Have to buy Tahltan tags next year?

[ElectricDyck]

Heard some rumours this is coming for anyone hunting in their territory..apparently the outfits already bought them this year? Official word is you wont need to buy them but if you dont to but dont leave your stuff unattended..

Rumors or fact?

[walks with deer]

do you know where i could get a chilicotin tag?

[walks with deer]

do you know where i could get a chilicotin tag?

sorry meant tng..
hoe many am i allowed

[Jagermeister]

do you know where i could get a chilicotin tag?

sorry meant tng..
hoe many am i allowed
just declare your aboriginal and you are go to go.

[dakoda62]

I see the opportunity for a startup security business. lol

[cdub]

So we buy our legal license and tag from the Gov then pay the extortion fee (tag) from the band to pay for protection in the bush. Sounds like organized crime to me.

[Bunner]

That's a load of of BS! How much are they asking for these supposed tags?

[walks with deer]

how many tng tags can we get...?

[bearvalley]

Heard some rumours this is coming for anyone hunting in their territory..apparently the outfits already bought them this year? Official word is you wont need to buy them but if you dont to but dont leave your stuff unattended..

Rumors or fact?

Its a fact that clients of outfitters are being issued Tahltan territory hunting licenses as of this year.
Next year there will be royalties paid.

The Tahltans are stepping up to the plate on managing wildlife within their territory thru wildlife studies/projects, wildlife guardians and a wildlife manager.....it takes money to fund these initiatives.

As for the official word that residents need to buy a Tahltan hunting license .....?????
I do know the BCWF was working on an MOU between them and the TCG last spring....maybe a phone call to them will clarify as to resident hunters buying these licenses in the future.

The money generated will be going back into wildlife and not just disappear into general revenue as our provincial government does with the license fees and royalties they collect.

[porthunter]

Why should the Tahltan receive any royalties? if there is some sort of royalty charge, why not give them to a conservation group that is knowingly putting the money in the right places.

Setting up blockades to keep out resident hunters from doing what is there right does not make the tahltan guardians or wildlife managers, it makes them bullies in numbers. I havent personally done any homework on the fact they do wildlife studies, but would be very happy to see these studies/projects, is that something that is available to general public? Because if it is and it makes sense, maybe I would have no problem supporting that, but I need to see where my money is going and that results are being produced.

Now, I'm not saying the BCWF or any other conservation group should be charging a fee on top of what we already pay, because that isnt right. But if some sort of thing arised, I would much rather see the money go to a group that is going to put the money in the right place AND show proof of that. Not a group that is stopping resident hunters from filling there freezers and to the best of my knowledge not producing any science based facts on wildlife management.

I have hunted Tahltan territory 3 of the last 4 years. Never have I ran into issues, but for some reason this year, when in stores or gas stations wearing my camo as a clear hunter, I certainly didn't feel very welcome by all.

[ElectricDyck]

Its a fact that clients of outfitters are being issued Tahltan territory hunting licenses as of this year.
Next year there will be royalties paid.

The Tahltans are stepping up to the plate on managing wildlife within their territory thru wildlife studies/projects, wildlife guardians and a wildlife manger.....it takes money to fund these initiatives.

As for the official word that residents need to buy a Tahltan hunting license .....?????
I do know the BCWF was working on an MOU between them and the TCG last spring....maybe a phone call to them will clarify as to resident hunters buying these licenses in the future.

The money generated will be going back into wildlife and not just disappear into general revenue as our provincial government does with the license fees and royalties they collect.

I've cancelled hunts because of their illegal blockades..I think they will have a hard time convincing hunters to give them money to manage wildlife after restricting access and fighting to shut down the resident hunt..

"I do know the BCWF was working on an MOU between them and the TCG last spring"

Forgive my ignorance, whats a MOU and whos the TCG?

[Frank grimes]

Are they going to sell cow and calf tags? Or keep them all for their own slaughter?

[mooseknuckler]

MOU memorandum of understanding
TCG Tahltan central government
......those are my guesses....

[Steeleco]

Fact or fiction this thread WILL NOT turn into another racially motivated one. Clear?

[Wild one]

Fact or fiction this thread WILL NOT turn into another radially motivated one. Clear?

