My 2 cents on the Junior Hunt.....

[blackford]

Before I start I want to clear up what some of you are going to think. I was able to get my deer this year. Infact in our group we are fine for deer for a season and a half. Thats with us going to the elders in the community and giving the hunters that are to elderly to hunt some deer to enjoy. My parents brought me up the right way...


Ok. So I hope I don't ruffle to many feathers here. I know I am going to get a back lash on this but from the hunters I spoke to this year so far - they agree with me. The open youth season in region 8 has got to stop. Plain and simple. When I started hunting about 15 years ago we had a lot more deer. Infact my first deer was shot with my dad no further than 100 yards away. We didn't need a "open youth season" and we all seemed to do ok. I learned how to clean a deer and I was instantly hooked on the sport. I didn't need a youth season to get me going.

Before I even start - I have yet to hear of any youth that went hunting and missed a deer. No matter how young or old they are. No matter how big the deer was or if it was moving or to far... they always seem to hit it. Infact I have been out for bow season and see kids in pyjamas in the truck. What I am getting at is that I am willing to bet Dad is taking the shot a high percentage of the time. You can't tell me otherwise. How is a youth who has never possibly shot at an animal before get out of the truck and shoot a deer first try... cmon ladies and gents....


Secondly the length of time the season is open. Sept 1 -Sept 30 and then it open for everyone else for any buck. I went this year and I got my buck... I hunted off the beaten path. I can tell you that every single buck I saw was moving pretty quick. Chances are they have been shot at ( from the kids doing it right) or they have heard the bullets fly towards other deer. This is ridiculous..... I have 1 week a year to dedicate to hunting. By the kids going out and shooting and eliminating a lot of deer from the mix, it makes it harder for me to get my deer. I contribute just like the parents of the kids do and I think I am entitled as much as they are to bagging my deer.


Thirdly- Jesus Christ- now even open for birds... every year I limited out on grouse. This year I came nowhere close... wonder why..?

Lastly, we have new regulations saying we can take only one deer from selected regions. This is because deer counts are down ( I guess). If this is the case then why are we letting dads in with the kids to shoot deer before the other hunters can. Lets make it fair for everyone.

My thoughts is if the youth draw was to continue we make it like a limited entry. Give a certain amount of spikes, 2 point, 3 point and larger for the youths. This will have dad.... I mean the youth have to count the points before shooting... It will teach them good habits and it will make the sustainability of the sport go further.

This is the only sport we give a break to the youths. Can youths fish the Fraser when its closed..

I am going to go hide under a rock because I am sure this will get some people upset but this needs to stop. And if we are going to open it up for the youth... Then why not open it up for the seniors.... they can't go on a 10 km hike to the alpine to get a deer.

In my eyes its all done wrong

[eatram]

Let me be the first to congratulate you on being willing to stick your neck out and voice your opinion. Especially when you know that you will be crucified for this. I wish that we as Canadians would be willing to be so bold as to voice our opinions even though we know that there may be backlash. I am going to stop writing now and get a bag of popcorn...

[two-feet]

Let me be the first to congratulate you on being willing to stick your neck out and voice your opinion. Especially when you know that you will be crucified for this. I wish that we as Canadians would be willing to be so bold as to voice our opinions even though we know that there may be backlash. I am going to stop writing now and get a bag of popcorn...
pop some for me, and bring beer

[srupp]

Hmmm lol..we need to recruit new hunters..get them away from their gameboys...computers.
Im all for anything to help these young hunters in the field and help them with success...
I didnt have this system..im all for helping them get started..
Give em a break..
Cheers
Steven

[blackford]

Let me be clear here. I want the next generations of hunters to thrive but..... maybe a shorter season and maybe closely regulated so dads are eating the aforementioned popcorn when junior is pulling the trigger . Also why not a draw system

[Danny_29]

Last time I checked a kid in school doesn't get a week off to go hunting?

[Big Lew]

It won't happen 'blackford'...it's been hashed through before. I'm a bow hunter and can see
the writing on the wall in relation to crossbows being involved. I'm not saying that crossbows
shouldn't be included in the bow season, only that they are now so well developed that the high
end ones are as accurate as a rifle out to 100 yards in the right hands. Then consider that even
compound bows are much more accurate and capable out to ranges almost double to what they
were when the rules were changed to make special bow only seasons. Add these modern weapons
in with the youth season, especially now that that youth season is extended, and it doesn't take
a rocket scientist to realize the early deer slaughter isn't sustainable the way it is now. About the
only way I can see maintaining this 'special' season for both youth and archery is to make it 3 points
or better. We all know that during the first week or so in September the young bucks, spikes and
2 points, are very easy to find and kill, especially by road hunters. If not, it will not be long before
that season is eliminated, or like in some regions, all hunting with the use of a vehicle will not be
allowed before 10 am.

[Islander30]

Your logic is strange to me. You say you started hunting 15 years ago, when there was a lot more deer around, and you shot your first deer no more than a 100yds with your dad....so you say that proves you didn't need a youth season to get your deer ??? Sounds like you didnt need a youth season because there was A LOT MORE deer around, as you just said yourself.

Secondly if you hear of a Dad taking the shot for a kid then report them to RAPP, it's illegal and not the intention of the youth season at all. If like you say it happens all the time start reporting these poacher Dads that are running around taking hunts away from their own kids !!! But why should the honest be punished anyways ? With that logic its like saying all hunting should be closed because of a few poachers !

You also defend senior hunts by saying they can't do 10 km hikes ??? Again your logic baffles me, did it occur to you that although seniors may not be able to hike as much THEY CAN HUNT EVERY DAY OF THE SEASON !!! Kids just like you ( who apparently can only hunt one week a season) have to go to school !

And by the way my son missed his first whitetail and got scoped in the nose for his consultation prize just last week, he's 11.....it was a nice buck and I had plenty of time to shoot it for him, but that would have been wrong....it was not even a youth season so I COULD have shot the buck for him and cut my tag, but I didnt..that's not how to teach him to improve, it's better the buck walks.

Hunting doesn't have to be a selfish sport. Think of others sometimes, put yourself in their shoes. Like SRUPP said it's not easy to get a kid into hunting these days....certainly none of their friends hunt, not unless it's on Xbox or PS4. So ya youth hunts give kids an advantage, but we're in a time when the whole sport of hunting is danger of extintiction. So whatever little advantage helps a kid get into hunting I applaud....who knows maybe one day that kid will stand up and be the voice that saves hunting !

[Wild one]

Youth season when the youth is the shooter I am ok with. But I have posted about the abuse of the season years ago and most don’t care. Calling a CO some say well unless you have video of the father being the shooter it’s going nowhere

As a father I like the principal of it but idiots wreck it

Timing of the season I am not a fan of and don’t believe it should be during archery season. But this is BC where bow hunting makes you an evil elitist and archery seasons just steal opportunity from others lol

Nope you won’t see much love when it comes to youth season related issues

[Wild one]

Last time I checked a kid in school doesn't get a week off to go hunting?

Its called being your school work on the hunt just like any other vacation. It works out great did it every year as a kid and usually for 10-14days not 7

I have 2 kids and can tell you there is no lack of pro D days and holidays in school as well

[Steeleco]

I've benefited from both my kids having a youth season and even now they are both grown feel it should stay to get more young kids out there. As to the dad doing the trigger work. Those guys should be beat with a pound of their own shit! If the meat is that important go buy it, it's cheaper. I and a few dad's I know would NEVER make my kid lie about their hunting experiences. We have passed on a few animals that Dad could have shot, but the kid would have to lie about it for the rest of their lives. It's 9 days at the beginning of the season that often overlaps with the returning to school, in most cases high school which means more as they get older. If you can't handle the competition, take up needlepoint!!

[.264winmag]

I think the youth season is great, if I had my own kids it'd even be better. As said we need the youth more interested in the outdoors than the video games and wondering what gender they are.
There's always going to be some people that bend the rules, we don't shut all hunting doen because of it. If Dad wants to poke a spike of the road with the kid riding shotgun, well it ain't right but he's the one that's gotta live with it HA. I don't hunt the fsr, and save for the alpine I could care less about deer hunting until November. Just practicing and stretching the legs before that imo, let the youth have at the young dumb bucks...

[HarryToolips]

I personally think the youth season should be there, but I agree that it should be shortened to the first 12 to 15 days of Sept...it is good to start the season in the sense that it is a good way to adjust the deer to hunting pressure before the main GOS starts...dads who shoot deer for their kids should be ashamed of themselves, and should be reported as mentioned if at all possible...btw in my part of reg 8 myself and my group are seeing good numbers of deer this year..

[Cyrus]

I hear a lot of stories about dads blasting their kids deer for them. A lot of big bucks around in early September. I didnt have a youth season...I got skunked like other people...I still hunt. Todays youth is different though with entitlement issues and focus on technology stuff and now sitting around and smoking weed all day.

[steel_ram]

I think the idea of a youth season is great. Better yet make it a season for those that have never cut a tag period. Let the newbies kill the road side spikes. Unfortunately there are the cheater, the dads taking the kids out in their pajamas. The same guys that haul their wives around for the extra tags.

[Danny_29]

Its called being your school work on the hunt just like any other vacation. It works out great did it every year as a kid and usually for 10-14days not 7

I have 2 kids and can tell you there is no lack of pro D days and holidays in school as well


Cool that you could do this. But the usual kid does not have this opportunity.

[carnivore]

The same guys that haul their wives around for the extra tags.

I call them "tags of convenience" Chatted with some moose hunters one time that had a bull down and were racing back to camp to get Granny because she had a draw and tag.

[wos]

When I started hunting we never had a youth season! But i had a father that made sure he always took the time to take me hunting. Whether it was just a morning hunt for ducks or a week long adventure chasing deer. He also gave up many of his own opportunities on game so i could get a chance to be successful. That takes alot of patients. The youth season can be a great tool that takes alot of pressure off the parent as they aren't allowed to shoot or need to look for a 4 point. Time spent hunting with your kids is some of the best time you can spend with them. If the government is giving us a special season for the occasion then im glad they recognize the importance aswell. Or we can bla bla bla about all the bad and loose yet another season. The way some people are talking lately about low game numbers and how quickly they start pointing fingers really makes me scratch my head.

[kootenay88]

Yup. I am in grade 12 and have taken a week of to go elk/deer hunting since I was 10. A fair amount of "kids" in school I know take time off to hunt.

[Wild one]

Cool that you could do this. But the usual kid does not have this opportunity.

That actually depends on how their parents choose to raise there kids. My son has the option every year but prefers just to bird hunt a little around home. Most of my friends with kids who hunt take the kids a week or more every year

Its actually easier these days because kids get way less homework

[RyoTHC]

I hear a lot of stories about dads blasting their kids deer for them. A lot of big bucks around in early September. I didnt have a youth season...I got skunked like other people...I still hunt. Todays youth is different though with entitlement issues and focus on technology stuff and now sitting around and smoking weed all day.

I'm sorry, but I have to laugh at you...
I suppose there are massive amounts of kids sitting around getting drunk all day right???

Why don't you think before you speak.

You may be right about entitlement issues but all I see here is jealousy and resentment.

[ratherbefishin]

My granddaughter,aged 13 shot her first deer in ‘youth season’,then proudly took the picture to class on the first day of school.My hunting partner brought his 14 year old daughter along this year...she insisted on full camo gear which she wore to school and on her return,including the video of her walking with a rifle over her shoulder and then cutting the deers throat and gutting it...small concessions were made to ensure her privacy in a toilet and shower.

Anything we can do to recruit new hunters ,especially young ladies to the sport gets the thumbs up from me...and if token ‘youth seasons’serve to get them out,so much the better.With all the political correctness going against us,we need more young people ,especially girls in the field to counter the current political tide.

[Wild one]

In my opinion the families that use the youth season properly consist of parents that would take the time to take their kids hunting with or without it

Is it good for kids getting into hunting yes is it a huge game changer not in my opinion

[boxhitch]

So we are talking about a 9 day opening here, in most cases, and for bucks only. Not sure why the youth in reg 8 still get 30 days for mule deer, must not be much impact.
If an animal gets downed, the adult cuts a tag and is on his/her way to filling a bag limit or may be done for the year.

Then remember that the hunter harvest of any game is deemed to be part of that portion of the population that is surplus to the needs of breeding and birthing of a new crop of critters
Hunters are not the reason for wildlife declines, real or perceived

Then consider how the early hunting and or harassment can actually be a benefit to game later in the season due to their increased waryness

All this before considering the benefits to having youth involved in the activity

Sorry that the activity spoils your quality of hunt but I am all for it.

[Ajsawden]

Growing up on the island in the 90's did not always have the best deer hunting, but my dad always got me out. I was obsessed from the time I could walk. I never got to see the big timber that filled the whole valley, or see 100 deer in a day, or hunt 2 feet of snow in early november, but I got to experience it all through Dad's stories. I know every spot on every road where he'd saw deer, shot deer, heard deer, smelled deer, etc. I loved it. Not sure why, but I was hooked. His hunting success went for a complete shit after he started taking me out. There were days he'd get me up at 5am and I remember saying, "no you go without me today Dad, I want you to get something". First deer we ever got together I was 10, next deer I got to deal with, my first, I was 14. I feel sorry for the kids that need to get something in their first outings or they give it up right away. There are hunters who like to hunt, hunters who love to hunt, and hunters who live to hunt, and I don't know if a youth season will change what category kids place themselves in, but if it helps, I have to support it. We certainly need the government to acknowledge hunters as as viable income source, otherwise, they stop caring. Regardless of the seasons, A big thankyou to the Moms and Dads, Big Brothers and Sisters, Grandmas and Grandpas, Aunts and Uncles, friends and family and all those who take the time, to take someone hunting.
Rambling over.

[Keta1969]

In my opinion the families that use the youth season properly consist of parents that would take the time to take their kids hunting with or without it

Is it good for kids getting into hunting yes is it a huge game changer not in my opinion

X2 One of my granddaughters will hopefully be out with her dad or myself next year. She will be going regardless and has been out enough already to know you don't always get deer but she's learning how you get a deer.

[Bugle M In]

I remember one year, I must have been entering grade 1, if not kindergarten?, and I absolutely refused to go to school, cause I wanted to go with my dad on a hunt to Alaska Highway.
I will give my dad this, he took me!, and that must of been hard for him to take me at that age, and know his hunt wasn't going to be what he thought, but, I did walk every step he wanted to take, and I outwalked everyone. (thanks dad)

So, that is coming from an adult now who appreciated and remembers that to this day!, so there is a youths perspective.

That being said, I agree that fathers are taking "liberates" with the "youth hunt".
I heard that the Pitt River Elk LEH permit was held by a youngster, but much of the time, the father did the hunting while kid sat in the cabin.

I also hear about this type of scenario all around the province, just like the zone x leh for elk in the EK etc.
So, you do have a point, and it is fair that you bring this up, and have an opinion that justifies conversation!

I agree with the Bow Folks as well, it should be open to them at the same time.
The reason you don't see the deer etc, is that by the time you and me get out there, the gunshots have rung, and the wildlife know its "Game on".

I do understand that many kids have the attention span of about a sunrise, nothing longer, thus the season to get them interested, so I agree with the season on that point, s we need recruitment, otherwise we as hunters will become such a "minority" when it comes to preserving the heritage of hunting, that we will become an unheard voice in the ring of politics etc, and might just end up being permanently banned, so consider that.

And it is hard to prove that fathers are doing the shooting (but I agree many are), unless you have "lots of video".
They can be charged by calling RAPP, but being convicted of the offense is very difficult.

I guess we can all just admit that it happens, and start to say "hey, we know its happening, and we are keeping our Eye's open to report".
That's about all we can do, is to admit that people are taking "liberties" with that season, and just stay aware.

[Big Lew]

I'm not against a youth season if that's what it takes to get today's youngsters interested.
As other have pointed out though, before there was a special youth season, dedicated parents
included their children when going hunting, school or not. I was one of them, as was my other
brothers. I took both my son and daughter along while they were still in diapers. They looked
forward to going all year long. They didn't need a special season. They wanted to go even if they
didn't get anything, or even a chance to do so.We certainly didn't need a 'special season' to
encourage us to go. Times change though, and today's society of self entitlement, instant gratification,
and coddling doesn't help. The one bright side is the new regs pertaining to reduced total bag limits.
Even with the parental cheaters, they still have to cut a tag and that is it for that species for the season.

[finngun]

when i pointed first grouse to my son to shoot..and he got it down...i was very happy i did so.. so was my boy..i always remember that ...so his first deer..memories what never dissapear..:redface:

[Islander30]

Why does there have to be a guaranteed conviction with video etc. or it's not worth reporting someone...so therefore the season should be taken away ??? I don't understand that attitude, I think a parent who gets a phone call from a CO saying hey we've had a report you like to fill your kids tags during youth season, if so you should be ashamed of yourself, might actually make a few guys stop doing that....a good shaming lecture from the right CO, would definataly make some guys think twice about pushing their kid out of the way to blast a friggin spike...I mean come on is this really such a huge plague of a problem that the youth season must be stopped !?!

.

[Camotoes]

Not from Region 8 so I don't know the specifics in your area but as a father who is teaching my kids how to hunt I sure do appreciate the youth seasons. I am learning that everything is harder and takes longer when hunting with a youth. It helps to keep them interested as there is more opportunities, and personally I hope they expand upon the youth seasons.

as for parents shooting on their children's behalf... I doubt it happens that often and if you personally know of specific instances then please report them.

[RJHunter]

So now its shameful to take kids hunting during a youth season? Wow. I don't have anything nice to say so.....

