clowns on quads [Archive]

sealevel

10-15-2007, 07:30 AM

I am starting to dislike quads! yesterday i rode ( yes my quad) up a spot in 8-26 i have been hunting this place for about 10 years. every year there has been more quad traffic but yesterday was terrable. Now i use mine to get around .i have places i still hunt. ridges and edges of cutblocks. I ride slow looking carefull for critters and salvage. But i had guys passing me trying to beat me to the next cut block only to roar though the middle of it. on a hill that has lots of animals there drivin so far back in the thick stuff. well i will cross that spot of the list

Fisher-Dude

10-15-2007, 07:44 AM

That sucks. But it's ethics (or lack thereof) that are the problem, not the quads. You could have clowns in trucks, clowns on horses, clowns on dirtbikes, clowns on bicycles, clowns on foot, etc.

Three times this weekend I gave the "right of way" to folks who were there before me - even helped out some guys with my Leica binos who were watching 3 moose at dawn who couldn't see if any were bulls through their spotter.

There will always be someone out there who will spoil your party. About all we can hope to do is set a positive example and hope that it rubs off.

Jetboat

10-15-2007, 08:40 AM

I agree that there's too many clowns on quads. I mean, we drive "rapidly" in response to our wells/compressors down up here in the northern part of the province. The roads are private and we have radios in our trucks. I can't count how many times I come around a corner and some dork is puttering along in the middle of the road totally unaware. Get the damn quad off the road and drive in the ditch or down the cutline. Do people pull the same stupid stunt on logging roads?

newhunterette

10-15-2007, 08:51 AM

grrrrrrrrrrrr - I had a really great reply to this thread and it never posted beccause I got booted from the sight - grrrrrrrrrrrr

not going to take another 15 minutes retyping it so the gyst was

we have to stop blaming inanimate objects for causing our troubles - QUADS do not run on thier own - people ride them, RIFLES/GUNS do not shoot on thier own - people fire them, KNIVES do not stab.cut,slice on thier own - people use them - my point is we as the people who have intergrity and intelligence and manners have to make more of a point in educating those who do not get the big picture (CLOWNS)

there will always be idiots in all areas of our lives - blaming and banning Quads isnt going to fix the problems - the CLOWNS will find another way to "tick you off"

just my $.05
Ali

rollingrock

10-15-2007, 09:11 AM

I was coming around a corner and stopped as I heard the quad coming. Not surprisingly he cut the corner without even thinking there might be someone around as if the road was on his private property. When he saw me it was real close. So he braked and almost flipped over. So what if I didn't stop......

Sharkey

10-15-2007, 10:42 AM

Fisher-Dude

10-15-2007, 11:42 AM

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I was reading the Synopsis for Region 8 and it said that they were considering limiting 'off road' vehicles to main roads only. That would help with the clown-issue, but would also limit your access to your hunting grounds on your quad too. You can't win 'em all I guess.

That proposal is looking at restricting vehicles to "established" roads and trails above 1700 meters. Unfortunately, as it is worded, it would restrict hunters and their access, but not joy riders, dirt bikers, mushroom pickers (and quad riders on mushrooms :???:), ranchers, loggers, etc. It was in response to a vocal minority who want to restrict the access of hunters who don't hunt the same way they do so that they could have the highcountry all to themselves.

It would do absolutely nothing for the recruitment and retention of hunters - in fact, more restrictions = less hunters = the end of hunting.

NEEHAMA

10-15-2007, 11:46 AM

Get a faster quad, like a raptor or a banshee!! then they can't pass you!....

forgive me...

farside

10-15-2007, 12:09 PM

Hmmm... Personally, I think quads are FANTASTIC. As long as they are miles and miles away from where I am elk hunting:mrgreen:.

As the weather was good this weekend, everybody and there dog was out roaring around where I was trying to tag an elk here on the island. None appeared to be hunting just getting some rec time in. Unfortunately my draw and its proximity to Campbell River means I am going to see quads and such on nice afternoons.

