle M In]

Not meaning to throw more fuel on the fire, and slightly veered of angle here, but, if this FN thing wasn't enough.
There are folks in the hunting arena who would also like to curb hunts based on where one lives, with more priority given to
locals, vs those from the LM.
Some will agree with that, and others wont. (really depends on what side of the fence you live:?)
All it tells me is, the more limited hunting becomes in the province, the more some will want to limit those they "still can limit"!
So, although of course, in the end, proposals/decisions that are happening today, could have further consequences down the road.
Limitations follow more limitations, so on and so forth.
Looking over the decades at hunting regs, and how big they have grown, makes it really easy to see the trend.
And it doesn't look like there is any help or sunshine on the horizon.

In a nutshell, this all all because the ministry and countless different government parties in power have done very little.
And i refer to little as not doing much to help wildlife thrive.
So, as it dwindles, so are we.
IT will be a dog eat dog mentality soon enough.

[Avalanche123]

Not meaning to throw more fuel on the fire, and slightly veered of angle here, but, if this FN thing wasn't enough.
There are folks in the hunting arena who would also like to curb hunts based on where one lives, with more priority given to
locals, vs those from the LM.
Some will agree with that, and others wont. (really depends on what side of the fence you live:?)
All it tells me is, the more limited hunting becomes in the province, the more some will want to limit those they "still can limit"!
So, although of course, in the end, proposals/decisions that are happening today, could have further consequences down the road.
Limitations follow more limitations, so on and so forth.
Looking over the decades at hunting regs, and how big they have grown, makes it really easy to see the trend.
And it doesn't look like there is any help or sunshine on the horizon.

In a nutshell, this all all because the ministry and countless different government parties in power have done very little.
And i refer to little as not doing much to help wildlife thrive.
So, as it dwindles, so are we.
IT will be a dog eat dog mentality soon enough.

I have been hunting in BC in 1985...I agree with your comments and bolded your last sentence but it seems to be dog eat dog now.....

[IronNoggin]

... In a nutshell, this all all because the ministry and countless different government parties in power have done very little.

In this particular case they did a lot.
To ensure their gravy train isn't interrupted that is.
They tossed all hunters under the bus simply so they did not have to address cost;y habitat remediation, and to allow them to permit industrial degradation & destruction of even more habitat.
That is entirely Effed Up!

Writing is very much on the wall if this proceeds!

Those that are sitting on their laurels thinking this will not effect them, think again!
Already hungry eyes well south of the Peace are turning towards deer and elk.
I suggest it is in your best interest to get involved while you still have the opportunity to do so!!

While limited time remains to get an email or letter (or many of each) headed in the right direction, please note:

Today represents the FINAL DAY to get your comments in to the government survey!

https://apps.nrs.gov.bc.ca/ahte/content/close-peace-caribou-hunts-and-reduce-peace-moose-hunts-region-wide

If you haven't already, please do!!

Cheers & Thanks!
Nog

[HappyJack]

The odd thing is the court ruling is in regards to their ability to hunt closer to home with less competition, so why implement LEH over the entire MU? Unless there was someone else in the mix that we don't know about lobbying for it??


The court ruling said NO SUCH THING.
What they did say was:successful on their hunts and do not need to travel far from or outside of their territory to find game

Exactly what he said.......

[IronNoggin]

Get a grip http://www.outdoorsmenforum.ca/images/smilies/snapoutofit.gif

What immediately prefaces what you had to yell?

"Justice Burke found that BRFN’s Treaty 8 rights depend on healthy populations of moose and other wildlife "

There is NO case suggesting the moose & caribou populations do not meet the standard of "healthy".
Period.

They do NOT have to travel "outside of their territory to find game".
Period.

You, and they, are simply using that as an excuse for abhorrent behavior towards your neighbors.

The government is employing that excuse to further degrade the land.

Both are pathetic.

Once again... http://www.outdoorsmenforum.ca/images/smilies/snapoutofit.gif

Nog

[Bugle M In]

I know there is a lot going on with hunters and FN and the province.
And its a big factor and also with some heavy consequences down the road, and i think we are really only starting down the
road of pitfalls.

I brought up the dog eat dog, due to some other conversations I have had of recent and some of the other chats on other
forums within the hunting circle.
And while we all should be watching and taking action with this whole FN issue, there are some that see it as over and done with
and are now looking at what other avenues are left for hunters.
And, what i am finding alarming (and quite a lot to be honest), is the direction some are considering.
And that consideration is knowing that LEH will become the big end game for us to hunt in BC.
And with that, some are considering that priority be given to residents "in the area".
In other words, if you ain't from around them parts, like the LM or island, that you have less consideration or opportunity.

To me, I can se why some might "feel" that way.
But, its a whole other issue if that is how we are going to operate in the future!
We do that, then some of us are no different than the segregation we are seeing right now within 7b!
So, while we complain about them vs us.
There of some of us that are starting to try and seperate from the rest of us!

And all i can say is, the Ministry will be more willing then ever to entertain that concept, imo.
After all, the end game is finding ways to do away with us.
Piece by piece, hunter by hunter.
Segregate/Divide and conquer comes to mind.
And we are doing a piss poor job in "protecting each other", imo.

[mikeman20]

sent the emails.

[Arctic Lake]

Thank You for the tips for letters and comments . Done
Arctic Lake

[Ohwildwon]

This is what I wrote in the comment section…

One land, one people…

Thanks for turning me from a sustainable hunter,

to a poacher, all for your political gain..

[IronNoggin]

Seems we have been granted a day's grace!
The government site actually appears to still be open for comment!

