Rifle in sheep country

[AllDay]

I am just wondering what the lowest caliber rifle someone would bring into sheep country. Still pretty new to hunting and just want to be smart. I have a 270 Winchester and feel like that might not help if a G bear decides to try ruin my plans. Hiking in off the highway and covering a lot of ground on foot through g bear country.

Any thoughts or advice on this?

[Jimbob]

What do archery hunters, fishermen, hikers and other outdoor people do? I go into grizzly bear country with no gun all the time. I think any gun is a bonus.

[Brew]

Your fine with the 270. I’d go down to the 6.5 creedmoor as my lightest even though a 6mm cartridge will do the job. Use a good tough bullet if your worried about it. I wouldn’t worry about bears although they are everywhere up there. Seen a lot last season off the highway

[mod7rem]

I’ve been hunting sheep every year starting in 2003 and the last thing I would be worried about is having enough gun for grizzlies. I’ve seen maybe a half dozen in all those trips and so far no bad encounters. I think you’d have a better chance of getting in a car accident on your way there. I also think that in reality, if sh*t really hits the fan, your chances are poor whether you have a 270 win or a 338 win.
I would recommend taking the rifle that you are the most comfortable and practiced with.

[northof49]

My choice....300win tuned with 180gr Nosler AB for sheep/goat shots and 3 rounds of 180gr TTSX for hiking in/out.

[Bustercluck]

A little bit off topic, but who uses a bear fence or warning system when they’re in bear country? I’m also planning a sheep hunt this year and my partner wants one but I don’t really care. I think the best defence is not having any kind of food or smelly scents in your tent.

[REMINGTON JIM]

I am just wondering what the lowest caliber rifle someone would bring into sheep country. Still pretty new to hunting and just want to be smart. I have a 270 Winchester and feel like that might not help if a G bear decides to try ruin my plans. Hiking in off the highway and covering a lot of ground on foot through g bear country.

Any thoughts or advice on this?

FINE with a 270 WINNY ! Nosler Accubond or a Barnes TTSX Bullet - Your Golden ! jmo RJ

[338win mag]

A little bit off topic, but who uses a bear fence or warning system when they’re in bear country? I’m also planning a sheep hunt this year and my partner wants one but I don’t really care. I think the best defence is not having any kind of food or smelly scents in your tent.
I would put the bacon in your buddys pack.

[AllDay]

Thanks for the replies. Still new to this. Just looking for some input on the topic. It's different getting dropped off in the mountains vs. hiking 30 km on foot through old horse trails to get into the mountains. Still dumb enough to hike in off the highway. I feel like a fly in trip will happen after this year.

[mod7rem]

A little bit off topic, but who uses a bear fence or warning system when they’re in bear country? I’m also planning a sheep hunt this year and my partner wants one but I don’t really care. I think the best defence is not having any kind of food or smelly scents in your tent.


I agree with you on a clean camp. But there’s definitely some luck involved in not having bear problems. On a two week trip it’s very tough to not have food smells, dead animal smells in your clothes and gear.

[AllDay]

I’ve been hunting sheep every year starting in 2003 and the last thing I would be worried about is having enough gun for grizzlies. I’ve seen maybe a half dozen in all those trips and so far no bad encounters. I think you’d have a better chance of getting in a car accident on your way there. I also think that in reality, if sh*t really hits the fan, your chances are poor whether you have a 270 win or a 338 win.
I would recommend taking the rifle that you are the most comfortable and practiced with.

That's true. I seen two g bears on my first sheep trip. One of them was in the mountains, other was at the bottom of the valley on our way out. Only reason I am trying to get different opinions is because I am still learning

[mod7rem]

Thanks for the replies. Still new to this. Just looking for some input on the topic. It's different getting dropped off in the mountains vs. hiking 30 km on foot through old horse trails to get into the mountains. Still dumb enough to hike in off the highway. I feel like a fly in trip will happen after this year.

