243 for sheep?

[Goliath]

Just saying a person's way better off shooting a gun they're comfortable with then something they're scared of. And, make the first shot count.

Good point. I don't think there's any debate about making the first shot count. If they feel more comfortable with a lighter or heavier caliber is up to every person to decide...nothing illegal or unethical there.

Please don't take this the wrong way, but IMO the whole issue of being "scared" of a calibre's recoil can be vastly solved with education and practice. Not saying that many folks on earth can shoot a 460Weatherby, but if my wife can shoot a 300WM without flinching, I think a lot of folks limit themselves because they're "scared" of getting kicked.

Similarily my wife use to be nervous about parking the big pickup at the Safeway parking lot. Didnt' even want to try. Never mind driving with a camper! With practice she's as good as anyone now.

[Fisher-Dude]

Watched one of my hunting buddies shoot a spiker whitetail thru the front shoulder and out the opposite rear ham some years back, with a 300WM, 180 gr NP. Same shot path as Heitsman is talking about but from the other end of the animal. That deer took off, uphill no less, and kept going. I sent my partner up high to push the deer down. We were lucky enough that it came down to where I was waiting for it, and stopped watching my partner while I slipped a bullet into its skull, the only shot I had available before it hit the thick shit and a steep gulley.

That deer had a 4" wide crater from one end to the other. The bullet didn't do the job because the shot was slightly left on a quartering towards deer. A 243 wouldn't have made any difference, nor would a 338. The deer was going to die at some point with internal damage and liver damage (a 243 would have done the same thing), but who knows if we would have recovered it if I hadn't been able to pop it in the mellon.

Shot placement is key with any gun. A 300 WM didn't make any difference in this case.

[wiggy]

absolutely. I haven't shot a bighorn but I'd bet $100 that a 85gr Barnes TSX or 90gr Nosler eTip would punch both shoulders and exit on one inside 400 yards

I've had a 55gr Nosler BT @ 3800 f/s exit broadside on a lung shot, on coyotes as well as a 250 lb 5x5 mule deer at 40 yards

243's kill with luck

Seen a ram killed with a 243 at around that distance. Was hit off the front shoulder and we found the bullet on the skin on the other side. It was a nosler partition. Sheep ran uphill after the shot and was heading over the top when it stumbled on shale slipped fell and broke its neck from falling down the entire slide. We werent 100 percent that the shot hit em but the shooter said he thought he seem him cringe. The ram ran up that mountain jack rabbit. If it was hit by a 300 at that distance it would have tumbled on the spot. Seen another guy open up on a ram in a blizzard downhill at 300 yrds. He was hitting 2 ft behind the rams ass and trying to lead him.

[David Heitsman]

Guys,

The shot went in in front of his left leg, missing his ass by 10"
passed diagonally through his body and lodged in the right shoulder. (Notice I didn't say 'front' shoulder since you folks that hang on my every word would have had a comment about too.)
Why he wasn't bleeding / frothing from the nose seemed odd as there would have had to at the least been a diaphram puncture. The shot I suppose may have traveled above the lungs themselves.

Perhaps hydraulic'd is the incorrect term but a .30 would have been a thru and thru and there would have been bone and tissue damage that would have resulted in it's inability to run the mile to the breaks.

Was it poorly placed? Yes evidently. However we did spend most of the next day finding it.

Anyway, I'm sure you fellas who deem yourselves to be the ethics police
for all BC hunters will have something deraogatory to add to my post.
Just know that rarely do I ever go back and look at your useless bla bla'ing anyways.

[Kody94]

Guys,

The shot went in in front of his left leg, missing his ass by 10"
passed diagonally through his body and lodged in the right shoulder. (Notice I didn't say 'front' shoulder since you folks that hang on my every word would have had a comment about too.)
Why he wasn't bleeding / frothing from the nose seemed odd as there would have had to at the least been a diaphram puncture. The shot I suppose may have traveled above the lungs themselves.

Perhaps hydraulic'd is the incorrect term but a .30 would have been a thru and thru and there would have been bone and tissue damage that would have resulted in it's inability to run the mile to the breaks.

Was it poorly placed? Yes evidently. However we did spend most of the next day finding it.

