No motorized vehicle access with E bike

[GreatWhitePopogeebo]

Anyone use a pedal assist E bike to access roads that are closed to motorized vehicles? Just wondering what the rules are I'm kinda on the lazy side. Thanks

[Whonnock Boy]

It is considered motorized, and still illegal. You have one solution, get in shape. :)

[Bugle M In]

Yup, it is motorized.
You can always try a hand glider I suppose!!??

[GreatWhitePopogeebo]

OK gym it is. I thought I if E bike was rated 500w or less was considered a regular bicycle thus considered non motorized. My bad

[WaterFowlin]

Yep. As far as fish cops are concerned it's motorized.

Lace up and burn rubber, boot rubber.

[Everett]

Under the motor vehicle act its a bicycle if it has peddles and is under 500 watts I believe. So should be legal for road closures. There is difference between electric assisted and just plain electric. We have people in my town who have suspended licences whipping around on electric scooters and because they have pedals the cops can't do a damn thing about it. I doubt a fish cop could do anything either because they are not considered motorized.

[Walking Buffalo]

Under the motor vehicle act its a bicycle if it has peddles and is under 500 watts I believe. So should be legal for road closures. There is difference between electric assisted and just plain electric. We have people in my town who have suspended licences whipping around on electric scooters and because they have pedals the cops can't do a damn thing about it. I doubt a fish cop could do anything either because they are not considered motorized.

I am in Alberta and have not reviewed the BC regulations. I suspect the rules are very similar as they are here.

This is correct in terms of a motorized vehicle on "roads".
In Alberta the definition of an OHV includes ANY motorized vehicle regardless of motor size. ANY motorized vehicle is illegal to use in a non-motorized area.

[goatdancer]

Under the motor vehicle act its a bicycle if it has peddles and is under 500 watts I believe. So should be legal for road closures. There is difference between electric assisted and just plain electric. We have people in my town who have suspended licences whipping around on electric scooters and because they have pedals the cops can't do a damn thing about it. I doubt a fish cop could do anything either because they are not considered motorized.

Motor vehicle act has no bearing on road closures done by Fish & Wildlife.

[Fisher-Dude]

If all else fails, consult the regulations.

E-bikes are designed to be self propelled by a motor. No go.


MotorVehicle - means a device in, on or by
which a person or thing is being or may be
transported or drawn, and which is designed
to be self propelled, and includes an ATV or
snowmobile, but does not include a device
designed to be moved by human, animal or
wind power; a device designed to be used
exclusively on stationary rails or stationary
tracks; or a boat propelled by motorized power

[GreatWhitePopogeebo]

Sorry I meant pedal assist bike if that makes any difference. If left messages with two COs and two fish wildlife clerks still no response I don't think anybody knows. This year I'll use regular bike hopefully I get responses see by next year lol

[Everett]

Well by that definition e-bikes are legal.


If all else fails, consult the regulations.

E-bikes are designed to be self propelled by a motor. No go.


MotorVehicle - means a device in, on or by
which a person or thing is being or may be
transported or drawn, and which is designed
to be self propelled, and includes an ATV or
snowmobile, but does not include a device
designed to be moved by human, animal or
wind power; a device designed to be used
exclusively on stationary rails or stationary
tracks; or a boat propelled by motorized power

[Fisher-Dude]

Well by that definition e-bikes are legal.

How so? E-bikes are self propelled.

[Everett]

How so? E-bikes are self propelled.

E bikes don't work without peddles there for they are self propelled and not a motorized vehicle.

[pg83]

I'm no lawyer, but they seem to fall smack in the middle of the law.

Illegal in that they can be "self propelled"
Legal in that they can be "moved by human"

I would play it safe and use a regular bicycle, but I wouldn't judge the person who decided to use one. Until they come up with some clarification one way or the other.

[Bugle M In]

E bikes don't work without peddles there for they are self propelled and not a motorized vehicle.

Yes, you may have a "grey" area here....
But, I sure as heck wouldn't want to be "out in the field", on a year long planned trip, to only be stopped
by CO's and get fined or worse, have my bike taken away at that time.

Yes, maybe I could fight (although I think it does fall under "motorized"), and win, but sure wouldn't help me
at the time I needed the bike (or would have helped me at the time) to have my bike "Confiscated".

Better to get a ruling ahead of time....and if you do win the argument...."Get it in Writing".

[AgSilver]

Yes, you may have a "grey" area here....
But, I sure as heck wouldn't want to be "out in the field", on a year long planned trip, to only be stopped
by CO's and get fined or worse, have my bike taken away at that time.