[Islander30]

So now its shameful to take kids hunting during a youth season? Wow. I don't have anything nice to say so.....


Not at all, you misread ! I said it's shameful to shoot a deer FOR your kid during youth season....while the kid sits in the truck in his pajamas...as witnessed by the OP !

[zippermouth]

The internet has created a new hunter, all follow the rules, only ever take ethical shots and never miss. What most people don’t see is what happens with a lot of hunters who do not read these forums. I would like to think most parents don’t shoot deer for their kids, but I’m pretty skeptical as I have heard quite a few “rumors” of this myself.

Do I want the youth season removed? : No.

I don’t believe the season takes opertunity away from myself or other hunters. If you can’t find a deer go kill some coyotes post season. Or a couple black bears the next spring. Everyone knows there’s plenty of black bears around, and even more coyotes. People should learn to be less jealous.

There’s a reason there’s fewer deer around, and it’s not from the amount of hunters. Pretty sure it’s above most people’s head as there’s always threads like this popping up. It’s not the good old days anymore but hunter opertunity is huge. And there are still animals around. You really have to work for them now.

[HighCountryBC]

We seriously have people complaining about a youth season? This is a perfect example of why hunters in BC lag so far behind other provinces and states..

Complaints of adults shooting deer during the youth season are from the usual suspects who couldn't fill a tag hunting in a National Park. It is extremely rare and most guys are just looking for an excuse as to why they didn't cut a tag. It's jealously, plain and simple. Cry me a river. If you actually see something illegal, report it.

I love seeing the young guys/gals tagging out early in the school year!

[Wentrot]

Frigging pathetic....

[skibum]

it makes it harder for me to get my deer. I contribute just like the parents of the kids do and I think I am entitled as much as they are to bagging my deer.

Comes down to one thing. Entitled. Period.

You are not entitled to "your deer"

[RJHunter]

Not at all, you misread ! I said it's shameful to shoot a deer FOR your kid during youth season....while the kid sits in the truck in his pajamas...as witnessed by the OP !

Sorry I wasn't responding to your post. I am responding to the OP and the rest that are suggesting that most or a high percentage of parents that are out with kids in youth season are being unethical and are breaking the law. Sure there are a few, but to suggest that most of us are breaking the law kind of pisses me off. I believe the OP is suggesting that the youth season should be closed because Dad is usually the one shooting the deer for the kid. I fall under the group that takes kids out during youth season and the thought that someone would suggest that we are poaching because a couple of kids are in pajamas.... Good to know that some will assume I am using my kids to get a deer early. Sorry, hard to blame poor success on kids.

[Islander30]

Sorry I wasn't responding to your post. I am responding to the OP and the rest that are suggesting that most or a high percentage of parents that are out with kids in youth season are being unethical and are breaking the law. Sure there are a few, but to suggest that most of us are breaking the law kind of pisses me off. I believe the OP is suggesting that the youth season should be closed because Dad is usually the one shooting the deer for the kid. I fall under the group that takes kids out during youth season and the thought that someone would suggest that we are poaching because a couple of kids are in pajamas.... Good to know that some will assume I am using my kids to get a deer early. Sorry, hard to blame poor success on kids.

My apologies to you....and I agree with you 100% ! Last year I took my son hunting on the mainland for a first time off the Island trip for both of us. He shot his first mule deer before I did...one of the happiest days of my life ! Those who don't understand that are missing what it means to be parent all together!

[Bugle M In]

No reason to get pissed off, imo.
The OP is just bringing up a "conversation".
Yes, based on his/hers experiences of late, which obviously is their opinion.
But I do think there is room for conversation on this.

All that being said, no matter when the opening is, a soon as a couple of gunshots go off, game becomes wary.
Should kids have the 1st crack, I think so, but then I was never much for opening day hunts anyways,
(I like to give the game a chance!:mrgreen:).

[blackford]

No reason to get pissed off, imo.
The OP is just bringing up a "conversation".
Yes, based on his/hers experiences of late, which obviously is their opinion.
But I do think there is room for conversation on this.

All that being said, no matter when the opening is, a soon as a couple of gunshots go off, game becomes wary.
Should kids have the 1st crack, I think so, but then I was never much for opening day hunts anyways,
(I like to give the game a chance!:mrgreen:).

Thanks . I wanted to make a few points clear.

The youth season used to be a week or so long. The kids are then in school. We now make it 30 days and then its Open season for everyone. I agreed with the week long opening but a month.. This eliminates alot of deer.

@SKIBUM I should be entitled to a deer as much as I am or you or your son for that matter. But... with this opening i am not. Why is it that the youth season entitles the Dad/ youth more than the average person...

Its impossible to patrol the bush. you hear a gunshot and you see it later on. A perfectly placed shot while the kid is in the truck and the dad is skinning the deer...


I WANT TO MAKE IT CLEAR... THIS IS NOT ALL THE KIDS AND PARENTS BUT RATHER COMMON FROM WHAT I SEE IN THE BUSH. Do i have grounds to call a CO about it... Or for that matter the balls to call and report someone who has a rifle in the same bush i am sleeping in... NO.


Why not a draw system. Teach the kids how it works... Also leave the chickens alone...or make it a reduced limit.

Also the messages from people claiming i must of not got a deer... I did.. I managed. It was the only deer i saw and it came home..

[kootenaihunter]

So far, I've just seen assumptions and opinions, par for the course.

Does anybody, including the OP, have any hard facts or data to suggest that the 30 day youth season is reducing ungulate populations? I'm talk hard numbers.

And, remember, kids are kids. I doubt there are many that are 'hunting hard' all 30 days. Realistically, a week would only be one, maybe two days of hunting on the weekend for the average youth. Now, 30 days give 4 weekends = 8 days, of which all are probably not utilized either.

As for the unsubstantiated allegation that many adult hunters are using their kids tags to shoot deer aka poaching, then I would be more worried that the province is full of poachers, and if their abusing the youth season, what else are they illegally doing that is impacting the deer population?!?!?

If you witness poaching and do not call RAPP, then shame on you.

Again, this is more 'hunter on hunter' bs, divide we continue to fall....

[limit time]

Thanks . I wanted to make a few points clear.

The youth season used to be a week or so long. The kids are then in school. We now make it 30 days and then its Open season for everyone. I agreed with the week long opening but a month.. This eliminates alot of deer.

@SKIBUM I should be entitled to a deer as much as I am or you or your son for that matter. But... with this opening i am not. Why is it that the youth season entitles the Dad/ youth more than the average person...

Its impossible to patrol the bush. you hear a gunshot and you see it later on. A perfectly placed shot while the kid is in the truck and the dad is skinning the deer...


I WANT TO MAKE IT CLEAR... THIS IS NOT ALL THE KIDS AND PARENTS BUT RATHER COMMON FROM WHAT I SEE IN THE BUSH. Do i have grounds to call a CO about it... Or for that matter the balls to call and report someone who has a rifle in the same bush i am sleeping in... NO.


Why not a draw system. Teach the kids how it works... Also leave the chickens alone...or make it a reduced limit.

Also the messages from people claiming i must of not got a deer... I did.. I managed. It was the only deer i saw and it came home..

Damn you see a lot of parents pulling the trigger.... you must have a lot of bad friends or you are at the right place at the right time all the time ? So punish the kids.....since they changed the regs for mule, my kid shot his deer on my tag. Now I’m done for mule. No mule for me ! There you go one mule saved for ya....

also, the LEH system is a BS system, and not the way it should be. If you want to save deer and chickens do the kids a solid and don’t hunt ;)

happy hunting !

[blackford]

It would be interesting to see how many of the votes or supporters of the youth season have a vested interested in the youth hunt because they have a youth in the family......


Also, hey.... I simply have the balls to bring up these matters and questions . As a hunting community we should welcome this sort of discussion rather than bully people with answers.... How are we going to teach people to hunt respectfully when they cant respect one another in a discussion...

[Taurusguy]

I will go out on a limb here.. this season my 14yo son won a youth doe draw for region 8 .. we practiced shooting my 30.06 many times during the summer so he would be ready to shoot his doe when the time came. Then we ended up on a day trip and he gets an oppertunity at a little 2pt and shoots it... and boy was I proud.. but.. when we got up to it, his hit broke its its back and it was still alive. Trying to get away with its 2 front legs only. I told him hes gotta finish it off and not let it suffer but he couldnt do it... being up close while it was like that made him a bit emotional... so I had to shoot it in the head for him. He felt so bad for it... and so did I. But I couldn't let it continue to suffer... my son was very apologetic and I tried to let him know it's ok and that's it's not always pretty .. he was silent for a bit.. and as I said a bit emotional. Did I do the wrong thing by killshotting it for him? ... should I have made him finish the job?

Edit: so now that he got a 2pt he wont be shooting his doe... which is good imho

[blackford]

You are missing the point. So your Tag has now turned into a deluxe open season tag because you have a kid....hardly seems fair for many reasons.

I dont want to save the deer or chickens . I just want it fair for everyone. And dont worry.... I hunt.. Its something I was brought up open and i wasnt pussified as a child to come shoot the animal with special conditions.. If i didnt get anything my dad simply said... Its hunting kid... its not shopping...

[blackford]

I will go out on a limb here.. this season my 14yo son won a youth doe draw for region 8 .. we practiced shooting my 30.06 many times during the summer so he would be ready to shoot his doe when the time came. Then we ended up on a day trip and he gets an oppertunity at a little 2pt and shoots it... and boy was I proud.. but.. when we got up to it, his hit broke its its back and it was still alive. Trying to get away with its 2 front legs only. I told him hes gotta finish it off and not let it suffer but he couldnt do it... being up close while it was like that made him a bit emotional... so I had to shoot it in the head for him. He felt so bad for it... and so did I. But I couldn't let it continue to suffer... my son was very apologetic and I tried to let him know it's ok and that's it's not always pretty .. he was silent for a bit.. and as I said a bit emotional. Did I do the wrong thing by killshotting it for him? ... should I have made him finish the job?

Edit: so now that he got a 2pt he wont be shooting his doe... which is good imho


I dont see an issue with you doing this in my eyes... Completely different than him saying " Dad its to far... can you shoot it cause i will miss"

[Bugle M In]

Yes, the 1 MD limit will definitely help in many regards, so that is one thing to keep in mind going forward.
A lot less traffic/opportunity now being possible.
Wondering if this coming Nov R3 hunt around the long weekend will show "less traffic" for once (ever since R5 closed at this time, it became a gong show).
Maybe a shorter 2 week season would be okay by me, but that being said, I don't really go out for MD looking for a meat buck anyways.

Also, OP, I would have to say most people don't take the time to get out of their vehicles enough.
I know most youngsters (wearing their flip flops in the truck) aren't going for any kind of hike.

If looking for a meat buck, getting inside the timber where they spend most of their time, will get you the success you are looking for on a yearly basis.

I know right if I went out for this weekend, I would have my spike buck down, 95% guaranteed.

Hope the rest of year season is good and you have success.

[kootenaihunter]

You are missing the point. So your Tag has now turned into a deluxe open season tag because you have a kid....hardly seems fair for many reasons.


Is you gripe that too many youth are shooting deer, not leaving enough for hunters once GOS is open?

Or, there are too many poachers taking advantage of the youth season?

[blackford]

My issue is that the youth season is to long and poachers

if we have a deer shortage allowing for 1 MD only then why do we lengthen this season

its compounded

[Taurusguy]

There is only a 1 MD limit in regions 3-8 .... regions 1 and 2 allow for a 2nd deer... but good luck.. hunting is soo tough in region 2 and I'm not going to the island for a 2nd deer.

But the cut back on deer in 3-8 was a great idea... now if I could just find some good white tail spots .. lol

[Bugle M In]

See, this is where I have issues with this site.
The OP just brought up a "discussion".
Yes, it is based on "his opinion" and experiences.
Cant we just leave it to a discussion, rather then put someone down for putting up a thread/post?
Why start heading into the "bashing" part over it?
If your fine with the Youth Season, just say so, and/or give reason why.
If you have concern's, then say so.
I just don't understand why so many times things have to get "personal"?

[BornNRazed]

I am all for the youth season, the opening of the restriction allows for for more opportunity to see deer and more opportunity TO PASS on unethical shots for the sole reason of filling a tag. I think as fathers and mentors of the next generation of hunters we need to be focusing hard on teaching the youth ethics, responsibility, hard work, patience for the right shot, and respect for the sport we all enjoy. I don’t see this as an opportunity to “open” my tag to a super tag but rather an opportunity to watch many deer walk that were not an ethical or confident shot, knowing it’s not the only opportunity your youth will get. And to the OP why not spend your time finding local youth and teaching them NOT to be unethical and to be the change you wantto see rather than trying to close this opportunity down.

Just St my two cents

[Islander30]

See, this is where I have issues with this site.
The OP just brought up a "discussion".
Yes, it is based on "his opinion" and experiences.
Cant we just leave it to a discussion, rather then put someone down for putting up a thread/post?
Why start heading into the "bashing" part over it?
If your fine with the Youth Season, just say so, and/or give reason why.
If you have concern's, then say so.
I just don't understand why so many times things have to get "personal"?

I guess because lately, unfounded emotion based opinions have resulted in some serious outcomes.

[whitlers]

I am all for youth season but I have seen some less than stellar fathers/uncles/grandfathers with their youth while hunting in the bush early season archery.

As long as these youth are being mentored in the right and ethical direction then I think its great!

I do agree that the season could be shorter but I also see the other side of the equation which allows them more time to take an ethical shot.

Good thread. Keep it professional people.

[139grainsofhell]

I'm for it but would like to see it not overlap with archery season and maybe limit the age to 16 instead of 18.

[LBM]

See, this is where I have issues with this site.
The OP just brought up a "discussion".
Yes, it is based on "his opinion" and experiences.
Cant we just leave it to a discussion, rather then put someone down for putting up a thread/post?
Why start heading into the "bashing" part over it?
If your fine with the Youth Season, just say so, and/or give reason why.
If you have concern's, then say so.
I just don't understand why so many times things have to get "personal"?

Really this coming from you

[Bugle M In]

Really this coming from you

What??????????????????
Incredible, and so out of context as usual....made me laugh LBM.

[Cyrus]

I'm sorry, but I have to laugh at you...
I suppose there are massive amounts of kids sitting around getting drunk all day right???

Why don't you think before you speak.

You may be right about entitlement issues but all I see here is jealousy and resentment.


yawwwnnnnn...thanks for that!

[antlerking]

The youth season is not 30 days it’s 10 days! What the youth get is to be able to take any buck not restricted to 4 point only for the additional 20 days! I am in full support of that ! If I had it my way (not entitled) they would be the only ones allowed to harvest a yearling buck all season long! How do you think my 12 or 13 year olds feel when they pass up the same bucks all season long to have some entitled hunter roll up and shoot them off moms tit? The youth season is not the problem, it’s people that think to have a successful hunt you have to kill something!

[rageous]

I support youth seasons for the most part.


The youth season is not 30 days it’s 10 days! What the youth get is to be able to take any buck not restricted to 4 point only for the additional 20 days! I am in full support of that ! If I had it my way (not entitled) they would be the only ones allowed to harvest a yearling buck all season long! How do you think my 12 or 13 year olds feel when they pass up the same bucks all season long to have some entitled hunter roll up and shoot them off moms tit? The youth season is not the problem, it’s people that think to have a successful hunt you have to kill something!

Ya should have a look at region 8 mule deer season.

[jtred]

Did your dad shoot your deer for you? My daughter certainly shot her first deer, a whitetail buck in later November. She also shot her first mule deer this season, her second. She got it on the first day of youth season. Both one shot kills, mainly because she has been shooting since she was 6 years old. For you to imply that most of the deer shot during youth season are shot by the fathers implies that this is how it went down for you. The purpose of the very short(September1-9 not the 30th) is to get the youth out there when there isn't so many hunters in the field and not as much pressure. I think the youth season is a spectacular idea. Not many of us fathers are poachers you know.

[RJHunter]

Pretty tough to debate some subjects online with a couple of posts. Probably not even worth trying. I'm sure it's an interesting conversation to have over a couple of beers but words are only part of a conversation and its too easy to get caught up with a couple of words. Should have stayed on point with a short thought rather than getting pissed off. Sorry about that.

[Billybird]

I've benefited from both my kids having a youth season and even now they are both grown feel it should stay to get more young kids out there. As to the dad doing the trigger work. Those guys should be beat with a pound of their own shit! If the meat is that important go buy it, it's cheaper. I and a few dad's I know would NEVER make my kid lie about their hunting experiences. We have passed on a few animals that Dad could have shot, but the kid would have to lie about it for the rest of their lives. It's 9 days at the beginning of the season that often overlaps with the returning to school, in most cases high school which means more as they get older. If you can't handle the competition, take up needlepoint!!

I second that sentiment! The youth season is short, we have more pressing issues. Youth open is not the cause if lower deer populations, habit loss and an increase in predation are more important.

[limit time]

See, this is where I have issues with this site.
The OP just brought up a "discussion".
Yes, it is based on "his opinion" and experiences.
Cant we just leave it to a discussion, rather then put someone down for putting up a thread/post?
Why start heading into the "bashing" part over it?
If your fine with the Youth Season, just say so, and/or give reason why.
If you have concern's, then say so.
I just don't understand why so many times things have to get "personal"?

Because all he gives is his opinion... and hunting to me and most is a way of life !!! Not a fricken privlage . So ya, people will get personal.

