Wolves...Region 8

[scoutlt1]

Just came back from a few days roaming around in 8-6 and 8-8.

Didn't see any deer (was mostly road hunting so understandable), but lots of sign. Deer, Moose, Bear tracks all over the place. Managed to bag a bunch of grouse, and came across a nice bull moose and cow.

What surprised me most was the amount of Wolf sign that I saw. I've covered lots of ground and spent quite a bit of time in that area and have never seen that many tracks.
I took a pic of one track on the road that was more than twice the length of a .30-30 round. Over 5"....




I had a nice dream about Miley last night at least..... :)

[sumonda]

Just got back from 3 days in 8-7.. never saw a single deer!, did see some Deer and moose sign and heard the Wolves on Sunday going crazy over something.

[338win mag]

Shoot every wolf you see.

[BgBlkDg]

Damn right, Coyotes too and do it year round where you can.

[scoutlt1]

Shoot every wolf you see. Absolutely!!!

[scoutlt1]

Damn right, Coyotes too and do it year round where you can.

For sure! We also saw one very fat coyote that was hanging around a bunch of cattle. Couldn't shoot because we were right next to 5A (unfortunately).....

[Ourea]

Just came back from a few days roaming around in 8-6 and 8-8.

Didn't see any deer (was mostly road hunting so understandable), but lots of sign. Deer, Moose, Bear tracks all over the place. Managed to bag a bunch of grouse, and came across a nice bull moose and cow.

What surprised me most was the amount of Wolf sign that I saw. I've covered lots of ground and spent quite a bit of time in that area and have never seen that many tracks.
I took a pic of one track on the road that was more than twice the length of a .30-30 round. Over 5"....




I had a nice dream about Miley last night at least..... :)

Same on the other side of the Okanagan
8-1, 8-9, 8-12.
Surprising how close they are getting to town.

[islandhunter]

I heard them howling not far up red creek not long ago. The deer seem to be disappearing to.......coincidence???

[Stone Sheep Steve]

Same on the other side of the Okanagan
8-1, 8-9, 8-12.
Surprising how close they are getting to town.

And 8-11 up by Terrace mtn

[one-shot-wonder]

Howard Lake, Greyback, Canyon Lakes....all polluted with large dog tracks. I would post pics of the large track I ran into when firewood hunting but I heard photobucket has called in ghey.

Less and less deer/moose posts on here and more and more wolf whining, the same to continue if sportsman don't start dealing with the predators year round.....

[horshur]

Yeh whatever...just don't want anyone hunting there eh?... I feel your pain.
damn sure this is cyclical.Local history references suggest the last big fires years were in mid 20s to mid 30s...lots of reference to wolves in this time period as well. Read Patterson's bio..it will turn.

[Ourea]

Yeh whatever...just don't want anyone hunting there eh?... I feel your pain.
damn sure this is cyclical.Local history references suggest the last big fires years were in mid 20s to mid 30s...lots of reference to wolves in this time period as well. Read Patterson's bio..it will turn.

Landscape has changed dramatically since that era.
Only a fraction of winter range now.
Habitat fragmentation from forest practices, add 10's of thousands of km's of FSRs that are wolf hiways.
The game is very different now.

[338win mag]

What is also different, is the "save the wolves" mentality of people today as compared to a time long ago, not to many "hippies" back then.
Wolves were already killing everything in sight in region 8 before a season was implemented, too little to late imo, and there should be a bounty offered as an added incentive.

[bang flop]

I hunt to the north of you in reg 8. Took a couple pot shots at a pack of wolves on the river. Musta hit one as we could hear it howling for hours after.

Pack was at least 8 or better. Never seen or heard wolves in the area untill this year, been hunting area for 10 years.

Saw an average of 2 does per day... never seen so few deer. Partly attributed low deer sighting to the dry fall.

Game cams are showing cats, in groups up to 4, griz in groups up to 3, multiple yotes, and wolves frequently picked up. See more preds than deer... scary.

[Whonnock Boy]

This morning in region 3 I called in a pack of 5 or 6, knocked one down, and out the hurt on another. More wolf track than deer track.....

[gcreek]

Gee, LBM told me I was pretty well alone with the high wolf population. For that matter GoatGuy told me the same thing 5or 6 years ago.

You guys should be careful, with your anecdotal evidence, the experts don't like hearing it....

lol

[HarryToolips]

I fortunately have seen quite a few deer in reg 3/8 lately, and not alot of pred sign...but I know the wolf pops around here is increasing..will be trying pred calls this winter...has anyone had any luck at last light getting them, or usually just first light??

[one-shot-wonder]

I fortunately have seen quite a few deer in reg 3/8 lately, and not alot of pred sign...but I know the wolf pops around here is increasing..will be trying pred calls this winter...has anyone had any luck at last light getting them, or usually just first light??

If I had to guess I would say you spend most of your time hunting on the westside of OK Lake? Based on anecdotes, I would submit there are more wolves on the east side of OKanagan than west.

[ursus]

On my way to the coast last Monday morning saw a big dead one grey and black just east of Sunset exit on the connector. There is a lot around!

[TexasWalker]

This morning in region 3 I called in a pack of 5 or 6, knocked one down, and out the hurt on another. More wolf track than deer track.....

Where abouts?
I'm very interested in shooting wolves in region 3.

[LBM]

Gee, LBM told me I was pretty well alone with the high wolf population. For that matter GoatGuy told me the same thing 5or 6 years ago.

You guys should be careful, with your anecdotal evidence, the experts don't like hearing it....

lol

Interesting were was this said. Seems like the you and some you associate with like to make stuff up.

[Ourea]

Region 8 has the highest FSR density in the province and only getting worse.
Oddly, I see my majority of wolf tracks on roads.
As the roads increase and the timber decreases....... think you get the picture
Now read this.

"Wolves, which are a major predator, can travel up to four times faster on roads, and that makes their hunting way more efficient than under natural conditions," explained Scott McNay, the wildlife biologist in charge of the restoration program.

https://i.imgur.com/z1byjty.jpg

[IronNoggin]

... the same to continue if sportsman don't start dealing with the predators year round.....

You (and us all) will actually have to convince the government to get onside to make any significant difference.
Current studies well show that indiscriminate shooting and removals of one or two critical pack members will result in a near immediate upsurge of wolf populations.
"Sportsmen" who do this shooting may "feel better" by taking the odd one out, but in the vast majority of situations, they are actually contributing to the problem they think they are dealing with. Removal rates by this sector are FAR too sporadic, and FAR too low to make any difference whatsoever in the overall picture.

What is required is a dedicated team of very experienced killers using air support, combined with experienced trappers completely focused on the removal of entire packs. Only then will we see the numbers start to fall. The only real alternative is to await the eventual crash of prey species, and the resulting fall of their predators as a consequence. :(

I wish this were not true, but sadly it is.
And I wish that I thought we could convince government to pay attention, but again sadly I do not...

