crossbow or compound bow

[tikka]

i want to buy a bow for this hunting seasin, but i am debating on weather to buy a cross bow or compound bow. i am leaning more towards a cross bow. i have not bow hunted so i am wonderig if anyone hase some sudjestions on which one they think would be the best one to buy

[Tinney]

Compound. No advantage to a crossbow unless you like using a trigger.

Yay! We haven't had a crossbow thread in a while
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v355/PGKris/Random-Watching.gif

[jessbennett]

CROSSBOW!!!!!!!!!!!........:lol: :lol: just kidden. compound all the way.......... shoot a compund man. heck shoot a recurve. they only advantage a crossbow has, is that it sits cocked and waiting...you dont have to draw it, you can use a scope on it, and it shoulders like a rifle....... compund, takes a little work , some practice, but way more rewarding.

[The Hermit]

I just got a compound at Christmas... my experience has been that it is very easy to shoot with deadly accuracy. With a peep sight and a good fiberoptic sight ligning up on the target is easy, the let off makes it easy to hold, and damned if the arrows don't go pretty much where ya point the thing! Honestly I thought this was going to be harder!

I am practicing every couple days because I want to beat BowWalker at a 3-D shoot this year! ;-)

[J_T]

The compound is likely a more efficient weapon. The bolts used in a crossbow, may in fact not provide you with enough killing power.

Crossbows are likely much heavier than a compound or recurve, and for that reason they can be cumbersome to pack in the bush. I've sat in my treestand and watched crossbow hunters still hunting beneath me and my quick assessment was that it seems there is no great way to pack the crossbow.

The compound is the way to go.

JT

[tikka]

i was also wondering on how easey it is to spok an animal when drawing the boe when hunting compared to having a cross bow already set to fire. that is my bigest consern. i wnet bow hunting with a friend in september i did not have a bow but he did and it was more fun than rifle. we didnt get anything though but having the deer get so close to you without seeing you was the coolest part. it seems to take more efort in bow hunting but that is what makes seem beter to me.

[bcfarmer]

hi there tikka

movement is movement, drawing a compound or shouldering a crossbow, both are movement and have the potential to spook a deer.

I own 2 crossbows...and shoot them because of shoulder injury. The crossbow is much noisier than a compound...much more chance of animal jumping the string. As for awkwardness of carrying each...I haven't carried a compound in the bush so can't really compare. My crossbows have slings so this helps to a certain extent.

As for killing power, i've been told by the experts that there is more than ample power to kill an animal out to 40 yds. Once again because of noise I wouldn't recommend shooting much more than 30.

crossbows also take practice to become efficient at. Contrary to the myth that a hunter can just pick one up and go hunting. Practice practice practice.... and learn yardages

in the end it is your own decision...but if your in good enough physical condition then you'll probably get more out of a compound. ( man that was hard to say..lol)

happy hunting
bcfarmer

[sealevel]

Just like JT said how do you pack it. All crossbows i have heard are loud . And if you every need a second shoot very slow loading.----On the good side you can shoot in all kinds of positions . A compound can be very quite and a lot of fun to shoot. One if the best things for me is shooting a compound it is so good for my back

[J_T]

I would express a caution to a new bowhunter using a crossbow. As everyone that has experienced both rifle hunting and bowhunting should agree to, there is a difference in the approach to hunting with the two distinct weapons (rifle and bow). Of legal archery tackle, the crossbow feels and operates like a rifle. There is less of a distinction.

Last season, our camp observed a couple of hunters using crossbows, and it appeared to us, that they didn't distinguish between the two. With a rifle, you might see an animal on the move at distance and attempt a shot. The concern many experienced bowhunters have, is that an individual that is crossing over from rifle to bow and is using a crossbow, may continue to hunt similarly. IE, what we observed by two crossbow shooters where extremely long shots (60 - 80 yards) shooting all bolts and running to retrieve those bolts from the ground and shooting them again.

For this reason CO's have also expressed concern about cross over hunters who choose a crossbow.

For this reason, if you are new to bowhunting, most of us recommend the International Bowhunting Education Program (IBEP) as it will make you aware of subtle and not so subtle differences in bowhunting that are very important.

If you are looking for a great bowhunting experience. Perhaps a compound bow will provide you with that. Enjoy.

JT

[huntwriter]

It depends how much time you want to spend practicing and learning.

The compound bow needs more time to learn and continuous practicing to stay in shooting shape.

On the other hand, a crossbow is easy to learn and once sighted in your done. There is no need to shoot frequently to stay in shape and keep the muscles tuned.

The compound bow is lighter and easier to carry around on a spot and stalk hunt. The crossbow is heavy and bulky. It is often wrongly stated that the crossbow is not as efficient in taking game, but that has been disproved time and time again. The efficiency and effective range of both bows in a hunting situation are almost equal.

[bcfarmer]

[quote]
Last season, our camp observed a couple of hunters using crossbows, and it appeared to us, that they didn't distinguish between the two. With a rifle, you might see an animal on the move at distance and attempt a shot. The concern many experienced bowhunters have, is that an individual that is crossing over from rifle to bow and is using a crossbow, may continue to hunt similarly. IE, what we observed by two crossbow shooters where extremely long shots (60 - 80 yards) shooting all bolts and running to retrieve those bolts from the ground and shooting them again.

For this reason CO's have also expressed concern about cross over hunters who choose a crossbow.

For this reason, if you are new to bowhunting, most of us recommend the International Bowhunting Education Program (IBEP) as it will make you aware of subtle and not so subtle differences in bowhunting that are very important.[quote]

personally JT. I think you should have just stuck to the last paragraph. Once again it is the human being behind the weapon not the weapon that determines the ethics involved. We've all seen abuse, no matter which weapon is used.

having said that, tikka , JT is definitley right that all bowhunters...new or experienced should take the course...always something to learn.

bcfarmer

[Bow Walker]

i was also wondering on how easey it is to spok an animal when drawing the boe when hunting compared to having a cross bow already set to fire. that is my bigest consern. i wnet bow hunting with a friend in september i did not have a bow but he did and it was more fun than rifle. we didnt get anything though but having the deer get so close to you without seeing you was the coolest part. it seems to take more efort in bow hunting but that is what makes seem beter to me.
Tikka - what was your friend using to bow hunt? Cross bow? Compound? Traditional?

