Is it worth spending more on some shotguns?

[Marlowethelazydog]

All,

This must be a fairly classic question by now. I am an avid upland bird/hare hunter working the forest and fields from August through end of April (not counting Turkey hunts and big game). Twice a week I hit the trees and will cover 6- 10 hours of ground depending on sunlight, weather etc. Currently, I have a 410 bore, 20gauge and 12gauge all relatively cheap guns (I think the most I paid was about $550 and that was for the Winchester 12gauge).
For the other avid upland hunters out there that like to do lots of walking, is it worth upgrading to a finer firearm in the neighborhood of $1500 - $2000? I know accuracy isn’t going to be a benefit and all that pretty wood on the fancier guns is going to get scratched over the years. Is the fit and feel all that much better than say a 870 Express? Longevity? For the double guns (my 410 bore is one albeit a cheap lightweight Stoeger) in particular is it worth spending the money to upgrade to a Browning or Benelli?
A little about my tastes – I shoot skeet but very casually often my own thrower not at the club. From a hunting stance I likely don’t fire 4 boxes of shells from each of my 3 shotguns a season (so a little less than 300 in total) – but I do hunt most every week and rarely come home without game. In total I generally go through a full case of shells per shotgun per year counting trap/skeet and hunting (maybe a little less in the 410 bore as I only hunt with it for 2 month or so out of the year).

Advice appreciated!

Thanks.

[B.C.Boy(100%)]

I don't know about fit and finish of shotguns in the value range you mentioned.

I used to use an 870WM 12g for a while for upland birds, but it was long, that was my minor beef with it.
I found an 870 LW Special Field in 20g it's much shorter, and lighter, much handier to carry through the thick when jumping from meadow to meadow.

For me it was about length of firearm, it's function over fashion for me, mind you the little english styled 20g has both.
Just before I stumbled upon the 20g I was looking at the Weatherby SA-08 Compact in 20g for upland hunts.

May not have answered your question, just my two cents.

[Marlowethelazydog]

I don't know about fit and finish of shotguns in the value range you mentioned.

I used to use an 870WM 12g for a while for upland birds, but it was long, that was my minor beef with it.
I found an 870 LW Special Field in 20g it's much shorter, and lighter, much handier to carry through the thick when jumping from meadow to meadow.

For me it was about length of firearm, it's function over fashion for me, mind you the little english styled 20g has both.
Just before I stumbled upon the 20g I was looking at the Weatherby SA-08 Compact in 20g for upland hunts.

May not have answered your question, just my two cents.

Length is important to me as well. I find even 26" too long sometimes which is why I use a short barreled 410 (20") until the foliage drops its leaves and I start longer shots. I generally don't use the 12 at all until there is snow on the ground and I find I am actually shooting out to 40 yards. I guess the advantage of a double is that it is shorter with the same length of barrel as a pump. Semi Auto's are generally out for me and while I don't have tons of experience with them I have seen many jam up in Northern hunts (albeit likely due to too much oil in the action). Doubles get expensive fast but it is really unclear to me how much I need to spend for an honest to god reliable work horse. The Stoeger is actually a good gun but I replaced the firing pins with harder ones (cost about $30). I haven't had any issues with Stoeger, but the online reviews are pretty hit and miss.

[albravo2]

Interesting question. I've been pondering the same question on a number of different fronts lately.

I think you get 95% of the functionality from a cheap version but only 50% of the owner satisfaction of a 'nice' gun. A cheap, beat up gun may kill birds or bunnies as well or better than a beautiful side-by-side but you don't get the same happiness every time you touch or see the gun.

I have a perfectly functional Buck knife but it is functional, not satisfying. My Bark River knife is a work of art and craftsmanship and it give me a little pleasure every time I see it or use it. It isn't quite as good as my Havalon for skinning, but I still prefer the feel of it in my hand.

[BigD_83]

Rifles, shotguns, and handguns are tools, toys, or both. They can be funcitonal and ugly, or beautiful and shoot crooked, and any combination between.

Your quiver is pretty solid, but if the esthetics are important to you, and a beautiful, well-machined gun makes you want to go out more, then I don't see an issue with spending more to do that. Personally, I wouldn't want to give up too much else to make it happen.