Inside sources have noted "The government engagement page was bombarded with comments the last few days. Over 98% want the proposal gone."

So Folks, if you haven't already, please take advantage of the one day's grace...

https://apps.nrs.gov.bc.ca/ahte/content/close-peace-caribou-hunts-and-reduce-peace-moose-hunts-region-wide

Cheers & Thanks!
Nog

[Bugle M In]

And you know what ( and it’s no surprise), I have seen 0 airtime on the news about this!!!
Not shocked, but it sure sums up the whole hidden agenda.

[bearvalley]

Hopefully the 7B proposal gets put on hold and properly thought out.
There’s talk that the heat is on government.
This thread shows what can get done if all pull together.
Thanks IrronNoggin for keeping everyone on the right path.

[Cabled]

Hey,
looking for info on the proposed harmonization of seasons that was in the proposed hunting reg changes back in January. Does anyone know where I could find it? Not seeing it on the govt website.
thanks.

[Arctic Lake]

Yes Thanks Nog for all the time you devoted to keeping us informed ! Much appreciated !
Arctic Lake

[HappyJack]

Hopefully the 7B proposal gets put on hold and properly thought out.
There’s talk that the heat is on government.
This thread shows what can get done if all pull together.
Thanks IrronNoggin for keeping everyone on the right path.

Wishful thinking I'm afraid, this was probably a done deal before it even came out.

[bearvalley]

Wishful thinking I'm afraid, this was probably a done deal before it even came out.

Time will tell Jack.
There’s been a lot of flaws pointed out in what the NDP pulled with their trade off of hunters in favour of resource extraction.

[Sitkaspruce]

Wow, hit the ice for a week of fishing and zero cell coverage and come back to a few different posts driven by people to get people to fill out the survey or what ever you call it!! Nice to see this gaining some speed!

I guess we will see what transpires come LEH time. And remember, this is only a 2 year trial.........

A couple things that have come to light:

- This was a BRFN (actually Yahey vs the Crown) decision for their own traditional territory, which is about 70-80% covered by industrial activity and private land ownership. So what the judge stated in her decision has some truths. BUT, you all have to ask, why is the decision being applied to all of 7B and the treaty 8 lands, when no other band was involved in the court case and the judge didn't hand down her decision for the rest of the Treaty 8 bands?? Why is lands that have no industrial activity being put on LEH?
- This push by the NDP to go to LEH is really being driven by three treaty 8 bands. In fact, some bands are not enthusiastic about the LEH decision at all.

We are but pawns in a chess game where the king and queen on both sides actually working together to clear the board of the pawns.

Mark my words, elk and deer are next as they are also easy to manipulate. The only thing holding that back is the ranchers and farmers and their associated groups. They fought a very good battler to reduce elk pops up here and will do it again, especially if elk got to LEH. But elk will probably only go to LEH north of FSJ, west and south of the Pine R. and along foothills of the Rockies. Deer will be simply to reduce hunter #'s as most FN don't chase deer.

Cheers

SS

[bearvalley]

Sitkaspruce, how much thought have you given to Y2Y and our current Minister of Environment….???

[Bugle M In]

Another thing to throw on the pile here but to further consider future impacts on hunting opportunity on top of 7b, treaties, more and more Leh, is also wildfire.
I know some groups like FN bands, depending where and big the impacts have been to date want to see full out closures, not just vehicle bands.
And I don’t think we are finished burning.
To me, this right now dictates everything going forward and what opportunities, or better yet, how little opportunity will be left.
Important to all to take the time and pass it on.
Now is not the time to fight over the remaining crumbs.
Plenty of time for that later.

[IronNoggin]

I would like to extend my personal THANKS to everyone that took a moment to try and defend our outdoors heritage by commenting on the government survey, sending emails through the various platforms that were offering such, and most especially to those who wrote actual letters and sent them in.

Some little time remains to do the latter, as well as hitting the sites offering their form emails.

Your help in this matter was and is Greatly Appreciated!

Let's now hope someone with at least a little common sense is listening on the receiving end...

Cheers,
Matt

[Ohwildwon]

And you know what ( and it’s no surprise), I have seen 0 airtime on the news about this!!!
Not shocked, but it sure sums up the whole hidden agenda.

I asked Jesse Zeman, (on twitter) if he could get on Mike Smythe’s talk show

on CKNW 5 days ago, he just gave me a thumbs up!

[Sitkaspruce]

Sitkaspruce, how much thought have you given to Y2Y and our current Minister of Environment….???

BV

I have not looked much into Y2Y, but I do have a bit of an inside into some of their "direction" and from what I have seen, it is not good. Too much save the land AND the animals than lets protect the land and allow recreation to occur on it, including hunting. They want to set land aside to create these "protected areas" between the Yukon and the Yellowstone and don't allow any recreation on it. But I am all ears if there is more to them......

MOE is another story. Will be interesting to see how the reorg and UNDRIP will affect them. I know lots of staff, along with FLNRORD (or MOF and LANDWaRS) are PO by what has happened up here with no discussion with them.

If I missed you question BV, you might have to spell it out more for me....

Cheers

SS

[Sitkaspruce]

Wow, hit the ice for a week of fishing and zero cell coverage and come back to a few different posts driven by people to get people to fill out the survey or what ever you call it!! Nice to see this gaining some speed!

I guess we will see what transpires come LEH time. And remember, this is only a 2 year trial.........