[limit time]

Did your dad shoot your deer for you? My daughter certainly shot her first deer, a whitetail buck in later November. She also shot her first mule deer this season, her second. She got it on the first day of youth season. Both one shot kills, mainly because she has been shooting since she was 6 years old. For you to imply that most of the deer shot during youth season are shot by the fathers implies that this is how it went down for you. The purpose of the very short(September1-9 not the 30th) is to get the youth out there when there isn't so many hunters in the field and not as much pressure. I think the youth season is a spectacular idea. Not many of us fathers are poachers you know.

I’m with you 100%
My son shot his deer on my tag this year and last year, two years of no deer for me. I’m OK with this and I would never take that experience away from my kid, never ! Its his time to hunt before he goes back to school. There’s a lot more to hunting then counting points. It’s a way of life.

[Elkhound]

Interesting discussion.

I obviously have support for the youth hunt and as most know we were very successful this year.
I agree. Youth season is only 10days. But they do get a chance for any buck for all of Sept and Oct.

To say that a child cant get out of a truck and shoot a deer is ridiculous. My 2 youngest kids did it this season.
My daughter was not comfortable on the first buck. So my son got behind the rifle and pulled the trigger at 78yrds. We were lucky the buck stuck around.
Same morning my daughter got hers at less than 50yrds. She was much more comfortable.
The other 2 youths got their first bucks but not jumping out of the truck. And 2 teenagers dragged one of them a whole km back to the truck.

We saw a ton of deer and a ton of bucks this year. Region 8. One weekend we saw 14 bucks. My daughter passed on 3 bucks as they were too far for her. I cringed knowing I could whack them. But we watched them walk. One of the other youths Alora...... well she passed on 3 bucks before hers as well. Situation and ranges not comfortable for her. Steeleco and I were both there and again deer would have been down.

My 16 year old cancelled many tags of mine her first couple years till she got her own licence. I was more than happy to let her.

I'm sure there are dads that poach their kids deer. But I've never seen it. What a disgrace and what a horrible lie they must make their kids do for the rest of their lives.

Like another poster. My daughter had a doe draw this year. She too passed up many small bucks. She put a limit on herself. 3 pt or better. If she didnt get one. Then she had a doe draw to fall back on. Her perseverance and self control paid off. 4x4 for her.

So. I love the youth season. It let's them be able to get out and have a chance at less spooky deer. My youngest 2 were only successful because those deer stuck around for so long.

I have much more to say but no point really. I dont think many will change their minds as we all have our opinions made up already.

But I will say this. If you see a dad poaching deer in a youth season and dont report it. You are a huge part of the problem.

[Darksith]

to take something like "dad shooting the deer under the youth license" as a point of contention...well its like saying poaching is bad, bc that is exactly what is happening if/when that happens.

Are you a parent? I am a father of 2 boys, I love to bring my kids out hunting, that being said I would never teach them that bending or breaking the rules is OK. They need to learn that shit on their own. ROFL OMG I am kidding! Seriously though, I can't wait to watch my kids punch a tag, whether it be mine or theirs, and I certainly don't need them to lie about who shot what just so a deer can be harvested. I eat mule deer tag soup most years simply because its hard to shoot a book buck after you have punched a 2 point!

There comes a point in a hunters life (for me anyway) where it is more enjoyable to watch my friends knock down a deer that I helped them get than to be the shooter myself. Maybe its a parent thing, maybe its a stage that I am fortunate enough to be at because I have shot a bunch of deer...no wall hangers yet, thats what Im holding out for now, so I'd rather take my boys out, or take my friends out and let them punch tags all day long until we see something that I instantly call dibs on!

So to the point at hand...I really doubt there are a ton of parents out there taking shots and asking their kids to lie in case they bump into a CO. First off my kids are a terrible lier and if they were asked repeatedly they would cave and I would be in big trouble. And if they are old enough to lie to law enforcement repeatedly they are definitely old enough to be the trigger man. Also, no one posts stories of shots missed

[silvertipp]

Apparently there is a lot of you guys that have never enjoyed the youth hunt
My son practiced his shooting regularly and has never had a problem shooting his own game
sometimes there is a little coaching as to when to shoot or to calm down but has always done it himself
There is no way in hell he or I would want it any other way
I have hunted with several fathers and have never heard of anyone shooting there kids game
to think there is a shortage of game due to the youth season is ridiculous

[Brez]

Let me be the first to congratulate you on being willing to stick your neck out and voice your opinion. Especially when you know that you will be crucified for this. I wish that we as Canadians would be willing to be so bold as to voice our opinions even though we know that there may be backlash. I am going to stop writing now and get a bag of popcorn....
Thank you for having the balls to say and print what many of us have been saying under our breaths. I and many friends agree with you. I learned to hunt during the same season as my father. My sons learned to hunt during the same seasons. They got deer. They got grouse. They got to hunt as much as they wanted for the most part.
You are absolutely right that we keep putting more and more pressure on a dwindling resource and wonder why it is in trouble.
I am retired and have (I'm told) lots of time on my hands. I know that I do not need a special season when I am a senior. We already have some of if not the most liberal hunting seasons in North America. If I cannot get a deer within the regular GOS hunting seasons, with the opportunity to hunt virtually every day, it's not the hunting season that needs work.
Good on you to speak up!
like, like, like.

[Brez]

Hmmm lol..we need to recruit new hunters..get them away from their gameboys...computers.
Im all for anything to help these young hunters in the field and help them with success...
I didnt have this system..im all for helping them get started..
Give em a break..
Cheers
Steven
I totally agree that we need to recruit new hunters and the younger the better but in my opinion, youth seasons don't do that.....dads and moms do. the government doesn't need to give the kids more time, the parents have to take more of THEIR time. Again, just my opinion.

[Brez]

Here's one idea by a forward thinking management to recruit young hunters, and note the date...

Activities for young hunters at Springer Special Pheasant Hunt Youth Day
Join us for shooting practice, dog demos and free lunch during Oct. 20 youth day during Springer Special Pheasant Hunt
Young hunters are encouraged to join the Wyoming Game and Fish Department during the Saturday, Oct. 20 Youth Day of the Springer Special Pheasant Hunt for special activities to learn more about pheasant hunting.> (http://links.govdelivery.com/track?type=click&enid=ZWFzPTEmbXNpZD0mYXVpZD0mbWFpbGluZ2lkPTIwMTgxM DE4Ljk2Mzg4NTAxJm1lc3NhZ2VpZD1NREItUFJELUJVTC0yMDE 4MTAxOC45NjM4ODUwMSZkYXRhYmFzZWlkPTEwMDEmc2VyaWFsP TE3MDQ3MDU4JmVtYWlsaWQ9YnJlczRAdGVsdXMubmV0JnVzZXJ pZD1icmVzNEB0ZWx1cy5uZXQmdGFyZ2V0aWQ9JmZsPSZleHRyY T1NdWx0aXZhcmlhdGVJZD0mJiY=&&&101&&&https://wgfd.wyo.gov/Regional-Offices/Laramie-Region/Laramie-Region-News/%E2%80%8BActivities-for-young-hunters-at-Springer-Special)How to field clean a game birdAfter bird hunting hunting, it's time to clean your quarry; but how? Wyoming Game and Fish biologist Clark Johnson shows an easy step-by-step process for field cleaning.

[Big Lew]

I totally agree that we need to recruit new hunters and the younger the better but in my opinion, youth seasons don't do that.....dads and moms do. the government doesn't need to give the kids more time, the parents have to take more of THEIR time. Again, just my opinion.

That's my opinion as well...my dad, mom. and grandparents all made time for teaching me to hunt and fish
as soon as I was able. I was more than eager to go even if I didn't get anything. I sure didn't need a special
opening to entice me. My parents took me out of school (after acquiring homework) when they were able to go.

[HighCountryBC]

10 day youth seasons "putting too much pressure on the resource" to the point it's a "conservation concern". Now that is some funny stuff! Sounds like a few members took full advantage of the legalization today.

Kids are busy with school, busy with sports, busy....being kids. Are people that upset that they get a few days to themselves to start the season? 1 step forward, 2 steps back with BC hunters.

[GoodPartner]

I haven't posted on here forever but this one got me :)

My son got his own license when he was 10 but we didn't feel ready to hunt for deer for the last couple of years. It was hard not to push him as I hope he will love hunting like I do, so we were patient. we practiced shooting, he shot some grouse etc. This year (he is 12) he got an LEH mule doe tag for region 8. I thought he was lucky at first but we realized after the fact that the LEH doe tags for region 8 changed to youth only so his odds of drawing were excellent.

The next thing I realized was that he could hunt for any buck during the entire month of September. Last year we went out for a few days during the early September youth season but with school, work and all the other family activities it is tough to get many days out. More like a morning or an afternoon here or there. I knew that he would have a good chance for his first deer with the doe tag but we actually got to hunt more in September together with the focus being on him. That was great.

My son shot his first deer in late September. It was a 2pt mule deer buck in region 8. This means he will not fill his LEH doe tag. Before that I honestly wondered how it was going to happen. road hunt? pile out of the truck, try to get him set up in time on the road and keep calm? No way would I want him to rush or feel uncomfortable. What if he took a bad shot, crippled a deer and got turned off hunting for life? We have talked through all that stuff but it is another thing to experience it. I stressed to him that we would go through all the steps and only when he was ready would he ever pull the trigger. It all seemed pretty challenging. I have been hunting for 7 years now but I still feel like a rookie myself. I don't see that many bucks through the season. how was he going to get one?

we saw a nice 3pt early in the season while we were grouse hunting. We followed it off a road into the woods. It stopped twice and I could have shot it but with him following me and trying to get him set up we didn't have a chance at all. It was super exciting though and we were both happy for the encounter.

When he shot his deer last month it wasn't right off the road like I imagined. We followed it up a steep cut into the timber. on the way up he slipped, stepped on branches, he even stopped to pee. I just shook my head and said go ahead if you have to. of course the wind was blowing straight uphill toward the deer :). He kept clanging the shooting sticks on branches and logs. It was not the quietest stalk. When we got up to the treeline I saw the buck and it was looking at us. It was only about 50 yards away. It would watch us, then go back to feeding. We couldn't get a good place to shoot from as the slope and brush were in his way, we needed to get closer. The whole thing must have taken 45 minutes. We kept moving closer, trying to set up the shooting the sticks. The buck would watch us, then go back to feeding, always seeming to be behind a tree at just the right angle. Finally we were set up in a good position were if the buck stepped left or right from behind a tree my son would have a clear safe shot. I told him he could shoot when the buck stepped out if he felt comfortable. The buck took a step out to the right and stopped. My son said now?, I said yes and he pulled the trigger. we watched the buck jump and turn and I could see the shot was fatal. The buck ran less than 50 yards down the hill and expired. It was a powerful experience for both of us. One we will never forget.

My son undoubtedly learned a lot for himself that day, but I learned something for my own hunting too. Why was that deer still standing there? It heard us, it smelled us, it saw us...but it didn't move off. I couldn't help but draw parallels between that young buck and my son. Both made mistakes that day, but that young buck was on its own while my son had me to help him along. Perhaps if that buck had a couple more years in a bachelor group with some older bucks it would have acted differently. It will never get the chance now. It was the perfect deer for my son to take but I also made up my mind that day that I'm not going to shoot young deer anymore.

I'm not judging anyone else for how they hunt, especially for those with limited experience. Believe me I know what that is like. I'm still thrilled to even see a buck. There is absolutely nothing wrong with taking a younger deer, but something is different for me now.

Since my son's deer and the opening of the any mule buck season I have passed on six bucks. This is totally a first for me. They have all been spikes or two points, they have all been standing out in the open close to their moms. These are mostly the deer that go down early in the season. It has been tough to pass on a few of those deer. I know there is a decent chance I might go through this season without filling my tag. But that is what feels right for me now.

Participating in the youth hunt with my son has shifted my own perspective on hunting in a meaningful way. Rather then focusing on right or wrong, good or bad, I would say instead that my understanding has deepened. That is always the type of experience I am looking for when I hunt.

So I'm all for the increased youth hunt. I can see the other side of the argument but I think there is a lot of value for both the youth and their mentors in the youth season. I can't speak for everyone but I am not one of the dads out shooting deer for my kids.

[BornNRazed]

I think a lot of people are forgetting it was hardly five years ago the GOS was a lot more liberal than it is now. mule deer were any buck from sept 10 to nov 20 with a doe season, moose had a calf season (at least in my region anyways) that ran for twenty days... etc. So to say I hunted the regular season when I was a kid is not a good point because the GOS had far more opportunity than these kids “special seasons”.

[Elkhound]

Great story goodpartner. Please tell me you will post up a pic of your son and his deer

[Bugle M In]

That's epic right there^^^^

The 1st season for my hunting partner, that I got into, we were walking, then suddenly I saw a deer to our left, no more then
35 yards away, just standing and staring at us.
IT was a small 3 pt WT, but it was legal.
I looked at my partner, and said well, there you go.
Truth was, and my partner knew this, that we were there for elk, but carried tags for that "just in case bruiser" passed by.
His 1st season, so never had taken anything, and now was his opportunity.
He looked at me and shook his head, knodding yes, as to say, ya, I can take it!?
I looked at him, then back at the deer, who had now put its head down to start feeding again, and then looked back at my partner.
I said, yes, you can, he's legal, BUT, do you find this situation "sporting enough"??
He looked at the deer, then back to me, and said, yes, I hear you, lets leave him alone.

He has yet to take his first animal yet.
He has had a couple of chances since then, but still hasn't connected, and its been about 8 years now.
But, he still says to me, even now, that he has no regrets about not taking that buck that day.

[blackford]

I have been asked if I have kids and I gave 2. They actually come with me and aren’t ready to hunt but they are by my side. When it’s time they can have a gun and be ready to pull the trigger. In the meantime , I am not going to pretend they are hunting in youth season.

Like I said. Not all Dads or Moms during youth season poach. But let’s be honest. I have been getting texts and phone calls from guys I know in this board and one nice PM that understand where I am coming from but don’t want to be a whistle blower.

If the deer population is declining for whatever reason let’s do what we can to look after them. When I was out during 4 point season I had several 2 points follow me ... one walked towards me. Why does this youth season need to be so long on region 8 .


there also seems to be a direct corilation between those who support it and thousands who have youth hunters . I thank my dad for showing me you don’t always win. Sometimes you need to learn from mistakes and also when your hunting with the. If boys you need to play with the big boys. It’s completley unrelated but this is the same reason why at school on sports days they have participan robins only. We are afraid of our kids losing . Quit the pussification of these kids. Get them out there like the rest of us.

Whats next- sockeye fishing when they want and remove bait bans ....


dads who are saying that it’s over because they had to cut there tag.... cmon. That tag would be more special if you got the deer while it wasn’t trying to come see your truck if you had a spare baloney sandwich...


i am nkt not trying to ruffle feathers .... I just think that we need to look at this. 30 days in region 8 is ridiculous

[Rackmastr]

We seriously have people complaining about a youth season? This is a perfect example of why hunters in BC lag so far behind other provinces and states..

Complaints of adults shooting deer during the youth season are from the usual suspects who couldn't fill a tag hunting in a National Park. It is extremely rare and most guys are just looking for an excuse as to why they didn't cut a tag. It's jealously, plain and simple. Cry me a river. If you actually see something illegal, report it.

I love seeing the young guys/gals tagging out early in the school year!

x2.... A lot doesn't surprise me these days but yet I keep opening threads like this up and shaking my head....

[blackford]

x2.... A lot doesn't surprise me these days but yet I keep opening threads like this up and shaking my head....

Not true. I got my deer and it wasn’t in a national park.

[Rackmastr]

Not true. I got my deer and it wasn’t in a national park.

I was referencing the first sentence he posted. And yep, its true....threads like this are a fine example of why we're at where we're at.

[Elkhound]

Like I said. Not all Dads or Moms during youth season poach. But let’s be honest. I have been getting texts and phone calls from guys I know in this board and one nice PM that understand where I am coming from but don’t want to be a whistle blower.

If the deer population is declining for whatever reason let’s do what we can to look after them. When I was out during 4 point season I had several 2 points follow me ... one walked towards me. Why does this youth season need to be so long on region 8 .

If you are getting that many phone calls and messages about poaching and nobody is doing anything about it. Then I will say it one more time.
The people not reporting are a huge part of the problem.

Oh no. Some kids took out some stupid young deer. I have seen 4 and 5 points taken that were just as dumb. Maybe any deer that you see that doesnt run like hell should be deemed special needs and not allowed to shoot it.

One more thing. I saw waaaaaaaay more guys out hunting and tagging stupid deer in the archery season using crossbows that some are capable of 100 yrds shots. But again. A 30 day season for kids that might get out once or twice in that 30 days is the culprit. Btw. I love the archery season. And I have a bow. But never taken a deer in that archery season.

[limit time]

I have been asked if I have kids and I gave 2. They actually come with me and aren’t ready to hunt but they are by my side. When it’s time they can have a gun and be ready to pull the trigger. In the meantime , I am not going to pretend they are hunting in youth season.

Like I said. Not all Dads or Moms during youth season poach. But let’s be honest. I have been getting texts and phone calls from guys I know in this board and one nice PM that understand where I am coming from but don’t want to be a whistle blower.

If the deer population is declining for whatever reason let’s do what we can to look after them. When I was out during 4 point season I had several 2 points follow me ... one walked towards me. Why does this youth season need to be so long on region 8 .


there also seems to be a direct corilation between those who support it and thousands who have youth hunters . I thank my dad for showing me you don’t always win. Sometimes you need to learn from mistakes and also when your hunting with the. If boys you need to play with the big boys. It’s completley unrelated but this is the same reason why at school on sports days they have participan robins only. We are afraid of our kids losing . Quit the pussification of these kids. Get them out there like the rest of us.