Shooting the same style as your buddy will enhance your own experience(s) and his as well.

Having said all of the above, it is my opinion (and only mine) that you just might enjoy the compound style of archery the most - although I will not discount Traditional, as I am getting more and more interested in the "stick-n-string" side of things.

Choose carefully and I hope you enjoy your choice.

Do not forget to practice - whatever style you choose, practise only makes you better.

[tikka]

my friend was using a compound bow.
thanks for the input. now that i think of it, the compound bow seems to be more chalanging and that is what keeps it intoresting and injoyable.

[J_T]

personally JT. I think you should have just stuck to the last paragraph. Once again it is the human being behind the weapon not the weapon that determines the ethics involved. We've all seen abuse, no matter which weapon is used.
BCF, I was merely using an example to make a point. My example points out that it isn't about ethics, it's about the difference between styles of hunting. It's about knowledge, or a lack thereof. The crossbow, can mislead a bowhunter to assume his crossbow hunting harvests should be done similarly to those done with rifle. In making my point, I simply used an example. I wasn't pointing out ethics. Unless someone points it out how would they know it may not be appropriate to retrieve a bolt or arrow and fling again without confirming the arrow's readiness to be fired. Those who have read this may now have a better understanding of why.

I'm sure we all agree, the CORE program generally (depending on the instructor) lacks horribly in preparing a hunter for bowhunting. Which is why we support the IBEP.

JT

[Bow Walker]

Well spoken (typed) J T

[brotherjack]

They are both arrow flinging devices. They both fling arrows of similar weight, with similar broadheads, at similar speeds, over similar distances, using a similar method. Neither is likely more accurate than the other, and neither is likely to give you a tremendous advantage over the other. Both have their minor advantages and disadvantages when compared to each other. Anyone who tells you anything otherwise than the above probably has a personal agenda to promote one or the other.

I suggest you pick the weapon that most appeals to you, and don't listen to the guff that goes around on crossbow threads. Yee olde deer won't notice what flung the arrow what does 'im in. :)

[Tinney]

Easy there brojack.
We might keep this as the only civil crossbow thread ever. They are both similar. The only difference I can really see is that MOST crossbow shooters I know wanted the challenge of getting closer to game and still being able to shoot an arrow, but like using the bow like a rifle, if that makes sense

[huntwriter]

They are both arrow flinging devices. They both fling arrows of similar weight, with similar broadheads, at similar speeds, over similar distances, using a similar method. Neither is likely more accurate than the other, and neither is likely to give you a tremendous advantage over the other. Both have their minor advantages and disadvantages when compared to each other. Anyone who tells you anything otherwise than the above probably has a personal agenda to promote one or the other.

I suggest you pick the weapon that most appeals to you, and don't listen to the guff that goes around on crossbow threads. Yee olde deer won't notice what flung the arrow what does 'im in. :)

Exactly my sentiments.

As for using the crossbow like a firearm statements, that is not what I experienced among crossbow shooters with a few exceptions. As stated in my earlier post and again by brotherjack. The efficiency, accuracy and effective range of compound and crossbow are the same. All else is preference of the individual person.

[Elkhound]

i want to buy a bow for this hunting seasin, but i am debating on weather to buy a cross bow or compound bow.

Oooooooohhhhhhhh Nnnnnnnooooooooooo:lol:

Man I am glad this topis is not in my section. Good luck boys. Pretty civil so far......I am impressed8):biggrin:

[Gateholio]

Get a crossbow.

If nothing else, it will annoy some people.:lol:

[J_T]

Cute Gatehouse.

This is a civil discussion in response to someone's legitimate question. There was never any malicious thought previously to provoke anyone. Nor swing one way or another regarding legal archery tackle. The experiences provided by those who posted provided a good snap shot of information for Tikka.

I may not be a moderator, however I do view your post as potentially provoking. So I'd just like to set that record straight and those of us that remain civil can simply ignore your post.

We do appreciate your desire to participate though.

JT

[Gateholio]

You can ignore it, or just take it for what it is- A funny. Often indicated by the presence of a :lol:

It was a brief interjection of humour, a bit of satire based on previous crossbow threads.

You may carry on with your extremely serious discussion now....8-)

[Untouchable]

At the PNE, I cant hit the target Im aiming at from five feet with a crossbow, so I doubt I'd have any great success hitting a deer at 30 yards with one.:lol:
Guess I'll stick to rifle season.:cry:

[Elkhound]

At the PNE, I cant hit the target Im aiming at from five feet with a crossbow, so I doubt I'd have any great success hitting a deer at 30 yards with one.:lol:
Guess I'll stick to rifle season.:cry:

You mean that crossbow they fix so it's as inaccurate as hell:lol: Not a great comparison:wink:

[Tuffcity]

You don't want to go "trad"... horribly inaccurate... :) :twisted: :)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R2XE5MKq1iM

RC

[J_T]

RC,

Very very well put. Enough said. And they weigh so much. :lol:

[Coyote]

Tikka

You hit on something called fun with your buddy and his bow. Remember that.

Whatever weapon you choose, choose it for the right reasons, your right reasons.

One thing you must know about crossbows. Even though they may weigh in at a draw weight far in excess of a compound, recurve or longbow they have a much shouter power stroke, (the distance the string pushes or accelerates the arrow before the bolt is on its way). This is why a crossbow has to have a much heavier weight than other bows. They can also be extremely noisy. They can be just as effective but like anything else they have their limitations and you have to understand your weapon and know what you are doing.

