Region 3 Mulie: Is it regressing?.....

[Fish Nutz]

So after lurking for a while I figured i'd post up a pick of my best mulie to date. You will notice the bullet shaped chunk missing from the antlers which was not my best shooting but at 300 yards and on the move it made him stop so I could put him down for good so I will call it a win!! He is a very heavy and bladed out so I'm wondering if he might be regressing. His teeth were worn but not too bad, but based on his face I figure he was a cagy old veteran. Anyways here are a couple pics.

http://i622.photobucket.com/albums/tt302/Wes2000_ca/IMG_24501.jpg

http://i622.photobucket.com/albums/tt302/Wes2000_ca/IMG_25121.jpg

http://i622.photobucket.com/albums/tt302/Wes2000_ca/IMG_24891.jpg

http://i622.photobucket.com/albums/tt302/Wes2000_ca/IMG_25671.jpg

[Wentrot]

http://i622.photobucket.com/albums/tt302/Wes2000_ca/IMG_24501.jpg (http://s622.photobucket.com/user/Wes2000_ca/media/IMG_24501.jpg.html)

[Grumpa Joe]

Fantastic deer. Good mass, uniform lengths and a big body on him. Would definitely be proud of that one. Congratulations!

[Dannybuoy]

Nice buck ! Cant tell in the photo why you think he is old and on the way down ? Roman nose and long teeth and old looking muzzle are signs I look at . The antlers o that buck look prime IMO 7-8 year old ?

[fuzzybiscuit]

Nice buck! Great mass on that one.

[Fisher-Dude]

Nice! I think he's a prime, mature buck.

[kennyj]

Solid mature buck! One to be proud of for sure.
Thanks for posting your photos.
kenny

[Steelpulse]

Beast for sure definitely up there in age maybe just past prime but what a beauty

[Fish Nutz]

I figured that he might have been just on his way down. He was in great shape with lots of fat but with the 3 1/2 brow tines, the mass and the bladed out tines I thought he might have had better years with respect to antler growth (And getting shot obviously).

[250 sav]

typical horn configuration for nw of kamloops decent buck I dont think its regressing

[Sofa King]

his ballbag seems less plump. definitely mature. beauty buck. love his rack, especially the curl on the main beam.

[horshur]

he could be three not much older then four...

[limit time]

I really like the curve of the fronts.

[coach]

Nice buck! I agree with horshur.. 3 or 4 years old.

[hunter1993ap]

its a hard call, I have seen deer that never get bigger than 135-140. have seen one deers sheds as he went from a 120 4x4 to about a 135 4x4, we guessed him at 10+ years old and he never did gain much. saw 7 or 8 years of his sheds. his basses were always decent but near the end quite big, like pop cans. then again I've seen three year old deer in the 170's. genetics are huge, some deer will just never have the big rack as others.

[dana]

I agree with those that put him in the 3-4 yr mark. A nice young buck that still had yet to grow into his genetic potential.

[Fish Nutz]

3-4 years? That seems a bit off to me. It had a 25 3/4 inch neck and was almost 200 lbs on the hook. That would be a pretty hefty 3-4 year old. Thanks everyone for the input!

[Steelpulse]

I like how hunters worry about age despite it being a beast deer, we have better things to do......wait no we don't what am I talking about seriously nice deer once again haha

[dana]

3-4 years? That seems a bit off to me. It had a 25 3/4 inch neck and was almost 200 lbs on the hook. That would be a pretty hefty 3-4 year old. Thanks everyone for the input!
Many ol brutes are 400 on the hook.

[250 sav]

I agree with those that put him in the 3-4 yr mark. A nice young buck that still had yet to grow into his genetic potential.

I agree with dana on the age I have a almost identical rack from 10+ years ago, that was on about a 4 year old buck.

[mwalter]

This page may help age him. http://www.timberwolfinformation.org/info/deerjaw/ages.htm

[Darksith]

Many ol brutes are 400 on the hook.

400 on the hook? What with the guts in? I know a few butchers, they see a tone of deer every year, the big ones dressed and hanging weigh around 210. Immy moose weigh 400 on the hook.

[dana]

Guts out, hide and head on, pushing 400 is a big deer. So this deer pushing 200 still has a ways to go to is my point. In no way shape or form is this an old regressed buck.

[hunter1993ap]

400 on the hook? What with the guts in? I know a few butchers, they see a tone of deer every year, the big ones dressed and hanging weigh around 210. Immy moose weigh 400 on the hook.

my dad was in the business for a while, they weighed all their deer skinned dressed and no head and cape. the biggest deer he got in from a client was 199 no head no cape. and his personal best was 235 no head no hide. I would imagine the 235 would be in the ball park of 300+ pounds. 400 pounds like dana is saying is massive, im not saying impossible as I believe the guy, but holy big deer. but then again I've seen monster mulie rack with a 180 pound body, and this deer was pushing 9-10 years old.

[Fish Nutz]

To clarify it was dressed no hide or head or hoofs.

[Darksith]

my dad was in the business for a while, they weighed all their deer skinned dressed and no head and cape. the biggest deer he got in from a client was 199 no head no cape. and his personal best was 235 no head no hide. I would imagine the 235 would be in the ball park of 300+ pounds. 400 pounds like dana is saying is massive, im not saying impossible as I believe the guy, but holy big deer. but then again I've seen monster mulie rack with a 180 pound body, and this deer was pushing 9-10 years old.
I hear of the odd mulie that pushes the 235, but I think they are pretty rare. Anything over that is a mutant giant! I wasn't trying to call anyone out or start anything, Im sure it happens, same goes with the human race...man I would love to bump into a deer that big. One day hopefully.