Whats next- sockeye fishing when they want and remove bait bans ....


dads who are saying that it’s over because they had to cut there tag.... cmon. That tag would be more special if you got the deer while it wasn’t trying to come see your truck if you had a spare baloney sandwich...


i am nkt not trying to ruffle feathers .... I just think that we need to look at this. 30 days in region 8 is ridiculous

Again you point out emotion. How about you tell us what your plan would be to save the deer and how it would work .
Also how do you feel about the senior hunt ? Should we say F-U to them also ?

[okas]

If I remember right I had a hunting lic. at 12 but big game only had my dads tag.

[Wild one]

The youth season has had controversy since it started. Outside of a few who feel it’s causing a conservation concern with youth shooting too many bucks the issue is adults abusing the season

The abuse issues keep coming up commonly with the any buck MD youth season but Have heard of little to no abuse with the late WT youth season, Md doe youth season, the past moose calve season(closed do to moose populations) and elk season ( hear a little hear).

That 9 days were adults are restricted to archery or bears seems to be when there is the biggest talk of abuse

That brings the ? Would it help limit abuse if youth seasons were laid out to run during periods were adults taking them out still had reasonable rifle opportunity?

With examples of other youth seasons running with little to no controversy of abuse it seems that it maybe as simple as changes to how youth season is applied


But this is BC so odds are common sense addressing controversy will not be considered lol

Bring on reasons on how even considering compromise and steps to possibly limiting abuse is evil, I eat babies, I am an elitist, or even a GO lmao

[eatram]

.
Thank you for having the balls to say and print what many of us have been saying under our breaths. I and many friends agree with you. I learned to hunt during the same season as my father. My sons learned to hunt during the same seasons. They got deer. They got grouse. They got to hunt as much as they wanted for the most part.
You are absolutely right that we keep putting more and more pressure on a dwindling resource and wonder why it is in trouble.
I am retired and have (I'm told) lots of time on my hands. I know that I do not need a special season when I am a senior. We already have some of if not the most liberal hunting seasons in North America. If I cannot get a deer within the regular GOS hunting seasons, with the opportunity to hunt virtually every day, it's not the hunting season that needs work.
Good on you to speak up!
like, like, like.

Ummmm, just for the record, I agree with having a youth season. I was making a secondary point about respecting the fact that OP was willing to stick his neck out, FYI.

[Gateholio]

All this talk about abuse by Dads shooting the deer...

How many tickets have been issued? How many convictions? How many complaints made to COs?

If the abuse is as widespread as many on here are claiming, then there surely is done documentation, right?

[blackford]

simply put. if a tree falls in the forrest and nobody is there... does it still make a sound. I have hunted some pretty remote areas and some pretty heavy hunted areas in the last 15 years.... I have been stopped once by a CO. If you are relying on tickets in the bush...well to say it politely ... this isn't going to happen.

about 6 years ago I had a beer with a CO at a pub during hunting season and asked him about the conservation and youth season. He did say that they did a trial and put a decoy that moves in the bush during youth season and 4 point season. I wrote down the results as he was talking on my iPhone because I wanted to get them right....

In youth season, 34 people shot.

30 of those shots were done by dad or mom
15 shots were taken from inside a vehicle


In 4 point season they did the same thing.

over the weekend several cars stopped. ( he didn't have the number)

4 people shot from the truck
2 people shot from when it was not a 4 point but was only open


I asked him about youth season and he laughed.. He said he only gets paid to enforce the rules.



In regards to being part of the problem... Calling a CO and saying that the dad is in full camp shooting a high powered rifle and cleaning a deer while the sun is in ninja turtle pj's playing his Nintendo in his truck isn't reasonable grounds to fine someone. its so hard to police. Again... I am not saying its all the kids. I am just saying its a lot. a lot I hear about... its also a long time to shoot deer which aren't afraid of anything...


for those of you being brash about this.... please don't. its a topic that I wanted to bring up. based on the poll... a lot of people see different that what I see.. I respect that 100%

[zippermouth]

All this talk about abuse by Dads shooting the deer...

How many tickets have been issued? How many convictions? How many complaints made to COs?

If the abuse is as widespread as many on here are claiming, then there surely is done documentation, right?
considering i hunt on average 50+ days per fall for the last 10 years of my life and have been stopped a total of 3 times by a co might be a reason there hasn't been many convictions. i really like seeing conservation officers in the bush and always have good chats when i do see them, but it just doesnt happen enough. what the conviction number is is fairly irrelevant if people are doing it and getting away with it. honestly maybe the number of people cheating the system is so minimal it has no effect {this is what i believe}. But i have no proof of these things happening. maybe its jealous hunters like the OP making up stories to try and socially manage our hunting seasons, probably the case!

[Wild one]

All this talk about abuse by Dads shooting the deer...

How many tickets have been issued? How many convictions? How many complaints made to COs?

If the abuse is as widespread as many on here are claiming, then there surely is done documentation, right?


I forgot this response? Everyone’s integrity and assume it’s all false lol. Not a direct shot at you but you are throwing out a common rebuttal for the forum

Have not hunted during this season in a number of years but yes witnessed examples of abuse on a 3 occasion’s. I did not officially report it but did discuss it with a CO who I know well. The response that I was given was “unfortunately it is an extremely difficult one for a CO to pursue with out pics, video or CO directly witnessing it”

it falls under the same category of those who shoot off a friend or family members tag. The animal was taken during an open season and tagged is the only thing a CO can prove without a confession or video

[Wild one]

considering i hunt on average 50+ days per fall for the last 10 years of my life and have been stopped a total of 3 times by a co might be a reason there hasn't been many convictions. i really like seeing conservation officers in the bush and always have good chats when i do see them, but it just doesnt happen enough. what the conviction number is is fairly irrelevant if people are doing it and getting away with it. honestly maybe the number of people cheating the system is so minimal it has no effect {this is what i believe}. But i have no proof of these things happening. maybe its jealous hunters like the OP making up stories to try and socially manage our hunting seasons, probably the case!


How many people have you heard of being charged using the “FN tag” bit ?

This is an extremely common one in the area I live in CO’s won’t touch it because they can’t prove the non FN guy is the shooter

[blackford]

honestly maybe the number of people cheating the system is so minimal it has no effect {this is what i believe}. But i have no proof of these things happening. maybe its jealous hunters like the OP making up stories to try and socially manage our hunting seasons, probably the case!

Again... I am not jealous. I have more than adequate wild game every year...I have always managed to bring meat to the table. Its not jealousy.. It simply making provisions for a sustainable resource.

I can't stress this enough. Please don't be defensive. This post was brought up to discuss the issues.

how do you believe that its minimal numbers that cheat the system... If you are getting stopped .6% of the days you hunted in the last 10 years... cmon brother...

[Brez]

Again, Blackford, I thank you for bringing up a controversial topic. There is no need to get emotional or defensive or confrontational here. This is a hunting discussion forum and a very valid topic was put presented. We are all entitled to our opinions. They are based on our experiences and because someone else has had different experiences, hence different opinions, they are not diminished.

[Bugle M In]

There's been a few times in the past few years, going to the local Gun Shop.
During those times, there has been talk going on about juniors/seniors having these permits etc, and the dad being the one doing the hunting and shooting.
From what I recall, it was mainly in regards to some of that zonex hunts, and believe it or not, I just listened, and didn't say anything, and this I recall was a topic of discussion several times while there.
So, what I am saying, as some have said here, it is talked about!, and why the OP is getting kind of hammered over bringing this up, is beyond me, and probably why membership on this site is declining, and why many say they rarely come here anymore!
So, are those people wrong, or just don't have tough enough skin!??

Also, (I think I have said this), but my best friend sons had the LEH for elk in the Pitt last season.
There are 3 non fn permits.
There was also another father/son team in there at the same time.
All my buddy said was, there were days where they only saw that father out and about, while son stayed at the cabin etc.!
So okay, dad could have been just trying to "locate elk"!
But, it does show that some kids really don't care if they hunt or not!

The big difference with that scenario, that I think most of us "cant relate with"!, is the fact that when we were young, there was no F'n chance we were going to sit in the cabin!
We were probably telling dad to "move his ass" , "come on, lets go, I'm ready"!
(that is probably what most of us on this site were like)
But this kid wasn't, and this type of scenario sure leads to some "legitimate speculation" you could say.

Last thing, and I think this hasn't been brought up.
The OP brought up this whole thread based on MD.
Now, I do have doubts that the youth MD hunt enacts a lot of dads to use this loophole to get a deer!
When it comes to deer, MD or WT, I think the majority of the take is done by the youths.
So, I think the OP need not concern himself that it is the youth hunt that is making the MD disappear in his eyes.
(It's no different then when Bow opens first a week before, and then I go out, the game already knows it GOS)

But, when it comes to game like ELK, I think there might be some room for discussion (fair discussion) that some middle aged folks are using that for their advantage, by having a youth/senior in the family with a tag.
Reason being, elk and moose are more of the "prize harvest" then a deer, imo.

And now you take a coveted, once in a lifetime, Rosie Draw, and I think you have a real recipe for Dads using their kids.
Now that dad has a 2nd draw for the same area, under the disguise of using his child as an entry tag.
I think those type of things "do happen"!
And those type of special leh tags, are not always "what the kid wanted to do in the 1st place"!
But, what do you know, dad didn't win, but the kid did!
So, now I go back to the scenario in the Pitt last season.

So what was the outcome?
Well, my buddies son, who was 20, did get his bull, and did "do the hunting" while dad drove and help spot.
At that time, the other father/son had not taken a bull.
But, my understanding was, at a later date, the kid did "tag out".
Who the F knows who got it?
Maybe the kid did?

So, youth season and MD, I doubt there is much concern to be had, and it sure as hell wouldn't cause a "decline in population".
Coveted tags, there is a good possibility that others are doing the shooting at times.
But, isn't thee type of LEH designed that even if every permit holder is successful, that it will still have no effect on causing population decline?, I think that is what it is designed to do.

So really, this ends up being an "Ethics" issue.
And I think Ethics good for the most part in the province, but as the "rarity" of the tag gets, so does the ethics decline to some degree.
I think that is a fair statement.
I think it was a fair thread to be posted.
What I didn't think was right, was to make it "open season" on the OP.
And yes, if people see this type of thing going on, report it.
That stops a lot of "speculation" going on in the 1st place.
I'm out!

[horshur]

Show the stats for roadkill..compare them to even exaggerated claims of harvest during youth hunt...If you all want to virtue signal..go find the raincoast page...

[Bugle M In]

Show the stats for roadkill..compare them to even exaggerated claims of harvest during youth hunt...If you all want to virtue signal..go find the raincoast page...

I agree with that.
I see that the Road kill Stats where I go in the EK for elk, and probably outnumbers all the kills, for any species, by hunters,
3X over!!!
Bang on there my friend!

[HighCountryBC]

Again... I am not jealous. I have more than adequate wild game every year...I have always managed to bring meat to the table. Its not jealousy.. It simply making provisions for a sustainable resource.

I can't stress this enough. Please don't be defensive. This post was brought up to discuss the issues.

how do you believe that its minimal numbers that cheat the system... If you are getting stopped .6% of the days you hunted in the last 10 years... cmon brother...

If you're worried about a sustainable resource, focus your efforts on areas and objectives that will make more deer. Kids shooting a handful of surplus bucks before school starts isn't something that needs to be addressed.

If people spent HALF - that's right, HALF as much time getting on their elected officials about habitat, predators etc. as they did logging in to things like Facebook and HBC complaining about meaningless points like 4 point and youth seasons, we would be so much further ahead than we are now.

People want to know why the USA has such game rich areas? It is really simple. They fund wildlife management, they burn the heck out the country, they protect winter range (full closures, shed hunt closures etc.), and they kill predators. They harvest across all age classes and both sexes without silly antler point restrictions. Hunters don't waste their time complaining about stupid, meaningless points like folks up here love to do. We keep restricting seasons and game numbers keep getting worse.

[Ourea]

Gotta invest in youth, they are the future that will perpetuate our sport.
Simple as that.

[silvertipp]

To suggest the youth season has anything to do with the decline in deer population is ridiculous
the op be also suggest a youth is in able of making a quick shot at an animal also ridiculous
I have taken many youth hunters and fathers out hunting never had a problem with the kids getting off clean shots and kills
to suggest kids are playing Vidio games while dad is out hunting come on
a hole bunch of hear say going on without any evidence
the kids I hunted with were always the first one up and there was no way they would have let anyone shoot there deer
To use fishing in a closed season as a reference to kids hunting in a youth season only
suggests where you are coming from
quit whining about children learning and having an advantage over you and get out there and find a deer
if your that hard up give me a call and I will get my kid to take you out

[Wild one]

Gotta invest in youth, they are the future that will perpetuate our sport.
Simple as that.

Agree but this also needs to be done in a fashion that passes on good ethics

Without this you can create the demise of hunting

[Bugle M In]

If you're worried about a sustainable resource, focus your efforts on areas and objectives that will make more deer. Kids shooting a handful of surplus bucks before school starts isn't something that needs to be addressed.

If people spent HALF - that's right, HALF as much time getting on their elected officials about habitat, predators etc. as they did logging in to things like Facebook and HBC complaining about meaningless points like 4 point and youth seasons, we would be so much further ahead than we are now.

People want to know why the USA has such game rich areas? It is really simple. They fund wildlife management, they burn the heck out the country, they protect winter range (full closures, shed hunt closures etc.), and they kill predators. They harvest across all age classes and both sexes without silly antler point restrictions. Hunters don't waste their time complaining about stupid, meaningless points like folks up here love to do. We keep restricting seasons and game numbers keep getting worse.

Sad part is, I believe there re many that "have tried" to get "political side" to listen!
Even I tried my best, face to face with Heyman, running up to the election in fact, to listen.
Now, you would think that a politician, running for election, right at that point in time, would listen!?
Not an F'n chance!
No one is listening!
They have their agendas, and they have "their votes" so as not to have to listen!
That's the issue.
So unless some of our "great bios'" start speaking up, I doubt anything will change with just letters.
I(f we can swing the vote, to a point where it affects them, then hell ya, they will listen!
That's why we need an "organization" that shows them "exactly that".
So far however, we have sweet F*** all to have anyone bother to listen.
That's my 2 cents on another "post on an HBC thread".

[scottym]

Why does an early season make any difference to teaching a younger person to hunt.? Hunting can be taught
throughout the season. It’s also all about working hard get the game and appertaining what you killed for food.

[Ourea]

Agree but this also needs to be done in a fashion that passes on good ethics

Without this you can create the demise of hunting

Reality is you can't regulate ethics and morality.
Those standards are set by individuals themselves.

Rules and regulations govern our lives.
Some chose to comply, some don't.

[Wild one]

If you're worried about a sustainable resource, focus your efforts on areas and objectives that will make more deer. Kids shooting a handful of surplus bucks before school starts isn't something that needs to be addressed.

If people spent HALF - that's right, HALF as much time getting on their elected officials about habitat, predators etc. as they did logging in to things like Facebook and HBC complaining about meaningless points like 4 point and youth seasons, we would be so much further ahead than we are now.

People want to know why the USA has such game rich areas? It is really simple. They fund wildlife management, they burn the heck out the country, they protect winter range (full closures, shed hunt closures etc.), and they kill predators. They harvest across all age classes and both sexes without silly antler point restrictions. Hunters don't waste their time complaining about stupid, meaningless points like folks up here love to do. We keep restricting seasons and game numbers keep getting worse.

It’s not just the US BC has fallen behind most of Canada as well

Right now BC hunters are divided and will remain so till those trying to push for change wake up and understand compromise is needed because hunters are a diverse group

I spent the last year looking at different groups as possible voice for BC hunters and change well it’s not there. I found egos, I found greed, I found disrespect for fellow hunters, I found some who crave revenge, I found heart with no organization but not a possible voice. Everyone had their own vision and figured everyone else would benifit from “Their way” but not one considers the different hunters of BC

I actually considered getting involved with one but the I seen their in fighting

So go ahead get mad about hunters not following your vision but maybe the issue is that you need to find a vision all BC hunters would be proud to stand for

[Wild one]

Reality is you can't regulate ethics and morality.
Those standards are set by individuals themselves.

Rules and regulations govern our lives.
Some chose to comply, some don't.

I can’t argue with that and in all honesty I am just so sick of slobs so just want to limit their actions.

But I guess these sh!t fathers will pass their poor ethics with or without the youth season

[Grumpa Joe]

The purpose of the youth season at the beginning of September is to get the youth out before all hell breaks loose with all the other hunters get turned loose on the 10th. It's less stressful and less pressure has been put on the animals so they are not as skittish.

With respect to adults shooting their kid's deer the reality is that even if there was no youth season those same individuals would be shooting the deer under their kid's license and tags but in GOS instead. Ethics aren't reliant on a specially designated season. How many guys shoot bucks that aren't 4 point the day before the start of or the day after the end of the any buck season? A dishonest person will always find ways to be dishonest.

[Bugle M In]

The purpose of the youth season at the beginning of September is to get the youth out before all hell breaks loose with all the other hunters get turned loose on the 10th. It's less stressful and less pressure has been put on the animals so they are not as skittish.

With respect to adults shooting their kid's deer the reality is that even if there was no youth season those same individuals would be shooting the deer under their kid's license and tags but in GOS instead. Ethics aren't reliant on a specially designated season. How many guys shoot bucks that aren't 4 point the day before the start of or the day after the end of the any buck season? A dishonest person will always find ways to be dishonest.

^^^^ Bingo, so folks, if you see BS happening, just report it.

