pine beetle and habitat

[thinkingman]

has anyone else thought about pine beetle infestation and the change in habitat?

i've been in 5-02 over the years (spring bear hunting) and have noticed the pine beetle coming... and then arrive in the area we've been in. Next i noticed a low bush that i figured out was saskatoon berries... browsed down to about 30 inches from the ground. it's spreading like mad, and seems to be providing browse for moose. i'm now seeing moose sign in a semi-arid area that used to hardly have any sign in it.

i'm no forest scientist, but from my observations i see more browse and graze for deer and moose in areas that have had pine beetle kill. seems to me the pine beetle may result in the growth of habitat for ungulate species as they adapt to the devastation visited on mature forests.

while many of the environmenatlists keep saying the sky is falling regarding the pine beetle infestation, i'm seeing adaptation by plants and animals. (and i'm not discounting the grief this is causing logging and the communiities that rely on logging in the interior)


anyone else observing changes in specific areas?

[Mr. Dean]

Without a doubt it's going to open up new habitat. What makes it scary is when all the pine tree's are gone, what are the beetles goin to do next?

Not to mention the extinction of a natural species of BC.

[Fisher-Dude]

I was up in reg 5 last weekend and was amazed by the devastation...I've seen 70 - 80% attack before, but 100% attack was new to me. Some reserve strips look like they have been burnt with the death of every tree.

Although the new cuts will provide a lot of browse for ungulates, the animals do need cover. This cover is needed to avoid predation, and for thermal cover during the colder months. With the death of the forests on such a scale, I'm concerned that this may be a problem we didn't anticipate. The animals will adapt, but I think we may see some big changes in where they hang out.

[browningboy]

When we went up north, the kill was enormous as well as up the coquihalla, the scenery is defineatley changing but one thing I'm always curious about, we can put vehicles on and search mars, we can make identical whatever (dogs, cats) by extracting DNA but we can't kill a beetle?? You think it would be so easy to a point, something like adding something on the ground that will be absorbed by the trees and once the beetle tries it, it dies??
Too easy I guess, looks like we'll look like Nevada soon, poker anyone???

[Sitkaspruce]

There is no way anybody can control the beetle. When beetle first started to make the news, and it has been here for ever, just not in the amount we are seeing, the spread ratio was 1-4, so for every tree attacked, there was enough brood to spread to 4 other trees the next year. Right now in some areas the spread ratio is 1-13+ trees. The way Mother nature always control it was to burn it off, but we control fire so that does not happen any more. The devistation that is being caused by the beetle and logging is no different than what mother nature used to do, except at a 1000 fold larger. The forest that the beetle lives in is a forest that need fire. An old growth tree in the interior is 120+ years old, compared to an old grow on the coast that 350+. So the spread of plant species is just a natural term in the life of a forest. After a while the trees will start to come back and it will start all over again.

The beetle is starting to slow down in BC as it moves eastward. In the Fort it is now starting to atack spruce and has killed most of the 20-40 year old plantations as well, so now we are losing out mid-term timber supply. Logging will not be the same as it is or was and things are starting to switch to mining and bio-energy.

[Ridge-Runner]

There is only one way to reduce or eliminate the pine beetle epidemic in this province and that is to let the MOE manage it, and it should be subdued or extinct in short order!!!!!:mrgreen::???::wink:

Cheers, RR

[Jagermeister]

It's too late to react to the pine bettle epidemic in this province, the damage is done.
The thing to focus on now is getting the forest growing again and planting trees is not going to do it.
The forest areas have to be prescribe burned as this will rejuvinate the area quicker than any other method.
It's just a waste of manpower to push the wood into piles unless you're planning to plant grasses or alphalfa and use the land for range and my guess is this is the paln.

[houseman]

The only ways to have stopped this would have been fires in the summer and weeks straight of very cold weather, but those options are gone now, and have been for a few years. I agree with jagermeister, we need to control burn all the areas that logging is now pointless in, and let mother nature do her thing.

[Pete]

As a trapper the impact of the MPB on my area has been nothing short of devastating. I have lost tousands and thousands of acres of timber and I am not just talking about pine tree but everything, fir, spruce, birch, poplar you name it gone all in the guise of pine beetle salvage? At one stage I was losing up to 150 - 200 loads a day out of my area.
It breaks my heart to see that absolute devastation that is being left behind. Have you ever sat and thought where do all of the little animals and birds go? Now we are looking even bigger problems. What happens when it rains and there is nothing to hold the water in check. Trees play a very important part in our air quality, who is watching over that? It is not just a matter of harvest what is going to hjappen when the harvest is over and the logging is done? What are we going to be left with?

[boxhitch]

I echo Pete's sentiments. For years, the Reforestation work going on has been to harvest mixed-species forests and replant pine ( due to fast regeneration) The entire matrix has been changed, and now a pest is attacking the predominant tree. The future is in question.

[moosinaround]

Mother Nature does what she does. 150-250 years ago ones livelyhood was not on the harvest of trees. Mothernature would keep ecosystems in balance. It is a cycle older pine which is a pioneer species dyes off at 150-250 years old, sometimes sooner. A natural burn, windthrow, or pine beetle ravages the great expanse of pine, which in turns renews the species. In colder wetter temperate areas pine dies off as climax species such as spruce and balsam are groomed from underneath the pine and hardwood canopies. We as humans have interupted the natural cycle and rythyms of the ecosystem. We need these trees to build houses, warm ourselves ect. and are inconvinienced by the beetle, but it is totally natural. We are quite arrogant as a species to think we can control what happens in nature. We can't we can manipulate, but not control it. Anyways that is my small rant on the beetle, we have to live in the bed we have made for ourselves. Moosin

[Jagermeister]

It's ironic, I was in a conversation today about the ways how you could predict the type of winter to expect. One of the things that I used to pay attention to was the way the squirrels in my backyard in Quesnel would harvest and store their cone harvest. They were pretty predictable when it came to snowfall accumulations. If they gathered and stockpiled the cones at the base of a tree, you could expect to see lots of snow. On the otherhand, if they had the tendency to leave the cones scattered about, lesser amounts of snow could be expected. If you could get close enough to see their coat densities, one could surmise temperature expectations. This lead me to reflect on how the loss of the forest that the squirrels depend on would impact on that method of weather prediction and it brings us to the point that Pete made about the well being of the little critters of the forest, like squirrels and pine martens and rabbits and coyotes............you get the picture.