Grim state of affairs...
Nog

[DarekG]

I've only been hunting since 2013 so it may not count for much, but this year by far is the most wolf infested year I've ever seen.
Every single time I've gone hunting I've found wolf tracks, or shit, or heard them howling, or even seen them. Haven't had a chance to take any down though.

[one-shot-wonder]

You (and us all) will actually have to convince the government..

Grim state of affairs...
Nog

Agreed, i know the science behind wolf removal... All predators includes cats of all shapes and bears or all kinds

[horshur]

Region 8 has the highest FSR density in the province and only getting worse.
Oddly, I see my majority of wolf tracks on roads.
As the roads increase and the timber decreases....... think you get the picture
Now read this.

"Wolves, which are a major predator, can travel up to four times faster on roads, and that makes their hunting way more efficient than under natural conditions," explained Scott McNay, the wildlife biologist in charge of the restoration program.

https://i.imgur.com/z1byjty.jpg




what do you think the hunting was like in 1935? With the Wolves..and the Great Depression. Was it worse then now or better?..

[Ohwildwon]

You (and us all) will actually have to convince the government to get onside to make any significant difference.
Current studies well show that indiscriminate shooting and removals of one or two critical pack members will result in a near immediate upsurge of wolf populations.
"Sportsmen" who do this shooting may "feel better" by taking the odd one out, but in the vast majority of situations, they are actually contributing to the problem they think they are dealing with. Removal rates by this sector are FAR too sporadic, and FAR too low to make any difference whatsoever in the overall picture.

What is required is a dedicated team of very experienced killers using air support, combined with experienced trappers completely focused on the removal of entire packs. Only then will we see the numbers start to fall. The only real alternative is to await the eventual crash of prey species, and the resulting fall of their predators as a consequence. :(

I wish this were not true, but sadly it is.
And I wish that I thought we could convince government to pay attention, but again sadly I do not...

Grim state of affairs...
Nog

I believe this is true, but only if you take out the Alpha male or female?

If its one of the subordinates the pack will not split up...

Perhaps a rather pathetic dent in the grand scheme of things, at least it might help to keep the fear of humans in their behavior?...

[Walking Buffalo]

I believe this is true, but only if you take out the Alpha male or female?

If its one of the subordinates the pack will not split up...

Perhaps a rather pathetic dent in the grand scheme of things, at least it might help to keep the fear of humans in their behavior?...

There is "science" saying the the pack will always split and become more productive, and there is science saying that this scenario may or may not happen. Other research shows cases where removal of the Alpha pair results in the whole pack dissolving from infighting/chaos.

Be very suspicious of research that states a species will act only in a certain way. There will often be a bias involved.

[Monashee]

yeah wolves make good time on roads http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/north/driving-with-wolves-on-an-n-w-t-highway-1.4024425

[IronNoggin]

Be very suspicious of research that states a species will act only in a certain way. There will often be a bias involved.

LOL! You probably already know some of the who's I do involved with wolf studies.
And while I do see a little bias from time to time, it's not at all what many might think. :-D
Some of the absolute best intel comes from those who are Hell, I lived there mentality.
And you also likely know I gun them every single chance I get... 8-)

Cheers,
Nog

[LBM]

Region 8 has the highest FSR density in the province and only getting worse.
Oddly, I see my majority of wolf tracks on roads.
As the roads increase and the timber decreases....... think you get the picture
Now read this.

"Wolves, which are a major predator, can travel up to four times faster on roads, and that makes their hunting way more efficient than under natural conditions," explained Scott McNay, the wildlife biologist in charge of the restoration program.

https://i.imgur.com/z1byjty.jpg




So whos to blame the humans building all the roads making it easier for the wolves or the wolves killing the animals.

[Ohwildwon]

There is "science" saying the the pack will always split and become more productive, and there is science saying that this scenario may or may not happen. Other research shows cases where removal of the Alpha pair results in the whole pack dissolving from infighting/chaos.

Be very suspicious of research that states a species will act only in a certain way. There will often be a bias involved.

So back it up with some science or its fake news, right?:razz:

#jasmine

[338win mag]

I wont be checking any nutsacks for the Alpha wolf thing, just start shooting.

[Whonnock Boy]

Going to ask my boy if he wants to head out for poke first, he's pretty keen, then I'll send you some intel.


Where abouts?
I'm very interested in shooting wolves in region 3.

[Bugle M In]

I have always seen that wolves like the roads, so yes, in my opinion, the more roads, the worse the #'s can become.
I also think, and this is just my opinion, but ever since the pine beetle really started to show it's effects and real potential for destruction, and the logging Co's started to literally cut anything that was still green, before the beetle
got to it, that wolves have exploded in #'s because of that.....
Basically, when the snow gets deep enough, which happens faster in open clear cuts, rather then under the tree canopied areas (unlogged), that the wolves become very efficient at killing.
Ever watch a pack of wolves take down a healthy elk?....that elk steps into one snowdrift, that is a little deeper with snow then rest, and they get tripped up real quick, and that's it...the wolves have that animal down in seconds!
I think because of all the logging we've done the last 15 - 20 years now, and at a high rate because of the beetle,
has led to the wolves increase in population, because it has even given them a larger advantage when hunting their
prey now.....that's what my eyes are telling me anyways...
As for the roads, yes, the wolves like them a lot for traveling, but in my opinion, if it was "only" the fact that we had more roads in the back country, we may not be seeing the high wolf #'s we do now.
I really do think it is the open landscape that we have created, and especially during the winter months, that has led to the wolves increase.
Either way, yes, I do think man was responsible for that.
And no matter what we recreational weekend hunters do to help remove wolves, I doubt we will put a dent into the #'s and like others say, possibly just make it worse.
So, we either let the wolves hammer all the game, until they are gone, and thus, they the wolves eat themselves out
of house and home, which I question how many years that will take....or..
the ministry really has to do something about it.
Sadly though, I think this government would rather see the wolves perish naturally, and instead, take away opportunities for us, and tell everyone else that they are doing this to ensure that ungulate #'s increase to everyone else.
If we had doubts in the past that the ministry was going to set a policy that would help remove wolves with the former government, we can feel pretty assured that this ministry now, under the new regime, will doing nothing at all....at least not what we were hoping!
We won't be wondering where the deer are...
We will be wondering where we will still be allowed to hunt.

[Ourea]

So whos to blame the humans building all the roads making it easier for the wolves or the wolves killing the animals.

Roads aren't going anywhere.....

[Linksman313]

Just chiming in from 8-14, 8-15, found much smaller WT and grouse density noted in the areas I hunt in these regions. Last year on last evening of season (Nov) was hunting northeast corner of 8-15 and saw nothing but Wolf trails everywhere. Got them howling as the sun went down. This year first spring thaw went back to shed hunt and observed more of the same (dense track), this season can't find a single deer hair in same habitat that was successful for years. Suspect deep snowpack/cold temps and predators are the high percentage cause IMO.

[Stone Sheep Steve]

I have no doubt that roads increase the predation efficiency by wolves ...but they are still efficient predators away from human influence.
Look no further than the thread on wolves in the Tuchodi. No roads...no logging....no oil and gas development.

