Moose hunting in the Omineca Region.

[Razor84]

This has been circulating on Facebook and I received it via email from a friend

By Nolan O’Brien
Follow on Instagram: @youraveragewoodsman (https://www.instagram.com/youraveragewoodsman/)

youraveragewoodsman@gmail.com


To: Hunters and Outdoors people who enjoy Moose.

I took some time to write down my thoughts on the subject of Moose regulations, and how we manage Moose in the Omineca region. I realize some might agree with me on certain things and disagree on others. However, I believe that it is important for people to voice opinions thoroughly, and be able to back up some sort of debate on their opinions based on their observations on these matters, which is what I am trying to accomplish in this write up.

I sometimes find it difficult to relate to some hunters and outdoor users and easier with others when I spend parts of 100+ days a year hunting and or fishing and then there are so many people in BC that spend half that time or less who stand by their firm beliefs and opinions that are sometimes contrary to good ethics and conservation strategy and are often based on their rights, emotion, or what is most convenient for their individual needs, or based on how things were done 30 years ago in the good old days.

I often think about Moose because I enjoy hunting for them and I enjoy seeing their presence in the bush. Unfortunately it seems to me that there are significantly fewer Moose than there was when I was a kid 15-20 years ago in most of the areas I hunt in 7a.

I feel that most people and all groups of hunters and outdoors enthusiasts would agree that moose numbers in the Omineca are now below what the habitat can support even with the loss of habitat in a lot of MU’s. I also think the biologists would also agree with this, especially in some areas more than others.

Although I don’t personally have any real scientific data or statistics, I am very familiar with current Moose hunting and LEH regulations and through my observations in the outdoors I have developed some opinions, and I am open to share my logic.

I often ask outdoors users what they think the reasons for declining moose populations are?


The first reason people give me nine times out of ten is:
“Well, there’s too many wolves! Also too many Bears are eating all the calves when they are born in the spring.”

Second reason... “Well, the natives are hunting them too hard, and shooting too many Cows, and it’s unfair hunting opportunity”...

Third... “Well, I think it’s because the forest companies are spraying all their food with herbicide to promote pine monoculture”...

Others summed up:
“Well, too many get hit by trains and Motor vehicles”...

“Diseases, and Ticks are wiping them out”....

“They are starving over the bad winters and lack of food”

“Loss of habitat due to excessive clear cutting of our forests” etc....

I hear many reasons and agree that these among others are definitely some legitimate contributing factors for the Moose numbers declining.

Another question I ask is:
Of everything that normally kills Moose, what reasons for Moose mortality and decline in numbers can we possibly control by better wildlife management through hunting and hunting regulations?

It seems to be a question that many people don’t have a solid answer for other than wipe out all the predators. Or they don’t think about that part at all, or some people are quick to pass most of the blame to something that we cant easily control, and refer to the predators or unregulated hunters.

A short while ago I took part in a poll on the Facebook page: 250Hunter to see what game animals members of that group prefer to hunt the most. Amongst the list on the poll were Deer, Elk, Moose, Mountain Game Species, and various Predators... To no surprise, Moose came out on top as the favourite species to target amongst hunters in the group. which consisted of mostly PG and Northern or central B.C. residents.

So we know that moose are the favourite amongst most hunters. BC residents, probably FN, and even outfitter clients probably target moose more than any other single species in the Omineca region even above Elk and Deer.

Now when we look at how we regulate moose hunting with LEH and General Open Seasons, everyone can hunt for Spike-Fork Bulls during the GOS from September to November, and most MU’s have a liberal amount of Any Bull tentative authorizations and even Antlerless LEH, as well as outfitter authorizations. So after all these hunting authorizations targeting all classes of Moose (Cows/Calves, and Bulls of all sizes) are given to BC residents and Outfitter Clients... The First Nations have no restrictions whatsoever in regards to allotted dates or class of animal.

This brings me to wonder why some people can be so reluctant to admit that maybe hunters including BC residents, First Nations, and Guide Outfitter Clients combined are the number 1 cause of moose mortality above all. Maybe by selecting high numbers of all classes of moose ie: Bulls of all sizes, and Antlerless (Cows/Calves), we are not doing this species any good with our regulations, and it seems to me like humans are possibly over harvesting on Moose in general.

