Some Big Whities For Ya...

[Maglic]

You guys are funny, high countrys own words, even with him around deer activity remains high. His own cameras are showing bucks from year after year according to him. SSS cameras are showing deer living for years.
Cats arent a problem there

Cats may not be a problem there but in this study they certainly are the problem number 1.
https://bcwf.bc.ca/southern-interior...roject-update/
------ The excerpt from the study about mortality ------------
As of October 2019, we have the following does and yearlings (fawns from spring of 2019) collared in our study areas:

Boundary: 22 does, 5 yearlings,
Cache Creek: 26 does, 3 yearlings,
West Okanagan: 27 does, 12 yearlings

Generally speaking, our deer in the Boundary have very low survival rates, whereas Cache Creek have high survival rates, and the West Okanagan is somewhere in between. Survival of adult does after the first year of the project was 69% in the Boundary, 95% in Cache Creek, and 83% in the West Okanagan. We will have a better idea of fawn survival by spring of 2020. The breakdown of mortality sources in our study areas are as follows:
Boundary Mortalities = 22
Cougar 15, Canid 1, Coyote 1, Drowning 1, Apparent Grizzly Bear 1, Unknown 1, Vehicle 2
Cache Creek Mortalities = 7
Black Bear 1, Cougar 2, Coyote 1, Unregulated harvest 2, Health 1
West Okanagan Mortalities = 15
Cougar 5, Apparent cougar 3, Coyote 1, Predation 1, Starvation 2, Unknown 1, Vehicle 2
---------------------------

As you can see 21% of collared does and yearlings were killed by Cougar in Boundary region\West Kelowna around 6-8%,
But in all cases Cougar is number 1 predator issue affecting does and fawns. NO fawns no bucks, simple as that.

So my question is where do you draw your conclusions from?

[Seeker]

Cats may not be a problem there but in this study they certainly are the problem number 1.
https://bcwf.bc.ca/southern-interior...roject-update/
------ The excerpt from the study about mortality ------------
As of October 2019, we have the following does and yearlings (fawns from spring of 2019) collared in our study areas:

Boundary: 22 does, 5 yearlings,
Cache Creek: 26 does, 3 yearlings,
West Okanagan: 27 does, 12 yearlings

Generally speaking, our deer in the Boundary have very low survival rates, whereas Cache Creek have high survival rates, and the West Okanagan is somewhere in between. Survival of adult does after the first year of the project was 69% in the Boundary, 95% in Cache Creek, and 83% in the West Okanagan. We will have a better idea of fawn survival by spring of 2020. The breakdown of mortality sources in our study areas are as follows:
Boundary Mortalities = 22
Cougar 15, Canid 1, Coyote 1, Drowning 1, Apparent Grizzly Bear 1, Unknown 1, Vehicle 2
Cache Creek Mortalities = 7
Black Bear 1, Cougar 2, Coyote 1, Unregulated harvest 2, Health 1
West Okanagan Mortalities = 15
Cougar 5, Apparent cougar 3, Coyote 1, Predation 1, Starvation 2, Unknown 1, Vehicle 2
---------------------------

As you can see 21% of collared does and yearlings were killed by Cougar in Boundary region\West Kelowna around 6-8%,
But in all cases Cougar is number 1 predator issue affecting does and fawns. NO fawns no bucks, simple as that.

So my question is where do you draw your conclusions from?

The reference you are using is related to mule deer. This is a whitetail thread. Different beast. Pretty common knowledge that Cougars prefer Mule deer and become specialists to a degree. The conclusions drawn from this group come from recording doe/fawn ratios yearly at all sites along with predator sightings. Its a long thread, but it is mentioned in the guts of it.

[Maglic]

The reference you are using is related to mule deer..

TRUE,
sorry for thread hijacking.
it was reply to LBM referring to this quote:"I hope you harvest him, they sure do take their toll on the deer populations...I've heard that a mature cat will take up to 50 deer a year...do you all consider that an accurate statement?"
Harry was not specifically referring to whitetail, but to all deer.

