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View Full Version : The best allocation topic letter yet !



ydouask
02-14-2015, 11:30 AM
This is the best letter yet because it speaks to all the residents and Canadian Citizens in B.C. MAYBE it will get the point across to everyone that a minority group within our Provincial population is being ignored and bullied by our own Government !

This is not my creation, but one I received via email the other day... please read all of it. ydouask.

What would you do if the government allowed non-residents to bike on the Seawall, Stanley Park and other nice bike paths but you couldn’t?
What would you do if the government allowed non-residents to fish salmon around Vancouver Island and on the Fraser River but you couldn’t?
You would be upset and it would be entirely within your rights.
This is what is happening with hunting in BC, where non-resident hunters have more rights than British Columbia’s hunting families. Non-residents can hunt all species even the rare ones, while British Columbians are placed on a lottery draw and are not allowed to hunt species like bull moose, elk and sheep in their back yards. British Columbians are being treated like second-class citizens in their own province.
Alberta, Saskatchewan, Manitoba, Ontario, Quebec and New Brunswick respect their resident hunters and non-resident cannot hunt the rare species or non-resident opportunities are limited.
For example, In Alberta, only resident hunters can hunt mountain goat. In Saskatchewan, only resident hunters can hunt mule deer, caribou and elk. In Manitoba, only resident hunters can hunt elk.




Species for residents only



Alberta

Goat



Saskatchewan

Caribou, elk, mule deer



A rally is planned on the doorstep of the BC Legislature in Victoria on Monday March 2/2015.
Everybody is welcome.
Denis Lampron CA, MBA Email: denis1lampron@hotmail.com (denis1lampron@hotmail.com)



Manitoba

Elk



Not only can non-residents of BC hunt all game in BC, moreover, in the past three years non-residents killed more caribou and mountain goat than residents, respectively killing 53.6 % and 56.4% of the harvest. Do you find that acceptable?
Further, non-residents of BC are depriving about 1,000 families of the nutritional moose red meat for a year; an annual value for BC residents of about $2,000,000, yes $2 million! Do you find that acceptable?
Moose meat has more protein and less fat than beef. Game meat is organic, lean, and does not contain dyes, artificial hormones or antibiotics. Depriving a resident of a moose is depriving them of feeding their family with nutritional red meat for a year, a $2,000 value (moose meat is about 400-500 pounds, $4-$5 per pound).
May be you understand now why on January 31, a sea of more than 1,200 people rallied in West Kelowna and marched to Christy Clark’s office to register their protest.
A similar scenario happened in Quebec in the 1970’s. Residents could not go hunting and fishing in their back yards because private hunting and fishing clubs covered the southern portion of the Province, owned by foreigners and industry (pulp and paper, banks, etc.). The revolt that followed from the hunters and anglers was relentless, tumultuous and rebellious. So in 1978, the Quebec government changed the law to allow access to resident fishermen and hunters.
Now hunting is popular in Quebec, people are looking for organic meat. 29,000 people took the hunter education course in 2013. Moose hunter numbers are at a record high of the past forty years in Quebec with 180,000 moose hunters, about 6 times the number of moose hunters in BC.
The BC government recognized the benefits of hunting for the province and state on their own website:
http://www.env.gov.bc.ca/fw/ds/docs/070427_HunterRecruitment-RetentionStrategy.pdf (http://www.env.gov.bc.ca/fw/ds/docs/070427_HunterRecruitment-RetentionStrategy.pdf) :
"BC resident hunters, for being in constant contact with nature and with the game they hunted, were among the first to realize that wildlife was not an infinite resource, and they banded together into clubs and associations and lobbied for conservation measures, habitat protection and wildlife management have been on the leading edge of the conservation movement ever since the concept was developed. Today, the healthy populations of game animals that thrive across BC owe their well- being to hunters."
"Hunting gets people exercising in the outdoors and actively involved in their environment. It promotes family bonding and fosters an awareness of the value of our environment and the importance of looking after it."
"Lifelong friendships and strong family bonds are developed and enhanced through hunting experiences. The arduous conditions hunters frequently face build teamwork, resourcefulness and attitudes of cooperation and consideration."
Conclusion:
The confrontation between resident hunters and the government is unlikely to stop. Resident hunters believe this injustice is totally unacceptable.
Recommendation:
The BC government should:
Immediately cancel the February 6, 2015 Allocation Policy aim to increase 50 animals for non-residents over 2014 and implement the 2007 Allocation Policy that was agreed between the parties.
For next year and thereafter,
Eliminate the preferences/tags for non-residents,
Allow only BC residents to hunt rare species
Create, a separate entity like the Freshwater Fisheries Society of BC (FFSBC) and recruit a strong diverse independent board of directors to manage the wildlife with an economic development perspective and to increase the pie for years to come.
 