[Razor84]

What would happen if we managed our increasing Elk herd the way we manage and regulate Moose, by shooting a lot of the Young Bulls by permitting GOS for Spike-Bulls as well as having upwards of 50-100+ ‘Any bull Elk’ authorizations per MU on top of the Antlerless Elk LEH authorizations during the winter? My answer to that question is: They definitely wouldn’t be doing so well in PG/Upper Fraser and Vanderhoof/Fort Fraser/Fort St. James like they are. So why do we manage and regulate Moose hunting like that?
We’ve also proven that by permitting liberal hunting opportunity over long seasons on young Mule Deer Bucks warrants for low deer numbers in most cases and very unfavourable doe:buck ratio’s for the deer hunter.

Many of the most famous hunters, and guide outfitters in North America will often agree that in most cases the best way to ensure sustainable numbers of any of the big game species while hunting an area year after year is to select only the mature males and some females. This focusses most of the hunting pressure generally on the males who are closer to the outer limit of natural life expectancy and are potentially more dangerous to younger bulls/bucks due to their dominance and size when rutting rituals ramp up during the breeding seasons. We do a great job of that here in 7a with the 6 point Elk GOS, 4 point mule Deer GOS, in the Skeena region we have a 5 point Caribou GOS, full-curl rams for Thinhorn Sheep GOS Provence wide, etc... and those species do well even in areas with high or extreme hunting pressure over extended seasons year after year.


Why is it with Moose that we harvest so many young bull Moose with the spike-fork bull Gos?... then on top we also have all of these Any Bull LEH authorizations in some MU’s over 100. Then some of the First Nations hunters come thru and take a swath out of anything that is brown at any time of the year as their given right. It’s not a wonder to me that most of our bulls never get to reach maturity and breed or even live much beyond their third or fourth birthday.

It seems to me that there are too many hunters in BC that are typically only interested in creaming off a nice young Bull moose because they figure it tastes better and is easier to deal with than a big mature bull. That I can’t argue with, however that type of management strategy does not seem to be working now a days. With all the bush access due to logging that we now have following pine beetle epidemic and tree salvage making Moose that once dwelled in areas that were virtually inaccessible now easy to reach with a 4x4 pick-up truck. Also now we have more sophisticated means of travel with better All-Terrain vehicle technology, and better hunting related equipment all together.

It might be hard to convince some hunters that selecting mostly the big mature bulls isn’t necessarily about Trophy Hunting or shooting ‘Wall Hangers’. It’s still a meat harvest, it’s still a sporting hunt, it’s still a hobby, and yes It could also be a once in a lifetime harvest on massive Bull Moose! Most of all I feel like it would be the best way to regulate our Moose harvest for growth of the herd in the 7a Omineca region. Also the hunters who don’t want to hunt big mature bulls will still have the opportunity to apply for the smaller number of LEH authorizations which would give more choice on which ever class of Moose they would prefer to hunt.

Some people including myself agree that the quality of hunt when looking for a 2 point moose is low and is barely more than a fluke if a hunter finds one at all during the fall. They are seldom interested in moose calls during the rut unlike the big bull moose, and I see that killing them is wasted potential for that young bull to one day become part of the breeding pool and part of the rut action that is fun to witness. I’ve also been told that a good reason we harvest spike-fork bulls is because it’s a good point restriction due to the fact that they are a needle in the hay stack which is true. Another reason is that a 2 point moose has poor antler genetics and they should be culled from the herd. I think those two reasons are kind of unreasonable and probably have no real evidence to back-up the genetics theory. I think that if our moose were managed and regulated by cutting down the number of any-bull LEH authorizations and exchanging the spike-fork GOS with a Tri-Palm/10 point only GOS in all or most of the 7a Omineca MU’s it is the only way our moose numbers can recover whilst continuing a sustainable annual harvest in years to come.