Yes, maybe I could fight (although I think it does fall under "motorized"), and win, but sure wouldn't help me
at the time I needed the bike (or would have helped me at the time) to have my bike "Confiscated".

Better to get a ruling ahead of time....and if you do win the argument...."Get it in Writing".

Very much a new area that surely wasn't contemplated at the time of writing...it's definitely got a motor and that motor assists/operates to propel the vehicle but it also doesn't function without human propulsion and the motor just "assists", as it were. I'm going to bet they err on the side of caution and lump it into motorized, though.

[ryanb]

Where grey areas exist, they exist to be taken advantage of by people that understand when it comes to fighting charges in court, grey is never to the advantage of the crown.

Certainly the way motor vehicle is defined in the regs certainly leaves the door open for pedal assist e-bikes.

Insisting the regs be made black and white, will surely close that loophole.

This legal advice from a non - lawyer is worth what you paid for it.

[behemoth]

Some guys draw the line on what is ethical by referring to the law. So in this scenario you can aim for the grey area and you may very well be within the law and therefore meet your own ethical standards. They are your own ethics and its only up to you to judge them.

For me personally, I would look to the spirit of the law to determine whether it is ethical. I know from firsthand experience that areas that have no motorized access tend to have better hunting opportunity. So when an area has a ban, I respect that and wouldn't even consider looking for a loophole. I'm looking for the harder hunts that have difficult access and overcoming that adversity is a huge part of the satisfaction of the hunt.

Again, not trying to make a judgement, just suggesting that there are other ways to look at it

[Bugle M In]

Some guys draw the line on what is ethical by referring to the law. So in this scenario you can aim for the grey area and you may very well be within the law and therefore meet your own ethical standards. They are your own ethics and its only up to you to judge them.

For me personally, I would look to the spirit of the law to determine whether it is ethical. I know from firsthand experience that areas that have no motorized access tend to have better hunting opportunity. So when an area has a ban, I respect that and wouldn't even consider looking for a loophole. I'm looking for the harder hunts that have difficult access and overcoming that adversity is a huge part of the satisfaction of the hunt.

Again, not trying to make a judgement, just suggesting that there are other ways to look at it

"Spirit of the Law" is a good way to sum it up!
It was designed to have you only go in past that point of closure/restriction, on foot, or by horse.

[AgSilver]

Check out Motor Assisted Cycle in the MVA...it's actually probably fine. I'm not sure I'd want to test it because I can't find in the Regulations (not the Synopsis, but the ACTUAL regs where it discusses closures to motor vehicles)...but the MVA excludes motor assisted cycles from being considered motor vehicles or vehicles.

http://www.bclaws.ca/civix/document/LOC/complete/statreg/--%20M%20--/47_Motor%20Vehicle%20Act%20[RSBC%201996]%20c.%20318/00_Act/96318_01.xml#section1

[btridge]

Check out Motor Assisted Cycle in the MVA...it's actually probably fine. I'm not sure I'd want to test it because I can't find in the Regulations (not the Synopsis, but the ACTUAL regs where it discusses closures to motor vehicles)...but the MVA excludes motor assisted cycles from being considered motor vehicles or vehicles.

http://www.bclaws.ca/civix/document/LOC/complete/statreg/--%20M%20--/47_Motor%20Vehicle%20Act%20[RSBC%201996]%20c.%20318/00_Act/96318_01.xml#section1

wildlife act draws on more than the MVA such as the BCORV ACT.

[AgSilver]

BCORVA draws on the MVA for the definition of vehicle and excludes motor assisted cycles as well:

http://www.bclaws.ca/civix/document/id/complete/statreg/14005

[Ourea]

Power assist bikes ie; no pedaling no power....perfectly legal.
You receive no thrust unless you are pedaling.
They are not recognized as a motorized vehicle under the MVA
These are perfectly legal in road closures.
I have confirmed this with several of my MOE enforcement contacts.

E bikes that can propel a rider without pedaling.....absolutely not.

There is no debate unless the MOE changes their definition to access on rd closures

[HighCountryBC]

Power assist bikes ie; no pedaling no power....perfectly legal.
You receive no thrust unless you are pedaling.
They are not recognized as a motorized vehicle under the MVA
These are perfectly legal in road closures.
I have confirmed this with several of my MOE enforcement contacts.

E bikes that can propel a rider without pedaling.....absolutely not.

There is no debate unless the MOE changes their definition to access on rd closures

Beat me to it. This is as clear as it gets.

[358mag]

Just call a CO and find out .

