Bullet choice for grizzly

[sako04]

Wondering what kind of bullet people would recommend for grizzly

I'm shooting a 300 win mag and need a bullet with a good bc but still have the power to kill a grizz at longer ranges

[Rackmastr]

I shot mine with a 338WM and a 210gr TSX. Shot was around that 150 range if I remember right.

Not sure what you consider 'longer range' for grizz, but I like the idea of a strong constructed bullet and it worked well for me!

[todbartell]

180gr TTSX & 200gr Accubond come to mind.

[srupp]

hmmm.."longer ranges" best advice is shoot em over 70 yards and under 150 yards..as for ammo..Highly recommend TSX ammo..I only use TSX and in my Sako .338 use 225 grain ..great results..,stay on the larger end for weight for your 300 and Tsx and you will be fine on reasonable ranges for grizzly..again breaking that front shoulder down..premium bullets shot at reasonable distances will result in safe humane harvest..



cheers

Steven

[cassiarkid]

I have a 300 Weatherby Mag and shot mine with a 180gr Speer Grand Slam. Went through and broke both front shoulders at about 150 yrds.

[BiG Boar]

200 grain TSX is what I shot mine with. Have taken elk out to 500 yards with them also, so I think they will work for grizzly. That being said, I wouldn't want to shoot one that far. Blood trailing a gut shot grizzly sucks in the worst of ways.

[BCBRAD]

+1 on the 200gr Accubond.

[paw325]

TSX, TTSX, LRX, Partitions, E Tips, Trophy Bonded Bear Claws, Swift A Frames, any of those around 180gr work very nicely. If your looking for longer ranges, id suggest 175gr LRX, have only killed 1 with that bullet, but it worked rather well. Seen a few killed with the others listed. Pick the one your rifle shoots best.

[REMINGTON JIM]

TSX, TTSX, LRX, Partitions, E Tips, Trophy Bonded Bear Claws, Swift A Frames, any of those around 180gr work very nicely. If your looking for longer ranges, id suggest 175gr LRX, have only killed 1 with that bullet, but it worked rather well. Seen a few killed with the others listed. Pick the one your rifle shoots best.

Add SWIFT 180 GR SCIROCCO 11 'S to that list too ! :wink: RJ

[BCBRAD]

best advice is shoot em over 70 yards and under 150 yards


This is real good advice, better chance from things going sideways.

[gerrygoat]

Wondering what kind of bullet people would recommend for grizzly

I'm shooting a 300 win mag and need a bullet with a good bc but still have the power to kill a grizz at longer ranges

Whichever shoots better in your gun between the 200 gr Partition and 200 gr Accubond, both will open up nicely at long range and still smash heavy bone close up. There are a lot of bullets that would work but those two would be my choice.

[Everett]

Any decent quality bullet 150gr or larger will sort out your Grizzly if you put the bullet in the kill zone. If you gut shoot it doesn't matter what type of bullet you are using it will get messy. If you are using old school lead core bullets go for the 200gr option.

[Fisher-Dude]

Swift A-frame.

[srupp]

hmmm not a bit of experience with the Accubond..however have seen some practice work done with A frame and it seemed to work quite well.. that being said and if things have changed I am not aware of it..with the Nosler partition..it was my belief that the Nosler was designed to shred..lose 40% on impact..IMO that is exactly what you don't want to happen..high retention is a better choice for grizzly hunting..and yes I have shot G bears with Noslers partitions I just think there are now better options...

cheers

Steven

[Hunt-4-Life]

I'm going to start working up a grizz load for my 30-06. (gasp! No magnum!?!?) Going to use a Hornady Interlock 220 grain and IMR4831 as soon as I can get some more powder.

[trapperRick]

35 Whelen 250gr PSP Core- Lokt it's a bear stopper for sure

[GoatGuy]

TSXs are a great option or any other premium bullet that doesn't disintegrate on impact. Otherwise whatever is cheap should work. NPs are last on the list.

[pescado]

First bullet I would try would be the A-frame. If that did not shoot I would find a bullet off PAW's list above and go kill your bear. I would not want to reach to far out when I shot him.

[Big G Hunter]

I shot mine with a 30-06, 180g trophy bonded bear claw. little ironic huh? Got him from about 60yards away, quartering to me. Went in the left shoulder and stopped at the hide on the far side. Left shoulder was mush, right shoulder was fairly broken and lungs were toast. They worked great. Listen to SRupp. He's got some knowledge on Grizzlys.

[BCBRAD]

From the wound channel on the Accubond the loss of weight is progressive through out its travel in the animal, the X bullet seems to 'cookie cutter' through in my experience. I have recovered the X bullet in all calibers I used, but not all the time, some failed to open up as well. Never recovered an Accubond yet. Used the X bullet from 1992 up until about 5 years ago, these days I prefer the Accubond.

[Fred1]

best advice is shoot em over 70 yards and under 150 yards


this is real good advice, better chance from things going sideways.

x3 x2 :)

[warnniklz]

Recovered .323 cal 200 grain accubond that I recovered... not from a G-bear though

https://fbcdn-photos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/t1/1422512_10153456528740387_763822980_n.jpg

https://fbcdn-photos-e-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/t1/1426607_10153456529140387_277123753_n.jpg

https://fbcdn-photos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/t1/1450946_10153456529435387_913412993_n.jpg

[Barracuda]

tsx or ttsx anything else is second best or first loser depending on how you want to look at it.

[paw325]

Add SWIFT 180 GR SCIROCCO 11 'S to that list too ! :wink: RJ

If your saying they work RJ, Im believing you:mrgreen: its just ive never used them or seen them used on a bear.

For the guys that don't like Partitions, I've gotta ask why?

I've seen a pile of tough critters killed with them, in more calibers than I can count with all my fingers and they flat out kill. If I'm not pushing an X bullet of some sort, Partitions are next in line.

[Fisher-Dude]

Add SWIFT 180 GR SCIROCCO 11 'S to that list too ! :wink: RJ


Yup. Great bullets.

7 RM recovered last fall from a mule deer I shot. Very good expansion, and unlike Barnes, Sciroccos expand EVERY time.


http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e70/Fisher-Dude/photo_zpsf72193f6.jpg

[Rattler]

Shot mine with 180gr accubond out of a 300WM at 130 yards. Bang flop! Shot passed behind front shoulder and lodged in his neck - quartering away slightly uphill.

[MBOGO]

Swift A-Frame is my choice for every thing

[srupp]

In my opinion the nosler partition bullet was never designed to do what we ask.. Or expect of our hunting bullets designed to specifically harvest a grizzly bear. I just reread the literature from the nozzle partition bullets, and they are counting on two thirds retention after their bullets do their work... 66% left... 33% shed along its path... Compared to the TSX.. That continuously delivers 97% retention.... Big difference..

The nosler was developed to blow apart within the chest cavity of the big game animal... Again shedding 33% as shrapnel to further destroy the lungs... In grizzly hunting you want to take out front shoulder... And that is much better suited to a bullet that retains more of its original bullet weight. This assumes you want to take up front shoulder.. Which I do.. And that the shot will be at reasonable ranges between 70 and hundred and fifty yards.. Which is reasonable.. And the concept is to imobilize the bear where you shot it... Not where he chooses to stand and continue the fight..