Sometimes when I bring my ideas forward I’ve heard people tell me that we don’t have good enough antler genetics in the Omineca region to have good success with a Tri-palm/10point GOS. I think that’s also unreasonable because I feel it’s more of the issue that most of our bulls are killed many years before they would ever grow any kind of substantial antlers to the level of tri-palm or 10 point. I’m confident in my prediction that if we implemented the big tri-palm/10 point bull harvest that there would be a low harvest rate for the first couple of years of implementation, however the size of the bulls and the rate of harvest would climb drastically over 3 to 5 hunting seasons. In my observations I’ve seen quite a few tri-palm bulls over the years as well as I’ve been on some hunts where those big tri-palm bulls have been harvested in region 7a.

I predict other benefits to only hunting the large mature bulls is that the quality of hunt would become very rewarding due to the possibility of locating and calling in a big bull utilizing calls during the rut. There will be more action for hunters during the hunting season in general and also a greater potential for an abundance of nice trophy sized animals would be possible and would correspond nicely with the greater quantity of meat that is retained from a large mature bull over your typical small spike-fork bull, which will be less appealing to some people and more to others. It also gives all moose hunters equal opportunity to hunt big bull moose every fall as opposed to only when the LEH permit is won by a lottery system with limited transparency.

From my experience in hunting all other members of the deer family throughout B.C. I can say that there is a noticeable difference in quality of hunt, between areas that have point restrictions that limit harvest to a mature class of males, than areas that have different or less limited restrictions.

The Proposals that I would like to bring forward in regards to Moose are:

-To reduce the Bull Moose LEH authorizations to 5 or less per MU and limit Antlerless Moose authorizations to 1 per MU until Moose numbers recover.

-replace the current general open season that limits harvest to Spike-Fork Bulls Only for the entire 7a Omineca Region with;
An annual GOS that limits harvest to Tri-Palm/10Point Bull Moose Only from September 1st to 9th (bow only). followed by September 10th to November 31st (open to other methods of harvest other than bow only)
And all Moose harvested from 7a be submitted for compulsory inspection.

It would make hunting opportunities more equal amongst BC residents, also more conservative, as well as extend the season through November (post rut) to create better opportunity to make good success rates on harvesting Tri-Palm/10point bulls. It also still allows for a small number of LEH permits to be rewarded annually to a limited few.

I feel that this management strategy would only be successful if implemented throughout the entire 7a region and all its MU’s, in order to disperse the moose hunting crowd that is already attracted with the authorizations and regulations that are currently in place. I feel that it would also be beneficial for Moose populations recovery in the southern MU’s of the Skeena region in close proximity to Morice/Bulkly and Skeena River drainages, to follow suit with the Omineca as well.

As Moose numbers increase or decrease of course it could be monitored easier with Compulsory inspections and it would be possible for the number of LEH permits to be increased or decreased in small increments accordingly.

Something that all hunters need to remember is whether you hunt for sustenance, pure enjoyment as a hobby to get out and adventure, antlers on the wall... Or maybe hunting and all aspects of outdoor activities is your lifestyle; THIS ACTIVITY INVOLVES TAKING FROM THE LAND no matter how you look at it. Therefore we all owe it something in return through good ethics, discipline, and conservative means, all things aside. Taking care of wild animals and their habitat must be the #1 priority for all bush users over everything, to ensure that we are able to have this for future generations. It does not matter what category of hunter you fall under, and this needs to apply to anyone that enters the woods with a weapon of means to kill wildlife. Its a privilege not a right for us British Columbian hunters to have some of the best diversity of wildlife species anywhere in North America, unfortunately the privilege is slowly disappearing. Caribou in many areas are already at serious risk! What can we do for Moose?

IT’S TIME FOR ALL HUNTERS TO OPEN UP, AND FORM TOGETHER AS ONE GROUP!

Feel free to reply to the e-mail, if you have feedback or opinion.
Also regardless of personal opinion please forward and share with any hunters or guide outfitters you know.
If you classify as First Nations, please share with your Chief and band council.

Thanks.

[Razor84]

What do you guys think of this? Does he have some good ideas? I am new to moose hunting and haven't been seeing as many as I'd like when out reconing my spots

[Darksith]

Just my 2 cents here, but a lot of these questions/statements have answers already out there...the author just doesn't have all of the info.

[Deaddog]

Two million spent on gathering the data on moose , a large part of it spent in 7a. Biologists have the data, they are the ones to ask regarding population trends. Anecdotal evidence is based on a persons own experience, be that in-depth or just learning. Hunter surveys show kills and days but not what level the populations are at. In my area in 7a I have seen a rebound in the number of moose over the past two years, however that really means zero as it is relative to an individuals own area and habitat they are in . Bios are more than willing to share the info when asked. I believe our leh system is working.

