Elk- the big picture

[two-feet]

So just east of Smithers we have a herd of elk that appears to be growing, 20 years ago seeing an elk was a big deal and now i see them once or twice a week if i am in the area.

What is happening where you guys are at? New populations, growing, shrinking?

Do they tend to displace moose?

[walks with deer]

The elk seemed to have displaced moose in some areas of the peace however that said seems like exploration is more the cause of change..

[forestwalker]

i know out east of williams lake, the elk seem to be reappearing. I've seen a couple since we moved out towards likely and have heard from neighbors that their is a good number of them around now. Same thing around horsefly. Talked to people in horsefly that has say that the FLNR have been transplanting elk out that way for the last dozen years or so, don't know whether or not that's accurate but it does get you wondering. I heard there were a few shot out in horsefly fairly recently. Seems to be little information and not many people talking about it if this indeed the case though. They are beginning to reestablish themselves throughout parts of the cariboo though.

Don't know about elk displacing moose, they seem to utilize different habitats of sorts. Would be nice to hear from others with an opinion on the matter.

Cheers

[two-feet]

i know out east of williams lake, the elk seem to be reappearing. I've seen a couple since we moved out towards likely and have heard from neighbors that their is a good number of them around now. Same thing around horsefly. Talked to people in horsefly that has say that the FLNR have been transplanting elk out that way for the last dozen years or so, don't know whether or not that's accurate but it does get you wondering. I heard there were a few shot out in horsefly fairly recently. Seems to be little information and not many people talking about it if this indeed the case though. They are beginning to reestablish themselves throughout parts of the cariboo though.

Don't know about elk displacing moose, they seem to utilize different habitats of sorts. Would be nice to hear from others with an opinion on the matter.

Cheers

i had no clue there were elk around horsefly/likely

[northof49]

No displacement of moose....different habitat and eat different forage. Elk are a wonderful success story for hunters at a time when moose are raking a beating from wolves. IMO elk are much hardier which can be seen by them expanding their ranges to new areas like these. Wwweeeeeee chuckle chuckle chuckle!!!

[walks with deer]

Elk in the peace exploded do to clover cuties. Frack in and displacing that much water dries up swamps.curling become wolf highways I have son first hand. Calf elk equal dinner.


Chuckle chuckle equals your parents where siblings..

Elk display e moose by creating more food hence sustain a larger population of wolves.

Resulting In less stupid moose.

[walks with deer]

Damn auto correct elk equal wolves cutlines equal elk.moose can't compete in survival against elk without water that has been displaced under ground..hope that's more clear

[Caribou_lou]

Id say they displace deer more than moose. At least in the spots I use to hunt East of Smithers. When a season does open up I know where to go! They also live in what use to be Telkwa Caribou wintering grounds. So you think that itself would be enough reason to open a season for them. Problem is our Bios are anti hunting and wolf lovers.

[Fella]

Saw a big bull elk in a spot that I never expected to see him. Moose and deer in there but never seen elk. Very interesting!

[HarryToolips]

According to the bios they're increasing in reg8, and they're supposed to be removing compulsory inspection on them in reg8, so who knows maybe that's true..

[250 sav]

I have seen elk in 6 of the 7 management units around Kamloops that I hunt. Some areas the odd one or small group others large herds. It reminds me of when the whitetails moved in

[HarryToolips]

^^^^^i wonder when the numbers in reg3 will be high enough to support a 6 pt season.....

[250 sav]

Depends on FN harvest. The herds east of town get hit hard on the wintering areas. I would like to see a six point season now as I believe hunting would make them a little spooked and cautious. Now the elk don't seem that wild you can walk within 50 yards before the will spook. So one bad apple could walk up on a group and shoot several or all of a small group at 1 go

[Bugle M In]

In the E.K., I now see more Moose on my Elk Hunt week than Elk??
Unfortunately, the season Moose doesn't open for several weeks at that point.
Seems like the Deer and Elk are more affected by the Wolves than the Moose in that area??!!

[decker9]

Lots of elk being spotted here in 6-04, I heard rumour of a leh for private land, kinda like the doe leh, strictly rumour so far tho.

[Ferenc]

Seen some gooders in Boston bar.... Ahhhh the old one week season .. If it was to come back... Should see a new world record come out of our province if any of these areas open up.

[Norwestalta]

I don't know if elk displace anything but empty space in my freezer. I've seen elk,deer and moose in the same field at the same time. The fn around here don't traditionally hunt elk I think mainly because they were virtually non existent. I've also noticed that the elk help the deer during a high snow year. They seem to break trail for the deer. Over the years the elk population has grown and are becoming somewhat of a problem in the the farm land. I don't know if many of you have seen 100+ head in a bale yard but they do a lot of damage.