[Big Lew]

What I can't understand is those that say "it's not the hunters that are responsible for the decline of animal numbers,
it's habitant destruction and predators" Well, we humans are the top predator, plain and simple! Most of us are all
for culling the predatory wolves, bears, coyotes, and even cougars, but we resist any reduction in our hunting opportunities.
I've witnessed the decimation of dear populations in specific valleys by wolves...I've also seen deer populations almost
wiped out by hunters in some areas as well. Each hunter doesn't think they are a problem when they take a couple of
deer every year from an area and they'd be right if it wasn't for the other parade of hunters doing the same thing. A long
time ago most hunters thought there was an ever lasting number of deer, moose, elk, and caribou...something like the
proverbial purse, but like our salmons and over fishing, if the predators, which includes us, keep taking more than what
can be re-produced you are a big part of the problem. Having a short youth season (9 days) is much more reasonable than
having one a whole month long. People fail to realize that if a youth isn't able to get something during those 9 days it's not
the end of their chances, they still have the rest of the general open season just like everyone else.

[silvertipp]

Lew I have no problem shutting it down if that would help
this would of coarse have be all user groups not one group at a time
i still do not believe shortening the youth season will do any help at all to the decline of ungulates
If it is that bad that we need to shorten a youth season ,it should be closed to all user groups .

[Big Lew]

Lew I have no problem shutting it down if that would help
this would of coarse have be all user groups not one group at a time
i still do not believe shortening the youth season will do any help at all to the decline of ungulates
If it is that bad that we need to shorten a youth season ,it should be closed to all user groups .

Yes, all groups should also participate. There are many ways to help re-build the various herbivore populations
but most of us don't want to step forward. We would rather take what we can now even knowing there's less
and less available then hold off for the possibility things will be better in the long run. It's the same with resisting
any restriction on points. It's not all doom and gloom though, I know of several youths, both boys and girls, that
refused to shoot a little spike, holding off for something more mature. My son was one of them.

[Taurusguy]

Maybe there isnt the shortage of unglulates as people suspect... maybe they are just moving into mountains and forests that are not as accessible to people as we are all used to and have gotten smarter over the years.. *shrugs*... there's alot of mountain terrain with no roads on it still where animals can go and not be seen for a long time.

[Ourea]

Maybe there isnt the shortage of unglulates as people suspect... maybe they are just moving into mountains and forests that are not as accessible to people as we are all used to and have gotten smarter over the years.. *shrugs*... there's alot of mountain terrain with no roads on it still where animals can go and not be seen for a long time.

This comment flies in the face of all known empirical data on quantified wildlife populations.

[Bugle M In]

What I can't understand is those that say "it's not the hunters that are responsible for the decline of animal numbers,
it's habitant destruction and predators" Well, we humans are the top predator, plain and simple! Most of us are all
for culling the predatory wolves, bears, coyotes, and even cougars, but we resist any reduction in our hunting opportunities.
I've witnessed the decimation of dear populations in specific valleys by wolves...I've also seen deer populations almost
wiped out by hunters in some areas as well. Each hunter doesn't think they are a problem when they take a couple of
deer every year from an area and they'd be right if it wasn't for the other parade of hunters doing the same thing. A long
time ago most hunters thought there was an ever lasting number of deer, moose, elk, and caribou...something like the
proverbial purse, but like our salmons and over fishing, if the predators, which includes us, keep taking more than what
can be re-produced you are a big part of the problem. Having a short youth season (9 days) is much more reasonable than
having one a whole month long. People fail to realize that if a youth isn't able to get something during those 9 days it's not
the end of their chances, they still have the rest of the general open season just like everyone else.

So hunters destroy the wildlife populations?
Hmmm.
If one considers stuff, like say of late, the Vintners and their vineyards up in the Okanagan, now complaining that the deer are eating up all their plant, thus a call for a "cull".
Or, something like zone x on elk in the EK, because ranchers/farmers and ICBC are finding them also destructive.

I think there is a lot of room out there to blame "other facets" in society, rather then the hunter.
Why do I think this way, well just look at the hunting regs from days gone by til now.
And tell me if all those restrictions over the years have made virtually sweet F'all of a difference.
Just further declines in #'s overall.
No matter where you sit, populations will never achieve historic levels with "Mans') encroachment on lane and destruction!
(notice I didn't have to point fingers at us)
Blaming hunters for "shooting the shit out of wildlife" is just "old fashion talk and thinking", imo.

[Big Lew]

Never said, or meant to suggest that we as hunters are the sole reason for the population declines.
We are a part of it though. Man's encroachment during the last 150 years with his pollution and
taking over so much feeding and wintering grounds is also to blame. The increase in numbers of
predators such as wolves in relation to the herbivore populations is as well. Why are there so many
deer and elk within towns and cities, vineyards and many farms and ranches...numbers similar to
what once was in the country? Because there are few if any predators, including man, preying on them,
and they have more feed available to them then in the woods. We can help restore numbers by dealing
with habitant loss, by reducing natural predator numbers, we can even go to extremes by trying to
reduce the yearly carnage caused by vehicles and especially trains, but we also have to be smarter in
how we regulate our hunting. The recent reduction in yearly bag limits for mule deer is a start.

[Bugle M In]

Never said, or meant to suggest that we as hunters are the sole reason for the population declines.
We are a part of it though. Man's encroachment during the last 150 years with his pollution and
taking over so much feeding and wintering grounds is also to blame. The increase in numbers of
predators such as wolves in relation to the herbivore populations is as well. Why are there so many
deer and elk within towns and cities, vineyards and many farms and ranches...numbers similar to
what once was in the country? Because there are few if any predators, including man, preying on them,
and they have more feed available to them then in the woods. We can help restore numbers by dealing
with habitant loss, by reducing natural predator numbers, we can even go to extremes by trying to
reduce the yearly carnage caused by vehicles and especially trains, but we also have to be smarter in
how we regulate our hunting. The recent reduction in yearly bag limits for mule deer is a start.

Okay, I agree with that, and yes, if #'s are down, and applying some regs like the 1 MD limit, to help #'s come back up quicker, I am all in.
But, only if we are taking all the other steps like you said above, especially the protection of winter range, so on and so forth.
Regulations on their own shown to be an "utter failure".
So, if we are both on that same thinking path, then good, that's how we all need to be.

[Ourea]

Thread is on youth seasons.

[limit time]

The youth season is a win win for special interests IMO.

Caller - I think to many dads are shooting youth season deer. .

Goberment- how many are doing this ?

caller- don’t know for sure but it happens.

Goberment- do you have prof of this ?

Caller - no I don’t but I know it happens !

Goberment - is this affecting the deer numbers !

Caller- not sure .

Goberment- how can we solve this ?

Caller- to be sure this doesn’t happen it should be closed.

Goberment - if it stops just one dad we need to do this !

[wideopenthrottle]

I call them "tags of convenience" Chatted with some moose hunters one time that had a bull down and were racing back to camp to get Granny because she had a draw and tag.


no youth season where i grew up but hunted with my same aged buddies at 13 and 14.....poachers will be poachers and there is always ways to cheat when no one is watching (what you do when no one is watching is the true measure of your integrity)....

as a teen, there were many stories of peeps that shot moose when they shouldnt and would go find a native buddy to accompany him home with the moose...perhaps banning the natives from hunting outside of the regular season is the answer for that problem....<sarcasm>...going for popcorn .... BRB

[horshur]

I can’t argue with that and in all honesty I am just so sick of slobs so just want to limit their actions.

But I guess these sh!t fathers will pass their poor ethics with or without the youth season

they are hunting with there kid....shit fathers abandon kids..abuse them..there mom..steal there money from the piggy bank...

shooting others tags tags for meat is a culture. It is much more along the lines of public opinion because it was for meat...even the kid who couldn’t or didn’t shoot the animal feels valuable cause he/she had the tag..reached that possibility ..had a value..harkens back to ancient times...probably a waste trying to explain.

[Wild one]

they are hunting with there kid....shit fathers abandon kids..abuse them..there mom..steal there money from the piggy bank...

you really got to quantify what a shit father is...

Ok unethical poachers who use their children as a loophole to shoot a deer

[horshur]

Ok unethical poachers who use their children as a loophole to shoot a deer

Who are you?...vain guy who trophy hunts! The Bain of hunting

[Wild one]

Who are you?...vain guy who trophy hunts! The Bain of hunting

Nope not even close

I am actually getting to the point of asking myself why I bother giving a crap

[Gateholio]

simply put. if a tree falls in the forrest and nobody is there... does it still make a sound. I have hunted some pretty remote areas and some pretty heavy hunted areas in the last 15 years.... I have been stopped once by a CO. If you are relying on tickets in the bush...well to say it politely ... this isn't going to happen.

about 6 years ago I had a beer with a CO at a pub during hunting season and asked him about the conservation and youth season. He did say that they did a trial and put a decoy that moves in the bush during youth season and 4 point season. I wrote down the results as he was talking on my iPhone because I wanted to get them right....

In youth season, 34 people shot.

30 of those shots were done by dad or mom
15 shots were taken from inside a vehicle


In 4 point season they did the same thing.

over the weekend several cars stopped. ( he didn't have the number)

4 people shot from the truck
2 people shot from when it was not a 4 point but was only open


I asked him about youth season and he laughed.. He said he only gets paid to enforce the rules.



In regards to being part of the problem... Calling a CO and saying that the dad is in full camp shooting a high powered rifle and cleaning a deer while the sun is in ninja turtle pj's playing his Nintendo in his truck isn't reasonable grounds to fine someone. its so hard to police. Again... I am not saying its all the kids. I am just saying its a lot. a lot I hear about... its also a long time to shoot deer which aren't afraid of anything...


for those of you being brash about this.... please don't. its a topic that I wanted to bring up. based on the poll... a lot of people see different that what I see.. I respect that 100%


So, you say we can't rely on tickets, but surely there were tickets issued to the 30 Moms and Dads and 15 truck shooters? That's 45 people illegally shooting over a single weekend and no tickets?

I can understand that this can be hard for CO's but what about complaints? How many complaints are made? Again, if this is a real problem, then surely concerned hunters are at least reporting incidents they witness?

[horshur]

Nope not even close

I am actually getting to the point of asking myself why I bother giving a crap

Takes one to know one...what were you born in a vacuum?

[horshur]

Pretty sure in Ontario or Quebec..shooting others tags is legal...kinda like Pot is legal now

[horshur]

Bow hunting..”.someone who has the luxury to go home skunked”. A vanity just the same as trophy hunting.

[Wild one]

Really did not like my definition of a sh!t father

I have respect for the guy who takes a kid out to get their first deer but I don’t care what anyone says I won’t have respect for the father using there kid to exploit a youth season

Should be clear by now I don’t care about people on this forum trying to throw labels and assumptions about me for my opinions but have at it if you must lol

[Jelvis]

Wild one your tussling with the wrong member Hahahahaha
Jello-Hello-Horsh

[Big Lew]

Bow hunting..”.someone who has the luxury to go home skunked”. A vanity just the same as trophy hunting.

I have to challenge those blanketing statements sir! I've been a bow hunter for well over 25 years.
I've shot many deer with my bows...more than when rifle hunting. I'm definitely not a trophy hunter.
In all the considerable number of deer and 5 bull moose I've shot I've only kept one set of antlers
even though some of them were quite large 4 pointers. Same with my largest moose...it was big!

[Wild one]

Yep...it’s fine. Heard that one before...

If you think I am accusing you of shooting a kids deer I am not

If you’re pissed for other reasons oh well

[Avalanche123]

13 pages....unreal. We really are our worst enemy.

[Jelvis]

Big Lew a real Bow Hunter folks! Gotta respect that, an awesome hunter for sure --
Jel - horsh - hunting -- moose and deer -- gotta respect dat! --

[horshur]

You don’t have to respect...but it is still better then the alternative.....no need to throw out the baby with the bath water. The clock is ticking...the pig in the snake is at the far end..the bubble is bursting. Yin and yang. The largest demographic of hunters in their last days.

[Jelvis]

The cost of hunting with fuel at it's highest, it seems almost impossible to spend all that coin for a long week-end if you can't afford it.
-- Enormous fuel bills, expenses and more
Jelvis -- Don't step on my blue swade huntin boots --

[horshur]

If you think I am accusing you of shooting a kids deer I am not

If you’re pissed for other reasons oh well
No...though a member on here did that years ago..cornered my kid at the gun show.
I am just trying to show you another point of view..tempering(soften) a reality. Before you all throw out the baby...

[horshur]

Last try..twenty six year ago..my new wife had a doe draw. North Thompson had a dick CO..a friend of mine now. He threw his weight around made people uncomfortable...his job.
I was young,good hunter ,or so I thought..tagged out...virtue signaling bonehead...not even going to appear to be “one of those guys” didn’t pack a rifle. So my wife gets on a doe long weekend of nov..shoots..shot was not optimal...doe runs off..me holding my binoculars...we never retrieve that deer...blood all over in the snow..shitty deal my wife goes through that could have been a great day if I had not been so vain..we owe the game more then just keeping a regulation...

[j270wsm]

simply put. if a tree falls in the forrest and nobody is there... does it still make a sound. I have hunted some pretty remote areas and some pretty heavy hunted areas in the last 15 years.... I have been stopped once by a CO. If you are relying on tickets in the bush...well to say it politely ... this isn't going to happen.

about 6 years ago I had a beer with a CO at a pub during hunting season and asked him about the conservation and youth season. He did say that they did a trial and put a decoy that moves in the bush during youth season and 4 point season. I wrote down the results as he was talking on my iPhone because I wanted to get them right....

In youth season, 34 people shot.

30 of those shots were done by dad or mom
15 shots were taken from inside a vehicle


In 4 point season they did the same thing.

over the weekend several cars stopped. ( he didn't have the number)

4 people shot from the truck
2 people shot from when it was not a 4 point but was only open


I asked him about youth season and he laughed.. He said he only gets paid to enforce the rules.



In regards to being part of the problem... Calling a CO and saying that the dad is in full camp shooting a high powered rifle and cleaning a deer while the sun is in ninja turtle pj's playing his Nintendo in his truck isn't reasonable grounds to fine someone. its so hard to police. Again... I am not saying its all the kids. I am just saying its a lot. a lot I hear about... its also a long time to shoot deer which aren't afraid of anything...


for those of you being brash about this.... please don't. its a topic that I wanted to bring up. based on the poll... a lot of people see different that what I see.. I respect that 100%



awesome......conservation officers doing their jobs and catching poachers.

Youth seasons are in place to give kids a slightly increased opportunity to harvest an animal. As a parent, I'm sure you know that sept is a busy time for kids and getting out hunting can be very difficult. Some parents feel that school is too important to miss because of hunting. Reguardless of what the conservation officer you had a beer with thinks.....youth seasons aren't a conservation concern. Poaching on the other hand can be. If you know someone who is shooting deer for their kids......report them. Is it guaranteed to lead to charges/convictions.....no. But a conservation officer stopping by their house and questioning them could make them reconsider shooting their kids animals.
when my son was 10 he harvested his first black bear, a cow elk and 2 deer. He pulled the trigger on every one of them. The bear was shot in may the elk was sept and the 2 deer were oct/nov. we hunted in the youth season but didn't get the opportunity at an animal. Watching my son harvest his first animals was the best hunting season I've ever had, even if him filling all my tags meant I didn't get to harvest anything.

[Wild one]

No...though a member on here did that years ago..cornered my kid at the gun show.
I am just trying to show you another point of view..tempering(soften) a reality. Before you all throw out the baby...

Personally I probably would have knocked the guys teeth out for that

My only issue with youth seasons is the idiots that abuse them. I have never said get rid of them or they damage buck numbers. Adjust dates to hope limit idiots temptation yes. That is only because I have not heard near the abuse during the youth seasons out side of archery season.

Kids taking deer in youth season I have no issue with. Do I think they could benefit from adjustment to try and limit abuse it’s worth a try. Do I think they are a must for getting kids into hunting no. Kids benefit from it yup

Before the 9 day early archery season comes up I have not used it for about 7 years so not an issue

I am not the one saying do away with youth seasons

[ncurrie]

Before I start I want to clear up what some of you are going to think. I was able to get my deer this year. Infact in our group we are fine for deer for a season and a half. Thats with us going to the elders in the community and giving the hunters that are to elderly to hunt some deer to enjoy. My parents brought me up the right way...


Ok. So I hope I don't ruffle to many feathers here. I know I am going to get a back lash on this but from the hunters I spoke to this year so far - they agree with me. The open youth season in region 8 has got to stop. Plain and simple. When I started hunting about 15 years ago we had a lot more deer. Infact my first deer was shot with my dad no further than 100 yards away. We didn't need a "open youth season" and we all seemed to do ok. I learned how to clean a deer and I was instantly hooked on the sport. I didn't need a youth season to get me going.

Before I even start - I have yet to hear of any youth that went hunting and missed a deer. No matter how young or old they are. No matter how big the deer was or if it was moving or to far... they always seem to hit it. Infact I have been out for bow season and see kids in pyjamas in the truck. What I am getting at is that I am willing to bet Dad is taking the shot a high percentage of the time. You can't tell me otherwise. How is a youth who has never possibly shot at an animal before get out of the truck and shoot a deer first try... cmon ladies and gents....


Secondly the length of time the season is open. Sept 1 -Sept 30 and then it open for everyone else for any buck. I went this year and I got my buck... I hunted off the beaten path. I can tell you that every single buck I saw was moving pretty quick. Chances are they have been shot at ( from the kids doing it right) or they have heard the bullets fly towards other deer. This is ridiculous..... I have 1 week a year to dedicate to hunting. By the kids going out and shooting and eliminating a lot of deer from the mix, it makes it harder for me to get my deer. I contribute just like the parents of the kids do and I think I am entitled as much as they are to bagging my deer.