SSS

[Ourea]

I have no doubt that roads increase the predation efficiency by wolves ...but they are still efficient predators away from human influence.
Look no further than the thread on wolves in the Tuchodi. No roads...no logging....no oil and gas development.

SSS

Or my thread "Death of a Valley".

http://www.huntingbc.ca/forum/showthread.php?100008-Death-Of-A-Valley

Zero access yet took a thriving elk herd and cleaned them out.

There is Way more to the wolf explosion than simple "cycles".

Another reason to support a sustainable science based funding model.
With money and more science based research a better understanding can be reached how to help with all wildlife issues.

[LBM]

Roads aren't going anywhere.....
Apperantly they are as you posted in thread #22

[LBM]

I have no doubt that roads increase the predation efficiency by wolves ...but they are still efficient predators away from human influence.
Look no further than the thread on wolves in the Tuchodi. No roads...no logging....no oil and gas development.

SSS
Yes and each region or MU is different and has to be treated that way. The problem is different in each and has to be fixed/solved differently in each.

[Ourea]

Apperantly they are as you posted in thread #22

Ha ha and touche.
Yes, the reality is there will only be more.

I will pose a question (and it is coming from a constructive perspective).
What needs to be done?
How is it achieved?
Who pays for it?

[LBM]

You (and us all) will actually have to convince the government to get onside to make any significant difference.
Current studies well show that indiscriminate shooting and removals of one or two critical pack members will result in a near immediate upsurge of wolf populations.
"Sportsmen" who do this shooting may "feel better" by taking the odd one out, but in the vast majority of situations, they are actually contributing to the problem they think they are dealing with. Removal rates by this sector are FAR too sporadic, and FAR too low to make any difference whatsoever in the overall picture.

What is required is a dedicated team of very experienced killers using air support, combined with experienced trappers completely focused on the removal of entire packs. Only then will we see the numbers start to fall. The only real alternative is to await the eventual crash of prey species, and the resulting fall of their predators as a consequence. :(

I wish this were not true, but sadly it is.
And I wish that I thought we could convince government to pay attention, but again sadly I do not...

Grim state of affairs...
Nog
Each region is different but in parts of the EK this sure seems as to what happened. A few packs stayed pretty consistant numbers for years and travel routes. Then some people
got in panick mode some fueled by a few ranchers, even though they had never lost any livestock. So a few trappers caught a couple then the next year more wolves, then split
up, so now 2 packs then a couple caught out of the new one and so on. The right people at the start could have probably eliminated most of if not the whole pack.
If people want to trap or shoot wolves because you want one fine, but to do so because you think your saving ungulates you may be causing the death of more in some cases.

[Bugle M In]

And now you throw in some more road closures in the EK starting soon, and now the wolves will have more
safe havens/sanctuaries to run back into all the time, at least during the hunting season..
And I agree, the wrong trappers will just make it worse, just like when we go out and by luck tag 1 or 2,
we might be making it worse.
Whose going to pay for....not a clue...should be from our hunting tags/license money I suppose.
Who should be doing it....the ministry....but no balls..
How...well I am fine with heli, but that's about the most expensive way to handle it (at least up front),
and some don't like my thoughts on 1080...so, what, pay trappers....but how do you know that they can actually be capable of trapping the way it needs to be done???
May not agree with my thoughts, but, I answered the questions.

[lovemywinchester]

I have hundreds of hours in the bush over the last 7 years in Reg 3. One wolf spotted and I missed it. To say we need to kill more as hunters is not easy if you can never get the cross hairs on them.

[338win mag]

Wolves I have shot have been alone whether they are part of a larger group, who knows. I dont know any ranchers in region 8 who haven't lost cattle to wolves, one guy lost about a dozen in 1 year 2-3 years ago.

I have said this about 10 times now....where are the forest companies in all this?? they contribute nothing to any of the hunting communities issues, even though they reap the benefits, they build the roads, destroy habitat like crazy, cream the bush under the guise of the pine beetle. The pine beetle exists no doubt, but then cream the high elevation spruce?? its all bs.

I lost complete confidence in any form of government intervention regarding wildlife initiatives in this province, and anyone who is expecting help from this current government is dreaming. Help if any, is going to come from the bottom up, not top down.
This wolf problem isn't going anywhere soon and will continue until everything is dead, dont think so? take a look at who is spreading the "I love wolves" agenda, they spread half truths (which is another word for perfect lie) and tug at the heartstrings of people who through no fault of their own just dont know and should be shown video of how many and how wolves kill stuff.
These same people frequent this site and probably get some of their idea's here as they are aware its important to know your enemy.

This government as with the previous government wont spend anytime worrying about game population nor hunters needs and trying to gain the ear of the bc government is futile and quite frankly am getting abit weary of hearing "we need governments help" on every issue we as hunters face.
Sorry to sound down on this issue and other issues hunters in this province face today but I keep on hunting with confidence that it will turn around for the youth in the future but I'm not getting any younger so its unlikely I will see it in my lifetime.

[BgBlkDg]

That, ^^^^^^^, folks, about says all that needs to be said. I agree and am utterly disgusted with the situation, however, this is the way it has been since I can remember and that is some 65+ years.

I favour a mass poisoning programme using 1080 and f**k the little pizzants of the "Raincoast" phonies and the "Valhalla Wilderness" jerks and draftdodging parasites and all the rest, but, I am not optimistic such will ever happen in BC.

So, I will shoot wolves and coyotes every chance I get and until I am so old that I cannot see to shoot!

[TexasWalker]

That, ^^^^^^^, folks, about says all that needs to be said. I agree and am utterly disgusted with the situation, however, this is the way it has been since I can remember and that is some 65+ years.

I favour a mass poisoning programme using 1080 and f**k the little pizzants of the "Raincoast" phonies and the "Valhalla Wilderness" jerks and draftdodging parasites and all the rest, but, I am not optimistic such will ever happen in BC.

So, I will shoot wolves and coyotes every chance I get and until I am so old that I cannot see to shoot!

I knew it was those damn draft dodgers!!

[boxhitch]

......I will pose a question (and it is coming from a constructive perspective).
What needs to be done?
How is it achieved?
Who pays for it?-Need to convince the majority of the vocal populace that ungulates rate higher on the desirable scale than predators, that predators are the devils workers
-Achieved with a giant propaganda campaign, possible started in the grade schools like the antis- have done, and perpetuated through all sectors of society including Hollywood bobbleheads
-Build it and they will come. Once everyone is convinced ungulates are needy, underprivileged, malnutritioned being forced out of their homes, the funds will pour in from donations legacies and foundations that arise.

no one said it would be easy )

[scoutlt1]

Sadly, I think, in today's political climate, when it becomes clear that predators such as wolves, bears and cats are running low on "food" (deer, moose, elk, etc...), the "go to" will be to reduce human hunter opportunities rather than reduce predator populations.
That will be the "thinking" of both the law-makers and the ones that elect them.

Not good....