[Caribou_lou]

Lots of elk being spotted here in 6-04, I heard rumour of a leh for private land, kinda like the doe leh, strictly rumour so far tho.


I also hear that they mentioned to farmers that the LEH permits will stay local so they will actually be utilized. Wonder how that works?

[GROOTSKY]

I have trail cam pics with elk and moose on the same pic so I don't think they have a problem co-existing. In the Smithers area all the elk seem to stay somewhat lower in the valley bottom, I dont believe they migrate very high into the mountains even during the summer months. The herd east of Smithers has spread out with many elk now seen west of town in the Evelyn / Reiseter Creek area.

[Samsquantch]

I have trail cam pics with elk and moose on the same pic so I don't think they have a problem co-existing. In the Smithers area all the elk seem to stay somewhat lower in the valley bottom, I dont believe they migrate very high into the mountains even during the summer months. The herd east of Smithers has spread out with many elk now seen west of town in the Evelyn / Reiseter Creek area.

They have made it through the pass and have been seen at the copper/clore confluence as of 2013. I saw scat on the backside of treasure mountain a few years ago that was definitely elk.

[boxhitch]

I also hear that they mentioned to farmers that the LEH permits will stay local so they will actually be utilized. Wonder how that works?Not likely to be LEH draw tags , more likely a type of landowner permit, aimed at taking out the problem hay munchers, without using the cull word.
Something similar was run around the table for the south okanagan, BCWF voted against it wishing for a more gos type hunt. Instead, nothing happened

[Seeker]

We don't want a landowner to have a permit, it becomes a privitization issue. I believe that would be the argument the BCWF would present. That being said, there is an antlerless LEH season that has been well received in some areas of region 8. Whether it has achieved the desired results is argueable, but the elk seem to be fairing well enough and management goals(sex ratios) are being met. The elk harvest numbers for region 8 have been on a steady rise in region 8 for the last 5 years. Our herd is getting bigger and more spread out. The wolves are beginning to arrive in numbers as well and it will be interesting to see if the harvest/growth trend continues.

[Norwestalta]

We don't want a landowner to have a permit, it becomes a privitization issue. I believe that would be the argument the BCWF would present. That being said, there is an antlerless LEH season that has been well received in some areas of region 8. Whether it has achieved the desired results is argueable, but the elk seem to be fairing well enough and management goals(sex ratios) are being met. The elk harvest numbers for region 8 have been on a steady rise in region 8 for the last 5 years. Our herd is getting bigger and more spread out. The wolves are beginning to arrive in numbers as well and it will be interesting to see if the harvest/growth trend continues.

Well have the landowner tags here in Alberta. It seems to work out fairly well. I don't know why it would or wouldn't lead to privatization. If you're talking about access? Either you've got permission or you don't. What many people seem to forget is that the elk aren't a problem when the moose and deer season is open. They become a problem mostly during the winter when there's 3' of snow on the ground and it's -25.

The issue with landowner tags in Alberta is mainly mule deer. In many areas it takes 6+ years to draw a mule deer tag so a landowner will deny permission to people so he can groom a nice buck. I don't have mule deer on my land but generally December/January I could have 60 or more elk running around. I don't give permission except for friends,family and neighbors until I've got my elk in the freezer and then have at'er.

[Ourea]

We don't want a landowner to have a permit, it becomes a privitization issue. I believe that would be the argument the BCWF would present. That being said, there is an antlerless LEH season that has been well received in some areas of region 8. Whether it has achieved the desired results is argueable, but the elk seem to be fairing well enough and management goals(sex ratios) are being met. The elk harvest numbers for region 8 have been on a steady rise in region 8 for the last 5 years. Our herd is getting bigger and more spread out. The wolves are beginning to arrive in numbers as well and it will be interesting to see if the harvest/growth trend continues.

FN in Reg 8 is an increasing factor on elk.
Been far more aggressive with harvest in recent yrs.

And as Seeker mentioned....an ever increasing wolf presence.

Despite increased harvest from both FN and residents, coupled with a new wolf component....elk numbers remain strong.
I know in my whitetail areas, where elk were not part of the landscape, they are showing up with more and more consistency.

Elk cover a lot of real estate and are always ranging.
With the ever changing landscape elk will continue to be impacted/displaced and find new ground.

The one key factor is winter range.
Elk populations are determined, for the most part, by how much winter range they have access to.
Poor winter range = low elk numbers

[two-feet]

They have made it through the pass and have been seen at the copper/clore confluence as of 2013. I saw scat on the backside of treasure mountain a few years ago that was definitely elk.
Ya i know a guy that saw one right at the bottom of the copper river rd

[northof49]

Damn auto correct elk equal wolves cutlines equal elk.moose can't compete in survival against elk without water that has been displaced under ground..hope that's more clear

Clear as mud.....thanks tho for clarification

[HarryToolips]

FN in Reg 8 is an increasing factor on elk.
Been far more aggressive with harvest in recent yrs.