A couple things that have come to light:

- This was a BRFN (actually Yahey vs the Crown) decision for their own traditional territory, which is about 70-80% covered by industrial activity and private land ownership. So what the judge stated in her decision has some truths. BUT, you all have to ask, why is the decision being applied to all of 7B and the treaty 8 lands, when no other band was involved in the court case and the judge didn't hand down her decision for the rest of the Treaty 8 bands?? Why is lands that have no industrial activity being put on LEH?
- This push by the NDP to go to LEH is really being driven by three treaty 8 bands. In fact, some bands are not enthusiastic about the LEH decision at all.

We are but pawns in a chess game where the king and queen on both sides actually working together to clear the board of the pawns.

Mark my words, elk and deer are next as they are also easy to manipulate. The only thing holding that back is the ranchers and farmers and their associated groups. They fought a very good battler to reduce elk pops up here and will do it again, especially if elk got to LEH. But elk will probably only go to LEH north of FSJ, west and south of the Pine R. and along foothills of the Rockies. Deer will be simply to reduce hunter #'s as most FN don't chase deer.

Cheers

SS

An update to the above.

BRFN say they have nothing to do with the 7B moose decision. That knocks off another band that is NOT pushing for this decision. Sadly the ones that are have always had the ear of the NDP. And, just for shits and giggles, are the one who have been fighting site C....one problem goes away when you can correct another.

https://www.alaskahighwaynews.ca/fort-st-john/we-have-no-agreement-blueberry-river-first-nations-speaks-out-against-proposed-hunting-closures-5196702

IF the moose (and deer/elk) decision makes the Site C battle disappear or gets reduced to "meetings", then we will know one of the reasons for the push! Tin hat?? Maybe, but not far off......

Cheers

SS

[Arctic Lake]

Please let us know if this happens !
Arctic Lake

I asked Jesse Zeman, (on twitter) if he could get on Mike Smythe’s talk show

on CKNW 5 days ago, he just gave me a thumbs up!

[bearvalley]

BV

I have not looked much into Y2Y, but I do have a bit of an inside into some of their "direction" and from what I have seen, it is not good. Too much save the land AND the animals than lets protect the land and allow recreation to occur on it, including hunting. They want to set land aside to create these "protected areas" between the Yukon and the Yellowstone and don't allow any recreation on it. But I am all ears if there is more to them......

MOE is another story. Will be interesting to see how the reorg and UNDRIP will affect them. I know lots of staff, along with FLNRORD (or MOF and LANDWaRS) are PO by what has happened up here with no discussion with them.

If I missed you question BV, you might have to spell it out more for me....

Cheers

SS

Sitkaspruce, with the NDP’s closure/reduction proposal having no science to back the regulation change and looking very much like the 7B proposal is a caucus decision …. I can see George Heyman, the Minister of Environment and also the ex CEO of the Sierra Club of BC being quite pleased if people are removed from the Y2Y corridor.
Heyman, with his past ties to the environmental movement isn’t a friend to hunters.

[Ohwildwon]

Please let us know if this happens !
Arctic Lake

Mike is on CKNW 9am till noon weekdays

[Imdone]

No wonder, several long time Bios, COs and managers are quiting their jobs. Their passion for their positions is being torn away, lack of respect from government to them and wildlife is rampant.

Simply put, this government doesn't give a dam about them, their efforts, their knowledge or wildlife. It's no different than their lack of management of fisheries.

The NDP are proving they are self directed by the new world order, woke n broke, being re-elected to get that pension. Past records of the NDP governance has done nothing but sink this province to the sewers in so many ways.

[Bugle M In]

This government, or better some in the nod don’t care.
Ss said before, Heyman is my Mia.
ehen nod tried to get in he was pounding doors like crazy.
Returned to my complex twice.
Said he was all supportive of hunters.
Second return I had more questions to have better clarity.
He talked about the nod stance in gbear.
But, I wanted to talk ingulate # and declines also.
And finally I asked about having FN report all their kills for better science.
He literally turned and walked away at that point.
And I was cordial and commenting due ti his science and numbers.
Told me everything right there

[IronNoggin]

Things that make you go Hmmmmm...

‘We have no agreement’: Blueberry River First Nations speaks out against proposed hunting closures

Blueberry River First Nations Chief Judy Desjarlais says her community had no involvement with the province’s proposal to cut the number of moose that can be harvested in Northeast B.C.

Blueberry River First Nations Chief Judy Desjarlais says her community had no involvement with the province’s proposal to cut the number of moose that can be harvested in Northeast B.C.

“We have no agreement in regards to that decision by the province, what they’ve decided to do, regarding the funding,” said Desjarlais. “That was their own action, it had nothing to do with Blueberry, because we have not reached any agreement with the province, especially with the wildlife impact pertaining to the treaty rights litigation.”

She added that the nation remains at the negotiating table, following their legal victory last summer in winning a cumulative impacts claim against the province.

“We’re working with the province to make it clear that Blueberry had no hand in their decision when it comes to reducing the number of moose hunted,” Desjarlais said.

Under the new terms, caribou hunts would be closed permanently in the Peace Region, while the number of killable number of moose would be slashed to 50%, in addition to cutting the number of hunting licenses available to 50%.

Moose hunting would also be closed from Aug. 15 to 31, and Oct. 1 to 15 in the Peace.

According to a regulation release earlier this month by the province, the hunting changes are expected to be an interim measure and one part of a broader package of actions specific to improving wildlife stewardship, upholding Treaty rights, habitat conservation, and the future of resource management.

“These proposed hunting regulations are aimed at addressing the ability of Treaty 8 First Nations to continue their way of life and begin to address the impacts of industrial development of the rights guaranteed in this Treaty as confirmed in the Supreme Court of BC decision Yahey vs. BC,” reads the release.

Desjarlais said she’s unable to comment on what Blueberry wants to see for moose and caribou management as they remain at the negotiating table with the province.

