Quote Originally Posted by boxhitch View Post
Points that have come up in discussions-

- In the big picture, the hunters foot print is pretty small, there will always be escapement. Small areas get most of the pressure but in reality most of the ground goes untouched

-wildlife cannot be stock-piled. Holding capacity is what it is. Increase numbers may only lead to increase winter kill......may. Quality of habitat is just as important as quantity

-Antler restrictions are the safety valve, licensed hunters never kill all the breeding stock

- regulating for quality instead of opportunity will only discourage hunters, without hunters there is no value to wildlife, with out value there is no interest in management
Boxhitch,

What you are saying is basically bang on to what i have been trying to tell these other groups that want either closures or
further restrictions when i talk to them face to face.
The only other thing I have tried to tell them is that these fires will have some short term impact and maybe the missing deer
just moved elsewhere for now.
Example, the elk were brought up that roam the area, and now they are suddenly gone elsewhere.
I told them of course they are, there was a big fire so they moved for now.

The big impact to me has been the number of hunters everyone else is seeing.
And that for some, that is the reasoning that there are no longer mature bucks to be seen.
That too many hunters are now taking way too many young bucks.

I am not the one saying that.
I agree that there has been a huge increase in hunters in the area.
I think R5 caused that, but many others think it is FB/IG. (maybe its both)
And yes, i would agree, there does seem to be a shortage of the older bucks now being spotted for a few years now.
And for years, I always seen Doe with yearlings, plenty of them, so it was never a concern.
ITs only been the last year or 2 that the area seems a little light on them as well.
But then again, i also have argued to these same folks we no longer get the snow, so it is possible that many of the deer
just arent in the area as they would be if there was snow.

Trust me guys, i have tried hard to make some of these folks try to understand that their closure and restrictions wont be
the answer.
As for the huge influx of hunter #'s, all i can conclude is it all started when R5 closed.

So, in the end, are these other groups wanting closures or removal of part of the season to reduce hunters which they think
in turn will bring back deer.
In other words, again we are to blame for being hunters.
And, would it not make sense to open up R5 once again, as that fits in the time frame that many feel it got so busy?????