What's the best 12 gauge defender to pack around?

[JPG]

I'm keen to buy a packable shotgun after having one too many run ins with bears lately.
Many advice or opinions would greatly be appreciated. Something light weight as I tend to be on foot a lot. Also what ammo?
regards,
Jesse.

[BgBlkDg]

Owned and used Win. Mod 12, several Remmy 870s, a High-Standard and both a Benelli Nova and a 14" Super Nova.

I now use only Benellis, they have been the best for me.

Bears, if I need to, Brenneke slugs and for "vermin" OO or SSG buckshot.

[BiG Boar]

Just carry bear spray. Easy to pack, and you're probably more ready and accessible and more likely to carry it often. If I was going to a fresh kill it would be a different story, but of the thousands of hikers in our province, your chances of attack are so remote its not even a whole number. Even the guys who do get attacked with guns, often times are of no actual use. But if I had to carry one, it would not be a pistol grip, (they are not accurate) and it would be a pump action. And not a chinese knock off.

[mpotzold]

I have aWinchester Defender 1300 & only use Brenneke 3” slugs for protection.Forget about the buckshot. It simply lacks penetration(plenty of articles).
Never had to use the Defender yet .It’s mostly used for camp defence.

Practicing one day I had the Defender jam on me when using slug,buckshot,slug combo.

A 45/70 7lbs GG is considerably superior to any shotgun for bear defence. Use over 500gr solids with a wide meplat.

[BgBlkDg]

I found that my two lever .45-70s, custom built for working in remote Griuzzly country, were much harder to control with the heavy handloads, kicked VERY hard and were also quite costly. So, I would not choose these again and I am very used to shooting heavy rifles very fast and well....or was until my recent back issues.

All in all, I tend more and more to agree with Dave, (Big Boar) on this and have spent hundreds of days/nights alone in G country, unarmed and my favourite tool for this is the little Freon horns we used in the Coast Guard station boats.

Each to his/her own, but, most will NOT practice enough to make a bear gun really worth packing.

[Robin]

For bear protection I use a FabArms SDASS Martial 12g 14". I load 1 round 00 buck for a dirt shot or just noise the rest are slugs. Fortunately I've only had to use it for the noise affect.

[bcshadow]

I have a mossberg maverick 88. Fortunately, I haven't had to use it for defense but I load the 3 inch slugs as previously suggested. Pretty light, but the shoulder suffers. I make sure it is in good order before I head out. This is a basic gun, but I am happy with it, no problems and have put quite a few shells through. You should be able to find them at good pricing in a few stores.

[604ksmith]

I recently purchased a Mossberg 590A1 with tactical forend (120lumens) for about $650 and couldn't be happier.

The gun comes with a 6 shot tub, 18 inch heavy barrel, and a tang safety. The quality is amazing, this is the only shotgun to pass the US Military testing requirements. Having a light built into your forend also really comes in handy, and IMO should now be a requirement for any bear defence gun.

[Elkchaser]

870 pump with 20 inch deer barrel. Proven, simple, very reliable and stands up to harsh treatment. Magnum receiver holds four 3 inch slugs in tube with plug removed. As I've said before - only as effective as operator. Did 12 years of work required annual live range exams and always blast off 5-10 slugs at range on 10 yard targets every time I'm there. Put five slugs in GB at 7 yards on an elk kill in 2008. It works, but primarily due to muscle memory. If you don't plan on practicing a lot, and doing so under artificial self imposed pressures of time/accuracy, probably should go with biggest can of bear spray you can find.

[180grainer]

Still working on getting an old 870 wingmaster and converting it with a 20 inch barrel and 3 shot mag extension. Don't want to do it with the one I use for bird hunting. Best pump shotgun around and one all others are measured against.

[RiverRunner]

Build one.
Remington 870 wingmaster
12" barrel
various other custom components
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a166/rodflyrod/IMG_2431.jpg (http://s11.photobucket.com/user/rodflyrod/media/IMG_2431.jpg.html)

http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a166/rodflyrod/IMG_2420.jpg (http://s11.photobucket.com/user/rodflyrod/media/IMG_2420.jpg.html)

[604ksmith]

That's a damn good looking gun!

[180grainer]

Build one.
Remington 870 wingmaster
12" barrel
various other custom components


That's the gun. I'd do it a little different with a 20 inch barrel, blued, and keeping the wood, but the workings of the gun would still be the same. What type of choke did you put in it? I was thinking a mod choke. Have you ever patterned the gun to see what's happening?