Thirdly- Jesus Christ- now even open for birds... every year I limited out on grouse. This year I came nowhere close... wonder why..?

Lastly, we have new regulations saying we can take only one deer from selected regions. This is because deer counts are down ( I guess). If this is the case then why are we letting dads in with the kids to shoot deer before the other hunters can. Lets make it fair for everyone.

My thoughts is if the youth draw was to continue we make it like a limited entry. Give a certain amount of spikes, 2 point, 3 point and larger for the youths. This will have dad.... I mean the youth have to count the points before shooting... It will teach them good habits and it will make the sustainability of the sport go further.

This is the only sport we give a break to the youths. Can youths fish the Fraser when its closed..

I am going to go hide under a rock because I am sure this will get some people upset but this needs to stop. And if we are going to open it up for the youth... Then why not open it up for the seniors.... they can't go on a 10 km hike to the alpine to get a deer.

In my eyes its all done wrong

I’m a little confused why this is even a discussion. Why are we not doing anything in our power to encourage the youth to hunt? Do we not want conservation to continue on for generations to come? With all the anti’s out there making death threats etc... to hunters, should we not be doing what we can to advocate, educate and make the road easier for these kids to learn and be able to teach the future generations? When my kids were younger yes I let them skip school to go hunting and be out doors, but now that my oldest is about to graduate and is applying for pre-vet schools, she can’t afford to miss school. That youth season allows her to get out, without messing up with her homework. The kid also works two jobs on top of that. It baffles me that adults would want to take away a youth season! Unfortunately with this kind of mindset, hunters will become a dying breed. Also, 15 yrs ago in region 8 we didn’t have the wolf problems that we do now.

[Steeleco]

There's 2 members in this discussion that need to chill. Or they won't be discussing shit!!

[Ourea]

This thread is about the youth season.
Try to keep it on the rails.

[TravisC]

I like the Youth season as most do. Its great time spent with kids showing them the great outdoors. And any buck is perfectly fine for that season. I'm hoping that in 4 years time its still there for my son to take advantage of if he will want to hunt. So hard to get away from the shitty to do family hunting trips.
My issue with the youth part is the leh doe youth only in some regions. Leh should be on an equal for everyone.
(I don't care if I have a doe draw) what I mean is there's a ton of new hunters or hunters that have been putting in multiple years searching and still coming up empty handed while many youth have taken multiple deer with the ability to hunt 8 years of youth seasons.
So Why are these new hunters or hard workers punished for doing the time and not allowed to enter that leh doe draw. Many of us have a spouse that might also love to hunt and how many of us have taken our kids out hunting and seen how excited they are when we also get something. Or how happy I am that My wife finally got a chance at an animal. My wife and I might get one weekend a year or every other year to get a whole family hunt in together and as people state that with school youth don't get much time out either. That's true but same goes with some family adventures. Not every one has the time, money, or jobs that allow multiple trips a year. So something like an LEH system there should be zero age brackets unless its actually fit into the youth season time frame or made youth season as a LEH thing in itself, otherwise everyone should be allowed to apply for these region draws.
As a father and husband I would love nothing more than to be able to see my son and my wife to get an animal. I don't care about me lol I'd be so giddy if they did , but as it stands it is next to impossible to get out for a family trip but an LEH doe for my wife would be a guarantee for her (if she didn't miss) where my son and I could be there to watch her get it. In a few years time hopefully we will get some awesome family time out for early season youth when my sons old enough. But even then I still believe that others like my wife should not be discriminated against for being allowed to apply for a LEH tag in a zone that allows such tags. Yes not all zones are LEH doe youth only but its started and soon they all will be.

[natebavis]

I have also benefited from youth season over the past few years. My nephews have taken some early season bucks. I will say we don’t always tag out although we are coasters and are time restricted. I agree with a lot of stuff posted here on both sides. My vote. Region 8. Discontinue sept 1-31. Just make it sept 1-9. That makes sense to me. Nate

[natebavis]

I am actually happy a youth supported by a gaurdian can’t bounce between 8/3,,,, daily to tag out. Did we do it. Yes but I am glad we can’t anymore. Never felt good about it.

[Ourea]

^^^^^^
Interesting and speculative statement/comment.



This thread is about the youth hunt.

I support bringing youth into any healthy interest/gives them an advantage to pursue their passion, ...that perpetuates their drive in life......furthermore, that sustains our sport.

Complain about kids being given an advantage to help them become motivated in pursuit of their goals and passion?
Best break out your moral compass.

[natebavis]

1 deer max is great which is now the deal. ,,,,,for us as well. Like I said going between 8/5 all over the weekend never felt great to me. Management throughout all seasons

[338win mag]

Its good for our youth, which in turn is good for families.

[willyqbc]

Been watching this thread for a while and trying to figure out how to phrase my response in a way that I won't have to give myself an HBC time-out!!

Blackford....my apologies, but your original post has struck me as coming from someone selfish, spoiled and self-entitled.......

from your first post.....

This is ridiculous..... I have 1 week a year to dedicate to hunting. By the kids going out and shooting and eliminating a lot of deer from the mix, it makes it harder for me to get my deer.


Jesus Christ- now even open for birds... every year I limited out on grouse. This year I came nowhere close... wonder why..?

........so because your hunt isn't all you hoped it would be, you seek to limit opportunity for youth? Is it not fair to say that curtailing the youth season will make it harder for them to get their deer??? You seem to feel its wrong that this (in your eyes) is happening to you...yet you're more than fine with doing it to them!!! .......selfish.....

You mention several times throughout the thread the declining deer numbers, conservation concern etc


Infact in our group we are fine for deer for a season and a half. Thats with us going to the elders in the community and giving the hunters that are to elderly to hunt some deer to enjoy.

so your group shot enough for yourselves for a year and a half even after giving some away......yeah, seems like you're doin your part to protect deer populations allright. This just reeks of a "limit others, so theres more for me" attitude which is unfortunately rampant among the resident hunters of this province. I sat on the region 5 allocation committee for several years with gov't and the assorted user groups....it always amazed me how often I saw this attitude from the various resident hunter representatives.

If your main argument is that Dads shooting their kids deer is the problem and so we should curtail the season....well, those folks are just poachers. Every species in the province gets poached...should we just shut it all down? probably the most rampant abuse of the system in this province in regards to hunting is all the non-hunting members of a family that go get their CORE so the hunter of the family can get more chances in the draw....should we shut down every species thats on limited entry? I think not.

The number of hunters in this province is on the decline....and the majority we do have, i'd wager to say are my age (45) or older. We hunters are an aging demographic and if we don't do everything we can to replace our numbers from the bottom (youth), we will very soon become so inconsequential in numbers that it will be pretty easy for the gov't to just shut er all down for good.

Human nature....we tend to be so focused on the "how does this effect me?", that we fail to see the bigger picture.

JMHO
Chris

[Elkhound]

Well said Willyqbc

[silvertipp]

Thanks Chris for taking the time to write what alot of us are thinking

[blackford]

Been watching this thread for a while and trying to figure out how to phrase my response in a way that I won't have to give myself an HBC time-out!!

Blackford....my apologies, but your original post has struck me as coming from someone selfish, spoiled and self-entitled.......

from your first post.....




........so because your hunt isn't all you hoped it would be, you seek to limit opportunity for youth? Is it not fair to say that curtailing the youth season will make it harder for them to get their deer??? You seem to feel its wrong that this (in your eyes) is happening to you...yet you're more than fine with doing it to them!!! .......selfish.....

You mention several times throughout the thread the declining deer numbers, conservation concern etc



so your group shot enough for yourselves for a year and a half even after giving some away......yeah, seems like you're doin your part to protect deer populations allright. This just reeks of a "limit others, so theres more for me" attitude which is unfortunately rampant among the resident hunters of this province. I sat on the region 5 allocation committee for several years with gov't and the assorted user groups....it always amazed me how often I saw this attitude from the various resident hunter representatives.

If your main argument is that Dads shooting their kids deer is the problem and so we should curtail the season....well, those folks are just poachers. Every species in the province gets poached...should we just shut it all down? probably the most rampant abuse of the system in this province in regards to hunting is all the non-hunting members of a family that go get their CORE so the hunter of the family can get more chances in the draw....should we shut down every species thats on limited entry? I think not.

The number of hunters in this province is on the decline....and the majority we do have, i'd wager to say are my age (45) or older. We hunters are an aging demographic and if we don't do everything we can to replace our numbers from the bottom (youth), we will very soon become so inconsequential in numbers that it will be pretty easy for the gov't to just shut er all down for good.

Human nature....we tend to be so focused on the "how does this effect me?", that we fail to see the bigger picture.

JMHO
Chris


Willy, I completley applaud feedback and I thank you for phrasing it in a way that is professional and being a good brother. Here is my explanation..


In regards to ME getting MY deer. What was meant by that is I literally have 1 week a year sometimes to either be successful or not. I do manage and I haven't gone hungry yet but we have to remember we are working on a resource. Having youth and (sorry I have to) Poachers possibly have a longer youth season is limiting to everyone who does not have a youth with them that chooses to hunt. In regards to making it tough for youth... Part of hunting getting skunked or making a decision no how to get to the animals... not oh look... the deer is looking at me... lets see if we can win either shoot the easiest deer or have dad help..


I will let you off easy on my next point because you don't know me. Years ago I had my gall bladder removed and can't eat a lot of meat. I eat very small portions and to be honest need maybe half of a deer for me and my family. I can't harvest half of a deer so what I do is shoot the first deer I see thats legal and within a good scenario and butcher it. I then go to family and seniors in my community that were hunters and because of age or health can't get out to shoot a animal. I probably don't have a season of and a half of deer meat but I am not making the youth argument because I am running short. I look after my elders and I will always do so. A full deer is to much meat for me.


Whether its poachers or dads shooting the kids deer... It happens. CO's can't be everywhere... I would rather a 9 day season of mayhem vs a month long...

I have a buddy up in Princeton right now who is hunting with his son... No youth hunting needed. He just messaged me and said he hasn't seen a thing. I said.. Shitty... his answer was "not really... I am enjoying a weekend a way with my boy and he is learning that not everything is a 2 foot putt"


Anyhow.. I agree. It seems like a lot of people are looking at "how does the youth hunt effect me and not look at the big picture". I see a lot more deer dieing that wouldn't have in the beginning. a longer season means more deers shot. They had not youth season when I was a little guy and we managed. My dad did a good job and I will be hunting for the rest of my life as long as my health allows it...

[835]

Blackford,
yep you stuck your neck out....... ! lol..... I 100% emphatically disagree with you. I think if the deer are so hard up then maybe take other management strategies.. I wont delve too far into that. You said so your self in your post
"I went this year and I got my buck... I hunted off the beaten path"
That should cover most people.... As far as Dads shooting their kids deer that is illegal, and for sure needs to be addressed. Obviously with officers in the bush... and we all know how well that works...
I would like to say your wrong with most dads shooting their kids deer, I know a group of guys I met online on this site. Every year they take out their kids and they get deer and their kids shoot those deer... I have watched them "grow up" online here.. And ya, im 43... I had no youth season... but I had way way more deer in the forest.....

you the adult hunter should be managed not youth.
Blackford you are entitled to your opinion, but I implore you to really look at it... you want more deer out there? but you still get yours every year and are willing to cut off a kid? look close at the people who want youth season Axed... if they aren't getting deer and still want it gone, they are probably not hunting hard enough... sitting in a truck wondering why there is no mulies out there when there was tonnes 15 years ago.... lets axe kids because we cant " get off the beaten path"
and if they do get their deer every year and still want to axe youth??? that's greed...

anyway....
we all learn different ways to look at shit here... arguing don't teach... and Blackford your post was a good one.... I just think yer wrong! lol

[Dougielightning]

Thanks Chris, agree with everything you’ve said. Funny thread, though good conversation. Been seeing a lot of young spike mules in our area that surely would have been shot by youth hunters if there were any youth hunting pressure to speak of. My daughter ( now 16, been hunting for six years) passes on them in hopes of seeing them grow to maturity, as we have a serious decline in the mule population here. Not saying there’s anything wrong with shooting those spike bucks but that’s her decision. Fast forward, October 1st any buck seasons start. The camps pull in set up and those young deer ( in our area anyway) get totally shot to hell. By adult hunters. Would be interesting to see a youth successful harvest stat for different areas compared to a standard successful resident hunter stat. Funny to go after the youth season as the reason it’s a struggle to harvest a deer. If we’re talking real impact on our populations we surely need to look elsewhere, especially when we’re talking poaching, over harvesting ,and just downright mismanagement.

[blackford]

835 we have a difference of opinions. I respect that .

[triggerhappy]

I didn't start hunting until I was an adult and I do not have kids, but I love the idea of the youth seasons. I think they should be expanded. I think all mule doe tags should be available only to kids. Great way to get them into hunting by giving them the easy kills.

I would really like to know what sick **** piece of shit fathers are killing deer and then cutting their kid's tag and stealing that opportunity from their kids? Most hunters want to get their kids into hunting, I would be shocked if there was more than a very small amount of fathers doing this. Most fathers are more excited about their kid getting a kill then getting a kill themselves.

And what makes you think these kids can't shoot a deer in one shot their first time? If they have been properly trained by their fathers, that shouldn't be an issue at all. They are most likely taking shots under 100 yards.

There are lots of deer for us adults to get. The easy ones should be available for the youngsters.

[tyreguy]

Stayed out of this one for a while as i figured it would stir up some people, but its not "too" bad i guess.

I did my Core Hunter Training course in 1979 when i had just turned 14, and i hunted with my dad but never harvested a deer and it wasn't until i turned 19 that i finally got one on my own. It would have been good to have a youth program then but we didn't, and a few would remember when 8-11 was closed for about 10yrs for deer hunting which at the end of the day didn't create a huge influx of deer either
My son got his licence at 13 and harvested his first Whitetail and Mule Deer bucks (spike / 2pt), 2 wt doe and 1 cow elk on the youth program as well other deer during the regular season. The youth program increased success and has the young hunter providing for his family and he is very proud of that, which alone gives the program enough merit to keep it going.
What i like about the early youth season is that there is no reason for an adult to be packing a rifle, perhaps protection only but for a road hunter he doesn't need it. (thats all i'm going to say about the hearsay parent shooting comment)
I've harvested many deer and would move out of the way for a youth to shoot anyday, and i think the prospect of eliminating the youth season so others can get more is as mentioned, a very selfish approach to perhaps a bigger issue.

Blackford, i knew you were going to get roasted and kudos for at least speaking your mind - but i don't support this subject as you've presented.

[Bugle M In]

Well Blackford, welcome to the site.
Anyways, I think you got the answer to your thoughts.
I think it was a fair conversation piece, otherwise, why do we even bother coming here to type/read.
If it is pictures that everyone wants, might as well stick to some of the hunting Facebook sites.
At least here, from time to time, you get the odd stories.
Better yet, is some folks at least help others out thru pm's on a "special area" or on some special LEH permits, so it has it's
good points to stick around.
I did see you were going to stick your neck out on this one, but it was good to see all the opinions.(ahh, emotions!)
Good luck for the rest of the season, and try just hitting the timber around areas where you see lots of sign and daily activity if you want my thoughts on success;-)

[blackford]

Yes gentlemen... In all honesty this reminds me of a movie quote... having said that... its all about interpretation..


“Unless someone like you cares a whole awful lot,
Nothing is going to get better. It's not.”
― Dr. Seuss, The Lorax (https://www.goodreads.com/work/quotes/886002)

[horshur]

Yes black ford if you get the chance take a kid hunting....

few years ago ago had my good friends daughter for the October hunt...first evening and dusk damn wolves howling...she whispers to me”is that what I think it is” I nod...awesome ! I don’t care if i get anything now...try howling..she did...and the wolves obliged...shivers! The kid was in tears...
And she did get her buck the next afternoon..shoots better then her old man...take a kid hunting.

[willyqbc]

Part of hunting getting skunked or making a decision no how to get to the animals... not oh look... the deer is looking at me... lets see if we can win either shoot the easiest deer or have dad help..

Blackford, while I do agree as a parent that there is a definite need to build character in our children....I don't see a young hunters early years as the time or place for it. We are in such desperate need of new young hunters coming up behind us. If we don't "recruit" them, our hunting nheritage will wither and die within the next generation or two. Children build positive associations through success, the key is to get em involved and having success in the formative years so they grow to love hunting. There is nothing that will imprint on a kid stronger than the love, respect, praise of a parent when the child has success with something. As the years go on and they get older and more mature, there is plenty of time for them to learn about "tougher" hunting scenarios. I believe in advertising, this is what they call the "ole bait and switch"!! Let the kids think its "just that easy", once they are hooked theres plenty of time to learn its not quite as easy as it seems!

The only thing that will sway policy, funding etc, is the number of vocal voters bitchin about it. I would even support initiatives that help adult first time hunters have success and get them hooked too. I would gladly give up my tags to youth or first time hunters in an effort to improve recruitment. Hell, i basically did that for the last 8 years... my son got his core at 10 and we couldn't use all the meat that would have come if we'd both been filling tags, so for 6 years or so he was "on the stick" for everything we hunted....he got to take moose, bear, WT, mulie, elk. as a result of those years, I can garauntee he will be a hunter for life and will pass this lifestyle down to his kids. Despite your concerns about the shit-heel parents out there using their kids for a way to get an easy deer.....I would bet every penny i have, that my kids experience is much more the norm.

JMHO
Chris

[Onesock]

Just wondering if anyone thinks the First Nations will allow junior hunters next year when they control all the hunting seasons?