[HarryToolips]

That, ^^^^^^^, folks, about says all that needs to be said. I agree and am utterly disgusted with the situation, however, this is the way it has been since I can remember and that is some 65+ years.

I favour a mass poisoning programme using 1080 and f**k the little pizzants of the "Raincoast" phonies and the "Valhalla Wilderness" jerks and draftdodging parasites and all the rest, but, I am not optimistic such will ever happen in BC.

So, I will shoot wolves and coyotes every chance I get and until I am so old that I cannot see to shoot!
I completely agree, and I'm sure everybody will burn me at the stake for this but here it goes: I think we should all do the poisoning anyway, because we know it's the right thing to do, and we won't get any help from the government, so let's do it, and the CO's I hope will look the other way, because they know what's right....I sure as hell would, if I had the knowledge/resources sign me up...but before y'all flame me, ya know I'm just saying what many of you are too scared too say, but it's what your thinkin..

[604redneck]

Ya kill all the wolves! Its there fault! Definitely has nothing to do with humans.....

[mulieaddiction]

I was thinking on going for a pred hunt or 2 in dec jan if anyone is interested or have some area they know roughly where they are

[Stone Sheep Steve]

I completely agree, and I'm sure everybody will burn me at the stake for this but here it goes: I think we should all do the poisoning anyway, because we know it's the right thing to do, and we won't get any help from the government, so let's do it, and the CO's I hope will look the other way, because they know what's right....I sure as hell would, if I had the knowledge/resources sign me up...but before y'all flame me, ya know I'm just saying what many of you are too scared too say, but it's what your thinkin..

An outfitter in the south OK recently tried that. Didn't go so well for him.
Charges laid.

[LBM]

I completely agree, and I'm sure everybody will burn me at the stake for this but here it goes: I think we should all do the poisoning anyway, because we know it's the right thing to do, and we won't get any help from the government, so let's do it, and the CO's I hope will look the other way, because they know what's right....I sure as hell would, if I had the knowledge/resources sign me up...but before y'all flame me, ya know I'm just saying what many of you are too scared too say, but it's what your thinkin..

Don't think its the right thing to do, and not what Im thinking you can only speak for your self. Personally think the people that suggest illegal stuff should be seriously looked into specially if they have been into the regions that stuff has happened. There is another guy that keeps suggesting it on here as well.
As I have said many don't know what goes on out there, more animals are killed because of humans, who knows what else these guys are doing.

[LBM]

That, ^^^^^^^, folks, about says all that needs to be said. I agree and am utterly disgusted with the situation, however, this is the way it has been since I can remember and that is some 65+ years.

I favour a mass poisoning programme using 1080 and f**k the little pizzants of the "Raincoast" phonies and the "Valhalla Wilderness" jerks and draftdodging parasites and all the rest, but, I am not optimistic such will ever happen in BC.

So, I will shoot wolves and coyotes every chance I get and until I am so old that I cannot see to shoot!

Again feel this is part of the problem in trying to get other groups to listen or understand others opinions is to continually put them down or call them names.
Curious to as how many wolves you have shoot in your 65 + years.

[338win mag]

Sadly, I think, in today's political climate, when it becomes clear that predators such as wolves, bears and cats are running low on "food" (deer, moose, elk, etc...), the "go to" will be to reduce human hunter opportunities rather than reduce predator populations.
That will be the "thinking" of both the law-makers and the ones that elect them.

Not good....
Thats why we dont want changes to hunter opportunity, once there gone they wont be coming back anytime soon, if at all, and its what the anti's want.

Who should pay? I would start with the forest companies, I dont think its too much to ask that they fund a campaign to bait then shoot wolves, I dont think it would cost too much, they have deep pockets even though they are always crying about losing money. These entities are like the cat who ate the canary and they have feathers hanging out of their mouths, and their silence pisses me off.

I'm all for legal measures to poison, they need to develop a poison that wont kill all the other animals in the bush, until they do I cant support poison.

[LBM]

Ha ha and touche.
Yes, the reality is there will only be more.

I will pose a question (and it is coming from a constructive perspective).
What needs to be done?
How is it achieved?
Who pays for it?
wolves have to be managed as do all animals, because of human involvement.
I am not in favour of poison and as mentioned feel those that mention it should be looked into.
I have had friends have there pets killed because of it.
I feel all the funds from out door activitys should go back into out door activitys plus
those using it such as logging/forestry, outfitters, tour and out door recreating groups.

[LBM]

An outfitter in the south OK recently tried that. Didn't go so well for him.
Charges laid.

Do you mind mentioning what outfitter.
Hopefully they take his outfitters license and area away.

[BgBlkDg]

[QUOTE=LBM;1949312]Again feel this is part of the problem in trying to get other groups to listen or understand others opinions is to continually put them down or call them names.
Curious to as how many wolves you have shoot in your 65 + years.[/QUOT

I am NOT going to dignify your insolent, ignorant and baseless comments here by posting ANY information on my activities from my first fly-caught Trout, aged 6, 1952, to my last trip in Sept. of this year.

I hardly have to justify or verify my decades of active wilderness work, conservation or personal integrity to an obvious poseur-troll like you and I suspect that I am not alone in my dislike of you and your pathetic drivel. So, piss off and bother someone who is willing to waste time with nincompoops like you.

[Bugle M In]

wolves have to be managed as do all animals, because of human involvement.
I am not in favour of poison and as mentioned feel those that mention it should be looked into.
I have had friends have there pets killed because of it.
I feel all the funds from out door activitys should go back into out door activitys plus
those using it such as logging/forestry, outfitters, tour and out door recreating groups.

Go ahead...pm me, I will give you my name.
I have a clear conscience, and do everything by the book.
Talk to your retired CO in the area, he knows I am more ethical then most.
(although, I don't think your history with him is to your liking)
I am talking about putting that stuff way back in the "back country", where trapping does not seem to happen,
or where the trappers will most certainly be ineffective.
Like Gcreek and you stated to him...trapper has taken a lot of wolves around his area, yet they keep coming back.
Sounds to me like the wolves come from further back and will continue to be an issue.
Sure, the trapper likes to be able to set the same traps in the same spot...year after year, but it does not mean he is putting a dent into them at all.
Trapping is better around city/town limits then 1080, but in the back country, I think it would be a good choice.
Doubt there is the 1800.00 per hour plus staff costs to put a heli up to shoot them.
Either way, it should be the ministry to handle that, but, you know yourself, they haven't been doing too much on any of the issues, and don't look like they will anytime soon.
Instead, you offer really no solutions, or any new input to be discussed.
What is your "solution" buddy!

[boxhitch]

Sadly, I think, in today's political climate, when it becomes clear that predators such as wolves, bears and cats are running low on "food" (deer, moose, elk, etc...), the "go to" will be to reduce human hunter opportunities rather than reduce predator populations.
That will be the "thinking" of both the law-makers and the ones that elect them.