[eastkoot]

Lived and worked for forest service in 100 mile years ago doing battle with the bugs. Went there hunting this year and was in awe of the destruction. They are attacking any pine tree, even 3-4 inch diameter. Also noticed a decline in squirrels, saw more deer than squirrels. Now we are getting the same pattern in the East Kootenays and I don't think there is anything that can stop them other than extreme cold weather which we aren't getting anymore. That must be just natures way.

[Coyote]

Seems to me with the increase in beetle killed area there will be an increase in browse followed by an increase in moose, deer, elk or whatever happens to inhabit the area. Give it a couple of decades as the young forest closes in and the browse will decline and so will the herds. Saw that happen on the coast in the late 70s and early 80s

[Stresd]

In area 5 on the weekend looking at all the brown. When a fire hits any of these killed areas, nothing is going to stop it.

[hunter1947]

I was up at Smithers BC this year on a moose hunt and i couldn't believe the dead pine trees that had been killed buy the beetle.:frown:

[Pete]

I agree with some of te earlier post say that this has happen before and it most certainly has. Where as fires raged and the winter were much colder it had an effect on keeping the beetle under check. AT least there were dead standing to provide habitat for wildlife and of course we had the biodiversity of tree species that sustained the wildlife. Now when they go into an area everything is taken. So where is the sustainability in that. Anyone that wants to grasp the true picture of what is happening I would be more than happy to take them on a tour of my trapline and let you see the true impact of what is happening.

[Walksalot]

The Mountain Pine Beetle is nothing new, truer words were never spoken.
The road to hell is paved with good intentions and I think it fits nicely here.
I think the devastation in B.C. and the way it was handled is a blue print of what not to do. I think it is a classic case of logging companies convincing the MOF that they could harvest the the timber and control the beetle. They set about logging the "red tops" thinking they were getting rid of the beetle but in actuality the were simply logging the symptom and the beetle had moved on to greener pastures. By the time all parties concerned woke up and realized what was happening the beetle was in the epidemic stage. Fire was always looked upon as this evil force of nature which causes death and destruction but in actuality it was our greatest allie(sp).

I think the forests will regenerate and nature will heal Herself. The deciduous growth will create habitat for the ungulates and help with air quality but unlike the conifers it won't happen 365, 24/7. Some stands of timber had such a dense canopy that virtually nothing grew in the under story. While it was not much good as far as ungulate habitat goes it was great for rabbits and other small creatures. What will happen short term down the road, lots of speculation but no one really knows.

Where do we go from here? Do we let fire get rid of the "dead standing" or do we let it fall to the ground and rot, both put nutrients back into the soil. As the forest grows back, and it will grow back, I think we will see logging practices change drastically. I think the days of the huge clear cuts will be over and selective logging will be the order of the day. As long as man stays to hell out of regeneration I think we will be fine. By that I don't mean not to replant but put back was was there for it flourished and will flourish again. Don't start to introduce timber types we think would be better but put back what did well before. If Robert Service could see it now.

We sleep in the sleep of the ages, the bleak, barbarian pines;
The gray moss drapes us like sages, and closer we lock our lines,
And deeper we clutch in the gelid gloom where never a sunbeam shines.
On the flanks of the storm-gored ridges are our black battalions massed;
We surge in a host to the sullen coast, and we sing in the ocean blast;
From empire of sea to empire of snow we grip our empire fast.
To the niggard lands were we driven, 'twixt desert and floes are we penned;
To us was the Northland given, ours to stronghold and defend;
Ours till the world be riven in the crash of the utter end;
Ours from the the bleak beginning, through the aeons of death-like sleep;
Ours from the shock when the naked rock was hurled from the hissing deep;
Ours through the twilight ages of weary glacial creep.
Wind of the East, Wind of the West, wandering to and fro,
Chant your songs in our topmost boughs, that the sons of men may know
The peerless pine was the first to come, and the pine will be the last to go!
We pillar the halls of perfumed gloom; we plume where the eagles soar;
The North-wind swoops from the brooding Pole, and our ancients crash and roar;
But where one falls, from the crumbling walls shoots up a hardy score.
We spring from the gloom of the canyon's womb; in the valley's lap we lie;
From the white foam-fringe, where the breakers cringe, to the peaks that tusk the sky;
We climb, and we peer in the crag-locked mere that gleams like a golden eye.
Gain to the verge of the hog-back ridge where the vision ranges free;
Pines and pines and the shadow of pines, as far as the eye can see;
A steadfast legion of stalwart knights in dominant empery,
Sun, moon and stars give answer; shall we not staunchly stand,
Even as now, forever, wards of the wilder strand,
Sentinals of the stillness, lords of the last, lone land?

[sealevel]

This pine bettle is just the start . Fir bark beatle is rapidly increaseing spruce beatle is eating the fir needles. we now have a bug in the cedar . so far its only in the cedar thats down. And a blite is killing the birch. Whats the future of our forests i can`t see one . This is not a natural thing and its not a cycle man has done it now he has live with it.