Nosler partition is a tremendous bullet.. And I have used on many big game animals... However with the 1100 pound coastal grizzly harvested last spring, or your trophy of a lifetime, or confrontation with any grizzly after a hard won LEH and finding the coveted trophy grizzly... You don't want what might work... Nor the cheapest... you Literally want to bring a gun to a knife fight .

It is absolutely true that any grizzlies shot once through the lungs with nosler partition bullet.. Is a dead bear.. I believe it is even more true.. That you want to break down the front shoulder, thus removing the bears ability to escape to the timber... And the Barnes TSX.. With over 30% greater retained bullet weight is by far the better choice... In this grizzly bear hunting situation .

cheers

Srupp

[leadpillproductions]

barnes .......

[Gateholio]

TTSX for sure. Always perfect expansion coupled with weight retention for penetrating power.

[angus5024]

If you want a "long range" bullet for Grizz, you better be able to x ring every time before you go out. Everybody on here has mentioned good bullets but the only ones with decent b.c's are the 180 Scirroco, the 200 Accubond and the TTSX's.
Good luck!

[leadpillproductions]

I was just about to say that lol good job steve

[Gateholio]

Yup. Great bullets.

7 RM recovered last fall from a mule deer I shot. Very good expansion, and unlike Barnes, Sciroccos expand EVERY time.


http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e70/Fisher-Dude/photo_zpsf72193f6.jpg



Exactly the type of bullet performance I wouldn't want on a grizzly. A bullet that expands to that degree on a deer would be horrible for breaking grizzly shoulders. That bullet has lost considerable weight, looks like most of the inner core is gone.

[Fisher-Dude]

139 gr left on a 150 gr bullet. That is excellent performance on a quartering shot that travelled through a lot of deer before it stopped.

Shot a book black bear with a 180 gr Scirocco with my 300 WM. The far shoulder was pulverized, and the bear dropped in his tracks.

[srupp]

Hmm great performance on mule deer is a differnt story completly..it is not what we are discussing...grizzly bears was the specific topic...and considering we have only discussed the bear running away....he may indeed decide to attack...and the broken up badly deformed deer bullet is not what I am trusting my life to....Imo not even close...

Cheers

Sr

130 grains left from 150 grains is far from Tsx 97% retention...

[Gateholio]

139 gr left on a 150 gr bullet. That is excellent performance on a quartering shot that travelled through a lot of deer before it stopped.

.

What bone did it impact, and where in the animal was the bullet recovered?

[Fisher-Dude]

Read it again: 139/150 = 93% and guaranteed to expand. Better than a 100% weight retention that does not expand.

[Gateholio]

Read it again: 139/150 = 93% and guaranteed to expand. Better than a 100% weight retention that does not expand.

I doubt very much if you have ever found a TTSX bullet that has not expanded.

[gerrygoat]

I can't believe some of the stuff people believe, any of the better bullets will kill a bear. A Barnes will work and so will a Nosler Partition, anyone who says the Partition isn't a good bullet for killing animals doesn't know what they are talking about when it comes to bullet performance.

[huntingfamily]

Check out these 30 cal bullet tests:
http://www.canadiangunnutz.com/forum/showthread.php/845216-30-cal-bullet-test-cow-femurs-and-lots-of-newspaper-Part-1-Part-2-Part-3-Part4-added

There are a lot of suitable bullets out there. And the Barnes bullets have their issues as well as the others.
Just sayin...

[Fisher-Dude]

I doubt very much if you have ever found a TTSX bullet that has not expanded.

I haven't because I don't use them.

Do I need to post a string of web pics of Barnes failures?

[gerrygoat]

A good lead cored bullet will generally open up a wider wound channel than the typical mono bullet which is something I prefer on bears in particular. Each has their strengths and weaknesses even the Barnes bullets.......

[375 ultramag]

I always use TSX. I'm shooting a 375 um and using a 270 grain for big game. Never disappointed and great weight retention.

[Gateholio]

I haven't because I don't use them.

Do I need to post a string of web pics of Barnes failures?

I'd love to see pics of TTSX bullets that haven't expanded when they impact game. (If they exist) I've shot a number of animals with TTSX bullets from 130-250gr and they all expanded very well, judging from the incredible amount of damage they did to the vitals of the animals, and the rare few I've recovered.

[GoatGuy]

I can't believe some of the stuff people believe, any of the better bullets will kill a bear. A Barnes will work and so will a Nosler Partition, anyone who says the Partition isn't a good bullet for killing animals doesn't know what they are talking about when it comes to bullet performance.

The front end of the bullet disintegrates on shoulder and the 'core' zips through just like a solid leaving a very small exit hole. Retains very little weight. Animals don't seem to be 'rocked' by them at all. Lots of blood shot meat and animals that go way too far. Of course, anything that has the air let out of it will die.

Can only speak from personal experience - used to have a bullet but haven't seen it for a decade. Remember a new guide showing up at Nahanni who shot those as well - they told him in no uncertain circumstances he wasn't leaving camp with his gun and those bullets. Pretty animated event.

If they work for you that's great. Last choice for me.

[elknut]

I myself would not shoot a G bear with a TSX bullet....Lost an elk to a poorly expanding bullet...Full front shoulder shot...The TTSX however is another story...It guarantees to fully expand and still retain pretty well 100 %...Throw away the TSX and shoot TTSX...They are also one of the most best grouping bullets out there..As far as Nosler...They will kill well..

[Timberjack]

Hey guys - I just read an interesting article in rifleshooter magazine, on a 30 cal bullet test. Trophy bonded tipped performed well in that guy's test. Wondered if any of you have had any real world experience with them, esp on bigger animals. They happen to shoot really well out of my 300 Whizzum...

TJ

[hunter1993ap]

I'd love to see pics of TTSX bullets that haven't expanded when they impact game. (If they exist) I've shot a number of animals with TTSX bullets from 130-250gr and they all expanded very well, judging from the incredible amount of damage they did to the vitals of the animals, and the rare few I've recovered.

I'm sure if you recovered the animal the bullet worked great. but if it doesn't expand the recovery might not happen. I don't have any experience with barnes but I have heard rumors of them not expanding. but then again it could just be from bad bullet placement.

[Fisher-Dude]

I'd love to see pics of TTSX bullets that haven't expanded when they impact game. (If they exist) I've shot a number of animals with TTSX bullets from 130-250gr and they all expanded very well, judging from the incredible amount of damage they did to the vitals of the animals, and the rare few I've recovered.

7mm 150 gr TTSX failures. I like the bullet performance in the 7mm 150 gr Scirocco pic above better. :)

http://img109.imageshack.us/img109/7026/img1019ye.jpg

[Everett]

I always find it funny people who bitch at Barnes bullets never have used them between myself and my hunting partners I have seen 30+ animals killed by barnes bullets all dead animals.
Fisher Dude your pic shows recovered bullets which means the dead animal was recovered which means the bullet did what it was supposed to kill the animal. To my eye they look like bullets that didn't have enough velocity to expand.

[Weatherby Fan]

I've shot Barnes X and then the TSX and TTSX and of all the ones we've recovered they all opened properly and retained 97% or better, I have not shot a Grizzly but many Elk,Moose and Deer and all performed as expected.

I also used Swift A Frames in the past which also performed well, I think if you use any well constructed bullet you will be fine with your caliber.

My preference would be a TSX or TTSX as I seen a 300wsm using a 180gr TSX stop a charging Grizzly at 9 yards in it's tracks, that sold me on them.