Ok but are we good to correct you spelling lol

[russm]

Ok but are we good to correct you spelling lol

Correct YOUR spelling lol

[Wild one]

Correct YOUR spelling lol

Well that backfired lol

[REMINGTON JIM]

will ONLY be WORST by NEXT year when the Indians are COMPLETELY running the F&W of BC :icon_frow RJ

[russm]

Well that backfired lol

Lol, that’s something that’d happen to me :p

[303savage]

Why is our governments letting them get away with extortion ?

[ElectricDyck]

Fact or fiction this thread WILL NOT turn into another radially motivated one. Clear?

Clear!!!!!!

[buckerup]

All outdoorsmen and women of bc carry on with your traditions as you are just as entitled to do so as any other citizens. If you’ve finally got the draw you've always wanted then go and make that hunt happen. If you come across road blocks or aggression from anyone or from any group or ethnic background that is preventing you and your group from going on a legal and ethical hunt then move forward and don’t take any shit. Please Don’t endager yourself but this fear mongering and intimidation has got to be called out and please persue your legal hunt. What’s going on is as we all know total bs. If limitations and restrictions are to be made or recommended to be implemented for preserving of game let it be for all, not just bc resident hunters to absorb. I’m sure we can all agree that we know or are related to people that once lived off the land and sea. Seems pretty strange that some that never have are considered 1st nation and have entitlement and unlimited access to continue with that lifestyle while others that have been tax paying citizens of this country for their whole lives are turned around at ilegal roadblocks and other situations. Don’t give in or give up. There’s way too much on the line. proguide66 for premier next time around. ��������

[HappyJack]

That's a load of of BS! How much are they asking for these supposed tags?

$500 for bull moose, $250 for deer and black bear. At least that is what we heard.

[REMINGTON JIM]

Why is our governments letting them get away with extortion ?

The Green Party and the NDP are all IN on it ! They WANT it to Happen - They want the Indians to take over all the F&W stuff ! :sad: RJ

[HappyJack]

Anyone hear if they would be issuing migratory and grouse tags too? Or is that just more bar room babble?

[bearvalley]

Why should the Tahltan receive any royalties? if there is some sort of royalty charge, why not give them to a conservation group that is knowingly putting the money in the right places.


Here’s a question......how much money has been put into wildlife projects within Tahltan territory before the TCG and other stakeholders initiated the current roundtable form of decision making that is taking place within the northwest?

What conservation group provided the funding?

[bearvalley]

Anyone hear if they would be issuing migratory and grouse tags too? Or is that just more bar room babble?
Just babble.

[finngun]

happyj..$500 for bull moose, $250 for deer :roll:wholly brick port alberni ya can buy deer 100@ $ from some 'land keepers' and ya don't have to go hunting at all..just phone call..maybe home delivery too? that's rip off..8-)

[bearvalley]

happyj..$500 for bull moose, $250 for deer :roll:wholly brick port alberni ya can buy deer 100@ $ from some 'land keepers' and ya don't have to go hunting at all..just phone call..maybe home delivery too? that's rip off..8-)

His $500 for bull moose & $250 for deer is just more babble!

[gutpile]

If the Indians can get away with this in BC, then this will spread to other provinces

[Wild one]

If the Indians can get away with this in BC, then this will spread to other provinces

Probably Not BC is extra special when it comes to treaty issues

[Steeleco]

Ok but are we good to correct you spelling lol Yes and thanks!. Don't get me wrong, the direction this government both provincial and federal is going isn't looking good for us. But the place to vent isn't here on HBC it's at meetings with MLA's and MP's. I went to both Kelowna and stood on the lawn in Victoria to be vocal against the wrong doings the former government were doing. It's time these days were planned again, but sadly at this point it's all hear say. Until there is factual documentation we have only the spoken word to go off. Thus going off on rants on HBC only shines a bad light on us all. I've met many HBC members and near all have been great people.

I myself don't know who to be pissed at most? The natives for doing it? The government for letting them? Or the rest of us for voting these ass hats into power?

[REMINGTON JIM]

Steelco says : I myself don't know who to be pissed at most? The natives for doing it? The government for letting them? Or the rest of us for voting these ass hats into power?