Not too much different actually, very common to get dropped off on a remote lake, river or airstrip, then hike 30kms on horse trails to find sheep :)

[AllDay]

Not too much different actually, very common to get dropped off on a remote lake, river or airstrip, then hike 30kms on horse trails to find sheep :)

Haha I guess when I fly in I'll find out! I thought the sheep were just waiting for you at the landing zone haha.. Either way, thanks for your input!

[Treed]

There are a few attack a year. Going on a back country hunt puts you into a higher risk group but you are probably statically a hell of a lot safer than a taxi driver in the lower mainland - and none of them wear seat belts!

[Bugle M In]

You are fine with a 270 Win.
Find some books on good old Jack O'Connor.
I think he more than anybody made that cartridge legendary while hunting in North America, especially here in BC.
Or a 7mm mag if you wanted added security and a great ballistic rifle for sheep.

[zippermouth]

Most hunters strap their rifle securely in their pack so it really doesn’t matter if that’s your plan. I like having a bigger caliber rifle in grizz country. And I never put it on my pack, possibly saved my life and fiancé’s life this fall with a snarling black bear. I was also bluff charged this year by a grizz and felt better having a 300wm, rather than a 6.5 creedmoor. I’m hoping I never have to pull the trigger on a charging bear again but with the grizz hunt shut down and more human bear encounters it might be smart to use a bigger caliber rifle...

[Ron.C]

A little bit off topic, but who uses a bear fence or warning system when they’re in bear country? I’m also planning a sheep hunt this year and my partner wants one but I don’t really care. I think the best defence is not having any kind of food or smelly scents in your tent.
I haven't hunted sheep, but goats and use a Pac Alarm around my tent.

on a side note as you asked about caliber, I now use a 7mm-08 for all my big game hunting. Figured it's better to hunt with a rifle/caliber that I shoot well and enjoy carrying. And its better than my bow or muzzle loader in the unlikely event I have to shoot at a Gbear.

[AllDay]

Most hunters strap their rifle securely in their pack so it really doesn’t matter if that’s your plan. I like having a bigger caliber rifle in grizz country. And I never put it on my pack, possibly saved my life and fiancé’s life this fall with a snarling black bear. I was also bluff charged this year by a grizz and felt better having a 300wm, rather than a 6.5 creedmoor. I’m hoping I never have to pull the trigger on a charging bear again but with the grizz hunt shut down and more human bear encounters it might be smart to use a bigger caliber rifle...

I usually carry the rifle through most of the areas on the hike in. If I ever need a break it's in the quick draw sling, which is pretty fast.

I realize chances are slim but I like to have the right tool for the right job. Definitely appreciate all the different view points

[decker9]

Thanks for the replies. Still new to this. Just looking for some input on the topic. It's different getting dropped off in the mountains vs. hiking 30 km on foot through old horse trails to get into the mountains. Still dumb enough to hike in off the highway. I feel like a fly in trip will happen after this year.

Dont overlook the hike in!! Flying in is a blast, and if you sheep hunt, you should definetly do it! It’s a great experience. On that note, of 7 fly in’s and 3 hike in, it was my 3rd hike in where I found my first ram, almost 30km’s from the truck lol.

On the bear subject, I’m a 100% believer in a good dog. My pack dog has saved my butt twice from grizzly, the first wasn’t such a big deal, but sure could have been, the second time, my dad and I would have had a fight on our hands if it wasn’t for my dog. But on that note, a dog can also make things worse, proper training is very important.

[whitlers]

Dont overlook the hike in!! Flying in is a blast, and if you sheep hunt, you should definetly do it! It’s a great experience. On that note, of 7 fly in’s and 3 hike in, it was my 3rd hike in where I found my first ram, almost 30km’s from the truck lol.

On the bear subject, I’m a 100% believer in a good dog. My pack dog has saved my butt twice from grizzly, the first wasn’t such a big deal, but sure could have been, the second time, my dad and I would have had a fight on our hands if it wasn’t for my dog. But on that note, a dog can also make things worse, proper training is very important.