WF

[Fisher-Dude]

I always find it funny people who bitch at Barnes bullets never have used them between myself and my hunting partners I have seen 30+ animals killed by barnes bullets all dead animals.
Fisher Dude your pic shows recovered bullets which means the dead animal was recovered which means the bullet did what it was supposed to kill the animal. To my eye they look like bullets that didn't have enough velocity to expand.

I could kill an animal with a 22 cal solid and recover it too, but that doesn't make it the best for a grizzly hunt. Just sayin'.

The 250 Savage I own killed Alaskan moose and Alaskan brown bear before it came into our family in the 1950s. I doubt the previous owner was using TTSX bullets. More than likely, he was lobbing 100 gr Corelokts or Noslers from it. Best choice? Nope, but they killed stuff dead.

[srupp]

hmm I did go and read stories of Barnes "failures"..lol one on the Nosler forum...no comment.I guess anything can fail, eventually... what I use for sheep and deer are not the same bullet MNFR. as my grizzly and moose bullets. I honestly have not had less than a photo perfect 97 % retention. Thats me personally..it provides extreme accuracy in my .338..and has mushroomed perfectly 100 % of the time..and its what I use to back up clients..and I personaly count on it for my safety...and its what I recommend every year for the many who call with a Grizzly tag in their pocket...if I seriously had any concerns I wouldn't recommend them.

When I go guiding this spring with disabled clients (Wounded Warriors ) the Sako .338 will be in my hands and the bullets will be Barnes 225 gr TSX..I am staking my personal well being and that of my client to the best bullet I can find for the situation...I am sure you will be equally confident in your selection.

cheers

Srupp

[Fisher-Dude]

I think lots of people are so scared of grizzly bears that they stress out over bullet choice. Relax and use a good quality bullet of whatever make you like, and with the rifle you shoot best.

Shoot the bear in the right spot when the shot is presented, and you'll have a dead bear.

[leadpillproductions]

shoot them threw the shoulders brake some bone game over.

[srupp]

this is the only one I have in my office, however it accurately portrays my personal experience, and I so far like the results...

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d47/srupp/P1010006-2.jpg (http://s32.photobucket.com/user/srupp/media/P1010006-2.jpg.html)

225 gr TSX..example and recovered bullet.....

srupp

[j270wsm]

My griz was shot with a 180gr partition@ 2980fps out of a 300win mag. Shot was ranged at 269yds and the bear went 15yds. Took out the heart with a low chest shot.

[leadpillproductions]

steve what was the range of the shot
this is the only one I have in my office, however it accurately portrays my personal experience, and I so far like the results...

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d47/srupp/P1010006-2.jpg (http://s32.photobucket.com/user/srupp/media/P1010006-2.jpg.html)

225 gr TSX..example and recovered bullet.....

srupp

[BlacktailStalker]

168gr TSX out of my 300WSM on this 2013 8'6" grizz was the kill shot. Double lung heart, decimated. Recovered projectile in the skin on the opposite side.
Haven't used anything but in 7 years now.

http://i1024.photobucket.com/albums/y305/TaylenJames/photo_zps702e1e12.jpg (http://s1024.photobucket.com/user/TaylenJames/media/photo_zps702e1e12.jpg.html)

http://i1024.photobucket.com/albums/y305/TaylenJames/DSC00731_zpse2f0fd5a.jpg (http://s1024.photobucket.com/user/TaylenJames/media/DSC00731_zpse2f0fd5a.jpg.html)

http://i1024.photobucket.com/albums/y305/TaylenJames/DSC00711_zpsc7a6134e.jpg (http://s1024.photobucket.com/user/TaylenJames/media/DSC00711_zpsc7a6134e.jpg.html)

http://i1024.photobucket.com/albums/y305/TaylenJames/DSC00723_zps184ee16a.jpg (http://s1024.photobucket.com/user/TaylenJames/media/DSC00723_zps184ee16a.jpg.html)

http://i1024.photobucket.com/albums/y305/TaylenJames/DSC00735_zps36d10aaa.jpg (http://s1024.photobucket.com/user/TaylenJames/media/DSC00735_zps36d10aaa.jpg.html)

[BCBRAD]

All good conversation. The 200gr NAB is my everything load and g bear is not intentionally on the list, but shit can happens sometimes. Strictly for g bear a 9.3/286gr bullet is more than adequate, an NP in this weight is reported to loose ~20% of its weight, this leaves ~ 230gr left over to penetrate, or could use 300 gr solid if legal @ 2500fps mv.

[Gateholio]

7mm 150 gr TTSX failures. I like the bullet performance in the 7mm 150 gr Scirocco pic above better. :)

http://img109.imageshack.us/img109/7026/img1019ye.jpg


Funny. You say they don't expand yet all of these show expansion. You call these failures, but don't tell us how they failed.

I recovered a 130gr Ttsx that looks much like the 2 on the left. The damage that it did to the bear was incredible. Obviously, the bullet entered, expanded, penetrated through the vitals and at one point tumbled and lost its
petals. Doesn't mean that it failed.

[gerrygoat]

The front end of the bullet disintegrates on shoulder and the 'core' zips through just like a solid leaving a very small exit hole. Retains very little weight. Animals don't seem to be 'rocked' by them at all. Lots of blood shot meat and animals that go way too far. Of course, anything that has the air let out of it will die.

Can only speak from personal experience - used to have a bullet but haven't seen it for a decade. Remember a new guide showing up at Nahanni who shot those as well - they told him in no uncertain circumstances he wasn't leaving camp with his gun and those bullets. Pretty animated event.

If they work for you that's great. Last choice for me.

Like I said earlier both will work, the outfitter you mentioned doesn't know what he is talking about. The Barnes acts in the exact same way as you mention as well it blows off the front end just as you describe. I don't understand why in general can't be objective about bullet performance and look at the strengths and weaknesses of a particular design. You are free to use what you like.

[paw325]

Re: Partitions

I've read a couple responses to my query about hunters disliking Partitions for hunting dangerous game. I will reiterate that I have killed or have seen killed upwards of 60 animals (including very large grizzly and cape buffalo) with partitions in many different calibers.

I believe the responses I received were from hunters who may have never shot a grizz or any animal with a partition. They merely reiterated some "facts" they were told or read online or in a magazine. If I misinterpreted this I apologise.

Now, if anyone has an example of a partition failing to kill an animal, any animal (don't care how big, grizz, cape buffalo, whatever) after being well placed, id like to hear the story and see the recovered failure.

[gerrygoat]

I wouldn't consider the pictures FD posted on the Barnes failures either that is how they typically work. I like using Barnes on things like deer when using fast rounds since in general they are less damaging than a lead core bullet. For the record the Accubond is my go to bullet I just find it laughable that anyone thinks a Partition is a bad bullet they are probably the most reliable bullet out there which is why they continue to be used 60 years after being invented.

[GoatGuy]

Now, if anyone has an example of a partition failing to kill an animal, any animal (don't care how big, grizz, cape buffalo, whatever) after being well placed, id like to hear the story and see the recovered failure.

Hahaha, there's the trick - recovering a bullet from an animal that wasn't killed. :mrgreen:

[Mikey Rafiki]

I'll be loading 200g Accubonds and 200g TSX. Don't have a griz hunt planned, but I will feel a lot safer hunting elk in griz country.