Don't be in a rush. Before you run out and buy one talk to a few KNOWLEDGABLE people, not just dealers who want your money. And also learn a bit about the other bows available. I think you'll find it time well spent.

And J T is right. Hunting with a bow is not the same game as hunting with a rifle. If you get the chance...take the IBEP course.

Coyote

[tikka]

i will get either one or the other in the summer so i can have time to practice for september. but until then i have time to think about which one i will get, but thanks for the info. i was just wondering what anyone had to say about either one as i like to get as much info on things as i can before i get something.

[Tinney]

Something else to chew on.....99% of the archery clubbs I know of will not allow the use of a crossbow at their ranges.....so you'll need somewhere to practice if you buy a crossbow.....and believe me, it's a lot easier to learn indoors than out.
IMO, archery clubs should allow crossbows.

[willyqbc]

Tinney makes a good point about being allowed to use the X-bow at club ranges and things such as 3D shoots. The social aspect of archery is great and you may very well miss out on that with a crossbow. As far as the clubs allowing X-bows Tinney...as i understand it, its not their call. Most clubs in the province rely on BCAA for their insurance and their insurance carrier will not cover X-bow's under the policy. I believe that clubs such as Merritt who allow them at the shoot have to purchase an extra rider on the policy to cover it off. I could be wrong but it seems to me that was what the issue boiled down to in the end...the clubs can't afford the possible liability of having X-bow shooters on board.

Chris

[Gateholio]

There should be some solution to the insurance issues- If there is a will to change things in the clubs.

Tikka,

I was shooting my buddys new compound last night. I haven't shot a compound in years, but the new tech stuff made it sooooo easy. First 2 arrows almost touched each other, and the third was only an inch and a half out of the group.

The bow was failry light, there was no TWANG of the bowstring and all you could hear was the (very fast) whizz of the arrow through the air.

I was pretty impressed, it was a far, far shorter learning curve than wiht my old longbow and recurve, that is for sure!:lol:

I'm interested in seeing how he does on a bear this spring, and I might try it out on a bear, too.

The new crossbows are very easy to learn to shoot well, but the compounds these days arent' far behind them!8-)

[Rainwater]

The Keremeos Cawston Sportsmen allow Xbows at their shoot (shameless plug here ,April 29th shoot). I will say before you make your decision that there is a segment of the population that looks down on Xbows. This segment of the populace also includes SOME conservation officers. At a meeting the other night it is now indicated that CO's will be more involved in regulation changes too. Whether you care about that or not is your business so buy what you like but keep that in the back of your mind.

[Bow Walker]

http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/36/36_1_21.gif (http://www.smileycentral.com/?partner=ZSzeb001_ZSYYYYYYJOCA) Great group Gatehouse! Was that at 10 or 15 yds.??

[Gateholio]

It was at about 45 yards. My friend was shooting at close to 60 yards and doing the same. I was really impressed by these new bows.

[Elkhound]

It was at about 45 yards. My friend was shooting at close to 60 yards and doing the same. I was really impressed by these new bows.

I am doing the same with my new bow as well. I was surprised how uncomplicated it was from the start. Judging distance is the hardest part of the whole thing.

Ps Tikka-if you are planning to hunt in other areas other than BC like me who is going for an archery hunt in Alberta this year. Take note. Some places like Alberta do not let you use a crossbow in the archery only season.

[Tinney]

Tinney makes a good point about being allowed to use the X-bow at club ranges and things such as 3D shoots. The social aspect of archery is great and you may very well miss out on that with a crossbow. As far as the clubs allowing X-bows Tinney...as i understand it, its not their call. Most clubs in the province rely on BCAA for their insurance and their insurance carrier will not cover X-bow's under the policy. I believe that clubs such as Merritt who allow them at the shoot have to purchase an extra rider on the policy to cover it off. I could be wrong but it seems to me that was what the issue boiled down to in the end...the clubs can't afford the possible liability of having X-bow shooters on board.

Chris

That's my problem Chris...why should insurance be higher for Xbow shooters? There's no significant danger factor between the two styles. In the hands of competent and even rookie shooters, they have about the same lethality.

[J_T]

Tinney, the lack of insurance coverage may simply result in a transfer of policy from one jurisdiction to another. In many jurisdictions crossbows are not considered archery tackle. If an insurance policy is developed in one area of the country other areas would be bound by the policy.

Boils down to a general lack of understanding.

FYI I know that following a discussion on here about 2 months back there are a lot of clubs that are opening up to the crossbow at shoots. Whether they have addressed the insurance policy is one thing, but they are opening their arms.

JT

[blaker_99]

Glad to se you're joing the ow scene Tikka. If you are planning on using your new bow for the upcoming season i'd suggest either a ton of practise with your compound bow and i mean a lot!! Or if you want a bit faster way to get comfortable with a bow g with an Excalibur exo-max. PM me i have one for sale as i have purchased a new compound bow and ready to kill with it now haha cheers.

[sealevel]

every club down in this neck of the rocks welcome crossbows. but if a club has to pay one dollar for extra insurance thats one dollar to much. is there anyone actually shooting a crossbow. i haven`t seen one for two years. i you want a crossbow buy it and shoot it but to say they are not welcome is crap.

[willyqbc]

last time i saw x-bows on a course was at the merritt shoot 2 years ago i believe..there were 3 fellows shooting them. I left that shoot telling those fellows I would try and get my home club to allow them at our shoot....It didn't happen. I really wonder if the insurance thing is just a convenient excuse for the segment of the archery population who has a problem with X-bows. I dunno what the answer is but if I had my way the x-bower would be welcomed

Chris

[J_T]

Willy, I agree, they have to be welcomed in. The crossbow is legal archery tackle and if Government have issues with crossbows (and they have in fact expressed concerns) then we as a part of the archery community have a responsibilty to do what we can to work with all archery users (our community) and work towards remedy of what it is government has issue with.