ALL of the above ! :evil: RJ

[ElectricDyck]

I find it hard not to be pessimistic when it comes to interactions with first nations. Whatever happens now wont matter because thenext generation (my kids) are being taught that indians were better than europeans, lived at peace and nothing went to waste and europeans wrecked that. They even go on a field trip and listen to an indian spiritual leader talk about how the rocks are alive and you can speak to them....
At first when i spoke about the native history they dont speak about like the haida having slaves, buffalo run off cliffs with the majority left to rot and burning kitchen cabinet doors for wood because they knew the government would replace them they didnt believe me...the next generation will be brainwashed and give everything away out of guilt.

[BgBlkDg]

It IS changing and an incident of a decent, white citizen being killed at one of these blockades might precipitate a major conflict which will be won by the majority...........

[bearvalley]

Yes and thanks!. Don't get me wrong, the direction this government both provincial and federal is going isn't looking good for us. But the place to vent isn't here on HBC it's at meetings with MLA's and MP's. I went to both Kelowna and stood on the lawn in Victoria to be vocal against the wrong doings the former government were doing. It's time these days were planned again, but sadly at this point it's all hear say. Until there is factual documentation we have only the spoken word to go off. Thus going off on rants on HBC only shines a bad light on us all. I've met many HBC members and near all have been great people.

I myself don't know who to be pissed at most? The natives for doing it? The government for letting them? Or the rest of us for voting these ass hats into power?

Steeleco, what’s worked in the past hasn’t worked and rallying the troops once more to get more of what is fast disappearing is pointless.
Some of the organizers of the Kelowna & Victoria rallies are friends of mine and they fully realize those rallies did nothing to enhance wildlife or hunting...they were attention getters...done to circle the wagons and bring in the troops.
Those rallies actually backfired.
One group gained membership...the other got a black eye and the strength and public support for all hunters got kicked in the nuts.

Some of us have realized that the only way to curb this type of public backlash happening again is to build unity between groups that have stayed distant.

The Tahltans have not forced anyone into the licensing system....it has been voluntary.
The TCG has not had any recent road blockades...the ones in the past were mostly under the guidance of a few elders and a couple were instigated by Suzuki’s grandson and a few of his hippie buddies.

We all seem to forget as we are fighting amongst ourselves that FN’s are major players in the wildlife arena....under the Canadian constitution they are entitled ( I hate that word ) to the first 50% of harvestable game.

Look at the big picture...if the funds collected go into projects such as wildlife health studies, predator management and FN’s education on wildlife issues...can it be a real fail.
Up until a couple years ago zero dollars had been invested in wildlife projects within Tahltan territory ....since then close to 750 K has been invested.
Lets not bash a new concept in management before it gets a fair trial....carrying on down the old path sure hasn’t worked.

[westcoaster]

It IS changing and an incident of a decent, white citizen being killed at one of these blockades might precipitate a major conflict which will be won by the majority...........


You volunteering to be killed?

[bearvalley]

It IS changing and an incident of a decent, white citizen being killed at one of these blockades might precipitate a major conflict which will be won by the majority...........

Dewey, come on up and I’ll introduce you to some of the TCG members and you can discuss wildlife issues and life in general.
After, you can decide if a civil war with a bunch of people you don’t know is really warranted.

[Buck]

So 50% to how many Thaltans? 25% Outfitter quota roughly depending on species to a few oufitters and clients and 25% to 90,000 residents hunters the future so bright i gota wear shades.

[bearvalley]

So 50% to how many Thaltans? 25% Outfitter quota roughly depending on species to a few oufitters and clients and 25% to 90,000 residents hunters the future so bright i gota wear shades.

I’d say your not real good at math or someone’s feeding you numbers.

[Buck]

I’d say your not real good at math or someone’s feeding you numbers.

Well fill us in ?

[Goose]

So are the CO's working for the FN govt now? Or how is enforcement going to work?
We already pay for the CO's out of the govt coffers, and we pay for our licences.....now we have to pay even more?
This is turning into the US model of pay for private fenced land

[Mulehahn]

Bearvalley, serious question. Do you honestly believe they would stick to the 50%? If so then lets have a proper survey done, find out the total allowable harvest and give them 50% of the tags for free. That is all they are allowed. They can fill them however or whenever they choose. But they can never go over or they will be charged. Do you honestly believe they would accept that?