“We’re still at the table, but first and foremost we would like our Treaty rights protected. As you know from past posts, Treaty rights have been breached when it comes to impacts by development,” said Desjarlais. “The result of that is that is there was a threat to our way of life, which is hunting, fishing, and trapping.”

https://www.alaskahighwaynews.ca/fort-st-john/we-have-no-agreement-blueberry-river-first-nations-speaks-out-against-proposed-hunting-closures-5196702

And from this article: https://energeticcity.ca/2022/03/24/141117/

South Peace MLA Mike Bernier spoke with Energeticcity last week and said he’s concerned the province is creating a racial divide in the Peace with their proposed moose and caribou hunting restrictions.

Bernier believes that the government’s decision is based solely on politics.

“My fear is, and what I’m starting to hear, is that the government is actually creating and continually creating almost a racial divide here. I feel very bad for the First Nations in our region who are being caught in the middle because the government’s making announcements without talking to people without talking to all of the stakeholders and all of the different clubs,” Bernier said.

“The challenge there is I’m even hearing from a lot of First Nations locally that are contacting me kind of off the record saying they are getting very frustrated with the government trying to put them in the middle of this.”

Minister of Forests Katrine Conroy rebuked Bernier’s comments and says the regulations are an attempt to create a better future for everyone residing in the Peace.

“Mr. Bernier’s attempts to stoke racial divides are disturbing and frankly represent an outdated approach. In 2019, all members of the B.C. legislature stood together to support enshrining the Declaration on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples into law. Our government remains dedicated to living up to that commitment,” Conroy said.

“Our goal is to bring communities together, not divide them. It’s important to remember that these conversations are focused on addressing the ability of Treaty 8 First Nations to continue their way of life and the impacts of industrial development on their rights,” Conroy said.

Conroy says she has personally met with B.C.’s hunting community members to ensure their views are heard as part of this process.

.................................................. .........

Odd that Conroy won't answer any letters or emails, but has the gall to insist she "has personally met with BC's hunting community members". I call BS on that!

Not at all surprising she trotted out the race card. Somewhat ironic of her considering what she is in the process of promoting...

Nog

[Bugle M In]

Thanks Nog,
I will stand by my words as well with the one on one, face to face with Heyman.
I knew the great hunt was over if they got in, but made a great long speech about supporting
meat hunts blah blah blah.
But, talk about FN role in working together for better numbers for science, well….
As soon as I said FN, he literally walked away.
And I was no where in the realm of bashing them.
I look at both FN and RH as the only way “ combined” to make a difference.
I can’t say who else in the upper seats of the NDP are behind all of this, but there was
wsy more going on even before they got in!

Worst part, they got in because Clarke didn’t eliminate the bridge toll fully.
Not that they were adding value to our wildlife either.
But we wouldn’t be dealing with this OP right now.

For RH, this is bad bad bad.
Snd I agree, if it goes thru, there will be a racial divide like no other time in our BC history.
It may not show in the LM, but anywhere in the Interior,
it will be a huge game changer!

[Sitkaspruce]

Sitkaspruce, with the NDP’s closure/reduction proposal having no science to back the regulation change and looking very much like the 7B proposal is a caucus decision …. I can see George Heyman, the Minister of Environment and also the ex CEO of the Sierra Club of BC being quite pleased if people are removed from the Y2Y corridor.
Heyman, with his past ties to the environmental movement isn’t a friend to hunters.

And he was my Union President.....and now I have found out that most of the Union executive is somehow linked with the Sierra Club....3 more years....3 more years I keep telling myself!

Interesting that Y2Y and SC has come to the table. No surprise as they have been hiding in the weeds, but to use the FN as a way in the back door will piss the FN off. Y2Y has been trying to inject themselves in the "save the caribou" program in the south Peace, but so far, they have been kept at arms length. BUT...maybe they got in by sweet talking the two FN bands in the south that are driving the moose change. Thanks BV, now I have something else to dig into.

There is lots of disillusion in the ranks of FLNRORD/MOE as if you screen out the bureaucrats, which takes a lot of work, there is some very dedicated staff who try to do good work. To see it just yanked out from underneath them with no discussion has left a bitter taste in their mouth....and wondering what their job is and who they are working for.

Cheers

SS

[weatherbyjunkie]

I just checked my email and there was a draft of the letter my MLA is going to read tomorrow in the legislature regarding the 7B changes, looks pretty good. I wonder how many of these will be read this week? And how much difference it will make..... Something is better than nothing in terms of effort, but I'm also not naive enough to hold my breathe waiting

[Bugle M In]

Well, it’s better than nothing.
Concern needs to be heard so that others can begin to comprehend.
The hush hush with the media is what concerns me the most.
The politician side of the ndp does not however.

[IronNoggin]

I just checked my email and there was a draft of the letter my MLA is going to read tomorrow in the legislature regarding the 7B changes, looks pretty good. I wonder how many of these will be read this week? And how much difference it will make..... Something is better than nothing in terms of effort, but I'm also not naive enough to hold my breathe waiting

After he has had the opportunity to present that to the Legislature, please consider posting it here.

Thanks,
Nog

[DJK]

After he has had the opportunity to present that to the Legislature, please consider posting it here.

Thanks,
Nog


I'll second that. Please and thanks.

[weatherbyjunkie]

I'll second that. Please and thanks.

I don't have very good success posting on this site. Any helpers?

[weatherbyjunkie]

I'll second that. Please and thanks.


Also, have any other HBC members have their MLA write/read letters on this matter?

[IronNoggin]

I don't have very good success posting on this site. Any helpers?

PM incoming...