I won't display my guns, so for me, function is more important than form.

[SSG-man]

When I just go out focusing on birds I usually take the 22 or 223 even so I could possibly shoot a deer but shotguns I like my basic HR break action over my 870 for lightness and quiet action.
smooth quiet action would matter to me if I was spending more money

[1/2 slam]

I've used Ithaca's, Winchesters and Remington's. All were very functional and did the job. Then I bought an over and under F.A.I.R.( Fabbrica Armi Isidoro Rizzini) A beautiful Italian made 16 ga. It's light, fast and fits me very well. I'll never go back. If it gets banged up so be it.

[BgBlkDg]

IME, a really fine gun simply balances and handles far better and I also enjoy the aesthetic aspect of it. I have had some pretty choice pieces over the past half century+, but, am not really much of a shotgunner.

I loved doubles and combo guns, but, am now using a Benelli Nova and a Super Nova, plus my Miroku-Browning Mod. 42 pump .410, my "truck gun" used for Grouse. I sold all my nice doubles and O.U, but, still have a Merkel drilling in 12-9.3x74R and a Browning Mod. 7500 O/U in .308Win-12ga.

Are these guns "worth it" as a couple of them cost major coin? That is up to the owner/user and we all have different tastes. budgets and desires.......its only money and GUNS are much more important than that!!!! :)

[adriaticum]

My personal view is that until you have tried all the cheap ones, you shouldn't.
There is nothing particularly different between a $300 O/U and a $3000 O/U other than things that don't make it shoot any better.
Expensive shotguns just have fancier stock and finer engraving and prettier colours, and if you really want to pay than they can also customize and build a gun for your length of pull and balance it for you.
They don't shoot any straighter and they are not any more reliable in terms of click/bang ratios.

But fancy shotguns are easy on the eyes.



(Not my shotgun)

http://www.gundogmag.com/files/2013/12/dreamdoubles_beretta_F.jpg

[250 sav]

love my my bps uplands 20 gauge with a 22 inch barrel for uplands.I have been dissapointed with cheap over under and s/s shotguns

[Marlowethelazydog]

love my my bps uplands 20 gauge with a 22 inch barrel for uplands.I have been dissapointed with cheap over under and s/s shotguns

I have been looking at that BPS Upland - decent price and good size. Maybe a stupid question, but any problems feeding in cold weather? I have seen this on a couple shotguns (not Browning, but Weatherby) and in my mind I attribute it to poor maintenance by the owners.

Thanks everyone for your feedback so far, some good points made.

[justachip]

The one thing you will gain with a "better" shot gun is reliability no broken firing pins or jamming up. Nothing worse on a hunting trip than a gun failure. We all count the days to get out there so we want to enjoy every minuet.

[Cdn-Redneck]

Shoot a beretta over and under and you will be forever in love with one.

[VLD43]

In order for a shotgun to shoot well for you, it must be properly fit. The gun must shoot where you are looking. I shoot a lot of skeet (about 5000 rounds a year). The gun I use for this is a Browning Grade 7 Citori. I also shoot trap, and use a Perazzi over and under for this. I would never dream of using an over & under for bird hunting, as it is the wrong choice. When bird hunting, I always use a pump or autoloader. Probably one of the best bird gun designs out there, is a side by side. Over & unders have a very deep receiver and are not as quick to reload as a side by side, which by comparison has a very shallow receiver, and reloads quickly. A lot of african Professional hunters use rifles which are side by sides for this very reason(quick follow ups and reloading). As most of use can not necessarily afford a good side by side, pumps and autoloaders are the next logical choice. What ever you decide, know that the two most important things to address are proper fit, and lots of practice. There are a lot of good articles on the internet that explain how to properly fit a shotgun. A good gunsmith can help you with fit. If you understand stock geometry, it is possible to get a pretty cheap shotgun to shoot well. Also know, that buying a more expensive gun, does not mean you will shoot better.

[250 sav]

I have been looking at that BPS Upland - decent price and good size. Maybe a stupid question, but any problems feeding in cold weather? I have seen this on a couple shotguns (not Browning, but Weatherby) and in my mind I attribute it to poor maintenance by the owners.