And as Seeker mentioned....an ever increasing wolf presence.

Despite increased harvest from both FN and residents, coupled with a new wolf component....elk numbers remain strong.
I know in my whitetail areas, where elk were not part of the landscape, they are showing up with more and more consistency.

Elk cover a lot of real estate and are always ranging.
With the ever changing landscape elk will continue to be impacted/displaced and find new ground.

The one key factor is winter range.
Elk populations are determined, for the most part, by how much winter range they have access to.
Poor winter range = low elk numbers
It's too bad about the FN harvest, I talked to a fellow hunter/conservationist up in the Postill lake area, who lives up there..he said they've come around for their 'harvest' of cows, calves, and whatever else they could shoot a couple times in the past..well, let's just say he 'pressured' them into not hunting around there anymore, or so he says...lets hope a few more of us can have the ballzzz to do the same thing..I personally know one FN member who I have had long conversations with regarding his harvest of female ungulates, and I at least made him feel very very guilty..

[albravo2]

Never saw an elk growing up in PG, now not uncommon.

Used to see dozens of moose, now not that common.

Never, ever saw a whitetail, now not uncommon.

Here in Squamish I see the elk herd regularly, especially when I'm flying. Seems like a healthy herd.

[greenhornhunter]

Was hunting bear between boston bar and the coquihalla and saw a cow and tons of sign everywhere. Was so amazed that there is that much of a moose population so close to the lower mainland

[Jagermeister]

I saw a photo in the early 80's of an elk taken by Andy Halverson near Elysia Resort on Quesnel Lake when Andy owned the resort.
The was a remnant band of elk that ranged in the Skeleton Valley over to Beaver Valley. The herd had stagnant growth until new blood (bull) showed up about 20 or so years ago. I believe that that group splintered to form the herd that frequents the Gravelle Ferry area.
Where the Bouchie Mountain herd and the Strathnave/Hixon herds originated from is anyone's guess.

[decker9]

I also hear that they mentioned to farmers that the LEH permits will stay local so they will actually be utilized. Wonder how that works?

I actually heard the exact same thing, but never believed it just because I have never heard of straight local draws before. It will be interesting to see if there's anything in the regs about it. I know there's some good herds and some big bulls that hang around the north side of Francois lake.

[Cordillera]

Elk in the Bulkley Valley have been around for a while but are doing better probably due to easier winters in the past decade. In deep snow years of past they would have gotten hammered where moose would have still done ok (moose have long legs for a reason). Where elk move in, and habitat is present, they can do well because they have more twins and triplets than most species. This kind of shift between species has been going on for a long time. Moose in the Bulkley valley were rare a hundred years ago and caribou were plentiful. We humans just don't like admitting that nature is dynamic.

[wideopenthrottle]

saw a huge bull on the way up to Lillooet...we were heading up for a mule deer hunt when I saw an elk crossing sign..i said to my buddy...I didn't know the elk were getting established here, is there a season?...as I said that a huge bull popped up beside the road , watched us slow down a bit and then crossed behind us...I would say that they put the sign in the right place...heheheheh

[HarryToolips]

^^^^see, why isn't there a 6 pt only season in region 3??, we should be asking our bio's this...I'm sure it's for some stupid political reason..

[GROOTSKY]

I don't think that we in the B.V. should be in any hurry to open up any sort of season on elk. Let them get established, get the numbers up and see how they fair after a few tough winters

[HarryToolips]

^^^but obviously there is scattered herds in region 3, I've heard in other areas of southern region 3 as well..I have been educated numerous times, mostly by people on this site, that a 6 pt only season does not hurt the population, which makes sense...if you think about it, a 6 pt only season would give greater genetic bio-diversity amongst a given herd, as the odd dominant bull would be harvested therefore allowing lesser bulls to do some breeding no???..therefore why not open up this season, the same one as in region 8/4..

[Norwestalta]

Seen elk in toad river. My cousin also has them around his cabin in Whitehorse.

[markomoose]

I saw a photo in the early 80's of an elk taken by Andy Halverson near Elysia Resort on Quesnel Lake when Andy owned the resort.
The was a remnant band of elk that ranged in the Skeleton Valley over to Beaver Valley. The herd had stagnant growth until new blood (bull) showed up about 20 or so years ago. I believe that that group splintered to form the herd that frequents the Gravelle Ferry area.
Where the Bouchie Mountain herd and the Strathnave/Hixon herds originated from is anyone's guess.
I've seen the Gravelle Ferry herd a few times now with a real nice big bull.

[two-feet]

Several years ago at this same time of year i was walking out from a successful bear hunt near Telkwa and jumped a big bull in velvet, it is so great that there is another type of animal to add to potentially see in the bush around here.