[blackford]

I have taken kids hunting. They love it. But it’s boots on the ground and help for a while . We work up to shooting ...they love it

[Big Lew]

Times change...years ago there were many more 'country kids' that naturally experienced
most outdoor activities as they grew up toward the day they could take a shot at an animal.
Now, with so many not able to get that head start, and considering how stressed for time
their parents are, I can see why so many are in favour of a early youth advantage. It's like
fast tracking or taking a shortcut. I see nothing wrong with it considering today's environment,
but I am opposed to it being for a whole month. Giving youths a chance before they get into
their school curriculum is one thing, but the other 3 weeks is not different than general hunting
season starting the 1st of October. Many, if not most hunters can only get out there on weekends.
Their kids get weekends off as well. A hunting experience isn't, and shouldn't only be about killing
something. Learning to take failure occasionally is part of life. As others have said, sometimes
now-a-days we're a bit too over protective. Like is a school sports day, everyone getting a ribbon
so as not to upset their feelings is going too far. Schools are to be preparing kids for real life in the
very competitive world.

[quadrakid]

I can,t beleive that in the middle of hunting season the busiest thread on HBC at 17 pages and running is this thread.Sad.

[Jelvis]

People love to disagree quadra I ain't kidding you. Even hunters like to debate and get sensitive, but at least we and others see how important this issue is.
Jel -- Always encourage your kids to shoot and hunt -- take them to the range -- take them hunting -- plan your trip togedder -- from LEH aps to the final steak --

[LBM]

I can,t beleive that in the middle of hunting season the busiest thread on HBC at 17 pages and running is this thread.Sad.

actually the cannabis thread is at 18 pages, sad as well.

[blackford]

discussion is always good. I have heard several points to each argument.

[835]

835 we have a difference of opinions. I respect that .

We do... on that.. but, we all hunt!
This site has changed my opinion on things more ways than i can count.. A good debate is always something to learn from.

[Big Lew]

In regard to the month long youth season...we shouldn't forget that there are a lot of childless hunters
sitting on their thumbs during that month while hunters with children enjoy that special privilege...doesn't
seem fair. As someone pointed out, would it be fair for any other pursuit such as the salmon runs? By the
time a month has gone by the best opportunities until the rut are long gone.

[Bugle M In]

What I like is that this last page or 2, has shown that we "all can talk" it over.
Leaving emotion behind, yet still showing compassion respectfully.
If we can do this every time a debatable topic comes forth, then I think we can all move forward as one big team to get
some of the problems we face moving in appositive direction with some actual force.
Good job guys/gals!

[Islander30]

Willyqbc, your posts are exactly correct and well said ! I'm not even going to read any rebuttals or contradictions to your posts because you have written the truth, that's all there is to it ! Thanks, its comforting to know some people are still able to see clearly.


.

[Brez]

The world spins - That is the truth. The sun comes up - that is only the truth for those that can see it. We all have different truths based on our experiences. Doesn't mean anyone is totally wrong....or totally right for that matter. It's nice to see that the discussion has gotten around to be civil.

[BigfishCanada]

I have been taking kids Jr hunting for 15 years now, I have taught kids EVERYTHING i practice, even in regards to Alcohol in camp, cleaning and caring for your meat once tagged, safety in their gear, even having rules for the kids to always have a knife on your side, a compass, and a lighter in your pocket. Out of 19 kids i have taken out that many are now adults, every one of them understand the value of Conservation weather or not they still hunt today. Put aside all the poaching talk many of you say, I have had dozens of deer taken during Jr season and NEVER have i or someone in my group ever shot for a kid (That's not legal) and every deer the kids have had their hands in the blood, or had to 100% drag that deer back to the vehicle. Junior season, brings safety not just in the comfort of the deer not being as spooked, but less drunks and ******s in the bush, and a way better comfort knowing that its mostly dads in the bush at that time of year.

The way i raise kids to hunt Junior season, is the intent, not all the poaching, un ethical shit you guys are mentioning

[Islander30]

The world spins - That is the truth. The sun comes up - that is only the truth for those that can see it. We all have different truths based on our experiences. Doesn't mean anyone is totally wrong....or totally right for that matter. It's nice to see that the discussion has gotten around to be civil.

very wise...lol ! ok fare enough...."in my opinion" he speaks the truth !

[Brez]

very wise...lol ! ok fare enough...."in my opinion" he speaks the truth !
Well,...............I have never been called wise before! Wonders will never cease. lol. I owe you a beer.

[HarryToolips]

I have been taking kids Jr hunting for 15 years now, I have taught kids EVERYTHING i practice, even in regards to Alcohol in camp, cleaning and caring for your meat once tagged, safety in their gear, even having rules for the kids to always have a knife on your side, a compass, and a lighter in your pocket. Out of 19 kids i have taken out that many are now adults, every one of them understand the value of Conservation weather or not they still hunt today. Put aside all the poaching talk many of you say, I have had dozens of deer taken during Jr season and NEVER have i or someone in my group ever shot for a kid (That's not legal) and every deer the kids have had their hands in the blood, or had to 100% drag that deer back to the vehicle. Junior season, brings safety not just in the comfort of the deer not being as spooked, but less drunks and ******s in the bush, and a way better comfort knowing that its mostly dads in the bush at that time of year.

The way i raise kids to hunt Junior season, is the intent, not all the poaching, un ethical shit you guys are mentioning
Good on ya, your a true ambassador of hunting....

[dana]

I strongly support the Youth Seasons. My kids took full advantage of them when they were young. And if you think kids can't hunt or shoot then I guess you have never been around kids before. The acusation that the season is just for dad's to pull the pin is utter Bull$hit. There are many stories that don't get shared on forums like this because people are afraid to get ripped a new one. Yes, kids miss. Yes, kids might make bad shots. Here is a News Flash, so do Adults! I shared gobs and gobs of photos and stories on this site and others of my family's hunting adventures. I shared as much as I did for one reason. To inspire other dad's to do it too. To take kids into the outdoors and share the hunting heritage. If you aren't doing this, then you need to be!

[whitespringer]

Blackford, you make rational arguments and I'm glad you expressed yourself. I am a father of two and due to circumstances, have never been able to take "advantage" of youth season on behalf of my boys. School, work etc. Maybe most get there buck, but how many youth hunters don't even get out there for their birthright? Plenty. Factor that into the equation. Respectfully,
whitespringer

[curt]

Unfortunately I agree with the original post Dana you are the exception NOT the norm the fact is many dads do pull the trigger thats just reality and if you believe otherwise then your head is respectfully up your ass! [/QUOTE]

Then a TON of us here have our heads up our butts because thats not what we have seen. EVER I seriously dont believe its as bad as what some people here are making it out to be. Yes there will always be poachers. Wish we could curb that somehow. But I dont think Dana and other fathers here on HBC are the exceptions. WE ARE THE NORM

[Elkhound]

My apologies Curt

I meant to reply to your post but I hit the wrong button and edited it with my comment inserted. Not sure how I did that



Then a TON of us here have our heads up our butts because thats not what we have seen. EVER I seriously dont believe its as bad as what some people here are making it out to be. Yes there will always be poachers. Wish we could curb that somehow. But I dont think Dana and other fathers here on HBC are the exceptions. WE ARE THE NORM


Last edited by Elkhound (http://www.huntingbc.ca/forum/posthistory.php?p=2043662); Today at 05:01 PM.

[wideopenthrottle]

the whole point of the youth hunt is to match new and unsure hunters with less skiddish game. the first youth i saw fill his tag took 3 chances at a deer before he pulled the trigger....that was the whole point... he was challenged by prey that an experienced hunter would have shot 10 times over...they need those opportunities to go through all the mental steps taken before pulling the trigger...That is the awesome part about the junior hunt IMHO

[Big Lew]

First, I've expressed my opinion like eveyone else concerning the special youth 9 day-month scenarios
but I'll add that even though those that are enthusiastically in favour of it might not mean it, many are
making it sound as if it's their only chance at getting game. There's absolutely no reason youths can't
be out there hunting during the rest of legal seasons like all other hunters. Like just about every parent
out there hunting, they'll learn as they go. The emphasis toward recruiting and encouraging youth isn't
only during a week or so, it's much longer. It shouldn't be only about instant gratification, it should be
about the whole concept of hunting as well. I know of youngsters that went out and under the guidance
of their dad were talked through the aiming and shooting, had their picture taken with their trophy,
and then that was it. It was all alien to them, they did as their dad told them, but they really didn't fully
understand what had transpired and were overwhelmed by it all. Many didn't want to go again.
Like so many others have said, when they were very young they couldn't wait to go out with their dad, granddad,
or anyone else if only someone would allow them to tag along. If they got to shoot something that was a bonus.

[Islander30]

the whole point of the youth hunt is to match new and unsure hunters with less skiddish game. the first youth i saw fill his tag took 3 chances at a deer before he pulled the trigger....that was the whole point... he was challenged by prey that an experienced hunter would have shot 10 times over...they need those opportunities to go through all the mental steps taken before pulling the trigger...That is the awesome part about the junior hunt IMHO

No kidding hey ! I think getting a 10-12 yr old lined for the shot should be a sport in itself....hard on dads nerves I'll tell ya....especially when it doesn't work out !

[curt]

no worries at all!

[curt]

well we all have our opinions and ill stick by mine no special seasons we all hunt together I'd like to see 4 point season all year too give these young bucks an opportunity to live and learn as well if we have a mule deer decline why are will so willing to shoot all the up and comers!?

[dana]

So Curt, with one stroke of a brush you have just called every dad on this board a POACHER! Nice buddy! Elkhound, Coach, myself and all the other dad's on HBC who have ever taken their kids hunting and seen success, we are all POACHERS! And because of other remarks on this thread, you can then conclude that we are also Pieces of Shit for taking our kids out hunting as well. WOW!!! I can tell you, I do not have my head up my ass. I am not the exception. I am the Norm! There is no greater experience in hunting than to watch your kids take their first animals. I have killed some pretty darn big trophy class animals over the years. Some that I have put a ton of sweat, blood and tears for years to see through to fruition. And I can tell you, those hunts and animals Pale in comparison to the hunts I've had with both my kids! This is all part of passing on the Hunting Heritage that has been passed along to us. If you don't get that, then you better hang up your hunting gear and give up hunting. If you are so jealous of some kid's success' that you need to call all dad's 'POACHERS' then you better just quit because you have lost sight of what truly is important in hunting.

[Jelvis]

As long as all rules from the Ministry in the BC Hunting Regs and the LEH or GOS are adhered to -- Only the tag for thee hunter can be shot by thee hunter! :arrow:
-- No one else can pull on another's tag, son, daughter, step child or a new hunter -- Father or assistant --> all shoot their own tag!
Jel -- If all the rules and regulations are followed to the T -- then this is hunting -- this teaches the child that following the BC Regs and LEH are the proper things to do!

[dana]

Jelvis, Jr Hunters can cut their dad's tags if they have a Jr Licence. Happens often. Dad's sacrificing their own tags to start their childern out on the right foot!

[tinhorse]

When I take my son out, he is the only one carrying a rifle. He has his .243, I carry shooting sticks, the pack and a pair of binoculars to help him spot. This is his first year and he came close once but couldn't quite get set up before the deer walked off into thick timber and took his shot away. We will be back out later in November or next weekend hopefully and hope to connect then. He is very patient and wants to make sure he has a great shot not just a shot at a deer. As for the youth season, being on the island makes it that much tougher to find deer at times, those little blacktails are sneaky. Having a youth antlerless season gives the youngsters a much better chance as the brush is super thick and hard to get around in with full sized legs. The grouse hunting is sparse so if they are to be successful the youth doe is definitely the best chance they have.

[silvertipp]

So Curt, with one stroke of a brush you have just called every dad on this board a POACHER! Nice buddy! Elkhound, Coach, myself and all the other dad's on HBC who have ever taken their kids hunting and seen success, we are all POACHERS! And because of other remarks on this thread, you can then conclude that we are also Pieces of Shit for taking our kids out hunting as well. WOW!!! I can tell you, I do not have my head up my ass. I am not the exception. I am the Norm! There is no greater experience in hunting than to watch your kids take their first animals. I have killed some pretty darn big trophy class animals over the years. Some that I have put a ton of sweat, blood and tears for years to see through to fruition. And I can tell you, those hunts and animals Pale in comparison to the hunts I've had with both my kids! This is all part of passing on the Hunting Heritage that has been passed along to us. If you don't get that, then you better hang up your hunting gear and give up hunting. If you are so jealous of some kid's success' that you need to call all dad's 'POACHERS' then you better just quit because you have lost sight of what truly is important in hunting.

Well said Dana couldn't agree more

[dana]

First year my son hunted deer he was 11. We hunted the early youth season in Region 3 and saw some absolute incredible deer. One buck was flirting with the 190 inch typical mark. The buck was feeding in a high elevation cutblock. We stalked closer and closer. 40 yards with the iron sighted 30-30 lever gun, a family heirlom from my father-in-law who passed before my son was born. The buck was feeding broadside with head down and no clue we were there. Set up the shooting sticks and got my son set up. No go. He was too short to see the buck's vitals due to the tall fireweed. Okay, lets get closer. 30 yards, 20 yards. Nope, still can't see above the fireweed. There was a big stump at about 12 yards. That should get him high enough to see. Mover ever so slowly. Inching closer and closer. At 15 yards all hell broke loose as we pretty much stepped on another buck that was bedded. When he bolted up, the big boy took off for the timber. I yelled, 'Hey Buck! Hey Buck!' to get him to stop. It worked, he stopped ever so briefly just before entering the timber. Turned around and there was the buck we stepped on standing broadside at 20 yards, a young nontypical with trash and double droppers. I said to my son 'You can take that one.' He said to me, 'No dad, we're hunting big bucks!' We both laughed so loud the young buck clued in and bounded for the safety of the timber.

[tyreguy]

The benefit of having a youth only season is there is no reason for anyone else to be carrying a weapon other than maybe a bow. You go out for a youth hunt and you’re trying to get you kid on a deer, it’s not about filling tags.
Probably the season that had the possibility of abuse was the youth / senior elk hunts, and again this could be limited to only the hunter if it’s a limited season for them only. I have heard of prosecutions particularly over 1100m elevations.
If a dad uses his kids to fill their tags - what is he teaching them? I teach my kids the difference between right and wrong, about respect and if another wants to teach his kids by his bad example it will catch up eventually either from the law or his kids respect because I think the majority of people think the same way I do from what I’m hearing.
i checked just a minute ago and (whew) and my heads not up my ass!!
=curt;2043662]Unfortunately I agree with the original post Dana you are the exception NOT the norm the fact is many dads do pull the trigger thats just reality and if you believe otherwise then your head is respectfully up your list ass! [/QUOTE]

Then a TON of us here have our heads up our butts because thats not what we have seen. EVER I seriously dont believe its as bad as what some people here are making it out to be. Yes there will always be poachers. Wish we could curb that somehow. But I dont think Dana and other fathers here on HBC are the exceptions. WE ARE THE NORM[/QUOTE]

[dana]

A week or so later found us hunting the GOS in region 7 which also had a youth antlerless season at the same time. My son went for a quad ride with his grandpa one afternoon and ended up harvesting his first deer, a whitetail doe, with his grandpa's 30-06. They came back to camp to get help and the entire family, including cousins, assisted in the recovery. You can't get any better hunting memories than this.

http://i.imgur.com/UOC7rit.jpg

[dana]

We hunted hard the rest of the early season for a mule deer buck in Region 3. Saw some great ones but they just were a little too quick. Finally with the start of the late season, my son decided to lower his standards and harvested his first 4 point muley buck. Were were hiking some steep fir ridges and this guy presented himself. Nothing like coming out heavy with your kid's first buck in your pack.

http://i.imgur.com/AYHxYgl.jpg

[dana]

The point of these posts is to show that kids can indeed hunt and see their own success. To think it is dad doing the shooting is nothing short of ignorant. Of the years my kids were legal to hunt the youth seasons, I betcha we only saw success under those seasons less than 50% of the time, but both my kids saw success in regular seasons. I took the youth season off of work some years, and we still didn't see the success then. But with each time out, they were learning and with learning comes confidence and skill. The Hunting Heritage is passed along. I posted all these adventures as my kids were growing up. For the sole purpose to encourage other parents to do the same. Get out there, take your kid to the outdoors. Let them learn the art and skills that we hold so near and dear to our hearts. This is the only way for hunting to have a future! Funny though, many times the blessed internet hunting sites had many who were jealous of my kid's success'. I was accussed of shooting my kid's tags. I was told I was a worthless piece of $hit as a dad because I kept it real and shared stories of their failures as well. And the worst attacks came when my then 12 year old son did a backpack mountain goat hunt and shot a nanny. The keyboard warriors swarmed. Heck, even 10+ years later, some of those keyboard warriors still bring it up. Hahaha! By far that hunt topped my list as the Best hunt I've ever been on. I was so proud of my son for being such a tropper and filling his LEH on a legal goat. The memories are very strong when I look up on the mountain goat mounted up on the wall. Those with no kids don't have a clue of the raw emotion looking at that goat brings these many years later.

http://i.imgur.com/3GGgcV9.jpg

[Jelvis]

Awesome photo's dana and stories too, keep em coming, you got the history of the Rivers --
Jelly - The History of the Hunt -- Awesome stuff folks ! -->

[bownut]

First year my son hunted deer he was 11. We hunted the early youth season in Region 3 and saw some absolute incredible deer. One buck was flirting with the 190 inch typical mark. The buck was feeding in a high elevation cutblock. We stalked closer and closer. 40 yards with the iron sighted 30-30 lever gun, a family heirlom from my father-in-law who passed before my son was born. The buck was feeding broadside with head down and no clue we were there. Set up the shooting sticks and got my son set up. No go. He was too short to see the buck's vitals due to the tall fireweed. Okay, lets get closer. 30 yards, 20 yards. Nope, still can't see above the fireweed. There was a big stump at about 12 yards. That should get him high enough to see. Mover ever so slowly. Inching closer and closer. At 15 yards all hell broke loose as we pretty much stepped on another buck that was bedded. When he bolted up, the big boy took off for the timber. I yelled, 'Hey Buck! Hey Buck!' to get him to stop. It worked, he stopped ever so briefly just before entering the timber. Turned around and there was the buck we stepped on standing broadside at 20 yards, a young nontypical with trash and double droppers. I said to my son 'You can take that one.' He said to me, 'No dad, we're hunting big bucks!' We both laughed so loud the young buck clued in and bounded for the safety of the timber.