There is much to be gained by attending a 3D shoot.

JT

[Onesock]

Or......We could agree with the gov'y and put xbows in the GOS...........

[Onesock]

Now..... Actually I tried to get the Courtenay Fish & Game club to allow x-bows in our shoot on Mar31/Apr1 but alot of the guys were very much against it. I tried to explain to them that as legal archery tackle we should accept x-bows with the hope of teaching the newby bowhunter proper bowhunting ethics and they would have nothing to do with it. One comment was "how many would actually show up", I couldn't answer that but told them if just one did it would be worth it. So the world turns.

[sealevel]

they are welcome but i don`t really anyone aclually likes shooting them.

[greybark]

:sad: The Port Coquitlam archery club welcomed the use of crossbows at their 3-d events for the past FIVE years . Posters for the shoots prominetly advertized the crossbow welcome . Only one crossbow shooter atended during that time and I shot with him .
:| The ball is now in their court and it is up to them to show up in numbers enough that they must be counted and accepted into the archery comunity.


REMEMBER -- Keep Your Fingertab On --

[huntwriter]

Not trying to stir anything, just stating a fact as to why most insurance companies don’t cover crossbows. Over past years, archery clubs and organizations, including Pope & Young and the NBEF (National Bowhunter Education Foundation), have gone out of their way to ridicule the crossbow as a dangerous and unethical weapon. These clubs and organizations lobbied hard to keep the crossbow outlawed. Some years ago I spoke to a insurance representative in America about crossbows and why they are not covered by the insurance. I was told that it is due to information and input gathered from “reputable” (archery clubs and organizations) sources.

Today as more and more American states amend laws to make crossbows legal to hunt for all hunters we see that many archery clubs and organizations renew their ridiculous and totally unfounded negative claims about crossbows. Sad really, that these organizations have to resort to such silly tactics just to protect their own selfish agenda. It was because of this stance that I turned my back at the NBEF and the IBEP many years ago. T he way I see it, crossbows are 100% archery equipment and yes they should be in the archery season, not the rifle season or have a special season.

[GoatGuy]

I will say before you make your decision that there is a segment of the population that looks down on Xbows. This segment of the populace also includes SOME conservation officers. .

Not that that should ever be a deterrent to anyone thinking about getting a crossbow.

Also, some conservation officers implies more than one! ~~~~ Is that really the case?

There are also conservation officers that don't believe in bowhunting in general. There are also biologists that believe the same- - - shouldn't deter anyone who wants to get involved in either.




At a meeting the other night it is now indicated that CO's will be more involved in regulation changes too. Whether you care about that or not is your business so buy what you like but keep that in the back of your mind.

I think it's great - no local slant based on a couple guys observations when hunting for 5 - 7 days during the season. COs are 'on the ground' more than most.

[GoatGuy]

For this reason CO's have also expressed concern about cross over hunters who choose a crossbow.

JT

I hope you guys aren't making a statement for the government! :|

You make it sound like that is the general consensus amongst CO's ~ that certainly is not the case.

[Fisher-Dude]

I fully intend to be wandering the woods this fall, with a crossbow, during the COVETED BOW ONLY SEASON, whether any of the "real" bow hunters like it or not! :lol:

BTW, the COs I know think crossbows are kinda cool and foster participation. So there.

[J_T]

Fish Dude. That's awesome. Carry on and enjoy the archery season with your crossbow.


I hope you guys aren't making a statement for the government! :neutral:

You make it sound like that is the general consensus amongst CO's ~ that certainly is not the case.

No, we aren't making a comment for Government. The Government has made this statement to many of us. Perhaps if you were a member of a significant archery organization, you would have known this. Help me, understand why you can make a statement suggesting that it is not the case. (I thought perhaps I had credibility in your eyes?)

In fact, I have personally talked to two CO's that have expressed concern. I defended the crossbow as legal archery tackle in both cases. As members of the UBBC, we have received letters from Government expressing a similar concern from Biologists in 3 Regions. While that is not a majority consensus amongst Government it does suggest there is an awareness within Government.

During a meeting with the Minister not that long ago, he also expressed a concern and specifically mentioned the crossbow. Again, those "bowhunters" in attendance with the Minister and staff defended the crossbow as legal archery tackle and suggested the archery community bears responsibility in managing the image of the crossbow.

Is it ok for the rest of us to accuse you of saying things that may in fact not be supported as truth? Why would I say something that isn't true?

JT

[Beverly]

i want to buy a bow for this hunting seasin, but i am debating on weather to buy a cross bow or compound bow. i am leaning more towards a cross bow. i have not bow hunted so i am wonderig if anyone hase some sudjestions on which one they think would be the best one to buy


How about a compound crossbow? :lol: I hunted all last season with a crossbow and as a 120# small person had no reason to whine about the minor extra weight.

I also never missed a deer due to noise or movement which is more than I can say for my recurve packing buddy lol!

[GoatGuy]

Fish Dude. That's awesome. Carry on and enjoy the archery season with your crossbow.

No, we aren't making a comment for Government. The Government has made this statement to many of us. Perhaps if you were a member of a significant archery organization, you would have known this. Help me, understand why you can make a statement suggesting that it is not the case. (I thought perhaps I had credibility in your eyes?)

In fact, I have personally talked to two CO's that have expressed concern. I defended the crossbow as legal archery tackle in both cases. As members of the UBBC, we have received letters from Government expressing a similar concern from Biologists in 3 Regions. While that is not a majority consensus amongst Government it does suggest there is an awareness within Government.

During a meeting with the Minister not that long ago, he also expressed a concern and specifically mentioned the crossbow. Again, those "bowhunters" in attendance with the Minister and staff defended the crossbow as legal archery tackle and suggested the archery community bears responsibility in managing the image of the crossbow.