Thanks everyone for your feedback so far, some good points made.About 8000 rounds through the uplands a no problems

[250 sav]

The one thing you will gain with a "better" shot gun is reliability no broken firing pins or jamming up. Nothing worse on a hunting trip than a gun failure. We all count the days to get out there so we want to enjoy every minuet.
I agree 100%

[britman101]

Also keep an open mind to second hand shotguns which have been kept in very good condition by their owners. Sign of the times but I am noticing on hunting forums guys trying to get some cash in hand by selling their good quality over/under or side by side shotguns. And some by very good gun makers not junk. A good way to save some money and yet get a shot gun that can give you many enjoyable hours of hunting out in the field. My two cents worth on the matter.

[Foxton Gundogs]

My personal view is that until you have tried all the cheap ones, you shouldn't.
There is nothing particularly different between a $300 O/U and a $3000 O/U other than things that don't make it shoot any better.
Expensive shotguns just have fancier stock and finer engraving and prettier colours, and if you really want to pay than they can also customize and build a gun for your length of pull and balance it for you.
They don't shoot any straighter and they are not any more reliable in terms of click/bang ratios.

But fancy shotguns are easy on the eyes.



(Not my shotgun)

http://www.gundogmag.com/files/2013/12/dreamdoubles_beretta_F.jpg

You have probably never done much shooting with a good shotgun fit and balance can't be compared, not counting the workmanship in the mechanics. My Red Label handles and shoots like no $500 shotgun ever will and it's not top of the line when it comes to O/U. That being said If a lower end gun seems to work for you and you are happy then stick with it but be aware there is a big difference when and if you ever find the want to step up to something better and it's not all about inlay and engraving.

[wideopenthrottle]

if you really want to test a shotgun for comfort, migratory birds (after you are skilled) or skeet/trap is the way to really see if the thing shoulders quickly and feels right especially from a slightly awkward position...I have a savage that is 37 years old (owned from new when in grade 6) ..it was around 100 bucks at the time...It has killed hundreds or maybe over a 1000 ducks and likely over 200 grouse...the key is to know where/what the pattern is relative to where you aim....I shot a grouse a week ago with buddy's full choke 12 gauge (mine is a modified choke) and #6 non lead shot (I have not hunted birds since long before lead was banned and always used 7 1/2)...I lined up high to avoid holes in the breast (get a bb or two in the head) and sure as crap I missed...twice...got him with the third...obviously you want a gun with a rep for reliability if you are in harsh conditions or do a tonne of shooting but a cheapie can still fit the bill

[Marlowethelazydog]

if you really want to test a shotgun for comfort, migratory birds (after you are skilled) or skeet/trap is the way to really see if the thing shoulders quickly and feels right especially from a slightly awkward position...I have a savage that is 37 years old (owned from new when in grade 6) ..it was around 100 bucks at the time...It has killed hundreds or maybe over a 1000 ducks and likely over 200 grouse...the key is to know where/what the pattern is relative to where you aim....I shot a grouse a week ago with buddy's full choke 12 gauge (mine is a modified choke) and #6 non lead shot (I have not hunted birds since long before lead was banned and always used 7 1/2)...I lined up high to avoid holes in the breast (get a bb or two in the head) and sure as crap I missed...twice...got him with the third...obviously you want a gun with a rep for reliability if you are in harsh conditions or do a tonne of shooting but a cheapie can still fit the bill

Skill being what it is (I don't miss an honest flush more than 30% of the time :) ) my preference would be for a double SxS - the problem is to assess fit I need to find one for sale. I know WS, Grouse etc often carry o/u Mossbergs but I am looking for a little more if I go that direction in terms of quality and the onyx sxs seem to be hard to fine. Of course they can be ordered. I find SxS sight better for me that an O/U but that could be just the ones I have tried shooting skeet. I can find Huglu's which kind of hit that CZ range of $900-$1000 just not any SxS. I may have to save for a couple months and be okay with up-ing my spend to $2000 or $2500 to get a quality sxs. Decoration matters little to me on a gun, it needs to fit and it needs to last. This gun in particular will not be used for steel shot or waterfowl hunting, just upland.

[Cdn-Redneck]

There is a franchi asecention on gun nutz for $1700. Good looking gun no engraving or fancy work. Look on cabelas.ca for specs.