[BornNRazed]

I always thought an immature and shorter leh season in September, then Bow only tri-palm/10 point for 2-3 weeks during prime rut and breeding time to allow some peace for the moose to breed (has really worked in the moberly area to bring back the moose) followed but a 3 week rifle trip palm/10 point would be an excellent compromise and would help numbers

[mpotzold]

I know this has been discussed ad nauseam before!

Been hunting the Omineca area(mostly 7-38,7-28 & 7-25) since the mid 60’s & had many successful hunts.

The moose were everywhere until the Omineca Model was introduced in 1981. The numbers declined steadily thereafter. IMO the model was a nonsensical design prepared by some armchair thinks-he-knows-it-all!

Other major factor in the decline was giving the FN the right to hunt at night. It was/is like shooting fish in the barrel. Also there is the indiscriminate day or night year round countless slaughtering with no reporting. We have been witness to some of it & have reported it to no avail.

Obviously wolves & bears predation has an impact on the moose survival rate especially the bears that are known to kill dozens of newborns. No doubt the bears are the major culprits not the wolves as many thorough studies in Alaska will attest.

Based on my limited experience & talking to many other hunters, the way I see it (for what it’s worth) on bringing the moose back to normal density.

-NO COW/CALF hunting for all unless it can be proven that there are too many for the area to sustain.
-ABOLISH NIGHT hunting, limit harvest numbers, sex, age & time of the year. Reporting by the FN must be made mandatory so proper management can be done.
-bring back the grizz hunt & control black bear numbers.
-deactivate roads to some sensitive areas & no motorized vehicles in others for all.
-wolf control if needed
-LEH on bull only & open when full recovery has returned
-if drastic action is needed then close moose hunting to all for 1 or more hunting seasons until full recovery.

[hawk-i]

Control the predators along with the FN harvest and the moose will return...its not rocket science!

[boxhitch]

This is from the start of the 5 year moose study, ending March 2018
Who has seen the results


In response to declining Moose numbers in central British Columbia, the Ministry of Forests, Lands and Natural Resource Operations initiated a five-year (December 2013–March 2018) Moose research program to investigate causes for the decline.

Moose and landscape status in Moose research study areas in central B.C. in March 2014.

Study Area Region/ MU Landscape Moose Status
1. Bonaparte (3408 km2) 3 (Thompson/Okanagan)MU - 3-29, 3-30B Habitat Feature -MPBLogging - Ye sRoads – Ye s 335–582/1000 km2Stable
2. Big Creek (4511 km2) 5 (Cariboo)MU - 5-04 Habitat Feature -MPBLogging - Ye sRoads – Ye s 251/1000 km2Declining
3. Entiako (10,543 km2) 6 (Skeena)MU - 6-1, 6-2 Habitat Feature -MPBLogging - Ye sRoads – Ye s 268/1000 km2Stable
4. Prince George South (5280 km2) 7A (Omineca)MU - 7-12 Habitat Feature -MPBLogging - Ye sRoads – Ye s 400/1000 km2Declining
5. John Prince Research Forest (6461 km2) 7A (Omineca)MU - 7-14, 7-25 Habitat Feature -Spruce Logging - Ye sRoads – Ye s 390/1000 km2Stable

[boxhitch]

found it

https://www2.gov.bc.ca/gov/content/environment/research-monitoring-reporting/libraries-publication-catalogues/eirs-biodiversity

DETERMINING FACTORS AFFECTING MOOSEPOPULATION CHANGE IN BRITISH COLUMBIA:TESTING THE LANDSCAPE CHANGE HYPOTHESIS2018ProgressReport: February 2012–April2018

[boxhitch]

We identified the probable proximatecause of death for the 97 cow mortalities as
52 predation (42 Wolf, 4 Cougar, 6 bear),
16 hunting (1licensed, 15 unlicensed),
19 health-related (9 apparent starvation, 2 failed predation attempt, 1 chronic bacterial infection, 1 peritonitis, 1 prolapsed uterus, 5 unknown health-related),
3 natural accident, and
7 unknown.
There were 21 calf mortalities which all occurred between 11 March and 23 May. Proximate probable cause of mortality of calves was
11 predation (9 Wolf, 1 Cougar, 1 Bear),
8 health-related (4 apparent starvation, 2 apparent starvation/tick, 1 failed predation attempt, 1 gastro-intestinal infection)
and 1 vehicle collision.
We recorded a significantly higher proportion of health-related(particularly apparent starvation)mortalities (i.e.,45%) in 2016/17 than in 2017/18.