The Ladysmith Sportsman’s Club is handling donations for the cause. Dave Judson ( 250-245-3690).
 
PS. In another letter, I will talk about how the "pie", the wild game population in BC can be increased.

ruttinbuck
02-14-2015, 11:56 AM
That needs to be in every paper in BC on Monday.
Talk to the writer and get that in printRB

325
02-14-2015, 12:09 PM
That needs to be in every paper in BC on Monday.
Talk to the writer and get that in printRB

That is a great letter for sure. It should be in all the papers.

GoatGuy
02-14-2015, 12:15 PM
It was sent out to the papers, see who prints it.

Vladimir Poutine
02-14-2015, 12:19 PM
The very first part is a great template for anyone to copy and sign and then send. It's that easy

yama49
02-14-2015, 12:20 PM
I agree, well written letter.

adriaticum
02-14-2015, 12:47 PM
I would just change the word "non-residents" to "Guide Outfitters".

Huevos
02-14-2015, 12:58 PM
Good to see that GOABC isn't the only side peddling propaganda. Probably should check facts before a newspaper prints it. Elk and moose can both be hunted in Saskatchewan by non residents.
How many of those goats were taken on a GOS area I wonder. I would guess a lot. Guides would argue that with these statistics, it shows that residents don't even use their portion but are still fighting for more.

I would agree that some of he letter is well written, but full of half truths, and misinformation.

Goat is a once in a lifetime draw in alberta they give out something like 6-10 tags a year province wide. Not quite like BC wouldn't you say?

Spy
02-14-2015, 03:18 PM
Half truths are what we get fed from the Liberals and the Goabc ! That letter is great lets get it out there, good job resident hunters:-)

Walking Buffalo
02-14-2015, 03:33 PM
As an ex BC resident now resettled in Alberta I would like to offer a different perspective to the information posted

Alberta restricts mountain goats to residents only simply because we issue so few licences. On average there are 5-6 goat licences available per year. If Alberta could support more licences then non residents would likely have the opportunity to obtain a goat tag along with all other species both through the draw system and general seasons and hunt with a hunter host, without having to hire an outfitter.

I would like to see BC resident hunters recognize the importance of supporting and maintaining non resident hunting opportunities without the requirements to hire an outfitter. Of first importance to keeping wildlife within the public domain is to follow the pillars of the North American Model of Wildlife Management, which includes an understanding that wildlife is to be shared with all citizens of Canada. Secondly, but just as important is to maintain access to wildlife for non residents without the requirements of hiring an outfitter. This keeps a separation of "ownership" rsstricted to residenta and outfitters and eliminates a monopoly that reduces non resident support for local concerns.

If you want us residents and non residenta to support each other, you must give your counterparts an interest.

Excluding non residents from accessing wildlife will only isolate potential support for your problems.

Reciprocity between jurisdictions will become more conditional in the future.
If I can't hunt at your place, then you can't come and hunt at mine....
this does no one any good, well, except for the outfitters....

Walking Buffalo
02-14-2015, 04:04 PM
Good to see that GOABC isn't the only side peddling propaganda. Probably should check facts before a newspaper prints it. Elk and moose can both be hunted in Saskatchewan by non residents.
How many of those goats were taken on a GOS area I wonder. I would guess a lot. Guides would argue that with these statistics, it shows that residents don't even use their portion but are still fighting for more.

I would agree that some of he letter is well written, but full of half truths, and misinformation.

Goat is a once in a lifetime draw in alberta they give out something like 6-10 tags a year province wide. Not quite like BC wouldn't you say?

While I agree that there are quite a few flaws in the information, you have offered even more.*

Sask nr moose and wild elk hunts, and mule deer are available only on indian reserves which is a federal jurisdiction, not provincial.*

One aspect of Saskatchewan's exclusion of nr elk, moose, caribou, prongorn and md hunting is this is the way their regulatory system works in order to disallow outfitting for these species.Perhaps if jurisdictions started to enforce the interprovincial trade and business agreements in terms of reciprocity for hunting, BC would offer nr nonoutfitted access to sheep and g bears and Saskatchewan would open the doors to nr nonoutfitted elk and md..... that would be a better world for all Canadian hunters.


With regards to the letter, it really needs some serious polishing before being published.

Sofa King
02-14-2015, 04:08 PM
As an ex BC resident now resettled in Alberta I would like to offer a different perspective to the information posted

Alberta restricts mountain goats to residents only simply because we issue so few licences. On average there are 5-6 goat licences available per year. If Alberta could support more licences then non residents would likely have the opportunity to obtain a goat tag along with all other species both through the draw system and general seasons and hunt with a hunter host, without having to hire an outfitter.