[Bugle M In]

Also, have any other HBC members have their MLA write/read letters on this matter?
In the past I did and sent to Heyman.
All I ever get is some bs standard issue reply from his office.
I have never ever received a personal email back from him directly.
Once he got in, he went with his personal agenda.
Before being elected, he responded to my emails directly and in person.
Now it is all political bs written ahead of time by staff.
That should tell everyone everything right there.
Basically the same issue like you see happening between the sport salmon industry anthe main politicians in charge back east!
Same crap.
The only time politicians take time to respond directly and in first person is when they are trying to get elected or win.

[IronNoggin]

Dear Premier,

I am exceedingly disappointed that you have chosen to simply ignore my repeated requests for clarification in this matter.
I was under the impression that you and your Government works for us, and are therefore accountable to us to some degree.
I can now clearly ascertain that is not the way you understand it to be.

This is a very serious matter, especially so given the stated concerns of the involved First Nation, outdoor enthusiasts and many more.
It very much appears to be trading away the opportunities of the majority of those groups in order to proceed with further environmental damaging industrial developments. It also very much appears you and your Government did so unilaterally without the explicit consent of the involved First Nation, in direct contrast to what You yourself have stated you will be adhering to now and into the future.

I am now aware of several organizations that are investigating the potential of litigation should this proposal be implemented.
Due to the refusal of yourself and many of your Ministers to provide clarification / justification on the matter, I will be supporting those initiatives as strongly as I possibly can should this proposal be implemented.

Sincerely,

[IronNoggin]

Joint Statement from Chief Judy Desjarlais and Ministers Conroy & Rankin:

https://blueberryfn.com/statement-from-chief-judy-desjarlais/

Some may infer FN support for this initiative, however I am quite doubtful of that. Not what the Chief said at all: "Blueberry River First Nations has not come to an agreement with the Province on any wildlife measures, including any changes to wildlife regulations".

She does go on to note that: "We believe moose have been affected by over-development and that some temporary measures are required in some areas. As long as wildlife management and habitat restoration are managed sustainably, there can be a healthy hunting industry in future for everyone in northeast BC"

My interpretation would be that the BC Government took what they were alluding to, and ran willy nilly with it, imposing the restrictions over a MUCH LARGER area than that influenced by the FN in question. That they did so unilaterally. That they did so in the face of stable or increasing moose & caribou populations. And that they did so in order to continue with actually increasing the exact same type of environmental degradation / destruction that drove the court case in the first place.

Nog

[Sitkaspruce]

There are three bands pushing this agenda and the BRFN are not one of them. Neither are the Doig or the HRFN.

Here is one of them

www.dawsoncreekmirror.ca/local-news/saulteau-first-nations-calling-on-the-province-to-give-local-hunters-priority-in-limited-moose-hunting-draws-5207371 (http://www.dawsoncreekmirror.ca/local-news/saulteau-first-nations-calling-on-the-province-to-give-local-hunters-priority-in-limited-moose-hunting-draws-5207371)

This band is not even a BC band, they are Cree FN that "moved" from Manitoba in the 1900's and have been given the Peace Moberly Tract for them to manage and that is now off limits to all non FN for moose hunting....to start.

Everyone has to remember that the decision was for the BRFN (actually Chief Yahey) and the excessive development on their traditional territory, not Treaty 8's. Yet somehow, the Government, Saulteau, West Moberly and Prophet River FN's have turned that decision into one that covers all of the Peace. No Caribou hunting at all and a huge reduction of 50% of the licensed resident hunters hunting moose in the Peace. And remember, we have conservatively 45000 moose in the Peace and were harvesting ~1300/year, ~3% of the population. Now we are at 1% if we harvest the reduced number of 489. There is no, zero, zippo conservation concerns with moose in the Peace, yet here we are.

Do the homework, follow the UNDRIP decision and you will soon see that this is already spreading across BC.

Cheers

SS

[Rob Chipman]

Also, have any other HBC members have their MLA write/read letters on this matter?


Short answer? Yes.

Longer answer? My MLA gets all sorts of info from me to help her deal with things like anti-wolf cull calls, as well as calls from me for more funding, more science, etc.

That includes regular emails with updates from BCWF as well as wildlife bios and in person and Zoom meetings on a quarterly basis.

Once you get that system up and running it's not too hard to maintain.

[Ohwildwon]

I asked Jesse Zeman, (on twitter) if he could get on Mike Smythe’s talk show

on CKNW 5 days ago, he just gave me a thumbs up!

He’s on tomorrow @11:30am :cool:

[IronNoggin]

He’s on tomorrow @11:30am :cool:

Missed that due to being in eye surgery when it happened.

Any links by any chance??

Hoping...

Nog

[Ohwildwon]

Suggest listening on the Audio Vault.

Mike Smythe was excellent at laying out the talking points.

Jes was on point, in this has nothing to do with scientific

harvesting management…..

Please take the time to have a listen,

help solidify your talking points on this disgusting

NDP Government over reach…

Cheers all, please push back if you can!

[TheObserver]

Is the option to oppose still available? I am trying and it doesn't want to give me the option.

Nevermind just read the title.

[Bugle M In]

I just have to say this to all.
I live near city hall in Vancouver.
I have gotten to know a great many everyday folks since I have my dog.
And with that, I have countless opportunities to get to know all these people and them to get to know me.
And thru that, I have taken countless hours of time to inform them of how problematic our wildlife and habitat, salmon and steelhead issues are.
And I can sum up their entire knowledge on all these issues as totally pathetic.
The majority of people in this province, especially in the LM have no clue as to what is happening!
Skme you could say have no interest in the subject/s certainly.
But for the most part, many just don’t know.
The media does a piss poor job and often times has a one sided agenda with particular angles.
It either has to hold some FN content in it or some sort of Anti angle.