Would love for Barnes to make an 8mm TTSX.

[pescado]

I don't think Phil Shoemaker would choose the 200 NP and his 30\06 to back up his clients in Alaska if they wouldn't work. He thought it to be a good choice and it worked for him. I don't think they were going to keep him in camp doing dishes because his choice of bullets was a partition. Lots of good choices out there. Go kill your bear and have a fun hunt.

[todbartell]

Chuck Hawks recommends a SD(sectional density) over 0.300 for dangerous game such as a grizz for best penetration.
I still have a box of Win. Mag. 220 gr. Silvertip for my 300 WM that was used for hunting moose.
Its SD=0.331 In comparison to a SD of 0.271 for a 180 gr.
TBBC would be my choice of bullet construction.(been using the TBBC HE 300gr for my 375 for over 10 years)



Bullet construction is more important that SD. A 208gr Amax has great SD and packs a real wallop downrange, but when it hits, it doesn;t have the construction to perform on big game

I'd take a 150gr Barnes TTSX over a 220gr round nose for penetration.

[BlacktailStalker]

I think lots of people are so scared of grizzly bears that they stress out over bullet choice. Relax and use a good quality bullet of whatever make you like, and with the rifle you shoot best.



For sure. Man, forget grizzlies, last spring I rounded the corner with dogs on the ground and bumped into a doe with two brand new fawns. Holy sh!T was that bish mad, I'd have rather faced a grizz than her, she was relentless and twice as furious. Dogs didn't know what to do they thought they were in shit for 'running' deer, nope they were in shit cuz they wouldn't run away fast enough LOL I thought they were going to get opened up for sure, twice I ran behind the side of the truck with her in hot pursuit.
For sure needed an H&H with 350's for her and a cavalry of troops, forget being scared of grizzlys bears !

[Gateholio]

Bullet construction is more important that SD. A 208gr Amax has great SD and packs a real wallop downrange, but when it hits, it doesn;t have the construction to perform on big game

I'd take a 150gr Barnes TTSX over a 220gr round nose for penetration.

As I've posted before, in informal tests I've done, I found that a 130gr ttsx will equal or better a 180 gr partition, when shot from a 300. And a 140gr TSX from a 7-08 will equal or better a 200gr cup and core from a 30-06.

[BCBRAD]

http://youtu.be/sygwGif8_io


One two punch, if legal.

[Timbow]

Be nice to know some history on these bullets recovered....




7mm 150 gr TTSX failures. I like the bullet performance in the 7mm 150 gr Scirocco pic above better. :)

http://img109.imageshack.us/img109/7026/img1019ye.jpg

[BigSlapper]

Below are pictures of the 30.06 165 gr TSX recovered out of my 2012 Mulie.
With performance like this I would not have a problem using it for Grizzly - mind you a 180 gr would probably be a step in the right direction using the 30.06 anyway.

http://i1077.photobucket.com/albums/w475/Tunkwa/165GRTSX_01_zpsd21f8bea.jpg (http://s1077.photobucket.com/user/Tunkwa/media/165GRTSX_01_zpsd21f8bea.jpg.html)
http://i1077.photobucket.com/albums/w475/Tunkwa/165GRTSX_02_zps0ef23f31.jpg (http://s1077.photobucket.com/user/Tunkwa/media/165GRTSX_02_zps0ef23f31.jpg.html)
http://i1077.photobucket.com/albums/w475/Tunkwa/165GRTSX_03_zps83c9befe.jpg (http://s1077.photobucket.com/user/Tunkwa/media/165GRTSX_03_zps83c9befe.jpg.html)

[gerrygoat]

Bullet construction is more important that SD. A 208gr Amax has great SD and packs a real wallop downrange, but when it hits, it doesn;t have the construction to perform on big game

I'd take a 150gr Barnes TTSX over a 220gr round nose for penetration.

I agree for the most part, most cup and core 220's won't make it too far and some like the Hornady 220 RN can be downright awful. A friend of mine had one of those come apart on a grizzlies shoulder and an hour later it just about got him and would have if another forum member here wouldn't have stopped it with a 200 gr E Tip from his 338 WM. I shot my first moose with the 220 gr Silvertip in a 30-06 when I was 20 and noticed my second shot came apart on the spine of the animal, the first shot punched nicely through the lungs but no heavy bone was hit. The next moose a couple of years later used the old style 180 gr Speer Grand Slam and they worked to perfection. I will also say the 220 gr Partition is a beast on game.....

Others have mentioned shooting bears in the shoulder being a good thing, the man I guided for a few years back told me he didn't recommend that shot at all it turns out he had seen many failures of bullets not getting through or even missing the lungs altogether. Harry recommended just simply drilling one through the lungs, he was in on the demise of a lot of grizzlies so I will defer to his wisdom.

[BCBRAD]

https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRBECVKoro9hYJ8j6YaHc2CqS7J4zeLR QzFbX0kPPPk7Mgx1sKA As you can see by the pictures the slower the velocity the less they open up , this relationship between velocity and frontal insures consistent penetration area over a wide range of velocities. The 'mushroomed' bullet forms a large meplat at near ranges, this essentially enables the bullet to provide a larger shock wave in the animal when energy is highest, as ranges get longer the lower velocity will not allow such a large frontal area and the bullet can penetrate better.

[chilko]

A quick note in response to the Barnes vs Nos Part theme of this thread. The Nos Part uses different jacket thickness' as caliber increases to make a tougher bullet in calibers where it would seem more appropriate.In typical deer hunting calibers it is deliberately made more fragile. Certainly in 338 cal and up I wouldn't hesitate to use it but i have no idea how thick the jacket is on the 30 cal product.

[gerrygoat]

A quick note in response to the Barnes vs Nos Part theme of this thread. The Nos Part uses different jacket thickness' as caliber increases to make a tougher bullet in calibers where it would seem more appropriate.In typical deer hunting calibers it is deliberately made more fragile. Certainly in 338 cal and up I wouldn't hesitate to use it but i have no idea how thick the jacket is on the 30 cal product.


That is a good point, the Accubond works the same way, the 35 cal Accubond is tougher than the 338's and smaller looking at the recovered bullet thread at the Nosler site.

Here are a couple I did there and a recovered bullet from a moose.

http://www.noslerreloading.com/viewtopic.php?f=55&t=16209

http://www.noslerreloading.com/viewtopic.php?f=55&t=17143

http://www.noslerreloading.com/viewtopic.php?f=47&t=16651

You will see the 264 140 gr Accubond penetrated well but is built lighter than the 358's.

Contrary to SRupp's shot at Nosler earlier in the thread they actually are very fair in allowing competitors bullets to be shown in a good light and if someone doesn't like the way a Nosler product works people are free to mention it.

The complete bullet testing section, definitely worth a look.

http://www.noslerreloading.com/viewforum.php?f=41

[huntingfamily]

Gerrygoat,
Other than the Sierra bullet, the rest all worked great!
Personally I like the accubond for bears as that's what dropped a large boar grizz in impressive fashion for me.
One and done...

[gerrygoat]

The 260 gr Accubond in 375 Ruger dropped the one in my avatar, my shooting sucked but that is another story..... no fault of the bullet though. What cartridge were you using? I don't have the 375 anymore but really like the 225 gr Accubond in my 35 Whelen for big animals.

