billy or nanny?

[monasheemountainman]

Watch this video, not much to see until the shot so feel free to fast forward. I think this guy got guided to a nanny, what are your thoughts. bases look thin, curve on the horns is sharper and near the top, distinguished glands around the base of the horn. then on top of that lack of close ups on the goat after the recovery.

your thoughts? id be pissed if i paid big money for a goat and got guided to a nanny, but thats why you should know how to identify. I could be wrong though you dont get much time to see it in the video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r-pmk1c_2j0

[wideopenthrottle]

looks like a nanny...solo goat and on the last day of the hunt so maybe not a piss off to the shooter

[monasheemountainman]

I guess but jeez I wouldn’t shoot a nanny even if I paid for it

[boxhitch]

320 nanny, 400 billy, 418 nanny, 504 nanny, some mixed footage I'd say, but the end result looks like a nanny alright.
Last day kill, legal critter, hunter had a chance to make a choice IF the guide communicated that it was a nanny
Outfitter should be pissed but ...

[monasheemountainman]

For sure I’m not getting into a legal or moral debate about it, just me personally I wouldn’t shoot one even if I paid for a goat hunt

[Ltbullken]

Looks like a nanny. The fact they didn't put up any good profile, trophy, as it lays footage kinda gives the tell as well. Pissed off? Depends on the expectations of the client and the nanny/billy allocation if there was one. I bet the biologist on inspection would have given the outfitter the stink eye, though.

[tomcat]

Looks like a billy to me. Lone animal, nanny's usually in a group, gentle horn curve and base of horn wider than the eye width.

[guest]

Any one dedicated to hunt Goats must take all efforts possible to NOT shoot a Nanny. Many Nannys are the Leads of the group. Its these large Nannys that lead the youngins to summer and winter range etc.
Still many have issues with not taking time to ID the Goat.
When you study them enough or do your homework you can tell the difference.

Take your time. You certainly cant run up where the dominant Billys lurk.....so why hurry judgement of Sex . We owe it to them to correctly determine the Sex of the Goat.....just to have an opportunity to harvest one of these Magnificent animals.

Dont just shoot the 1st that comes along, dont shoot a suddenly appearing Goat because its legal. It can often be a Nanny.Do your due diligence to only harvest a Billy. Take your time. You owe it to the sustainability of the population. Dont shoot a goat in a group. Look for a Loner, usually in the toughest spot on the mountain. Watch how it urinates. Look for scent glands behind the horns. Long slowly curved horns with not much space between at the bases is a sign of a Bill. Rump patches are often dirtied up on the Bills. They look more off white to yellowy cream then pure white.

The only reason its legal to shoot a Nanny is because the gov usually would loose in court challenges because they are too simular looking. Specially to new Goat hunters.

Dont shoot a Nanny Period. Its just another reason to close the hunt.

IMO

[monasheemountainman]

Any one dedicated to hunt Goats must take all efforts possible to NOT shoot a Nanny. Many Nannys are the Leads of the group. Still many have issues with not taking time to ID the Goat. When you study them enough or do your homework you can tell the difference.

Dont just shoot the 1st that comes along, dont shoot a suddenly appearing Goat because its legal. It can often be a Nanny.Do your due diligence to only harvest a Billy. Take your time. You owe it to the sustainability of the population. Dont shoot a goat in a group. Look for a Loner, usually in the toughest spot on the mountain. Watch how it urinates. Look for scent glands behind the horns. Long slowly curved horns with not much space between at the bases is a sign of a Bill. Rump patches are often dirtied up on the Bills. They look more off white to yellowy cream then pure white.
The only reason its legal to shoot a Nanny is because the gov usually would loose in court challenges because they are simular looking.

Dont shoot a Nanny Period. Its just another reason to close the hunt.

IMO


I agree CT, your thoughts on that animal?