[todbartell]

I'd take a centerfire rifle. Marlin 1895 Guide Gun in 45/70, Ruger m77 Alaskan 375 Ruger, Ruger m77 Scout 308, among others. Short, light, lots of thump, and versatile for use in hunting situations too

If I was to get a shotgun I'd be probably looking at a MagPul stocked Mossberg 590A1, but too heavy to pack very far!

[caddisguy]

I have a dominion grizzly compact 12ga I picked up a number of years ago. Great little gun with an 8 inch barrel and retractable stock. It's basically an 870 clone with a custom barrel so the ring fits over the short magazine tube. I only wish that I could buy a longer barrel so I could legally hunt with it. No such luck though :( Great little gun otherwise fun plinking around with.

[180grainer]

I'd take a centerfire rifle. Marlin 1895 Guide Gun in 45/70, Ruger m77 Alaskan 375 Ruger, Ruger m77 Scout 308, among others. Short, light, lots of thump, and versatile for use in hunting situations too

If I was to get a shotgun I'd be probably looking at a MagPul stocked Mossberg 590A1, but too heavy to pack very far!
If it's a one gun hunting situation then your only going to have the gun you're hunting with which wouldn't be a shotgun. Unless of course you're hunting ducks. Mossberg claims that shotgun is the only one to pass the MilSpec 3443E yet more 870's are used by militaries and police worldwide than any other shotgun....go figure...:)

[hoochie]

anyone else have one of these?
Browning Hi-Cap 7+1
I put a high vis front sight and added some length to the stock. fugly, but I love it

~[URL=http://s800.photobucket.com/user/mrmabley/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20151027_190223_zpsglfndbnc.jpg.html]http://i800.photobucket.com/albums/yy284/mrmabley/Mobile%20Uploads/20151027_190223_zpsglfndbnc.jpg[/URL

[RiverRunner]

That's the gun. I'd do it a little different with a 20 inch barrel, blued, and keeping the wood, but the workings of the gun would still be the same. What type of choke did you put in it? I was thinking a mod choke. Have you ever patterned the gun to see what's happening?

Pretty sure its improved cylinder… came with the barrel. Mainly it's a slug gun. By having a XS big dot sight on it that is taller than your regular bead… the usual problem of hitting high with such a short barrel is counteracted. Out to 30 yards,,, put the white dot on what you want to hit…. and it will hit.

[kevan]

My carry gun is an old Remington 12 ga. double hammer gun with 16" tubes.
Originally made for some unknown ' security ' company it has served me well.
Breaks down into 3 pcs., barrels, forearm and butt it takes up no space in a pack and actually has sling swivels if one should need.

[mpotzold]

I found that my two lever .45-70s, custom built for working in remote Griuzzly country, were much harder to control with the heavy handloads, kicked VERY hard and were also quite costly. So, I would not choose these again and I am very used to shooting heavy rifles very fast and well....or was until my recent back issues.

All in all, I tend more and more to agree with Dave, (Big Boar) on this and have spent hundreds of days/nights alone in G country, unarmed and my favourite tool for this is the little Freon horns we used in the Coast Guard station boats.

Each to his/her own, but, most will NOT practice enough to make a bear gun really worth packing.


I don’t-you know what they say about statistics!:wink:

Jesse had some recent close calls & wants to have an equalizer if charged. Better be safe than sorry.

Stopping a charge by a predatory bear are slim to none using bear spray even when hit directly, in time & with no wind. We have a couple cans handy at camp in case a bear wonders in. Wouldn’t want to shoot a curious bear! :cry:
Anti-gun LIBERAL propaganda comes to mind!

Chances of a hunter/bear encounter followed by a charge is not rare. Hikers are not hunters as they frequent heavily used trails & are a lot noisier especially when in groups. As a hunter I’ve had 5 bear(1 grizz) close encounters since 2007 that had a potential to turn nasty .I (2x with Eve) faced black bears with my rifle chambered & shouldered but the bear chickened out. With the grizz charge we didn’t have a weapon handy –the screaming diverted the charge with only feet to spare.

Lost count of bear attacks in BC this year but in only a 10 day period in Sept. there were 4 hunters attacked by grizzly in BC alone. There were probably many more charges/attacks by both grizz & black on both hunters & non-hunters that were not reported especially in the US.