[huntingfamily]

Sako in 300wsm, 180 gr accubond bullet. Lasered at 200 yards.
http://www.huntingbc.ca/photos/data/500/IMG_8753_1_.jpg

[Fisher-Dude]

Not sure if I want to take a risk of 4 outta 9 Barnes failures when grizz hunting (or rabid doe hunting). They do look cool IF they expand.


http://img.totaloutdoornetwork.com/UserFiles/2/26/2682/tn_DSCN1420.JPG

[gerrygoat]

Beautiful bear, love the color on it. I shot a goat and a deer with the same bullet in a 30-06, worked fine on both.

[Johnny G1]

Not sure if I want to take a risk of 4 outta 9 Barnes failures when grizz hunting (or rabid doe hunting). They do look cool IF they expand.


http://img.totaloutdoornetwork.com/UserFiles/2/26/2682/tn_DSCN1420.JPG What the hell did you dig the top 4 out of??????

[gerrygoat]

I think that can happen to any mono bullet when they don't hit the animal square, the TTSX and E Tip are supposed to be better in that regard with the big hollow point under the plastic tip.

[Timberjack]

Hmmm. No comments on the trophy bonded tipped? How do they compare to the TBBC? Looking forward to my 1st grizz hunt this spring.

Cheers TJ

[gerrygoat]

Hmmm. No comments on the trophy bonded tipped? How do they compare to the TBBC? Looking forward to my 1st grizz hunt this spring.

Cheers TJ

Same basic design as the regular TBBC but with a boat tail and polymer tip, they have a great reputation so you will be in fine shape. They look to be an improvement over the original bullet.

[Gateholio]

So, I found the story behind the 3 bullets FIsher DUde posted a pic of:

I'd like to get input from those of you who may have used Barnes TTSX bullets on large game. The bullets in the picture are 7mm 150 TTSX in front of 60 grains of IMR4831 in Remington 700 7 Rem Mag Rifles. The first bullet (left) weighed 104 grains and was recovered from a Kudu shot through the left shoulder and was found just under the skin on the right shoulder. The second (103 grains) was from a wildebeest and third (139 grains) from a warthog shot lengthwise. Another eight animals were taken with the same load but those shots were through and through and the bullets were not recovered. One was a wildebeest that was found 100 yards from the shot and there was no blood trail; a pair of Jack Russell terriers could find no blood trail. The shot was too far back and too high but hit a lung resulting in the bull piling up within 100 yards of the shot. Can't argue with the one shot kills but our PHs were very disappointed with the recovered bullets. I contacted Barnes and their response basically was "stuff" happens. These recovered bullets certainly don't look like the ones in the Barnes advertisements. Your thoughts?


So 3 one shot kills with bullets that "failed"

Tell me again how it is a failure when you kill an animal with one shot?

Recovered bullets dont' always look pretty, but it's hard to argue that they failed when they all killed with one shot.

[Gateholio]

Not sure if I want to take a risk of 4 outta 9 Barnes failures when grizz hunting (or rabid doe hunting). They do look cool IF they expand.


http://img.totaloutdoornetwork.com/UserFiles/2/26/2682/tn_DSCN1420.JPG

And what is the story of these bullets?

[Barracuda]

they look like tumbled bullets.

[Gateholio]

Definitely tumbled, but in what circumstances ?

[Barracuda]

probably dug out of butts .

[pescado]

Those bullets look similar to leadpills lrx pics he had. They killed but sure can't say they preformed as they were suppose too. I can see him having 1 but 3 out of 9 is high. Wonder what happens to make that happen?

[Barracuda]

Yup dug outta the butts

this is what I found



on 11/03/2012 10:36 PM | Quote




Joined: 02/18/2002
Location: ND

http://s1.totaloutdoornetwork.com/images/icons/icon_msg_nonew.gif (http://www.fishingbuddy.com/user_papabaer?app_task=PrivateMessage)http://s1.totaloutdoornetwork.com/images/icons/phpads_icon_members.gif (http://www.fishingbuddy.com/user_papabaer?app_task=AddToBuddies)

After all the hype I have seen on the Barnes TSX bullet performance I decided to give them a try. Loaded up the TSX 85 grain for my 243. Sighted in the rifle with a clay bank behind the target. Was able to retrieve 9 of the bullits and was very shocked to find that 4 out of the 9 failed to expand. Has anyone else had or seen this issue. After seeing this I have to question the performance on a deer. This has me worried they may act the same as shooting a full metal jacket - punch a small hole in and small hole out without expending enough energy to clean put the deer down.
http://img.totaloutdoornetwork.com/UserFiles/2/26/2682/tn_DSCN1420.JPG

[Fisher-Dude]

http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f268/dubbleA/Barnes168TSX.jpg

The narrative:

"I always had my doubts about the X bullets expanding on game myself. It wasnt until I recovered this one that my thoughts were confrimed. This .308 168gr.TSX was fired from a 300 WSM at 3000fps MV at appx 107yds on a big bodied Canadian whitetail shot head on, slightly quartering through the chest, I recovered the bullet in the right rear hindquarter. Yes, the deer traveled 30 yards and piled up but this bullet could actually be loaded again, no exspansion at all. Yes, it did open my eyes and I''ll never have trust in them again. That's my opinion only, your milage will vary."

[Fisher-Dude]

http://www.monstermuleys.info/photos/user_photos/3349cimg8274.jpg

The narrative:

"I thought i would share this I have always shot Berger VLDs but a buddy of mine talked me into trying some Barnes TSX. So i worked up a load for my gun using them and was fairly impressed with how they preformed at the range. So i figured i would take them out after elk this year. I got set up on a bull at about 340 yards across the canyon. My first shot and the bull just sort of flinched a little and continued to feed as if nothing had happened. Second shot dumped him in his tracks. As i crossed the canyon i thought what the hell 340 yards off a bipod and you missed?? I must be getting to old for this. However upon caping out the bull I indeed found two entrance holes about two inches from one another. Once i rolled him over to get at the other side i found both of the bullets lodged in the hide not quite passing clean through him. As you can see on my first shot the bullet failed. Needless to say I think ill keep the Barnes for the range!"

[Fisher-Dude]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v312/brad300wsm/P1000371.jpg

Narrative:

"That bullet reminds me of what I pulled out of my elk this year"


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v312/brad300wsm/P1030171.jpg

Narrative:

"What Chuck Nelson pulled out of a Mule Deer this year"

"As JJ's excellent post indicates, when TSX's work they work VERY well. When they don't, they REALLY don't, and frankly I've never seen more "problems" with a single bullet make in my years of hunting/handloading than the Barnes X/XLC/TSX/TTSX."

[Barracuda]

could you imagine how many failures one can find on partitions bergers accubond etc insert old fashioned bullet here :lol:

[Fisher-Dude]

This one is especially pertinent to the discussion:


http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h108/montero_2006/alvaro_1.jpg


Narrative:

"These 180gr TSXs are the ones I mentioned before that were recovered from a mountain grizzly."


YIKES!

[Gateholio]

Shot into clay and they tumbled. Big deal.

The other ones are TSX which many hunters have used with great success, but like all bullets, sometimes weird shit happens and the nose gets plugged or pinched. The TtSx bullets have a tip to help initiate expansion which is why we don't see any unexpanded ttsx bullets.