To clarify it was dressed no hide or head or hoofs.

on the hook in my mind is no hide, head or anything...butcher doesn't weight it with the hide on, if he is someone is getting hosed ;)

That is a big deer, but his face doesn't really look that old. Did you check the chart for aging and look at the teeth, or is the jaw long gone. Would be curious to know how close the educated guesses were

[beeker]

Genetics are an interesting thing for sure. Imo (others may have seen this) in region 3 we have seen some nice bucks (antler wise) where their body size is quite small (pretty sure its a genetic strain in the area). Other times, smaller antlers and big bodies. Muley hunting is awesome, you never know what you're going to see from body size to antler configurations.

[Fisher-Dude]

Genetics are an interesting thing for sure. Imo (others may have seen this) in region 3 we have seen some nice bucks (antler wise) where their body size is quite small (pretty sure its a genetic strain in the area). Other times, smaller antlers and big bodies. Muley hunting is awesome, you never know what you're going to see from body size to antler configurations.


Some of it is environment/lifestyle too. I've seen 100 lb crack whores in Rutland with the same size of rack as a 135 lb trophy wife from the Upper Mission. :twisted:

Now, I haven't confirmed if those racks were enhanced by the guys mounting them.

[Looking_4_Jerky]

Nice buck!

I think "dressed" is usually considered be the live animal minus the internal organs, with head, hooves and hide on. Given that you are at 200lbs with no internals, fur, head, or hooves, I'd say you're probably in the neighborhood of 300lb live weight, which is definitely a large local deer. The largest mule deer might go around 400 live, but I'm sure it's rare. In any case, how that relates to antler size is questionable, as neither are directly proportional to age, or each other.

From my perspective, nothing in that picture implies to me that is a particularly old buck. It’s body size would likely be relatively constant from ages 4.5 through 8.5, so that’s not a good indicator. I do think that at 6 or 7+ (and likely before) you’re likely going to start seeing physical indicators of age, i.e. greying muzzle, battle scars on face/ears/nose, worn teeth, etc, but this buck appears to have none of that. In fact, as others have said, he looks prime, and with some extra length, looks like the best bucks that would come out of our region. Many “nice” bucks we see are only 3.5 to 4.5 yrs old, and apparently 6+ year old deer are exceptionally rare, despite that mule deer can live to 12 in the absence of predation or hunting.

I’m giving that buck 4.5yrs, maybe 5.5.

[coach]

3-4 years? That seems a bit off to me. It had a 25 3/4 inch neck and was almost 200 lbs on the hook. That would be a pretty hefty 3-4 year old. Thanks everyone for the input!

Were you just hoping we would all agree with you?

[dana]

Darksith,
Big old bucks are not your common buck coming into a butcher now are they? The average age classes coming into butchers are 1.5-4.5 years. Once bucks break into the 5-11 year range, they normally have a ton of smarts and avoid hunters. It ain't that they are extremely rare, it is rather they are extremely smart. 400 lbs bucks do occur, especially in BC. Northern deer, be it whitetail or muley, can and do hit some loftey weights. Bucks in the 200-250 range are more the norm yes, but to think that a buck can't hit those numbers by 3 or 4 just shows a lack of understanding of the species.

[GoatGuy]

We killed a mulw deer about 10 years ago in October. 4 quarters bone in were 180 something lbs. have to add neck meat, loins, trim and ribs.

huge difference in weight between early October and late November.

nice deer, doesn't look like an old deer though.

congrats.

[180grainer]

Great buck. Mount that sucker!!!! And then take him to the taxidermist.

[hunter1993ap]

heres a couple sheds from an old buck starting to go downhill. I believe the one side is the biggest this deer ever was. note the size difference in one year. http://i1148.photobucket.com/albums/o565/okanagan199/elkmulesheds010_zps26456080.jpg (http://s1148.photobucket.com/user/okanagan199/media/elkmulesheds010_zps26456080.jpg.html)

[250 sav]

My 3 heaviest weighed deer, no hide no legs a skined butcher ready carcass
242 and according to the old tooth is truth 18 years old
238 14 years old
219 don't know age
These were all nov /dec bucks with no fat and would have been heavier before the rut

[HarryToolips]

Wicked buck dude......

[Fish Nutz]

Were you just hoping we would all agree with you?

Haha no the purpose of this post was not to have everyone agree with me. I have my own thoughts on it as i'm not new to hunting but was curious what some of the members on this forum had to say as there are many who's years of experience hunting can top mine by 2 or 3 times. For those who saw it in person they thought it was 6.5-7.5, but that's beside the point. I haven't harvested that many "Mature" deer and was looking for input to possibly further my knowledge on the subject.

Thanks Everyone for you input

[winbuckhunter]

That's dressed out weight. No hide, head or legs past the knee. Or tenderloins..

[BearSniper]

That is a very nice looking Buck. We'd all be proud to have him in our sights. Good shooting!

[buckdragger]

Great buck!

[tundra]

That is a nice buck to break into the larger rack but by no means is that an old buck on his way down. If you look at the antlers they tend to grow up from the bases this is common with younger bucks. Typically an older buck's antlers will grow out flat before they turn up. I would agree with Dana that it is in the 3.5 to 4.5 year old range. Nice looking and definitely had the potential to become a true monster. Keep hunting in that area as the genetics are good by the looks of things. The true monsters are rarely seen and generally are only concerned with just living. They may breed the odd doe in the rut but mostly just stay out of site.