[kurtl]

I think this article was not about finding out what issues are causing the decline in the moose population. I read this more as a statement that it is time to change what our regulations say we can hunt.

He is saying we should be eliminating/decreasing antlerless hunting opportunities so the cows have a chance to breed and increase the population, and also to eliminate spike fork general open season so they have a chance to mature into bigger breeding bulls. In his theory, it doesn't matter if it is predators, disease, habitat or whatever. The only thing we can do is change what we allow to be harvested and then we can hopefully see some recovery in the numbers. Most of the reasons for moose decline are out of our control, but what we can control is what we are allowed to harvest.

[Caribou_lou]

Most of the reasons for moose decline are out of our control, but what we can control is what we are allowed to harvest.

Well. Nothing is out of our control as I see it. Limiting hunter harvest is the easiest solution. (Attempt)

Im hunting region 6. Babine lake. There is no Cow or Calf hunt. But Im seeing more cows without calves. Is limiting a bull harvest going to bring back calves being picked off by predators. I don't think so.

[Wild one]

Southern region 6 is a good example legal hunting is not the issue

[HarryToolips]

We identified the probable proximatecause of death for the 97 cow mortalities as
52 predation (42 Wolf, 4 Cougar, 6 bear),
16 hunting (1licensed, 15 unlicensed),
19 health-related (9 apparent starvation, 2 failed predation attempt, 1 chronic bacterial infection, 1 peritonitis, 1 prolapsed uterus, 5 unknown health-related),
3 natural accident, and
7 unknown.
There were 21 calf mortalities which all occurred between 11 March and 23 May. Proximate probable cause of mortality of calves was
11 predation (9 Wolf, 1 Cougar, 1 Bear),
8 health-related (4 apparent starvation, 2 apparent starvation/tick, 1 failed predation attempt, 1 gastro-intestinal infection)
and 1 vehicle collision.
We recorded a significantly higher proportion of health-related(particularly apparent starvation)mortalities (i.e.,45%) in 2016/17 than in 2017/18.
Over half of the fatalities are wolf and FN related according to that study...proving again that wolves need to be hammered, and FN need to start being conservationists first, and stop harvesting cows...

[boxhitch]

'unlicensed' figure may be slightly skewed as a collar is a big detterent, leading to kills of non-collared

[LuckyHorseshoe]

Over half of the fatalities are wolf and FN related according to that study...proving again that wolves need to be hammered, and FN need to start being conservationists first, and stop harvesting cows...


I agree that wolf numbers need to be kept in check as well, but also more responsibility should be put on rescouce compaimies to deactivate/tear out roads that provide easy travel. The fact that FN can hunt at night and have not have some type of per capita allowance for harvest OR even report what hey harvest still blows me away.

[tinhorse]

Deactivating roads is key in my opinion as well.

[Wild one]

Deactivating roads is key in my opinion as well.

Present form of deactivating roads stops nothing but stock trucks and cars. Even at that a chainsaw and logs solves most. ATV, small lift, and samurai/sidekick and they do nothing. With how common deactivations have become most who use BCs backroads are well adapted to deal with them

lots of areas with heavily deactivated or extremely deteriorating road systems are experiencing major decline.

[markomoose]

Present form of deactivating roads stops nothing but stock trucks and cars. Even at that a chainsaw and logs solves most. ATV, small lift, and samurai/sidekick and they do nothing. With how common deactivations have become most who use BCs backroads are well adapted to deal with them

lots of areas with heavily deactivated or extremely deteriorating road systems are experiencing major decline. I totally agree !