I've seen examples and read descriptions of bullet failure of just about every kind. The Scirrocco was replaced with the Scirrocco 2, some guys here hate partitions and I've seen Accbonds that look like shot too. It's funny how the same bullet can perform so differently for different people. I drove a 260gr NAB lengthwise through a big bear. Picture perfect bullet was recovered from the bear that dropped instantly. Same bullet barely killed a small moose, recovered bullets looked bad. What happened?

I do note that often with these "failed" Barnes bullets the animal dies pretty quick. Hmmm

[Gateholio]

This one is especially pertinent to the discussion:


http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h108/montero_2006/alvaro_1.jpg


Narrative:

"These 180gr TSXs are the ones I mentioned before that were recovered from a mountain grizzly."


YIKES!

I'm guessing the bear died ? For every "failed" Barnes bullet there is a thousand that performed great.

[Fred1]

Well isn't that sumthin?! Never seen a Barnes not expand. Always thought they were fool proof... As mentioned I wonder how many "poor bullet performances" happen with the old school bullets? I suppose dead is dead, but who really wants to have to track a pissed off semi-wounded grizzly?... that blooowwwsss.... that bloooooowwwwwwsssssss..........

[Fisher-Dude]

I'm guessing the bear died ? For every "failed" Barnes bullet there is a thousand that performed great.

Likely, the guide blasted it with his old Parker Hale 30-06 and 180 gr Corelokts to finish it off. ;)

[Mulehahn]

Bullets perform in weird ways. After personally witnessing photos of accubond perform like a varment bullet, exploding on the shoulder with 0 penetration leaving a deer bawling and flailing on the ground, I won't use them. But many people swear by them. I have never had a problem with partitions, but others have. I like the tsx in my ruger compact because of the lighter weight and they have always worked but don't shoot in my 25-06 at all. There is no perfect bullet, but I would not hesitate to shoot a grizzly with any premium bullet of appropriate weight that shoots well out of my rifle.

[BiG Boar]

What do you guys think about the Berger bullets at longer ranges on grizzlies? Talking like 150 grain and up.

[gerrygoat]

What do you guys think about the Berger bullets at longer ranges on grizzlies? Talking like 150 grain and up.

Regardless of weight they are still designed to come apart in an animal it would work for a lung shot but I wouldn't want to head into the thick stuff after a bear I just whacked with them. Heck I would use a Barnes before them lol :)

[hunter1993ap]

What do you guys think about the Berger bullets at longer ranges on grizzlies? Talking like 150 grain and up.

I wouldn't use it simply because I wouldn't want to shoot a grizzly at more that a few hundred yards. but I believe the bullet would work well. once you get it slowed down enough it would work similar to a harder grade bullet up close.

[BiG Boar]

Here is a good sample of TSX bullets. These were the ones recovered from animals. (Most animals were harmed in this test) The one at the end is from a 375 H&H. I was told by the old timer guide who reloaded (literally) them that if you take out half the powder and put the bullet back in, the bullet goes "slow" and punches through bush. Well, I took him at his word and shot at the Eland through the african bush (70 yards). On the second (running) shot he was quartering hard and I gave him a second shot (in the open). This is the bullet that killed him (as there was no broad side shot). The first bullet (also going slow) did not make it through the bush to the animal. The fact is, that bullets that look like this, are not going fast enough to open. Still killed it dead though, even though it didn't open.

Barnes are a good bullet. I believed the hype for years. However I am now convinced that anything will pretty much work with correct shot placement. In Africa I just used core lokt's (other than the eland), and I have even killed moose with berger bullets! The goat I took this year died with a core lokt bullet also. Fact is, if you get 150 grains of metal injected quickly through your lungs/heart/shoulder you're in major trouble.

http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/nn5/bigbore14/C73C1FE8-3CBB-4451-9C96-575FD1A3259A_zpsdpmkdgfb.jpg (http://s300.photobucket.com/user/bigbore14/media/C73C1FE8-3CBB-4451-9C96-575FD1A3259A_zpsdpmkdgfb.jpg.html)

[BCBRAD]

I'm figuring some of these failed X bullets are due to not being stabilized due to the wrong rate of twist, bullet yaw when it hit the animal. 150 gr X bullet in a270 comes to mind.

[Weatherby Fan]

I'm figuring some of these failed X bullets are due to not being stabilized due to the wrong rate of twist, bullet yaw when it hit the animal. 150 gr X bullet in a270 comes to mind.

I would say lack of velocity in most cases would be the culprit in TSX bullets that don't mushroom properly.

[gerrygoat]

The mono bullets definitely need more speed to open than a typical lead core bullet. Lighter bullets and speed is a good thing with them

[.330 Dakota]

I doubt very much if you have ever found a TTSX bullet that has not expanded.

The TTSX always expands and in my experience, exits,,which after breaking a shoulder or 2 is fine by me,,the TSX on the other hand doesnt expand unless it hits something very substantial,,ie heavy bone,,and you wouldnt find it because it exits the same size it enters. I have used both bullets with that exact experience. I will never buy another box of TSX's however I am a huge believer in the tipped ones. That is exactly why Barnes brought out the tipped bullet. The better BC and lack of deforming in the loading and unloading process was a big bonus. I am using Accubonds in my bear gun however it is a 375 and they are 300 grainers, so not too worried there

[.330 Dakota]

I would say lack of velocity in most cases would be the culprit in TSX bullets that don't mushroom properly.

I whacked a deer a few years ago at about 60 yards with an 06 and a 165gr TSX,,absolutely no expansion, zipped right through the lungs with a pencil sized wound,,deer went about a 1/4 mile,,that sucked,,switched to the tipped TTSX,,much better

[Gateholio]

Agreed, every bullet works with correct shot placement. All bullets work when things go right. Not every bullet works when things go wrong, which is why I like the Barnes. They offer you any angle you want kill capability. Not so with every other bullet.

[gerrygoat]

Agreed, every bullet works with correct shot placement. All bullets work when things go right. Not every bullet works when things go wrong, which is why I like the Barnes. They offer you any angle you want kill capability. Not so with every other bullet.

The Barnes will do that and a lot of other designs too, Nosler, Swift, Hornady, Woodleigh and others make bullets that will work well. When it comes to bullets we live in a golden age right now.

[gerrygoat]

I whacked a deer a few years ago at about 60 yards with an 06 and a 165gr TSX,,absolutely no expansion, zipped right through the lungs with a pencil sized wound,,deer went about a 1/4 mile,,that sucked,,switched to the tipped TTSX,,much better

I agree with you and won't use a TSX or X again, the TTSX isn't perfect but is a good bullet and an improvement over the previous Barnes bullets. I had a 250 gr X from a 375 Ruger do the exact same thing penetrate with little expansion on a black bear, a second 260 gr Accubond did the trick. As long as the mono bullets are going fast enough to expand at longer range they work fine. That is one reason I like the better lead core bullets they expand better at long range while still penetrating the vitals up close, more reliable all around.

[Fisher-Dude]

Agreed, every bullet works with correct shot placement. All bullets work when things go right. Not every bullet works when things go wrong, which is why I like the Barnes. They offer you any angle you want kill capability. Not so with every other bullet.


Does that make you think you can shopot a moose in the ass because you're shooting a Barnes bullet? I hope not.

[Gateholio]

The Barnes will do that and a lot of other designs too, Nosler, Swift, Hornady, Woodleigh and others make bullets that will work well. When it comes to bullets we live in a golden age right now.

yup , we sure do. Lots of great bullets these days.