I would like to see BC resident hunters recognize the importance of supporting and maintaining non resident hunting opportunities without the requirements to hire an outfitter. Of first importance to keeping wildlife within the public domain is to follow the pillars of the North American Model of Wildlife Management, which includes an understanding that wildlife is to be shared with all citizens of Canada. Secondly, but just as important is to maintain access to wildlife for non residents without the requirements of hiring an outfitter. This keeps a separation of "ownership" rsstricted to residenta and outfitters and eliminates a monopoly that reduces non resident support for local concerns.

If you want us residents and non residenta to support each other, you must give your counterparts an interest.

Excluding non residents from accessing wildlife will only isolate potential support for your problems.

Reciprocity between jurisdictions will become more conditional in the future.
If I can't hunt at your place, then you can't come and hunt at mine....
this does no one any good, well, except for the outfitters....

you don't know that, you are just speculating.
but the fact is that it is only residents allowed to hunt goats.

you are 100% correct in regards to the "if I can't hunt at your place, then you can't hunt at mine".
fair is fair, and I don't think that people who wish guides just disappear are really thinking that properly.
but the other provinces have realistic allocations, bc's has become a province/outfitter greed issue.
and lots of our guide outfitters aren't residents themselves, I think that's a complete bogus issue entirely.

Walking Buffalo
02-14-2015, 04:29 PM
you don't know that, you are just speculating.
but the fact is that it is only residents allowed to hunt goats.

you are 100% correct in regards to the "if I can't hunt at your place, then you can't hunt at mine".
fair is fair, and I don't think that people who wish guides just disappear are really thinking that properly.
but the other provinces have realistic allocations, bc's has become a province/outfitter greed issue.
and lots of our guide outfitters aren't residents themselves, I think that's a complete bogus issue entirely.

Why do you insist of making a clown of yourself? Actually, I do know.

Alberta has a policy of allowing nr hunters to access all wildlife within our hunter host program where the numbers offer a nr allocation split. If the allowable harvest of goats increases then nr will be given acces to a share.

In regards to the bc allocations, I am dumbfounded with what that the outfitters are recieving. As a nr of BC, I fully support the call for a 90/10 split. I also think residents should eliminate the outfitters monopoly on nr hunting.

Downwind
02-15-2015, 12:10 PM
I would like to see BC resident hunters recognize the importance of supporting and maintaining non resident hunting opportunities without the requirements to hire an outfitter. Of first importance to keeping wildlife within the public domain is to follow the pillars of the North American Model of Wildlife Management, which includes an understanding that wildlife is to be shared with all citizens of Canada. Secondly, but just as important is to maintain access to wildlife for non residents without the requirements of hiring an outfitter. This keeps a separation of "ownership" rsstricted to residenta and outfitters and eliminates a monopoly that reduces non resident support for local concerns.

If you want us residents and non residenta to support each other, you must give your counterparts an interest.

Excluding non residents from accessing wildlife will only isolate potential support for your problems.

Reciprocity between jurisdictions will become more conditional in the future.
If I can't hunt at your place, then you can't come and hunt at mine....
this does no one any good, well, except for the outfitters....

I think a lot of BC residents would support this. They aren't the ones you need to sell its the outfitters. Look what they were able buy in regards to allocation by crying they can't keep afloat. I would love to see a NR LEH system. The 10% they are allocated goes into a LEH draw system. If they get drawn they can buy a tag and either hunt with a BC resident or hire a guide but guides have no actual tags. That would be my preference. Would be able to generate a lot more money then just selling tags and the rest going into the guides pockets.

two-feet
02-15-2015, 08:43 PM
I think this is a good idea. NR LEH means more revenue (hopefully put back into conservation) and breaks the GO strangle hold on NR hunting. End the monopoly. By the time the dust settles it would be nice to see a different look in BC for wildlife management. This system is broken.

Rattler
03-22-2015, 09:41 AM
Great letter, puts our HAP issues that most non hunters can relate to. Did anyone see this printed in a newspaper?

BgBlkDg
03-22-2015, 09:58 AM
I have long advocated for a reciprocal hunting system among CANADIANS and am now in favour of capping ALL "non-resident alien" access to OUR big game, birds, fishing and permits for situations like the Slocan Chief cabin in Kokanee Glacier Park, at a MAX. of 2.5% administered by a straight draw system where a Non-refundable FEE for every application is charged before said application is considered.

I want other CANADIAN citizens to have access to BC hunting, but, NOT various foreigners and intend to personally lobby for the above; I have lost all empathy for GOs and especially the GOABC.