PRAY FOR RAIN and lots of it!!!:twisted:

KevinB

10-15-2007, 12:33 PM

[quote=Fisher-Dude;195067] But it's ethics (or lack thereof) that are the problem, not the quads. You could have clowns in trucks, clowns on horses, clowns on dirtbikes, clowns on bicycles, clowns on foot, etc.
quote]

Great point Fisher-Dude. Very true. But, a quad allows a clown to be a clown in a lot of places, and to drive back and forth between them all really really quickly...:wink:

Sharkey

10-15-2007, 01:39 PM

I stand corrected - thanks F.D. I didn't have the synopsis handy (I'm supposed to be working).:wink:
~D

RMG

10-15-2007, 02:06 PM

I figure the more hunters on quads, the fewer hunters there will be on foot. The faster a quad goes the fewer animals the hunters on quads will see, and even fewer will be shot. That means more for me. I have had the opportunity many times to watch wildlife in clearcuts that will not move when a vehicle putters into sight, and only take flight when said vehicle slamms on brakes. When I hunt an area I will always leave if there is someone there first, but will never leave an area because a quad, vehicle or other person roars up the road or trail. To me the wildlife doesnt seem to be concerned with vehicles that roar around the country side. But then I am more tollerant and patient that the average grizzly bear too.

slowkey

10-15-2007, 02:34 PM

steepNdeep

10-15-2007, 03:45 PM

seven yrs of walking, still hunting and all thoughs fun things - big dougnut for animals

2nd yr with the quad - 3 deer and 1 elk

yeah quads scare all the animals away. keep sittin in them woods boys

Anyone commenting on the ineffectiveness of hunting off the road is unwittingly commenting on their hunting skills... Mostly it's the dumber, smaller ones that hang around the roads (animals, that is) :lol: Whatever floats your boat.

Quads are good tools, but they breed laziness... Once on one I find it hard to get off... I've driven right up to the edge of a ridge to glass the other side.

I can't count the times, road hunters, quads, etc. have driven past me while I was watching an animal from the ridge above. (I'm only concerned that they might see me moving and take a shot at me...) 2 weeks ago I had a 150 class muley in my sights, while a quad putted along at first light... (I let him walk)

I have killed the odd animal from the road, but for me, 'hunting' starts when I get off of the road. The more guys on quads, the less in the woods... GIV'ER! :cool:

slowkey

10-15-2007, 04:12 PM

well guess i'm lazy but at least the freezer is full. mmmmmm elk steaks

ruger#1

10-15-2007, 04:29 PM

Can you get a quad up a tree stand.

slowkey

10-15-2007, 04:34 PM

well I have a winch

Hey don't tree stands damage trees??;-)

and you don't get any exercise just sitting there! you don't haul a 6 pack up with you :eek:

The Hermit

10-15-2007, 04:41 PM

In order of personal preference>>> I like..

* still hunting
* hunting from a natural blind or my dog house
* hunting from a tree stand
* road hunting ( a quad might make this more fun though)

I do it all and would rather road hunt than work, cut the lawn, or sit on a beach. I did figure out why so many people drink beer while road hunting... its BORING! Ha!

slowkey

10-15-2007, 04:56 PM

yes a bad day hunting is better than a good day at work.

beer and road hunting never! that would be drinking and driving hehe plus quads vibrate and then you have to pee and of course then your scent will scare the animals away as well

ruger#1

10-15-2007, 04:59 PM

I do have a quad and used to use it alot for hunting, Now it just sits in the garage or i just use it for retrieval. As far as I'm concerned quads should be restricted to logging roads . And designated trails, But along with hunters with all the rules of atving, the rest of the idiots or weekend warriors should be educated in the same rules. Hunters have the rules in the hunting regs, and the average Joe idiot that goes and buys an ATV, never gets to see the rules. I ran into alot of those idiots in Prince George a couple of years ago. If i would of caught up to them i would of run them over with my truck. I got two rock chips in my windshield from that ordeal.