[.330 Dakota]

Another EXELLENT bullet that is often over looked is the Sierra Game King,,I have a friend that uses them exclusively and has never had a failure

[Walksalot]

I shot these into a stack of phone books(dry) at 90 yds. Penetration was about the same. I have used Sierra Gameking bullets for most of my hunting. My biggest concern is a pinhole from the Barnes TSX at close range if shooting for behind the front shoulder. The rifle is a Tikka T3 Lite in a 7mm/08.

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e317/walkslots/IMG_0900_zps29b82ac3.jpg (http://s42.photobucket.com/user/walkslots/media/IMG_0900_zps29b82ac3.jpg.html)

[pescado]

I'm figuring some of these failed X bullets are due to not being stabilized due to the wrong rate of twist, bullet yaw when it hit the animal. 150 gr X bullet in a270 comes to mind.

Agree Brad in that it looks like they didn't stabilize. You would think this would show up at the range when your doing your load development. I have had buletts that wouldn't stabilize and it is evident on the paper and in the group size. These bullets were also the larger vld's being shot through a barrel with to slow of a twist. The tsx bullet sure isn't a bullet with a large b.c so I wonder what causes them to tumble? With what I am reading here it seems to happen more than I like.

[Gateholio]

Does that make you think you can shopot a moose in the ass because you're shooting a Barnes bullet? I hope not.

Leave it to FD to always jump on an opportunity to go to the most extreme example possible. :)

May answer is this- I wouldn't use a THS for the first shot at a moose or any big animal , but if a follow up shot was needed, and all I had to shoot at was the butthole, I'll be happy I had a Barnes bullet in the chamber. Considering the huge volume of successful end to end shots made with Barnes on big animals including Cape buffalo, I'd be confident of the bullet dropping the moose.

[BCBRAD]

Agree Brad in that it looks like they didn't stabilize. You would think this would show up at the range when your doing your load development. I have had buletts that wouldn't stabilize and it is evident on the paper and in the group size. These bullets were also the larger vld's being shot through a barrel with to slow of a twist. The tsx bullet sure isn't a bullet with a large b.c so I wonder what causes them to tumble? With what I am reading here it seems to happen more than I like.

Yes it should , but some people just look for holes through their spotter and don't rally examine the holes for 'keyholeing' others figure if you can hit bucket at 100m ,good enough.

[BromBones]

I used to be picky about bullet choice, and figured grizzly bears were crazy monsters that could absorb lead all day and still come and eat you. Now they can take some punishment but they live on blood and air like anything else. Vent one or both of those and he's dead.

Pick any premium bullet and if it's accurate in your rifle, take it hunting. The first shot is what matters.

My opinion? Swift A-Frames are the best bone smashing, heavy duty bullets out there. And the TTSX is right there as well, better all around bullet and probably the best hunting bullet on the market right now.

[goinghunting]

I was shooting 130 tsx's out of my 270 wsm but did have issues on a couple saskatchewan whitetails and found one that didnt expand. So I switched to the ttsx because the gun really shot these barnes and haven't had issues since. But has anyone had any experience with the hornady gmx? Looks like it will still hit really hard but might expand slightly easier?

[325]

I have been using the TSX for the last few years, but am switching to the TTSX this year for the improved BC and expansion. Over-all, I really like the monolithic bullets, and they would be my bullet of choice for dangerous game.

As an aside, all bullets can "fail". I took a 60 meter frontal shot on a spike whitetail with my 325WSM shooting 200 grain Accubonds. I hit the right shoulder blade, and the bullet exploded, with fragments of bone and bullet everywhere. The buck died after a 100 meter sprint, so the bullet didn't fail, but I was a bit shocked at how it came apart. A TSX or TTSX won't do that.

[BiG Boar]

I shot these into a stack of phone books(dry) at 90 yds. Penetration was about the same. I have used Sierra Gameking bullets for most of my hunting. My biggest concern is a pinhole from the Barnes TSX at close range if shooting for behind the front shoulder. The rifle is a Tikka T3 Lite in a 7mm/08.

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e317/walkslots/IMG_0900_zps29b82ac3.jpg (http://s42.photobucket.com/user/walkslots/media/IMG_0900_zps29b82ac3.jpg.html)

A pin hole shouldn't be your concern. My concern would be the 7-08 pea shooter (children's rifle) that I was holding! Get ready to throw the rifle at him if he charges! You want a sure way of knowing you're under gunned? Have a 800 pound grizzly running at you.

Not saying a 22 won't kill a grizzly, but I definitely don't think most outfitters recommend 7-08 and up. :)

[Fisher-Dude]

Leave it to FD to always jump on an opportunity to go to the most extreme example possible. :)

May answer is this- I wouldn't use a THS for the first shot at a moose or any big animal , but if a follow up shot was needed, and all I had to shoot at was the butthole, I'll be happy I had a Barnes bullet in the chamber. Considering the huge volume of successful end to end shots made with Barnes on big animals including Cape buffalo, I'd be confident of the bullet dropping the moose.


If you used better expanding bullets for the first shot, you wouldn't need to drive another pin-hole into the ass end when the animal runs away. :D

[Walksalot]

A pin hole shouldn't be your concern. My concern would be the 7-08 pea shooter (children's rifle) that I was holding! Get ready to throw the rifle at him if he charges! You want a sure way of knowing you're under gunned? Have a 800 pound grizzly running at you.

Not saying a 22 won't kill a grizzly, but I definitely don't think most outfitters recommend 7-08 and up. :)

If I were going after grizzly I would take my big rifle(30-06). The 7mm/08 is what I am going to use for deer, elk and moose. I wasn't thinking so much of pin holing a bear I was thinking more of deer at close range. I got carried away from the theme of this thread, my bad.
The reason I went to the 7mm/08 is that I am getting recoil sensitive in my old age and my big rifle starts to weigh at the end of the day. Having said that, I would have no problem standing my ground with a charging bear with a 7mm/08. I think shot placement and the ability to maintain a cool head is at the top of the list. I have seen guys with big magnums vibrate in a shooting bench upon a misfire from their big magnum and break wind with eyes wide at the mention of a charging bear.

[BCBRAD]

A solid* followed by a controlled expansion soft point will end hostilities, but then you'd have to have a meaningful caliber for that.

* Appears to be technically illegal for game use in BC

[BiG Boar]

If I were going after grizzly I would take my big rifle(30-06). The 7mm/08 is what I am going to use for deer, elk and moose. I wasn't thinking so much of pin holing a bear I was thinking more of deer at close range. I got carried away from the theme of this thread, my bad.
The reason I went to the 7mm/08 is that I am getting recoil sensitive in my old age and my big rifle starts to weigh at the end of the day. Having said that, I would have no problem standing my ground with a charging bear with a 7mm/08. I think shot placement and the ability to maintain a cool head is at the top of the list. I have seen guys with big magnums vibrate in a shooting bench upon a misfire from their big magnum and break wind with eyes wide at the mention of a charging bear.


Oh good, I didn't realize you had a big rifle like that. I thought you were talking about a 7-08 and going for grizzly.

[paw325]

Wondering what kind of bullet people would recommend for grizzly

I'm shooting a 300 win mag and need a bullet with a good bc but still have the power to kill a grizz at longer ranges

Im curious as to what bullet you decided on Sako?