Somehow, our organizations from all sides, be it wildlife or fish, but all, have to figure out a way to get the news out there.
Hunting sites and R&G clubs have a very small focus group where most already know the issues.
Its outside of our little arena where the news and info needs to get pounded into the mainstream media.
Dont know how that is possible? But I only know if it doesn’t start to happen soon, then we are finished or worst yet,
it will be too late.
The majority of people amongst us just do not have a clue.
All if us in our separate organizations need to work together and focus on that one issue together.
I think it is by far the first priority.
Nothing will change otherwise.
Maube blocking borders on this kind of issue is what people will support.
But something to change the tide???

[J_T]

^^^ My only comment is regarding working together. Members of various organizations that are sitting on committee from:
- BCWF
- BC BHA
- WSSC
- TBBC
- UBBC
- GOABC
- Wildlife Stewardship
- Apologies if I missed one
Are for the most part, very much aligned, on the same page and working together. Many of these groups also sit on other committees as you know. They are not focused on their specific wants, but rather focused on wildlife, fish, habitat and working together. Collectively, we understand the indigenous relationship is complex. But we also understand being positional and dismissive, is simply not going to reveal results.
I'm not sure you will ever see the disparate views of so many on this site, 'working together'. Given the various perspectives of many on here, they will never put their own interests aside and align with the greater good. Wildlife.

A thread on 'what do hunters really think is important' would be interesting. If we could avoid the spiral declines of such topics as covid, Russia/Ukraine, freedom convoys, and the like.

When I receive interest from someone wanting to get involved, I ask a number of questions about their perspective on the situation. We can learn a lot from listening and working to understand. Rather than spouting off our theories and conspiracies.

[gathto]

Sorry if I missed this on previous posts. I just reviewed the proposal again and found this comment about the reduction of Licensed hunters in 7B. This means basically a reduction in hunting all game species doesn't it?



The effect of the hunting regulation changes will be approximately a 50% reduction in the number of moose killed by BC Licensed hunters in the Region 7B. There will also be a reduction of the number of BC Licensed hunters in Region 7B, which will be reviewed annually through the regional wildlife working group (Immediate Measure3).

[Fella]

^^^ My only comment is regarding working together. Members of various organizations that are sitting on committee from:
- BCWF
- BC BHA
- WSSC
- TBBC
- UBBC
- GOABC
- Wildlife Stewardship
- Apologies if I missed one
Are for the most part, very much aligned, on the same page and working together. Many of these groups also sit on other committees as you know. They are not focused on their specific wants, but rather focused on wildlife, fish, habitat and working together. Collectively, we understand the indigenous relationship is complex. But we also understand being positional and dismissive, is simply not going to reveal results.
I'm not sure you will ever see the disparate views of so many on this site, 'working together'. Given the various perspectives of many on here, they will never put their own interests aside and align with the greater good. Wildlife.

A thread on 'what do hunters really think is important' would be interesting. If we could avoid the spiral declines of such topics as covid, Russia/Ukraine, freedom convoys, and the like.

When I receive interest from someone wanting to get involved, I ask a number of questions about their perspective on the situation. We can learn a lot from listening and working to understand. Rather than spouting off our theories and conspiracies.

yep, all the above noted organizations have come out with very similar statements on the issue and all are generally aligned on most issues across the province. I’m fact many people have memberships in multiple groups. There is beginning to be more unity in BC to fight for habitat fish and wildlife and its great to see

[Bugle M In]

Yes JT,
there seems to be much more alignment with many of the groups.
And yes, there will be specific interests within each party.
I don’t know how we fix that? If ever?
But I do know, if we don’t get on the same page on the major points, we are in big troubles.

My biggest concern is from my last post is:
How do we get the general public to get properly informed.
To get them to also voice the same concerns,.
To become aware and actually start caring?

They are uninformed big time.
They are not aware.
Just because we are in a first world country, we have some real 3rd world problems developing in regards to habitat.
They do not get it.
And we won’t get far until they do.

You said it best in regards to the round table discussion.
The politicians who are involved are most likely only involved because they are seeking election.
There truly is very few of them that fully understand the situation.
Even they are uniformed
And that is what we have to chose from.
And that’s bad news for us.

Public awareness should be priority number 1.
Then we end up solving the real problem of funding.
And we would have majority backing.

And yes, that is a huge challenge.
If that doesn’t happen, I am of the opinion that it’s game over in 20 years max.

[Rob Chipman]

Yes JT,
there seems to be much more alignment with many of the groups.
And yes, there will be specific interests within each party.


I think you're misreading him. JT and I turn up in a lot of the same meetings with a bunch of those groups. I think it's worth underlining what he's observed when he said that these groups are
for the most part, very much aligned, on the same page and working together. ..... They are not focused on their specific wants, but rather focused on wildlife, fish, habitat and working together.


We are not pursuing specific interests. We are all very aligned. There isn't much of a problem on the score that needs to be fixed (aside from the allocation disagreements between RH and GOABC- that's a discussion for another thread but let's stick a pin on it before someone hits the rerun button).



My biggest concern is from my last post is:
How do we get the general public to get properly informed.
To get them to also voice the same concerns,.
To become aware and actually start caring?

They are uninformed big time.
They are not aware.


I want to say "It's simple. Not easy, but simple".

How do you get uninformed people to get properly informed and aware? You inform them. Simple.

It's not easy. It takes a lot of hands, and those hands have to be volunteers, and they have to be clear on what they're trying to do (and JT references this as well, fwiw).