You Nailed it Steve!

Everyone should ask themselves, did you need a Youth Season to make that happen? Maybe spending the"Whole Season" together is the true Youth Season?

I spent most of my early hunting in some of the most amazing places packing the lunch without a rifle on my shoulder, awaiting for the day that I could pull the trigger.
I dragged out many bucks with my older brother, and learned more about the hunt than many my age. When the day came that I could carry a rifle on my shoulder and I
called myself a hunter. Those were the best moments of my hunting life. It wasn't a date on the calendar the branded me a hunter, it was the way of life that was created.

All I can say is "GO OUT AND HUNT" and thats all.............

[limit time]

We hunted hard the rest of the early season for a mule deer buck in Region 3. Saw some great ones but they just were a little too quick. Finally with the start of the late season, my son decided to lower his standards and harvested his first 4 point muley buck. Were were hiking some steep fir ridges and this guy presented himself. Nothing like coming out heavy with your kid's first buck in your pack.

http://i.imgur.com/AYHxYgl.jpg

Nice deer !
Makes me wonder if this four point would be up to certain people’s standards on this thread ? Is that next ? The size of the four point ? ( sorry for the troll).

[RJHunter]

Can you share a link to the goat write up dana? Good points and stories! And just want to remind all that the dads that take kids hunting in youth season are the same dads that don't fill their tags sometimes in regular season because they don't want their kids to lose the opportunity for a deer. I didnt shoot a deer last year because i wanted to make sure my kids had the opportunity. My daughter got her buck but i still ended the season with a couple of tags in my pocket. No regrets because my kids deer was a way cooler experience than anything I have ever shot.

[westcoaster]

I think what this thread is about is a whole lot of ASSumptions as to what other hunters with youth are up to.

I have never shot my kids animals, I have never taught them to lie or cheat. For better or worse, they have always harvested their own.

I will say the mind of a youth does seem to function a little slower than that of an adult. They don't seem to have the same appreciation as to the necessity of quick, efficient, timely movement after spotting a legal animal. For that, the youth season is invaluable for keeping them engaged and encouraged about hunting.

[dana]

Nice deer !
Makes me wonder if this four point would be up to certain people’s standards on this thread ? Is that next ? The size of the four point ? ( sorry for the troll).

IMO Size is the very reason the original poster started this thread. You see, a kid probably shot a bigger buck than he did and that just ain't fair right? Jealousy is alive and well on the hunting boards of today. While true sportsmen are happy to see others have success, particularly a kid, the unsportsmen huddle around their keyboards in their momma's basement, despise the success of others, particularly kids. You see they have hunted there whole lives and haven't even seen a buck that big and then a kid goes out and shoots a monster for their first buck? Seriously? That ain't right. The dad must have shot it and we must get rid of all youth seasons to end this injustice. Seen it happen on this very board with my family. And ding ding ding, it has obviously happened again.

[westcoaster]

Edited to delete as I was wrong...

[dana]

Can you share a link to the goat write up dana? Good points and stories! And just want to remind all that the dads that take kids hunting in youth season are the same dads that don't fill their tags sometimes in regular season because they don't want their kids to lose the opportunity for a deer. I didnt shoot a deer last year because i wanted to make sure my kids had the opportunity. My daughter got her buck but i still ended the season with a couple of tags in my pocket. No regrets because my kids deer was a way cooler experience than anything I have ever shot.The goat hunt was over 10 years ago and the attacks spanned many a thread and wasn't just on this board. As for personally going skunked to see your kids have success, that is truly the mark of a good dad instilling high values in his childern. Good on ya!

[dana]

I think what this thread is about is a whole lot of ASSumptions as to what other hunters with youth are up to.

I have never shot my kids animals, I have never taught them to lie or cheat. For better or worse, they have always harvested their own.

I will say the mind of a youth does seem to function a little slower than that of an adult. They don't seem to have the same appreciation as to the necessity of quick, efficient, timely movement after spotting a legal animal. For that, the youth season is invaluable for keeping them engaged and encouraged about hunting.

I have seen this same attribute of slowness in many a newbie adult as well. It takes time and practice to get a hang of this hunting thing. With the youth being our future, all the more reason to maintain youth seasons so that the practice hones skill and we have a strong hunter for tommorrow.

[eatram]

I'm in the phase of taking the Junior BEFORE he is allowed to hunt the junior hunt. He will learn a heck of a lot before he is allowed to hunt them on his own tags. I do look forward to him pulling the trigger. I am glad that he has a chance at them. Sept-Nov. What a blessing to have so much time and so many unique seasons. We all have reason to celebrate this fact.


https://i.postimg.cc/W48KNN50/407.jpg (https://postimg.cc/Z99jjStq)

https://i.postimg.cc/gJQPpc0N/417.jpg (https://postimg.cc/ZB8QFSpd)upload a photo online (https://postimages.org/)

[dana]

I'm in the phase of taking the Junior BEFORE he is allowed to hunt the junior hunt. He will learn a heck of a lot before he is allowed to hunt them on his own tags. I do look forward to him pulling the trigger. I am glad that he has a chance at them. Sept-Nov. What a blessing to have so much time and so many unique seasons. We all have reason to celebrate this fact.


https://i.postimg.cc/W48KNN50/407.jpg (https://postimg.cc/Z99jjStq)

https://i.postimg.cc/gJQPpc0N/417.jpg (https://postimg.cc/ZB8QFSpd)upload a photo online (https://postimages.org/)

Awesome!!! That's what it is all about right there!!! #raisethemupright

[Elkhound]

Awesome!!! That's what it is all about right there!!! #raisethemupright

Yup. I agree. Fantastic

[eatram]

... and he is learning that hiking, spotting, and tenacity will EARN you success. My boys take part in the hunt. They don't "sleep in their pajamas" while we hunt and I definitely won't shoot their deer.

https://i.postimg.cc/k5c78dgy/IMG-9257.jpg (https://postimg.cc/HJrGDR5J)

https://i.postimg.cc/x19fdC0d/IMG-9254.jpg (https://postimg.cc/SJtFTmY0)

[HarryToolips]

^^^^awesome job there eatram...

[Brez]

I'm in the phase of taking the Junior BEFORE he is allowed to hunt the junior hunt. He will learn a heck of a lot before he is allowed to hunt them on his own tags. I do look forward to him pulling the trigger. I am glad that he has a chance at them. Sept-Nov. What a blessing to have so much time and so many unique seasons. We all have reason to celebrate this fact.


https://i.postimg.cc/W48KNN50/407.jpg (https://postimg.cc/Z99jjStq)

https://i.postimg.cc/gJQPpc0N/417.jpg (https://postimg.cc/ZB8QFSpd)upload a photo online (https://postimages.org/)
And there you go! Taking them out, spending time with them and teaching them their whole life is what it's all about because it's a lifestyle. I'ts not just Sept 10 - Dec 10. It's not just "I'll take them out for the youth season." It's taking every available minute to spend time with them and instilling proper values. By the time they are 10 years old, the only thing they haven't done is pull the trigger. Youth seasons have nothing to do with it.

[westcoaster]

Last year, Thanksgiving long weekend, on our way to my daughters doe draw.
Drove to beat hell, stopped for the night on our way to our destination, got up the next morning and looked out...

It was a legal buck and I had a tag. Little too far for my daughter to take a poke at it. There was also a main dirt road somewhere through the trees and I would have been shooting straight across it.
I also really didn't want to mess up her hunt.

With more negatives than positives, I let that guy go with the only shots fired being the ones from the camera.

Bringing up the road in the background and passing on this buck has made the kids more aware of their target and beyond.

https://i.postimg.cc/6QZP4Yw3/Deer1.jpg

[Nate]

I had my first, and last youth season this year as I am 17. I did get a buck, but I will openly admit I missed at another deer.

[northernbc]

Great picture

[northernbc]

And there you go! Taking them out, spending time with them and teaching them their whole life is what it's all about because it's a lifestyle. I'ts not just Sept 10 - Dec 10. It's not just "I'll take them out for the youth season." It's taking every available minute to spend time with them and instilling proper values. By the time they are 10 years old, the only thing they haven't done is pull the trigger. Youth seasons have nothing to do with it.great picture

[Good2bCanadian]

My son turns 10 in January.
Im super excited to help him learn how to hunt as best I can.
It wont be, blast the first thing we see.
I currently have a full freezer so we are not shy on venison right now.

He came with me this year on a trip and we got into a pack of howling wolves chasing some elk.
He heard the first howl and alerted me.
"Dad, you here that?"
I just happened to have the fox pro with me and we called the pack in with their howls getting louder and louder.
My boy and i hid behind an enbankment with my 22-250 in hand. We scanned the timber edge in hopes one would show, and break cover, but they did not.
"What do you think of that son?"
"Wow dad, that was intense."

Looking forward to teaching my little man the best I can.
I promised him, id get him a shoulder mount for his very first, so I wanna make it count the best we can.

[IslandWanderer]

Am I correct in thinking that the youth season is also open to those with a youth license and using the supervising parent's tags? That is to say, they haven't passed the core and don't have their full license yet.

[j270wsm]

You are correct

[Imdone]

Great way to get youth interested and involved.

That said, lots bitch that it's not youth doing a lot of the harvest. That's sad if true.

But ...... That's where we need more COs afield to catch prick poachers shooting on youth only season when they lawfully can't.
This needs to be policed more. But what doesn't.

[mauserman]

How about this. How hard would it be that once the little guy/gal has bagged their first buck in youth season, however many years it takes, then they've fulfilled our communal wish that they get their first deer and now they can join the rest of us in looking for four points until October (I'm in Region 8 ). When the CO pulls people over he already knows everything about everyone with his computer. He looks up little junior's name, ahh, junior got their youth buck 2 years ago, no more youth season for junior. Done. I don't think the youth season is intended for dad (and the youth) to fill his freezer every year with easy young mulies for 7 years per kid.... just my two cents

[HighCountryBC]

How about this. When the CO pulls people over he already knows everything about everyone with his computer. And that's good. How hard would it be that once the little guy/gal has bagged their first buck in youth season, however many years it takes, then they've fulfilled our wish that they get their first deer and now they can join the rest of us in looking for four points until October. I don't think the youth season is intended for dad (and the youth) to fill his freezer every year with easy young mulies for 7 years per kid.... just my two cents

Pretty silly take.

Youth harvest is minimal in the grand scheme of things and we need as many youth involved in the sport as possible. They have very limited time between going back to school, sports etc. A month long youth season is peanuts in the big picture. Very few will get out for more than a handful of days.

[mauserman]

It's not peanuts and is a really long open season when we are trying to reduce the pressure on mule deer. I know guys who kill small mule deer every year with their kids before Oct 1. I brought up 3 kids, 2 of them hunters and hockey players and super active so I think I get it. They each got a spike on their first try, but every year after it was four points only until Oct 1.... It teaches kids that maybe taking the first buck they see isn't always the best bet in the long run. Didn't work with my boys - blammo on the first one! Very few adults get out more than a handful of days in September - and we're looking for four points. Won't hurt the youth a bit - as long as they get out there!!

[Elkhound]

I see more adults taking deer with crossbows in Sept than I do youth hunters taking deer with rifles.


Edited my original post for clarity

[HighCountryBC]

It's not peanuts and is a really long open season when we are trying to reduce the pressure on mule deer. I know guys who kill small mule deer every year with their kids before Oct 1. I brought up 3 kids, 2 of them hunters and hockey players and super active so I think I get it. They each got a spike on their first try, but every year after it was four points only until Oct 1.... It teaches kids that maybe taking the first buck they see isn't always the best bet in the long run. Didn't work with my boys - blammo on the first one! Very few adults get out more than a handful of days in September - and we're looking for four points. Won't hurt the youth a bit - as long as they get out there!!

The harvest during youth season is a very small percentage of the overall harvest throughout the season. That data is readily available.

You're confusing your reasons for what you want your kids to harvest with the goal of the youth season. Whether they harvest the first spike they see or hold out for a bigger buck is irrelevant. The main thing is that the opportunity is there for them to harvest any buck from the 1st to the 30th with the limited amount of time they have.

[mike_b]

You lost me when you said you were "entitled" to bag a deer. Only thing you're entitled to is getting out of the house and getting into the bush. Nothin' more after that.....grow up

[The Hermit]

It won't happen 'blackford'...it's been hashed through before. I'm a bow hunter and can see
the writing on the wall in relation to crossbows being involved. I'm not saying that crossbows
shouldn't be included in the bow season, only that they are now so well developed that the high
end ones are as accurate as a rifle out to 100 yards in the right hands. Then consider that even
compound bows are much more accurate and capable out to ranges almost double to what they
were when the rules were changed to make special bow only seasons. Add these modern weapons
in with the youth season, especially now that that youth season is extended, and it doesn't take
a rocket scientist to realize the early deer slaughter isn't sustainable the way it is now. About the
only way I can see maintaining this 'special' season for both youth and archery is to make it 3 points
or better. We all know that during the first week or so in September the young bucks, spikes and
2 points, are very easy to find and kill, especially by road hunters. If not, it will not be long before
that season is eliminated, or like in some regions, all hunting with the use of a vehicle will not be
allowed before 10 am.


Hey Big Lew - Playing the devil's advocate here... Bow hunters kill very few of all the deer shot each year. The "deer slaughter" lays mostly at the feet of rifle hunters. Rifles with their big ol scopes and range finding binoculars, and wind measuring units are so much easier and accurate even out to 700 - 900 yards than your dad's old 30-30 right? Perhaps we should eliminate rifle hunting all together or at least in the rut to save a lot of deer?

Hey BlackFord - As for the kids, I'd be fine with reducing the youth season to a week hunting on their parent's tag, and I'd prefer that it happen in the rut rather than during bow only seasons, but thats just me. I have a 5 year old grandson that can hardly wait to go hunting with me and he will be starting out as a bowhunter on quail and rabbits until he is competent to handle himself for bigger game. Also, wondering what your take on FN's only being allowed to hunt with rifles in daylight during GOS? If you want to hold on to traditions why not use bow and arrow outside of the GOS? That would also save a lot of deer, moose, elk, etc. Cheers,

[Brez]

I was thinking on this just today and how about the government and ministries manage the resource for an adequate amount of animals and that would entice new (and older) hunters to get out there and have fun. I had no problem enjoying learning to hunt at the same times and on the same level playing fields as all the rest of the hunters of the day, and neither did my sons.


Pretty silly take.

Youth harvest is minimal in the grand scheme of things and we need as many youth involved in the sport as possible. They have very limited time between going back to school, sports etc. A month long youth season is peanuts in the big picture. Very few will get out for more than a handful of days.

[Steeleco]

Am I correct in thinking that the youth season is also open to those with a youth license and using the supervising parent's tags? That is to say, they haven't passed the core and don't have their full license yet.

Actually before your question got into a debate about this topic as it always does and always will, it was answered incorrect. Kind of!! It's for youth under the age of 18 core or no core that are in the company of an experienced hunter (iirc 2 full years with a said core?) The reason a kid with core cannot hunt alone has lots to do with the PAL. They cannot get a full PAL until age 18 thus cannot pack a rifle alone in the woods. The youth hunt used to be 16 when my son took full use of it, but was changed some years back to align itself with the PAL rules. Now I'm not sure if a youth hunter can hunt bow unaccompanied?

[sillybear]

It is a sad state of affairs when a parent has to use his kid to kill a dear early.
What have you taught your child? After 56 years of hunting just about all game this great province has to offer,
the biggest thrill of my hunting career has yet to come. When my Grandson shoots his first buck it will be the
highlite of my hunting career. I look forward to when he turns 10 and his first youth season!!!

[IronNoggin]

Hey Big Lew - Playing the devil's advocate here... Bow hunters kill very few of all the deer shot each year.

While I do agree with your point, I feel obligated to remind you that Dave (aka Big Lew) passed away on May 30th of this year. Prior to doing so, he had purchased an Excalibur crossbow that I helped him locate, and was planning on hunting with it. The same as what I do each and every year...

Nog

[j270wsm]

It is a sad state of affairs when a parent has to use his kid to kill a dear early.
What have you taught your child? After 56 years of hunting just about all game this great province has to offer,
the biggest thrill of my hunting career has yet to come. When my Grandson shoots his first buck it will be the
highlite of my hunting career. I look forward to when he turns 10 and his first youth season!!!

When my son was 10 he filled 4 tags…..black bear, cow elk, goat and white tail doe. 4 of the most memorable hunts I’ve ever been on.

[ratherbefishin]

I love taking kids out,bought pink ‘cricket’single shot 22s for young ladies...light, right size and good triggers.They all moved up and shot their first deer the next year..getting kids into shooting spirts and especially girls is what it going to counteract the politically correct anti gun bunch