Not good....Thats the beauty in the safety of todays regulations and game management to healthy conservative male/female ratios. As long as the ratio is suitable for the females to bare young, the surplus males are what hunters have as opportunity. Overall numbers may go down, but as long as the ratio is maintained, hunters will have ops. There is no doubt hunter success will go down with fewer males to take out, but arguably the hunt can continue and the available females will have off spring.
Having more surviving offspring is the key to increasing populations, but hunters take won't make more or less babies, if ratios are proper
Its really a simple process, and has been the key to management so far which is to 'maintain a healthy population'. Nobody has set a mandate for the province to grow more ungulates or to have a target of 'x' number of any wildlife, and until that step is taken there is no target to strive for, no need to change management.
Hunters will never win the battle to have their desired species increase in numbers at the expense of some other type of wildlife.

The only arguement that is getting traction now about increasing ungulate numbers is the indians demand for more sustenance animals, and unfortunately the easy answer there is to reduce the licensed hunters take..

[J_T]

Go ahead...pm me, I will give you my name.
I have a clear conscience, and do everything by the book.
Talk to your retired CO in the area, he knows I am more ethical then most.
(although, I don't think your history with him is to your liking)
I am talking about putting that stuff way back in the "back country", where trapping does not seem to happen,
or where the trappers will most certainly be ineffective.
Like Gcreek and you stated to him...trapper has taken a lot of wolves around his area, yet they keep coming back.
Sounds to me like the wolves come from further back and will continue to be an issue.
Sure, the trapper likes to be able to set the same traps in the same spot...year after year, but it does not mean he is putting a dent into them at all.
Trapping is better around city/town limits then 1080, but in the back country, I think it would be a good choice.
Doubt there is the 1800.00 per hour plus staff costs to put a heli up to shoot them.
Either way, it should be the ministry to handle that, but, you know yourself, they haven't been doing too much on any of the issues, and don't look like they will anytime soon.
Instead, you offer really no solutions, or any new input to be discussed.
What is your "solution" buddy!
I'm not a wolf expert by any means. However my understanding is, when you have a pack you have an Alpha pair. With an alpha pairing, 'generally' only the alpha female goes into heat, and only about once per year. If you take out either of the alpha pair, you have a fracturing in the pack and they separate into multiple packs and all the females go into heat. The result is generally more wolves and more packs. It is best, if wolf population control is strategic. Leaving the alpha pairing if possible. As Alpha's, they tend to stay in a defined area.
When we/generic 'we', see wolves and notify say the trapper in hopes to take an approach to reduce/remove the pack, that trapper is limited to the range of his trap line to attempt any trapping of wolves. And as we know, wolves move around and follow the prey species. So a trapper who has wolves in his area in the summer months, eating elk, every year, will not be able to trap them, because they aren't there when his trapping season allows him to trap.

[Bugle M In]

Thats the beauty in the safety of todays regulations and game management to healthy conservative male/female ratios. As long as the ratio is suitable for the females to bare young, the surplus males are what hunters have as opportunity. Overall numbers may go down, but as long as the ratio is maintained, hunters will have ops. There is no doubt hunter success will go down with fewer males to take out, but arguably the hunt can continue and the available females will have off spring.
Having more surviving offspring is the key to increasing populations, but hunters take won't make more or less babies, if ratios are proper
Its really a simple process, and has been the key to management so far which is to 'maintain a healthy population'. Nobody has set a mandate for the province to grow more ungulates or to have a target of 'x' number of any wildlife, and until that step is taken there is no target to strive for, no need to change management.
Hunters will never win the battle to have their desired species increase in numbers at the expense of some other type of wildlife.

The only arguement that is getting traction now about increasing ungulate numbers is the indians demand for more sustenance animals, and unfortunately the easy answer there is to reduce the licensed hunters take..

well said, and so true.

[Walking Buffalo]

I'm not a wolf expert by any means. However my understanding is, when you have a pack you have an Alpha pair. With an alpha pairing, 'generally' only the alpha female goes into heat, and only about once per year. If you take out either of the alpha pair, you have a fracturing in the pack and they separate into multiple packs and all the females go into heat. The result is generally more wolves and more packs. It is best, if wolf population control is strategic. Leaving the alpha pairing if possible. As Alpha's, they tend to stay in a defined area.
When we/generic 'we', see wolves and notify say the trapper in hopes to take an approach to reduce/remove the pack, that trapper is limited to the range of his trap line to attempt any trapping of wolves. And as we know, wolves move around and follow the prey species. So a trapper who has wolves in his area in the summer months, eating elk, every year, will not be able to trap them, because they aren't there when his trapping season allows him to trap.

This theory has been shown to occur, and other times different outcomes happen.
Studies have also shown that when the Alpha pair is killed, the remaining pack dissolves into chaos, infighting and dispersal....
These broken packs are vulnerable to mortality from themselves and neighbouring packs. Lone wolves are at a survival disadvantage.
Large stable packs are more likely to produce offshoot packs in comparison to unstable packs. Yet this is rarely mentioned...

IMO, the excessive promotion that killing the Alpha pair increases wolf populations is faulty for being biased, they usually will not admit that the opposite outcome often happens.

Now why would someone do that?

[bearvalley]

This theory has been shown to occur, and other times different outcomes happen.
Studies have also shown that when the Alpha pair is killed, the remaining pack dissolves into chaos, infighting and dispersal....
These broken packs are vulnerable to mortality from themselves and neighbouring packs. Lone wolves are at a survival disadvantage.
Large stable packs are more likely to produce offshoot packs in comparison to unstable packs. Yet this is rarely mentioned...

IMO, the excessive promotion that killing the Alpha pair increases wolf populations is faulty for being biased, they usually will not admit that the opposite outcome often happens.

Now why would someone do that?

What you say is true.
Large packs containing numerous adult wolves being tampered with is where fragmentation and creation of more wolves occurs.
Packs made up of pups and sub adults tend to crumble when the alphas are removed.
Another myth is that just the alpha female has pups.
Wolves are no different than dogs.
More than one adult female in a pack will breed....tail is tail.

[Stone Sheep Steve]

Do you mind mentioning what outfitter.
Hopefully they take his outfitters license and area away.

No problem as it was in the news several months ago.
Jim Weins.

http://www.huntingbc.ca/forum/showthread.php?138413-another-guide-charged/page2

[LBM]

Go ahead...pm me, I will give you my name.
I have a clear conscience, and do everything by the book.
Talk to your retired CO in the area, he knows I am more ethical then most.
(although, I don't think your history with him is to your liking)
I am talking about putting that stuff way back in the "back country", where trapping does not seem to happen,
or where the trappers will most certainly be ineffective.
Like Gcreek and you stated to him...trapper has taken a lot of wolves around his area, yet they keep coming back.
Sounds to me like the wolves come from further back and will continue to be an issue.
Sure, the trapper likes to be able to set the same traps in the same spot...year after year, but it does not mean he is putting a dent into them at all.
Trapping is better around city/town limits then 1080, but in the back country, I think it would be a good choice.
Doubt there is the 1800.00 per hour plus staff costs to put a heli up to shoot them.
Either way, it should be the ministry to handle that, but, you know yourself, they haven't been doing too much on any of the issues, and don't look like they will anytime soon.
Instead, you offer really no solutions, or any new input to be discussed.
What is your "solution" buddy!