Assuming you have a bunch of volunteers to do the work how do you do the work of informing? You get a clear message and you deliver it. You deliver it at screenings of documentaries and talks by bios doing the work. You spread the message on social media. You build a network of people on social media (including business people who are exploiting social media for profit and understand how it works, where it works and why it works) and you spread a message that runs counter to the one that you don't like seeing in the media.

How do you get them to care? You don't if you're an honest operator.

They either already care and are just uninformed, or they already don't care and it doesn't matter if you inform them.

And that brings us to the message that you try to inform people about.

If the message is that we're driving fish and wildlife to extinction in this province because of the way we disrupt habitat and manage human impact on it you will find a lot of people already care, and when you give them specifics they'll take notice of what you're saying. Most people care about animals. Anyone who's listened to much Shane Mahoney has heard him explain how the animal lover who thinks she's an anti-hunter is not actually our enemy. That's coming out of the mouth of a guy who was instrumental in making the North American Model of Wildlife Management a common term and a well understood system.

If he's saying it, listen.

If the message is that roughly 2% of the 5 million people who live in this province are losing the right to shoot animals? You're probably going to find that a lot of people already *don't* care. If you tell them that it's the fault of the Indians? Or the WEF? Or Trudeau? Of agenda 2030? Stick a fork in your own ass and turn yourself over, because you're done. You are not making the sale. Everyone is entitled to hold their opinions on all those *other* issues, but they are not fish, wildlife and habitat issues.


JT also said:
Collectively, we understand the indigenous relationship is complex. But we also understand being positional and dismissive, is simply not going to reveal results.

All I can say is: Hunnerd percent! A recent intra-org meeting of most of the groups he listed proved that in spades.

You want results? You have to learn to deal with and live with people that you may think you don't like. That includes First Nations. Hate them if you must, but make a decision: are you going to indulge your hate or are you going to concentrate on the goal of fish, wildlife and habitat?

(Some of you may have seen Sean Penn on Hannity the other night. They talked about how far apart they were politically and how Penn did not trust Hannity, but that he was willing to talk to Hannity, on Fox, about Ukraine. Why? Because, as Penn explained, his distrust of Hannity is a petty and personal indulgence that pales in significance next to what's happening in Ukraine. There's a lesson there.)



Want to inform the 60% of people who came out against the wolf cull, the majority of whom were in southern BC? Predominantly in the Koots, Okanagan and Lower Mainland? Join an existing group of volunteers and bring a guy like Clayton Lamb down to George Heyman's riding, set up in a craft brewery, create an exciting event and inform people who already care *but are just uninformed*. He'll challenge anti-wolf cull people to re-evaluate their thinking, just as Dr. Rob Serrouya did when he presented in Gastown on the subject.

Don't know who Clayton Lamb is: Check out this tweet thread: https://twitter.com/ClaytonTLamb/status/1508801589208920075

Some of you may disagree with his position on Indigenous peoples, or on Y2Y. You'll need to decide if that disagreement is a petty and personal indulgence or whether its a hill to die on.

[Sitkaspruce]

Don't mean to double post, but with more than one post on this, I have updated a couple different posts on this topic.

Iron Noggin made the local newspaper......

www.alaskahighwaynews.ca/fort-st-john/hunters-rally-behind-bc-liberals-on-proposed-moose-hunt-changes-5217035 (https://www.alaskahighwaynews.ca/fort-st-john/hunters-rally-behind-bc-liberals-on-proposed-moose-hunt-changes-5217035)

And comments from one of the bands behind the changes

www.alaskahighwaynews.ca/opinion/letters-open-season-on-moose-doesnt-make-sense-5207226 (https://www.alaskahighwaynews.ca/opinion/letters-open-season-on-moose-doesnt-make-sense-5207226)

I do agree with what they are saying about habitat destruction and fragmentation. Is some areas, especially along the foothills from Tumbler to the Graham R, where Saulteau and West Moberly hunt, there has been some recorded loss of moose numbers and it does get crowded. And there is other places where numbers are down. BUT, it is not because of hunting (remember, we have the 2/3/10 rule and most places have a rut closure Oct 1-15). It is because of habitat destruction/fragmentation buy multiple industries caused by a lack of government oversite. Over all, moose are doing well in most places in the Peace and will continue to do so. I am also p*ssed off about the hate speach, threats etc. There is no place in this for that kind of sh*t. If you are angry, focus it at the NDP, they are the creator of this crap we are in.

I don't agree with most everything else they say. IF LEH was so great, then why are moose numbers still going down in other regions in BC where there is LEH?? The BC Government has already stated that all wildlife is owned by ALL people of BC, so they will not give the tags to locals.

And, what they don't say, is they have already got the their own private hunting spot, the Peace Moberly Tract, where no white resident can hunt moose, never.

Remember Bill 14 and this little tidbit

Sheltering

This change enables the minister and First Nations to enter into legally binding agreements on “sheltering.” Sheltering is the practice of a host First Nation permitting a guest First Nation to harvest wildlife within the host’s territory. Permission typically comes with conditions (such as who may hunt what species, when, where and by what means). When a First Nation enters into these agreements with the minister, it will bring provincial laws into alignment with the existing Indigenous laws. This change is expected to improve certainty around data collection and sharing of information on wildlife.

Cheers

SS

[Bugle M In]

I totally understood JT and agree fully with all he said.
No issues there.
And as stated, have spent countless hours and too many of the general public to keep count, trying to educate them
on the issues.
How hunters are easily pointed at by society as the problem when in fact I go into great detail about the real issues.
I rarely waste any time talking about FN related issues, except maybe the use of nets and lack of reporting.
It mostly on cause and effect.
All the stuff that has been talked about on hbc.

