Can a load inside a cartridge be compromised given time?

[nolimits]

Given time, an obviously an exposure to elements, can the powder inside any cartridge be affected and/or compromised to the point of total non performance? Is there a shelf life for bullets? What's the way to be sure that they are still in top shape?

[squamishhunter]

Other than switch out carry ammo a couple times a year, due to moisture, dirt on primers, hunting/target ammo sits on a shelf in a dry environment.


I suppose a de-humidifier in a special ammo closet would help.

[Seeadler]

I don't think that properly stored ammo has a shelf life. I have fired ammo with dates from the teens (as in 1917) to the 1930's and it was just fine.

[Gateholio]

It takes an awful long time.......I put a handloaded 30-06 cartridge in a glass of water for a week, took it outside and loaded it up, BOOM!!! :)

[Seeadler]

Best way to tell if OK is discolouration of the brass or bullet. Google verdigris.

[Shooter Jr.]

The seal around the bullet and case neck is tight, pretty much waterproof FYI. Also, the primer pocket is usually sealed in factory ammo. So while it is possible, it would take a really long time in extremely harsh environments.
My answer is probably not.

[butcher]

Still reloading with powder my dad bought in the 1970's. Zero concerns

[steel_ram]

Maybe a myth? I was told of ammo that was in a vehicle for a long time, exposed to a lot of vibration caused the powder granules to break down basically turning it into a faster burning powder.

[nolimits]

Other than switch out carry ammo a couple times a year, due to moisture, dirt on primers, hunting/target ammo sits on a shelf in a dry environment.


I suppose a de-humidifier in a special ammo closet would help.


I would like to add, to make things clear as much as possible, that my concern is mostly with ammo that was taken out to the field and exposed in one way or another to elements, like rain or snow. Be that ammo sitting in a clip, spare clip, or one of the additional spare carriers, like a belt pouch or but stock pouch. I never thought of it, expecting that ammo be waterproof, but I have doubts now. Any bullets that have been on a hunting trip, for a week or more, sitting in rain, snow for few days, but never fired during that trip, should it be considered good to go, or disposed after a period of time, or to avoid waste used as a range ammo?

[nolimits]

I don't think that properly stored ammo has a shelf life. I have fired ammo with dates from the teens (as in 1917) to the 1930's and it was just fine.


That begs a question what a properly stored ammo is. Ammo sitting in a safe which is kept in a unheated garage for few years might be not exactly that, or am I wrong?

[nolimits]

It takes an awful long time.......I put a handloaded 30-06 cartridge in a glass of water for a week, took it outside and loaded it up, BOOM!!! :)


I am not questioning any of this, as the BOOM is there, every time, but with the powder affected in one way or another the performance might not be there anymore, especially if you trying to reach 200-300 yards or more.

[nolimits]

Best way to tell if OK is discolouration of the brass or bullet. Google verdigris.


Googled. Thanks for that. I also noticed on one spent shell and 2 remaining bullets stored in my rifle but sleeve some very distinct rusting on the side of the holder. Will try to take some pics and post in spare time.

[Sharpish]

I have painted a ring of nail polish around the neck where the bullet seats and also around the primer where it seats. Just a thin ring. It dries hard and the shell is now 99.99999% waterproof. I got the idea from looking at milsurp ammo I bought for my SKS. They do it to every round and then seal it hermetically in a can and I expect it works perfectly 200 years later.

[nolimits]

I have painted a ring of nail polish around the neck where the bullet seats and also around the primer where it seats. Just a thin ring. It dries hard and the shell is now 99.99999% waterproof. I got the idea from looking at milsurp ammo I bought for my SKS. They do it to every round and then seal it hermetically in a can and I expect it works perfectly 200 years later.
I like this idea, but shouldn't high grade, premium ammo have that kind of protecting coating already on it?

[Sharpish]

I doubt it. Sporting ammo isn't built to withstand long storage and battlefield conditions. I'm impressed gatehouse tried the glass of water idea. I know I've had ammo in a plastic bag in a pants pocket on 10 day hunts and its soaking in condensation, seems to fire fine.