I know quite a few people up there as well and (unless things have changed dramatically for the better in last 2 years since I was up there) they would never stand for it. No doubt the vast majority would stay within that quota, but there are a few that do shoot anything and everything they can. The same as in any group with the difference being the Talhtan will never alliw there members to be charged. They will handle it in house. The problem being those that do such things are already on the outskirts of their society and do not care about the punishment they will recieve.

Give them 50% of the tags and any member who exceeds it will face the same consequences as you or I and almost no hunter would object.

[bearvalley]

Well fill us in ?
Buck, I’m not about to waste my time trying to educate a fed puppet that already knows that the allocated percentages under LEH are not true harvest percentages.
That lie, the battle it instigated and the division it created was our biggest downfall.
Enough said.

[bearvalley]

Bearvalley, serious question. Do you honestly believe they would stick to the 50%? If so then lets have a proper survey done, find out the total allowable harvest and give them 50% of the tags for free. That is all they are allowed. They can fill them however or whenever they choose. But they can never go over or they will be charged. Do you honestly believe they would accept that?

I know quite a few people up there as well and (unless things have changed dramatically for the better in last 2 years since I was up there) they would never stand for it. No doubt the vast majority would stay within that quota, but there are a few that do shoot anything and everything they can. The same as in any group with the difference being the Talhtan will never alliw there members to be charged. They will handle it in house. The problem being those that do such things are already on the outskirts of their society and do not care about the punishment they will recieve.

Give them 50% of the tags and any member who exceeds it will face the same consequences as you or I and almost no hunter would object.
Mulehahn, let’s hope this leads to accountability.
Honest question and points you’ve made.
The real question is “are the Tahltans harvesting their 50% at present...we don’t know that answer but when it comes it might be surprising.

[bearvalley]

So are the CO's working for the FN govt now? Or how is enforcement going to work?
We already pay for the CO's out of the govt coffers, and we pay for our licences.....now we have to pay even more?
This is turning into the US model of pay for private fenced land

The CO’s are working with the wildlife guardians...they don’t seem to have an issue with the concept.

[Pemby_mess]

The CO’s are working with the wildlife guardians...they don’t seem to have an issue with the concept.

Again, can't the Nisga'a treaty be used to predict what the arrangement with the Taltan might look like? DFO works with the nisga'a government fisheries management. I was fishing the Nass a few years ago, and had numerous interaction with both DFO and the Nisga'a authorities themselves. It all seemed to fit together fairly flush. I assume the Nisga'a have some sort of similar arrangement between the provincial COs. Anybody have experience hunting in the Nass valley?

[limit time]

Its a fact that clients of outfitters are being issued Tahltan territory hunting licenses as of this year.
Next year there will be royalties paid.

The Tahltans are stepping up to the plate on managing wildlife within their territory thru wildlife studies/projects, wildlife guardians and a wildlife manager.....it takes money to fund these initiatives.

As for the official word that residents need to buy a Tahltan hunting license .....?????
I do know the BCWF was working on an MOU between them and the TCG last spring....maybe a phone call to them will clarify as to resident hunters buying these licenses in the future.

The money generated will be going back into wildlife and not just disappear into general revenue as our provincial government does with the license fees and royalties they collect.
So... it’s not really about numbers....

[S.W.A.T.]

Heard some rumours this is coming for anyone hunting in their territory..apparently the outfits already bought them this year? Official word is you wont need to buy them but if you dont to but dont leave your stuff unattended..

Rumors or fact?

The way I see it is my native fees are collected every year when I pay my taxes. If they want more the can get a flipping job

[Guller74]

I haven't read all the posts on this topic but i suspect they are they same as previous years...lots of ranting but zero action. If we want to make a difference then we need to be smarter. Start putting trail cams at your camps and film any blockades. Get the FN folks on camera if they are ransacking camps. The next step is to send the evidence in to major news outlets and start showing the evidence of their "peaceful" actions. Right now mainstream media is eating up this reconciliation BS with no care for what's really happening out there! Otherwise we just sound like a bunch of loose cannons.

[gcreek]

http://tahltan.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/2018-Wildlife-Newsletter-final-online.pdf

bearvalley asked me to post this for him.