What kind of dog are we talking about? I am toying with bringing my mutt out with me but she might be to small at 35 lbs. Shes built solid and has great instincts but I would worry about her getting tangled up with a pred.

[northof49]

^^^^or a porcupine....and that is no fun. Good to pack along small locking needle nose vice grips to yank out.

[boxhitch]

You are fine with a 270 Win.
Find some books on good old Jack O'Connor.
I think he more than anybody made that cartridge legendary while hunting in North America, especially here in BC.
Or a 7mm mag if you wanted added security and a great ballistic rifle for sheep.Likely while he had a guide along, who may have been heavily armed....or not

[whitlers]

^^^^or a porcupine....and that is no fun. Good to pack along small locking needle nose vice grips to yank out.

Good advice haha thanks

[boxhitch]

Want a cheap camp alarm? Get a $12 personal rape alarm and a cheap flyfishing reel full of backing line
Set up is fast and easy. Works for saving a meat cache too.

[Bugle M In]

Likely while he had a guide along, who may have been heavily armed....or not

True.
I have to say, I did stop listening to all those Hunting magazine writers a long time ago.
I realized most of them were basically riding the coat tails of guides/outfitters, who are the folks with the
"real experience".
Sort of why I liked talking to the pioneers who did it themselves, which there are a few of them who write and do
videos.

But the 270 will do the job.
Can always pack 150gr in the pocket after the sheep/goat is down, for that just in case moment.
Close range, the gun/bullet will work.
Plus you get to have a couple extra loaded in compared to most magnums (granted many now carry higher capacity clips
but that wasn't the case when I used to go).

Only reason I really carried the 300 win mag now is because longer shots on elk, I found the 270 didn't go thru and thru,
which made finding blood a real pain in the ass at times.
One can never really know where gbear will be hanging.
For me, have seen them closer to where I hunt elk, rather than sheep.

[Weatherby Fan]

^^^^or a porcupine....and that is no fun. Good to pack along small locking needle nose vice grips to yank out.

on our fly in we seen no less than a dozen porcupine, 2 of them chewed the shit out of our camp one night and my brother had a heck of a fight with them but in the end he won out !

[srupp]

Hmmm .270 is plenty.
Leave the familly dog at home..he will come running back to hide between your legs..he WILL fit..400 pound grizz not so much.
Cheers
Srupp

[Bugle M In]

Dogs like a husky are good in the tent to tell you something lurks outside!
But are a pain in the ass for hunting anything.
But they will chase gbear! (stupid dogs)

[pg83]

Give this article a read if you have the time:

https://journalofmountainhunting.com/make-your-mountain-rifle-a-bear-stopping-rifle/

[AllDay]

Thanks again for all the information! Definitely really enjoy getting a bunch of different perspectives on what works for certain people. It has been really helpful.

[Bugle M In]

The Fail Safe were a good choice for my Husky 270, like them a lot and used it on a lot of elk.
But, no longer make them.
Still have Federal with Nosler Partitions, which is good bullet for elk, it was just my husky didn't like them that much.
(might have been the powder rather than bullet, imo.)
But, at close range, they will still hit their mark.
So a few of those in the pocket while sheep hunting was what I did.
The rifle loved the old style 130gr boat tail silver tips (better than the newer silver style ballistic tip ...plastic).
So that was the bullet I used when goat and sheep for distance.

Most elk one can be brought in/dropped at close range, so pin point accuracy isn't as crucial.

So basically, as long as a really well constructed bullet will hit reasonably well on paper at 100 yards, you have a good
bullet for gbear after sheep etc is down.

Just make sure the ammo you use for sheep, and thus sighted in for, will also not be too far off for the bear ammo.
I found using Winchester for my rifle worked best, and even if it was sighted in for say a 130gr silver tip, if I threw in
and fired off a heaver bullet, like fail safe, impact point didn't change much, just up and down.
Going from Winchester 130 to Federal 150 partition led to some left and right and up and down bs.
But again, at 30 yards or so, if a bear wont leave you alone, it will hit him.