Anyway, I'm sure you fellas who deem yourselves to be the ethics police
for all BC hunters will have something deraogatory to add to my post.
Just know that rarely do I ever go back and look at your useless bla bla'ing anyways.

243's definitely aren't well suited for a raking shot like that. I am actually a little surprised that it penetrated that far. Your example is one where a 300WM would have obviously worked better.

Everyone needs to understand the limitations of what they choose to hunt with.

The 243 doesn't have a lot of horsepower and the lighter bullets don't lend themselves to bucking wind, or penetrating through thick bone or long distances. With the right bullet and the right circumstances they can be surprising though. Keep the distances reasonable, and place shots well, and don't take silly shot angles, etc, the 243 will do just fine.

IMHO, 80%+ of shot effectiveness is placement. The other 20% is bullet construction and impact velocity....and that 20% really only matters if you take shots that require deep penetration or penetrating big bones.

Use unsuitable bullets in a big gun, and you're probably just as well off with the 243.

Although a friend or two of mine might argue, I don't think that calibre makes up (much) for bad shot placement. It might help a fringe shot a little, or with breaking down big bones in some circumstances, but a bad shot will usually result in a long follow up just about the same as a lighter calibre.

[todbartell]

Seen another guy open up on a ram in a blizzard downhill at 300 yrds. He was hitting 2 ft behind the rams ass and trying to lead him.

soooooo let's say 48" wind drift @ 300y - that would be 65mph crosswind (for 243 w/ 100gr @ 2950 fps)

a 300 Win Mag with 180gr @ 2950 fps would be drifting 38"

a 7mm STW hot loaded w/ 160gr @ 3300 fps would be drifting 29",


probably not the best decision to take a 300 yard shot in a 65mph wind, 243 or not

[wiggy]

soooooo let's say 48" wind drift @ 300y - that would be 65mph crosswind (for 243 w/ 100gr @ 2950 fps)

a 300 Win Mag with 180gr @ 2950 fps would be drifting 38"

a 7mm STW hot loaded w/ 160gr @ 3300 fps would be drifting 29",


probably not the best decision to take a 300 yard shot in a 65mph wind, 243 or not

I agree but when a full curl ram is trotting across the scree men can loose all rationality. You can tell them to wait but nooooooo boom boom boom

[Kody94]

soooooo let's say 48" wind drift @ 300y - that would be 65mph crosswind (for 243 w/ 100gr @ 2950 fps)

a 300 Win Mag with 180gr @ 2950 fps would be drifting 38"

a 7mm STW hot loaded w/ 160gr @ 3300 fps would be drifting 29",


probably not the best decision to take a 300 yard shot in a 65mph wind, 243 or not

I agree but when a full curl ram is trotting across the scree men can loose all rationality. You can tell them to wait but nooooooo boom boom boom

LOL, I get it....because it was the .243 and a clean miss, the 'irrational' hunter can blame the failure on the rifle/cartridge. It he had taken the same shot with the 7mm STW and hit it in the hind quarter, the hunter would have just been a crappy shot.

[bridger]

I have seen quite a number of rams harvested in my hunting career taken with a variety of calibres- smallest being a 25/06 largest a 338. I agree with most opinons on this post that shot placement is critical and that under the right conditions a 243 is an adequate sheep rifle. there are other factors to consider other than sheep are soft skinned and easily killed which in my experience is not always true. rams are not always taken under ideal conditions. wind, rain, snow etc have an effect and lighter bullets don't do as well under those conditions as do heavier ones. Can a 243 kill a sheep? Absolutely, but most of us don't get that many chances at a ram so it would seem prudent to me to use a calibre with a heavier faster bullet, providing you can shoot it properly and that just takes practice most of the time. My favorite sheep rifle for years was a 25/06, but as the grizzly encounters increased I went to a 300wsm and it is out of the many i have owned
and hunted with over the years my favorite all time.

[Whisky Creek]

Use a bullet / cartridge adequate to do the job under ideal conditions and shot opportunities, AND also one which will allow a little room for error in times where "shit just doesn't work out exactly as planned".....
"Walk softly and carry a big stick" AND swing it well....

Exactly my point also Bridger, the wind, rain, snow, G-bears etc.... are all examples of where "$hit doesn't work out exactly as planned".....