slowkey

10-15-2007, 05:20 PM

To be a little serious now

What Ruger #1 just stated is one of the biggest problems quad hunters are facing now - The image that rec quaders are creating. I just came back from the east koots a couple of weeks ago an some of the locals were saying that in the summer peopel come from out of provice and just rip up the country side. Becuse of this they have a lot of signs now posted informing quaders of there responsibility for damage (even had one in the out house at a forest service camp site) and that they must stay to existing roads and trails.

As for the hunting issue . As stated in several post on this site many of us are meat hunter. As a meat hunter I'm going to use the most effective method to harvest my meat. At this point I have found a quad to be the most effective (and no I don't care if I get a 150+ buck spikers taste better).

And lastly if your still hunting and I drive up on my quad and spoil your hunt how close are you to the road???? that sounds like a big hike.

Of course none of this matter because in a couple of days someone will complain again

ruger#1

10-15-2007, 05:29 PM

I can see it coming now, Just like the few idiots that have made it possible for us to take a boating course, We might have to take an ATV course and have to carry a card to be able to use an ATV .

tooley

10-15-2007, 05:33 PM

Hey sealevel, I also hunt 8-26 and I have also found a problem with this. I also hunt on a quad, Quite frankly it is the only way I can afford to go hunting. I do not have a problem with quads, just with some people who ride them.......any suggestions on where to get a meat buck?

sealevel

10-15-2007, 07:54 PM

tooley i have never hunted there but i was looking at timber. do you know where olien fsr is. its off trinity valley go up there tell you hit sowsap . i saw lots of sign all around up there.

J_T

10-15-2007, 10:07 PM

Has anyone on here hunted off a quad, or used a quad in the Williams Lake, 100 mile area lately? I understand the Forestry Compliance officers in that area, have been out in force targeting ATV use on Forest roads and they have been ticketing those not properly insured, or in inappropriate areas etc.

Just asking.

mrdoog

10-15-2007, 11:52 PM

Clowns are evil things, wether on a quad or not.

Will

10-16-2007, 03:06 PM

Fisher-Dude

10-16-2007, 03:17 PM

That what I'd like to see....actual enforcement of existing laws.

X2. I would also like the ATV dealers to be forced to hand out an "ATV USE" pamphlet that details what the laws are re: FSRs, public roads, etc. So many folks are buying ATVs that have no clue about the required 3rd party liability insurance for FSRs, nor do they get any training on what environmentally responsible use of their machine is.

It seems simple to us outdoorsy folks that you don't go rip a swamp to shreds, but take a city slicker and put him on an 800cc buggy with 28" Gumbo Mudders and you know what he's looking to do - to see "what his machine will do". I think at the very least there should be literature handed out with the machines.

Will

10-16-2007, 03:28 PM

I can see it coming now, Just like the few idiots that have made it possible for us to take a boating course, We might have to take an ATV course and have to carry a card to be able to use an ATV .
Well as much a pain in the A$$ as it may be....the reality of it is that there are always Stupid Folk among us that require these Courses.

I'd be 100% in favour of a Mandatory Training & Education Course for Anyone & Everyone operating a Motorized vehicle off road !
It would be the BEST dam thing the BC Gov did for the environment in a long time 8)

MB_Boy

10-16-2007, 03:34 PM

Well as much a pain in the A$$ as it may be....the reality of it is that there are always Stupid Folk among us that require these Courses.

I'd be 100% in favour of a Mandatory Training & Education Course for Anyone & Everyone operating a Motorized vehicle off road !
It would be the BEST dam thing the BC Gov did for the environment in a long time 8)

I tend to agree. I spend a lot of time on the water.......and even though the Boater's Operator's card was a bit of a pain there was PLENTY of time to find time to take the test. Far too many morons operating boats on lakes, rivers and on the ocean.