[Goose]

Page 23 got my attention ....among loads of other BS thats heavily one-sided.
"• All main resident hunter access points are now covered underLEH or the specific GOS Seasons. It is expected the newregulations will deter hunters from these areas and dispersethem into more remote areas or have them hunting closer totheir home
• Early and late hunting seasons will not be attractive toresident hunters who have to travel, it will allow local huntersmore opportunities"

Challenge accepted

These new "regulations" will be sure not to create any conflict, or confusion....(sarcasm)

[bearvalley]

http://tahltan.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/2018-Wildlife-Newsletter-final-online.pdf

bearvalley asked me to post this for him.

Thanks for posting the newsletter gcreek.

[BromBones]

The Tahltan tags are being issued to guided clients only. It's an understanding between TCG and Tahltan Guide Outfitters Association. There has been no mention of applying the tags to resident hunters and as far as I know, nothing like that is planned either. If they can rake a few more $$ out of non-residents and put it back into management, fly at 'er.

The LEH and area restrictions for resident hunters are frustrating, but it should end the chance of blockades in the region. There is still plenty of opportunity to hunt the area, you just have to sift through the regs a little more carefully and put some more details in planning a hunt. Frustrating as I said, as were the calls to stop hunting after the forest fires this year, but there are worse alternatives that are happening elsewhere in the province.

One thing to keep in mind, the Tahltan are extremely opposed to the grizzly hunt ban which is great. We should be backing them on it 100% as they push back against the decision, it's probably the only way to get some traction on it.

[Jimbob]

The Tahltan tags are being issued to guided clients only. It's an understanding between TCG and Tahltan Guide Outfitters Association. There has been no mention of applying the tags to resident hunters and as far as I know, nothing like that is planned either. If they can rake a few more $$ out of non-residents and put it back into management, fly at 'er.

The LEH and area restrictions for resident hunters are frustrating, but it should end the chance of blockades in the region. There is still plenty of opportunity to hunt the area, you just have to sift through the regs a little more carefully and put some more details in planning a hunt. Frustrating as I said, as were the calls to stop hunting after the forest fires this year, but there are worse alternatives that are happening elsewhere in the province.

One thing to keep in mind, the Tahltan are extremely opposed to the grizzly hunt ban which is great. We should be backing them on it 100% as they push back against the decision, it's probably the only way to get some traction on it.

Smart to look at things with a level head. Working with FN's is a reality of the future. Supporting them in the fight to get grizzly bear hunting open in their area is a great idea. Here is a FN that is publically declaring they want a hunting season for resident hunters in their area, we would be idiots not to join with that.

[two-feet]

Smart to look at things with a level head. Working with FN's is a reality of the future. Supporting them in the fight to get grizzly bear hunting open in their area is a great idea. Here is a FN that is publically declaring they want a hunting season for resident hunters in their area, we would be idiots not to join with that.
Yup, times are a changin, this model MAY be the best deal we resident hunters get offered. And we are alligned with the Tahltan on predator management. There is only one clear point in all this to me: either work with the FN or get what the pandering, nutless govt gives us.

[BgBlkDg]

The OTHER and most appropriate alternative is to elect a government that supports we BC citizens and will CRUSH ANY aboriginal bullsh*t with serious military force.

Time to p*ss or get off the pot!

[Rackmastr]

The OTHER and most appropriate alternative is to elect a government that supports we BC citizens and will CRUSH ANY aboriginal bullsh*t with serious military force.

Time to p*ss or get off the pot!

Haha, can always be counted on for a good 'appropriate alternative' from our resident BgBlkDg....:lol:

[Wild one]

The OTHER and most appropriate alternative is to elect a government that supports we BC citizens and will CRUSH ANY aboriginal bullsh*t with serious military force.

Time to p*ss or get off the pot!

And what party would that be?

[okas]

will ONLY be WORST by NEXT year when the Indians are COMPLETELY running the F&W of BC :icon_frow RJ sounds like they are already

[okas]

The OTHER and most appropriate alternative is to elect a government that supports we BC citizens and will CRUSH ANY aboriginal bullsh*t with serious military force.

Time to p*ss or get off the pot! ha ha they are having lots of babies and soon will take the vote

[BgBlkDg]

And what party would that be?

How about a resurrection of the Reform Party or something of that sort?