What do I need your name for, I can tell enough about your character and ethics from what you write, sorry but your not some one I would be buddys with.
No lots of retired COs , cops, teachers, doctors people from all walks of life and many still practicing there profession, don't need them telling me about someone,
Im quit capable of making my own choice and decisions.

[LBM]

No problem as it was in the news several months ago.
Jim Weins.

http://www.huntingbc.ca/forum/showthread.php?138413-another-guide-charged/page2
Ya thanks I did goggle it and seen it was him but didn't open the link for said may contain viruses so will see if can find another one.

[LBM]

[QUOTE=LBM;1949312]Again feel this is part of the problem in trying to get other groups to listen or understand others opinions is to continually put them down or call them names.
Curious to as how many wolves you have shoot in your 65 + years.[/QUOT

I am NOT going to dignify your insolent, ignorant and baseless comments here by posting ANY information on my activities from my first fly-caught Trout, aged 6, 1952, to my last trip in Sept. of this year.

I hardly have to justify or verify my decades of active wilderness work, conservation or personal integrity to an obvious poseur-troll like you and I suspect that I am not alone in my dislike of you and your pathetic drivel. So, piss off and bother someone who is willing to waste time with nincompoops like you.

You could have just said NONE, way easier then your little rant here. I thought your back/spine was acting up on your last trip so you didn't go
out, toured Nelson for a couple days then went home.

[BgBlkDg]

Given your illiterate screeds here and your ignorant comments on others whom you do not know, have never met and should leave in peace, my only response is to tell you to kindly "mangez la merde" as "Fluffy's " pere was wont to say........

[HarryToolips]

Don't think its the right thing to do, and not what Im thinking you can only speak for your self. Personally think the people that suggest illegal stuff should be seriously looked into specially if they have been into the regions that stuff has happened. There is another guy that keeps suggesting it on here as well.
As I have said many don't know what goes on out there, more animals are killed because of humans, who knows what else these guys are doing.
Sure, we as humans have changed the landscape to the Wolves benefit, but if we can't get the government to do aerial shooting, what other option do we have to manage their numbers?? Sure, hunting them is good but highly ineffective..and you were the one who discouraged people including myself not long ago from taking up trapping, as you can 'teach' them..I for one am sick of hearing how wolves have decimated ungulate populations in many parts of the province..

[Stone Sheep Steve]

Sure, we as humans have changed the landscape to the Wolves benefit, but if we can't get the government to do aerial shooting, what other option do we have to manage their numbers?? Sure, hunting them is good but highly ineffective..and you were the one who discouraged people including myself not long ago from taking up trapping, as you can 'teach' them..I for one am sick of hearing how wolves have decimated ungulate populations in many parts of the province..

The current government seems to grant FN's what they want in regards to hunting.

Getting the First Nations on board to manage wolf numbers is our only hope....IMO.

SSS

[HarryToolips]

The current government seems to grant FN's want they want in regards to hunting.

Getting the First Nations on board to manage wolf numbers is our only hope....IMO.

SSS
Sad, but very true.....

[338win mag]

The current government seems to grant FN's what they want in regards to hunting.

Getting the First Nations on board to manage wolf numbers is our only hope....IMO.

SSS
Its a good place to start.

[LBM]

The current government seems to grant FN's what they want in regards to hunting.

Getting the First Nations on board to manage wolf numbers is our only hope....IMO.

SSS

Funny how so many are against them and what they can do but if they can be used to there advantage its ok.

[bearvalley]

Funny how so many are against them and what they can do but if they can be used to there advantage its ok.

So true.....

[338win mag]

Funny how so many are against them and what they can do but if they can be used to there advantage its ok.
Not everyone is against them and some people are smart enough to see a joint venture would be in everyone favor, I'm sure the same thinking is occurring in the FN camp. Maybe the FN wont wanna be on the same page on the wolf issue and they will go it alone, for the same reasons...why would they do that?

[bownut]

This site is so full of Fair Weather Friends it makes me sick, seems like every time you open up the posts, theirs is someone getting thrown under the bus. Nice to see nothing has changed.
Months ago the talk was all about Round Table Meeting in the future and how The Big PICTURE was going to solve everything. Fast forward and everyone is throwing knives across the table.
As far as the predator control, it is so full of factors that we can't even start to make a plan without everyone involved understanding all the factors.
So lets all learn to get along and find some money to get things started.

[Stone Sheep Steve]

Months ago the talk was all about Round Table Meeting in the future and how The Big PICTURE was going to solve everything. Fast forward and everyone is throwing knives across the table.


And along came the NDP. Nothing but divisive policies to keep ALL of us hunters from uniting.

[Ourea]

The reality.......
As the resource shrinks the fighting will only increase.

Get behind a sustainable funding model that puts $$ back to the resource.
The stakeholders will never stop fighting in the sandbox.
Let them fight over a growing resource, not a shrinking one.

As this downward spiral of game populations continues there will be only one user group that takes more of the shrinking pie. Not wishing to be perceived as bashing but it is the simple reality.

[steepNdeep]

I was shifting my focus out of hunting just when the wolves were starting to come into southern BC. With their reintroduction in Yellowstone & Idaho, I remember hearing about the wolves as they swept through regions in the states north & westward & how they seriously affected hunters. They had to fight long & hard just for the right be able to hunt to start to control their population. In the meantime, wolves got a big head start...

I also vividly remember bowhunting near the border & seeing my first wolf face-to-face at ~70m. It is a cool experience to have their wildness as part of our ecosystem, but they are experts at what they do & would change hunting in an area for generations if left alone...

It's depressing now that all I see on forums is poor ungulate population woes & wolves... IMHO, if you really want to do something:

1) UNITE - Everyone has to get united (through hunting associations & clubs) & fight hard to lobby the politicians to make it a priority build and maintain a predator control strategy to protect the resource. If you're not united & vocal (more than the anti's) things will deteriorate.

2) HUNT THEM - In addition, as individuals we have to do our part in predator management & spend some time out there focussed on protecting our resource. Those that don't help in some fashion, have no right to complain about it.

I have called in a few dogs over the years - they are super sharp & a fun challenge! Calling them in is similar to hunting elk in the rut. It's a good excuse to GET OUT THERE in mountains in the winter. Wolves will be more concentrated around the obvious wintering grounds & the ungulates are more vulnerable then...

[bownut]

The first year that Wolves opened in region 8 I took out two in a pack of 10-15, it was opening day and the pack was all over the moose and elk, the deer were grouped up in the camps sites and
along the edge of the lake ready to swim. Later that week I found the main den and had another go at them but the bush was too thick.
This has been a long standing problem that many hunters haven't seen until now. I have been following the packs in the Okanagan for many years and with all the open country from the 03 fire
the deer have now moved to the valley bottom for safety.
This is the trend that started back in Creston with farmers bitching about the elk, Crandbrook with the deer, Grandforks with deer, Penticton, and Kelowna. The cities are now the migration zones
and people are just going to have to adjust, it is just too bad that they don't head back up. Why would they?
Just something to think about, what happens when hunters start a bait pile for hunting and concentrate animals to a food source, I bet that is pretty easy pickings when they go home at night.
I had i fella show me some trail cam photo's of a bunch of deer a few years back, then the cats rolled in. End of his great hunting spot. Done done done.....