[Bear Chaser]

Pretty sure you are worrying way more about this than you have to.
Signifigant discolouration with corrosion is something to watch for and such cartridges should not be used for hunting.
Sludge buildup from leather carrying pouches can result in stuck cartridge cases and difficult extraction after firing. I've seen it happen to a partner when a bull elk required a follow up shot. Adds to the nerves a bit and I wouldn't want to experience it on dangerous game.
Keep your cartridges clean in the field and examine them in your carrying pouch often. Potential deviation due to extended periods of storage has not been a problem in my experience shooting at game.
Properly handloaded or factory ammo has an infinitesimally small chance of internal contamination given regular hunting handling and storage.

[Bugle M In]

It takes an awful long time.......I put a handloaded 30-06 cartridge in a glass of water for a week, took it outside and loaded it up, BOOM!!! :)

So.....BOOM! is a better sound than say....KABOOM!!??
I'm laughing at why you would be compelled to do that...
Must of been a slow week in Pemberton...lol

[Gateholio]

Maybe a myth? I was told of ammo that was in a vehicle for a long time, exposed to a lot of vibration caused the powder granules to break down basically turning it into a faster burning powder.

It's kinda sorta possible. But very unlikely. You would probably have to put in a tumbler for a year, being in a vehicle would take decades.


I would like to add, to make things clear as much as possible, that my concern is mostly with ammo that was taken out to the field and exposed in one way or another to elements, like rain or snow. Be that ammo sitting in a clip, spare clip, or one of the additional spare carriers, like a belt pouch or but stock pouch. I never thought of it, expecting that ammo be waterproof, but I have doubts now. Any bullets that have been on a hunting trip, for a week or more, sitting in rain, snow for few days, but never fired during that trip, should it be considered good to go, or disposed after a period of time, or to avoid waste used as a range ammo?

The brass will get tarnished, not a big deal. I have ammo that has tarnish patterned imprints from being in a shellholder in weather...It doesn't look good but it's harmless. You can always clean it off with superfine steel wool or a green scrubbie pad if it bugs you.


That begs a question what a properly stored ammo is. Ammo sitting in a safe which is kept in a unheated garage for few years might be not exactly that, or am I wrong?

No worries for us in Canada. In Africa way back in the day there was some .458 ammo that had baked in a game warden warehouse for years that supposedly "caked up" and was shooting with crappy velocity or barely at all. But with todays modern powders, I think ammo in your garage is good for decades. Just go to the range more often!


I am not questioning any of this, as the BOOM is there, every time, but with the powder affected in one way or another the performance might not be there anymore, especially if you trying to reach 200-300 yards or more.

I didn't chrono it, but it sure felt full power.


I have painted a ring of nail polish around the neck where the bullet seats and also around the primer where it seats. Just a thin ring. It dries hard and the shell is now 99.99999% waterproof. I got the idea from looking at milsurp ammo I bought for my SKS. They do it to every round and then seal it hermetically in a can and I expect it works perfectly 200 years later.

Lots of guys nail polish theri primers and neck, but I've never bothered. If I was making ammo to purposely store for a long time I would probably do it though.


I like this idea, but shouldn't high grade, premium ammo have that kind of protecting coating already on it?

Probably the primers. But maybe not. Military ammo designed to be stockpiled usually has more of this sort of precaution.


So.....BOOM! is a better sound than say....KABOOM!!??
I'm laughing at why you would be compelled to do that...
Must of been a slow week in Pemberton...lol

We were discussing getting ammo wet in the rain all season, and factory vs handloads. I actually only intended to keep it submerged overnight but forgot about it. It may have even been 10 days. When I have had a question, I've always been more inclined to find the answer myself rather than ask, if possible.

[jbruce]

I,ve humped shells up and down my hunting patch in the rain and snow for years (box 0f shells will last me five years easy)never had an issue yet

[boblly1]

i have ammo that has been in my cabinet for over 45 years And i use a piece on every animal i have taken in as many years. T.hat is including deer moose or bear everywhere from 40 to over 400 yards so i do not think so.

[squamishhunter]

I would like to add, to make things clear as much as possible, that my concern is mostly with ammo that was taken out to the field and exposed in one way or another to elements, like rain or snow. Be that ammo sitting in a clip, spare clip, or one of the additional spare carriers, like a belt pouch or but stock pouch. I never thought of it, expecting that ammo be waterproof, but I have doubts now. Any bullets that have been on a hunting trip, for a week or more, sitting in rain, snow for few days, but never fired during that trip, should it be considered good to go, or disposed after a period of time, or to avoid waste used as a range ammo?