[250 sav]

Have a mossberg silver reserve I bought when they 1st came out had a broken firing pin about every 2000 rounds, seven firing pins in total. Had a gunsmith make some that have lasted, got about 5000 rounds on them now (my son shots sporting clays with it.) Now after 7 firing pins and approx 20000 rounds I have loose gun that I can't rely on. For shotguns for me I would buy a browning, berreta,benelli, ruger etc. not any the turkish made guns.Have approx.8000 rounds on bps 12, 6000 on bps 20, 3000 on maxus 12 and no issues at all with them. If money is a issue I would buy a used gun or new quality pump before acheapo/u ors/s.

[ACB]

If your into SXS's the 12ga. Ruger Gold Lable is a great shotgun, easy on the eye's,light; about 6 1/2LBS, no engraving. Trouble is their not cheap and they don't make them any more. But if you want, I just happen too have one for sale if the price is right. Wink Wink, Nod Nod, say no more. These guy's are right, fit is everything. If it doesn't fit it doesn't matter if it's a $150 or $25,000 shotgun, or how pretty it is your not going to shoot it well.

[okas]

this is true to so many things, trying to justify why $$ .. just buy what you ca afford .. look for a nice used gun

[Dog_River]

It sounds like you really enjoy Upland Hunting. Sadly here in BC there is not much of "Upland Tradition" as it is in the eastern Canada, US and UK. I would suggest you get your hands on some good traditional upland hunting books such as "The Upland Sporting Life" by George "Bird" Evans. It goes into the true essence of what this life is all about. In short it's all about good double barreled shot guns, great bird dogs and a reverence for the birds themselves. There are alot of other great books as well if you look around. To me I don't enjoy bird hunting without the dog work.

I personally shoot a 1926 AH Fox and am just about to buy a Browning Superposed in a vintage year. Doubled barreled guns whether SxS or O/U are traditional upland guns and are a lot safer than the other actions. The opinions are all over the map on this thread. Have a look at some great upland sites as well and there are also some great upland hunting blogs.

Enjoy your holidays.

Dog_River

[badgreenbird]

Lots of good points on here. having a gun that fits well is the most important. Doesn't matter if it's a cheap gun or an expensive one. One of the shotguns that I shoot best with is a cheap old Baikal SxS. But if you often find yourself wistfully looking at the higher end guns, you won't be happy until you have one - or more. If you shoot it well, you're set for life. Otherwise, the search continues. I saved and bought a Beretta 686 28 gauge and it's a beautiful gun. I shoot ok with it, but decided it's not for me and put it up for sale. Then I got a nice AYA SxS. Haven't even shot it yet. But if I can't hit anything, that too will be sold off. I sure wish I could try out some of these things before buying them, but no luck with that so far....

[Dog_River]

Maybe you should think about getting a shotgun fitted to you. Do some online research on what all that entails. I have no idea where that can be done in BC.

I just bought a Browning Superposed and it seems to fit and swing really nice. Whether I can hit anything with it remains to be seen.


Lots of good points on here. having a gun that fits well is the most important. Doesn't matter if it's a cheap gun or an expensive one. One of the shotguns that I shoot best with is a cheap old Baikal SxS. But if you often find yourself wistfully looking at the higher end guns, you won't be happy until you have one - or more. If you shoot it well, you're set for life. Otherwise, the search continues. I saved and bought a Beretta 686 28 gauge and it's a beautiful gun. I shoot ok with it, but decided it's not for me and put it up for sale. Then I got a nice AYA SxS. Haven't even shot it yet. But if I can't hit anything, that too will be sold off. I sure wish I could try out some of these things before buying them, but no luck with that so far....

[Dutch]

Upland Weatherby 28gauge receiver is not a modified 20 nice fit finish not that expensive better than I would have expected like it a lot, and I have shot a few ,,,

[1899]

Appreciating, and lusting for, fine shotguns is a curse. Unless you are wealthy. In that case if is a welcome affliction.

Keep in mind that you don't need to buy new. I've scored some nice shotguns at a fraction of their new price. This is especially true with some of the less well known brands. Best buy ever? Minty Beretta 409 for $400 - mind you that was 20 years ago, but still. Keep your eyes open and have your wallet ready!