[Ourea]

Running 20+ cams I can't support all of your claims as they are a bit assumptive. (and I certainly appreciate your insight and time in the field)
Being in the bush year round with my scouting and cam'ing efforts I have yet to get a cat taking a run at deer on a bait site. Another thing that intrigues me is despite having wolves move in and f*ck my WT program at times they never come thru my baiting sites.....They roll by on the skid roads and cut blocks but they don't work the timber for the most part. (and I have followed tracks for hours)

And DEFINITELY there has been a change in deer behavior in the last ten yrs with their growing tendency to compress into rural and even urban environments

I do agree 100% that wolves are a growing presence.
Most bush rats have seen this trend for quite some time.

[Liveforthehunt]

I have alot of cams up as well 0urea pushing 30 at times depending on snow depths etc . And to relate to bownuts observations I have only had a few wolves on my cams over the past few years in the okanagan region ... Not one wolf kill or any predator for that matter anywhere near the bait sites. Also having a handful of cougars as well as a few grizz and lots of blackies. That being said was up the hill today checked a few cams and this by far has been my least productive year animal wise in terms of pictures and animal presence . I have been lucky enough to bang down a couple wolves in reg 8 as well 2 years ago. I think there must be multiple variables effecting the "declining population of game. Unless they have moved on.

[Ourea]

I have alot of cams up as well 0urea pushing 30 at times depending on snow depths etc . And to relate to bownuts observations I have only had a few wolves on my cams over the past few years in the okanagan region ... Not one wolf kill or any predator for that matter anywhere near the bait sites. Also having a handful of cougars as well as a few grizz and lots of blackies. That being said was up the hill today checked a few cams and this by far has been my least productive year animal wise in terms of pictures and animal presence . I have been lucky enough to bang down a couple wolves in reg 8 as well 2 years ago. I think there must be multiple variables effecting the "declining population of game. Unless they have moved on.

I agree with and support your observations and opinion.

[Stone Sheep Steve]

Just something to think about, what happens when hunters start a bait pile for hunting and concentrate animals to a food source, I bet that is pretty easy pickings when they go home at night.
I had i fella show me some trail cam photo's of a bunch of deer a few years back, then the cats rolled in. End of his great hunting spot. Done done done.....

Witnessed this very first year I tinkered with bait. Didn't know what I was doing...and didn't have a functioning tcam.

Was set up on the very edge of a canyon. Crawled into my treestand well before first light. About 7:45 I saw a flash of brown coming out of the canyon. Got my bow ready expecting a brown deer to appear but instead watch a cougar sneak up towards the pile and peak over. Bow was ready in my hand and the cat was at a mere 15 yards. Problem was is that I forgot to pick up my cat tags when the season started.
The cat didn't see any deer and silently slipped back into the canyon.
At the end of the day I crawled out of my stand and went over to where I saw the cat. Tracks told the tale. The cat had been there in the hours of darkness and had unsuccessfully gone after a deer that had been feeding.

Having said this, I gave up on that area but still ran a cam of two just on trails. Had quite a few pictures of cougars (as well as cougar hounds and cougar hunters) on cam.

[bownut]

Now that some hunters are seeing some of the effects of bait placement I will give you a bit of history on my baiting experiences.
This story goes back to the mid 90's during the hard winters and lack of food, the Kelowna Club decided to try help the deer through the winter.
The Bio's were not really supportive of our ideas, but with their direction we set up our feeding area. This area is now a large subdivision known as Kettle Valley Estates, back then
held most of the wintering deer south of Kelowna. The feed lot had to be out of the heavy brush and free of any cliffs or rock formations that may aid in cat attacks. Corridors would be
certain death for all that past.
We first started feeding with small amounts of mixed hay and apple pulp from Sunripe and as they adjusted to the new diet we ramped up the volume. We had no kills at the feeding
area, and I was so fortunate to be surrounded by large groups of deer as we emptied out the back of the pickup. I will never forget those days having 160 class Whitetails standing at your feet.
They sure were a hungry bunch. Without the knowledge of how to place and how to feed I feel that the outcome would have been different.
Fast forward to now and many hunters place feed in areas and create traps for game without little knowledge of what damage that they have done.
Four years back I was hunting Mule deer and came across a large dump of apples on a cliffy area at the end of the hunting season, in the spring when shed hunting I walked over more kills just above the bait than
I have ever seen in 20 years of hunting there. I don't need to be a Bio to figure out what happen that winter.
I guess what I am getting at is Predation also falls on us as Hunters, and putting the blame on Wolves and Cats is only a part of the factor.

[steepNdeep]

Good points.


Witnessed this very first year I tinkered with bait. Didn't know what I was doing...and didn't have a functioning tcam.

At the end of the day I crawled out of my stand and went over to where I saw the cat. Tracks told the tale. The cat had been there in the hours of darkness and had unsuccessfully gone after a deer that had been feeding.

Having said this, I gave up on that area but still ran a cam of two just on trails. Had quite a few pictures of cougars (as well as cougar hounds and cougar hunters) on cam.

Cool experience, Brett! I've seen a couple cats with rifle in hand, but have yet to shoot one. Cat populations are relatively easy to control with dedicated (errr... obsessive) houndsmen... as 2-stroke has shown us ; ). Wolves are not that easy.


The feed lot had to be out of the heavy brush and free of any cliffs or rock formations that may aid in cat attacks. Corridors would be certain death for all that past.

Fast forward to now and many hunters place feed in areas and create traps for game without little knowledge of what damage that they have done. Four years back I was hunting Mule deer and came across a large dump of apples on a cliffy area at the end of the hunting season, in the spring when shed hunting I walked over more kills just above the bait than I have ever seen in 20 years of hunting there. I don't need to be a Bio to figure out what happen that winter.

I guess what I am getting at is Predation also falls on us as Hunters, and putting the blame on Wolves and Cats is only a part of the factor.

Ungulate populations are under growing pressure from all sides. Habitat fragmentation, FSR road networks aiding predators & urban development of wintering grounds being some of the biggies. I'm sure concentrating the animals via bait doesn't help, either. However, the biggest change that we've seen in the last couple of decades is the re-introduction of wolves in our area.

We should do all that we can to help ease the pressure & protect our wildlife resources. Big buck may soon be replaced by big wolf contests... ;

[todbartell]

Witnessed this very first year I tinkered with bait. Didn't know what I was doing...and didn't have a functioning tcam.