[Whonnock Boy]

I think it boils down to this. Does the E-bike have a motor? Yes. Therefore, it cannot be used in an area closed to motorized vehicles.

mo·tor
ˈmōdər/
noun



1.
a machine, especially one powered by electricity or internal combustion, that supplies motive power for a vehicle or for some other device with moving parts.

[Ourea]

I think it boils down to this. Does the E-bike have a motor? Yes. Therefore, it cannot be used in an area closed to motorized vehicles.

mo·tor
ˈmōdər/
noun



1.
a machine, especially one powered by electricity or internal combustion, that supplies motive power for a vehicle or for some other device with moving parts.







WB, that is purely your interpretation.
I have met face to face with CO's to discuss as I was using a power assist e bike.
Power assisted bikes are allowed on rd closures
See my previous post above.

As 358mag said, "call a CO" if you are planning to use a power assist pedal bike.

[Whonnock Boy]

Funny.... I quit reading just before getting to your post. Regardless, I still think it's pretty grey. There's a motor, and there's power other than muscle and sweat. I wonder where this will go....
WB, that is purely your interpretation.
I have met face to face with CO's to discuss as I was using a power assist e bike.
Power assisted bikes are allowed on rd closures
See my previous post above.

As 358mag said, "call a CO" if you are planning to use a power assist pedal bike.

[Ourea]

Funny.... I quit reading just before getting to your post. Regardless, I still think it's pretty grey. There's a motor, and there's power other than muscle and sweat. I wonder where this will go....

It is not grey.
RCMP do not recognize power assist bikes as a MV.
You can't be charged with impaired driving using one.

To answer your question......
They are 100% legal by definition under the motor vehicle act and CO's (that I spoke to) said fill ur boots.

You still have to pedal ur ass off, it's just easier.

[Bugle M In]

So, I am curious.....
How much do power assist bikes help "eliminate" the amount of force it takes to pedal compared to a plain jane non assisted bike?

In other words what percentage of effort is eliminated if you were to pedal say up a big hill, compared to a regular bike?

I ask cause...I ain't getting any younger either...

[Ourea]

Google or youtube it

There are generally several "gears" or levels of power assist.
The more you wish to increase the amount of assist (make it even easier to pedal) the shorter the battery life.
A person in less than moderate shape can eat a large hill and feel like superman doing it.

From experience, prolonged steeper inclines where you would use the high setting you can burn a battery out in under an hr.
You can get several hrs out of a battery on lower settings.

[orion]

So, I am curious.....
How much do power assist bikes help "eliminate" the amount of force it takes to pedal compared to a plain jane non assisted bike?

In other words what percentage of effort is eliminated if you were to pedal say up a big hill, compared to a regular bike?

I ask cause...I ain't getting any younger either...

There are three classes of e-bikes and various regulations to deal with them.

Class 1- require pedaling. No pedal = no go. You have different levels of assist which is reflected in battery time. Most jurisdictions do not consider these motor vehicles and are therefore allowed on non motorized paths and trails etc. An example is the Specialized Turbo Levo (www.specialized.com (http://www.specialized.com)). At higher assist settings they are a big help on hills but still require effort on the riders part.
Class 2 - are also pedal assist and thus require active pedaling but have a "throttle" override which allows you to boost your power when needed.
An example is the Radroverbike ( www.radpowerbikes.com ). These bikes usually have their top speed limited and are also usually considered non-motorized.
Class 3 - are basically e-powered motor cycles and are run mainly off a "throttle" . You have the option of pedaling to help conserve battery power but most of the power comes from the motor. An example is the Rambo bike ( www.rambobikes.com ) marketed specifically for hunters by US Cabelas. This class of bikes is in a legal grey zone at this time.


Using a dictionary definition to define motorized/non-motorized may seem logical but does not address legal definitions and as others have pointed e-bikes are not considered "motorized" vehicles.

As for the ethics involved, that is an individual matter. From my perspective, I have no difficulty using a class 1 or 2 as bike as I am still being self propelled. If don't pedal - I don't go which I feel is in the spirit of the regulations.

This is an emerging technology. Projections are that 30% of adult bike purchases will be e-bikes in 5 years time. Legal requirements may need to be re-defined. I am currently wintering in the Phoenix Arizona area and three surrounding cities have just past regulations making Class 1 and 2 e-bikes legal for non-motorized bike paths and off road trails.

[hunter1947]

Any peddle bike that is not assisted with any power to the bike is legal to travel into road closures I did this for years ,,works well to get away from hunting pressure..

[Bugle M In]

Thanks orion, that was a great understanding of the legalities.
Ourea, thanks, that explains how it actually physically feels.
Appreciated Guys.