Some final advice in writing.
TO MORRIS AUG.18,2007
ALWAYS PACKA GUN WHEN IN BEAR COUNTRY.
Gary Shelton

[Gateholio]

For bear defense, I would rather carry my 375 Ruger if I was actually concerned about grizzly bears, or if not really that worried, my 45 Colt M94 Trapper, or even my Rossi Ranch Hand 45 Colt If I just wanted to carry something.

When I carry a shotgun (rare these days) it's a 870 clone with a 14" barrel and a front sight I hand filed myself. It's pretty big, which is important for fast aiming. I also use a youth buttstock on it, to make it a bit shorter. I use 2 3/4" Brenneke slugs rather than the 3" as recoil is reduced for faster follow up shots and you can often get an extra one in the magazine. Pictured below (on top) is a Maverick 88 with an 18" barrel, that I used to use, and has been all over BC and the Yukon, on mountains, horses, canoes and kayaks. It has virtually no original finish left so every now and then it gets a paint job. The black shotgun is the 870 clone, which ironically runs better than the last Remington I used

https://scontent-yyz1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfp1/v/t1.0-9/10489685_10152506152845516_7975341203298407874_n.j pg?oh=8e3a756b3664a588269466950dda6f38&oe=56B8052E

[okas]

sold some old shot guns and bought a KSG all in one as 14.... 2 3/4 in the tubes... keep the 44rem. Rossi ranch hand as well.

[RadHimself]

I carry a 70's vintage 870 wingmaster, 18" barrel, slugs and a sling to the end of magazine. When hiking, the rest of the time my rifle doesnt leave my hands

[Daka]

Good old SxS with 18" bores. Just above forearm to make it legal and able to shoot....
double triggers and one double O and slug in other...
most likely charging bear wont give you much time to pump 3 or 4 shots...
easy to carry in backpack,to load and manouvre in thick brush as well

[kevan]

Good old SxS with 18" bores. Just above forearm to make it legal and able to shoot....
double triggers and one double O and slug in other...
most likely charging bear wont give you much time to pump 3 or 4 shots...
easy to carry in backpack,to load and manouvre in thick brush as well

My thinking also as I said in post # 19...

[RadHimself]

Depends how you run the pump... Practice it enough and its damn near full auto

im trying to track down a Nam era Ithaca model 37 with a duck bill

[Ohwildwon]

http://i284.photobucket.com/albums/ll37/mikemcclement/12006679_912255722189056_3407767094963372128_o_zps kpbjxs9k.jpg (http://s284.photobucket.com/user/mikemcclement/media/12006679_912255722189056_3407767094963372128_o_zps kpbjxs9k.jpg.html)




The Predator that is...:)

[180grainer]

Depends how you run the pump... Practice it enough and its damn near full auto

im trying to track down a Nam era Ithaca model 37 with a duck bill
Any old Ithaca will do. Get one of those and then add the parts. If you check out the old trench guns they had the same old engravings on the sides as your grandpa's slam fire duck gun.

[Daka]

Depends how you run the pump... Practice it enough and its damn near full auto

im trying to track down a Nam era Ithaca model 37 with a duck bill

It can be done when practising but when something is coming fast from other side in your direction, reflexes and training dont really show bright side...

[835]

What no votes for the Maverik 88?
im surprised how cool this thread has been kept this time! i thought Robin was goin down with the fabarm!

i have a 88 with a scabbard, pistol grip to keep a low profile when walking down coastal rivers through the shit...... but if it had a Butt it would be more accuratly shot and better controled..... id rather a 1985 45/70 because it would have more uses and be more fun,,, but the 88 is 250$ as apposed to 800$ for a JM ....

but you got guys here recomending everything from "bear spice" to The 500G War hammer......... so take yer pic!

[180grainer]

Unless you're going to hold up a bank, pistol grips are functionally inferior to a shoulder held shotgun, (as far as I'm concerned they're all Hollywood). If you have one, just go out with a buddy, (of equal skill) with a regular pump and try to see who's "more accurate" and who's "faster" at putting three rounds on a target at 15 yards. Bet you lose on both counts.