And yes, people do seem to realize stuff they weren’t aware of or had considered.
But, I always get the sense that for most, once the conversation is over, they stop pondering it.
Back to ordering from skip the dishes and whatever mini series they are into watching.

What is missing is a daily “bombardment” of the issues, imo.
Without it, mists folks have about a 5 second attention span.
I know people first hand who are out there in their industries trying to lead a charge with great science in their hands to prove what they are saying.
But it seems to be them vs the government and in a nutshell, leaving them banging their heads on the table.
And even while busting their asses, they still find themselves losing ground.

To me, the missing factor is the general public.
And the general public isn’t there because they are not getting the info and news they need daily that actually gets them to wake up.

That is my only point.

[Bugle M In]

My take on the Roundtable discussion and 7b is simple.
The NDP will hammer it thru.
aid the Libs were to get in( and I have my doubts), that yes, we may not be seeing the same issue.
I don’t know what recourse they would have after the fact to be honest?

But I also took away from the discussions and all the varied comments that did end up going off topic, imo, that if the Libs get in, much of our issues related to wildlife and habitat still won’t get any better sadly.
I think for many mla’s, regardless of party, have very little clue as to what us going on of what to do about it.
Snd I am not criticizing personal intelligence of many of them.
Its not that.
Its just way outside the wheelhouse for thx majority of them.
There is very few running in politics that truly understand it when it comes to wildlife and user groups and the future.
That’s what I got from it.

[IronNoggin]

My take on the Roundtable discussion and 7b is simple.
The NDP will hammer it thru.

I hope you are wrong.
And if not, they WILL find themselves in Court.
Hopefully in front of the same Judge that made the related ruling.

Nog

[IronNoggin]

Of the dozens of letters & Emails I sent out in this regard, the only one that responded was Heyman:


https://i.imgur.com/KmjV7qr.jpg


My response:


You are the Minister of ENVIRONMENT!!
The BC Supreme Court Case which initiated these draconian actions by your party was focused entirely upon Environmental concerns.
Period.


Your attempt to "pass the buck" in this instance is beyond infuriating.


I demand an answer as to your involvement with these matters, and further that you take immediate steps to rectify the stripping away of hunting privileges in order to continue with increased environmental degradation / destruction.


In other words: DO YOUR JOB!

[Bugle M In]

I told you Nog, I have a couple of face to face conversations with him.
Talked a good game the first time around.
Second time round when I had some tougher questions for him he just “walked away”.
And I mean literally walked away!!!

So nope, I will go with my gut.
Doesnt matter how many fights thee are to be had out there.
You have to stand up for the Big Fundamental ones First!!!
In other words, go with our gut feelings.
Sure, there are plenty of issues to deal with.
But if we don’t stand up to the core ones, the others are just frivolous and dissolve into nothing anyways.
So, what’s the point then??!

Heymsn is an F’n goof anyways.
Even if he wasn’t a politician, he wouldn’t be someone I would associate with anyways.
But, it’s folks like him who are changing”our future”!

[huntingfamily]

Have your voice heard — another opportunity to get involved in wildlife management decisions.

The Province is seeking feedback on key elements of the draft plan including the plan’s goals & objectives as well as the proposed habitat and population management actions. In addition to the online posting and feedback, opportunities for engagement for stakeholders and communities in Northeast B.C. are scheduled to share information and provide feedback throughout the process.

Engagement timelines: April 4, 2022 – May 20, 2022

https://engage.gov.bc.ca/caribou/boreal-caribou/

[Bugle M In]

Have your voice heard — another opportunity to get involved in wildlife management decisions.

The Province is seeking feedback on key elements of the draft plan including the plan’s goals & objectives as well as the proposed habitat and population management actions. In addition to the online posting and feedback, opportunities for engagement for stakeholders and communities in Northeast B.C. are scheduled to share information and provide feedback throughout the process.

Engagement timelines: April 4, 2022 – May 20, 2022

https://engage.gov.bc.ca/caribou/boreal-caribou/
Bump…………..

[Atlas12]

Have your voice heard — another opportunity to get involved in wildlife management decisions.

The Province is seeking feedback on key elements of the draft plan including the plan’s goals & objectives as well as the proposed habitat and population management actions. In addition to the online posting and feedback, opportunities for engagement for stakeholders and communities in Northeast B.C. are scheduled to share information and provide feedback throughout the process.

Engagement timelines: April 4, 2022 – May 20, 2022

https://engage.gov.bc.ca/caribou/boreal-caribou/



When people reply to this, if you want to slow the erosion of hunting rights, DO NOT FRAME THIS AS AN US-VS FIRST NATIONS ISSUE.
NOTHING will screw hunters more than trying to frame this as a race issue.
If everyone can remain civil, maybe we'll finally get a seat at the table with a microphone for once.

[bearvalley]

Of the dozens of letters & Emails I sent out in this regard, the only one that responded was Heyman:


https://i.imgur.com/KmjV7qr.jpg


My response:


You are the Minister of ENVIRONMENT!!
The BC Supreme Court Case which initiated these draconian actions by your party was focused entirely upon Environmental concerns.
Period.


Your attempt to "pass the buck" in this instance is beyond infuriating.


I demand an answer as to your involvement with these matters, and further that you take immediate steps to rectify the stripping away of hunting privileges in order to continue with increased environmental degradation / destruction.


In other words: DO YOUR JOB!

Matt, good on you for taking a stance.
Heyman, with his Sierra Club background will never support hunters.
Backcountry exclusion and the Y2Y movement….that’s more his style.