That's how I addressed it.

[whitlers]

Give this article a read if you have the time:

https://journalofmountainhunting.com/make-your-mountain-rifle-a-bear-stopping-rifle/

Interesting read. Makes sense.

[Citori54]

At one time before we all figured we needed the latest greatest new cartridge (I'm just as guilty), .270 win was considered the go to sheep cartridge. It still is a fine caliber, relatively fast & flat shooting, reasonable recoil. I always preferred the 140 grain bullet in the 270, but there were not the better selection of 150 grain pills then. I took moose with the .270 and 150 Nosler partition no problem. On a mountain mule deer trip this year we saw 13 different grizzlies in 7 days but had no issues and I was packing a 7-08 - certainly not the best medicine for big bears. As others have said if you are attacked at close quarters caliber will likely not matter.

[russm]

What kind of dog are we talking about? I am toying with bringing my mutt out with me but she might be to small at 35 lbs. Shes built solid and has great instincts but I would worry about her getting tangled up with a pred.

35 pounds worth of getting away time lol

[decker9]

What kind of dog are we talking about? I am toying with bringing my mutt out with me but she might be to small at 35 lbs. Shes built solid and has great instincts but I would worry about her getting tangled up with a pred.

My dog is a husky/Shepard I was told when I got her, she’s about 70lbs in the fall. With a dog a person is up against buckbrush and sharp shale, at times a guy has to take the longer way around to avoid some areas for sure. Iv had to pack my dogs pack more then once because of thick brush. A smaller dog might actually get around better then a bigger dog lol.

I believe a well trained dog is key, Iv heard many counts of a dog bringing a bear back to the owner. One thing I found once I started packing my dog tho, she pays 100% attention to me and what I’m doing, it’s like she has a job then, and loves it. The “heel” and “stay” type commands seem a lot more effective when her pack is on.

[Bustercluck]

Give this article a read if you have the time:

https://journalofmountainhunting.com/make-your-mountain-rifle-a-bear-stopping-rifle/

This is a pretty good read. I was thinking of loading up some heavy partitions for my 300wsm, but maybe a solid might be a better option. I’ve been using Barnes ttsx exclusively for the past bunch of years, but I’m a little bit nervous about loading them up against gbear with some of the claims people have that they don’t open up.

[Weatherby Fan]

This is a pretty good read. I was thinking of loading up some heavy partitions for my 300wsm, but maybe a solid might be a better option. I’ve been using Barnes ttsx exclusively for the past bunch of years, but I’m a little bit nervous about loading them up against gbear with some of the claims people have that they don’t open up.


My nephew stopped a charging Grizzly at 9 yards with a 300 WSM and 180 TTSX, they worked just fine.

[northof49]

on our fly in we seen no less than a dozen porcupine, 2 of them chewed the shit out of our camp one night and my brother had a heck of a fight with them but in the end he won out !

ya they are hell on dogs....and a disaster in the back country if you can’t get the quills out. Usually they will be deep in mouth up in the nose and around or in eyes. It is a horrible situation for sure. If you can’t remove the quills they will continue to migrate inward because they are barbed. Just try pushing one into clothing and try to pull it out. Hard sitution to deal with holding dog down and trying to avoid getting bit....ugly ugly ugly and very upsetting.

[jac]

I would bring the 270 and Bear spray on your side and your good to go!!

[Ohwildwon]

How much does your .270 weigh?