[rageous]

They should deactivate roads to prevent 4 legged predator usage not just 2 legged predator usage

[Caribou_lou]

They should deactivate roads to prevent 4 legged predator usage not just 2 legged predator usage

You'd have to restrict all backcountry winter activities in that case. Snowmobiles are always singled out for creating easy access for wovles into Caribou, Moose, sheep habitat. In reality, wolves could use a snowshoe track or cross country/backcountry ski track just as well as a sled track.

[rageous]

You'd have to restrict all backcountry winter activities in that case. Snowmobiles are always singled out for creating easy access for wovles into Caribou, Moose, sheep habitat. In reality, wolves could use a snowshoe track or cross country/backcountry ski track just as well as a sled track.

I see your point but usually the wolves follow the game.
In winter most game moves to lower elevation.

A lot of sledders use road systems. Same with skiers, same but lower snowshoers

[BearSupreme]

They should deactivate roads to prevent 4 legged predator usage not just 2 legged predator usage

Closing down roads will only restrict humans, its proven that logging roads in general have allowed predators (especially wolves) to expand their ranges and cover way more ground then they ever used to. Its hard to restrict a road once its there, they rarely fully grow over again and its usually with different plant life than the original area.

[Wild one]

They should deactivate roads to prevent 4 legged predator usage not just 2 legged predator usage

Ok explain how you would accomplish this?

[rageous]

Remove the road completely

In an area I hunt wolves travel the same roads going through cut blocks hunting just like humans on their quad or in trucks hunting do

[Wild one]

Remove the road completely

Pretty vague

You would actually need to get creative making roads unusable for wolves. Roads is the hot word right now but it’s actually a matter of man building travel routes and roads are just one. Railroad tracks, horse trials, hiking trails, atv/snowmobile trails, pipeline and the list goes on. It does not take much so think about the level of obliteration you would need to do to a road to impact a wolf

Travel routes created by man benifiting wolves is a negative on ungulates but it’s not as simple to solve as deactivating. Roads are this years hot topic but no one has a realistic approach to addressing it or saying that this issue goes beyond just a roads creating these travel routes

Remember the big kill WT to save MD from predators/competition program how effective was that? There is a hot topic save all theory thrown out every few years.

I do support that we need roads reclaimed, and habitat improvement but in the end dealing with predator issues we need predator control to see results

[rageous]

Good points Wild one. Too bad your a soon to be a non B.C. resident. You have a lot of good idears.

[Wild one]

Good points Wild one. Too bad your a soon to be a non B.C. resident. You have a lot of good idears.

Blame those who voted NDP lol

[Rob Chipman]

Recent study from northern Alberta indicates that putting lots of logs over the road makes an impact on reducing human and animal travel/predation. I'll try to find the study for details. Seems like such an easy fix that it sounds a bit too good to be true...but hey, they studied it as science.

[Wild one]

Recent study from northern Alberta indicates that putting lots of logs over the road makes an impact on reducing human and animal travel/predation. I'll try to find the study for details. Seems like such an easy fix that it sounds a bit too good to be true...but hey, they studied it as science.

Still not an impact on predator numbers and that is why Alaska is active with direct predator control.

Enough trees with branches I could see being effective but I have watched wolves duck under and hope over the trunks of fallen trees without missing a stride on a systemic line. This would still be temporary but could buy enough time if you replanted fast growing species like poplar in the road to reclaim it. One large flaw man carries chainsaw and will at times undue your work to gain access. Some areas this will be a battle

This is still only one issue not an overall solution. Reclaiming a portion of BCs forest service roads is possible and I agree with it. At best you will accomplish small pockets that are more difficult for wolf predation(not the only preds either) and May have small improvement in localized ungulate populations. On the large scale of things there will still be an overwhelming amount of travel routes. The wolves are still there and you only made a small impact on the success rate in a small portion of thier range

Is working on the over abundance of roads is worth while yes but it will not solve predator numbers or the impact they are having on overall predation

What is your solution for areas that are being impacted with little to no roads? Yes

Indirect methods are not going to solve or even make much of an impact. Expecially relying on one factor that can not be completely controlled. Running both direct and indirect methods of predator control you may see the results you hope for

Dreams of easy fixes often lead to failure for a reason

But its dinner lol

[Wild one]

I can tell I was rushing my crap typing skills there ^^

If you need anything cleared up in that mess ask lol