[elch jager]

The edit job makes it look like the Billy at 4:00 was the one they shot. 4:18 is a different spot, different animal - and does look to be a Nanny.

[warnniklz]

320 nanny, 400 billy, 418 nanny, 504 nanny, some mixed footage I'd say, but the end result looks like a nanny alright.
Last day kill, legal critter, hunter had a chance to make a choice IF the guide communicated that it was a nanny
Outfitter should be pissed but ...

I was thinking same thing in mixed footage

This looks like a billy. Look at the stirred up dirt bed.
https://scontent.fyyc2-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/66627567_10162174037400387_8225581838991622144_n.j pg?_nc_cat=101&_nc_oc=AQn8u7C6DqdgCj8X37QJr42BHcsJUuO_eUcRk33ZfAu MULjsfswOxrt2sZEp9WC9PzM&_nc_ht=scontent.fyyc2-1.fna&oh=c531543417bb7bfc4be9cc40280fc30d&oe=5DC272FB

Now there's a rock formation just above it
https://scontent.fyyc2-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/66416725_10162174050640387_2458070965309931520_n.j pg?_nc_cat=104&_nc_oc=AQnIXFg1HsrN39x--CYxoShZXUDS_7R6EN_XgvALdkJG3H9H4-j-ylzBXMTMSgQckeo&_nc_ht=scontent.fyyc2-1.fna&oh=2f693611db221052c8f4703a1742f8f5&oe=5DAE557F

Horn profile looks different than the first image
https://scontent.fyyc2-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/65947896_10162174037380387_7303130796338970624_n.j pg?_nc_cat=110&_nc_oc=AQloXPGdHWrA_CwZUe7V5cVJu1kZCyY0djKWKruPqxE _FUYNPX-WcIpa8gVHFN36NIU&_nc_ht=scontent.fyyc2-1.fna&oh=4e9faf8d8247cb14f53825564783ddfa&oe=5DBB1E20

[Bubbacanuck]

As a non-goat hunter, why do the regs allow for the harvesting of nannies? It seems with sheep, they have restrictions to rams. Is it because they are too hard to tell apart? Just curious as I want to be a hunter conscious of sustainability, yet I like to cut tags...

[eatram]

As a non-goat hunter, why do the regs allow for the harvesting of nannies? It seems with sheep, they have restrictions to rams. Is it because they are too hard to tell apart? Just curious as I want to be a hunter conscious of sustainability, yet I like to cut tags...

Look at post #8

[Bubbacanuck]

Look at post #8

LOL I read the post but somehow missed the line of losing the court battle. That is what I assumed. Makes sense but sure leaves it open to nannies being harvested.

[eatram]

LOL I read the post but somehow missed the line of losing the court battle. That is what I assumed. Makes sense but sure leaves it open to nannies being harvested.

Good thing that goats are in hard to reach places. Generally, hunters who are willing to go to these places are hard working people. Hard working people want to "earn it". This includes earning respect for themselves. This keeps nannies safer than over-regulation. MHO

[warnniklz]

I wouldn't be against BC adopting the Alaskan model of nanny harvest

[guest]

I agree CT, your thoughts on that animal?

Looks like different footage of different Goats.
Would be wrong of me to say for sure......but the harvested one based on only what i can see or more cant see and not be able to zoom in etc etc looks like a Nanny.....my 2 scents ar ar.

[whitlers]

Definitely different goats. That's interesting nice catch!

[decker9]

Agree with others, looks to be a couple different goats. 3 year old billy’s Often resemble a nanny, and vise versa. Regardless, that one shoulda been left on the mountain. It’s the guides job to insure the right animals get taken for future populations, regardless of what the hunter thinks, imo.