It's your call.

As someone that works/lives in grizzly country up north I'd rather switch out my ammo for peace of mind.

To add: rolling your cartridges in a rag soaked with gun oil then loaded, seems to help keep moisture/debris from accumulating.

[russm86]

It's your call.

As someone that works/lives in grizzly country up north I'd rather switch out my ammo for peace of mind.

To add: rolling your cartridges in a rag soaked with gun oil then loaded, seems to help keep moisture/debris from accumulating.

I'd be careful with that not to get too much oil on the cartridges, I believe it's been proven that having a fluid film on a case in the action when fired can lead to pressure spikes... I believe oil was especially bad for this as it doesn't compress therefor no case expansion which means smaller space/volume for combustion (= higher pressure) as well as then more force is going to be exerted on the bullet and the bolt face...

[Seeadler]

That begs a question what a properly stored ammo is. Ammo sitting in a safe which is kept in a unheated garage for few years might be not exactly that, or am I wrong?

Heat and humidity would be the issue, chemical reactions slow down with lower temperature. Supposedly, Hodgdon stored the WWII surplus powder they were selling for decades in open air sheds.

I'm still using powder and primers I bought in the 90's. And still shot ammo that has a $3.95 price tag on it, and this is centerfire rifle.

[IronNoggin]

I am not questioning any of this, as the BOOM is there, every time, but with the powder affected in one way or another the performance might not be there anymore, especially if you trying to reach 200-300 yards or more.

LOL! Still looking for "reasons" for those last 4 misses?? :lol:

Methinks in Myth Buster's speak, the theory of compromised ammunition as being the culprit has largely been de-bunked. ;)

Next...

Cheers,
Nog

[nolimits]

LOL! Still looking for "reasons" for those last 4 misses?? :lol:

Methinks in Myth Buster's speak, the theory of compromised ammunition as being the culprit has largely been de-bunked. ;)

Next...

Cheers,
Nog

Yes, still looking for reasons. Seems it is not related to weather, ammo and/or my shooting ability. After a visit to highly recommended local gunsmith, it turns out that I have not one, but two fairly significant issues with my rifle. Damage to the crown and copper build up inside of bore. As we speak the rifle is being worked on, and hopefully it will fix all my issues.

[IronNoggin]

... After a visit to highly recommended local gunsmith, it turns out that I have not one, but two fairly significant issues with my rifle. Damage to the crown and copper build up inside of bore.

Either of which can cause some rather serious accuracy issues, but when combined... :shock:

You're in very good hands with Gary. I suspect he'll have that pea shooter solidly grouping bullseyes in short order.

Good on ya for getting to the bottom of the matter & dealing with it!

Cheers,
Nog

[Salty]

To add: rolling your cartridges in a rag soaked with gun oil then loaded, seems to help keep moisture/debris from accumulating.

That is a bad idea for a bunch of reasons the main one being you never want oil in the chamber it can create pressure increase as russ says and associated sticking and jamming issues. Burned oil will quickly gum up and make subsequent chamberings and firings even more dangerous. Oil everything on guns but never in the chamber.

[russm86]

Yes, still looking for reasons. Seems it is not related to weather, ammo and/or my shooting ability. After a visit to highly recommended local gunsmith, it turns out that I have not one, but two fairly significant issues with my rifle. Damage to the crown and copper build up inside of bore. As we speak the rifle is being worked on, and hopefully it will fix all my issues.

I recommend from now on using a solvent with a copper remover in it when you are cleaning your rifle barrel, I used to use just the old Hoppes No. 9 stuff until I started having accuracy issues with a Remington rifle of mine. After a bunch of dinking around with it someone suggested making sure it was properly cleaned out as I was using Barnes TSX and nosler e-tips. Anyways, I did a few cleanings with Wipeout and couldn't believe how much copper fouling was coming out that was never removed by the Hoppes, I now only use the Wipeout, I love it. PS, some rifles may be better with a little bit of fouling not completely cleaned out so either you can only do 1 run through with wipeout and then leave it or more often what I do is make sure it is 100% clean and then shoot a few fouling shots. I clean between 12 and 20 rounds fired depending on the rifle/ammo etc.