Was set up on the very edge of a canyon. Crawled into my treestand well before first light. About 7:45 I saw a flash of brown coming out of the canyon. Got my bow ready expecting a brown deer to appear but instead watch a cougar sneak up towards the pile and peak over. Bow was ready in my hand and the cat was at a mere 15 yards. Problem was is that I forgot to pick up my cat tags when the season started.
The cat didn't see any deer and silently slipped back into the canyon.
At the end of the day I crawled out of my stand and went over to where I saw the cat. Tracks told the tale. The cat had been there in the hours of darkness and had unsuccessfully gone after a deer that had been feeding.

Having said this, I gave up on that area but still ran a cam of two just on trails. Had quite a few pictures of cougars (as well as cougar hounds and cougar hunters) on cam.

cool story, Brett

[wideopenthrottle]

-Need to convince the majority of the vocal populace that ungulates rate higher on the desirable scale than predators, that predators are the devils workers
-Achieved with a giant propaganda campaign, possible started in the grade schools like the antis- have done, and perpetuated through all sectors of society including Hollywood bobbleheads
-Build it and they will come. Once everyone is convinced ungulates are needy, underprivileged, malnutritioned being forced out of their homes, the funds will pour in from donations legacies and foundations that arise.

no one said it would be easy )

we used to....think lil red riding hood (remember how the hunter/woodsman saved her), the boy who cried wolf (a wolf was something to alert the whole town about), the three little pigs (wolves coming to kill even when you are in a house) etc...we had everyone before my generation hating and fearing wolves and you can be damn sure they all did their part to get rid of dangerous animals.....now we have dog food commercials showing dogs running with wolves telling us how close our pet dogs are to wolves...the pendulum has swung too far back towards the preds....

[Ohwildwon]

we used to....think lil red riding hood (remember how the hunter/woodsman saved her), the boy who cried wolf (a wolf was something to alert the whole town about), the three little pigs (wolves coming to kill even when you are in a house) etc...we had everyone before my generation hating and fearing wolves and you can be damn sure they all did their part to get rid of dangerous animals.....now we have dog food commercials showing dogs running with wolves telling us how close our pet dogs are to wolves...the pendulum has swung too far back towards the preds....

Well said wideopen! Excellent analogy...

[Whonnock Boy]

So anyways, I got those wolves to come in right near...... on second thought, I think I'll keep that information for people who I actually know, and don't think I am some drama queen. Good luck. I hope you nail a few.


Where abouts?
I'm very interested in shooting wolves in region 3.

[TexasWalker]

So anyways, I got those wolves to come in right near...... on second thought, I think I'll keep that information for people who I actually know, and don't think I am some drama queen. Good luck. I hope you nail a few.

lol this entire post was made for nothing but drama, you've just perpetuated the stereotype yet again.
Being you should be very conservation minded I'd suggest not posting the location of your wolf encounters would be counter productive to our common goal, helping ungulates.

Cheers.

[skibum]

...............
They sure were a hungry bunch. Without the knowledge of how to place and how to feed I feel that the outcome would have been different.
Fast forward to now and many hunters place feed in areas and create traps for game without little knowledge of what damage that they have done.
Four years back I was hunting Mule deer and came across a large dump of apples on a cliffy area at the end of the hunting season, in the spring when shed hunting I walked over more kills just above the bait than I have ever seen in 20 years of hunting there. I don't need to be a Bio to figure out what happen that winter. I guess what I am getting at is Predation also falls on us as Hunters, and putting the blame on Wolves and Cats is only a part of the factor.

Cool thanks for sharing that!

[BChunter1982]

I hunted hard up in those areas this season unsuccessfully and 1 of the reasons was the amount of wolf tracks i saw. Yes there were a fair amount of coyote tracks as well but the wolf population is exploding. Besides a hunt in 3-26 yesterday I have never seen so much wolf tracks. If i see one I'll fire away but only had 1 cross the road in front of my wife and I this year and there was no shot available (it was a BIG grey and tan colored wolf). I will be headed out often over the next few weeks to do some predator calling and hope to bag some of these beasts

[BChunter1982]

Maybe more on the east side but let me tell ya there is NO SHORTAGE of them on the Westside, the last 3 years things are changing drastically over there (I hunt it religiously)and they are everywhere!

[Redneck Rocket]

The reality.......
As the resource shrinks the fighting will only increase.

Get behind a sustainable funding model that puts $$ back to the resource.
The stakeholders will never stop fighting in the sandbox.
Let them fight over a growing resource, not a shrinking one.

As this downward spiral of game populations continues there will be only one user group that takes more of the shrinking pie. Not wishing to be perceived as bashing but it is the simple reality.

A great starting point, and one that I believe the BCWF has been pushing for for a long time, is to have a similar piece of legislation drafted to the US Pitman-Robertson Act, and stipulate that 1. All licensing revenues MUST be used for conservation, enforcement, habitat restoration & preservation and 2. To introduce a levy/tax/duty on hunting & fishing equipment which again MUST be spent on the above. I'd pay 10% more for everything if I knew it was all going to create opportunities.

We all need to put pressure on our representatives for something like this.

[bownut]

Sad, but very true.....
Whats sad, getting on board with FN?

[HarryToolips]

Whats sad, getting on board with FN?
No, sad that getting the FN's on board to put pressure on the government to deal with our wolf problem is really our only hope of getting government help, it seems..

[HarryToolips]

Checked my one trail cam, region 8-10 today....

http://i.imgur.com/8jTDjpX.jpg (https://imgur.com/8jTDjpX)

http://i.imgur.com/d00wQxa.jpg (https://imgur.com/d00wQxa)

[Stone Sheep Steve]

What elevation was that tcam at, HTL??

[HarryToolips]

Hmm maybe 8-900 meters above sea level I think...

[scotty30-06]

What's the wolf population around penticton/OK falls area....any one have any idea?

[tracker]

lots on the east side of the valley ,not so many on the west side yet!

[one-shot-wonder]

What's the wolf population around penticton/OK falls area....any one have any idea?

Quite healthy....exponential growth in past 10 years. These packs are just north of there....

http://i.imgur.com/QrtLUcf.jpg (https://imgur.com/QrtLUcf)

http://i.imgur.com/yq7OfHk.jpg (https://imgur.com/yq7OfHk)

[HarryToolips]

^^^^^you know someone with a helicopter?? tempting to make good things happen for ungulates with that isn't it..

[one-shot-wonder]

Out playing with the drone at work this winter...wasn't carrying a firearm.

[HarryToolips]

^^^lol too bad we can't rig em up with guns for pred hunting...

[scotty30-06]

Nice pics with that thing....need to rig up a frag grenade dropping mechanism lol....I would be looking at hunting few km west of kaleden in the area marked "penticton 1"

[northof49]

Poor wolves were only out looking for fresh milk for their cornflakes.....everyone knows they don’t like eating MD and moose and the real problem is habitat. Notice the tracks....dead moose walking. Most likely crapped out the next day. That there is the problem.

[.308SLAYER]

Nice pics with that thing....need to rig up a frag grenade dropping mechanism lol....I would be looking at hunting few km west of kaleden in the area marked "penticton 1"

I'll meet you there