If its over 9 lbs with a scope, you definitely need to spend $4000 to $7000 on a lighter rifle.:razz:

[wildcatter]

The Fail Safe were a good choice for my Husky 270, like them a lot and used it on a lot of elk.
But, no longer make them.
Still have Federal with Nosler Partitions, which is good bullet for elk, it was just my husky didn't like them that much.
(might have been the powder rather than bullet, imo.)
But, at close range, they will still hit their mark.
So a few of those in the pocket while sheep hunting was what I did.
The rifle loved the old style 130gr boat tail silver tips (better than the newer silver style ballistic tip ...plastic).
So that was the bullet I used when goat and sheep for distance.

Most elk one can be brought in/dropped at close range, so pin point accuracy isn't as crucial.

So basically, as long as a really well constructed bullet will hit reasonably well on paper at 100 yards, you have a good
bullet for gbear after sheep etc is down.

Just make sure the ammo you use for sheep, and thus sighted in for, will also not be too far off for the bear ammo.
I found using Winchester for my rifle worked best, and even if it was sighted in for say a 130gr silver tip, if I threw in
and fired off a heaver bullet, like fail safe, impact point didn't change much, just up and down.
Going from Winchester 130 to Federal 150 partition led to some left and right and up and down bs.
But again, at 30 yards or so, if a bear wont leave you alone, it will hit him.

That's how I addressed it.

I remember that, used to have a 270 Whitworth and those silver tips worked well.
That was my first rifle and I should have kept it.

[Danny_29]

ya they are hell on dogs....and a disaster in the back country if you can’t get the quills out. Usually they will be deep in mouth up in the nose and around or in eyes. It is a horrible situation for sure. If you can’t remove the quills they will continue to migrate inward because they are barbed. Just try pushing one into clothing and try to pull it out. Hard sitution to deal with holding dog down and trying to avoid getting bit....ugly ugly ugly and very upsetting.

Agreed, mine tangled with one out on a bird hunt. Pulled the first one out myself, just miserable. Packed up and headed to the vet. Did not enjoy.

[whitlers]

My dog is a husky/Shepard I was told when I got her, she’s about 70lbs in the fall. With a dog a person is up against buckbrush and sharp shale, at times a guy has to take the longer way around to avoid some areas for sure. Iv had to pack my dogs pack more then once because of thick brush. A smaller dog might actually get around better then a bigger dog lol.

I believe a well trained dog is key, Iv heard many counts of a dog bringing a bear back to the owner. One thing I found once I started packing my dog tho, she pays 100% attention to me and what I’m doing, it’s like she has a job then, and loves it. The “heel” and “stay” type commands seem a lot more effective when her pack is on.

Good insight on changing your route due to the dog. I didnt think about that.

My dog loves her pack too. I think your right, it's like a sense of pride they have while wearing it haha. She is trained well, her recall and stay commands are good but I'm not sure how she would react around a pred. Her personality says stand her ground and make alot of noise but who knows until it happens.



35 pounds worth of getting away time lol

Hahahaha I guess that wouldn't get me far. I need a bigger slower dog haha

[whitlers]

My nephew stopped a charging Grizzly at 9 yards with a 300 WSM and 180 TTSX, they worked just fine.

I wanna hear that story. Jesus!

[hawk-i]

270 win is plenty..my mountain rifle is a Kimber Montana in 280 AI.

[303savage]

I think shot placement is just as important as the calibre used.

[REMINGTON JIM]

I wanna hear that story. Jesus!

Hes still POOPing ! :wink: lol RJ

[IronNoggin]

Dogs like a husky are good in the tent to tell you something lurks outside!
But are a pain in the ass for hunting anything.
But they will chase gbear! (stupid dogs)

Stupid to make generalizations actually...

My Big Boy is 1/2 Alaskan Husky and 1/2 Timber Wolf.
He is totally unafraid of anything that walks, including humans, bears, cats, other dogs and pretty well damn near anything else.
And he is smarter by far than the average Two-Legs - FAR from "stupid".
I would MUCH rather have him in camp in Grizz country than an excitable hunter with relatively little experience.
Chase the bear? Hell No, he catches them if they can't get up a tree.
And the results are far from pretty. ;)

As for the 270, I would be entirely comfortable packing mine into Grizz Country (and have many times).
Run Nosler partitions at 140 or 150 grains, and make the only shot or two you are going to get anyway COUNT!