I know everyone thinks we are taxed and too tightly regulated, but some of these actually do make a bit of sense. Even $20.00 for a card may open up one moron's eyes (insert 'clown' if more fitting:wink:) on a FSR and perhaps teach them some courtesy and proper etiquette out in the field.....and that one moron being educated may benefit your hunt or save your life some day??

slowkey

10-16-2007, 04:59 PM

so as I have discovered on another thread here.

As long as I'm legal I can do whatever I want.

So if I'm insured and I'm driving on a FSR and I happen to drive by when your hunting

well you have a nice day !

J_T

10-16-2007, 08:06 PM

As long as I'm legal I can do whatever I want.
Are you? You sound like my son:grin:

Well as much a pain in the A$$ as it may be....the reality of it is that there are always Stupid Folk among us that require these Courses.
I used to run around in a variety of boats as a younger man. But now, if I were to take up boating again, I'd be glad there would be a course that might make me more proficient and refresh my memory.

I used to use a trike "back in the day" on the oil patch, I've never been on a quad, but if I were to take up quad-in, I'd appreciate the opportunity to skill up through taking a short course.

Of course, courses are in a sense a regulation, but they aren't all negative. They provide each of those participants a better sense of the standards, or right and wrong, the do's and the don'ts.

There might be less online frustration.

slowkey

10-17-2007, 10:14 AM

MB_Boy

10-17-2007, 10:26 AM

well I have a valid divers license and I have 3rd person liability
check link http://www.for.gov.bc.ca/hth/engineering/documents/brochures/Guide-for-Safe-Travel.pdf

you see when I bought my quad the first thing I did was find out my legal responsiblites to operate it. Then again I might be an exception

Slowkey....legal responsibilites don't necessarily mean you can operate it safely and nor does a two page pamphlet on a gov't website. ;) I agree a course/certification doesn't make any guarantees.....as common sense also has to prevail, but it is a step in the right direction....and may help in prevention.

Again...let me ask you.....here is a scenario; I am just like you with my valid driver's license (taken in a urban setting) and I just bought my brand new quad (never owned or operated one) and I come bombing around a corner at 60 kmh and crash into your partner/child/other family member riding with you and they are in critical condition. Does the fact that I put the effort forth to get 200,000 liability and got my driver's license 20++ years ago make things any better for you??

Let's just go one step further; I am sitting there devastated at the accident but unscathed walking away shaking my head saying to myself "How could this happen on my first time ever on a quad.....my brand new quad?!?!?"

If a certification other than being able to afford insurance and pass a drivers test at the age of 16 makes things a bit better for one person out there.....be it safety, courtesy etc I really don't see a problem with it.

Would an online test/certification that costs you say $10.00 be that inconvenient??

slowkey

10-17-2007, 10:40 AM

well because of my driving experience I don't bomb around blind corners or over the tops of hills.

So what your saying is I should take a test for common sense?

I agree with the boat course because they have rules of the water the average guy wouldn't know (I'd need to take the test).

but when taking a drivers license I am taught not to tailgate or drive in an unsafe manner. An ATV is a motorized vehichle and follow the same rules of the road as a car so why get tested twice?
In your agrument you stated a valid driver's license taken in an urban setting - If you feel that urban people don't understand how to drive on rural roads then maybe we should add one more class to drivers licenses and require all drivers to take a test to drive on rural/FSR (dirt) roads? because what is the difference if it is a ATV or a pickup (I've almost been hit by guys in p/u's bombing around on FSRs) ?

MB_Boy

10-17-2007, 10:58 AM

but when taking a drivers license I am taught not to tailgate or drive in an unsafe manner. An ATV is a motorized vehichle and follow the same rules of the road as a car so why get tested twice?
In your agrument you stated a valid driver's license taken in an urban setting - If you feel that urban people don't understand how to drive on rural roads then maybe we should add one more class to drivers licenses and require all drivers to take a test to drive on rural/FSR (dirt) roads? because what is the difference if it is a ATV or a pickup (I've almost been hit by guys in p/u's bombing around on FSRs) ?