[180grainer]

Depends how you run the pump... Practice it enough and its damn near full auto

im trying to track down a Nam era Ithaca model 37 with a duck billHere you go. I watch this video every now and then just cause the guy makes me laugh. But he's got what your looking for. https://youtu.be/ApdTCbpGW_4

[kootenaycarver]

Remington 870 Wingmaster with 18 in. cylinder choke barrel, folding composite stock. As good as it gets for defence shotguns.

[835]

Unless you're going to hold up a bank, pistol grips are functionally inferior to a shoulder held shotgun, (as far as I'm concerned they're all Hollywood). If you have one, just go out with a buddy, (of equal skill) with a regular pump and try to see who's "more accurate" and who's "faster" at putting three rounds on a target at 15 yards. Bet you lose on both counts.

you are correct,,,,
but it is a hell of a step up from bear spray..... and when you are climbing through the thick shit on the side of a river full of Coho...... you sure like the pistol grip because it sits below your shoulder line...
this question is all "application" and comfort level....

45/70 with 500gr Pile Drivers might be best, but if you are a recoil nanny you might get hurt..
12Ga full of slugs and a full stock is great but if you are in heavy cover a second shot doesnt exsist any way....
375 is just plain cool regardless but it is an expensive defense rifle...... but makes up for that in fun....
Bear spray is perfect if you have come to the conclusion that there are 1000's of guys spending 1000's of hours in the bush and dont get hurt and can also handle a "Bear situation" without freaking out...

i will still stick with my pistoled mavrick full of slugs.... cuz its comphy and convieniant... plus it is a hell ov a step up from Spice......
though i do aggree the accuracy and controle of a Full stock is way better


What is best? Who the hell knows beacuse sure as hell no one can aggree here! lol

[stevo911_]

Check out corwin-arms.com
He imports shotguns from Turkey, I have a couple of them and they're great.
The Sinsinati is exceptionally good quality for the price, it's a weatherby pa-459 (made in the same factory to the same spec) with immaculate fit and finish, just different stock and sights. He has some clip fed semis too. Short barrelled shotguns are his bread and butter.
He's a one-man operation, so his stock changes depending on what he's importing at any given time, couldn't be happier with his products (he's located in kamloops, but will be at the vic gun show this weekend)

[ElliotMoose]

I have an old beat up mossberg Mav 88 with the 18 inch barrel that has been my defence gun for years. Has yet to fail me thus far so for 250 bucks it really can't be beat. I have shot friends 870's and some of them seem to jam with certain ammo. I did pick up a brand new marlin 1895 GBL this year along with a couple boxes of 430 grain buffalo bore bullets because, well, it looks cool. Plus, with the proper ammo, it can be used as a hunting rifle for any big game animal we have here in BC. If you are recoil sensitive it may not be all that enjoyable to shoot... Although I think the maverick loaded with 3" 1 1/4 oz slugs kicks just as hard

[mpotzold]

you are correct,,,,
but it is a hell of a step up from bear spray..... and when you are climbing through the thick shit on the side of a river full of Coho...... you sure like the pistol grip because it sits below your shoulder line...
this question is all "application" and comfort level....

45/70 with 500gr Pile Drivers might be best, but if you are a recoil nanny you might get hurt..
12Ga full of slugs and a full stock is great but if you are in heavy cover a second shot doesnt exsist any way....
375 is just plain cool regardless but it is an expensive defense rifle...... but makes up for that in fun....
Bear spray is perfect if you have come to the conclusion that there are 1000's of guys spending 1000's of hours in the bush and dont get hurt and can also handle a "Bear situation" without freaking out...

i will still stick with my pistoled mavrick full of slugs.... cuz its comphy and convieniant... plus it is a hell ov a step up from Spice......
though i do aggree the accuracy and controle of a Full stock is way better


What is best? Who the hell knows beacuse sure as hell no one can aggree here! lol

Years ago took the Defender with a few other rifles to the Coquitlam gun range. First time firing the 3” Brenneke slug the fierce recoil cut my forehead(no scope on Defender).

Eve uses only the 325gr Leverevolution in her 45/70 GG and has no problem with the recoil.

Shooting the 540 gr Garretts doesn’t bother me that much.

The 375 H&H recoil shooting the 300 gr seems to be less than a 325 gr Leverevolution but the gun is too big & too heavy.
And forget about a scoped rifle if using it for bear defense.One of our 45/70’s has a detachable scope.

If recoil is an issue put on a slip-on or permanent recoil pad on your gun &/or a shoulder recoil pad.
Also consider a ported barrel .