Is it ok for the rest of us to accuse you of saying things that may in fact not be supported as truth? Why would I say something that isn't true?

JT

Nice to hear you guys defended crossbow hunters. I'm well aware of what transpired at your meeting.:lol:


I'm fairly aware of who's against and for crossbows - it isn't a 'big' group within the minsitry. With a bit of a prod about participation related factors they usually swing right around. The statements make it sound like CO's in general and MOE is against crossbows. That isn't the case.


I wouldn't want somebody to read this thread and decide not to get into bow hunting with a crossbow because a couple co's don't agree with it.

Don't get yourself worked up JT - I'm just seeing the writing in a different way and am making sure this kind of stuff doesn't deter anyone who wants to buy a crossbow! :lol:

[J_T]

Don't get yourself worked up JT - I'm just seeing the writing in a different way and am making sure this kind of stuff doesn't deter anyone who wants to buy a crossbow! :lol: This is a valid statement and applies across the board.

Communication is better accomplished through tone and body language. The written word is perceived by the reader, in whatever context their personal style dictates.

I myself often view your comments as condescending. I guess that might not be the case, however....

There are other members on here who simply reply such as to cause a stir. I don't really understand why they would want to interupt a good conversation. Respect on some level is important.

I also believe the moderators should act more like moderators, as the annointed people they are, they should be held to a higher standard. Sort of like the MLA's we tend to slam. Making sharp inflammatory comments that might derail a conversation is questionable for a moderator.

JT

[Gateholio]

There are also conservation officers that don't believe in bowhunting in general. There are also biologists that believe the same- - - shouldn't deter anyone who wants to get involved in either.

t.

There are some police officers that don't believe anyone other than them shoudl own firearms...It sure doesn't deter me from owning them.:lol:

Unless there is some sort of pressure from hunters to exclude crossbows form bow season, (which woudl make zero sense) I don't think we are going to see them removed any time soon, despite what a couple of CO's may think about them.

[sealevel]

who would have thunk it a crossbow shooter was at penticton today!! she didn`t get run off or anything---but then maybe its a manly thing--- enjoy your crossbow fisher-dude

[Rod]

How about a compound crossbow? :lol: I hunted all last season with a crossbow and as a 120# small person had no reason to whine about the minor extra weight.

I also never missed a deer due to noise or movement which is more than I can say for my recurve packing buddy lol!

She might be a 120# small person but she sure can be nasty!! LOL!

I might make more noise but I held the same liscence all season :eek: .

Rod

[Elkhound]

There are other members on here who simply reply such as to cause a stir. I don't really understand why they would want to interupt a good conversation. Respect on some level is important.

I also believe the moderators should act more like moderators, as the annointed people they are, they should be held to a higher standard. Sort of like the MLA's we tend to slam. Making sharp inflammatory comments that might derail a conversation is questionable for a moderator.

JT

J_T- doesn't matter if it's a mod or a regular member. If there is a problem with a post report it. If it's against the board rules Marc will deal with it. However, sometimes stirring the pot is a way for members to encourage better debate, as long as the board rules are followed of course. I myself play devil's advocate in certain discussions just to make people think about another point of view

[johnes50]

You don't want to go "trad"... horribly inaccurate... :) :twisted: :)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R2XE5MKq1iM

RC

That kid is good. Doesn't spend much time aiming between shots either.

Hello Gatehouse. What brand of bow were you shooting? You've got me curious.

[Gateholio]

Bowtech Mission? Something liek that...I didn't pay to much attention to it, since bows arent' nearly as fun as guns to me. :)

Although when I think of the hours and days and months I put in shooting bows when I was a kid, you'd think I would be more into bowhunting..:)

[The Hermit]

they are welcome but i don`t really anyone aclually likes shooting them.

Where the heck is the 10X on a crossbow shooter anyway? Just kidding. As a brand new archer with a compound, I would love to try my hand at shooting a crossbow at a 3-D shoot. It would be interesting to see if my scores go up or down and to get a personal feel for what they can do. Maybe if more archers tried it they might like it??

[Tinney]

I wouldn't mind trying one either actually, if I wasn't already a crack shot with the compound :lol: I think that not many people buy crossbows because they know that the local clubs won't let them shoot there....and that crossbows have been cut down time and again by the media and more 'traditional' forms of archery.....let's face it folks, they are archery tackle

[Rainwater]

Tinney, Face it folks if the government says it is, then "IT IS".

[J_T]

I wouldn't mind trying one either actually, if I wasn't already a crack shot with the compound :lol: I think that not many people buy crossbows because they know that the local clubs won't let them shoot there....and that crossbows have been cut down time and again by the media and more 'traditional' forms of archery.....let's face it folks, they are archery tackle

I think your right about experiencing it. I too wouldn't mind shooting one. I'm pretty sure my initial assessment would be that it is a gun without the bang though. As for you statement of why people don't buy crossbow I have two comments.
1) In most states crossbows are not considered archery tackle and they are not permitted in archery seasons. Therefore there is a hesitancy by hunters in many jurisdictions.
2) I believe that someone who seeks an archery experience leans to the compound bow. This is evidenced by that fact that few crossbow hunters attend 3D shoots and few crossbow hunters take their IBEP. If your response to my comment is that crossbow shooters might not be welcome at a 3D shoot, I would respond by asking why are they not knocking down the door to participate, or why are they not organizing themselves and enjoying a recreational opportunity of skill development? No, those who consider purchasing a crossbow, are rifle hunters wanting to take advantage of the bowhunting opportunity. Which is great don't get me wrong. More hunting, more hunters, all good.

Those who are looking for the archery experience adopt an archery social network, attending shoots, enjoying the camraderie. They are truly looking for something other than simply the bowhunting opportunity.

I doubt many people conciously make a decision not to buy a crossbow because they are concerned about what other people think. Being hunters I would suspect they would enjoy being controversial.