Why do you need a separate license to operate a motorcycle? A bus? Air brakes? There are differences in operation??

I am stating that a DRIVERS TEST is taken in an urban setting.....and I am not stating "urban people"....as I know everyone likes to poke their shots at them.

Bottom line is you don't take your drivers test on FSR's or driving off of FSR's, and an educational/operating certification is not a bad option? Would it really be that much of an incovenience for someone such as yourself who is so proficient in the operation of an ATV to take a test online? I mean you wouldn't even need the accompanying book would you? :wink: It is just everything you learned taking your drivers test as soon as you were legal to?

Yes rules of the water are different.....but rules on FSR's are not something that any old person is going to obey or know.....given that they can get in their car which they became certified to drive in an urban center, and drive down to a quad dealer and then manage to get themselves to an insurance dealer?

You have to realize there are newb's coming into this (ATV riding) who may or may not have experience from a young age. There is a lot more to know than some executive from Vancouver/Surrey/Kelowna/Prince George who just made a bunch of cash on a deal and decides he is going to buy a couple of quads and has never even been on a FSR in a vehicle let alone a quad.

Trust me....I have grown up riding trikes, quads, snowmobiles (I am from MB) and spent tons of time on the water. I will say there are still idiots on the water, but in the last few years I have seen things improve somewhat. I just don't think a bit of preemptive knowledge is such a bad thing.

Yes there are morons out there in all facets of life who I don't feel too sorry for with some of their stupidity, but we have to realize is THEIR stupidity can also affect US.

slowkey

10-17-2007, 11:07 AM

Well then would you agree that ATV should be licensed like snowmobiles? Personally I'd much rather see a plate on a ATV then if someone is being a jacka$$ his plate can be taken and they can be held responsible (or at least the owner).

Because snowmobiles are plated now do users need to take a driving test?? they use the same areas as ATVs (granted covered in snow)

MB_Boy

10-17-2007, 11:15 AM

I don't necessarily have a problem with the concept of licensing and just to clarify I am sort of lumping the "certification/operator" education together for all ATV's.

Just so you know I am not on any sort of a crusade here ;-)....I just think that some proactive measures instead of reactive measures need to be looked at. As Fisher Dude pointed out there are an increasing number of users out there and some safety precautions really would not hurt??

There is really no measurable way to determine how many of the 140-180 killed annually in Canada (unless you have access to those stats/facts) do so from their own stupidity, or are completely innocent, or are simply uneducated about safe and proper operation.

The "donkeys" out there that kill themselves due to their own stupidity I just shake my head at; however individuals, families etc who are impacted due to the stupidity of someone else or just pure lack of education are where my concern lies.

Fisher-Dude

10-17-2007, 11:23 AM

So explain why I can buy a cigar boat now with twin-turbo 454's in it and I DON'T need to have the boater's card (not til 2009), yet I need one for my 12 foot punt with my 3 horse Johnson on it?

The dorky federal Lie-beral politician that brought in the boater's card law answered it this way: "Those who use small fishing boats need to take the course because they are generally less educated than those who can afford the big speedboats, and are therefore are a bigger risk on the water." Yes, he took a LOT of heat over those comments, and rightly so.

When I bought my ATV in 1999, the dealership was required to give me a safety orientation before I took possession of the ATV. Is that still in place?

slowkey

10-17-2007, 11:29 AM

no I don't think your a crusader. This is a good discussion on the responsibility of being a ATV owner.

I guess the question is how many of those 140 - 180 are hunters?

Personally I'd like to see plates. It might stop people from ripping up habitat, bombing down roads, etc.. Its amazing how many people need the threat of being caught to act responsible

As for the disturbing hunters thing well I'm always going to call it sour grapes and wave when I drive by.