[butcher]

seen them recently at bridge lake, willow river, Adams lake, Clearwater, takla lake, Merritt and the usual spots like bull river, chetwynd, mcbride and valemount. They are everywhere.

[wideopenthrottle]

was moose hunting up near PG about 15 years ago sitting at the side of a pond calling for awhile...decided to move on but had a smoke to check wind and do a good look around before I moved...as soon as I stood there was a sound behind me..i thought it was the biggest mule deer I had ever seen when I saw the antlers...then as it wove its way through the trees I got a look at it's obvious elk ass...my rifle was up and aimed as soon as I saw wood.. flame on! for not using binos

[hunter1947]

The elk population whee I hunt is staying stable..

[Glenny]

i had no clue there were elk around horsefly/likely

I had no clue there was an Elk season or an LEH around horsefly. "But they are being shot there."

[curt]

110% agree the problem with that is greasey guide outfitters pay land owners to keep residents off and pay for private rights to fill leh draws its dirty and crooked but its happened in 7b lots!!! Or yo get the very familiar response you can only shoot the cows no bulls.......... because they are spoken for


We don't want a landowner to have a permit, it becomes a privitization issue. I believe that would be the argument the BCWF would present. That being said, there is an antlerless LEH season that has been well received in some areas of region 8. Whether it has achieved the desired results is argueable, but the elk seem to be fairing well enough and management goals(sex ratios) are being met. The elk harvest numbers for region 8 have been on a steady rise in region 8 for the last 5 years. Our herd is getting bigger and more spread out. The wolves are beginning to arrive in numbers as well and it will be interesting to see if the harvest/growth trend continues.

[curt]

The problem is a 6 point season doesnt really hurt the herd however if there is any type of season opened then the natives can go in a shoot whatever they deem appropriate. AND THAT IS FACT I had an in depth conversation with a kamloops CO his words exactly........ even to the extreme if there is 1 LEH for whatever animal you name it 1 draw FN have open season if you dont believe me make a few calls its fact! The only way to somewhat control what they harvest is no season period and again thats fact do your research! sad but true


^^^but obviously there is scattered herds in region 3, I've heard in other areas of southern region 3 as well..I have been educated numerous times, mostly by people on this site, that a 6 pt only season does not hurt the population, which makes sense...if you think about it, a 6 pt only season would give greater genetic bio-diversity amongst a given herd, as the odd dominant bull would be harvested therefore allowing lesser bulls to do some breeding no???..therefore why not open up this season, the same one as in region 8/4..

[250 sav]

The problem is a 6 point season doesnt really hurt the herd however if there is any type of season opened then the natives can go in a shoot whatever they deem appropriate. AND THAT IS FACT I had an in depth conversation with a kamloops CO his words exactly........ even to the extreme if there is 1 LEH for whatever animal you name it 1 draw FN have open season if you dont believe me make a few calls its fact! The only way to somewhat control what they harvest is no season period and again thats fact do your research! sad but true

They are shooting them anyway

[panhead]

Can't remember where I read it, but it said the Chilcotin was mostly elk at one time ... now moose (if you can find one.)
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Desire is the cause of all suffering.

[wos]

I posted an elk shed I found on the gang about 3 years ago. It was an old shed but it shows they are everywhere.

[Bugle M In]

The problem is a 6 point season doesnt really hurt the herd however if there is any type of season opened then the natives can go in a shoot whatever they deem appropriate. AND THAT IS FACT I had an in depth conversation with a kamloops CO his words exactly........ even to the extreme if there is 1 LEH for whatever animal you name it 1 draw FN have open season if you dont believe me make a few calls its fact! The only way to somewhat control what they harvest is no season period and again thats fact do your research! sad but true

Yup...it is sad.... and it is true.

[Bugle M In]

110% agree the problem with that is greasey guide outfitters pay land owners to keep residents off and pay for private rights to fill leh draws its dirty and crooked but its happened in 7b lots!!! Or yo get the very familiar response you can only shoot the cows no bulls.......... because they are spoken for

I've seen these type of comments before, and I suspect this will only happen more in the future.
Privatization has already started for hunting here in BC, even though it is not written, it is happening.

[boxhitch]

All the more reason to fight against the privatization of Crown lands. We don`t want a mess like they have south of 49.
Folks here don`t realize how lucky we are and take access for granted too easily. Trespass fees are just the start.

[HarryToolips]

They are shooting them anyway
Yes, Ive heard the same rumor, that the natives have shot elk around the Merritt area, so if theyre shooting them anyway, we may as well open up a 6 pt season in region 3, it would hopefully help the herd with more hunting pressure to keep them away from the FN groups..

[REMINGTON JIM]

a Buddy lives across the Fraser river from Quesnel and says there are BIG herds of them there ! RJ