[Gateholio]

If you used better expanding bullets for the first shot, you wouldn't need to drive another pin-hole into the ass end when the animal runs away. :D

Nothing like that has ever happened to me when using Barnes bullets. On the other hand, I had 150gr ballistic tips blow up on deer shoulders and require follow up shots.

I have used 270gr TSX that are suitable for Cape buffalo on light animals like deer and black bear and they all expanded with great effect. The exit wounds were not large, but the insides were torn to shreds. I do wonder about some reports of "penciling through " because it seems some hunters don't realize the lungs are shredded when they see the smallish exit wound that is often typical with Barnes bullets that don't hit bone. Vital organs shredded, but smallish hole in hide still= very dead animal

[chilko]

[QUOTE=Gatehouse;1469346]Nothing like that has ever happened to me when using Barnes bullets. On the other hand, I had 150gr ballistic tips blow up on deer shoulders and require follow up shots.

Not being critical, strictly as a matter of curiousity, what caliber were those ballistic tips and do you have a guess at the impact velocity?

[emerson]

[QUOTE=Gatehouse;1469346]Nothing like that has ever happened to me when using Barnes bullets. On the other hand, I had 150gr ballistic tips blow up on deer shoulders and require follow up shots.

Not being critical, strictly as a matter of curiousity, what caliber were those ballistic tips and do you have a guess at the impact velocity?

I've had 150gr SSTs out a 30-06 at 40yds explode on a smallish black bear shoulder. Shards penetrated to the lungs, but I couldn't find any significant pieces. MV3000fps approx.

[chilko]

Bought some ballistic tips about a decade ago. If I ever get around to loading them I'll probably either shoot paper or keep the velocity way down.

[Gateholio]

7mm Remington magnum at about 100 yards. Since then, Nosler beefed up the jackets on the BTs tgat would be used for big game. Just like lots of bullets evolve- barnes, swift, nosler etc.

[REMINGTON JIM]

Another EXELLENT bullet that is often over looked is the Sierra Game King,,I have a friend that uses them exclusively and has never had a failure

No Failure :shock: thats because hes NEVER shot anything with them ! Gopher Bullets at BEST ! :-D LOL jmo RJ

[chilko]

Yeah just curious. in the boring off season I always seem to do load development with different components than normal but always go back to what I know works once hunting season starts.

[cole97]

Nosler accoubond 175grain

[chilcotin hillbilly]

Exactly the type of bullet performance I wouldn't want on a grizzly. A bullet that expands to that degree on a deer would be horrible for breaking grizzly shoulders. That bullet has lost considerable weight, looks like most of the inner core is gone.


Thats what I think, it would be the one of the last bullets I would choose.

[REMINGTON JIM]

I can't believe some of the stuff people believe, any of the better bullets will kill a bear. A Barnes will work and so will a Nosler Partition, anyone who says the Partition isn't a good bullet for killing animals doesn't know what they are talking about when it comes to bullet performance.

Completely Agree with you Buddy ! :wink: RJ

[Redneck Rocket]

Pick any premium bullet and if it's accurate in your rifle, take it hunting. The first shot is what matters.


I've been reading this thread with interest, not commenting because I really know very little about bullets and ballistics. This is an interesting point though, and one I considered when I was buying my first rifle. I was back & forth between the 270 and the 30-06, and settled on the 270. My reasoning was that since I'm a very new shooter and hunter, I wanted to place a premium on accuracy over hitting power. Not that I want to cripple anything, I want the cleanest kill possible. I just figured that the hitting power was irrelevant if I missed so I picked what someone told me was a faster and flatter trajectory bullet because for a new hunter it would be easier to cope with different ranges.

It strikes me that the same must be true in this discussion. Not just as regards caliber but I'm sure it must be important to have a gun that you are familiar with and comfortable with. Let's face it, you're not going to have much time to get shots off so you're right, the first one probably counts for the most!

[pescado]

X3..!!!!! Over 60 years strong. The benchmark bullet.:-D

[gerrygoat]

I've been reading this thread with interest, not commenting because I really know very little about bullets and ballistics. This is an interesting point though, and one I considered when I was buying my first rifle. I was back & forth between the 270 and the 30-06, and settled on the 270. My reasoning was that since I'm a very new shooter and hunter, I wanted to place a premium on accuracy over hitting power. Not that I want to cripple anything, I want the cleanest kill possible. I just figured that the hitting power was irrelevant if I missed so I picked what someone told me was a faster and flatter trajectory bullet because for a new hunter it would be easier to cope with different ranges.

It strikes me that the same must be true in this discussion. Not just as regards caliber but I'm sure it must be important to have a gun that you are familiar with and comfortable with. Let's face it, you're not going to have much time to get shots off so you're right, the first one probably counts for the most!

I am not one who likes arguing on the internet, but that is precisely the reason why some of us will take people to task sometimes, there are a lot of inexperienced hunters out there and we don't need any more myths on bullet performance, caliber choice etc. We all can have our favorite bullet but is it so hard to be objective about the strengths and weaknesses of a particular bullet? The thing about some Barnes users I have noticed is they love to take shots at the Partition bullet and claim they are no good which is laughable, I guess when you are the standard it comes with the territory. A good lead core bullet will expand more reliably at long range than any mono bullet, at the same time the mono bullet will penetrate a bit better at close range and damage less meat. Anyway I need to get back to work.

[REMINGTON JIM]

I still LIKE and USE Nosler Partition Bullets ever if gatehouse thinks there for Fudds ! :wink: LOL RJ

[GoatGuy]

I am not one who likes arguing on the internet, but that is precisely the reason why some of us will take people to task sometimes, there are a lot of inexperienced hunters out there and we don't need any more myths on bullet performance, caliber choice etc. We all can have our favorite bullet but is it so hard to be objective about the strengths and weaknesses of a particular bullet? The thing about some Barnes users I have noticed is they love to take shots at the Partition bullet and claim they are no good which is laughable, I guess when you are the standard it comes with the territory. A good lead core bullet will expand more reliably at long range than any mono bullet, at the same time the mono bullet will penetrate a bit better at close range and damage less meat. Anyway I need to get back to work.

Personally, not a pro barnes only, just an anti-partition. :-|

[Gateholio]

I've been reading this thread with interest, not commenting because I really know very little about bullets and ballistics. This is an interesting point though, and one I considered when I was buying my first rifle. I was back & forth between the 270 and the 30-06, and settled on the 270. My reasoning was that since I'm a very new shooter and hunter, I wanted to place a premium on accuracy over hitting power. Not that I want to cripple anything, I want the cleanest kill possible. I just figured that the hitting power was irrelevant if I missed so I picked what someone told me was a faster and flatter trajectory bullet because for a new hunter it would be easier to cope with different ranges.

It strikes me that the same must be true in this discussion. Not just as regards caliber but I'm sure it must be important to have a gun that you are familiar with and comfortable with. Let's face it, you're not going to have much time to get shots off so you're right, the first one probably counts for the most!

There have been comparisons between the 30-06 and 270 since 1925. Shot placement is always the # 1 consideration. After that it's bullet performance.

The 30-06 was made famous with mostly 150-200 gr cup and core bullets. Nowadays the cartridge itself is largely irrelevant when discussing the same class of cartridges ( like 7-08/308/30-06/270)

Just use a premium bullet and you get it all. A 7-08 with 140gr TSX bullets will outperform a 30-06 with 180gr cup and core bullets.