[boxhitch]

That would be nice, but the guide doesn't have much at stake.
Too many possible scenarios to guess what happened up to the kill shot
From a pure trophy aspect, there are numerous nanny goats ranked high in the record books
There can be pressure brought on the g/o if the gang takes too many nannies, but most areas have plenty with little hunting pressure

It is good to here that most BC hunters would hold out for a billy, hopefully one with age and body size and yellowed hair
imo the horns aren't the trophy

[ElectricDyck]

I've seen quite a few solo nannys so doesn't mean much...I can't remember where I heard it but someone said" It's legal to loiter around schools and talk to 13 year old girls, doesn't mean it's right" LOL

[monasheemountainman]

Looks like different footage of different Goats.
Would be wrong of me to say for sure......but the harvested one based on only what i can see or more cant see and not be able to zoom in etc etc looks like a Nanny.....my 2 scents ar ar.

I’m only talking about the harvester goat, definitely different goats in the video.

[eatram]

That is a BIG nanny. Her face is really really long. Probably as old as she'd get. Let's all give the guide a bit of slack and trust that he was taking an old dry "doe" out of the herd. We don't know the whole story. Could be that this nanny was limping already from some RH's bullet. Guides generally do good for the resident herds...

[decker9]

Any one dedicated to hunt Goats must take all efforts possible to NOT shoot a Nanny. Many Nannys are the Leads of the group. Its these large Nannys that lead the youngins to summer and winter range etc.
Still many have issues with not taking time to ID the Goat.
When you study them enough or do your homework you can tell the difference.

Take your time. You certainly cant run up where the dominant Billys lurk.....so why hurry judgement of Sex . We owe it to them to correctly determine the Sex of the Goat.....just to have an opportunity to harvest one of these Magnificent animals.

Dont just shoot the 1st that comes along, dont shoot a suddenly appearing Goat because its legal. It can often be a Nanny.Do your due diligence to only harvest a Billy. Take your time. You owe it to the sustainability of the population. Dont shoot a goat in a group. Look for a Loner, usually in the toughest spot on the mountain. Watch how it urinates. Look for scent glands behind the horns. Long slowly curved horns with not much space between at the bases is a sign of a Bill. Rump patches are often dirtied up on the Bills. They look more off white to yellowy cream then pure white.

The only reason its legal to shoot a Nanny is because the gov usually would loose in court challenges because they are too simular looking. Specially to new Goat hunters.

Dont shoot a Nanny Period. Its just another reason to close the hunt.

IMO

100%!

For anyone who is on the Instagram and wants to learn/learn more about distinguishing nanny’s from Billy’s, feel free to check out my page. A ton of cam videos to study, and quite a few nanny’s that lots would consider Billy’s. We as goat hunters owe it to the population to do our homework before pulling a trigger.

[hawk-i]

Looks like a nanny is some frames and a billy in others.

[twoSevenO]

Any one dedicated to hunt Goats must take all efforts possible to NOT shoot a Nanny. Many Nannys are the Leads of the group. Its these large Nannys that lead the youngins to summer and winter range etc.
Still many have issues with not taking time to ID the Goat.
When you study them enough or do your homework you can tell the difference.

Take your time. You certainly cant run up where the dominant Billys lurk.....so why hurry judgement of Sex . We owe it to them to correctly determine the Sex of the Goat.....just to have an opportunity to harvest one of these Magnificent animals.

Dont just shoot the 1st that comes along, dont shoot a suddenly appearing Goat because its legal. It can often be a Nanny.Do your due diligence to only harvest a Billy. Take your time. You owe it to the sustainability of the population. Dont shoot a goat in a group. Look for a Loner, usually in the toughest spot on the mountain. Watch how it urinates. Look for scent glands behind the horns. Long slowly curved horns with not much space between at the bases is a sign of a Bill. Rump patches are often dirtied up on the Bills. They look more off white to yellowy cream then pure white.

The only reason its legal to shoot a Nanny is because the gov usually would loose in court challenges because they are too simular looking. Specially to new Goat hunters.

Dont shoot a Nanny Period. Its just another reason to close the hunt.

IMO

X100 ... excellent post, Howard. Well said!!!