[LBM]

Cats may not be a problem there but in this study they certainly are the problem number 1.
https://bcwf.bc.ca/southern-interior...roject-update/
------ The excerpt from the study about mortality ------------
As of October 2019, we have the following does and yearlings (fawns from spring of 2019) collared in our study areas:

Boundary: 22 does, 5 yearlings,
Cache Creek: 26 does, 3 yearlings,
West Okanagan: 27 does, 12 yearlings

Generally speaking, our deer in the Boundary have very low survival rates, whereas Cache Creek have high survival rates, and the West Okanagan is somewhere in between. Survival of adult does after the first year of the project was 69% in the Boundary, 95% in Cache Creek, and 83% in the West Okanagan. We will have a better idea of fawn survival by spring of 2020. The breakdown of mortality sources in our study areas are as follows:
Boundary Mortalities = 22
Cougar 15, Canid 1, Coyote 1, Drowning 1, Apparent Grizzly Bear 1, Unknown 1, Vehicle 2
Cache Creek Mortalities = 7
Black Bear 1, Cougar 2, Coyote 1, Unregulated harvest 2, Health 1
West Okanagan Mortalities = 15
Cougar 5, Apparent cougar 3, Coyote 1, Predation 1, Starvation 2, Unknown 1, Vehicle 2
---------------------------

As you can see 21% of collared does and yearlings were killed by Cougar in Boundary region\West Kelowna around 6-8%,
But in all cases Cougar is number 1 predator issue affecting does and fawns. NO fawns no bucks, simple as that.

So my question is where do you draw your conclusions from?

As you see each area is different as is any region or state etc cant base things on one study. Doesnt take much to figure out that if a area consists of mainly mule deer that the odds are that is what will be the main diet.
Studys can be flawed in ways as well. Lots of times one is done because some thing is happening but by the time the study is done the damage is all ready done and the study doesnt really show what caused it only
what is happening now. I have also heard feed is a issue in these areas so seeing starvation and health issues is a red flag to me. From what you have posted other things have caused more mortality in 2
of the areas.

[HighCountryBC]

I have been thinking over the last few days about how my season has ended and how even after tagging out, I continue to venture to the whitetail woods. I came to the conclusion, that it is simply a desire to be a better hunter and in order to do so, I wanted to learn more. I have never been what I would consider a "whitetail" guy. They were an animal that after all other species had seasoned out, were the only species left to pursue. That ineveitably left me scrambling mid November trying to find an animal. Needless to say, I was only occasionally successful. Every year for the passed 3 years, I have read this thread and slowly I have began to discover areas that hold whiteatail, that are right under my nose. This year I have placed 5 cameras in locations that were found using information in this thread. All locations are now producing bucks during daylight hours on a regular basis. Some bucks are not gaggers, but certainly respectable mature bucks. Now I have limited time to get out as I have twin 9 year old boys and they consume most free time I have, so my standards pertaining to which buck I harvest is far from that of Ourea or High Country. At this point, I was willing to take any buck bigger than a 4 so I could put some "hotdogs" in the freezer for my boys; ie a meat buck. I sat for a total of 5 hours and killed a deer. I just wanted to give credit to the OP, and a bit of a thanks for being willing to share your trials and errors and insight to get others off the ground and into hunting whitetails. I honestly believe that I now have a great base for harvesting a buck each and every year moving forward. Cheers.

Great stuff, Seeker. I treated whitetail the same as you for a very long time. I was an elk and mule deer hunter through and through (still am) and thus, whitetails received very little focus from me. Things are definitely different now and it's been a blast figuring these guys out.

I've been slacking on updates recently but will get a few clips and pics loaded up here.

[HighCountryBC]

Like I said, been slacking on updates but never on hunting or gathering inventory!

The start of November was getting busier with lots of young bucks coming through, sorting out the pecking order etc. Some of the mature bucks and up and comers close to hitting their potential went for a "walk" as they so often do at this time of year. Over the last few seasons, I've found that it's usually 1 or 2 mature bucks that will dominate a particular site. Some of the sub-dominant bucks coming into their own will move on to find areas of their own. Seen this play out time and time again. This year it was the 5x5 with split brows that I've had for 5 years running dominating one of my spots. He's a complete bully and runs a lot of deer off the site. Not what I'm looking for in the antler department but at 8 years old and in his prime, he would be a great buck for someone to take out for a number of reasons. For the first time in a long time, I didn't have a buck to obsess over and his name was written down in pencil on the hit list. I wasn't going to take him early but several of my partners were more than willing to pop a primer on him.

[HighCountryBC]

[HighCountryBC]

[HighCountryBC]

[Dash]

Thank you for the update and post HighCountry! This is my favorite thread on HBC.

I love how you can hear how vocal that one buck is. Very interesting!

Going to give it one last kick at the can tomorrow and Saturday!