[180grainer]

hhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

[hunter1947]

12 gauge remington 870..

[moosinaround]

Anyone know if they make a bayonet for a rem 870 Shotty? I like to have the added hand to hand combat function as well as the slugs!! Moosin

[Ride Red]

I've been packing this one in my boat and scouting trips. Take the breacher out and screw a modified choke into it. It shoots the full mag into a 4" group at 50 yards off the bench. There are more 870's in the world today than any other shotgun for a reason, reliability.

Model 870™ Express® Tactical

Overview
Specifications

http://www.remington.com/~/media/50CE0C06B0504175B0CA8AB478DAA96E.ashx Overview:Remington tactical shotguns are rugged, ultra-dependable and continually evolve as they’re called to serve in new, increasingly demanding environments. Built on our legendary pump action that’s become the gold standard for high-risk applications, the Model 870™ Express Tactical with a quick pointing 18 1/2" barrel and includes our extended ported Tactical Rem Choke. It packs a full 7 rounds of 2 3/4" or 3" 12-gauge firepower with the factory installed 2-shot extension.
The Model 870™ Express® Tactical with XS® Ghost Ring Sights is optimized for rapid target acquisition and precise shot placement with the XS blade sight and XS Ghost Ring sight rail (fully adjustable for windage and elevation), which accepts optics and sight systems as well. Both models have black synthetic stocks and fore-ends with sling swivel studs. Receivers are drilled and tapped.
Key Features:

18 1/2" tactical barrel with XS® front blade sight RC Tactical (ext/ported tube)
XS Ghost Ring sight Rail (mounts to receiver)
Sight is fully adjustable for windage and elevation
Front blade sight works in conjunction with Ghost Ring to quickly and accurately acquire target
Tactical style fore-end
2-shot magazine extension
Receiver drilled and tapped for scope mounts (XS Picatinney rail with ghost ring included)

[Edge]

I have a mossberg maverick 88. Fortunately, I haven't had to use it for defense but I load the 3 inch slugs as previously suggested. Pretty light, but the shoulder suffers. I make sure it is in good order before I head out. This is a basic gun, but I am happy with it, no problems and have put quite a few shells through. You should be able to find them at good pricing in a few stores.

I also carry the Mossberg maverick 88...$199 @ Cabelas on sale. cheap, reliable and pretty light. slugs as well..my $.02

[mpotzold]

Anyone know if they make a bayonet for a rem 870 Shotty? I like to have the added hand to hand combat function as well as the slugs!! Moosin

There you go!:wink:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v643/thegreatveggie/870/profilezombiekiller.jpg (http://www.google.ca/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=images&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CAcQjRxqFQoTCI-z96yT7cgCFVDeYwod-EEGTQ&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.shotgunworld.com%2Fbbs%2Fview topic.php%3Ff%3D7%26t%3D40059%26start%3D4760&psig=AFQjCNGCRZjJD3SWH76sEzZ4sReiaz0yFA&ust=1446395786133743)

[Iron Glove]

I also carry the Mossberg maverick 88...$199 @ Cabelas on sale. cheap, reliable and pretty light. slugs as well..my $.02

Same here, been lugging it around for years if and when I think it might be wise.
I put a pistol grip with a folder on it, the grip has a high degree of recoil reduction in it, I forget the make.
It makes slug shooting a lot more bearable.

[180grainer]

1949 recoil operated Remington Sportsman 48. The mag extension is just for show as it would make it 7+1.
http://i1308.photobucket.com/albums/s610/Fbean102/HPIM0003_zpsr7etrqo5.jpg

[180grainer]

870 tactical. Still looking for a wood butt stock from a Wingmaster. Have a better front grip for it too. Just haven't put it on.
http://i1308.photobucket.com/albums/s610/Fbean102/870%20Tactical_zpsbi9ayrll.jpg

[Dutch]

1949 recoil operated Remington Sportsman 48. The mag extension is just for show as it would make it 7+1.
http://i1308.photobucket.com/albums/s610/Fbean102/HPIM0003_zpsr7etrqo5.jpg

Nice old girl have one in 28g not for defence but sweet ,so my advice try some out ,watched 3 guys at the gun club with there "tactical" shotties I believe anything that was after them was relatively safe ,in fact ,they suffered more than the supposed attackers