JT

[sealevel]

I can have a new shooter shoot a compound in a hour good enough to hit a deer at 20 yards. Same with a crossbow but can that archer or crossbow shooter judge the flight of the arrow. Can they tell the difference between 27 or 35 yards. No they can`t it takes practace. How many days shooting practace do`s it take to hit a pie plate at 50yards if you know the distance. Its a lot differant hitting that pie plate when you don`t know the distance. I don`t think its any easyer to shoot a cross bow than a compound. The hard part is knowing the path of the arrow----Was not the origanal argument against the crossbow was they were bought by gunhunters to take advantage of bow only season a week before the season opened . Remmember crossbows are not rifles.

[Elkhound]

Tinney I just got my first compound bow and within minutes I had groupings of 2-3inches at 40 meters, and 30 meters. under 2 inches at 20 meters. With just an archery buddy helping me along. Surely enough to kill a deer at 20 yrds. I sure hope so or I will get my ass kicked by a black bear this spring

[Gateholio]

Tinney, as I related earlier, I picked up a bow for the first time in years and made 3 "killing shots" rigth off th ebat.

Certainly there would be some bow set up as well as hunting technique, but I htink the average person that hunted previously woudl be able to have th eskills to shoot a bow accuratley enough to kill a deer at closer ranges, pretty swiftly.

[sealevel]

learning to shoot is the easy part but nobody with a crossbow or compound shoud be hunting with out months of practace.

[Gateholio]

Nice language you friggin dope.

How about some respect? If you don't agree with someone, then say why. But to just pound on someone like you just did suggests you are a lot less wise than you always attempt to be. Perhaps you are young, still in school and still stupid. In need of lessons by some more seasoned hunters, by some real men, little boy.

JT and Tinney....That will be enough of the insults, please.

[willyqbc]

JT and Tinney....That will be enough of the insults, please.

Agreed...debate all you like but do not get personal with it. The posts in question have been deleted from this thread.

Chris

[willyqbc]

In reply to those who believe that they will be ready to kill an animal with a compound bow very swiftly...I will offer up this opinion.

Shooting a compound is a game of repeatability. to hit the same spot there are a ton of things that need to be done the same each time. On the range it is very easy to go through the mental checklist to be sure you have everything in order....as we all know it doesn't usually work that way in the feild. Myself i think you need to spend a good deal of time building up that muscle memory so that when you draw anchor and fire your bow it is completely automatic and you can focus your attention on the animal,shot placement, obstructions in the way etc. We can only compute so many things at once and if your shot sequence needs to be thought through every step of the way its going to divert you from assesing the situation in front of you.

Just my thoughts
Chris

[greybark]

:) Hey Tinny , I disagree with your idea that it takes hours to shoot a compound with a 20yd kill skill . Most compound bows are so technicly advanced that anyone with some basic help can group out to and beyond 30yds in one hour .
:sad: Your assumtion that it takes a "qualified level instructor" to teach archery is partly correct at best . I have seen many of these " instructors" that are "leveled" that have no conception of the methods of teaching .
:) As Sealevel states it is possible in most cases to have a new compound shooter quite competent in one hour . It must be pointed out that this is at known distances and for hunting purposes more than an hour is needed to learn judging distances.
Sorry for stepping sideways a little on this one tikka.

REMEMBER -- Keep Your Fingertab On --

[J_T]

Now, I'd like to apologize (sort of) for my comment. I do feel that Tinney was out of line, and used my response to draw attention to it. I am a bit confused why it took my response to raise awareness of his post and have his post removed.

This has been a good conversation, although the initial topic is way out of reach with where the conversation has gone. Most of all, it has been civil. And this site needs some civil conversation regarding bowhunting.

I do my utmost to hold the high ground in light of those that simply want to inflame a situation and trigger negative response, in fact I posted a response to that previously on here.

When a good conversation is occuring, it just isn't acceptable for some of the guys on here (including myself) to just jump in and post a stupid comment. Moderators included.


JT

[Elkhound]

I am a bit confused why it took my response to raise awareness of his post and have his post removed.



Gatehouse and I do not have mod powers in this section of HBC. Therefore we could not edit or delete either

[sealevel]

The whole point in all this crossbow discusion is crossbows are legal and excepted. But other then having a stock and trigger in no way are they anything like a rifle. They are archery you need to practice and practice some more. Archery is almost a way of live . in know way should anyone just pickup a crossbow or any bow . just to hunt the 10 day archery only season.

[Gateholio]

[quote=J_T]Now, I'd like to apologize (sort of) for my comment. I do feel that Tinney was out of line, and used my response to draw attention to it. I am a bit confused why it took my response to raise awareness of his post and have his post removed.

Because maybe the bowhunting mod hadn't seen it yet?



When a good conversation is occuring, it just isn't acceptable for some of the guys on here (including myself) to just jump in and post a stupid comment. Moderators included.

Maybe you should let the mods of the forum decide what is or what is not acceptable?

You are free to use the "report a post" feature on any post that you find offensive, in fact, this technique may be more effective than continuously whining about the mods (who are also human and some even have a sense of humour) and demanding that they perform to your expectations, or "using your post to draw attention to another post, so it will be removed"

[Tinney]

I don't believe my post was out of line. I apologize if I did offend.

[Onesock]

I myself agree with the vast majority of bowhunters that xbows should only be allowed in the GOS. This is my opinion so go ahead and jump all over me. I will support them as of this moment as they are still legal archery tackle in BC. If xbows weren't legal in bow season the operators could still use them in the GOS.

[Gateholio]

I myself agree with the vast majority of bowhunters that xbows should only be allowed in the GOS.

...and your reasons for this is????

[Bow Walker]

This moderator has finally seen (and read) the whole thread.

Tinney - your deleted post was indeed inflammatory any way you look at it. Apology accepted.....not by me, as I am not the one you should apologize to. Good on ya for stepping up to the plate.

sealevel - your deleted response was worth deleting.