MB_Boy

10-17-2007, 11:30 AM

So explain why I can buy a cigar boat now with twin-turbo 454's in it and I DON'T need to have the boater's card (not til 2009), yet I need one for my 12 foot punt with my 3 horse Johnson on it?

FD.....as I mentioned before......IMPLEMENTATION of such a certification is what is key.

I agree the timelines etc for the boaters card is ridiculous. I spend a lot of time cruising on the ocean and I too find it VERY strange that I can run a 42' power boat up the coast with no license yet when I go to jump in a zodiac with a 4.5hp kicker to go and check my prawn/crab traps I need a license/card.

I NEVER stated that the boat certificaiton was 'perfect'.....just the concept of some education and certification was a good one.

Let me pose this to you.....

.....here is a scenario; I am just like you with my valid driver's license (taken in a urban setting) and I just bought my brand new quad (never owned or operated one) and I come bombing around a corner at 60 kmh and crash into your partner/child/other family member riding with you and they are in critical condition or maybe killed. Does the fact that I put the effort forth to get 200,000 liability and got my driver's license 20++ years ago make things any better for you??

I can be from ANYWHERE in this province be it Vancouver, Vanderhoof, Kitimat, Port McNeil, Kelowna, Cranbrook.....bottom line there is people coming from EVERYWHERE who may or may not have any experience in operation of said vehicles and jerks/morons exist everywhere in society....is it wrong to have a certification/safe operator's course??

Remember.....it can impact you more directly than I would ever wish on anyone.

MB_Boy

10-17-2007, 11:37 AM

no I don't think your a crusader. This is a good discussion on the responsibility of being a ATV owner.

Agreed entirely.

I guess the question is how many of those 140 - 180 are hunters?

Shoud it really matter?? Anyone operating an ATV can do so within or outside of hunting seasons. Unsafe operation can affect the recreational ATV rider, a fisherman, a hunter or any member of "John Q Public". (stupid saying my Dad used to use)

Personally I'd like to see plates. It might stop people from ripping up habitat, bombing down roads, etc.. Its amazing how many people need the threat of being caught to act responsible

I agree about the "threat". IMHO fines for a huge number of things are just not enough of a deterrent as of yet. Fines for poaching and illegal practices which are always deemed as "hunting" don't even come close to where they should be.

As for the disturbing hunters thing well I'm always going to call it sour grapes and wave when I drive by.

Ha ha.....fair enough. That leads into a whole new debate of quad access. If I am hunting 50 yards off a road and you come bombing down on your quad....or even on your bicycle dinging your bell and it disturbs game it is my own fault for hunting that close to a road. :razz:

rocksteady

10-17-2007, 12:40 PM

If you are interested in getting some training in ATV's, never had one before or just want a brush up. There are trainers available through the Canada Safety and British Columbia Safety Council.

I am a certified instructor for both and here's the lowdown of the course:

Day 1 - Basic classroom discussion regarding ethics, etc...(45 mins)
Out to the quads for maintenace inspection (pre trips) and all that good mechanical stuff....

The rest of the day is spent on slalom and other course layout and obstacles (logs/ruts etc) stressing body positioning, balance, center of gravity etc etc...

Day 2 - Which is an add on from the BC Safety Council. This is about a 1/2 day for loading and unloading from a trailer, as well as how to properly load gear on the racks and pulling a loaded trailer with an ATV....

DID YOU KNOW????? That almost half of all ATV accidents occur when people are loading and unloading quads out of a pickup/trailer????? I NEVER ride my quad out of the box of a truck (Reverse), just start it up and idle it out, standing in front of the machine, holding the brake lever for control.....

Good course especially for new riders, I would recommend it for someone who decides that their child should have their own ATV..Seen too many people that buy one, throw junior the keys and let him learn by trial and error in the back 40.....

http://www.safety-council.org/info/sport/atv.html