Cheers,
Nog

[swampthing]

I wouldn't worry too much about bears. Worry more about being killed while driving up there! Your 270 is plenty of gun. I have carried my 270 on 2 grizzly specific hunts. Bears get into peoples heads a bit too much. I think about them but try not to worry them. Every bear I see runs as fast as it can the other way when it sees me.

[Greenthumbed]

Give this article a read if you have the time:

https://journalofmountainhunting.com/make-your-mountain-rifle-a-bear-stopping-rifle/

I read that article a while back. I hunt with a .270 win. After reading the article I went to the loading bench and loaded up some 160 grain Nosler Partitions I had kicking around for the walk out. They're probably the hardest hitting .270 round I could come up with. I haven't used them yet and I hope I never have to.

[pg83]

I read that article a while back. I hunt with a .270 win. After reading the article I went to the loading bench and loaded up some 160 grain Nosler Partitions I had kicking around for the walk out. They're probably the hardest hitting .270 round I could come up with. I haven't used them yet and I hope I never have to.

Exactly. It really doesn't matter what gun you're carrying, the bullet is more important. That said, I should refer to my sheep hunting partner for real-world experience with aggressive grizz as he and a hunting partner both drilled a charging sow and had had either missed, they might not be around to tell the story.

[Bugle M In]

Stupid to make generalizations actually...

My Big Boy is 1/2 Alaskan Husky and 1/2 Timber Wolf.
He is totally unafraid of anything that walks, including humans, bears, cats, other dogs and pretty well damn near anything else.
And he is smarter by far than the average Two-Legs - FAR from "stupid".
I would MUCH rather have him in camp in Grizz country than an excitable hunter with relatively little experience.
Chase the bear? Hell No, he catches them if they can't get up a tree.
And the results are far from pretty. ;)

As for the 270, I would be entirely comfortable packing mine into Grizz Country (and have many times).
Run Nosler partitions at 140 or 150 grains, and make the only shot or two you are going to get anyway COUNT!

Cheers,
Nog

I think you misunderstood.
They aren't afraid, as I have had huskies.
And no, they aren't stupid.
I just don't like having to track down my dog after chasing something like a gbear away is all.
(when I di take him, he was leashed, but in the middle of the night, in a tent and something is outside, made it a little
hard to control them, and then there are those times you get out to piss, and they come out behind you, and of they go
barking and chasing something)
That was the "stupid" part I hated.

[IronNoggin]

I think you misunderstood.

...

That was the "stupid" part I hated.

Roger that.
Mine will leave on attack mode, but he always comes back on his own, and most often immediately returns when told to.
Only been a couple of times he refused to listen. Both were bears. Both in his mind were too damn close.
And once he had them on the run, he came back, literally grinning.

Cheers,
Nog

[Bugle M In]

Attack/Chase mode is where he didn't stop.
3 a.m., he tears off 1 km straight down the cut block in pursuit.
Thankfully I could still hear him barking.

Having a dog is definitely a way to help you know if something lurks close by.
Just to have a dog that can be a little quiet while stalking for game.

I don't know about yours, but getting "towed" all over the place isn't fun.
They were more concerned about "their hunting" than mine:-D

I have to say, I know one fellow who did have a pure bred Malamute.
Big Dog!
But, gentle and seemed some what calmer than Siberians.
The guy had a pack for the dog, and the dog had to pack along his own dog food and bowl!!!
That was awesome and great to see. (only issue was water for the dog up in sheep country).

He also said he was glad to have such a dog for bears.
(had a similar issue with an elk hanging and they were only in small tent).

Another thought for those hunting alone.
(the trick is to keep the dog from barking however when its something you are actually trying to stalk!!????????)

[JAGRMEISTER]

Intelligent response here. I am guessing an older/experienced hunter!