Thanks to WillyQBC for keeping you "kids" in line while I was nappinghttp://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/36/36_1_67.gif (http://www.smileycentral.com/?partner=ZSzeb001_ZSYYYYYYJOCA)



Gatehouse - I have yet to receive a comment via the "report-a-post" method. Have you? I think that anyone who feels slighted in a thread will most likely use a testosterone response before the report-a-post method. Something to do with fight your own battles perhaps?

Onesock - I disagree with your blanket statement that the "vast majority" of bowhunters think cross bows should only be allowed in the Gun Only Season(s). I will agree that a "vocal portion" of bow hunters think that way, though I believe that crossbows should be like all other archery equipment in that they can be used in the Archery Only Season, and also throughout the rest of hunting season.

As always - Just One Man's Opinion.

[Gateholio]

Gatehouse - I have yet to receive a comment via the "report-a-post" method. Have you? I


The reported posts go to you remail that you are registered under. You may only get them if they come form the bow forum, I get them all, so if noone has reported a post in the bow forum, maybe you havent' got one? I'm not sure??


I think that anyone who feels slighted in a thread will most likely use a testosterone response before the report-a-post method. Something to do with fight your own battles perhaps?

Yes, for sure some peopel like to duke it out.8-)

Don't start crying that the mods arent' doing thier job, and bitch that someone is ruining a thread when you are contributing to the flames, though:lol:

Bottom line is if a member sees something that they feel is wrong, they can (and should) use the report a post feature, and the mods can decide if it is something worth pursuing, if corrective or punitive actions need to be taken, if soeone needs to get a PM telling them to smarten up, if it was a joke, or if it just wasn't that big a deal...8-)

[willyqbc]

lets get this discussion off of "moderation" and back on track to help Tikka decide between X-bow and compound. if not we'll just shut this down as having run its course. hi-jack over!!:)

Have you formed any solid opinions on each weapon yet Tikka??

Chris

[Gateholio]

What are cost comparisions between comparabel examples of the 2? Is one more cost effective than the other? This could influence the decisions, too...

[The Hermit]

Most of you know that I am a brand new newbie archer cause I tend to yap about the stuff I'm excited about eh. In my whole two and half months of practicing every few days I was feeling pretty damned competent right off the bat.

After attending the 3-D shoot last weekend and seeing how many animals I would have badly wounded had those foamies been real has given me pause... I need a LOT more practice before trying to kill an animal over about ten yards! Here are my scores.

152/200 = 76%
186/250 = 74.4%
172/250 = 68.8%
Average = 73%

I already admitted not knowing much about archery and typical learning curves etc but I've been told that these scores are very good for a beginner...

I wouldn't be shooting a rifle if I was going to execute a clean one-shot kill on only 3 out of 4 animals that I had a shot at. Would you?

It is certainly different in a hunting like situation than standing at known distances, on flat ground, without any obstructions (trees, slalal, branches, mosquitoes, Dan's smelly farts etc to distract a guy! :-)

[Bow Walker]

Most of you know that I am a brand new newbie archer cause I tend to yap about the stuff I'm excited about eh. In my whole two and half months of practicing every few days I was feeling pretty damned competent right off the bat.

After attending the 3-D shoot last weekend and seeing how many animals I would have badly wounded had those foamies been real has given me pause... I need a LOT more practice before trying to kill an animal over about ten yards! Here are my scores.

152/200 = 76%
186/250 = 74.4%
172/250 = 68.8%
Average = 73%

I already admitted not knowing much about archery and typical learning curves etc but I've been told that these scores are very good for a beginner...

I wouldn't be shooting a rifle if I was going to execute a clean one-shot kill on only 3 out of 4 animals that I had a shot at. Would you?

It is certainly different in a hunting like situation than standing at known distances, on flat ground, without any obstructions (trees, slalal, branches, mosquitoes, Dan's smelly farts etc to distract a guy! :-)
My scores were similar Bill. Think about the adrenalin, the "out-of-breath" factor, and the startlement/excitement of seeing a live animal in its natural habitat and you with the intent of "harvesting" it.

Bow, Cross bow, gun, or hand grenade......your heart has to be going overtime. The bottom line is PRACTICE.

Practice until it is second nature - until you don't have to think about it, just do it and do it right. Whether the weapon be a Cross bow, or a Compound bow, one heckova lot of practice is needed to be proficient.

[J_T]

Most of you know that I am a brand new newbie archer cause I tend to yap about the stuff I'm excited about eh. In my whole two and half months of practicing every few days I was feeling pretty damned competent right off the bat.

After attending the 3-D shoot last weekend and seeing how many animals I would have badly wounded had those foamies been real has given me pause... I need a LOT more practice before trying to kill an animal over about ten yards! Here are my scores.

152/200 = 76%
186/250 = 74.4%
172/250 = 68.8%
Average = 73%

I already admitted not knowing much about archery and typical learning curves etc but I've been told that these scores are very good for a beginner...

I wouldn't be shooting a rifle if I was going to execute a clean one-shot kill on only 3 out of 4 animals that I had a shot at. Would you?

It is certainly different in a hunting like situation than standing at known distances, on flat ground, without any obstructions (trees, slalal, branches, mosquitoes, Dan's smelly farts etc to distract a guy! :smile:
Hermit, you just made me aware of the biggest reason why a traditional shoot is so great. There are moving targets, many of them (flying birds, running squirrels) The shot location is often through trees to simulate a hunting situation. Must stand backwards to target. Must stand sideways with pretty lady tickling your chin.

Never (well seldom) does a 3D shoot replicate a hunting situation, however it does take you a step closer. Standing in your back yard is one thing, a shoot another and taking it to the hunt is again another level. And we've all talked about hitting a target, or our shot placement, but what about our skills at retrieval. Likely the biggest decision you make after the shot, is at what point do you pursue? What kind of a shot did you make? Are you sure? How are your tracking skills. Blood trailing is not the only clue. Lots to think about.

Chris, I'm sure by now Tikka has made up their mind. I'm sure we're just sitting around the campfire slinging arrows at each other by now.

JT

[The Hermit]

Hey J_T at teh shoot on the weekend they had a moving bear at about 15 yards. That was pretty cool and I actually scored a 10X on the second round on him! Maybe I should practice on the squirrels in the forest behind my house!

The fist animal I ever killed was with my long bow when I was knee high to a little guy... it was a running squirrel at about ten yards. Stuck him to a log... Gack did I ever feel horrible! Proud and excited but horrible at the same time, that hasn't changed too much in the intervening forty some years.

Good points BowWalker and J_T. I haven't usually had to track anything too far. Lots to learn and look forward to.

[Onesock]

Why... In my opinion bows are bows, xbows are not!! I guess the biggest reason is not having to draw a xbow at the precise time a bow hunter has to draw his bow. Drawing a bow is alot of movement while pulling the trigger on xbow is very little movement. Gatehouse- I am not getting into this with you!! My opinion is my opinion is my opinion. If someone wants to use a xbow in GOS go for it.

[Gateholio]

I guess the biggest reason is not having to draw a xbow at the precise time a bow hunter has to draw his bow. Drawing a bow is alot of movement while pulling the trigger on xbow is very little movement. .

So it comes down to that the movement to discharge a crossbow is less than a compound, so the crossbow is making it "too easy" to use in bow season?

[J_T]

So it comes down to that the movement to discharge a crossbow is less than a compound, so the crossbow is making it "too easy" to use in bow season? No it isn't as simple as that. Those who shoot and hunt with a bow understand. Those who don't ask questions like this.

A crossbow is legal archery tackle. Onesock has stated his personal opinion. We are all entitled to that.


did I ever feel horrible! Proud and excited but horrible at the same time Welcome to bowhunting Hermit, those memories and feelings are going creep up on you again. Bowhunting is personal. Up close and personal.

It's those feelings that I explore with my boys and other young people I have introduced to hunting. Makes them value life in the big picture.

JT

[Gateholio]

No it isn't as simple as that. Those who shoot and hunt with a bow understand. Those who don't ask questions like this.

JT

well, that is what Onesock said:

I guess the biggest reason is not having to draw a xbow at the precise time a bow hunter has to draw his bow. Drawing a bow is alot of movement while pulling the trigger on xbow is very little movement

Your response indicates that there is no practical reason to not allow crossbows, only what those "in the know" understand. That says alot....

[Onesock]

Gate- A truck driver would never pretend to know anything about brain surgery, would he?

[Gateholio]

Gate- A truck driver would never pretend to know anything about brain surgery, would he?

Nor woudl the surgeon know how to steer an 18 wheeler...:roll:

Is this the best you can come up with then?

If I tell someone that somethign should not be allowed - like a 22LR is a poor choice for moose hunting, I can back that up wiht firm information. But the best you seem to be able to come up with regarding crossbows is:

"There is less movement with a crossbow, and it's "not the same, and if you were a bowhunter, you'd know what I mean"

[GoatGuy]

Gate- A truck driver would never pretend to know anything about brain surgery, would he?

Isn't that what www.google.com (http://www.google.com) is there for?

[Onesock]

Two guys that don't bowhunt seem to be experts on the situation. Also there have been alot of moose killed with a 22. Not the best but it will work.

[J_T]

Gatehouse,

All I meant with my statement was simply that sometimes there is no need for defense of an opinion.

There is a post on here discussing how far guys have shot animals with rifles. I disagree with some of those distances. Do I go on that post, disrupt what is merely a discussion amongst a few good guys about something that in my opinion is unethical? No, I leave them be.

People are entitled to their own opinion. To challenge someone's opinion the way you are pushing here, doesn't always lead to the answer you are looking for. It derails what might perhaps be a good thread and leads down a path towards deragatory comments.

Once again, here we are, in my opinion, as a moderator you are bending your rules to suit you. As a moderator, should you not be open minded relatively neutral and moderate discussion? Well, that's just my opinion, it doesn't mean it's the rules here I guess.


Is this the best you can come up with then?
Sounds more like you are calling him out behind the school.

JT

[Bow Walker]

Why... In my opinion bows are bows, xbows are not!! I guess the biggest reason is not having to draw a xbow at the precise time a bow hunter has to draw his bow. Drawing a bow is alot of movement while pulling the trigger on xbow is very little movement. Gatehouse- I am not getting into this with you!! My opinion is my opinion is my opinion. If someone wants to use a xbow in GOS go for it.
Onesock - yes, drawing a bow is a bit of movement at the critical moment, but so is raising and aiming a crossbow.

We don't hunt with our bows up and ready to draw and neither do x-bow hunters. IMHO the movement of both is pretty much the same so I don't think that is a valid point.

Consider this......guns whiz a projectile along at speeds in excess of 2,000 fps. X-bows, compound bows, and traditional bows achieve speeds of less than 400 fps. Who has the bigger advantage? Where do you draw the line and say that this or that type of equipment belongs in this or that category?

Pellet guns that exceed a certain fps must be licensed - I'm just not sure what that speed is right now. Not sure what pellet guns have to do with this topic, but it has to do with fps for killing (or harvesting if one prefers).

Anyway, I think that fps has more bearing on the topic than the shape of the weapon.

[Bow Walker]

Gatehouse.........add a smiley or two to your posts if you are not intending to be confrontational. It'll help to tone down the testosterone levels that I sense are beginning to build.

[Bow Walker]

This thread has (IMHO) run its course, not to mention that it has gotten off topic. If the posters would like to continue discussing the relative merits of X-bows they should do so in a fresh thread. It'll give us a brief cooling off time.

Thread closed.